S03.E14: Money, Booze and Lies

[nokat]

10 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

Lecy cleans up quite nicely, she was borderline stunning in the Black dress.

Yes, I thought she looked so beautiful.

[Winston Wolfe]

9 hours ago, rmontro said:

10 hours ago, Winston Wolfe said:

Lecy cleans up quite nicely, she was borderline stunning in the Black dress.

Lol, that sounds like kind of a half compliment, but good description. 

Folks have told me I don't quite know how to give a compliment, yikes. What I meant was Lecy/Becky looked very nice, we almost never get to see the Connors dressed up. Lecy/Becky has always had a very unique, interesting (in a good way) look about her, as opposed to Darlene's perpetually dour countenance.

[nokat]

I like Becky's scenes with Dan. Darlene just annoys me.

[Winston Wolfe]

12 minutes ago, nokat said:

I like Becky's scenes with Dan. Darlene just annoys me.

Getting nostalgic. I remember Dan/Darlene/Becky in the original show's "Dad's extra-thick" milkshake scene in the Kitchen. It was a really sweet Dad/Daughters moment.

[Snow Apple]

1 hour ago, nokat said:

I like Becky's scenes with Dan. Darlene just annoys me.

That's because she's playing Sara instead of Darlene.

Yes, people grow up and change, especially when life beats you down, but I hardly see anything of original Darlene.

[needschocolate]

On 4/1/2021 at 3:22 PM, Jillybean said:

Where the heck is Beverly Rose? I don't expect them to have a baby on set during Covid, but although her existence is mentioned, her whereabouts aren't. 

Maybe she is staying with Jackie's son Andy.  

[bobalina]

According to showbiz411 the show has  lost 50% of it audience since March 2020 and 9% since last week. I think they need to wrap it up.

Beverly Rose is an unnecessary  expense and they ba v e to pay for the stunt casting somehow.

[Winston Wolfe]

7 hours ago, bobalina said:

According to showbiz411 the show has  lost 50% of it audience since March 2020 and 9% since last week. I think they need to wrap it up.

Sara Gilbert clearly sees her future as a Show-runner, but between this show and The Talk maybe it's not meant to be. As another poster stated over on The Talk thread, it could be that SG just puts her name on projects and then delegates the decision-making to others. What ever's going on, it ain't working.

Edited April 3, 2021 by Winston Wolfe

[rmontro]

10 hours ago, Bastet said:

I don't think that's at all rare, and I don't like comparing women on the sexist, racist, ableist, ageist, transphobic, and homophobic "attractive" scale, but I think New Coke Becky is attractive in a more generic way and Original Recipe Becky attractive in a more interesting way, and my personal preference is for the latter.

You're right, rare was probably the wrong word.  It's just more common the other way.

[SassyCat]

I think Dan was a real jerk this episode with his overinflated sense of entitlement. Trying to bully 25% of the business from Ben. He isn’t even Darlenes husband, a son in law. I really didn’t like this look on Dan.

Becky did look gorgeous. I loved the old style finger wavy hairdo. 

[tessaray]

4 hours ago, bobalina said:

According to showbiz411 the show has  lost 50% of it audience since March 2020 and 9% since last week. I think they need to wrap it up.

Beverly Rose is an unnecessary  expense and they ba v e to pay for the stunt casting somehow.

I think it could be salvaged if they had enough courage to do a clean sweep of the writers room.  And if someone would speak truth to Sara about it. 

Becky looked great but she (Lecy) always brings something to the screen that makes it easy to watch. 💓 Sometimes it's plain vulnerability, sometimes it's a sense of humor but it's usually watchable.  (Even when it's not, it's still better than most of the other stuff.)  

The direction they've gone with Dan is uncomfortable to watch.  With all the retcons we've had to put up with, why couldn't they have given Dan a Social Security check and a smidegeon of a pension from some job before Roseanne debuted (or a small inheritance that would have paid off the mortgages)? Then just let him be Grandpa Dan, watching his kids make the same mistakes he and Roseanne did.  Money would still be tight but he'd have his dignity. 

 

[peacheslatour]

6 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I think it could be salvaged if they had enough courage to do a clean sweep of the writers room.  And if someone would speak truth to Sara about it. 

Becky looked great but she (Lecy) always brings something to the screen that makes it easy to watch. 💓 Sometimes it's plain vulnerability, sometimes it's a sense of humor but it's usually watchable.  (Even when it's not, it's still better than most of the other stuff.)  

The direction they've gone with Dan is uncomfortable to watch.  With all the retcons we've had to put up with, why couldn't they have given Dan a Social Security check and a smidegeon of a pension from some job before Roseanne debuted (or a small inheritance that would have paid off the mortgages)? Then just let him be Grandpa Dan, watching his kids make the same mistakes he and Roseanne did.  Money would still be tight but he'd have his dignity. 

 

That would be great. The Frasier reboot would be wise to have him living with Freddie and being a benign but meddling presence in his life.

[bobalina]

17 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

That would be great. The Frasier reboot would be wise to have him living with Freddie and being a benign but meddling presence in his life.

