Season 1 Discussion

[tessaray]

For All Mankind Season 1 discussion. 

[paulvdb]

Apple Launches ‘For All Mankind’ Trailer Of Ron Moore’s Alt-History Space Race Series
 

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We don’t have a definitive date yet for the upcoming Apple TV+ streaming service but we know at least a part of it will be out of this world.

In the middle of its annual World Wide Developer Conference and just ahead of the 50th anniversary of Apollo 11’s historic mission, the Tim Cook-led technology giant today dropped the first trailer for space race alt-history drama For All Mankind.

Depicting an America that lost the quest to the moon to the Soviet Union, the Ronald D. Moore, Matt Wolpert and Ben Nedivi created series aims to go very large, as you can see above with women in the capsule and ambitions for Mars and beyond. This is actually the first official trailer for any of the AppleTV+ series.

Already a likely shoe-in for more seasons, the 1960s and 1970-set first run of 10-episodes of the big budget series, which Apple has kept on a Manhattan Project secrecy status, stars The Killing alum Joel Kinnaman, Patriot’s Michael Dorman, Sarah Jones, Shantel VanSanten, The Looming Tower’s Wrenn Schmidt and The Crown’s Jodi Balfour.

[paulvdb]

Here Are All The Apple TV+ Original Series Available At Launch

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Apple said today that is Apple TV+ streaming service will launch November 1 and cost $4.99 a month. It also unveiled which of its original series and projects will be available on Day 1.

For All Mankind is one of their original series that will be available on November 1.

Edit: Some more information about availability of Apple TV+

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Apple TV+ will be available on the Apple TV app in over 100 countries and regions on November 1.

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The service will be available on the Apple TV app on iPhone, iPad, Apple TV, iPod touch, Mac and other platforms, including online at tv.apple.com, for $4.99 per month with a seven-day free trial. Starting today, customers who purchase any iPhone, iPad, Apple TV, iPod touch or Mac can enjoy one year of Apple TV+ for free. Through Family Sharing, up to six family members can share one Apple TV+ subscription.

[paulvdb]

Official trailer:

[tessaray]

When they first announced FAM, there were so few details. I had hoped that it was going to be a near future kind of show rather than this retro re-imagining.  I probably will wait on reviews before I plunk down any money for a subscription. (There aren't any other shows on Apple's service that I'm interested in at the moment.))  

[paulvdb]

‘For All Mankind’ Drama Renewed For Season 2 By Apple

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Ahead of For All Mankind’s series debut on Nov. 1 and premiere event tonight, the space race alt-history drama from Ron Moore has been renewed for a second season, which quietly started production within the past week or so, I have learned. Apple declined comment.

It is part of a strategy by Apple to get second seasons of most of its scripted series going ahead of lunch, which helps amortize costs and keep the Apple TV+ pipeline of original content going, avoiding lengthy hiatuses. Beyond The Morning Show, which had been picked up with a two-season order, Apple had not confirmed any renewals. Along with For All Mankind, also reportedly renewed or in the process of being renewed for a second season are such upcoming Apple series as the Jason Momoa starrer See; Emily Dickinson comedy Dickinson, starring Hailee Steinfeld, which Apple brass have been very high on; anthology immigrant comedy Little America; and the Hilde Lysiak young detective drama Home Before Dark.

[xaxat]

I was intrigued by the basic "what if" premise, but I just feel that this show has the politics of the era all wrong. Nixon pushing for women as astronauts? Yeah, no. Plus the Soviets had already done that. An African American astronaut candidate? No way that would be seen as a priority or point of national pride in the US, much less the world.

[ShellySelf]

I felt like he was only pushing because Russia had already beat the US to it.  And I hate how they kept referring to the women as “girls”. So belittling.  I know it was realistic but that bugs me in real life too. 

But I am loving the show!

[cali1981]

Episode 5, Into the Abyss, was excellent with solid performances by Joel Kinnaman and Sonya Walger.  The one weak spot in the series is the performance of Michael Harney as the network science guy who is the anchor for the mission broadcasts.  Maybe this is what the show runners want but his delivery gives a new definition to boring. It is way too deliberate.  I was in my early 20s when the Apollo program began and none of the network science/space program reporters spoke in this manner.  Jay Barbree on NBC and ABC's Jules Bergman were firecrackers compared to Jack Broadstreet.  A more realistic portrayal was done by Lane Smith in From The Earth To The Moon.

Edited November 20, 2019 by cali1981

[whiporee]

I enjoy it quite a bit.  Wondering how quickly time will be jumping now that we’ve had our first big leap.  

