S17.E18: Andrew Yang, Bret Easton Ellis, Charles Blow, Katie Porter, and Clint Watts

[Guest]

Airs June 7, 2019

Guests:

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Andrew Yang, Bret Easton Ellis, Charles Blow, Katie Porter, and Clint Watts

[J0nas3]

Katie Porter was a lot of fun on this show.

[Andromeda]

I'm really getting over Bill Maher. All he does is bitch about how parents are raising their kids, from a guy who has none! That and social justice warriors, all because his invitation to speak at a university was withdrawn when students protested, because he's anti-Muslim.

Get off it, Bill. You're just so butt hurt, but it's not funny.

[Caseysgirl]

We need Katie Porter in Congress but really, let’s get rid of Bill and give this show to her. She was much funnier and smarter than him.

[arachne]

Ugh! Do we now have to define what a "social justice warrior" is? Bill and Charles Blow were butting heads over that, for what felt like forever.

I've seen Katie Porter on the news, and yeah, she's terrific. I loved the way she (however inadvertently) embarrassed Bill about his own ill-advised birth.

Eyeroll over Bill's final New Rule about coddled millennial college grads. Like Bill, I have no kids myself, but could it be that these parents indulged their children out of fear of abusing them? Maybe they don't want their kids to get as fucked up as they were? I'm not saying they did right, but I'm trying to understand. 

[wknt3]

I thought this was a pretty good show in spite of Bill, not because of him. Andrew Yang was interesting, and the panel was great especially Katie Porter. Loved the panel calling out Bill and watching him be a whiny little butch about it. Bret Easton Ellis was mostly harmless, and the scripted material was mostly Bill taking a truncheon to a deceased equine, but we've seen worse.

[sugarbaker design]

Can Charles Blow be on every week to school Bill on the difference between a social justice warrior and a twitter troll?  Katie Porter was a totally unexpected delight!

[ganesh]

9 hours ago, Andromeda said:

All he does is bitch about how parents are raising their kids, from a guy who has none!

I don't think it's fair to disqualify one's opinion because they don't have kids. I don't have a problem disagreeing with him, but I don't have kids, but I was a kid and had parents and understand how they parented me, and I have friends with kids who talk about parenting. 

I think we've talked before here about what an SJW. I don't think any of them have the definition of it that we do. I think the guy on the panel was using the colloquial definition. What he's calling SJW isn't actually what is. He also needed to let it go because he was derailing the entire discussion.

But give me a break Yang. Democrats aren't condescending to anyone. People are fucking stupid is the problem, and they vote against their own interests because, as Bill said, the D is next to their name, even though the reason they have health care is because of that D and the reason their state takes more funding from the federal government is because of that D. Butthurt white dudebros are scared because they don't like anything different is the problem. 

Edited June 8, 2019 by ganesh

[iMonrey]

Agree the show was good despite Bill being his usual dense self. I could have sworn Andrew Yang had been on before. I can't think of where else I would have seen him. I like him, but he lost me as soon as he got onto this idiocy about not "condescending" to Trump voters. I don't know what that even means; I suspect it's a variation on "we just need to talk to these people" which is stupid. I also hate when they start talking about "identity politics." That's been the Republican playbook for the past 40 years, I don't know why Democrats get saddled with it.

e.t.a. JINX! ganesh

I'd like to give Bill the benefit of the doubt that he was just playing devil's advocate on gun control but he doesn't deserve the credit. Katie Porter and Charles Blow did a great job pushing back on that.

I was totally lost during the whole conversation about social justice warriors, I'm guessing Bill was back to his same old favorite subject, political correctness. 

I'm not sure what Bill was trying to say about abortion rights (although I loved Porter's comment that they were all living with the consequences of his mother's choice to have him) - it sounds like he was making the same argument my parents always did against abortion. Whenever I expressed my support for abortion rights they would say "If we felt that way you might not be here." WTF. That's like saying, the only reason we had you is because we had to, even though we didn't want to. That's not persuasive. I'd rather not be born that be born to parents who didn't want me but were forced to have me.

