S35.E15: Crash Into Me

[OnceSane]

Quote

One player engages in sloppy political maneuvering, while another takes a shocking gamble to save a friend; competitors must fight for survival in the elimination game Hall Brawl.

Airs July 8, 2020.

[mojoween]

Let’s go!

“Bless your cotton socks” is simply marvelous.

Hey look there’s Dee.  Haven’t missed her.  Bye Dee.

I’m SUPER surprised John actually kept his word for once but I know I am not the only person to be sad to not see Faysal in Hall Brawl.

I know I’m astonished every week but is Nelson...maturing?  Like since the beginning of the season?

You think Nelson was nervous, knowing that Rogan broke Jay in half?  Cory has the better build to go against Rogan and John knows it but I’m not giving him props for anything.

[AntFTW]

That house vote has to be the stupidest thing I've seen all season. It made no sense. However, that elimination between Jenny and Dee has to be the greatest thing I've seen all season.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[AntFTW]

3 minutes ago, mojoween said:

You think Nelson was nervous, knowing that Rogan broke Jay in half?  Cory has the better build to go against Rogan and John knows it but I’m not giving him props for anything.

No because I thought no matter which guy went in, it wasn't gonna be an easy one for Rogan. I thought all of the guys left would have given Rogan a run for his money. I don't expect Cory or Nelson to be slouches in a hall brawl.

If anything, I imagine that both of them were somewhat nervous about possibly losing.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[AntFTW]

1 hour ago, mojoween said:

I’m SUPER surprised John actually kept his word for once but I know I am not the only person to be sad to not see Faysal in Hall Brawl.

I know I’m astonished every week but is Nelson...maturing?  Like since the beginning of the season?

I think Johnny thinks he can beat Fessy. I believe that Johnny thinks Rogan is tougher competition than Fessy and that Rogan is a more well-rounded competitor. Additionally, I also think Johnny doesn't really care as much about rest of the guys left as he thinks he can beat them all.

Nelson is redeeming himself with me. He just needs to keep that going. I don't wanna see him come back next season, whenever the next season happens to take place, and be on that same BS that he pulled with Aneesa and Kailah.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[Treehugger9]

I cannot believe Johnny kept his word and didn't put Fessy in. Fessy definitely had the best shot at taking Rogan out, and I would imagine that Johnny thinks that Fessy and Rogan are his stiffest competition. I think they are! Maybe arrogance makes him think he has this in the bag (which i hope isn't true, but sadly may be). I never thought I'd be cheering for Nelson but I was jumping out of my seat and screaming at Nelson to drop him and run during that first round! I'm also thrilled that stupid Dee is out bc cutting her out of these episodes has left them so so boring. 

[Eolivet]

I was also surprised Johnny Bananas kept his word to Kaycee about not throwing Fessy in, but then I remembered Kaycee's social game is really quite something. She was the perfect balance of laid back, while not letting them walk all over her. And however she presented her argument, it made the guys believe it would not behoove them to break their word. Considering she's a rookie and Johnny Bananas is a zillion year old vet, that's impressive, to me. She got what she wanted, and the guys felt like they were running the show.

And wow, three BB21 rookies in the final. Let's go!

[Never Again]

I can’t stand Rogan and I detest Bayleigh.  I would have loved Bayleigh vs Dee, they are both bad people but honestly Bayleigh’s charity scam is worse.  I don’t doubt Dee is a racist but Bayleigh cheated a friend with cancer, and cheated all the people who bought tickets too.  And then in her Bayleigh way, went on the offense instead of defense when she and her man got called out. 

I have such newfound admiration for Nelson.  I think it was a mistake, obviously Cory being a football player and way more muscular had a better chance against Rogan. I do like the new Cory but he should have gone in.  Nelson took the inevitable loss and that was sad.  But man, what a friend!  I have good friends too but no one that would give up a million dollars, and the pride of championship, for me, and I wouldn’t expect them to and I wouldn’t do it either 

Great episode for excitement and drama but I’m sad that Nelson is gone and annoyed that Bayleigh, who skated through until last week, is still there and didn’t have to fight tonight to get into the final.  I hope Kaycee or Jenny win for the girls, and Cory for the boys. Please no Johnny or Rogan.  If just one winner I’ll go with Cory.  

 

[Lantern7]

Nelson is an idiot, right?

I don't watch Teen Mom. I don't get the exact logistics on how people can make money off of Teen Mom. I just figure that Cory's baby and babymama would be well-compensated for letting their lives be taped. My question: did Nelson know this? In his place, I would have used Teen Mom against Cory. But no, Nelson decides to sacrifice himself to help his buddy, and Rogan sends him home. We did get a few minutes of emotion from Cory and Nelson, and it did steer attention away from Dee's departure . . . but I still think it was a dumb move by Nelson.