I don’t love the actor playing Ed, but I like both the premise and the execution so far.  

[CarpeFelis]

Can’t stand Ed’s wife. The way she went on about how unqualified and undeserving the women ASCANs were - what the hell? (Especially considering the two former Mercury 13 were actually more experienced pilots than Ed.) Was she trying to be supportive of Ed, or jealous of these women, or is she one of those women who really, seriously buys into the idea that men are inherently superior? She also seems to resent the hell out of Tracy.

I do remember what the times were like - I was 11 when I watched Armstrong take the first step on the moon. And it was right about then we were finally allowed to wear pants to school instead of dresses or skirts.  But she was acting more like it was 1950.

[UNOSEZ]

7 hours ago, CarpeFelis said:

Can’t stand Ed’s wife. The way she went on about how unqualified and undeserving the women ASCANs were - what the hell? (Especially considering the two former Mercury 13 were actually more experienced pilots than Ed.) Was she trying to be supportive of Ed, or jealous of these women, or is she one of those women who really, seriously buys into the idea that men are inherently superior? She also seems to resent the hell out of Tracy.

 Well just watched the latest and they never really go into what all that was directly... But in her convo with the husband we see how incredibly wound up and scared she is.. So I'm gonna say it mostly came from a place of protecting Ed... The lady astronauts became the story and took some shine away from Ed.. And her belief was I guess they were being fast-tracked for publicity and if they weren't ready.. Then they were putting Ed at risk... A small part of it tho seems like some ingrained belief as to the social dynamics... She did seem to resent Tracy I think equally for running off and doing this totally freeing and independent thing.. But also because she was leaving her kids... I remember how she counciled her when she was ready to leave Gordo.. So I'd say she grew up with a very conservative mindset on how a wife should be.... But as of the latest epi.. She seems fine now.. Women astronauts have proven that they are as good as the men... She's gotten over some of her fear ( evidenced by her hanging the jaguar painting)  and she seems totally supportive of Tracy now.. Always taking care of the kids... I still wish we woulda gotten at least one confrontation between the two women some years back ( an episode or two ago)  to really specifically nail it down.. But that's not how they did and instead we kinda just saw her mellow out and we can out it together 

[whiporee]

Ed’s been gone at least three months now, maybe longer, and that’s at least two months later than planned. I think his wife (and that’s the way she’s defined herself) has had to step up and take on a lot more responsibility, and that’s how she’s validating her life in a show era that’s telling her she’s wrong. The ERA just passed, women are leading two of three of four flight teams and discovered ice on the moon, but she grew up thinking her biggest responsibility was to be the support system for her husband. For the astronaut. That’s why she’s willing to raise Gordo and Jamie’s kid, too, because thats what she sees as her contribution to the country. 

I think the show is being a little heavy handed in its portrayal of her, but I do think she’s an interesting character   

[Joimiaroxeu]

Poor Gordo went more than a bit stir crazy. Dani was good people to make that sacrifice for him.

You'd think NASA would've had a better backup plan so they could avoid having the team on the moon indefinitely. Seems like the situation would've eventually degraded beyond the astronauts' safe mental and physical tolerance.

If Shane's dead I wonder if NASA will tell Ed or keep him in the dark until he returns to Earth?

[Shaynaa]

On 11/29/2019 at 3:54 PM, Joimiaroxeu said:

Poor Gordo went more than a bit stir crazy. Dani was good people to make that sacrifice for him.

You'd think NASA would've had a better backup plan so they could avoid having the team on the moon indefinitely. Seems like the situation would've eventually degraded beyond the astronauts' safe mental and physical tolerance.

If Shane's dead I wonder if NASA will tell Ed or keep him in the dark until he returns to Earth?

I'm really curious what happened to Shane.  The end felt like a fake out but if he's really dead or seriously injured I'm not sure how NASA will cope.  It isn't like they can get him home any sooner.  I suspect NASA would keep him in the dark and I imagine Karen would go along with it even though she shouldn't.

[whiporee]

I think Moore's painted himself into one of his BSG corners here, because he wants to tell a human story but he's got all this space porn to deal with. We're taking weird steps in the overall progression -- like the time jump of two years to get to the moon base landing -- but we're not dealing with many of the implications back home. For example, the beards have been acting like a couple for nearly four years now -- hasn't she gone into space? Has Tracy gone into space yet? How often are the putting up Apollos? That's a bunch of money to be spending in an era of social upheaval -- how is all that playing out? Are people scared of actual violence breaking out on the moon? 