The less said about the final new rule, Bill's pet peeve, the better. However, I found it ironic he mentioned the spelling bee during that bit. I don't know if he heard about the big seven-way tie (or however many it was), but he inadvertently referred to something that demonstrates there are still a lot of great kids out there.

Edited June 8, 2019 by iMonrey

[ganesh]

7 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

e.t.a. JINX! ganesh

Word. 

7 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I was totally lost during the whole conversation about social justice warriors, I'm guessing Bill was back to his same old favorite subject, political correctness. 

Actually, I think Bill was on the right side of the discussion because the other guy wouldn't get off the same point and Bill wasn't talking anything about that. 

Bill needs to learn to take some shade. 

[ganesh]

Bill also did the same graduation bit before. 

[UYI]

26 minutes ago, ganesh said:

Bill also did the same graduation bit before. 

Yep, it was in 2009, exactly 10 years ago this year (I was 20 then, and now I'm 30--yikes! That was two years before I graduated from college!). A lot of it honestly seemed the same as back then, with the obvious difference being who was President then vs. now (also, the 2010 midterms hadn't happened yet). 

ETA: I FOUND IT! 😄

Edited June 8, 2019 by UYI

[UYI]

I found this from 3 years ago, too:

[sistermagpie]

46 minutes ago, ganesh said:

But give me a break Yang. Democrats aren't condescending to anyone. People are fucking stupid is the problem, and they vote against their own interests because, as Bill said, the D is next to their name, even though the reason they have health care is because of that D and the reason their state takes more funding from the federal government is because of that D. Butthurt white dudebros are scared because they don't like anything different is the problem.  

39 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Agree the show was good despite Bill being his usual dense self. I could have sworn Andrew Yang had been on before. I can't think of where else I would have seen him. I like him, but he lost me as soon as he got onto this idiocy about not "condescending" to Trump voters. I don't know what that even means; I suspect it's a variation on "we just need to talk to these people" which is stupid. I also hate when they start talking about "identity politics." That's been the Republican playbook for the past 40 years, I don't know why Democrats get saddled with it.

God, yes. Also beware of anybody who pretends that there is any time or place in American history when Martin Luther King Jr. wouldn't be a accused of pushing what Bill insists on calling "identity politics." He took racial inequality seriously and that's all it means. Of course he was for things that would benefit everyone, but to him "everyone" actually meant everyone. It seems like the only way to not "condescend" as a liberal is to agree with simple bigoted solutions to problems. Trump got up and promised to beat up all those "other people" and then those particular white people would be back on top because it would be 1952 again. But somehow that's not condescending.

Basically it's just saying that any problem that white working class men don't think immediately applies to them should be dealt with by saying it's unimportant or doesn't exist.

40 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I'm not sure what Bill was trying to say about abortion rights (although I loved Porter's comment that they were all living with the consequences of his mother's choice to have him) - it sounds like he was making the same argument my parents always did against abortion. Whenever I expressed my support for abortion rights they would say "If we felt that way you might not be here." WTF. That's like saying, the only reason we had you is because we had to, even though we didn't want to. That's not persuasive. I'd rather not be born that be born to parents who didn't want me but were forced to have me.

I've never understood this argument either. Do people honestly feel insecure about the idea that they might not have been born under different circumstances? If that had happened you never would have existed to worry about it so who cares? Do people also get nervous thinking about what would have happened if their dad used a condom that time? Or if Mom wasn't in the mood? Or what if there was something good on TV that night and they watched it and then went straight to sleep instead of having sex! What then?!

[ganesh]

I don't think it's a problem for Bill to criticize parenting just because he doesn't have kids. He was parented, he likely has friends who talk about parenting.

The issue is that the bit is stale. There were parents when I was growing up that were 'helicopter' because I remember my mother rolling her eyes at them. It's just the term wasn't invented yet. 

tbh, I don't really see that where I've lived, and I've been all over. Yes, there's entitled kids, but I haven't really come across too many. Some have attitudes, but I knock that shit out quick and they get in line. 

