Robin Hood: He Owes a Great Debt to Everyone

[Camera One]

From Speculation without Spoilers Thread:

 

I strongly disagree, and in fact this is one of the things that's disappointed me about OUAT's Robin thus far: he's not gray at all! He's a very standard (and bland) Good Guy. Hook is a far grayer character than Robin. The Knave from Once: Wonderland, who's mostly a good guy, is a grayer character than Robin.* Hell, freaking Snow White with her "dark spot" is grayer than Robin! There's no edge to this Robin at all (and here I blame acting as well as writing, because Tom Ellis had more edge in 5 minutes in 'Lacey' than Sean Maguire mustered in an entire season, and brought more dashing charm to boot).

 

Maybe he will grow on me yet, but after half a season, I still find him very bland.  I usually like the "nice guys" on a show and I don't always need edge, but this Robin Hood seems to lack a personality.  Tom Ellis's Robin Hood had an intensity that I just don't find with Sean Maguire's Robin Hood.  

 

A lot of it is the writing, for sure.  If they were going to give Robin Hood such a prominent role, at the very least give us his origin story to find out why he's stealing from the rich to give to the poor.  In some ways, I can't even visualize him stealing from the rich.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Camera One

[Mari]

From Speculation without Spoilers Thread:

 

Stealinghome:

 

 

 

Maybe he will grow on me yet, but after half a season, I still find him very bland.  I usually like the "nice guys" on a show and I don't always need edge, but this Robin Hood seems to lack a personality.  Tom Ellis's Robin Hood had an intensity that I just don't find with Sean Maguire's Robin Hood.  A lot of it is the writing, for sure.  If they were going to give Robin Hood such a prominent role, at the very least give us his origin story to find out why he's stealing from the rich to give to the poor.  In some ways, I can't even visualize him stealing from the rich.  

Yes.  And if the prominent role is to be a romance with Regina, there should be more build-up than "You have a tattoo?  Here's my heart." and "You killed a bunch of people?  That's really sexy." 

 

They didn't invest enough quality screen time in him for me to care about him as a person, and they put so little thought into the Regina/Robin romance that the only reason I care that might've been scuttled is that I'm afraid I'll have to listen to Regina whine if I continue to watch the show.

[Wandering1]

Yes.  And if the prominent role is to be a romance with Regina, there should be more build-up than "You have a tattoo?  Here's my heart." and "You killed a bunch of people?  That's really sexy." 

 

They didn't invest enough quality screen time in him for me to care about him as a person, and they put so little thought into the Regina/Robin romance that the only reason I care that might've been scuttled is that I'm afraid I'll have to listen to Regina whine if I continue to watch the show.

Wow, couldn't disagree more. Robin was introduced to Regina YEARS before they ever met. I think the show did a great job of showing them becoming familiar with each other and building some trust before they started a romantic relationship. Looking forward to seeing their relationship develop. It was a nice change to see two people that were actually interested in each other. Something other pairings have lacked.

[Rumsy4]

 

Robin was willing to follow Regina into her castle to help Snow and Charming. He was willing to go into Rumple's castle at a risk to help everyone.

 

From the Speculation thread. Robin has a strong sense of debt, and he followed Regina into the palace because he felt that he owed her a debt for having saved wee Roland's life from the flying monkey. And helping them get into Rumple's castle seems like a standard good thing to do. It does not make him seem morally gray. I hope we see some flashbacks of him doing some gritty things, otherwise, all he seems to be is a really good guy who can be a pushover at times. For instance, he should never have allowed Neal use his son as bait. If he felt that he owed Rumple a life-debt, he could have risked his life to repay it, but he risked his son's life. I can't see any merit to that. Overall, I haven't been very impressed with Robin Hood's character so far. 

[Camera One]

And then there's the bizarro way in which they tried to have him "bond" with other characters, with questionable success. Like when he asked Charming in the stables, "Is there anything you want to talk about?" I know he's a nice guy and all but could it be a little less abrupt?

Robin was willing to follow Regina into her castle to help Snow and Charming. He was willing to go into Rumple's castle at a risk to help everyone.

I don't think there's a question that he is brave. All that psychoanalysis of Regina during their long tour into the Castle made me wonder if he was Archie in disguise.