Instead, we're getting Shane and the other kid being bad in school. We're getting the beards story (which is poignant and all that, but if you're telling a story this big, you need to tell a story this big), Deke going back into space, all these little things that are taking time away from the big story they pitched us, and it leads me to think they haven't actually thought it all through. That's what happened with BSG -- really great ideas, really great execution, great acting and a big overall picture that they just never fully figured out. That's what I'm afraid of in this, that he hasn't really built the world he's trying to show, and  lot is falling through the cracks. 

[theschnauzers]

As I recall having grown up during this era, many of those space plans were on the drawing board until budget misers decided we couldn’t afford manned space flight to the moon or the solar system, including manned bases of the moon. The reality led towards joint space missions and the ISS instead.

I suspect they were going to wait until Ed got back, which was a matter of days.

[Joimiaroxeu]

If this were a different kind of show I'd wonder if the Russians had been watching Ed's family to see what kind of problem they could create to distract him from the mission. They probably didn't mean to kill his kid though. It'll be interesting to see if Ed and Karen's marriage survives the tragedy.

[Citizen A]

On 12/4/2019 at 7:04 PM, whiporee said:

which is poignant and all that, but if you're telling a story this big, you need to tell a story this big

100% agree. I was so stoked when they did the two-year jump a a few episodes back, and I though the show was going to start accelerating, or at least be moving along at a brisk pace.  But instead it's been bogged down in domestic minutia and drama that I just don't care about. 

Kudos to the actress playing Ed's wife, but I find the character she's playing so useless and weak, I can't summon any sympathy for her.

I want more alt-history not just a the few morsels we're getting.

[juno]

1 hour ago, Citizen A said:

But instead it's been bogged down in domestic minutia and drama that I just don't care about.

This.

I am starting to worry that this show is turning into a soap opera and not a drama about space travel.

I am a big fan of Sarah Jones and she is great on this show. I have enjoyed her since she starred in Vegas.

Edited December 7, 2019 by juno

[CarpeFelis]

The discussion between Margo and Aleida made me laugh a little. I was a senior in high school at the time this episode took place, and went off to engineering school the next year. And although the male:female ratio was 12:1 when I started (down to 6:1 by the time I left grad school in 1980), no, I did not have to work 10 times harder than the guys. And I’m still an engineer today. 

[whiporee]

I've always thought that the biggest mistake the US made in the 70s and 80s was not continuing the space race as an exploratory measure. After Apollo, everything because science and research based, taking away the feeling of discovery and adventure from NASA and the overall endeavor and reducing overall interest to an appreciative nod from a sense of awe. 

Moore and Company are apparently working to show me how wrong I've been.

In this world, the competitive element has made NASA so stupid that after blowing up one Saturn on the pad, they launch another one with a faulty computer. That when repairing said computer, NO ONE made safety precautions to make sure the dead computer hadn't left a bad command in its print queue. That an astronaut on a spacewalk would have a0)no radio direction finder and b) flashlight batteries that had just enough charge to complete her original mission.  And that a ship headed to the moon would have no broad-range telemetry or radio antennas, and that it would take them that long to figure a trajectory. 

And then, we've got the actual science. First, there's no possible way Molly could have disconnected herself, much less the 25 command module from 24's full burn. Second, even if she did, she'd have continued moving at the same speed she was when she disconnected. There's no friction in space -- nothing to slow you down. so she would have just kept going at the same speed as she was until she reached Alpha Centuri. 25 had some gravitational mass that might have slowed it a smidge, but at least it had rockets.  But Molly -- she's just headed out to space. 

Also, you don't go for burn before hooking up the LEM. That's much harder to do at full velocity than orbital velocity. And despite the fact that 23 blew up one of the launch pads, they have TWO other Saturns ready to go. How long has any of this been? They haven't buried Shane yet, but NASA's already had time to put together a new repair mission. 

Now we get to the people involved for some reason. Karen, who has always been shown as a strong military wife -- even last episode she was handling the funeral arrangements -- now can't get out of bed. We're supposed to care about the little girl and her boyfriend for some reason. ALL of the wives of the astronauts involved in this dangerous repair mission that's never been tried before are hanging out in Karen's kitchen. While this crisis is going on, Gordo's reached an epiphany about ratting out his shipmate, the FBI is going after janitors and Karen's getting stoned with the husband of the aforementioned Molly, who should be on her way to asteroid status soon.

