S05.E01: The Fiery Cross

[Athena]

Quote

Governor Tryon reminds Jamie of his obligation to hunt down and kill Murtagh Fitzgibbons.

Reminder: This is the No Book Talk topic. No discussion of the books is allowed including saying "in the books..." Posts may be removed without warning.

[Fallacy]

Starz released the episode early for Valentine’s Day. Am I the only one who has already watched it? I won’t say anything else about it yet in case I am. 

Edited February 15, 2020 by Fallacy
Autocorrect error

[Carlylefan]

I watched it twice after midnight.  I think we’re in for a very good season. The kilted Scot is back! Jamie is such a warrior!

[cardigirl]

I watched it this morning before work and again tonight. I liked it, although I though parts of it were a bit cheesy. 😉But yay! Outlander is back! 

[metaphor]

So very glad the show is back! I've missed the Frasers and their growing family. 

I thought the montage of the three couples (+ Fergus/Marsali) was really well done, demonstrating their differing situations. 

I was also very moved by Jamie and Murtagh's conversation. 

So far, a very promising start for the season. Can't wait for next week. 

[BitterApple]

I was surprised Fergus and Marsali are now 2.5 kids deep, I didn't think there was that big of a time passage considering Brianna's son looked maybe six months older at most. Minor nitpick, but something I couldn't help but notice.

I thought the wedding was beautiful, although the generational sex montage kind of grossed me out.

Lord John sitting alone and lonely broke my heart. Please show, find him someone to love. 

 

 

Edited February 16, 2020 by BitterApple

[Otherkate]

I was excited for this new episode, but ended up disappointed. I'm not sure I can keep going with the show if Briana and Roger are going to be such a focus. I can't stand either one of them and find it excruciating to have to watch them in their sex scenes.

It was also an incredibly cheesy episode. I know the show is always pretty romantic, but I never felt like it was cheesy before. Hoping I like next week's more. I do enjoy seeing more of Lord John, though.

 

 

[cardigirl]

5 hours ago, BitterApple said:

I was surprised Fergus and Marsali are now 2.5 kids deep, I didn't think there was that big of a time passage considering Brianna's son looked maybe six months older at most. Minor nitpick, but something I couldn't help but notice.

I thought the wedding was beautiful, although the generational sex montage kind of grossed me out.

Lord John sitting alone and lonely broke my heart. Please show, find him someone to love. 

 

 

They were holding Brianna and Roger’s son during the wedding. I think. I think they’re at one and a half kids still. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I know the show wanted us to see the burgeoning community coming together, but as someone who is not a fan of Brianna/Roger, it was a lot to have an entire episode dedicated to their wedding.

Beyond that, there wasn't a lot of plot in this episode. Jocasta's getting married, Murtagh is leaving, and Jamie rallied the locals before leaving to hunt for his BFF. The other 55 minutes of the episode was the wedding. The weird thing is that I normally love weddings (in real life as well as on tv/in movies) but I found myself wanting to fast forward through this one. The only reason I didn't was because I figured since it was the season premiere, something would happen eventually.

14 hours ago, BitterApple said:

Lord John sitting alone and lonely broke my heart. Please show, find him someone to love. 

I second this! I love John and I want him to be happy so I hope he finds someone.

ETA: I loved when Jamie referred to Fergus as "son of my name and of my heart." Awwwww!

Edited February 16, 2020 by ElectricBoogaloo

[Cdh20]

On 2/16/2020 at 9:13 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

 I love John and I want him to be happy so I hope he finds someone.

ETA: I loved when Jamie referred to Fergus as "son of my name and of my heart." Awwwww!

This!

 

I hosted a premiere party so watched with a bunch of family & friends. It's fun but you miss a lot, so I need to watch again. First impressions: the loud music & brightness seemed Hallmarky & un Outlanderish (the first 20 mins). But I loved lots of moments:

Bridesmaid Jamie gathering Brianna's wedding things (just like he did for Claire).

Jamie & Claire making googly eyes at each other & reciting the vows during the ceremony.

Shirtless Jamie ( more please)!

Some Roger redemption.

Loved Marsali & tongue twisters .