[Mari]

Wow, couldn't disagree more. Robin was introduced to Regina YEARS before they ever met. I think the show did a great job of showing them becoming familiar with each other and building some trust before they started a romantic relationship. Looking forward to seeing their relationship develop. It was a nice change to see two people that were actually interested in each other. Something other pairings have lacked.

Could you elaborate, please?    Because from what I saw on the show, they actually met for the first time after Regina destroyed the original curse, sending everyone but Henry and Emma back to the Enchanted Forest. 

 

While back in the Enchanted Forest, they had only a couple of scenes, and I can't say that that was enough to make a relationship--especially since they weren't necessarily all friendly.

 

When zapped back to Storybrooke--a time period that covers only days or a couple of weeks--their first interaction (where they don't remember the year in the Enchanted Forest) seems to be at Zelena's farmhouse, where Robin uses all the people killed as a come-on line

 

Did Regina know for years that there was someone she could love?  Yes.  But, then she deliberately rejected that person before she even met him, and went off into the world to kill a bunch of people and ruin a bunch of lives.  In the meantime, Robin met someone else he loved, and had a child, and because of Regina, she was killed. 

 

In my opinion, not exactly a romantic build-up for the ages.

[Wandering1]

I would love to see more flashbacks but I don't think it is required. He's Robin Hood, everyone knows his history. He's a thief. I love that he isn't as judgmental as some of the other characters. He also has his own sense of morals and values, which I love.

[jaytee1812]

From Speculation without Spoilers Thread:

 

 

Maybe he will grow on me yet, but after half a season, I still find him very bland.  I usually like the "nice guys" on a show and I don't always need edge, but this Robin Hood seems to lack a personality.  Tom Ellis's Robin Hood had an intensity that I just don't find with Sean Maguire's Robin Hood.  

 

A lot of it is the writing, for sure.  If they were going to give Robin Hood such a prominent role, at the very least give us his origin story to find out why he's stealing from the rich to give to the poor.  In some ways, I can't even visualize him stealing from the rich.

 

I've been watching Sean Maguire on TV since he was 12 years old and I don't think I've ever seen him play anyone who wasn't essentially a good guy. That's one of the reasons I love watching him. 

 

I thought Robin was always potrayed as someone with no grey areas, so far anyway (although season 2 is a little hazy for me). He follows 'good' or morally right no matter what, whether that violates laws or rules. 

[Mari]

I would love to see more flashbacks but I don't think it is required. He's Robin Hood, everyone knows his history. He's a thief. I love that he isn't as judgmental as some of the other characters. He also has his own sense of morals and values, which I love.

There's a difference between being judgmental and having good judgment.

 

I can't say that Robin has demonstrated either quality.

[Serena]

Wow, couldn't disagree more. Robin was introduced to Regina YEARS before they ever met. I think the show did a great job of showing them becoming familiar with each other and building some trust before they started a romantic relationship. Looking forward to seeing their relationship develop. It was a nice change to see two people that were actually interested in each other. Something other pairings have lacked.

The idea of Robin was introduced to her years before, maybe, but not Robin as a person. I can believe Regina would love the idea of "fated man who will love me always", I just don't buy that she loves Robin for the person he is. Because she's known him for a week (amongs other things).

 

I don't think much of Sean's acting so far, but to his credit, no one could make lines like "Who knew the EQ had a soft spot for children?" not cringeworthy.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Serena

[Wandering1]

There's a difference between being judgmental and having good judgment.

 

I can't say that Robin has demonstrated either quality.

Your opinion. But I think your wrong.

The idea of Robin was introduced to her years before, maybe, but not Robin as a person. I can believe Regina would love the idea of "fated man who will love me always", I just don't buy that she loves Robin for the person he is. Because she's known him for a week (amongs other things).

 

I don't think much of Sean's acting so far, but to his credit, no one could make lines like "Who knew the EQ had a soft spot for children?" not cringeworthy.

Again. No. Robin was introduced as her soul mate. Not true love. She made the choice to walk away from him. She made the choice to trust in him YEARS later. Both had a choice as to whether or not they entered into a relationship.

 

I guess to each his own about the dialogue. I mean maybe that is why I laughed hysterically when Hook claimed Emma saved everyone. I guess he'll say anything to sleep with her.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Wandering1

[Rumsy4]

 

I don't think much of Sean's acting so far, but to his credit, no one could make lines like "Who knew the EQ had a soft spot for children?" not cringeworthy.