I don't think we're getting a good ending. Cory's winning his first title would be a nice way to finish, but I feel that he wound up stepping on Nelson's back to make the final mission. Johnny is in his first finale in seven seasons, and his edit makes me uncomfortable. He's been an asshole, but not as much as before . . . leading me to believe that BMP is helping us swallow him winning title #7. Honestly, I don't think he's earned a redemption story. Bayleigh, Fessy and Kaycee are Big Brother, so screw them all. Maybe Melissa wins, and the horror that she was unknowingly pregnant would be glossed over? Or Jenny gets rewarded after dispatching Dee? That first hit . . . I think Dee spent the Nelson/Rogan battle on the sidelines, puking up bits of intestine.

Kyle fucked up royally in the mission. His dad is a stunt driver, and he shit the bed with his performance. And then Johnny convinced Kaycee to put him on the Tribunal. Ugggggggh.

ETA: Cory brings up his kid as motivation. How many bricks do you think Tony threw at his TV watching that?

Edited July 9, 2020 by Lantern7

[AntFTW]

5 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

Nelson is an idiot, right?

Yes! Absolutely! Always and forever!

  

5 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

Johnny is in his first finale in seven seasons, and his edit makes me uncomfortable. He's been an asshole, but not as much as before . . . leading me to believe that BMP is helping us swallow him winning title #7. Honestly, I don't think he's earned a redemption story. Bayleigh, Fessy and Kaycee are Big Brother, so screw them all. Maybe Melissa wins, and the horror that she was unknowingly pregnant would be glossed over? Or Jenny gets rewarded after dispatching Dee? That first hit . . . I think Dee spent the Nelson/Rogan battle on the sidelines, puking up bits of intestine.

Kyle fucked up royally in the mission. His dad is a stunt driver, and he shit the bed with his performance. And then Johnny convinced Kaycee to put him on the Tribunal. Ugggggggh.

Everybody has gotten grown this season! Johnny's an asshole, but not as much as before. He's matured JUST compared to season 34. Same for Cory and Nelson, they've matured also.

That elimination with Dee and Jenny was AWESOME! I bouncing out of chair and pacing, while screaming "RUN THROUGH HER!" and "MOW HER DOWN!" and "BODY HER!" (as a shout-out to Leroy on Vendettas yelling that out to Kam).

If Kyle wasn't in the Tribunal, Kyle was going into elimination. I have no doubt about that... and also, Kaycee also got her side of the deal too by them agreeing not to put his Fessy and following through with that.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[Decider]

"I'm not going to throw Nelson's name under the bus."   Oh, Cory.

Can the phrase "under the bus" be retired now, please and thank you?  This show ran it into the ground a long time ago but that pretty much sealed it as deader than dead.  (It did make me cackle, tho.)

[LotusFlower]

21 minutes ago, Lantern7 said:

I don't watch Teen Mom. I don't get the exact logistics on how people can make money off of Teen Mom. I just figure that Cory's baby and babymama would be well-compensated for letting their lives be taped.

Cory had a baby with Cheyenne, one of the moms on Teen Mom, and yes, they make a lot of money on the show and presumably the baby’s well-provided for.  But FYI, Cory has a new girlfriend who I think recently gave birth to his second child.  I don’t watch the show anymore, but if Cory (and even the new gf) are on the show at all, they likely only get paid for their occasional appearances.  And here’s another FYI - the new gf got caught in a Dee-like racist SM post, so that’s the end of her appearances on MTV, too.

[scrb]

2 hours ago, AntFTW said:

I think Johnny thinks he can beat Fessy. I believe that Johnny thinks Rogan is tougher competition than Fessy and that Rogan is a more well-rounded competitor. Additionally, I also think Johnny doesn't really care as much about rest of the guys left as he thinks he can beat them all.

Nelson is redeeming himself with me. He just needs to keep that going. I don't wanna see him come back next season, whenever the next season happens to take place, and be on that same BS that he pulled with Aneesa and Kailah.

Size was an advantage in the elimination.  There wasn't much suspense about Jenny vs. Dee.  There must be like a 40 pound weight difference, not to mention Jenny weight trains.

Kind of silly Jenny boasting in her TH that she wasn't going to let Dee stop her.  Come on, you have a huge physical advantage, have a little humility that the right elimination came up in this episode.

Among the men left, Nelson and probably Kyle are the lightest, also not used to physical contact.  But Nelson did well for himself, though took a lot out of him, unable to run without stumbling twice after the crash.

Hall Brawl is popular with the challengers and presumably the viewers but you rarely have evenly matched competitors.  Seems like for the producers to choose this elimination, at this point in the season, they're pretty much choosing which two players are going home.  Size is almost always going to win out.

