S04.E11: Kicked To The Curb

[Persnickety1]

12 hours ago, Doucette said:

I feel badly for Colt and Debbie - it is Larissa who has been inconsiderate and temperamental all along. Also I do not respect her for leaving behind her two young children in Brazil to marry an American man. The second person I have the most trouble with is Paola. I can not bear to watch her vanity (as on the reunion show where you could see she thought she was the best-looking woman there) - in this episode, she actually has a whole collage of her own bikini shots on her fridge. Very vain and superficial individual.  It is also very selfish of her to not consider moving to Ohio and to not want Russ' mother to hold the baby. By refusing to move, she is depriving her child of extended family. She moved away from her own family so there is really only her and Russ to be a family to the baby as he grows up in Miami. Children need extended family especially grandparents. Pao should try to understand that Russ' family is simply more conservative than she is and remember that modesty is a virtue.

Because I loathe Larissa (and Colt-y), I agree.  

I'm probably at a table for one here, but I don't believe for one hot second that Larissa ever had any intention to bring her children over here. I'll be gobsmacked if she ever brings them over in the future.  

The existence of those kids was never even mentioned at any time on the show...Until the "internet detectives" found out about them and disclosed it, then suddenly it's a little plot point for her and Colt-y this season.     

I think if the internet hadn't uncovered the fact that she had two kids, she would have never even mentioned it.  

And look at her now...I think she's quite happy with her new American way of life and the only way those kids will get to America is by coming over in the future the same way Larissa herself did, K1 Visa.  Hopefully they find someone better than Colt-y, though.

[Spike]

34 minutes ago, Persnickety1 said:

Because I loathe Larissa (and Colt-y), I agree.  

I'm probably at a table for one here, but I don't believe for one hot second that Larissa ever had any intention to bring her children over here. I'll be gobsmacked if she ever brings them over in the future.  

The existence of those kids was never even mentioned at any time on the show...Until the "internet detectives" found out about them and disclosed it, then suddenly it's a little plot point for her and Colt-y this season.     

I think if the internet hadn't uncovered the fact that she had two kids, she would have never even mentioned it.  

And look at her now...I think she's quite happy with her new American way of life and the only way those kids will get to America is by coming over in the future the same way Larissa herself did, K1 Visa.  Hopefully they find someone better than Colt-y, though.

If she becomes a citizen can’t she eventually bring them over?

[Elizzikra]

32 minutes ago, Persnickety1 said:

Because I loathe Larissa (and Colt-y), I agree.  

I'm probably at a table for one here, but I don't believe for one hot second that Larissa ever had any intention to bring her children over here. I'll be gobsmacked if she ever brings them over in the future.  

 The existence of those kids was never even mentioned at any time on the show...Until the "internet detectives" found out about them and disclosed it, then suddenly it's a little plot point for her and Colt-y this season.     

I think if the internet hadn't uncovered the fact that she had two kids, she would have never even mentioned it.  

And look at her now...I think she's quite happy with her new American way of life and the only way those kids will get to America is by coming over in the future the same way Larissa herself did, K1 Visa.  Hopefully they find someone better than Colt-y, though.

I don't fault her for leaving her children in Brazil. First, I believe at least one of them was legally adopted by a relative, which (if adoption means the same thing there that it does here) means Larissa can't just up and take her child anywhere anymore - she is no longer that child's legal parent.

Second, it's not uncommon at all for immigrants to leave children at home, in the care of others, while they get established in the U.S. Larissa knew she would be living with two near strangers. She would have been vilified if she had brought them here, for endangering them by having them live with Colt and Debbie. 

I can't stand Larissa but this one aspect of her story is credible to me. She didn't keep the kids a secret from Colt - he claims he knew about them all along.

[Doucette]

21 hours ago, 100Proof said:

Weird though. I've been known to drink pretty hard back in the day *cough* but chugging like he did I find impossible. It's pretty hard to take more than one swig without starting to dry heave. Gotta pause a minute or so between gulps, lol

I was pretty impressed with Colt being able to down that bottle of whiskey the way he did - and he did not even flinch when he swallowed it. I think Colt gets less credit than he deserves because he is able to remain very calm even while dealing with the temperamental tempests of Larissa. I do not think he would ever hit her while Larissa is abusive. He is just trying to make his marriage work but she has no respect for him -  name calling (fat pig!) is one example of this.

[Persnickety1]

11 minutes ago, Elizzikra said:

I don't fault her for leaving her children in Brazil. First, I believe at least one of them was legally adopted by a relative, which (if adoption means the same thing there that it does here) means Larissa can't just up and take her child anywhere anymore - she is no longer that child's legal parent.

Second, it's not uncommon at all for immigrants to leave children at home, in the care of others, while they get established in the U.S. Larissa knew she would be living with two near strangers. She would have been vilified if she had brought them here, for endangering them by having them live with Colt and Debbie. 

I can't stand Larissa but this one aspect of her story is credible to me. She didn't keep the kids a secret from Colt - he claims he knew about them all along.

I don't fault her for it as much as I am beyond skeptical she ever had any intent to bring them over here.  I think Larissa is all about Larissa, and the supposed breaking the news to Debbie was simply an attempt to address the situation and make her appear more sympathetic in the process.  I wouldn't be surprised if Debbie knew about the kids' existence all along, but they were a non-factor because there was never any intent to bring them over.  

I think the children were only brought up on the show when their existence was discovered and the issue became the elephant in the room, so to speak. 

I should note it's only Larissa's sketchy behavior around the existence of these children that makes me doubt her story.  I don't have these feelings about the other participants who have been forthcoming about the existence of children.  I don't think the children were a factor in her choice of Colt. 