 

She does have a soft spot for children--with gravy, not butter. Sorry! :-p

[YaddaYadda]

I would love to see more flashbacks but I don't think it is required. He's Robin Hood, everyone knows his history. He's a thief. I love that he isn't as judgmental as some of the other characters. He also has his own sense of morals and values, which I love.

But that's the thing with OUaT, the show is not really in line with the stories we know.  Snow White clocked Prince Charming and Prince Charming was raised a shepherd and Rumple is also Beast and the Crocodile and Pan was an evil little shit.

 

So whose to say that Robin Hood is the guy we grew up reading about?  I'm sure they would muck up Camelot and King Arthur if they ever decide to do that story.

 

Robin needs to be fleshed out as much as the other characters especially if he's about to be with Regina.  For me personally, there's a disconnect between Robin who was fighting the Sherriff and King John and the Robin who is apparently in love or in the process of falling in love with Regina.

[Wandering1]

I don't see the disconnect, but I would never argue against Robin getting more screen time. :)

[Mari]

But that's the thing with OUaT, the show is not really in line with the stories we know.  Snow White clocked Prince Charming and Prince Charming was raised a shepherd and Rumple is also Beast and the Crocodile and Pan was an evil little shit.

 

So whose to say that Robin Hood is the guy we grew up reading about?  I'm sure they would muck up Camelot and King Arthur if they ever decide to do that story.

 

Robin needs to be fleshed out as much as the other characters especially if he's about to be with Regina.  For me personally, there's a disconnect between Robin who was fighting the Sherriff and King John and the Robin who is apparently in love or in the process of falling in love with Regina.

 

 

I don't see the disconnect, but I would never argue against Robin getting more screen time. :)

The reason so many of us see a disconnect is because the traditional Robin fought against tyrannical rulers who treated their people badly.  If Prince John, or the Sheriff of Nottingham didn't get what they wanted, they would torture and kill people.  Often, those people were innocent.

 

That's pretty much who the Evil Queen was, but with differently placed genitalia. 

 

For traditional Robin Hood to completely overlook that is ludicrous.  He wouldn't.  It'd be like marrying Prince John or the Sheriff, as long as they had breasts and wore dresses--and therefore there should have been more of a struggle for Robin and Regina to start a serious relationship.  He should have needed some time to trust that she was a different person, now, and instead?  His first comment to her was  a cheesy come-on line about how it was bold and audacious she'd done all those things.

 

And while she did save the life of Robin's child, and has expressed romantic interest in him--considering her last marriage, shouldn't he be a little concerned about that?  Because saving Snow's life is how she met Leopold, and I don't think Leopold ever thought that Regina would be involved with his death and then spend years trying to kill Snow.

[Wandering1]

The reason so many of us see a disconnect is because the traditional Robin fought against tyrannical rulers who treated their people badly.  If Prince John, or the Sheriff of Nottingham didn't get what they wanted, they would torture and kill people.  Often, those people were innocent.

 

That's pretty much who the Evil Queen was, but with differently placed genitalia. 

 

For traditional Robin Hood to completely overlook that is ludicrous.  He wouldn't.  It'd be like marrying Prince John or the Sheriff, as long as they had breasts and wore dresses--and therefore there should have been more of a struggle for Robin and Regina to start a serious relationship.  He should have needed some time to trust that she was a different person, now, and instead?  His first comment to her was  a cheesy come-on line about how it was bold and audacious she'd done all those things.

 

And while she did save the life of Robin's child, and has expressed romantic interest in him--considering her last marriage, shouldn't he be a little concerned about that?  Because saving Snow's life is how she met Leopold, and I don't think Leopold ever thought that Regina would be involved with his death and then spend years trying to kill Snow.

Really, but you don't have a disconnect with the whitewashing of Hook or Rumple, interesting. Robin knows who the evil queen is. He lived in her realm. He also see's that she is changing. He knows that no one is just good or evil. He helped her because she saved Roland, but he had no control over her actions. Considering her last marriage?? Well considering she was forced to marry a man that she didn't know and didn't love, and who had originally wanted to marry her mother. What exactly did you want him to consider? That the Genie killed Leopold to try and win Regina's hand? I don't think Robin would care.  I don't think Regina planned to spend the rest of her life trapped with a man older than her father, but that was the sentence she suffered for saving Snow.