Oh yeah, the hero of the show -- first billed on the credits -- just committed absolute,  unjustified, premeditated first-degree murder, and in the process provoking what should be WW3 for no real reason at all other than he's lonely and sad (okay despondent, but he's also a military man who has lost people close to him before).

I'll keep watching, but this really should have been a much better show. 

ETA: After I've thought about it, I'm pretty sure Ed just knocked the guy out so he could subdue him, which isn't a terrible plan. They were using US equipment and were willing to threaten him as they came out of the pit, so there has been aggression on both sides. Still a bad look for him. but not as bad as I originally thought. Unless I'm wrong about that. Also, pink spacesuits that looks like they'e got a slip cover over them. USSR needs better clothing designers. 

Edited December 15, 2019 by whiporee

[cali1981]

I still enjoy the show but it sure has taken a bleak turn.  Ed may have committed the first lunar murder.  I'm hoping that he drained the airlock to disable the Russian rather than kill him but the latter did tacitly threaten Ed with his hammer when they met on the surface. The hard look on Ed's face while he watched the Russian gasping for air said a lot.  You would also think the Russians would have sent up a cosmonaut who spoke some English since their module was so close to the American one.  Obviously back home the cold war must be heating up and the two moon dwellers' paranoia reflects that.  The dirtying up of Ted Kennedy is totally superfluous and unnecessary. Maybe one of the show runners has a political agenda here?  Next week's episode is the finale so hopefully there will be a glimmer of optimism before the end. The only thing that I can think up is that, if Apollo 24 is lost (with the terrible irony of Deke Slayton, grounded for so many years, finally on a mission which may cost him his life) and the Russian is alive, that Ed goes back to Earth with him.  It's probably asking too much though.

Edited December 14, 2019 by cali1981

[Joimiaroxeu]

Why would Ed go confront the Russians? It would've been trivial for them to push him into the crater.

And then things went Gravity. My eyes rolled so hard.

Gordo redeemed himself by figuring out how to retrieve the untethered astronaut. He's back, baby!

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You would also think the Russians would have sent up a cosmonaut who spoke some English since their module was so close to the American one. 

Or maybe the US could have sent up an astronaut who spoke some Russian. Note that today on the ISS, English us the official language but all the astronauts need to be able to speak some Russian too.

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The dirtying up of Ted Kennedy is totally superfluous and unnecessary.

In addition to the fan service, I think the character is supposed to be representing a multitude of politician sinners including his brothers (both of whom died before much of their dirt got out), Gary Hart, Bill Clinton, etc. Plus there are people who believe it's in the DNA of a Kennedy man to get some adulterous dirt on him. The Kennedy hate is still strong.

[CarpeFelis]

1 hour ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

In addition to the fan service, I think the character is supposed to be representing a multitude of politician sinners including his brothers (both of whom died before much of their dirt got out), Gary Hart, Bill Clinton, etc. Plus there are people who believe it's in the DNA of a Kennedy man to get some adulterous dirt on him. The Kennedy hate is still strong.

Also IRL his image was smeared by Chappaquiddick. It was noted in an earlier episode that he’d called off a trip there - and thus he ended up being elected. I think the idea is that even in an alternate history, the personalities are still the same, even if events don’t happen at quite the same time or in the same way.

[xaxat]

19 hours ago, whiporee said:

I'll keep watching, but this really should have been a much better show. 

I think his show tried to be too much. An alternate history about Russians on the moon. A story about how the US diversified their astronaut corps. A story about the pressures of being the spouse of an astronaut. Oh, and then there's the story about people being actually in space. 

And I don't know what's going on with the janitor, his daughter. . . and the FBI agent?

I really don't see how they can resolve this next episode. My guess is that there is some deus ex machina that gets 24 to the moon. (Sorry guy who got incinerated. We barely knew you!) But, what the hell are they going to do with the fact that Ed sabotaged the Russian rover to force the cosmonaut to walk to the US station where Ed could murder him. (In literal cold blood.)

Good luck Margo. Gonna be hard to hold your authority as a flight director after signing off on that disastrous plan and your CAPCOM and acting mission commander mutiny on you.

Edited December 15, 2019 by xaxat

[Joimiaroxeu]

So had Ed sunk into a deep depression? Is that why he'd stopped monitoring the communications?

It just struck me in this episode how much the actress playing Karen looks like Meghan Markle. They could be sisters, IMO.

Okay, I take Deke's point about the security risk Ellen's secret posed but that wouldn't have been an issue if people like her hadn't been required to keep their sexuality hidden to begin with. And that was on top of the misogny at NASA. Women like Ellen were catching trouble in both directions.