We will see if the size is an advantage in the Final.  Looks like running up mountains covered with snow, climbing and then skiing..  That's probably the first half of the Final.

The equalizer is usually the puzzles and things like eating challenges.

I enjoyed the driving challenge but it's completely random, they might as well have thrown dice, unless someone of them have experience drifting cars.

[Treehugger9]

11 minutes ago, scrb said:

Kind of silly Jenny boasting in her TH that she wasn't going to let Dee stop her.  Come on, you have a huge physical advantage, have a little humility that the right elimination came up in this episode.

Tori destroyed Jenny in hall brawl previously and Jenny is significantly bigger than Tori....I think Jenny learned from that loss and trained appropriately...and good for her. She's not aggressive by nature but has the strength to dominate. 

[Spencer Hastings]

I can’t decide if Nelson is stupid or an incredibly exceptional friend. I don’t think I would’ve done that for my best friend.  I’d like to say that I would but...

Also glad that we can stop playing “Spot Dee.” 

[AntFTW]

7 hours ago, scrb said:

Size was an advantage in the elimination.  There wasn't much suspense about Jenny vs. Dee.  There must be like a 40 pound weight difference, not to mention Jenny weight trains.

Kind of silly Jenny boasting in her TH that she wasn't going to let Dee stop her.  Come on, you have a huge physical advantage, have a little humility that the right elimination came up in this episode.

Among the men left, Nelson and probably Kyle are the lightest, also not used to physical contact.  But Nelson did well for himself, though took a lot out of him, unable to run without stumbling twice after the crash.

Hall Brawl is popular with the challengers and presumably the viewers but you rarely have evenly matched competitors.  Seems like for the producers to choose this elimination, at this point in the season, they're pretty much choosing which two players are going home.  Size is almost always going to win out.

We will see if the size is an advantage in the Final.  Looks like running up mountains covered with snow, climbing and then skiing..  That's probably the first half of the Final.

The equalizer is usually the puzzles and things like eating challenges.

Size is a factor but I think Rogan and Nelson are close enough in size to where it would be a close match. I thought their size isn’t that significant of a difference to be a deciding factor here (which we saw that was the case). Rogan and Nelson (or even Rogan and Cory) are close enough in size to where brute strength and strategy makes a difference.  Nelson and Rogan are close enough in size to the point where Rogan can’t just run through Nelson. Nelson could have won. Nelson had openings to come out with a win. However, he was so wrapped up in trying to stop Rogan from advancing that he missed his openings. Nelson spent too much time trying to stop Rogan rather than trying to get to the bell first.

Think of Tori and Jenny last season. Jenny is bigger than Tori and has way more strength. However, Jenny’s strategy is why she lost to Tori, moreso than her strength or size. Jenny is strong enough where she could mow down any woman she goes against but her form in her hall brawl against Tori was terrible. The way she ran was terrible and the way she prepared for the collision between her and Tori was terrible.

I’ll also mention CJ vs Zach in BOTS 23. There is a significant size difference between CJ vs Zach’s big ass. CJ initially beat Zach, 2 to nothing. CJ won against Zach because of strategy rather than size. CJ knew Zach was too big to just push back so his strategy was to avoid collision and be faster, which worked for him. CJ’s partner (little Jasmine from RW: Cancun) lost so that meant CJ had to go against Zach again for a tiebreaker. Zach, who almost lost again to CJ, didn’t win because of size. Zach won because of strategy. Zach smartened up and used CJ’s strategy against him. Zach stopped focusing on trying to run CJ over and focused on avoiding collision and getting to the bell faster.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[AntFTW]

BTW, when did this rift between Jenny and Rogan start? She said to Nelson that she doesn’t trust Rogan but they’ve been working together. Rogan warned her about Dee targeting her. In her interview, Jenny also said she doesn’t like Rogan. I have no context at all for how that happened.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[Jillibean]

10 hours ago, Eolivet said:

I was also surprised Johnny Bananas kept his word to Kaycee about not throwing Fessy in, but then I remembered Kaycee's social game is really quite something. She was the perfect balance of laid back, while not letting them walk all over her. And however she presented her argument, it made the guys believe it would not behoove them to break their word. Considering she's a rookie and Johnny Bananas is a zillion year old vet, that's impressive, to me. She got what she wanted, and the guys felt like they were running the show.

I think Johnny is also aware that this will probably not be Kaycee OR Fessy’s last challenge, and he’d rather have them both as people who trust him than as people he has burned who will be out for blood in the future. He has a LOT of enemies already, and both Kaycee and Fessy have the goods to back up their threats. Kaycee has always had a great social game, but Johnny is also sort of historically impervious to people’s social games. He does what he thinks is best for his game. Fessy is not going to be good at puzzles, so that slightly reduces his final threat level, and inexperience can definitely impact people during a final as well. And other than Fessy siding with Jay at the very beginning of the game when they tried to get Johnny thrown in, neither has really come after him. I think he’s probably wise in the long run to keep the peace. 