[daxx]

Really, but you don't have a disconnect with the whitewashing of Hook or Rumple

First we are talking about Robin, not Hook or Rumple.

Many of us on here have a lot of issues with Rumples redemption arc.

Hook was never as evil as either of them, never did as much bad in canon. He has been shown to be remorseful and had a redemptive arc.

Regina backtracked her redemption by stating she had no regrets since all she did got her Henry. This is exactly the kind of thinking by those in power Robin Hood should hate and fight against.

I truly cannot get behind outlaw queen partly because this Robin seems to have lost his moral compass. If he was challenging her to see the error of her former ways and encouraging her to think more of the greater good I might be won over, but he doesn't challenge her or push her at all.

[Wandering1]

You can have remorse without regret.  A good mother would never wish her son didn't exist. Regina doesn't need to be "challenged or pushed" by Robin because she is changing for herself, not for him. That was made clear in 3B.

 

If you don't like Outlaw Queen that's cool. There are a ton of people that enjoy them.

Edited June 29, 2014 by Wandering1

[retrograde]

Robin knows who the evil queen is. He lived in her realm. He also see's that she is changing. 

Even if we fully accept Regina's redemption arc, Robin wasn't around to see any of that. So when he meets her (both times, because they have to meet again anew after the missing year), the last he's heard of her she was a murderous tyrant. I don't think everyone is saying he couldn't have come to see who she really was (again, for those who accept that she has truly reformed), just that it felt unrealistic to some of us that a guy who has typically dedicated his life to fighting evil tyrants was suddenly, "Oh you're not evil any more? Sounds legit. Wanna make out?" I think a lot of people wanted to see a slower and more organic relationship develop, perhaps even one that highlighted the conflict between their respective backgrounds. And, in conjunction with that, many of us feel that the Robin character himself has not been very fleshed out. 

[Mari]

You can have remorse without regret.  A good mother would never wish her son didn't exist. Regina doesn't need to be "challenged or pushed" by Robin because she is changing for herself, not for him. That was made clear in 3B.

 

If you don't like Outlaw Queen that's cool. There are a ton of people that enjoy them.

Um . . . the Oxford definition of remorse:  Deep regret or guilt for a wrong committed

 

As for the not challenging Regina--then what's the point of being in a relationship?  In most relationships, if it's about more than sex, you challenge each other.  Not in an adversarial way, but to achieve more, or to be better people, for example.

 

It's not that I don't think Robin and Regina couldn't have a good relationship.  I just think it happened too quickly to seem authentic.  It didn't fit, at least at the speed and point it was happening.

[Wandering1]

Really so he has no idea why a "murderous tyrant" is suddenly aligned with Snow and Charming? He has no idea that she is risking her life to get the shield down to help Snow and Charming get into the castle? He has no idea of the depth of her self loathing or her love of her son? Sorry but I disagree.  I think Robin witnessed Regina development.

Um . . . the Oxford definition of remorse:  Deep regret or guilt for a wrong committed

 

As for the not challenging Regina--then what's the point of being in a relationship?  In most relationships, if it's about more than sex, you challenge each other.  Not in an adversarial way, but to achieve more, or to be better people, for example.

 

It's not that I don't think Robin and Regina couldn't have a good relationship.  I just think it happened too quickly to seem authentic.  It didn't fit, at least at the speed and point it was happening.

Don't really care what oxford defines it as. Based on what is on screen, Regina has shown remorse, but she will NEVER regret that her son was born. No mother would.  Robin doesn't have to challenger Regina to be a better person. That was the point. Regina isn't changing for him. 

[Mari]

Really so he has no idea why a "murderous tyrant" is suddenly aligned with Snow and Charming? He has no idea that she is risking her life to get the shield down to help Snow and Charming get into the castle? He has no idea of the depth of her self loathing or her love of her son? Sorry but I disagree.  I think Robin witnessed Regina development.

Don't really care what oxford defines it as. Based on what is on screen, Regina has shown remorse, but she will NEVER regret that her son was born. No mother would.  Robin doesn't have to challenger Regina to be a better person. That was the point. Regina isn't changing for him. 

Responding in the Regina thread.

[formerlyfreedom]

Hello, folks! Just a reminder of the Previously.TV social contract. If you aren't able to disagree without attacking fellow posters don't post here. And once you've made your point, move on; don't keep restating it trying to change other people's opinions. We don't all have to have the same opinion on Robin.