Sad way for Deke to die though. At least he got to go to space.

Interesting post-credits scene. Wonder if that was added after the show got renewed? Have to wonder what plutonium is going to be used for on the moon. I'm looking forward to the second season to find out.

Edited December 20, 2019 by Joimiaroxeu

[CarpeFelis]

23 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Interesting post-credits scene. Wonder if that was added after the show got renewed? Have to wonder what plutonium is going to be used for on the moon. I'm looking forward to the second season to find out.

The newscast they were watching said the Jamestown colony was being expanded. Perhaps the plutonium will be used as an energy source.

OTOH, the Cold War is probably still going strong, as it was in our 1983. Unless something major changed in the show’s 1970s-1983, there’d be a significant Russian presence on the moon. Also, Reagan seemed to be gaining a foothold with all the worries about the space program problems being possible Russian sabotage. So my theory is, the Jamestown colony is real but also being used as a cover for a military base and the plutonium will be weaponized.

Another, happier, possibility: by 1983 we’re aiming to beat the Russians to Mars and the plutonium will power spacecraft being built on the moon (or in orbit) to get there.

—-

This was the first episode where I actually started to like Karen.

I half expected Mikhail to sabotage Jamestown while Ed was gone, after that shot of him looking up at the departing LEM and then over at Jamestown. Seemed a bit ominous, especially after he helped Ed. Or maybe I’m just misinterpreting what I thought I saw?

When Ed left Jamestown, why the hell didn’t he warn Ellen about what had been going on with the Russians? Seems like information she really needed to know!

Still don’t think real highly of Gordo and his cheating, but I have to admit I teared up a bit at  his and Tracy’s kiss in Mission Control and him giving her the gold pin.

Deke: sorry to see him go, but his last words to Ellen when warning her about “people like [him]” should have been “You deserve better”.

[Joimiaroxeu]

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I half expected Mikhail to sabotage Jamestown

Maybe not sabotage but at least go through everything and take whatever documentation he could.

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When Ed left Jamestown, why the hell didn’t he warn Ellen about what had been going on with the Russians? Seems like information she really needed to know!

IKR? It may be a little sexist but I worry about her being up there alone with what is probably an all-male Russian team. What if they decided to overpower her? She's certainly tough but she might not be able to hold her own if they came at her as a group.

Also, it was interesting to me how much smaller the Russian cosmonaut was than Ed. Ed's a big guy anyway but I wonder if the producers deliberately staged it that way. USA!

[theschnauzers]

As to the alternate timeline’s depiction of the development of lunar bases, etc. Keep in mind that after the Apollo 11 landing, and the others that followed through Apollo 17, NASA did have plans for a permanent lunar base, those plans were looking at a nuclear power plant to be put on the Moon; solar power was in its infancy with no certainty that solar power technology would be ready. And without a doubt, the paranoia over Soviet behavior would have been overt. Hence, the deportation storyline because of perceived possible espionage within NASA. NASA was created to be able to maintain a civilian space program independent of the military. That became more apparent after Apollo in our history when NASA pursued Skylab and then the Space Shuttle, and the military began developing its own shuttle-light program, which till is in place today as an unmanned program using its own shuttle design for extended missions.

Soon as far as the epilogue is concerned it’s totally consistent with was in the drawing boards has the politians not abandoned manned missions to the Moon.

[xaxat]

This week, I watched the live feed of the inaugural launch of Boeing's new spacecraft, the Starliner. After a seemingly flawless the ship failed to reach the right orbit where it could achieve it's second objective, docking with the space station.

Space is hard!

I want to like this show better, but it doesn't feel like the season arc was well constructed. It was more like they filmed a first draft. I'll be back though, to see the new politics of space and, presumably, a new astronaut class.

I don't know why they launched the next generation spacecraft from under water. It takes an enormous amount of fuel to launch a ship through the atmosphere. And then they added the pressure of hundreds of feet of water. (It did look really cool though.)

 

Edited December 22, 2019 by xaxat

[whiporee]

5 minutes ago, xaxat said:

This week, I watched the live feed of the inaugural launch of Boeing's new spacecraft, the Starliner. After a seemingly flawless the ship failed to reach the right orbit where it could achieve it's second objective, docking with the space station.

Space is hard!

I want to like this show better, but it doesn't feel like the season arc was well constructed. It was more like they filmed a first draft. I'll be back though, to see the new politics of space and, presumably, a new astronaut class.

I don't know why they launched the next generation spacecraft from under water. It takes an enormous amount of fuel to launch a ship through the atmosphere. And then they added the pressure of hundreds of feet of water.