I have to say, I feel like Johnny has mellowed a bit. Sure, some of it could be editing, and he definitely still feels it’s his job to start and stir up drama, and always will (and he’s not wrong). But as a person, he seems less on edge and quick to anger/narcissistic injury than he has in previous seasons. I thought he did a good job with Melissa last night in terms of listening to her and helping her feel less attacked while also explaining why they were frustrated with her vote. He seemed genuinely moved by Nelson’s “sacrifice,” and he’s obviously been much more chill with people like Nelson and Corey than he has been in the past. I also give him credit for refusing to have patience with either Zach’s behavior toward Jenna or Jenna putting up with it in a deleted scene from earlier this season, though it was in a very Johnny way (“she’s an idiot”). 

I see Kyle’s point about Melissa, but this is also why voting order can be important. Melissa and Bayleigh clearly didn’t realize that Rogan, Corey and Nelson intended to vote for Jenny. I did think it was telling when Melissa initially realized that Kyle was genuinely angry and immediately said, “I didn’t send her in, Bayleigh sent her in,” which is was objectively untrue since they contributed equally. Melissa’s had a quiet season, apart from all of us cringing in horror watching her lift heavy items and do physical eliminations with the knowledge we now have that she was pregnant, but it’s clear that when she’s in trouble her first instinct is still to blame someone else. OTOH, it really wasn’t Melissa’s fault. She got caught in the trap that so many others have in challenge history of thinking she was throwing a burn vote only to end up having her vote really matter. 

Aww, Nelly. That was sweet. I go back and forth with Nelson. I so enjoy his unintentional comedy, and I want to love him for how much he loves his best friend. But the way he treats women when he’s mad at them is disturbing. And I haven’t forgotten how he punched Derrick on Dirty Thirty.

I also still have to side-eye this moral swell of emotion over Corey needing the money for his family. What Corey needs is to use condoms. And what is the likelihood that Nelson actually has no kids out there, guys? (Kidding. I think.)

 

[AntFTW]

I also wanna bring up Cory bitching about these favors. Didn’t Jenny choose Cory to be in the very first tribunal on the first daily challenge when she owed him NOTHING?

[Treehugger9]

37 minutes ago, AntFTW said:

BTW, when did this rift between Jenny and Rogan start? She said to Nelson that she doesn’t trust Rogan but they’ve been working together. Rogan warned her about Dee targeting her. In her interview, Jenny also said she doesn’t like Rogan. I have no context at all for how that happened.

One of the challenge instagram accounts I follow posted a story yesterday that said that this was an extremely Dee heavy episode and a ton had to be cut out. I'm so mad bc this was one of the best seasons we've had in a really long time and by cutting out Dee, who was the center of 90 percent of the drama, we're left with these boring episodes where so much doesn't make sense. Grrrrr. 

[peachmangosteen]

12 hours ago, Eolivet said:

And wow, three BB21 rookies in the final. Let's go!

Gross lol.

8 hours ago, Spencer Hastings said:

I can’t decide if Nelson is stupid or an incredibly exceptional friend. 

Why not both?

1 hour ago, AntFTW said:

BTW, when did this rift between Jenny and Rogan start? She said to Nelson that she doesn’t trust Rogan but they’ve been working together. Rogan warned her about Dee targeting her. In her interview, Jenny also said she doesn’t like Rogan. I have no context at all for how that happened.

Yea, I was confused there, too. But since Dee and Rogan have been largely absent from these past few eps a lot of context is missing. 

1 hour ago, Jillibean said:

I have to say, I feel like Johnny has mellowed a bit. Sure, some of it could be editing, and he definitely still feels it’s his job to start and stir up drama, and always will (and he’s not wrong). But as a person, he seems less on edge and quick to anger/narcissistic injury than he has in previous seasons. I thought he did a good job with Melissa last night in terms of listening to her and helping her feel less attacked while also explaining why they were frustrated with her vote. He seemed genuinely moved by Nelson’s “sacrifice,” and he’s obviously been much more chill with people like Nelson and Corey than he has been in the past. I also give him credit for refusing to have patience with either Zach’s behavior toward Jenna or Jenna putting up with it in a deleted scene from earlier this season, though it was in a very Johnny way (“she’s an idiot”). 

I agree. And it makes me uneasy lol.

Going into the finale, I can't say I'm particularly rooting for anyone per se. I find Kyle immensely entertaining so I guess I'd be most pleased if he won. I wouldn't care one way or the other if Johnny, Fessy, Jenny, Melissa, or Cory win. I'd rather not see Kaycee or Bayleigh win but also meh. I'm rooting against Rogan for sure.