Maybe I'm wrong (wouldn't be the first time, to be sure), but I just don't think she ever intends to bring the children over.  Time will tell.

[Doucette]

Personally, I do not dislike Andrei - he is a typical Eastern European man who likes to be the head of the household and in charge.  He is not accustomed to the 'equal' roles of husbands and wives that is common in the US. I think Libby's father is truly only trying to look out for his daughter and grandchild's best interests but Andrei wishes to provide for his family himself. He likely could make good money doing handyman work if given a chance to build up a name for himself. I don't think Libby should tell Andrei to 'shut up' - especially in front of her family - as this is disrespectful. Of all the couples this season, I like Andrei and Libby the most. I also like Andrei's father - he's a smart man and it was cute how he tried to eat his cheeseburger with a fork! lol

[Persnickety1]

32 minutes ago, Spike said:

If she becomes a citizen can’t she eventually bring them over?

I'm not sure how that works.

I just don't think doing so is on Larissa's "things to do" list.  

(I'm old and skeptical and just want her and Colt-y to get off of my lawn)

[blubld43]

49 minutes ago, Persnickety1 said:

I'm not sure how that works.

I just don't think doing so is on Larissa's "things to do" list.  

(I'm old and skeptical and just want her and Colt-y to get off of my lawn)

I think the answer is yes. I only know this because of the family Pedro!

[Spike]

I think you could bring over kids and parents fairly quickly but siblings take a long time.  That was the issue with Alexi: his parents could come but not his brother and they didn’t want to leave him behind.

[Bryce Lynch]

I knew the scene with Coltee chugging whiskey seemed familiar.  

[shockermolar]

5 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

She seems to have finally woken up and understands CONroy's true intentions and is divorcing him, and avoiding the massive financial obligation she would have to him if she filed for him to get permanent residence. 

Eh. She's pissed because he fucked someone else. 

I'm 100% with RealReality on the power imbalance here. If a 30 year old white man went to a 3rd world country and found a black teenage bar girl living - at the minimum - in sub-optimal conditions, married her, brought her back to this country, and then held the power of a home to live in, food to eat, the ability to make her own money, threat of deportation, threat of arrest, over her head constantly to keep her in line so that he could keep having sex with her? Yeah, that's some icky stuff but it's exactly what Ashley's been doing to Jay. 

We don't know that his game plan was to use her for a green card, but even if it WAS? He doesn't have a green card because she was always waiting for him to prove himself over it. AND he's not exactly a stealth confidence man given that he's constantly getting caught out screwing around with other women. 

And, yeah, nothing compels someone to cheat on their partner. But nothing should compel a grown adult to prey on a teenager. There's an actual term for that: ephebophilia. 

Neither is an innocent, but only one of them was a child when they started this thing.

[RealReality]

2 hours ago, Persnickety1 said:

I'm not sure how that works.

I just don't think doing so is on Larissa's "things to do" list.  

(I'm old and skeptical and just want her and Colt-y to get off of my lawn)

I think it may be one of those like dream scenarios like "I'll have this amazing life and then I'll bring my kids over and it'll be amazing". I suspect devars mother had the same idea, but they don't realize that it's a challenge.

[LGGirl]

3 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

I can't stand Larissa but this one aspect of her story is credible to me. She didn't keep the kids a secret from Colt - he claims he knew about them all along.

I agree.   If I were her, I wouldn’t want to talk about them on the show.  Obviously, TLC thought they had to address it when the truth came out. 

Also, I don’t see wanting to bring them over as long as they were living with Coltee’s mom.  I think we all can agree that Coltee and Larissa forging out on there own is never gonna happen.   

[toodles]

On 7/9/2019 at 10:04 AM, Neurochick said:

Once again Bondy has everybody's number.

There are spoilers for Ashley and Jay in this review, so watch at your own risk.

I love her.  I look forward to her posts every week.

[iwasish]

1 hour ago, Spike said:

I think you could bring over kids and parents fairly quickly but siblings take a long time.  That was the issue with Alexi: his parents could come but not his brother and they didn’t want to leave him behind.

So Pedro may get his mom here but not his sister? 

[Spike]

12 minutes ago, iwasish said:

So Pedro may get his mom here but not his sister? 

It may differ by country but we are friendly with Israel so I don’t know why it would be harder to come from there.

[Elizzikra]

Quote

We don't know that his game plan was to use her for a green card, but even if it WAS? He doesn't have a green card because she was always waiting for him to prove himself over it. AND he's not exactly a stealth confidence man given that he's constantly getting caught out screwing around with other women. 

Even if Ashley had filed his change of status documentation, she could have rescinded it once she found out about Jay's cheating (as Jon did when Fernanda left him for Chicago). 

I think Jay absolutely, knowingly entered into a green card marriage. He might be a crappy con man, but that doesn't mean he's not a con man. He's just (thus far) not terribly successful at it. 

I don't like either one of them. But I don't think Jay is an innocent victim of a predatory older woman. I don't think Ashley is an innocent victim of a cheating husband either. Each of them was trying to use the other for something and each of them ended up arguably worse off than before. I don't think Jay was in any danger of being homeless and hungry. He has family in Florida that can send money to him. Ashley herself paid for him to be in a hotel and to eat until he could get to his U.S. based family. If he were to be deported to Jamaica, he would return to the life he had there -which while perhaps not the "luxury U.S. life" he was seeking, didn't seem to be so unpalatable to him. 