[ganesh]

Honestly, I think the whole abortion 'debate' is fucking stupid. Here's the thing - pro choice means you get to choose to have the baby if you want. I don't get why that isn't hammered home constantly. 

Democrats need to grow a spine and just shut this down. Don't call it pro-life. It's anti-choice. Get a fucking narrative. 

[Cyranetta]

Lawrence O'Donnell has featured Katie Porter's Congressional committee work in The Last Word, and it was delightful to see her in a more spontaneous environment.

[b2H]

I am sure we will see Katie again on this show.  She was fabulous.

Yang needs to be in Commerce in the next administration.  This is what I was hoping for with 23 candidates.  No one is talking about the workforce issues that are rolling into our economy.  I am retiring in three or four years, but my kids and grandkids will have to deal with these issues.

[deirdra]

6 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I'm not sure what Bill was trying to say about abortion rights (although I loved Porter's comment that they were all living with the  However, I found it ironic he mentioned the spelling bee during that bit. I don't know if he heard about the big seven-way tie (or however many it was), but he inadvertently referred to something that demonstrates there are still a lot of great kids out there.

Bill's joke was that white kids aren't winning many spelling bees (7 of the Octochamps are non-white).  It's the children of ESL immigrants who are doing better at spelling in English and educational achievement.

Edited June 8, 2019 by deirdra

[ganesh]

16 hours ago, b2H said:

I am sure we will see Katie again on this show.

I don't know. Bill seemed pissed when she made the joke at how expense. 

What happened in OT? Bill just kind of ended it. 

[deirdra]

Bill did seem pissed that Katie mentioned that he was born before Roe v. Wade and had abortion been legal his mother might have chosen to abort him. The kind of joke Bill would say about others, but can't take it himself.  The entire panel recognized that Katie was being sarcastic/ironic. He was also probably pissed that she was funnier than him through the whole show.

Bill often chops off Overtime before I'm ready for it to end. I never know why.

Edited June 9, 2019 by deirdra

[marymon]

I agree Bill was pissed.   He complains at how sensitive people are but he couldn't take the joke and hated it more that the crowd found it funny.

Pretty sure every generations thinks the ones behind them are  more of a mess etc.

Also

"Social justice warrior (SJW) is a pejorative term for an individual who promotes socially progressive views, including feminism, civil rights, and multiculturalism, as well as identity politics."

I always thought of that as people on the internet who talk the talk but don't walk the walk,   They think because they challenged (not informed) someone on twitter they have done their job.

as oppose to Activist...

Activism consists of efforts to promote, impede, direct, or intervene in social, political, economic, or environmental reform with the desire to make changes in society. Forms of activism range from mandate building in the community (including writing letters to newspapers), petitioning elected officials, running or contributing to a political campaign, preferential patronage (or boycott) of businesses, and demonstrative forms of activism like rallies, street marches, strikes, sit-ins, or hunger strikes.

[Caseysgirl]

I couldn’t believe how Bill was so offended by the obvious sarcasm in Katie Porter’s comment about Bill possibly not being born. He has very thin skin for a comedian who gets so upset by others with “ sensitivities” to humor.

[ahpny]

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I'm not sure what Bill was trying to say about abortion rights (although I loved Porter's comment that they were all living with the 

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I've seen Katie Porter on the news, and yeah, she's terrific. I loved the way she (however inadvertently) embarrassed Bill about his own ill-advised birth.

I found her suggestion (seemingly an ill-advised attempt at humor or sarcasm) that Bill should have been aborted offensive and nearly reaching Fran Leibowitz “wouldn’t it be funny if someone got killed” territory. Nevertheless, the balance of her comments were spot on and surprised even Bill with their humor and sagacity. I’m sure she’ll be back and deservedly so.

I think I understand what Bill was getting at that seemed to trigger her comment. Though he said he was firmly pro-choice, he accepted that at least some pro-lifers held reasoned views worthy of at least being heard. Basically, the issue isn’t 100% black and white, there’s at least some grey. That’s all he meant, as I heard. That position shouldn’t have been all that controversial, but it seemed to set Ms. Porter off.