[RedbirdNelly]

I've not watched in a long time, but is this crew unusually dumb? Has Melissa not watched this show before? there just seemed to be a complete lack of strategic thinking and just voting based on who you have ties to, oh yeah, I have an alliance I should protect. . oops. was just weird to me.

Watching Nelson now has me confused. It's like is this the same guy? 

It was nice of him but not sure I'd do it. I mean lots of us have children. Winning $1m would be nice across the board. I'm sure Nelson knows people he cares about. 

[peachmangosteen]

18 minutes ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I've not watched in a long time, but is this crew unusually dumb?

They're usually pretty much all dumb nowadays.

[AntFTW]

40 minutes ago, RedbirdNelly said:

I've not watched in a long time, but is this crew unusually dumb? Has Melissa not watched this show before? there just seemed to be a complete lack of strategic thinking and just voting based on who you have ties to, oh yeah, I have an alliance I should protect. . oops. was just weird to me.

It seems that the plan was for everyone in the alliance (plus Bayleigh) to vote for Dee, which production provided nothing leading up to that. They showed no one rallying votes for Dee. That threw me off when I watched the first time. That house vote made no sense to me whatsoever because production threw away all the context to cut Dee out. I couldn't understand why the girls seemed like they were burning votes on each other. It seemed like there was no plan and they were winging it on the girls vote.

The plan was for everyone to vote for Dee, which explains how and why Fessy ends up voting for Dee, breaking with his "Team Old Buck" alliance who voted for Jenny. In exchange for Johnny and Kyle not nominating him into interrogation, Fessy votes for Dee and Rogan. The tribunal was on board with this plan. Bayleigh, Melissa, Jenny, and Fessy were supposed to vote for Dee. Dee gets voted in by the house, and maybe the Tribunal picks Bayleigh. This is what I believe the plan was ultimately supposed to be.

It is also my understanding that Dee, at this point, knows that she was outed to Jenny about targeting her. Jenny mentions them having "problems" in the house vote.

Edited July 9, 2020 by AntFTW

[scrb]

3 hours ago, AntFTW said:

Size is a factor but I think Rogan and Nelson are close enough in size to where it would be a close match. I thought their size isn’t that significant of a difference to be a deciding factor here (which we saw that was the case). Rogan and Nelson (or even Rogan and Cory) are close enough in size to where brute strength and strategy makes a difference.  Nelson and Rogan are close enough in size to the point where Rogan can’t just run through Nelson. Nelson could have won. Nelson had openings to come out with a win. However, he was so wrapped up in trying to stop Rogan from advancing that he missed his openings. Nelson spent too much time trying to stop Rogan rather than trying to get to the bell first.

Think of Tori and Jenny last season. Jenny is bigger than Tori and has way more strength. However, Jenny’s strategy is why she lost to Tori, moreso than her strength or size. Jenny is strong enough where she could mow down any woman she goes against but her form in her hall brawl against Tori was terrible. The way she ran was terrible and the way she prepared for the collision between her and Tori was terrible.

I’ll also mention CJ vs Zach in BOTS 23. There is a significant size difference between CJ vs Zach’s big ass. CJ initially beat Zach, 2 to nothing. CJ won against Zach because of strategy rather than size. CJ knew Zach was too big to just push back so his strategy was to avoid collision and be faster, which worked for him. CJ’s partner (little Jasmine from RW: Cancun) lost so that meant CJ had to go against Zach again for a tiebreaker. Zach, who almost lost again to CJ, didn’t win because of size. Zach won because of strategy. Zach smartened up and used CJ’s strategy against him. Zach stopped focusing on trying to run CJ over and focused on avoiding collision and getting to the bell faster.

I'm not saying technique and strategy doesn't matter at all but Jenny was much bigger than Dee and unlike previous Hall brawls, there was no room to slip by.  We've seen in the past that some players were able to avoid full collisions, maybe more of a glancing blow and then try to slip by.

In this one, once a player was able to get by his or her opponent, the opponent was almost forced to try to pull him or her back to prevent him or her from having a clear path to the bell.  In previous battles, there were times where both players would just try to make it a race for the bell after short duration of contact, grappling, etc.  This one, the duration of grappling, pulling, pushing was much longer.  Jenny was just able to push Dee all the way to her bell, while being pretty much upright.  She didn't have to get low or make her body more horizontal.

For Nelson and Rogan, I would estimate 20-30 pounds difference and a couple of inches in height.  Nelson did punch above his weight and Rogan said Nelson wore him out.  But obviously the contact took a bigger toll on Nelson, because in the second round after they separated, Rogan stumbled but Nelson stumbled twice, couldn't really build up speed to get to the bell.

