S04.E14: Past, Present, Future

[jewel21]

Quote

The wait is over as Conrad and Nic welcome the arrival of their baby girl. Raptor's life begins to fall apart and he is forced to turn to Cain for help. Devon and Bell work together on a complicated surgery that may allow them to save multiple lives. Kit tries to deal with the moral repercussions of financially saving Chastain.

Airdate: 05/19/2021

Note: This is the season finale. 

[NeenerNeener]

I understand them not wanting to use a real baby in the opening scene...but there's a whole lot of "Uncanny Valley" going on with that doll they used instead.

[preeya]

On 5/15/2021 at 4:50 PM, jewel21 said:

Airdate: 05/19/2021

Note: This is the season finale. 

No cliffhanger?

Or was going into the baby's room supposed to be that?

Or Cain going to Johns Hopkins? Everyone knows he's leaving.

Or Billie's son suddenly showing up in her apartment? That's breaking & entering.

Edited May 19, 2021 by preeya

[MsTree]

6 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

I understand them not wanting to use a real baby in the opening scene...but there's a whole lot of "Uncanny Valley" going on with that doll they used instead.

Can you explain "uncanny valley"?

I thought the doll was pretty decent considering Days is just using an empty blanket😉

4 hours ago, preeya said:

Or was going into the baby's room supposed to be that?

Or Cain going to Johns Hopkins? Everyone knows he's leaving.

Or Billie's son suddenly showing up in her apartment? That's breaking & entering.

Sounds like a couple cliffhangers to me 😊

BTW, I thought I read that Cain will be recurring next season, and not necessarily totally gone.

[NeenerNeener]

3 hours ago, MsTree said:

Can you explain "uncanny valley"

"a humanoid robot bearing a near-identical resemblance to a human being arouses a sense of unease or revulsion in the person viewing it."

I was creeped out by that doll they were using, just like the "Reborn" doll in Servant. 

[Janie430]

So I realize the writers on this show have a specific opinion on corporate medicine, but in the hospital and the gene therapy start-ups defense, they got one great result - full remission, which makes this a major breakthrough.  But one great result doesn't mean that it's a slam-dunk from here to FDA approval. 

If you work off the standard 95% for statistical significance, that means that one out of 20 times, you get a fluke result.  So this therapy can work gangbusters in Rose, but not be so effective in anyone else, which means research to figure out why Rose was so responsive.  Further, with gene therapy for a disease like sickle cell, which is a disease that falls mainly on marginalized communities, I can see the FDA and the public demanding years of follow-up research to find side effects, before approval.  The drug companies are betting on a pretty good chance that the therapy will work out and be worth billions - but there is also the possibility that it will all fall apart.  The money the hospital took will allow them to cover a lot of care, staffing and procedures that aren't fully covered by Medicaid and Medicare.  Chastain was $30 million in the hole - did they really want to be running Phase I through Phase III trials and preparing FDA and EU applications for approval?  And the tech bro guy nearly went bankrupt and lost everything, which can destroy marriages and lives.  Wanting to take the money and get out before it all crashes down again is not necessarily morally wrong. 

It's not as simple as Big Pharma bad, it's more and issue of "the US allowed it's health care system to become very distorted in so many ways, and everyone has five reasons to change it, but one way it works for them that they don't want to change" making it very hard to fix.  For example, in the US, Nik and Conrad got to bond with their child in a private room after birth.  In the UK, if they went through the NHS, they would have been on a multi-bed ward.  The US made a decision to move to semi-private and private rooms decades ago, the UK didn't.  After fifty years of cultural expectation of being able to recover from one of the most painful experiences of your life without putting up with other people, walking it back is hard.  I wish the show could be more nuanced about that sometimes.

[preeya]

7 hours ago, MsTree said:

BTW, I thought I read that Cain will be recurring next season, and not necessarily totally gone.

Yes, I read that also. That said I'm hoping recurring is as minimal as it can be. I'm not a fan of Cain/Chestnut.

[vibeology]

If they think they're redeeming Cain by having him do the basic requirements of his job, they're nuts. Ooh, he showed up and did a surgery. That's his fucking job! Ooh, he mentored his resident. That's his fucking job. He was pleasant to the family member of a patient. Also his fucking job! Doesn't change anything for me. He's still a shitty person who has taken no extra steps to right the wrongs he did for years and years. Doing your job isn't enough.

The adoption ceremony with vows was cheesy but I loved it all the same. The creepy robot baby was not good and I wish they'd shown it straight on less often but I'm glad Nic and Conrad had their baby with zero drama. I don't care enough about Billie to have strong feelings about her plot.