More humour overall was nice.

Murtagh must not die (and Jamie should always cry!)

 

 

 

Edited February 17, 2020 by Cdh20
adding to post

[taanja]

On 2/16/2020 at 1:36 AM, cardigirl said:

They were holding Brianna and Roger’s son during the wedding. I think. I think they’re at one and a half kids still. 

I thought that at first but upon re-watch -- nope. Brianna and Rogers kid is in the basket dealio by Claire and Jaime.

Fergus and whatshername look like they had the older boy -- who literally grew a few years in the time jump of what? six months? and another baby plus one on the way.

also the house? suddenly became a mansion? huh?

Other than that weird time inconsistency == the dress Brianna wore was amazing! Loved it!

[Ziggy]

1 hour ago, taanja said:

also the house? suddenly became a mansion? huh?

Different house.  Jamie and Claire have a new, bigger house and gave Roger and Bree their (smaller) cabin.

[jmnf19]

On 2/14/2020 at 8:38 PM, Fallacy said:

Starz released the episode early for Valentine’s Day. Am I the only one who has already watched it? I won’t say anything else about it yet in case I am. 

Never mind early, I didn't even know it was back! I thought it was returning in April. Off to watch now.

Will the subsequent episodes now be dropped at midnight on Sunday (Saturday night)?

 

Edited February 18, 2020 by jmnf19
spelling

[cardigirl]

4 hours ago, taanja said:

I thought that at first but upon re-watch -- nope. Brianna and Rogers kid is in the basket dealio by Claire and Jaime.

Fergus and whatshername look like they had the older boy -- who literally grew a few years in the time jump of what? six months? and another baby plus one on the way.

also the house? suddenly became a mansion? huh?

Other than that weird time inconsistency == the dress Brianna wore was amazing! Loved it!

The basket dealio is by Fergus and Marsali's feet during the ceremony. I rewatched it too.  When Brianna and Roger are saying their vows and Claire and Jamie are sitting there watching them, there is no basket at their feet.  Claire walks down the path ahead of Brianna and Jamie and sits by herself until Jamie brings Brianna to Roger, then he goes and sits with Claire and they have no baby with them.

[Jadzia]

Wow, I was pretty bored by this. At the halfway mark I looked at the clock and realized that the only thing that happened was Brianna and Roger getting married. Yawn. 

I'm not sure exactly why Jamie was rallying the troops because I think I was checked out by then. 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Although I laughed when Roger told Jocasta to shove her money up her arse, the practical part of me wanted to remind him of what he and Jamie had just talked about that morning - Roger has no useful skills that would bring an income during this time period. He now has a wife and child to support and no job. I'm not saying he should be a kiss ass just to get Jocasta's money but seeing as his financial prospects at present are "sponge off the in-laws" (one of whom thinks he has hair ticks - hahaha), maybe not losing your temper with one of your wife's few relatives is something to consider. Then again, Jocasta loved it so what the hell do I know?

[BitterApple]

9 hours ago, Jadzia said:

Wow, I was pretty bored by this. At the halfway mark I looked at the clock and realized that the only thing that happened was Brianna and Roger getting married. Yawn. 

I'm not sure exactly why Jamie was rallying the troops because I think I was checked out by then. 

It seems like people either loved the episode or thought it dragged. I liked it, my mother hated it. The S4 premiere was a bit clunky, then the action picked up, so I'm assuming the same will happen with S5.

5 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

r. Then again, Jocasta loved it so what the hell do I know?

I didn't understand Jocasta's motivation for getting Roger all riled up? Was she trying to determine his true feelings for Jem?

[taanja]

12 hours ago, cardigirl said:

The basket dealio is by Fergus and Marsali's feet during the ceremony. I rewatched it too.  When Brianna and Roger are saying their vows and Claire and Jamie are sitting there watching them, there is no basket at their feet.  Claire walks down the path ahead of Brianna and Jamie and sits by herself until Jamie brings Brianna to Roger, then he goes and sits with Claire and they have no baby with them.

haha! I'll have to watch again -- this time specifically looking for that baby!