Anyways, technique can matter but I don't know that any of them had any special technique.  Fessy suggested to Nelson wrapping his arms around the legs and driving his legs, meaning he'd be horizontal.  Football players lead with the head when they're about to tackle or hit each other, which is part of the reason there's been a lot of concussions.  But it lets them get low and horizontal.

People who haven't played a lot of football would not instinctively lead with the head.  They're not used to it, they don't build up their neck muscles for it, etc.  Even modern football players, tackling technique has deteriorated because the CBA in the NFL limits practices and contact with practices.  So you see a lot of missed tackles, failure to wrap up, etc.  Or they go for kill shots and miss the tackle.

I don't know how good or physical a football player Cory was but he has size so he might have done well in this.  He was a defensive back, who are among the worst tacklers on defense so maybe he wasn't that physical in his football days. Division I safeties, you will find have very thick necks because they train to use their heads as hammers.  

Fessy as a TE prospect played a more physical position but a lot of TEs these days are converted large WRs, who are not great blockers.  But when they do block, TEs are mostly trying to grapple with LBs using their arms, not leading with the head and going for pancake blocks. Still if his coaches had his team do the Oklahoma drills, he would easily dominate the Hall Brawls.

[AntFTW]

15 minutes ago, scrb said:

I'm not saying technique and strategy doesn't matter at all but Jenny was much bigger than Dee and unlike previous Hall brawls, there was no room to slip by.  We've seen in the past that some players were able to avoid full collisions, maybe more of a glancing blow and then try to slip by.

In this one, once a player was able to get by his or her opponent, the opponent was almost forced to try to pull him or her back to prevent him or her from having a clear path to the bell.  In previous battles, there were times where both players would just try to make it a race for the bell after short duration of contact, grappling, etc.  This one, the duration of grappling, pulling, pushing was much longer.  Jenny was just able to push Dee all the way to her bell, while being pretty much upright.  She didn't have to get low or make her body more horizontal.

For Nelson and Rogan, I would estimate 20-30 pounds difference and a couple of inches in height.  Nelson did punch above his weight and Rogan said Nelson wore him out.  But obviously the contact took a bigger toll on Nelson, because in the second round after they separated, Rogan stumbled but Nelson stumbled twice, couldn't really build up speed to get to the bell.

Anyways, technique can matter but I don't know that any of them had any special technique.  Fessy suggested to Nelson wrapping his arms around the legs and driving his legs, meaning he'd be horizontal.  Football players lead with the head when they're about to tackle or hit each other, which is part of the reason there's been a lot of concussions.  But it lets them get low and horizontal.

People who haven't played a lot of football would not instinctively lead with the head.  They're not used to it, they don't build up their neck muscles for it, etc.  Even modern football players, tackling technique has deteriorated because the CBA in the NFL limits practices and contact with practices.  So you see a lot of missed tackles, failure to wrap up, etc.  Or they go for kill shots and miss the tackle.

I don't know how good or physical a football player Cory was but he has size so he might have done well in this.  He was a defensive back, who are among the worst tacklers on defense so maybe he wasn't that physical in his football days. Division I safeties, you will find have very thick necks because they train to use their heads as hammers.  

Fessy as a TE prospect played a more physical position but a lot of TEs these days are converted large WRs, who are not great blockers.  But when they do block, TEs are mostly trying to grapple with LBs using their arms, not leading with the head and going for pancake blocks. Still if his coaches had his team do the Oklahoma drills, he would easily dominate the Hall Brawls.

Did Nelson play a sport? I would assume he did and I'd also assume he wasn't a swimmer lol

Also, I wanna add that Dee had no strategy. Her "strategy" was to face Jenny head on and try push her back, essentially trying to outmuscle Jenny, rather than trying to get around her somehow.

Additionally, I have to admit that production fooled me. I think it was a second round between Rogan and Nelson and they showed Rogan stumbling first and I got out of my seat, took a gasp and thought "OMG! Nelson's about to pull out the win". I would love to see the GoPro footage from this elimination. I hope they post it on Youtube,

[LotusFlower]

2 hours ago, Treehugger9 said:

One of the challenge instagram accounts I follow posted a story yesterday that said that this was an extremely Dee heavy episode and a ton had to be cut out. I'm so mad bc this was one of the best seasons we've had in a really long time and by cutting out Dee, who was the center of 90 percent of the drama, we're left with these boring episodes where so much doesn't make sense. Grrrrr. 

Why did Dee stuff have to be cut out?  (I’m asking that rhetorically).  Especially since the show knew she was eliminated?  It’s just ridiculous how they’ve edited the show since her firing.  Do they think viewers would be infuriated to see her?  What is the blowback they’re so afraid of?

[lasu]

16 hours ago, Lantern7 said:

Maybe Melissa wins, and the horror that she was unknowingly pregnant would be glossed over? Or Jenny gets rewarded after dispatching Dee? That first hit . . . I think Dee spent the Nelson/Rogan battle on the sidelines, puking up bits of intestine.