With respect to panel guests losing it, I think I also understand why Charles Blow got so upset with criticism of Black Panther. It’s not really about that one movie. It’s about disproportionate criticism focused on something that has a prominent connection with African-Americans in film – which of course has been sore topic in so many ways for a century. It’s fine for a movie critic to dislike Black Panther and point out its flaws when that criticism in line with, and similar to, the critic’s review of other films. But when people who have essentially never engaged in film analysis seem to go out of their way to point out how horrible Black Panther is, well, that becomes suspect. What exactly about this film makes it so worthy of uniquely focused venom? Hmm, what could that be? How is this movie different from other comic-book action movies? I think Blow could have gotten his point across more succinctly and with less yelling, but I think he did have a point.

[ganesh]

1 hour ago, marymon said:

I agree Bill was pissed.   He complains at how sensitive people are but he couldn't take the joke and hated it more that the crowd found it funny.

It was a good joke, and he knows it. 

The guy on the panel clearly was talking about activism so I don't know why no one would correct him. 

[sistermagpie]

2 hours ago, ahpny said:

I found her suggestion (seemingly an ill-advised attempt at humor or sarcasm) that Bill should have been aborted offensive and nearly reaching Fran Leibowitz “wouldn’t it be funny if someone got killed” territory. Nevertheless, the balance of her comments were spot on and surprised even Bill with their humor and sagacity. I’m sure she’ll be back and deservedly so.

I honestly don't think the comment was strong enough to really say she was suggesting he should have been aborted. It was just such an easy and obvious response. Because it was Bill himself who raised that issue by saying, essentially, that he was nervous about abortion because it meant maybe he personally wouldn't be on the earth right now. So it was really hard, imo, for her to not make a joke about how yes, he existed and we were all living with that good or bad. Which, imo, is a good comment because whether or not abortion should be legal should not have anything to do with what any particular birth might grow up to be. If someone argues that Martin Luther King Jr. wouldn't have existed if his mother had terminated her pregnancy, well, same with Charles Manson. It's irrelevant. Nobody should ever argue against abortion by framing it as a time travel erasure issue.

Though his actual point was fine--he was just saying that lots of people genuinely feel strongly about the issue, which is true. Many of them clearly lie about *why* they feel strongly about it, but even in those cases they feel strongly.

[Kemper]

Haven't seen last night's show; but from what I have read here and on a couple of websites... it was Bill's reaction to the audience laughing that would have made me really uncomfortable. 

[atlantaloves]

OH WOW, THAT WAS A GOOD SHOW, because KATIE IS A NEW NATIONAL TREASURE...she looks like a soccer mom, but honey she's one cool and very funny bitch! I love her. 💋

[iMonrey]

Quote

I think I understand what Bill was getting at that seemed to trigger her comment. Though he said he was firmly pro-choice, he accepted that at least some pro-lifers held reasoned views worthy of at least being heard. Basically, the issue isn’t 100% black and white, there’s at least some grey. That’s all he meant, as I heard.

What I heard was Bill projecting himself into the situation. Which, I think, is very common in pro-life arguments. Somehow people imagine they might not exist or their own children might not exist because of abortion. I find that argument irrational. Bill said his mother was told not to have any more children before he was born. He cannot on the one hand say he is firmly in favor of a woman's right to choose and on the other hand suggest it might have been better for him if his mother did not have that choice.

[ganesh]

Yet she made the choice to have Bill. Which is the whole point. 

This issue is dumb as fuck to me. Pro choice means you get to have the baby if you want. 

Or, maybe, oh I don't know, invest in education and somehow, magically, unwanted pregnancies go down. 

It's like when people are frothing at the mouth to repeal the ACA, or laugh about free community college. You do realize the health care and education is for you too? 