All I know is when Fergus and whatshername rescued Murtagh from jail -- their baby was small enough to lay in a basket in the back of the cart/wagon and then 6 months later he looks to be about 3-4 years old.

 

[Cdh20]

1 hour ago, BitterApple said:

It seems like people either loved the episode or thought it dragged. I liked it, my mother hated it. The S4 premiere was a bit clunky, then the action picked up, so I'm assuming the same will happen with S5.

I didn't understand Jocasta's motivation for getting Roger all riled up? Was she trying to determine his true feelings for Jem?

The general consensus at my premiere party was that it was a bit slow, but was setting up all the storylines, much like each year’s openers. Usually the excitement starts midseason.

 

I believe she was indeed trying to get him to do exactly what he did, make an oath to Jem!

[greekmom]

I did like the part that Roger sang L-o-v-e (L Is For The Way You Look At Me) song to Brianna. 

But seriously the guy has no skills, what will he do besides mooch off his FIL to make some cash. 

[taanja]

19 minutes ago, greekmom said:

I did like the part that Roger sang L-o-v-e (L Is For The Way You Look At Me) song to Brianna. 

But seriously the guy has no skills, what will he do besides mooch off his FIL to make some cash. 

Well to be fair to ole Rodge-- he has 20th century skilz-- 18th century? not so much. He is a man out of time to be sure.

There is no way I would survive a month in that time period. I feel for Roger.

 

[toolazy]

13 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Although I laughed when Roger told Jocasta to shove her money up her arse, the practical part of me wanted to remind him of what he and Jamie had just talked about that morning - Roger has no useful skills that would bring an income during this time period. He now has a wife and child to support and no job. I'm not saying he should be a kiss ass just to get Jocasta's money but seeing as his financial prospects at present are "sponge off the in-laws" (one of whom thinks he has hair ticks - hahaha), maybe not losing your temper with one of your wife's few relatives is something to consider. Then again, Jocasta loved it so what the hell do I know?

She owns slaves - that's the main reason they don't want her money. They also don't want to be beholden to her, because she isn't entirely trustworthy.

 

8 hours ago, BitterApple said:

It seems like people either loved the episode or thought it dragged. I liked it, my mother hated it. The S4 premiere was a bit clunky, then the action picked up, so I'm assuming the same will happen with S5.

I didn't understand Jocasta's motivation for getting Roger all riled up? Was she trying to determine his true feelings for Jem?

Yes. She was testing his character.

 

1 hour ago, taanja said:

Well to be fair to ole Rodge-- he has 20th century skilz-- 18th century? not so much. He is a man out of time to be sure.

There is no way I would survive a month in that time period. I feel for Roger.

 

He might be better off in a city.  It's the wilderness, more than the year, that is his problem right now.  

 

 

I liked the episode a lot. I realized that it's the first Outlander episode in a while that didn't piss me off.  Except the house. That pisses me off.  

Edited February 18, 2020 by toolazy

[greekmom]

On 2/15/2020 at 9:01 PM, BitterApple said:

I thought the wedding was beautiful, although the generational sex montage kind of grossed me out.

I'm no prude but that's what turned me off from Outlander after season 2. 

 

[taanja]

15 hours ago, toolazy said:

I liked the episode a lot. I realized that it's the first Outlander episode in a while that didn't piss me off.  Except the house. That pisses me off.  

I watched again and yup. me too. That where did it suddenly come from house!

Cuz they have Claire in the background saying crap like ... Fraiser's Ridge filled up with people and as the seasons pass blah blah blah and the camera pans back and there's a big mansion.

Um... what seasons?

The show left off literally the day Roger returns -- the baby looked to be about 3 - 4 months old. It now looks to be about 9 months old. 

again I ask ... what seasons? How can there be "seasons" when the kid isn't even a year old?

Took me right out of the show.

[Nidratime]

Roger is out of place in the wilderness, although I'm guessing he can fish. But, he could easily teach at a college, and there were colleges in America at that time: Harvard, William and Mary, Yale, Princeton, King's or Columbia, the University of Pennsylvania, Brown, Dartmouth, and Queen's or Rutgers. Of course, none of them were down where he is. He could also probably clerk at a law office and even practice law. He could work in any office. He could be a publisher or printer (like Jamie was). There are probably a number of other jobs he could do, but none of them are located on the Ridge.