Thank you.

[Shanna Marie]

If they were going to give Robin Hood such a prominent role, at the very least give us his origin story to find out why he's stealing from the rich to give to the poor.

Do we even know that he's doing that much? I don't recall any mention of him handing out money to the poor. We've had no origin story for him, so we don't know why he's an outlaw, why he's living in the woods. We know there's some thieving, since he mentioned the job that went bad that led to what he thought was Marian's death. We don't have any indication that there's any political component to his activities or his status. That's what's frustrating about this version of Robin Hood. Since they haven't shown us anything about who he is and what he stands for, we're left to fall back on the traditional story, in which he was wronged by having his lands taken away, which left him an outlaw, and from there he started robbing the rich to give to the poor and generally fighting tyranny as well as he could. And that doesn't fit with his drooling all over the Evil Queen the second she comes back from Storybrooke, before he had any idea what had happened with her since she cast the curse that destroyed his land and left him scrambling to protect himself and his people from ogres.

 

I actually think this actor has a lot of charm and seems able to deliver lines with dry wit, so I'm blaming the writing for him being so bland. The other version in the Rumple flashback at least had the chance to stand up to Rumple and generally do something other than make eyes at someone who really should have been his enemy. It seemed like Sherwood was within a day's ride from Regina's/Snow's castle, since David made it there in a day trip, so if this Robin Hood is opposed to an evil tyrant, was it Regina? He was on wanted posters with Snow, so it seems likely. It really does seem like the equivalent of Robin falling for Prince John as soon as he actually meets him in person and realizes he's kind of hot. It would have worked so much better if they'd allowed a relationship to gradually develop over the missing year, during which he got to know her and realized she'd changed (she'd have had to show more signs of change than just being willing to help defeat her sister, though). Their bickering in the Enchanted Forest should have had more substance to it, with him concerned about her having been everything he was against until he really saw her in action over that year. Then they'd have been in a similar position to Snow and David in Curse 1, in which every fiber of their beings drew them together in Storybrooke even though they had no memory of each other. As it was, both upon the return to their own lands and in Storybrooke under Curse 2, Robin just goes for Regina without knowing anything about what she's like now.

[Camera One]

Do we even know that he's doing that much? I don't recall any mention of him handing out money to the poor. We've had no origin story for him, so we don't know why he's an outlaw, why he's living in the woods. We know there's some thieving, since he mentioned the job that went bad that led to what he thought was Marian's death. We don't have any indication that there's any political component to his activities or his status.

The third episode of "Once Upon a Time in Wonderland" had a flashback episode with The Knave in the Enchanted Forest, and that episode showed Robin Hood and the Merry Men at work, and I think Robin stated their rules for thievery. Even with that episode included, I still don't feel like I know Robin Hood that well, but it provided more info than the actual parent show about what the Merry Men did.

[KAOS Agent]

There was a line in "Witch Hunt" when Robin asked where Little John got the crossbow and he said something like the shopkeeper looked rich and we're poor here, which was supposed to be a nod to the steal from the rich, give to the poor Robin Hood lore, but kind of pissed me off because small town storekeepers aren't generally rich and stealing a very expensive crossbow like that would reflect a major loss for the store. Stealing from tyrannical dictators like Prince John who crush the people and whose wealth comes off the backs of the peasants can be justified, stealing from your average Joe who is just trying to make a living is not. Not cool, Merry Men. Robin at least was somewhat down on John for stealing, but largely seemed not to care, so he didn't really come off as highly principled either.

[retrograde]

If Storybrooke's economy is all magic anyway, maybe theft matters less. "Hey I think someone stole a crossbow... yet I seem to have all the supplies I need, even though I've never actually ordered any or received an outside delivery... Carry on!"

[KingOfHearts]

Or not, since they weren't "smart" enough to secure the return of that original Robin Hood actor. He was intense.

 

 

I actually really liked this actor. He seemed more passionate and less bland. Nothing against Sean, but Robin's writing and role in Lacey was just more interesting. The first actor seemed younger, more agile and more heroic.

 

I watched Quite a Common Fairy (at least I think it was), where we saw Sean as Robin for the first time. His character was actually much better in his first scene, and very much like his traditional face. When he was defending the castle he took from Rumple, he had a lot of fire in him that I don't really see today. Today he's more like a nice drinking buddy than a cunning thief filled with bravery.