I really did want more Devon on matchmaker dates and the fun that could be had there but I do think Devon and Leela are cute together so bring it on. But the true love story of this show is the Dads Bromance between Marshall and Kyle. 

[DoctorL]

I was confused that 'which patient gets the donor liver' was even a plot point. Split liver transplants are a completely routine procedure; both the recipients should have been given half the healthy donor liver. Healthy livers regenerate; that's why living liver donation is an option.

[NYGirl]

OMG that baby was so creepy.  It really distracted me throughout the episode.

Now that Rose is cured AJ's mom has something happen every week.

As finales go this one was pretty good.  I like no cliffhangers.

I don't care about Bobbie or her son.

It only took 3 weeks for Bell's stepson and his husband to adopt that little girl.

I think I'm going to miss Cain.   I definitely miss Mina

I'm glad the liver story turned out well.

[statsgirl]

The funniest part of the episode was Nic and Conrad wondering if the baby was still breathing.

The sickle cell treatment now has to go through hundreds of ramdomized trials in a number of locations to show that it works. That costs megabucks, something Devon's friend doesn't have. That said, this is a great argument for a national lab like the Connaught Labs to bear the costs of getting approval so that the final product can be sold at affordable rates.

How did Cain get into the surgery so quickly? Was there a transporter available?  Cain told Billie that no one asked him to do the surgery so taking AJ's call as that request was a nice bit.

AJ, Mina didn't leave you, she had to leave the country. You chose to stay.  And Cain didn't solely lose you "the love of your life". She made the bad decisions, he just reported them.  I don't remember AJ being a drama queen.

2 hours ago, NYGirl said:

It only took 3 weeks for Bell's stepson and his husband to adopt that little girl.

The daughter of the musician was a judge. She may have fast-tracked it.

[twoods]

I shouldn’t have read this thread before watching the episode because I couldn’t stop laughing at that creepy robot baby. They should have just shown a massive three month old because that was some weird shit.

AJs mom is going to have a health scare every week now? Come on, show.

I also wish we saw more of Devon’s matchmaking storyline because that had potential comedy gold written all over it.

[Crashcourse]

So are we supposed to think Cain is redeemed because he did his damn job operating on AJ's mom, and he winds up with Rose?  Not working for me.  

Although I like Devon and Leela together, I agree that it would been some lighthearted fun to see some matchmaker dates from hell before they got together. 

I don't care at all about Billie, but I'm looking forward to seeing what her apparently creepy son is up to. 

[CarpeFelis]

9 hours ago, DoctorL said:

I was confused that 'which patient gets the donor liver' was even a plot point. Split liver transplants are a completely routine procedure; both the recipients should have been given half the healthy donor liver. Healthy livers regenerate; that's why living liver donation is an option.

EXACTLY. I was wondering why they didn’t do that instead of giving Roland a faulty liver. If it was bad enough that it needed replacement, why was it good enough for him?! Hell, I’m not even in a health profession and I knew about that so why TF didn’t the writers? Do they have no medical consultants checking out the scripts?

The animatronic baby was just plain weird. Uncanny valley for sure. And the hair looked ridiculously wispy. I did love the laser lights in the baby’s room though. I could drive my cats crazy with those!

[MsTree]

10 hours ago, twoods said:

They should have just shown a massive three month old because that was some weird shit.

Would anyone really want their baby on the set during Covid? I'm not sure anyone would agree to a newborn...even up to 3 months old exposed during a pandemic. The robotic baby, while mildly creepy to some, was better than a stiff doll IMO.

[Crashcourse]

I've seen fake newborns on tv shows that looked much more real than the one on this show.  Whoever came up with this one should be fired. 

[yourmomiseasy]

I was pleasantly surprised that the birth took place off screen and there wasn't some cliched life or death drama tied to it.

[GiandujaPie]

On 5/19/2021 at 6:50 AM, Janie430 said:

So I realize the writers on this show have a specific opinion on corporate medicine, but in the hospital and the gene therapy start-ups defense, they got one great result - full remission, which makes this a major breakthrough.  But one great result doesn't mean that it's a slam-dunk from here to FDA approval. 