[ferjy]

On 2/18/2020 at 4:38 PM, taanja said:

Well to be fair to ole Rodge-- he has 20th century skilz-- 18th century? not so much. He is a man out of time to be sure.

There is no way I would survive a month in that time period. I feel for Roger.

 

Wait until Brianna tells him they won't be returning to their time. The look Brianna gave Roger when he mentioned going back.

 

 

[ferjy]

14 hours ago, taanja said:

I watched again and yup. me too. That where did it suddenly come from house!

Cuz they have Claire in the background saying crap like ... Fraiser's Ridge filled up with people and as the seasons pass blah blah blah and the camera pans back and there's a big mansion.

Um... what seasons?

The show left off literally the day Roger returns -- the baby looked to be about 3 - 4 months old. It now looks to be about 9 months old. 

again I ask ... what seasons? How can there be "seasons" when the kid isn't even a year old?

Took me right out of the show.

Actually, there was the conversation between them when Jamie was shaving Roger that alerted us to it. Jamie said he had been working on the new house for so long, and Roger thanked Jamie for giving him and Brianna the older small house to live in.

 

Edited February 20, 2020 by ferjy

[ferjy]

On 2/15/2020 at 9:01 PM, BitterApple said:

I was surprised Fergus and Marsali are now 2.5 kids deep, I didn't think there was that big of a time passage considering Brianna's son looked maybe six months older at most. Minor nitpick, but something I couldn't help but notice.

I thought the wedding was beautiful, although the generational sex montage kind of grossed me out.

Lord John sitting alone and lonely broke my heart. Please show, find him someone to love. 

 

 

That was pretty bad. How about a nice photo of the four generations instead. I half expected them to show the babies having a tumble!

 

[jmnf19]

1 hour ago, ferjy said:

Wait until Brianna tells him they won't be returning to their time. The look Brianna gave Roger when he mentioned going back.

 

 

I can't remember. Did Claire tell Brianna that that the baby might not make it through the stones?

[Cdh20]

36 minutes ago, jmnf19 said:

I can't remember. Did Claire tell Brianna that that the baby might not make it through the stones?

In season 4 when Bree was pregnant Claire said she had no idea if babies could go through, ( or how the time travel gene works). Although she was a few months pregnant with Bree when she returned to 1948.

[jenn31]

On 2/17/2020 at 8:30 PM, jmnf19 said:

Never mind early, I didn't even know it was back! I thought it was returning in April. Off to watch now.

Will the subsequent episodes now be dropped at midnight on Sunday (Saturday night)?

 

Yes, the Starz app releases it at midnight Sunday. 

[jmnf19]

19 minutes ago, Cdh20 said:

In season 4 when Bree was pregnant Claire said she had no idea if babies could go through, ( or how the time travel gene works). Although she was a few months pregnant with Bree when she returned to 1948.

Thanks. I thought it was something like that.

[jmnf19]

14 minutes ago, jenn31 said:

Yes, the Starz app releases it at midnight Sunday. 

Thanks. I was hoping that now that we have Starz in Canada that they would air Outlander on that channel and on the Crave app, as they did with The Rook. But it's still on W, who don't air it until Sunday at 9 p.m. (and no app). With loads of commercials (Starz has no commercials). ☹️

[ferjy]

On 2/18/2020 at 9:56 AM, taanja said:

All I know is when Fergus and whatshername rescued Murtagh from jail -- their baby was small enough to lay in a basket in the back of the cart/wagon and then 6 months later he looks to be about 3-4 years old.

lol And Claire and Jamie, still all shiny faced and looking 30 years old.

 

[ferjy]

I forgot to mention that I really like the new theme song rendition. I never liked the previous singer’s voice, for one, and I loved the harmony in this version. I used to mute the TV when the theme song came on, now I can let it play!

 

 

[Cdh20]

5 hours ago, ferjy said:

lol And Claire and Jamie, still all shiny faced and looking 30 years old.