 

Regina really doesn't need a neutral nice guy, nor does the show for that matter.

Edited July 19, 2014 by KingOfHearts

[Serena]

I read an interview with the original actor (he's now doing a show called "Rush" that just premiered) that he was audioting for something else entirely when the Once casting director saw him and told him they wanted him for Robin. So he didn't even seek the role of RH, it was basically offered to him... and the way I read his interview, it was more of a "yeah, why not? It's a role" thing that actually wanting the role.

 

Also, I'm pretty sure they hadn't decided the whole OQ thing back in S3, because the original RH doesn't have the Lion Tattoo.

[Souris]

Started the topic to reply to a post in another thread wondering about his lion tattoo.

 

In legend, Robin Hood is generally associated with King Richard I, known as Richard Coeur de Lion or Richard the Lionheart. The heraldic arms of the Plantagent kings featured three lions, though it's more associated with Richard than his "evil" brother and successor, John. There doesn't appear to be a Once equivalent of King Richard, at least so far, but the lion is a very traditional symbol. So, to represent the character of Robin Hood, if he didn't have an arrow tattoo, the next choice would be a lion. Though how Once explains the significance of his choice of tattoo remains to be seen, of course.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Souris

[FurryFury]

A cardboard plot device created as a love interest to make Regina happy. The point isn't even romance, just some angst and an automatically happy conclusion. Also, mediocre actor.

 

Thank god I never really cared about the legend, or I'd be pissed like hell. I know I was when they added Lancelot and then killed him off off-screen.

[YaddaYadda]

The character of Robin Hood has been destroyed long ago, sadly. A romantic hero that gets with his wife and son's mother's murderer, that's the stuff dreams are made of!

 

I'm no Robin fan, and we all know where the story is headed as far as OQ goes.  But he doesn't know what happened to Marian and what Regina did yet.  (I do wanna be fair so badly!)

 

As far as the tattoo goes, I hope they don't decide to make it all about Regina.  The tattoo is an integrating part of Robin Hood, his loyalty to King Richard and his fight against John and Nottingham.  Changing the meaning of the tattoo would be stupid. 

 

I'm a huge fan of the legend FurryFury, the same way I'll eat up anything about Camelot with a spoon and I was not happy with the whole Lancelot (the moment they mentioned Lancelot, all I could think of was Santiago Cabrera because well Merlin...), then they did the sword in the stone and that just made me wanna weep. 

 

So Robin Hood makes me a lot angry.  They should've kept Marian dead and had Nottingham do something since we know he's in Storybrooke after that beating he took from Rumple.

 

Robin has been a disappointment.

Edited September 5, 2014 by YaddaYadda

[ShadowFacts]

 

Changing the meaning of the tattoo would be stupid.

 

Hence they will probably do it.  Because they like to flip things around (and be all about Regina).

[NotBothered]

I just posted this over in Spoilery Discussion, but it probably makes more sense here.  The biggest problem with Robin right now is that they have given him nothing to do outside of Regina (I'm not counting Tom Ellis's version).  He is entirely defined by how he feels and acts towards her.  Even bringing Marian in seems to be all about Regina.  Making the tatoo another Regina reference will make him even more tedious and a be a total waste of mythology.  At the speed they're burning through things, I honestly don't think they can afford to just handwave Sherwood away.

 

I am dying for a proper fairyback with Robin in hopes that it makes that character a little more palatable.  He has the potential to be amazing, but this show is all about wasting potential.

[RadioGirl27]

I'm no Robin fan, and we all know where the story is headed as far as OQ goes. But he doesn't know what happened to Marian and what Regina did yet. (I do wanna be fair so badly!)

Yet is the key word here. He didn't know what she had done to Marian. But he does now. So if he stays with Regina that would be awful and it would really damage the character even more.

I'm a huge fan of the legend FurryFury, the same way I'll eat up anything about Camelot with a spoon and I was not happy with the whole Lancelot (the moment they mentioned Lancelot, all I could think of was Santiago Cabrera because well Merlin...), then they did the sword in the stone and that just made me wanna weep.

So Robin Hood makes me a lot angry. They should've kept Marian dead and had Nottingham do something since we know he's in Storybrooke after that beating he took from Rumple.