These two sentences...it's all I could think about watching the women's hall brawl.  What if Melissa had taken that first hit the way Dee did?  I...don't think that would have gone well.  I know the contestants sign their damn lives away, but I hope MTV is shaking at what a PR disaster causing a miscarriage would have been, and will do pregnancy tests throughout future seasons (which, this would indicate they don't do them even at the start of a season and that just seems stupid).  Bayleigh got pregnant during her season of BB too.  I'm not someone who thinks pregnant women need to be bubble wrapped, but I don't think they should be hit with mac trucks in the abdomen either.  I'm so glad she had a beautiful, healthy daughter. 

I was already laughing when Kyle screwed up the car challenge.  And I completely lost it when he said his dad was a stunt driver.  I don't like Kyle, but I also really like Kyle, and it's confusing.

So, it seems like everyone is maturing this season.  Is it the bunker?  They have all said the conditions were insane, and I wonder if they are trauma bonding.  I wonder if this cast will end up closer than most because they "went through something" together.  This has been the worst environment they have ever been in.  Usually, no matter what, at least you are getting a little cash and an all expenses paid tropical vacation.  This season they are having to suffer for it.  I would murder someone if I had to go outside in that freezing cold to use a port-a-potty.

[Jillibean]

1 hour ago, lasu said:

These two sentences...it's all I could think about watching the women's hall brawl.  What if Melissa had taken that first hit the way Dee did?  I...don't think that would have gone well.  I know the contestants sign their damn lives away, but I hope MTV is shaking at what a PR disaster causing a miscarriage would have been, and will do pregnancy tests throughout future seasons (which, this would indicate they don't do them even at the start of a season and that just seems stupid).  Bayleigh got pregnant during her season of BB too.  I'm not someone who thinks pregnant women need to be bubble wrapped, but I don't think they should be hit with mac trucks in the abdomen either.  I'm so glad she had a beautiful, healthy daughter. 

It’s truly frightening to think about how easily this could have happened, and I agree that pregnancy tests should be required. Many women who aren’t trying to get pregnant go for weeks without realizing they are. And I’m pretty sure this isn’t even the first time this had happened—wasn’t Robin unknowingly pregnant when she was on the Duel 2? But even beyond that...is it maybe time to retire Hall Brawl, or alter it to be less devastatingly aggressive? I know it’s a challenge classic, but it is just brutal. And it would be so easy for someone to be paralyzed running with their head tucked like that (which they had to do to protect their faces). 

Quote

I was already laughing when Kyle screwed up the car challenge.  And I completely lost it when he said his dad was a stunt driver.  I don't like Kyle, but I also really like Kyle, and it's confusing.

I so identify with this. I realize he’s a garbage human, but he really is funny. I was dying laughing at him and Nelson in the car challenge. However, I don’t know if I can ever forgive him for driving Cara into Paulie’s waiting, manipulative arms. Now I feel like I’ll never be rid of him and it’s sort of Kyle’s fault. 

Quote

So, it seems like everyone is maturing this season.  Is it the bunker?  They have all said the conditions were insane, and I wonder if they are trauma bonding.  I wonder if this cast will end up closer than most because they "went through something" together.  This has been the worst environment they have ever been in.  Usually, no matter what, at least you are getting a little cash and an all expenses paid tropical vacation.  This season they are having to suffer for it.  I would murder someone if I had to go outside in that freezing cold to use a port-a-potty.

I really think you're onto something here. The cast seems to uninamously agree that it was absolutely terrible to live in the bunker. It’s also been noted that production blacked out the windows of the buses used to transport them places, and that even when outside for missions it was always cold and gray, so they had very little sunlight for the time they were there, and obviously no fresh air while in the bunker. Johnny said in his challenge mania interview a few weeks ago that the conditions were worse than any challenge he’s ever done, including the Island. He also said he has a group text with what he called “the gnarly nine,” but wouldn’t reveal who was in it because of spoilers—after tonight, it seems clear that it has to be the nine people who made it to the final. I’m sure that the cast did bond in a different way as a result of these conditions, especially the people who were there for a month or longer. 

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, lasu said:

I don't like Kyle, but I also really like Kyle, and it's confusing.

Right!

[AntFTW]

BTW, I thought out of all the girls left that Dee was Jenny's biggest competition. I thought Dee and Jenny had the biggest potential to win out of all the girls.

[scrb]

I think Kaycee also is a fitness freak.

The Finals with all the endurance legs sometimes hit the bigger competitors harder than average sized people.

Fessy looks like he can run and run but as strong as he is, he would have to carry a bigger weight if he had to run uphill or even climb vertically in some places.