If Jay wanted to stay here so badly, all he had to do was not have sex outside his marriage until after he got his green card. That's it. Not so difficult. If I were Ashley, I wouldn't want to be responsible for him for ten years either after I found out he cheated on me -repeatedly.

Edited July 10, 2019 by Elizzikra

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

On 7/8/2019 at 11:30 AM, nytonc said:

Pow will drag that miscarriage around with her for the rest of her life. I’m sure she’ll throw it up to Axel when he gets older. She’ll eventually find a way to blame it on her mother-in-law. Rust will be in the corner saying WE had a miscarriage. 

Pow & Rust! I am DYIN' hahahahaha 

[Bryce Lynch]

2 hours ago, shockermolar said:

Eh. She's pissed because he fucked someone else. 

I'm 100% with RealReality on the power imbalance here. If a 30 year old white man went to a 3rd world country and found a black teenage bar girl living - at the minimum - in sub-optimal conditions, married her, brought her back to this country, and then held the power of a home to live in, food to eat, the ability to make her own money, threat of deportation, threat of arrest, over her head constantly to keep her in line so that he could keep having sex with her? Yeah, that's some icky stuff but it's exactly what Ashley's been doing to Jay. 

We don't know that his game plan was to use her for a green card, but even if it WAS? He doesn't have a green card because she was always waiting for him to prove himself over it. AND he's not exactly a stealth confidence man given that he's constantly getting caught out screwing around with other women. 

And, yeah, nothing compels someone to cheat on their partner. But nothing should compel a grown adult to prey on a teenager. There's an actual term for that: ephebophilia. 

Neither is an innocent, but only one of them was a child when they started this thing.

Jay is about 22 now, according Trashley., so can we stop with the "Jay was a child" stuff?

But if the your bar girl cheated on the 30 year old man from day 1 (or at least day 3), and kept cheating, I'd have no issue with him trying to deport her, or holding off on her paperwork until he was convinced she wasn't just scamming him for a green card.

Some people here act as though once you scam someone into marrying you, so you can get your green card, you are home free and have a right to have your scam be a total success.  

Wasn't it CONroy who proposed to Trashley?   
 

Spoiler

Anyone who has any sympathy for CONroy should read this:

https://mtonews.com/90-day-fiance-ashley-jay-raped-me-and-i-have-proof-text-msgs

[magemaud]

9 hours ago, Baltimore Betty said:

Pao tells us that her mother does not speak English but when Russ and Pao was talking about his mother coming to visit and how Pao does not want her to hold the baby, etc...suddenly Mother Pao says how awkward she feels when they fight. 

I don't have to know what a couple is saying to know that they're having an argument in another language. 

[100Proof]

8 hours ago, Doucette said:

Personally, I do not dislike Andrei - he is a typical Eastern European man who likes to be the head of the household and in charge.  He is not accustomed to the 'equal' roles of husbands and wives that is common in the US. 

Not saying you're one that says this, but a lot of folks here beat up on the ones that go live in another culture and who didn't learn anything about that culture and/or refuse to abide by the rules and mores of that culture.

6 hours ago, shockermolar said:

If a 30 year old white man went to a 3rd world country and found a black teenage bar girl living - at the minimum - in sub-optimal conditions, married her, brought her back to this country, and then held the power of a home to live in, food to eat, the ability to make her own money, threat of deportation, threat of arrest, over her head constantly to keep her in line so that he could keep having sex with her? Yeah, that's some icky stuff but it's exactly what Ashley's been doing to Jay. 

Guess if that 'girl' couldn't keep her hands off men and stepped out behind that guys back like Jay does with Ghastley then the situation all kinda evens out then, lol

<edit: an above poster said this much clearer>

I'm assuming you are a nice lady but perhaps haven't a twinkling of an idea what the mind of a male is like once they hit puberty. There ain't no 12-13 and above that wouldn't absolutely kill to be banging his brains out, be it a girl in his peer group or any older women that looks good to him.

Males seemed to have been dragged into this whole old/young thing as a way of assuaging any appearance of a double standard regarding what was pretty much exclusively over older male/under age female behavior, even if one side of that standard (teenage male) would be over-the-moon in seventh heaven absolutely flipping out at the mere thought that some 30 something year old hot chick wants to bang him. It IS different with guys.

Edited July 10, 2019 by 100Proof

[RealReality]

3 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

Even if Ashley had filed his change of status documentation, she could have rescinded it once she found out about Jay's cheating (as Jon did when Fernanda left him for Chicago). 

I think Jay absolutely, knowingly entered into a green card marriage. He might be a crappy con man, but that doesn't mean he's not a con man. He's just (thus far) not terribly successful at it. 

I don't like either one of them. But I don't think Jay is an innocent victim of a predatory older woman. I don't think Ashley is an innocent victim of a cheating husband either. Each of them was trying to use the other for something and each of them ended up arguably worse off than before. I don't think Jay was in any danger of being homeless and hungry. He has family in Florida that can send money to him. Ashley herself paid for him to be in a hotel and to eat until he could get to his U.S. based family. If he were to be deported to Jamaica, he would return to the life he had there -which while perhaps not the "luxury U.S. life" he was seeking, didn't seem to be so unpalatable to him. 

If Jay wanted to stay here so badly, all he had to do was not have sex outside his marriage until after he got his green card. That's it. Not so difficult. If I were Ashley, I wouldn't want to be responsible for him for ten years either after I found out he cheated on me -repeatedly.