 

I like my Jamie & Claire all young & beautiful, thank you!!!

[Cdh20]

7 hours ago, jmnf19 said:

Thanks. I was hoping that now that we have Starz in Canada that they would air Outlander on that channel and on the Crave app, as they did with The Rook. But it's still on W, who don't air it until Sunday at 9 p.m. (and no app). With loads of commercials (Starz has no commercials). ☹️

I live in Canada too, & the commercials are the worst!! I did prefer watching those first few seasons on Netflix!!

[Lola82]

I've been binge watching this show for the past couple of weeks and I finally caught up. I can now join the discussion, yay!

Every time there is a scene between Roger and Bree, I'm upset that they're taking the time away from other characters. I don't like either of them and the acting is sub par. Having the sex scenes switch from couple to couple just showed me how much chemistry Sam and Caitriona have compared to the others. 

[Cdh20]

3 hours ago, Lola82 said:

I've been binge watching this show for the past couple of weeks and I finally caught up. I can now join the discussion, yay!

Every time there is a scene between Roger and Bree, I'm upset that they're taking the time away from other characters. I don't like either of them and the acting is sub par. Having the sex scenes switch from couple to couple just showed me how much chemistry Sam and Caitriona have compared to the others. 

To be fair no one in the history of tv has the chemistry that Sam & Cait have. 

[taanja]

11 minutes ago, Cdh20 said:

To be fair no one in the history of tv has the chemistry that Sam & Cait have. 

Oh child! You are young!

Barbara Eden and Larry Hagman! ( Jeannie and Tony) <<< they were so smoking hot they had the TV censers in an uproar most of the time!

Anthony Geary and Genie Francis!!! (Luke and Laura!) <<< College campuses came to a standstill on the day they were married! (November 16, 1981; the event was watched by 30 million viewers and remains the highest-rated hour in American soap opera history)

^^^ and that's just off the top of my head.

I like Jaime and Claire well enough but chemistry is subjective to say the least. I have seen hotter couples in my time is all I am saying.

[Cdh20]

37 minutes ago, taanja said:

Oh child! You are young!

Barbara Eden and Larry Hagman! ( Jeannie and Tony) <<< they were so smoking hot they had the TV censers in an uproar most of the time!

Anthony Geary and Genie Francis!!! (Luke and Laura!) <<< College campuses came to a standstill on the day they were married! (November 16, 1981; the event was watched by 30 million viewers and remains the highest-rated hour in American soap opera history)

^^^ and that's just off the top of my head.

I like Jaime and Claire well enough but chemistry is subjective to say the least. I have seen hotter couples in my time is all I am saying.

🤣🤣🤣thanks for calling me young. Today is my birthday & I wish I was 25! 

[taanja]

Just now, Cdh20 said:

🤣🤣🤣thanks for calling me young. Today is my birthday & I wish I was 25! 

Happy Birthday!

I Dream Of Jeannie premiered in 1965 -- I was old enough to appreciate the chemistry between the two actors (They were the first couple I ever shipped) so that ought to tell you what an old lady I am!

Don't get me wrong -- I like Claire and Jaime -- I really do. 

[Cdh20]

2 minutes ago, taanja said:

Happy Birthday!

I Dream Of Jeannie premiered in 1965 -- I was old enough to appreciate the chemistry between the two actors (They were the first couple I ever shipped) so that ought to tell you what an old lady I am!

Don't get me wrong -- I like Claire and Jaime -- I really do. 

Thanks for the birthday wishes! I’ve been watching Tv since the 70’s, & I stand by what I said! 

[Otherkate]

I've seen plenty of couples with just as much chemistry as Sam and Cait, I don't think comparisons to them is the problem. For me the problem is that Roger and Bri are both completely devoid of chemistry with one another and the actress who plays Bri is just painful for me to watch try to act in every scene she has. I can barely take her in the scenes with Sam and I'd be happy to watch that guy do just about anything. I'm sure she's a nice person, but yeesh. On the other end, the actor playing Roger seems fine to me, but I can't stand the character.

I honestly couldn't believe that the entire premiere was so heavy on those 2 characters. 

