Terminator: Dark Fate (2019)

[slf]

On 10/22/2019 at 8:50 AM, Anduin said:

After that, I hate to link this, but I have to. They padded out her costume with boobs and butt.

I can understand why producers would get actors to work out. To make them look like they've spent their lives fighting evil, instead of enjoying the spoils of victory a little too much. But that's not an excuse in this case.

God forbid the 60-something cyborg-killing resistance fighter not provide some t and a.

[Anela]

On 10/22/2019 at 6:34 AM, slf said:

I love how Linda Hamilton looks. She clearly hasn't gone the plastic surgery route, she's not getting fillers or botox. She looks like a woman in her early sixties who's lived and aged. No fucking way would Sarah Connor, the Mother of the Resistance, look like some weirdly smooth-faced socialite who Hasn't Aged A Day!; not after everything she's seen and done, not with the burdens she carries. She's gonna have wrinkles and age spots and sun damage- she's spent decades on the run from killer robots, including a stint in a mental institution, trying to prevent and then survive the apocalypse and raise her hotheaded son to be the savior of mankind. I highly doubt she'd have a 10 step skin routine. I'd be pissed if they'd plucked and stuffed Hamilton's face until she looked like Madonna.

I don't have feelings about the trailer one way or the other. Some good movies have bad trailers and some bad movies have good ones and I can't tell by the trailer which one this will be. But I am absolutely seeing this in theater because I have missed Sarah Connor.

I agree with you. I can just imagine her reaction to instagram (which I love, but can picture a "WTF is this?" reaction. 

[ApathyMonger]

I thought it was fine. Good cast, and decent action, but the script was incredibly dull and predictable, and it mostly felt unnecessary. I don’t know when I’ve last seen a movie with such predictable “twists.”

Genisys had many, many problems, but at least it was trying something different.

That said, it’s still one of the better 2019 blockbusters.

[Robert Lynch]

1 hour ago, ApathyMonger said:

I thought it was fine. Good cast, and decent action, but the script was incredibly dull and predictable, and it mostly felt unnecessary. I don’t know when I’ve last seen a movie with such predictable “twists.”

Genisys had many, many problems, but at least it was trying something different.

That said, it’s still one of the better 2019 blockbusters.

I was afraid of that. I heard Edward Furlong's John Connor is just a cameo and nothing more.

[ApathyMonger]

Even calling it a cameo is very generous.

Spoiler

He just provides the face for a young John who dies in the opening scene.

[BooBear]

Well, it seems this is tanking with an estimated 28K opening weekend. It is too bad that many people will go to see it. It just encourages these studios to keep trying to make movies so they will get "some" money. But I heard this one had a big budget so... not helpful. 

[slf]

4 hours ago, BooBear said:

Well, it seems this is tanking with an estimated 28K opening weekend. It is too bad that many people will go to see it. It just encourages these studios to keep trying to make movies so they will get "some" money. But I heard this one had a big budget so... not helpful. 

If despite the film's lackluster box office haul the studio decides to greenlight more Sarah Connor-led movies I, for one, will be very happy.

[Robert Lynch]

4 hours ago, BooBear said:

Well, it seems this is tanking with an estimated 28K opening weekend. It is too bad that many people will go to see it. It just encourages these studios to keep trying to make movies so they will get "some" money. But I heard this one had a big budget so... not helpful. 

Oh, damn it! I hope I don't regret watching this. I got tickets for Tuesday. Damn, the trailer looked too promising.

I didn't know Cameron and Miller clashed on this film.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Robert Lynch

[stealinghome]

I just got back from the movie and thought it was really, really intense and enjoyable. I do agree it's a better action movie/blockbuster than a Terminator movie, if that makes sense, but on the whole I thoroughly enjoyed it and would absolutely sign up to see more movies with Sarah and Dani.

The movie's main problem is that it has too much. Too many characters, too many OTT action set pieces, and too much exposition of things that would work better hinted at but not shown or explicitly told (aka most of the Grace backstory/Dani's future). At the same time, it handwaves major plot points a little too much ("Carl" grew a conscience and has been living a normal life all this time? Really???). I do wonder if some moments got left on the editing room floor for time, but I also kind of think the screenplay was just a mess. More broadly, this movie loses sight of the fact that what made the original Terminator and T2 great wasn't their five hundred set pieces (admittedly very well done) but the human moments in between. And when this movie slows down and lets its characters breathe, it is really affecting, it just needed to do that more. That said, it never drags--it's long as movies go these days but it doesn't feel it at all. In fact it flies by. The adrenaline is fairly nonstop.

Linda Hamilton was the movie's MVP. She gave a really solid, moving performance. Her realization that another dystopian future is upon her in the hotel room, and then her scene with Dani in the woods later, were probably the best scenes of the movie. She just owned what Sarah would be like 20+ years later after having had to watch a preteen John die in front of her. OTOH, Arnold totally phoned it in (I haven't seen the most recent few Terminator movies but this definitely felt like his goodbye/like he's ready to be done with the franchise). I liked the girl who played Dani well enough, but the one future scene where she's the inspirational leader was not great. It pains me to say it since I liked her in HACF, but I didn't love Mackenzie Davis in this. The Grace part was underwritten in some ways, but she didn't do a ton with it either. Not sure how much range she has.