Robin has been a disappointment.

Yeah, me too. I love the legend of Robin Hood and his love story with Maid Marian. I even liked the Kevin Costner film. So I really hate what they have done with him. And I prefer not to talk about what they have done with Lancelot and Excalibur, it makes me cry.

[Crimson Belle]

Robin Hood, along with Arthur, Ivanhoe and Zorro, was one of my favorite childhood heroes, and Robing and Marian are one of the great timeless couples.

 

This version could be replaced by a blow up doll that Regina talks to, and it really wouldn't make any difference in the plot.  This character has the name of Robin Hood, but it's not Robin Hood.  I can see the origins in all the other characters, but not this one. 

[Curio]

I don't understand why the writers felt the need to bring back the character of Robin Hood if they couldn't get the original actor back. Re-casting characters always takes me out of the story because I get caught up in the whole behind-the-scenes casting process and I lose interest in the character. Unlike other characters on the show who make me forget about their actors when I watch them on screen (like Hook, Emma, and Rumple), I can't help but always see an actor playing Robin Hood, instead of just watching the character Robin Hood. If that makes any sense. So I guess I'm just predisposed to not liking him very much.

 

But anyways, back to my main point. If the writers couldn't get the original actor back, they should have just chosen a different famous character for Regina to fall in love with, especially since this Robin Hood doesn't have much of a personality anyways. I think the writers just wanted to pair Regina up with a really famous fairy tale character (Because whatever Emma has, Regina needs to have, too. They both share mommy duties with Henry. Emma has white magic? Regina needs to have white magic. Emma has a famous fairy tale boyfriend with a British accent? Regina needs to have a famous fairy tale boyfriend with a British accent. </sarcasm>), so they went with Robin Hood without really caring about establishing a good story for him.

Edited September 5, 2014 by Curio

[stealinghome]

I just don't know why they didn't pick someone who doesn't have a 500+-year, legendary OTP already. Actor issues aside, for me, breaking up Robin/Marian would be like breaking up Snow/Charming. Some things you just.don't.do. If the show had left Marian dead and portrayed Regina as Robin's second love, that would've been...somewhat more okay...but bringing her back and then having Robin wanting to choose Regina? Yeah, no, not okay. The show is just utterly ruining the Robin Hood character.

[Serena]

I don't understand why the writers felt the need to bring back the character of Robin Hood if they couldn't get the original actor back. Re-casting characters always takes me out of the story because I get caught up in the whole behind-the-scenes casting process and I lose interest in the character. Unlike other characters on the show that make me forget about their actors when I watch them on screen (like Hook, Emma, and Rumple), I can't help but always see an actor playing Robin Hood, instead of just watching the character Robin Hood. If that makes any sense. So I guess I'm just predisposed to not liking him very much.

They could have also, with some creativity, handwaved the casting change away. Like: between the time we saw Tom Ellis' Robin and the the present time, more or less 30 years passed. Robin was about to have a child at that point. Why couldn't that child be named Robin Jr, so he could have still been Robin Hood, but been played by another actor? Maybe original Robin and Marian also sent their child somewhere where he could be saved from the curse, so he aged normally.

They could have had a similar conflict with Marion coming back, only this time OQ breaks up because Regina killed his mother, not his wife. Is he gonna get back with the woman who, in another timeline, killed his sainted mother who almost lost her life while pregnant with him? It'd be a similar conflict, without love triangle.

[Shanna Marie]

If the show had left Marian dead and portrayed Regina as Robin's second love, that would've been...somewhat more okay...but bringing her back and then having Robin wanting to choose Regina?

While I'm willing to give him a slight break at the moment because he doesn't yet know that Regina was the reason he was separated from Marian (though the whole "Evil Queen" thing might have been a clue that she might have done some nasty things in her past), there's no way he can choose Regina after he knows without himself becoming a villain. Because what good guy would choose the person who imprisoned and planned the execution of his wife over his wife, no matter what had developed between them in the meantime?

 

But they do need to develop his backstory, how he became an outlaw and whether he was just robbing from the rich to feed the poor or whether he was fighting against an unjust ruler because in the absence of that backstory, I'm mentally filling in the common elements from the Robin Hood legend in which he was fighting against the unjust oppressive ruler in the absence of the true ruler, and that means he's essentially been hooking up with Prince John. That totally ruins Robin Hood.