Jay was right there saying that he had no money.  And I don't know his brothers situation, he may not have a ton of money or resources either.  Not everyone's family has money.  He couldn't even get money for food without signing the papers.  He knows she will call the cops if he tries to stay in the house.  He had no money for a room.  I'm not sure how much TLC would intervene but right then homeless hungry and broke seemed to be the situation he was facing.

...unless he agreed to sign legal documents he didn't understand and couldn't possibly understand the ramifications of.  Oh and he had to sign then RIGHT NOW.  Jay reading those documents without an even basic background or acquaintance with the legal system is still ridiculous, but he never even got a chance to read them. 

And when he said he didn't want to sign them, which he should have the right to do when he hasn't had a  chance to consult counsel about what it means for his rights he is told that he will be homeless, hungry and penniless in a city Ashley has told him is full of racists if he doesn't sign these papers RIGHT NOW.  It also appears to be freezing and oh BTW Ashley has no problem calling the cops if he even hangs out in front of her house so there is that. 

Exactly.  That's all he had to do.  The one thing he has never been able to do.  If he had this elaborate plan to scam a green card out of Ashley AND he knew he was being monitored like she told him, it made zero sense for him to have bathroom sex with witnesses and with a girl active on his social media. 

And yeah you could say jay is just a terrible GC scammer.  But, IMO, even a terribly stupid gc scammer would know better.  So to me, it's likely there is something more.  I think anyone who wants to have sex in a barbershop bathroom full of customers and kids is not okay.  

the fact that she doesn't want to be responsible for him financially doesn't do anything to ameliorate or justify her actions, for me.  And the fact that she could have pulled the adjustment of status doesn't change what it means that she never filed it and probably never would.

Even if he could work for a few months, that gives him a level of financial independence that Ashley was never going to be okay with.  A couple of bucks here and there for walking around money, that's okay, but a steady 9-5 that gives him a solid and reliable check.  Nope.   

Edited July 10, 2019 by RealReality

[Elizzikra]

28 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Jay was right there saying that he had no money.  And I don't know his brothers situation, he may not have a ton of money or resources either.  Not everyone's family has money.  He couldn't even get money for food without signing the papers.  He knows she will call the cops if he tries to stay in the house.  He had no money for a room.  I'm not sure how much TLC would intervene but right then homeless hungry and broke seemed to be the situation he was facing.

...unless he agreed to sign legal documents he didn't understand and couldn't possibly understand the ramifications of.  Oh and he had to sign then RIGHT NOW.  Jay reading those documents without an even basic background or acquaintance with the legal system is still ridiculous, but he never even got a chance to read them. 

And when he said he didn't want to sign them, which he should have the right to do when he hasn't had a  chance to consult counsel about what it means for his rights he is told that he will be homeless, hungry and penniless in a city Ashley has told him is full of racists if he doesn't sign these papers RIGHT NOW.  It also appears to be freezing and oh BTW Ashley has no problem calling the cops if he even hangs out in front of her house so there is that. 

Exactly.  That's all he had to do.  The one thing he has never been able to do.  If he had this elaborate plan to scam a green card out of Ashley AND he knew he was being monitored like she told him, it made zero sense for him to have bathroom sex with witnesses and with a girl active on his social media. 

And yeah you could say jay is just a terrible GC scammer.  But, IMO, even a terribly stupid gc scammer would know better.  So to me, it's likely there is something more.  I think anyone who wants to have sex in a barbershop bathroom full of customers and kids is not okay.  

the fact that she doesn't want to be responsible for him financially doesn't do anything to ameliorate or justify her actions, for me.  And the fact that she could have pulled the adjustment of status doesn't change what it means that she never filed it and probably never would.

Even if he could work for a few months, that gives him a level of financial independence that Ashley was never going to be okay with.  A couple of bucks here and there for walking around money, that's okay, but a steady 9-5 that gives him a solid and reliable check.  Nope.   

Jay could have gone to a shelter. He could have asked the police for a list of places he could go. He had a friend willing to take him in - he said that when the cops asked him if he had a place to go.

Should Ashley have demanded he sign the papers RIGHT NOW? No. It was a bitch move. But Jay has friends and a working cell phone. I don’t know if his family is rich, poor or somewhere in between but he’s not in this big bad country all by himself. 

I think he thought he could stay faithful to Ashley long enough to get his green card OR he thought he was a good enough scammer to not get caught. He was wrong. Ashley was a fool to expect fidelity but that was the deal and Jay knew it. No reason she should have to be responsible for him for the next ten years.

And while sex in a barbershop bathroom isn’t my idea of romance either, I don’t assume it points to some deeper seated issue Jay has. He wasn’t in there alone - at least one other person found the idea appealing. Some people are turned on by the idea of sex in a public place and they’re not all damaged.

[Doucette]

6 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

I knew the scene with Coltee chugging whiskey seemed familiar.  

lol good clip! I was impressed that he downed that amount of whiskey in one gulp without even flinching when he swallowed it. Do you think it really was whisky? Maybe watered down whiskey or coca cola. lol

[RealReality]

1 hour ago, Elizzikra said:

Jay could have gone to a shelter. He could have asked the police for a list of places he could go. He had a friend willing to take him in - he said that when the cops asked him if he had a place to go.

Should Ashley have demanded he sign the papers RIGHT NOW? No. It was a bitch move. But Jay has friends and a working cell phone. I don’t know if his family is rich, poor or somewhere in between but he’s not in this big bad country all by himself. 

I think he thought he could stay faithful to Ashley long enough to get his green card OR he thought he was a good enough scammer to not get caught. He was wrong. Ashley was a fool to expect fidelity but that was the deal and Jay knew it. No reason she should have to be responsible for him for the next ten years.