[Victor the Crab]

Good guests this past Friday, especially Katie Porter. Too bad it was brought down by that asshole of a host. I can't help but wonder if TPTB at HBO are starting to consider not giving Bill a new contract given his awful behavior as of late. The way he conducted himself after Porter cracked that joke about him, and how, yet again, he attacked his audience for laughing and cheering her, might be a black mark they put against him. Bill has not handled himself well in the age of Drumpf, and may not recover even after a new president is sworn in. Perhaps some newer, fresher, younger diverse talent is needed.

And I don't believe Porter will return as a guest of the show after she humiliated Bill on Friday. And if Bill thought Porter was difficult, he'd best not bring Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on as a guest. She wouldn't put up with his vulgar attitudes and would put him down quickly, making Bill go apeshit over everyone.

[smores]

4 hours ago, Victor the Crab said:

Good guests this past Friday, especially Katie Porter. Too bad it was brought down by that asshole of a host. I can't help but wonder if TPTB at HBO are starting to consider not giving Bill a new contract given his awful behavior as of late. The way he conducted himself after Porter cracked that joke about him, and how, yet again, he attacked his audience for laughing and cheering her, might be a black mark they put against him. Bill has not handled himself well in the age of Drumpf, and may not recover even after a new president is sworn in. Perhaps some newer, fresher, younger diverse talent is needed.

And I don't believe Porter will return as a guest of the show after she humiliated Bill on Friday. And if Bill thought Porter was difficult, he'd best not bring Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on as a guest. She wouldn't put up with his vulgar attitudes and would put him down quickly, making Bill go apeshit over everyone.

For as much as Bill has railed about Fox News and other pundits being "in the bubble" he's really put himself into his own bubble in the last few years.  It's become more and more apparent as he's not been able to take any sort of nuanced stand on speech being free but not everyone being worthy of your platform.  He shows it when he rails about how ridiculous it is that people fight for the rights of trans people to use whichever bathroom they feel the most comfortable in but then bitches about how narrow minded people are for not wanting to allow everyone to have free access to drugs if they want it, because that's what is important to HIM.  He complains about the special snowflakes that children are today while championing the hippies who changed the world in the 60s.  How are the social justice warriors any different?  

It's getting harder and harder to watch Bill for me.  I used to be able to appreciate the stands he took that I disagreed with, because they at least came across as informed and not a petty, personal grievance.  Now everything seems like he's just yelling at kids to get off his lawn and pissed because the world isn't the way it was when he was the hot new thing.  He hasn't adapted, though, it's on him.  

[iMonrey]

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The way he conducted himself after Porter cracked that joke about him, and how, yet again, he attacked his audience for laughing and cheering her, might be a black mark they put against him. 

Oh I don't know, I didn't think he was being serious. It looked like mock outrage to me. He's got a sense of humor, I have to give him that. 

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For as much as Bill has railed about Fox News and other pundits being "in the bubble" he's really put himself into his own bubble in the last few years.

I do agree with that, though. Especially when it comes to his favorite pet peeves: college kids being "snowflakes" and free speech. Otherwise, I think sometimes he is mistakenly blamed for being "against" something when his stand is actually that Democrats lose on particular topics and should steer clear of them. I think that's what he was getting at with gun control. He's not against gun control but he recognizes that it's not a winning issue for Democrats, statistically. 

[Victor the Crab]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Oh I don't know, I didn't think he was being serious. It looked like mock outrage to me. He's got a sense of humor, I have to give him that. 

I seriously doubt that. Bill has shown that he's so far up his own ass, he believes his farts are like potpourri. And his sense of humor, like his advancing old age, has been in decline for quite a while now.

[Andromeda]

22 hours ago, smores said:

t's getting harder and harder to watch Bill for me.  I used to be able to appreciate the stands he took that I disagreed with, because they at least came across as informed and not a petty, personal grievance.  Now everything seems like he's just yelling at kids to get off his lawn and pissed because the world isn't the way it was when he was the hot new thing.  He hasn't adapted, though, it's on him.  