Edited February 20, 2020 by Otherkate

[theschnauzers]

I’ve been trying to figure out the time jump in my mind and the are various clues. For instance, Fergus wife and just born baby were still in Fayetteville at the end of season four, and Roger has just returned to Bree at River Run with their newborn baby. We don’t know how manny settlers were at the Ridge, but Murtaugh and others were already reaching out to Scots in the Carolinas to move and settle there with the promise of land without the rents and taxes of more settled areas.

By the size of the settlers, it’s impractical to think only six months had past. By the time season five begins, enough time has passed, to attracted what has to be a couple hundred settlers, for the wedding to be planned, for the big house to ba mostly finished, and for invites to be sent out to travelers such as Governor Tyron, Lord John and Aunt Jocasta, and for Aunt Jocasta to be wooed by Duncan Innis. So my guess is two to two and a half years, given travel in those days, and how long it took by carriage, or horseback. That amount of time would smooth out who was where and who was living where as this episode began. 

[LadyArcadia]

7 hours ago, theschnauzers said:

I’ve been trying to figure out the time jump in my mind and the are various clues. For instance, Fergus wife and just born baby were still in Fayetteville at the end of season four, and Roger has just returned to Bree at River Run with their newborn baby. We don’t know how manny settlers were at the Ridge, but Murtaugh and others were already reaching out to Scots in the Carolinas to move and settle there with the promise of land without the rents and taxes of more settled areas.

By the size of the settlers, it’s impractical to think only six months had past. By the time season five begins, enough time has passed, to attracted what has to be a couple hundred settlers, for the wedding to be planned, for the big house to ba mostly finished, and for invites to be sent out to travelers such as Governor Tyron, Lord John and Aunt Jocasta, and for Aunt Jocasta to be wooed by Duncan Innis. So my guess is two to two and a half years, given travel in those days, and how long it took by carriage, or horseback. That amount of time would smooth out who was where and who was living where as this episode began. 

It can't be two years since the last season as Jem looked to be about six months old.  Although the rest of it makes sense. 

[taanja]

52 minutes ago, LadyArcadia said:

It can't be two years since the last season as Jem looked to be about six months old.  Although the rest of it makes sense. 

Exactly! and as I said before -- Claire's voice over said "seasons' had passed -- but that was NOT reflected in the age of the baby. Jem or whatever it's name is looked to be about 9 months -- not 2 or 3 years old.

But Fergus's kid looked to be about 3- 4 years old and last time we saw it was when they were rescuing Murtagh from prison (Brianna was greatly preggers and had the kid soon after) and he looked then to be about 9 months to 1 year old.

So... they aged progressed one kid and kept the other a baby?

[Cdh20]

I think it's supposed to be later that same year, probably 5/6 mths later(still 1770?), & like they can't control the weather for the seasons, they also can't have the kids be just the right size! *hand wave*. I will read the book when the season is over, & find out!

I just rewatched & enjoyed it more! I was able to watch everyone's expressions, & listen more closely to the dialogue. This is one show where you need to watch each character so closely to see how they feel! 

Edited February 22, 2020 by Cdh20
adding a thought

[DoctorAtomic]

I was confused about the time jump too.

I did get quite a kick out of the drinking game where you have to say the 'peter piper picked a peck of pickled peppers' phrases though.

I was curious that Roger said 'when we get back.'

Edited February 22, 2020 by DoctorAtomic

[DoctorAtomic]

On 2/15/2020 at 7:23 PM, Otherkate said:

I'm not sure I can keep going with the show if Briana and Roger are going to be such a focus. I can't stand either one of them and find it excruciating to have to watch them in their sex scenes.

I wouldn't go so far as to say I can't stand them, but there's clearly more drama surrounding Jamie because of having to hunt down Murtagh and Claire going around claire-ing up all over the place. But it is only the first episode and they're the focus because it's their wedding. I don't think we need to see Roger learning how to shave, although him having to learn a trade could be interesting. It's not exactly his fault that he's useless.

I like it when the show is about a race against history and there's still the fire to deal with, so I'm hoping that comes into play sooner than later, but I get it.