 

I'm with you on all the points. They launched it from water out in the middle of nowhere because the payload had plutonium in it, and they wanted to minimize the damage if something went wrong.

Pretty dramatic shot, but the rocket didn't look big or complex enough for lunar orbit. 

One thing they said was that this was for the expansion of Jamestown base -- so that means they've left it the same size for a decade? That would seem odd. 

This was one of the best episodes of the show so far, except for the Deke/Ellen stuff. I didn't buy she would tell him, and I didn't buy his reaction. And I didn't buy her following his advice to the letter -- she could have just as easily said "to all the people I love" and been good. Having Deke die was also a kind of cop-out, where the repercussions of her decision to tell were just wiped away.  Unless there were recordings of the dialogue inside the CM. 

Also, why didn't Harry get a monument on the moon? 

I'll be back, and hope they do a better job now that their feet are under them. 

[CarpeFelis]

I’m still wondering what the point of Aleida’s storyline was (besides the social commentary of an obvious parallel to what’s going on today with immigration). I’m hoping she will go on to some important role in NASA if the show ever jumps forward far enough.

[CarpeFelis]

1 hour ago, whiporee said:

One thing they said was that this was for the expansion of Jamestown base -- so that means they've left it the same size for a decade? That would seem odd. 

Also, why didn't Harry get a monument on the moon? 

Could be it isn’t the first time the Jamestown base is expanded.

And yeah, why DIDN’T Harry get a headstone? Probably only because his character hadn’t been on the show as much as the others.

[Shaynaa]

I would be so incredibly bored watching a show where "USA= big heroes and Russia = big villains absolute binaries. Mikhail Mikhailovic was totally on when he pointed out the American bodies and fact that no one owns the moon.  I'm really glad they didn't go for Russian sabatoge because they would be so easy and cheap.

I'm confused what happened to Aleida at the end?  Where did she go?  I imagine Margo would have a little more willing to help if she knew about her losing her place to stay but it seems like the INS or whoever raided the place would know Aleida was so it wouldn't be like she could just go stay with Margo, even if she did change her mind.

Are we jumping into the 80s with season 2? 

[xaxat]

Last week, NASA announced its newest astronaut class, the Turtles. 

If everything goes to plan, one of them will probably be the first woman to walk on the moon. 

[ahisma]

I just binged this whole series during Apple TV+’s free access. OMG I love it! 

I’m a complete sucker for ‘60s-‘70s era portrayals in general and NASA in particular, so this was right up my alley. I grew up in California in that era, a little more in the Molly/Wayne lifestyle, but I thought they did an excellent portrayal of the rigid conservatism that still held in much of the country, especially in the military. Since the women candidates could not, by definition, come from military pilot backgrounds, it makes sense that Molly and Wayne would be the ones to introduce a little more free thinking into the clique.

Maybe my favorite scene of the season is when Molly and crew are suited up and headed for the rocket, and the hallways are lined with women. Ed notices that it’s not the usual white shirt/black necktie crowd, and the emotion and joy on the spectators’ faces, so he gently nudges Molly to the front. 

Loved the introduction of national politics with archival photos/video/audio of Nixon, and then mocking up Teddy Kennedy in the White House in the same way. Both administrations, rightly or wrongly, took a lot of heat for the NASA accidents. I wonder what the alternate history impact will be on Reagan. IRL he and the USSR were in a spending race on nuclear weapons/defenses that bankrupted the USSR before us. Will it be the same, except with space instead? 

Wow, Gordo and Tracy have had a ride. I love that they do truly love each other under everything else, and that he is genuinely proud and supportive of her. 

When Gordo was up in Jamestown, I couldn’t help but intone Ren & Stimpy’s “Space ... madness!”

Poor Shane was such a victim of the spare-the-rod, military discipline style of child-rearing, and then .... At least his death seems to have broken Karen open, in what will become a good way.

So, so sad to lose both Gene and Deke.

1983 is a big jump. Aleida should be finishing graduate school. Not sure what the rest of our regulars will be doing.

On 1/15/2020 at 7:21 AM, xaxat said:

Last week, NASA announced its newest astronaut class, the Turtles. 

If everything goes to plan, one of them will probably be the first woman to walk on the moon. 

I love the mission name Artemis Project.

[TV Anonymous]

On 12/21/2019 at 10:22 PM, CarpeFelis said:

I’m still wondering what the point of Aleida’s storyline was (besides the social commentary of an obvious parallel to what’s going on today with immigration). I’m hoping she will go on to some important role in NASA if the show ever jumps forward far enough.