I seem to recall some portions where they weighed down the guys with more weight than they did the women but they probably overcompensated for the  guys being stronger by giving them more proportionate weight.

Plus if any of them have had limb or joint injuries in the past, which is common for football players, that could hobble them over long distances.

[BK1978]

9 hours ago, lasu said:

I was already laughing when Kyle screwed up the car challenge.  And I completely lost it when he said his dad was a stunt driver.  I don't like Kyle, but I also really like Kyle, and it's confusing.

 

I was that way when Kyle first appeared, but he has grown on me.  He has a very self-deprecating sense of humor, which I have as well, so maybe that is what won me over.  Or maybe it is because the show started being populated with people like Bear, Paulie, and Josh.  So compared to them Kyle is just the entertaining rouge.  Though I will say this my dislike of Bear has waned a little as well after seeing clips of him fucking with Aubrey O'Day and Frankie Grande on British Celebrity Big Brother.  I guess it is one of those enemy of my enemy type of deals, who knows.

[Zima]

On 7/8/2020 at 11:25 PM, Never Again said:

I can’t stand Rogan and I detest Bayleigh.  I would have loved Bayleigh vs Dee, they are both bad people but honestly Bayleigh’s charity scam is worse.  I don’t doubt Dee is a racist but Bayleigh cheated a friend with cancer, and cheated all the people who bought tickets too.  And then in her Bayleigh way, went on the offense instead of defense when she and her man got called out. 

Omg, whaat? Details, please! 

 

23 hours ago, Spencer Hastings said:

I can’t decide if Nelson is stupid or an incredibly exceptional friend. I don’t think I would’ve done that for my best friend.  I’d like to say that I would but...

Also glad that we can stop playing “Spot Dee.” 

I was kind of hoping that Dee made it into the final, just to see what kinds of crazy editing they would have done to cut her out as much as possible, lmao. 

15 hours ago, Treehugger9 said:

One of the challenge instagram accounts I follow posted a story yesterday that said that this was an extremely Dee heavy episode and a ton had to be cut out. I'm so mad bc this was one of the best seasons we've had in a really long time and by cutting out Dee, who was the center of 90 percent of the drama, we're left with these boring episodes where so much doesn't make sense. Grrrrr. 

Yeah, I am super bummed that they did this. I wish there was someplace to watch all of the original episodes. 

[IndyMischa]

21 hours ago, LotusFlower said:

Why did Dee stuff have to be cut out?  (I’m asking that rhetorically).  Especially since the show knew she was eliminated?  It’s just ridiculous how they’ve edited the show since her firing.  Do they think viewers would be infuriated to see her?  What is the blowback they’re so afraid of?

I think it was more punitive (to Dee) than for the sake of viewers. Fame is the primary goal for these attention whore, so turning off the attention spigot is the worst thing that can happen. 

8 hours ago, Zima said:

[re Swaggy and Bayleigh's cancer charity scam] Omg, whaat? Details, please! 

It's far too delicious/disgusting a trainwreck to summarize. Start with Lady Calypso's post, most of the way down this page. https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/6797-bb-in-the-media-outside-the-fishbowl/page/50/#comments

 

[peachmangosteen]

@Zima Direct link to @Lady Calypso's post summarizing the Bayleigh/Swaggy C charity drama.

[AntFTW]

Those editors are gonna miss that overtime pay for editing out Dee now that she's eliminated 😂

[MaggieG]

Rogan saying "Jenny, bless her cotton socks" made me laugh more then it probably should have. I rewound it several times. 

A small part of me was kinda hoping Dee would win the whole thing just to see how the editors would try to work around it

[Never Again]

19 hours ago, Zima said:

On 7/8/2020 at 11:25 PM, Never Again said:

I can’t stand Rogan and I detest Bayleigh.  I would have loved Bayleigh vs Dee, they are both bad people but honestly Bayleigh’s charity scam is worse.  I don’t doubt Dee is a racist but Bayleigh cheated a friend with cancer, and cheated all the people who bought tickets too.  And then in her Bayleigh way, went on the offense instead of defense when she and her man got called out. 

Omg, whaat? Details, please!

 

here’s just one link of many.  They are detestable!
 

https://soapdirt.com/big-brother-swaggy-c-fessy-take-cancer-money-kevin-schlehuber-family-outraged/

[GonnahearmeRoar]

Enjoying the season and I missed out on what Dee said. Was it awful? Jenny crushed that! Dee had no chance against that beast😀

[tinderbox]

On 7/8/2020 at 8:50 PM, AntFTW said:

I think Johnny thinks he can beat Fessy. I believe that Johnny thinks Rogan is tougher competition than Fessy and that Rogan is a more well-rounded competitor. Additionally, I also think Johnny doesn't really care as much about rest of the guys left as he thinks he can beat them all.....

 

 

I agree with you but hope we are both wrong.