And while sex in a barbershop bathroom isn’t my idea of romance either, I don’t assume it points to some deeper seated issue Jay has. He wasn’t in there alone - at least one other person found the idea appealing. Some people are turned on by the idea of sex in a public place and they’re not all damaged.

What shelter?  There isn't always a nearby shelter or a means of transportation in the middle of the night.  Not to mention that shelters are very dangerous, no matter how hard staff try.

Jay had a friend willing to take him in for a night or even a few.  But people get tired of guests.  And we've seen jay basically lose his two friends because of his behavior.  So who knows if the other friend was pissed or didn't want a guest anymore or was friends with the barber shop guys.  

I think if he did have a friend to call on in that situation, he would have done so.  He was out there walking the streets and not on the phone.  

The cops weren't there, was he supposed to call the police station (often closed at night) and ask for places to stay?  911?  I probably wouldnt call the cops to help me find a roof over my head in a pinch and I was born and raised in the US. 

I assume that the bathroom sex partner has issues too.  This wasn't just public sex, it was weird bathroom sex in a place with kids and regular folk who could all hear you.  It was where you worked while everyone was there.  Including kids.  It wasn't a penthouse story it was the story you hear and you're like "eww, really?"

And more than that, it was needlessly indiscreet for a guy playing a GC scam.  Even a dumb 20 year old playing a GC scam.  Particularly one who had been told, in no uncertain terms that he was being watched and monitored.  

She should divorce him, and the process should play out above board and legally, between two people who should have equal access to counsel and representation to protect their legal interests.

If that means he is deported so be it.

If it means she has to pay for him for ten years, so be it.  That is the risk that she, a 32 year old woman, took.  It was a risk she took with eyes wide open, since jay had never been faithful to her and she was fine with it.  She took a huge risk that someone with a history of infidelity would be suddenly faithful because of a ring an an Elvis impersonator officiant.  But she took the gamble, because I guess it was worth it to her.  Some people put their life savings on 00.  Giant risk, little chance it'll pay off, but you know the risk going in.  If you win that's amazing, but when it doesn't hit you don't get to change the rules of the game.   

[islandgirl1217]

US citizens can petition for parents, children under 21 & spouses and it doesn’t take as long as petitioning for a sister. That usually would take a good 10 years this applies to the DR and most countries.

Edited July 11, 2019 by islandgirl1217

[happy hobo]

On 7/9/2019 at 3:51 PM, Drogo said:

There has to be a way to work this into the standard marriage vows.

Isn't there a Commandment that says : Thou shalt not stick thy dick into Crazy?

[happy hobo]

On 7/9/2019 at 5:27 PM, Natalie68 said:

I thank all of you for the recaps.  I found myself ff all the scenes because I really dislike all these people so I quit watching but for some strange reason I want updates.  

Well, this is the end of the line for me. I have already passed on the Pillow Talk (the 'twins' made me nauseous), my husband absolutely HATES the show and I can't find one redeeming quality about ANY of these fools.  I'll just finish up "Other Way" (even more stupid people) and see how that works out. I will, however, also check in for recaps. I just can't stand actually watching anymore.

[BoomerRumor]

14 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

But if the your bar girl cheated on the 30 year old man from day 1 (or at least day 3), and kept cheating, I'd have no issue with him trying to deport her, or holding off on her paperwork until he was convinced she wasn't just scamming him for a green card.

Rather confused. Who is the bar girl and 30 year old man, now? Are we watching the same show? If you're talking about  Jay, he seems to be 22 or so.

[BoomerRumor]

23 hours ago, Bryce Lynch said:

CONroy cheats because he likes cheating and because he never viewed Trashley as a wife, only a sucker to use to scam a green card.

Who on earth is "Conroy?"

[Hannah94]

1 minute ago, BoomerRumor said:

Who on earth is "Conroy?"

I think that is his real legal name.

[xingu]

I think people need to stop posting in code.  I have no idea who CONroy or Conroy is, and I watch every show.  Who is the bar girl and who is the 30-year old?  I respectfully request that posters use names we are familiar with.  Clever names are clever to the ones in the know, but leave the rest of us clueless.

[Hannah94]

30 minutes ago, xingu said:

I think people need to stop posting in code.  I have no idea who CONroy or Conroy is, and I watch every show.  Who is the bar girl and who is the 30-year old?  I respectfully request that posters use names we are familiar with.  Clever names are clever to the ones in the know, but leave the rest of us clueless.

Idk for sure, but I think the post about the bar girl and 30 year old was a hypothetical play on the Ashley/Jay situation. As in, if a man in his thirties was involved with a girl who was twenty (or less than 20, I cannot figure out this shit show for the life of me), how would that be viewed. It's just fucked, IMO, all of it.  And sad.  

[Spike]

3 hours ago, Hannah94 said:

I think that is his real legal name.

I thought it was Skinz Jr.

[magemaud]

His given name is Conroy St. Christopher Smith

[Elizzikra]

Quote

I assume that the bathroom sex partner has issues too.  This wasn't just public sex, it was weird bathroom sex in a place with kids and regular folk who could all hear you.  It was where you worked while everyone was there.  Including kids.  It wasn't a penthouse story it was the story you hear and you're like "eww, really?"

That assumes a lot. First - we don't know who else was in the barbershop at the time. There could have been kids - or not. There's a whole spectrum of sexual behavior that isn't rooted in pathology and plenty of people who, as I noted before, enjoy sex in semi-public places. It's not my cup of tea either but all by itself, it's not indicative of pathology on the part of Jay or his partner. 