IMO that arc is the weakest link of the show and for me it pulls the show down. It is rather pointless and not to mention the most unbelievable aspect of the show. Yes I know, in the show where the Soviet Union not only landed on the moon, they did it before the United States and they brought female cosmonauts there, I found that Aleida story was hard to swallow. She was the daughter of a janitor, yet she had free access to the restricted gallery to the mission control. Her father got employed in a supposedly very secure facilities even though he was an illegal immigrant. And his father could collect classified materials from the garbage and just took them home. 

Edited July 16, 2020 by TV Anonymous

[AllyB]

On 12/14/2019 at 5:21 PM, whiporee said:

Second, even if she did, she'd have continued moving at the same speed she was when she disconnected. There's no friction in space -- nothing to slow you down. so she would have just kept going at the same speed as she was until she reached Alpha Centuri. 25 had some gravitational mass that might have slowed it a smidge, but at least it had rockets.  But Molly -- she's just headed out to space. 

Molly and the ships were in orbit and as such in the earth's gravitational pull. I'm not quite sure how far up the ships were compared to the ISS, but the ISS is still subject to about 90% of the earth's gravity that we feel on the surface. Even if they were a good deal further away than the ISS, they would all be well within our gravity well considering that the moon is in our gravity well. Molly would continue to orbit the earth in ever decreasing circles before her body would eventually burn up on re-entry.

[AllyB]

On 7/16/2020 at 12:58 PM, TV Anonymous said:

where the Soviet Union not only landed on the moon, they did it before the United States and they brought female cosmonauts there,

That second part is rooted in history. The 6th person the Soviets sent to space, and the 12th person ever, was Valentina Tereshkova in 1963. A little over 2 years after Yuri Gargarin's flight, the Soviets sent a woman. Tereshkova is to this day the only woman to have ever flown a solo flight in space. It was a massive public relations coup at home and around the world. Tereshkova toured the world and met with Queen Elizabeth in England when they were both pregnant the following year. In a similar but not quite alike nod to the Stevens' PR aspect, Tereshkova was very much encouraged to marry fellow Cosmonaut Andriyan Nikolayev shortly after her space flight, in order to have a fairytale Russian space couple. Their daughter being the first person in the world to have both parents who had been in space.

[kieyra]

Finished season one, had some stuff to type out about the messiness and how the overall quality feels like a broadcast show, especially the heavy-handed dialogue and plotting, but I’m too busy laughing about that teaser scene at the end with the plutonium ship launching from underwater. 

Good grief.

Ron Moore isn’t my favorite showrunner ever, but this was all surprisingly sloppy for him. In the podcast interview I listened to he mentioned having to get notes/approval from “Cupertino”, so I wonder if he lost a certain amount of creative control due to the Apple+ platform.

I wonder if that Aleida plotline can be salvaged. Cringefest so far.

[Zonk]

Episode 1:

I went into this cold, so it was a big (pleasant) surprise when the moon landing we saw in the beginning was the sovjets landing. Certainly makes things interesting.

Not sure why Apollo 11 would have nearly failed in this universe? NASA pushing too hard after the sovjets got to the moon or just another ccoincidence?

Are they seriously trying to make Wernher von Braum, the Nazi war criminal, into a sympathetic mentor figure? I mean seriously?

I'm sad that this doesn't have its own sub forum. Now I have to catch up before I can actively discuss the episodes without being spoiled...

Episode 2:

LOL. Wernher von Braun arguing about a military installation on the moon and that his work should only be used for peacefull purposes. He never cared about these things. He only cared about advancing his work.

I guess I just gotta think about this as an alternate universe (which it is) where Wernher von Braun wasn't the man he was in ours.

Edit: I guess not, considering the hearing and the talk later in the episode. Then it makes no sense that he would argue against the military base on the moon.

Edited April 25, 2021 by Zonk

[Zonk]

That moon base in the middle of season 1 doesn't look properly shielded. They are all going to die of cancer...

Also I'm a bit miffed that they don't actually have the 2 seconds delay that they mentioned in one of the first episodes. The Expanse incorporated that to great effect. On this show, communication is just instant.

So end of season 1: They didn't have enough guel left to even maneuver but they had enough fuel to get back to earth? Didn't sound like they had that just lying around earlier in the episode. They had to syphon it from an old lander. And they aren't producing fuel on the moon yet. So what gives?