Exactly this. He totally has entered the "get off my lawn" era of his lifetime. I'm really getting sick of him, because he's becoming stuck in his views and one-note on his show.

Don't the elders of every generation complain about "kids these days"? Can there BE anymore of an indicator that you're no longer moving with the times? He and Fran Leibowitz went on and on about it last week, and this week we got his graduation speech. I'm approaching 60, and I hope never to become one of those elders.

Bill should read this.

Edited June 13, 2019 by Andromeda
Added a link

[ganesh]

Bill doesn't mind getting dinged when it's one of his friends like Sarah Silverman who loves to break him up on the show, but he wasn't happy about this joke. I think it was more that he walked into it and it was a good joke. 

I don't mind him telling if the audience. There's a long history of that in comedy. I tend to think that him yelling made it more of a bit so he could take back the joke from her to him. 

[izabella]

19 hours ago, iMonrey said:

Otherwise, I think sometimes he is mistakenly blamed for being "against" something when his stand is actually that Democrats lose on particular topics and should steer clear of them. I think that's what he was getting at with gun control. He's not against gun control but he recognizes that it's not a winning issue for Democrats, statistically. 

I think that's what he was trying to say, too.  But he's wrong about the stats because a majority of Americans are in favor of gun control and are not afraid Dems are coming to "take their guns" because they never, ever have.  By suggesting Dems should steer clear of the issue, he's saying the Dems should mute the voices of the majority of Americans who are in favor of gun control. 

Dems should take the issue back and make it a strength - "we heard you America!  No more Las Vegas!  No more Parkland!  No more Pulse nightclub!  No more murders synagogues and churches across the country!  We heard you and we will legislate gun safety and gun control!"

Gun control is a feature, not a bug, for the Dems since a majority support it.  Just like a majority support reproductive and abortion rights.  Cowering away from those topics makes it seem like the Dems are on the wrong side of the issue, when they are not, and it gives the opposition the floor to make up lies about what gun control and reproductive rights means.  Avoiding those topics makes it seem like they are ashamed of their positions when they should proclaim them boldly and clearly.  Protecting women's rights to their own bodies and the safety of innocent people is nothing to be ashamed of.

[Victor the Crab]

7 hours ago, ganesh said:

Bill doesn't mind getting dinged when it's one of his friends like Sarah Silverman who loves to break him up on the show, but he wasn't happy about this joke. I think it was more that he walked into it and it was a good joke. 

I don't mind him telling if the audience. There's a long history of that in comedy. I tend to think that him yelling made it more of a bit so he could take back the joke from her to him. 

Real Time isn't Bill's usual stand up routine, where he can go after a heckler who interrupts his act. It's supposed to be a discussion show about the topics of the day where the guests give their opinions in front of a live studio audience. And the audience isn't trying to throw Bill off his game like some asshole attempting to insert themselves in his act. They were cheering and applauding one of his guests who said something they liked yet Bill did not. Like Katie Porter's funny joke about him not getting aborted, or Fran Lebowitz, a few weeks ago, saying Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders are too old to run for president. And Bill, being the diva that he is, threw a temper tantrum against them for what he perceived to be them turning on him.

For someone who claims how important Free Speech is, Bill is getting exposed as a fucking hypocrite. What he really believes in is Me Speech, where he wants to say whatever he feels like with no pushback from anyone whatsoever. And woes anyone who dares try and challenge him. He's every bit the Whinny Little Bitch Drumpf is.

[ProudMary]

I'm also wondering if Katie Porter will be invited back to the show because not only did she have the audience with her on the abortion joke at Bill's expense, but she also shut him right down about his rant on gun control being an issue the Democrats should avoid for 2020 when she interjected that she had won while campaigning on gun control in a very red California district.

I watched the show in the first place because Katie Porter was a scheduled guest. I've had my eye on her since the campaign and certainly have been fascinated by her excellence at questioning titans of industry and others testifying on Capitol Hill in recent months. What I didn't realize was just how funny she is. The woman is a political star.

Charles Blow got the better of Bill several times also, making this a very enjoyable panel.