 

Also, they've spent a lot of time on the financial aspects of the corporate healthcare industry, and now it's a public hospital that is required to treat everyone, there is never any talk of the fact that the state they live in has refused the Medicaid expansion that was supposed to be a big part of the Affordable Care Act. Who was going to pay for that homeless chef's liver transplant, when they made a point of mentioning that she had no health insurance. I get that they film in Georgia and probably don't want to piss off any state politicians by wading into this, but I think it's dishonest and disingenuous to never mention this as a problem, especially now that it's a public hospital. 

[bros402]

That uncanny valley baby was just creepy (Would've been better to just have them holding a blanket really closely and have crying noises play) - but I was surprised that the birth happened off screen, nobody dying the second the baby popped out, and nothing wrong with the baby.

Billie's son going to her apartment... yeaaaah, that's stalking. Still have no idea how he got her information, it's practically impossible to get that in Georgia - maybe he'll be like "i'm dying i need medical help and you are a doctor"

[Norma Desmond]

On 5/18/2021 at 11:40 PM, preeya said:

Note: This is the season finale. 

14 episodes only? Damn.

[bros402]

5 hours ago, Norma Desmond said:

14 episodes only? Damn.

COVID cut their order short, I believe

[nichelle]

Man, that baby. I can still picture it 😆. It absolutely was creepy and at this point I'm just hoping it doesn't appear in my dreams. It seemed like the camera just lingered on it as though they were proud of what they had done. It allowed far too much time to study it and get even more creeped out when it's eyes opened. Just nooooooooo! 

"Have you ever seen something so beautiful?" - I started laughing when Nic asked that question while staring at robobaby.

[hookedontv]

On 5/20/2021 at 5:42 PM, yourmomiseasy said:

 

I was pleasantly surprised that the birth took place off screen and there wasn't some cliched life or death drama tied to it.

 

So happy about this too. Even if the birth was straightforward, I have no desire to see someone screaming in pain while giving birth, I would have just fast forwarded through. 
 

Also happy that Nic’s dad had little screen time and glad that they didn’t name the baby after her dead sister. I like the name and that they will call her Gigi (G.G.?) 

I agree with the comments about Cain-why was such a big deal made about him doing his job? All the drama when really Kit or Bell or whoever had authority should have called him and told him to get his butt back to the hospital to perform surgery. 
 

I just hope Conrad and Nic’s baby doesn’t drag the show down like babies have done for so many other shows. 

[CB-LXX]

On 5/18/2021 at 7:04 PM, NeenerNeener said:

I understand them not wanting to use a real baby in the opening scene...but there's a whole lot of "Uncanny Valley" going on with that doll they used instead.

I'd rather the robot doll than the 3-6 month old babies that are usually trotted out for a birth.

[SnarkySheep]

On 5/19/2021 at 2:41 PM, statsgirl said:

AJ, Mina didn't leave you, she had to leave the country. You chose to stay.  And Cain didn't solely lose you "the love of your life". She made the bad decisions, he just reported them.  I don't remember AJ being a drama queen.

You can't blame AJ for being shocked - yes, Mina made some bad decisions, but so does just about every other character in primetime drama. The writers don't even remember them a season later, let alone have the characters called out for them, LOL

On 5/31/2021 at 12:28 PM, hookedontv said:

Also happy that Nic’s dad had little screen time and glad that they didn’t name the baby after her dead sister. I like the name and that they will call her Gigi (G.G.?) 

I just hope Conrad and Nic’s baby doesn’t drag the show down like babies have done for so many other shows. 

As someone who has worked in a school system for over a decade, I can confirm there is a myriad of Grace, Gracie, Grayson, etc. in prek/elementary, so I'm pleased they did Georgianna for the first name and Grace just as the middle.

I predict this show will go the way of many workplace-centered dramas - there will be a big to-do around the pregnancy/birth, then we will only get an occasional mention, if that. Which I'm ok with.

[Ceindreadh]

On 5/19/2021 at 2:50 PM, Janie430 said:

 

It's not as simple as Big Pharma bad, it's more and issue of "the US allowed it's health care system to become very distorted in so many ways, and everyone has five reasons to change it, but one way it works for them that they don't want to change" making it very hard to fix.  For example, in the US, Nik and Conrad got to bond with their child in a private room after birth.  In the UK, if they went through the NHS, they would have been on a multi-bed ward.  The US made a decision to move to semi-private and private rooms decades ago, the UK didn't.  After fifty years of cultural expectation of being able to recover from one of the most painful experiences of your life without putting up with other people, walking it back is hard.  I wish the show could be more nuanced about that sometimes.

 

In the UK, if they went through the NHS they'd also get to go home and not worry about being bankrupted by medical bills or have to argue with an insurance company.