Quote

What shelter?  There isn't always a nearby shelter or a means of transportation in the middle of the night.  Not to mention that shelters are very dangerous, no matter how hard staff try.

Jay had a friend willing to take him in for a night or even a few.  But people get tired of guests.  And we've seen jay basically lose his two friends because of his behavior.  So who knows if the other friend was pissed or didn't want a guest anymore or was friends with the barber shop guys.  

I think if he did have a friend to call on in that situation, he would have done so.  He was out there walking the streets and not on the phone.  

I'm going to respond and then agree to disagree with you on this issue of Jay as a helpless kitten. When I referred to the police, I was thinking of the first incident, when he went to get his belongings - not the second "divorce papers" incident. In both cases, he had a working cell phone. If he doesn't know where the nearest shelter is, he can google "nearby shelters." Yes -sometimes despite everyone's best efforts, shelters aren't as safe, clean and welcoming as we would like them to be. They are still there to keep people from freezing and starving on the streets, which you had indicated was a possible concern for Jay. If he wanted to continue to live in the relative comfort of Ashley's house, he shouldn't have cheated on her. Multiple times. He can call friends. He had ample notice that Ashley was pissed off and his marriage was breaking up so he could have done a little research on inexpensive motels, shelters, trying to get some help from family or friends, or any other options at his disposal. And the producers were RIGHT THERE - I truly don't think Jay was in genuine danger of starving or freezing to death.

Quote

If it means she has to pay for him for ten years, so be it.  That is the risk that she, a 32 year old woman, took.  It was a risk she took with eyes wide open, since jay had never been faithful to her and she was fine with it.  She took a huge risk that someone with a history of infidelity would be suddenly faithful because of a ring an an Elvis impersonator officiant.  But she took the gamble, because I guess it was worth it to her.  Some people put their life savings on 00.  Giant risk, little chance it'll pay off, but you know the risk going in.  If you win that's amazing, but when it doesn't hit you don't get to change the rules of the game.   

He, also a legal adult, took that risk right along with her. He agreed to marry her and remain faithful. He took a risk that she would continue to look the other way and instead she decided she wanted a faithful husband. His eyes were wide open. He left his home country, where he was presumably able to make some sort of living, knowing he would be financially dependent on a woman that he likely knew he would cheat on multiple times with multiple partners. His risked his ability to seek U.S. Citizenship for at least 10 years because he thought he could continue to be a player and Ashley would go along with it. If that had worked out, great! But it didn't. No reason Ashley should be responsible for Jay's cheating self for ten years in exchange for what? Two days of fidelity?

Jay is a liar, a womanizer and a scammer. I don't like Ashley but I don't think she owes Jay anything at all at this point. 

[RealReality]

7 hours ago, Elizzikra said:

That assumes a lot. First - we don't know who else was in the barbershop at the time. There could have been kids - or not. There's a whole spectrum of sexual behavior that isn't rooted in pathology and plenty of people who, as I noted before, enjoy sex in semi-public places. It's not my cup of tea either but all by itself, it's not indicative of pathology on the part of Jay or his partner. 

I'm going to respond and then agree to disagree with you on this issue of Jay as a helpless kitten. When I referred to the police, I was thinking of the first incident, when he went to get his belongings - not the second "divorce papers" incident. In both cases, he had a working cell phone. If he doesn't know where the nearest shelter is, he can google "nearby shelters." Yes -sometimes despite everyone's best efforts, shelters aren't as safe, clean and welcoming as we would like them to be. They are still there to keep people from freezing and starving on the streets, which you had indicated was a possible concern for Jay. If he wanted to continue to live in the relative comfort of Ashley's house, he shouldn't have cheated on her. Multiple times. He can call friends. He had ample notice that Ashley was pissed off and his marriage was breaking up so he could have done a little research on inexpensive motels, shelters, trying to get some help from family or friends, or any other options at his disposal. And the producers were RIGHT THERE - I truly don't think Jay was in genuine danger of starving or freezing to death.

He, also a legal adult, took that risk right along with her. He agreed to marry her and remain faithful. He took a risk that she would continue to look the other way and instead she decided she wanted a faithful husband. His eyes were wide open. He left his home country, where he was presumably able to make some sort of living, knowing he would be financially dependent on a woman that he likely knew he would cheat on multiple times with multiple partners. His risked his ability to seek U.S. Citizenship for at least 10 years because he thought he could continue to be a player and Ashley would go along with it. If that had worked out, great! But it didn't. No reason Ashley should be responsible for Jay's cheating self for ten years in exchange for what? Two days of fidelity?

Jay is a liar, a womanizer and a scammer. I don't like Ashley but I don't think she owes Jay anything at all at this point. 

So jay, who is probably in a suburban area without a homeless shelter (in my experience they are generally in impoverished urban areas, because that's where the need is) was supposed to know about the American concept of shelters, then he was supposed to Google the shelters he may not even know about, and then he was supposed to find transportation to this shelter that was probably not in his town. Without any money   He was also going to figure out free food at some point too.  The degree to which the crew would step in is questionable.

Jay didn't want to sign the papers, so if he knew the crew would step in or he had friends or any other option, it makes no sense that he didn't use those resouces. Therefore I think had the impression that the crew would leave him to his fate, and that would be fine for them.  I'm quite sure they have no obligation to intervene. 

The guys at the barbershop said there were a room full of customers including kids.  Not all sexual situations are  equal.  Most of them are, some aren't.  Barber shop bathroom sex with a room full of customers, including (especially) kids listening shows a desperation for any sex, that is, to me, abnormal.  That doesn't speak to someone with a kink for public sex but someone absolutely desperate to have sex, any sex.