Edited April 26, 2021 by Zonk

[Dobian]

Just finished the first two episodes and I'm hooked.  I really liked Man in the High Castle and am a fan of alternate history shows.  Some great "wow" moments in the first two episodes.

[AnnieBananie]

My dad and I are watching this together (every Friday night, Zooming) and we're in agreement that we just don't like most of the characters. We like Dani, and Pam, and Deke, but it's really hard to watch a show where so many people are unlikeable!

Still, very much looking forward to season 2.

[Zaffy]

I binge watched 1st season, mostly in Fast Forward.
Which as you understand, it is not a very good sign.
The premise was interesting but the execution was well.. messy.
At the end it was  like an endless soap opera and not of the good kind (if there is any).
The story was dragging SO much and the plot was repetitive. The pace of this show was  exhausting. I had the feeling of watching the same scenes with the same people saying the same things again and again. How many loooooong space rescue missions can you watch?

My big surprise was when I learned Moore was behind this mess. Wow....
I didn't watch season 2, I read a summary of it and I am very glad I skipped it.
 

[Crs97]

On 12/20/2019 at 12:34 PM, Joimiaroxeu said:

It just struck me in this episode how much the actress playing Karen looks like Meghan Markle. They could be sisters, IMO.

To me she looks like Meghan Markle and Julia Roberts had a baby.

[paramitch]

Huh.

I liked some stuff -- adored everything with the female astronauts, and really enjoyed everything relating to the alt-timeline astronomy aspect -- mission control, the rockets, the LEMs, the base, etc. Bring it on. Loved all that stuff. Even though some of the stuff in the final 2-3 episodes was increasingly eye-rolly! I mean, good lord. Spacecraft and astronauts tumbling around everywhere you looked!

The other stuff was variable for me. I loved Ellen and cared about her and Larry, and their being trapped into a closeted life is painful to see as a queer woman myself. On the other hand, I just don't like Pam. She's kind of a petulant ass. She isn't out herself, so it feels hypocritical  and a little false that she's always so judgmental of the choices Ellen has had to make.

Speaking of people I wanted to like but don't, I cannot stand Aleida. Part of it is the simplistic writing, but most of it is the absolutely terrible actress who plays her. She's a beautiful young woman but looks like she can barely marshal the interest or energy to act through her scenes. She seems to have two expressions -- vague wistfulness, or vague petulance. And her saintly dad is SUCH a better actor it was embarrassing to watch their scenes together. She's just awful. So I didn't care about her at all, and the fact that she was cavalierly willing to throw away the opportunities she had gotten because she wanted to finish high school with her friends? I mean, I'm sure it's realistic but I already disliked her, so -- ugh.

I enjoyed Margo's storyline, I just never bought that somehow she missed that Werner von Braun (hello, my darling Colm Feore!) had totally been a Nazi. I mean, it wasn't a secret at the time, exactly? So her horrified reaction felt like sloppy writing.

It took me awhile to come around, but I did grow to like Tracy and Gordo and their messed-up complicated marriage, which feels way more real to me than Ed and Karen's. The stuff with their little boy was sad, but... it was such an oddly chosen storyline.

I was so glad Ed didn't kill poor Mikhail, who I adored (and I love his actor, who is one of those guys who is always working). I loved their relationship by the end, and was so glad Mikhail genuinely helped him.

It's weird knowing we've lost Chris and Deke, who are so iconic and so integral to the actual space program. 

Also, all of y'all were talking about the big ocean launch and I went back and watched the end of the S1 finale again and realized I had missed an end credits scene with the big "GIANT ROCKET LAUNCHES FROM UNDER THE OCEAN" scene! Which was cool-looking, but OH MY GOD PHYSICS. No. No. No.

I'd give this a 6.8 or 7, but I'm in for season 2 for now.

[Haleth]

My husband and I have been binging this show the last couple weeks but I hadn't posted anything because the forum was so stale.  I agree with you Paramitch, the alt history (especially the women astronauts) was the best part.  I'll watch pretty much anything with Sonya Walger.  But the character of Aleida was a waste of time and hurt the pacing of an otherwise riveting show.

 

[transitfan]

On 12/14/2019 at 6:42 PM, CarpeFelis said:

Also IRL his image was smeared by Chappaquiddick. It was noted in an earlier episode that he’d called off a trip there - and thus he ended up being elected. I think the idea is that even in an alternate history, the personalities are still the same, even if events don’t happen at quite the same time or in the same way.

And yet, Teddy was still busted with Mary Jo (I can't spell her last name) down in Palm Beach.  Oh well, at least in this history she is still alive.