[shipperx]

I thought Robin was always potrayed as someone with no grey areas, so far anyway (although season 2 is a little hazy for me). He follows 'good' or morally right no matter what, whether that violates laws or rules. 

I tend to agree.  I've never thought of Robin Hood as a morally gray character. I've always thought of him as a good guy fighting for the greater justice within an unjust system. 

 

Yeah, he was an 'outlaw' but 'the law' (i.e. Sheriff of Nottingham) was evil.  Robin Hood was just: it was the law/the system/the authority that was UNjust. It's about like saying that because Katniss Everdeen is a bad guy because the Capitol/President Snow labels her an insurrectionist, or that Luke Skywalker is a 'bad guy' because he's fighting the overthrow of the ruling authority. 

 

Robin Hood (and similar characters such as Katniss) are basically an appeal to a higher -- more moral -- justice than simply following the assigned ruling order. 

[kili]

From the spoiler thread:

 

He does have shitty judgment, he let Roland be used as bait for the Shadow.  Marian for the custody win.

 

And part of the reason he was convinced to do that was because he felt he owed a debt to Bae's dad...presumably because Rumple missed hitting him with an arrow (he doesn't know that the miss was on purpose) after Belle helped him escape after Rumple nearly flailed him to death. Dude!

 

Definitely Marian for the custody win.

[Mari]

Definitely Marian for the custody win.

Adding in Robin's insta-relationship with Regina?  Yeah.  There shouldn't even be questions about it.  Given some of the parallels between Robin/Regina and Leopold/Regina? (Both widowers, both with a child, Regina saved both children's lives  . . . and we know how the one relationship ended.) 

 

Him jumping into that relationship with no qualms whatsoever?  I wouldn't trust Robin to keep one of those Baby Alive dolls safe. 

[FurryFury]

Given some of the parallels between Robin/Regina and Leopold/Regina? (Both widowers, both with a child, Regina saved both children's lives  . . . and we know how the one relationship ended.)

 

Wow, I never noticed that. Kinda creepy. 

[Mari]

Kinda creepy. 

Yup.  And even more so when you think about how we know that Regina has completely different expectations for the relationship with Robin because we saw the scene with the pixie dust and know the significance of Robin's lion tattoo.

 

Robin doesn't have that.  Yes, Regina told him some of it, but does he really think she never lied to Leopold?  Because she was frolicking around learning how to use dark magic, cast curses, attempting to resurrect her boyfriend, and planning Leopold's death.  There was probably some lying there.

 

But his first interaction with her in Storybrooke is the horrible bold and audacious speech, and a few days later he's introducing his tiny, tiny son to the same woman who killed both her last significant relationship (her thirty-year rape victim Graham), but is most famous for marrying a widower, stepmothering his child for years, then conspiring to kill that man and attempting repeatedly to kill that child.

 

No matter how attractive you find someone--and even if the person is telling you Pixie Dust!  Soul mates!  Yay!--shouldn't your first reaction be a little more tentative?   Maybe settle into the relationship a little more than a foresty romp or two followed by a fireside chat before you introduce the person who tried to kill her last stepchild to a possible future stepchild?

 

It's horrible parenting, because basically Robin trusts his groin to have good judgment.  (They've been involved less than a week.  That's not an epic bond.  That's lust with epic bond potential.)

 

Team Marian all the way.

Edited September 7, 2014 by Mari

[InsertWordHere]

 

This character has the name of Robin Hood, but it's not Robin Hood.

He is a RHINO- Robin Hood In Name Only.

 

(sorry, I couldn't resist)

[stealinghome]

InsertWordHere, that's the best laugh I've had all day. Thanks!

[Hookian]

Definitely Marian for the custody win.

 

That's gonna be kind of hard for Marian to win a custody battle when she's dead...bc I highly doubt she's gonna survive this storyline of her escaping death.

'

Edited September 8, 2014 by Hookian

[myril]

That's gonna be kind of hard for Marian to win a custody battle when she's dead...bc I highly doubt she's gonna survive this storyline of her escaping death.

'

Lucky for Robin then.

[Rumsy4]

Lucky for Robin then.

And for Regina. She can then go right ahead and marry the (not grieving) widower. Yay for being bold and audacious!

Edited September 8, 2014 by Rumsy4