I think Frasier was a better defined and thats the problem. Dan was on the original show for Roseanne to stomp all over. With no one to lead him around by the nose the writers seem unsure who he is.

[mythoughtis]

In what world did Ben and Darlene ‘give up an apartment’ so they could move in with Dan and help pay the mortgage?  
 If I remember correctly Darlene refused to move in with Ben so the  kids could stay in school there  but slept over at Bens.  Ben lost his job and then Darlene refused to take Bens job... so they were both unemployed and Ben moved In With Dan.  For free.  They didn’t start paying  rent until Dan almost lost the house. 
 

Dan had no reason to ask for part of the store.  He had a right to ask for a raise or commission.

 

[CrystalBlue]

7 minutes ago, mythoughtis said:

In what world did Ben and Darlene ‘give up an apartment’ so they could move in with Dan and help pay the mortgage?  
 If I remember correctly Darlene refused to move in with Ben so the  kids could stay in school there  but slept over at Bens.  Ben lost his job and then Darlene refused to take Bens job... so they were both unemployed and Ben moved In With Dan.  For free.  They didn’t start paying  rent until Dan almost lost the house. 
 

Dan had no reason to ask for part of the store.  He had a right to ask for a raise or commission.

 

Two months is too soon to be asking for anything at a job, let alone 25% ownership!  Ben had every right to say what all he did.  I still don't get why a grown man like Ben would want to be shacked up with his girlfriend and her two kids under her daddy's roof.  There's studio apartments for rent.

[peacheslatour]

17 minutes ago, bobalina said:

I think Frasier was a better defined and thats the problem. Dan was on the original show for Roseanne to stomp all over. With no one to lead him around by the nose the writers seem unsure who he is.

This is true. Dan was just this generic white working class dude who was into bowling and televised sporting events. Without Roseanne to drive the events of the family, Dan has no real personality.

[tessaray]

37 minutes ago, mythoughtis said:

In what world did Ben and Darlene ‘give up an apartment’ so they could move in with Dan and help pay the mortgage?  
 If I remember correctly Darlene refused to move in with Ben so the  kids could stay in school there  but slept over at Bens.  Ben lost his job and then Darlene refused to take Bens job... so they were both unemployed and Ben moved In With Dan.  For free.  They didn’t start paying  rent until Dan almost lost the house. 
 

Dan had no reason to ask for part of the store.  He had a right to ask for a raise or commission.

 

I think that Ben and Darlene were just about to sign a lease on an apartment of their own (S2-E20) right before Dan was about to lose the house. The money for the deposit and first month's rent went to help delay the foreclosure. Then they started also paying rent to Dan. 

p.s. Dan wanting part of the store is more like something Roseanne would want him to do.  OG Dan would never have done it.  (IMO) 

[mythoughtis]

9 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I think that Ben and Darlene were just about to sign a lease on an apartment of their own right before Dan was about to lose the house. The money for the deposit and first month's rent went to help delay the foreclosure. Then they started also paying rent to Dan. 

p.s. Dan wanting part of the store is more like something Roseanne would want him to do.  OG Dan would never have done it.  (IMO) 

Ok - thanks for reminding me about the lease.  But they were already living with Dan for free at that point.     As broke  as they are they would  never have been able to afford an apartment 

[rmontro]

2 hours ago, tessaray said:

The direction they've gone with Dan is uncomfortable to watch. 

Arguably, John Goodman became a big star because Dan was such a likable character.  That character seems to be long gone, and in his place we have a mean, bitter man.

[tessaray]

Just now, rmontro said:

Arguably, John Goodman became a big star because Dan was such a likable character.  That character seems to be long gone, and in his place we have a mean, bitter man.

I was willing to tolerate it when Dan was grieving but once he started to move on with Louise, I would have liked him to mellow a bit again.  The show using his age and work life as plots is more often miserable to watch than not. 

[Chaos Theory]

As much as I like The show the dower downer nature of it just doesn’t appeal to people.  Honestly Darlene actually used to be my favorite character but her pessimistic nature is just plain bad for the show in today’s world.     They never win.  They always lose.    Darlene always messes up and gets into a fight with Ben or Dan or Harris .    The show would be better if it was about them scraping out of poverty not reveling in it.  

Edited April 5, 2021 by Chaos Theory

[KayVeeTeeVee]

On 4/1/2021 at 9:38 AM, Stacey1014 said:

I was waiting for a scene with Becky and her friend where she admits where she is in life and it turns out the friend was just as unsuccessful and that he was just pretending to be successful to impress Becky. 

Maybe next week.  Becky goes to an AA meeting and guess who's there?  Her successful rival.

[bad things are bad]

On 4/2/2021 at 10:30 PM, Winston Wolfe said:

Don't think I've ever felt sadder for a fictional character as when Becky realized her made-up life was the one she really wanted for herself.

That was very well done, and kudos to Lecy for pulling it off without pathos. Very subtle

[Kel Varnsen]

On 4/3/2021 at 5:49 PM, CrystalBlue said:

Two months is too soon to be asking for anything at a job, let alone 25% ownership!  Ben had every right to say what all he did.  