And it's even more pronounced in light of the fact that he was on notice and was so indiscreet.  Even if you were to say jay was just a dummy with a green card scam....even a regular dummy so desperate for a green card that they would run a scam would be more discreet if there wasn't some deeper desperation in play.

My point is not that Jay's eyes weren't wide open (though I suspect he thought he could be faithful).  But rather that the legal system should play out with each party having equal access to counsel to protect their interest.   The legal system that we have in place should make the decision as to whether jay gets to stay and what, if any, obligation Ashley has.

However the case turns out, one person shouldn't be stripped of the right to seek counsel to protect their legal rights and interest because they were under duress and scared of being homeless, hungry, broke and freezing.

Edited July 12, 2019 by RealReality

[Spike]

Duress is a defense to a contract so maybe he has a case.  

[RealReality]

31 minutes ago, Spike said:

Duress is a defense to a contract so maybe he has a case.  

I think he could.  But, jay is not particularly a sympathetic character and he is poor. 

Unless he can get an attorney thirsty for TLC exposure I'm not sure many attorneys would want him to take him on as a client.

[magemaud]

I’m beginning to think Ashley’s whole “deport your ass” storyline is fake. How many times did she threaten to deport Jay then when she had the chance to put him on a plane she supposedly lets him go to Miami instead? Then he meekly returns to her bedside after she was hospitalized. I’m NOT saying her health crisis wasn’t real, but if he had been back in Jamaica when it happened, I doubt if it would have been possible for him to return to the US so quickly. We only saw him going to a hotel, who’s to say he didn’t stay there for a while and never took a flight anywhere? 

Edited July 12, 2019 by magemaud

[Nowhere]

11 hours ago, RealReality said:

I think he could.  But, jay is not particularly a sympathetic character and he is poor. 

Unless he can get an attorney thirsty for TLC exposure I'm not sure many attorneys would want him to take him on as a client.

I think Jay is an adorable kid with a good personality. I don’t think he’s a good husband obviously but I’m not sure if he understood the consequences at his young age. I also think he was probably sexually abused in some way and has problems regarding keeping it in his pants. So, I do think, due to his age, people do feel some measure of sympathy for him. He didn’t marry another 20yr old. Ashley is in her thirties with a fully developed frontal lobe. If she were my daughter, I’d be pissed at Jay for cheating of course, but I’d also tell my daughter that she should have expected it and marrying a young sex-obsessed man was not in her best interest from the beginning and she should have listened to those around her giving her warnings. Lesson hopefully learned. 

If Jay were my son, I’d be side-eyeing Ashley FROM THE START. No! I may have fought her in the streets! I know men like older women sometimes, but for an older woman to marry a man that young takes a special kind of crazy. I would have told jay to stay away from this woman predator. It’s one thing to date for fun or sex, it’s a whole other story to marry the young man. DON’T MARRY A 20 YEAR OLD. I’m sorry but something isn’t right with Ashley. For some reason she wanted to control a man and Jay was the perfect one for her purposes and to create drama, which some people really need in their lives it seems.

Jay isn’t off the hook for what he did but rumor has it,

Spoiler

Ashley had a sugar daddy at the time of Jay’s cheating. So, maybe she wanted a sugar baby of her own. If she’s cheating, I don’t know why Jay is expected to sit home and do nothing.

[Nowhere]

^^I’d like to add that if roles were reversed, I’d feel the same way. My twenty-year-old daughter told me that people in her class thought this 27-year-old man liked her. I didn’t show it but it did worry me and I talked to her about the situation. I just don’t think anyone under the age of 23 should be with someone much past their own age, because of maturity. And it makes me wonder why an older person can’t get someone their own age and why they’d target someone they can’t even drink with legally. I don’t have an issue with age gap relationships. I have less of an issue with older woman/younger man relationships. 

[the-grey-lady]

I loved the part when Libby's bitchy-ass sisters were all, "I can't BELIEVE Libby isn't answering the phone while she's in labor! How dare she!"

Libby's mother: Who doesn't want their mother there when they're in labor?

Libby's sisters: And all their bitchy-ass sisters?

Me: Me.

[Spike]

2 minutes ago, the-grey-lady said:

I loved the part when Libby's bitchy-ass sisters were all, "I can't BELIEVE Libby isn't answering the phone while she's in labor! How dare she!"

Libby's mother: Who doesn't want their mother there when they're in labor?

Libby's sisters: And all their bitchy-ass sisters?

Me: Me.

Maybe females are different but I wouldn’t want my genitals on display for my siblings.  I wonder if they all go watch vasectomies too.

[RealReality]

4 hours ago, Spike said:

Maybe females are different but I wouldn’t want my genitals on display for my siblings.  I wonder if they all go watch vasectomies too.

I couldn't even stomach that scene in the movie Knocked Up of the baby crowning.  

I get it....miracle of child birth.....but I'll just visit with baby afterwards.

[Spike]

9 minutes ago, RealReality said:

I couldn't even stomach that scene in the movie Knocked Up of the baby crowning.  

I get it....miracle of child birth.....but I'll just visit with baby afterwards.

The Pao birthing scene was plenty gory.  Did they have a warning for those eating while watching?

[DutchbutnoJesse]

Just watched the show Thursday and arrived at page 4 of the comments and didn't have patience anymore to comment, with the risk of duplicating... I take the risk. 🙂

Andrrrei; I know it is not a popular opinion but I still like him. Do we all forget that in the first season we were so impressed that he stayed so calm when the family tried to pull him down? Yeah I think he is a hothead as his father confirmed but I noticed that Libby very well can deal with that and tell him to plain shut up.