Not only that it seemed like Dan was expecting Ben to just give him 25% of the company, which seems like a huge amount of equity to get for free. The last company I worked for had an employee ownership program but it was very small shares of the company, and once you were there for long enough they let you buy those shares at a price that they set.

[bobalina]

11 minutes ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Not only that it seemed like Dan was expecting Ben to just give him 25% of the company, which seems like a huge amount of equity to get for free. The last company I worked for had an employee ownership program but it was very small shares of the company, and once you were there for long enough they let you buy those shares at a price that they set.

Commission would have been far more appropriate.

[Kel Varnsen]

11 hours ago, bobalina said:

Commission would have been far more appropriate.

Commission or some kind of performance related bonus or some kind of profit sharing thing would make way more sense. Because how is Ben supposed to know that this extra business is going to be permanent and not just some one time purchases from a few of Dan's buddies as a favour to him?

[CrystalBlue]

5 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Commission or some kind of performance related bonus or some kind of profit sharing thing would make way more sense. Because how is Ben supposed to know that this extra business is going to be permanent and not just some one time purchases from a few of Dan's buddies as a favour to him?

With Dan's grumpy attitude and propensity to fly off the handle at Ben, Ben should wait six months to see if Dan even keeps his job down the road!

[peacheslatour]

22 minutes ago, CrystalBlue said:

With Dan's grumpy attitude and propensity to fly off the handle at Ben, Ben should wait six months to see if Dan even keeps his job down the road!

Right? Maybe he gets another job offer to dry wall a bowling alley and just stops showing up at the hardware store. What they both should be doing is building up the business so they and their families can have health insurance and other long range benefits.

[QQQQ]

On 4/1/2021 at 6:59 AM, readster said:

We have been hit over the head since the original series and this series that Dan just is not a good man of business. Knows his stuff, can fix things on his own needing very little help or expenses on things. HOWEVER... he just can't do it in a long functioning situation. That's been proven over and over again. While Jackie and Rosanne seem to know how to run a business, they NEVER LOOK beyond the "fun part" and never invest, save or of course think if the economy might tank or their side of town isn't doing that well. 

Dan is to small businesses what Ted McGinley is to sitcoms.

[iMonrey]

Quote

Dan was in the wrong.

Two months is not enough to prove himself. The shortest probationary periods for jobs last 90 days. Most are six months to a year. His desperation is understandable but all he did was make everyone's financial situation - including his own - even MORE precarious.

Ben himself has not been there two months! He just inherited the store like yesterday and knows next to nothing about hardware. He needs a partner like Dan. Especially one bringing in business and revenue. He's just too stubborn to admit it. Likewise, Dan went about the ask entirely wrong, making a demand like a threat rather than offering reason and logic. Both sides were playing the emotional card instead of using their brains.

[chitowngirl]

On 4/6/2021 at 10:16 AM, Kel Varnsen said:

Commission or some kind of performance related bonus or some kind of profit sharing thing would make way more sense. Because how is Ben supposed to know that this extra business is going to be permanent and not just some one time purchases from a few of Dan's buddies as a favour to him?

Exactly! They might appreciate the service a small business gives them, but in the long run, better prices are what’s going to drive any business because the bottom line is what’s going to matter, especially in Covid times.

[Kel Varnsen]

1 hour ago, chitowngirl said:

Exactly! They might appreciate the service a small business gives them, but in the long run, better prices are what’s going to drive any business because the bottom line is what’s going to matter, especially in Covid times.

He could even make Dan manager of contractor sales. Although I would have loved it if Ben had said something like (and I am making up all the numbers here) "I checked with my accountant, my store is worth $300,000. In the last 2 months you have made me an extra $10,000 in profit. So why should I give you a quarter of my company in exchange for that?".

[gaucho91]

If you want to own 25% of a business, don't you usually need to come up with the money to buy it, as in actually pay the owner whatever it is worth? The owner, of course also needs to be willing to sell it. I couldn't believe that Dan was demanding it for free.  That was crazy.

[bobalina]

5 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Ben himself has not been there two months! He just inherited the store like yesterday and knows next to nothing about hardware. He needs a partner like Dan. Especially one bringing in business and revenue. He's just too stubborn to admit it. Likewise, Dan went about the ask entirely wrong, making a demand like a threat rather than offering reason and logic. Both sides were playing the emotional card instead of using their brains.

No.  Ben needs employees like Dan, people who know  the business and are willing to teach him while he takes care of the admin side.

[BetyBee]

I think it would have been a good idea to have an apartment above the hardware store. Then Darlene would have to decide if she wants to live with Ben (I don't think she does) or stay with her family. She probably ought not to be leaving her kids anyway, so I don't know what kind of place they supposedly have in mind. I really like Stan Ben, but I see zero chemistry in this relationship. I thought she was going to break up with him over him being sensible about the magical tickets and not getting her newfound lifestyle of not worrying and living every moment to the max. That will last about as long as his podcasting career.

The off to rehab scene was amazing.