Producer driven maybe but the evil sisters tried to stir things up and rwacting over the top when they heard Libby was in labour. Maybe it is a cultural thing but my wife and I said to each other: wtf. Your whole family there when you giving birth? No way.

Did I mention Nicole? Oh no, their storyline is so boring that TLC doesn't have footage anymore. 

I still like Pedro (yeah I know, I like to opposite to popular opinion:) ). I still think they are really in love. Though, there is something wrong with this story, producer driven, fake. 

Oh, I hated Chantel for stirring up the fire at the dinner with family Pedro. Her arrogant face when she said that the family shouldn't interfere with there business. If she just shut up at that moment and swallowed her pride... idiot! Nice translating from Pedro btw. Chantel said not to interfere and Pedro translated it as "you should shut up." Hmmm. Indeed, nice in tome for the spin-off what I am not going to watch... hopefully.

Pao and Ross: the previous episode was the first time we ff. If I want to see a "live" birth TLC has a lot of other program for that. 

I really hated how Poa set up her mother against her mother in law: disgusting! Noth said.

Colt and Larissa:

Omg. I can drink a beer like that but whiskey. Wow, that was weird. There was at least a quarter of liquid in that bottle. Bleh. 

If to choose, I still prefer Larissa altough I think she has psychical issues but so has the debcolt-clan. I am sure to push her button till she gets into a crisis, moreover when Colt is drunk... now I can understand what happened at the evenings when she got arrested.

Ash and the guy.... Ash likes power, be the victim. That is why her previous relations blew up. Jay... well.... asshole though I think he looks really funny in that jacket lol.

Edited July 13, 2019 by DutchbutnoJesse

[RealReality]

40 minutes ago, DutchbutnoJesse said:

Justbl watched the show Thursday and arrived at page 4 of the comments and didn't have patience anymore to comment, with the risk of duplicating... I take the risk. 🙂

Andrrrei; I know it is not a popular opinion but I still like him. Do we all forget that in the first season we were so impressed that he stayed so calm when the family tried to pull him down? Yeah I think he is a hothead as his father confirmed but I noticed that Libby very well can deal with that and tell him to plain shut up.

Producer driven maybe but the evil sisters tried to stir things up and rwacting over the top when they heard Libby was in labour. Maybe it is a cultural thing but my wife and I said to each other: wtf. Your whole family there when you giving birth? No way.

Did I mention Nicole? Oh no, their storyline is so boring that TLC doesn't have footage anymore. 

I still like Pedro (yeah I know, I like to opposite to popular opinion:) ). I still think they are really in love. Though, there is something wrong with this story, producer driven, fake. 

Oh, I hated Chantel for stirring up the fire at the dinner with family Pedro. Her arrogant face when she said that the family shouldn't interfere with there business. If she just shut up at that moment and swallowed her pride... idiot! Nice translating from Pedro btw. Chantel said not to interfere and Pedro translated it as "you should shut up." Hmmm. Indeed, nice in tome for the spin-off what I am not going to watch... hopefully.

Chantal was sooooo close at that dinner!  I was proud of her up until that point.  Lidia goaded her, but it would have been nice had she not taken the bait.

I still like Pedro, so I guess we can have a table for two!

But yeah I'm also starting to side eye and feel like recent drama may be for the purpose of the spin off.  These people are not compelling actors.  If their stories aren't real, I don't need to watch them. 

I have no plans to watch their spin off though I look forward to the snark!

[DutchbutnoJesse]

6 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Chantal was sooooo close at that dinner!  I was proud of her up until that point.  Lidia goaded her, but it would have been nice had she not taken the bait.

I still like Pedro, so I guess we can have a table for two!

But yeah I'm also starting to side eye and feel like recent drama may be for the purpose of the spin off.  These people are not compelling actors.  If their stories aren't real, I don't need to watch them. 

I have no plans to watch their spin off though I look forward to the snark!

Great to have someone agreeing with me. In the strange human psychology we need that. 🙂

You took my thoughts: I am not going to watch the spin-off but certainly will read the forum. Haha.

Lol, this show does something to me it seems. I just reread my snark and noticed that I used two times the word 'hate'. 🙂

[KariLois]

On 7/7/2019 at 10:54 PM, iwasish said:

Larissa is a bitch. I think even her attorney sensed it. He pretty much told her, watch your temper or you may find yourself heading back to Brazil.

She wasnt even in the country a couple weeks and expecting access to money, credit cards etc. Demanding an expensive car, bigger house etc. Take me shopping, compliment me constantly. She knew within a couple weeks that it was not what she was looking for. Sit down with Colt and tell him, this isn’t going to work for me. I’m sorry but I don’t want to waste your time or money. 

There are women who would have been more than happy to be in the situation Larissa found herself. 

Having to sit next to Larissa, with her constant primping and ever present cellphone, chauffeuring her around,,,, I’d have put her out of the car too. She was luck Debbie stopped the car first. I would barely have slowed down. 

I completely disagree.  Larissa was looking for validation.  And also, yes.  Move out!  Get a car with ac in Las Vegas!  Debbie is Coltee’s real wife and Larissa knows it.  The two of the, have been working on breaking Larissa since she got here.  Coltee exercises power over her by threatening to deport her and we know that Deb is so jealous she could scratch Larissa’s eyes out.  It is an abusive setup and I want to know Larissa is okay.  You might not like her, but she doesn’t deserve what she has gotten, either.