I do love how, even if the future/savior/leader changes, Sarah Connor still ends up raising or at least mentoring that person. And Dani is John, but she's also Sarah. Some really interesting recursion there (though that may well have happened on accident...). I will give the movie props for surprising me with the end--I thought for sure everyone else would die protecting Dani and she rides off into the future alone a la Sarah in Terminator 1, or Dani would be left with Grace, but I didn't predict Grace dying and Sarah and Dani being the duo at the end.

Also, I thought all the callbacks to the original Terminator and T2 were great, as was the end scene, which I take to be a callback to the Sarah Connor Chronicles (really appropriately given the events of this movie).

I would definitely recommend this, and would go again if I had time in the next few weeks.

[HolmesUltimateQu]

I saw this movie tonight and actually enjoyed it for what it was. I enjoyed it more than the other Terminator movies of recent years. I don't even remember which ones were which - there was a Christian Bale one and an Emilia Clarke one. I don't really remember what happened in those. I was a huge fan of TSCC (never forget) and will never not be mad at Fox for cancelling it. Seriously. I haven't started a new show on Fox since then. 

I loved the new Terminator and I thought Linda Hamilton was great. I also appreciate how she looks her age. She looks amazing. 

That being said, I agree with others that the story was predictable (my husband called it, "formulaic") and the Big Reveal was very anticlimactic. 

I wasn't feeling the character of Grace and while I liked Dani, I didn't really see anything that made me believe that she was capable of starting and leading a resistance. I know she had big talking moments but I didn't necessarily believe her (lol). 

Overall, though, I enjoyed it. It felt like a real Terminator movie and I don't regret going to see it in theaters. 

[Robert Lynch]

16 hours ago, stealinghome said:

I just got back from the movie and thought it was really, really intense and enjoyable. I do agree it's a better action movie/blockbuster than a Terminator movie, if that makes sense, but on the whole I thoroughly enjoyed it and would absolutely sign up to see more movies with Sarah and Dani.

The movie's main problem is that it has too much. Too many characters, too many OTT action set pieces, and too much exposition of things that would work better hinted at but not shown or explicitly told (aka most of the Grace backstory/Dani's future). At the same time, it handwaves major plot points a little too much ("Carl" grew a conscience and has been living a normal life all this time? Really???). I do wonder if some moments got left on the editing room floor for time, but I also kind of think the screenplay was just a mess. More broadly, this movie loses sight of the fact that what made the original Terminator and T2 great wasn't their five hundred set pieces (admittedly very well done) but the human moments in between. And when this movie slows down and lets its characters breathe, it is really affecting, it just needed to do that more. That said, it never drags--it's long as movies go these days but it doesn't feel it at all. In fact it flies by. The adrenaline is fairly nonstop.

Linda Hamilton was the movie's MVP. She gave a really solid, moving performance. Her realization that another dystopian future is upon her in the hotel room, and then her scene with Dani in the woods later, were probably the best scenes of the movie. She just owned what Sarah would be like 20+ years later after having had to watch a preteen John die in front of her. OTOH, Arnold totally phoned it in (I haven't seen the most recent few Terminator movies but this definitely felt like his goodbye/like he's ready to be done with the franchise). I liked the girl who played Dani well enough, but the one future scene where she's the inspirational leader was not great. It pains me to say it since I liked her in HACF, but I didn't love Mackenzie Davis in this. The Grace part was underwritten in some ways, but she didn't do a ton with it either. Not sure how much range she has.

I do love how, even if the future/savior/leader changes, Sarah Connor still ends up raising or at least mentoring that person. And Dani is John, but she's also Sarah. Some really interesting recursion there (though that may well have happened on accident...). I will give the movie props for surprising me with the end--I thought for sure everyone else would die protecting Dani and she rides off into the future alone a la Sarah in Terminator 1, or Dani would be left with Grace, but I didn't predict Grace dying and Sarah and Dani being the duo at the end.

Also, I thought all the callbacks to the original Terminator and T2 were great, as was the end scene, which I take to be a callback to the Sarah Connor Chronicles (really appropriately given the events of this movie).

I would definitely recommend this, and would go again if I had time in the next few weeks.

Now I am wondering how Mackenzie Davis would fare in the remake of The Innocents. Pretty big shoes to fill Deborah Kerr's performance there. 

[junemeatcleaver]

This movie bombed in North America and overseas, a sequel to Dark Fate is unlikely to see the light of day.  I doubt that will stop the studio from making Terminator movies, though.  They'll blame Dark Fate's fate on the female leads and cast some broody generic dude as John Connor when they try again.

[Robert Lynch]

10 hours ago, junemeatcleaver said:

This movie bombed in North America and overseas, a sequel to Dark Fate is unlikely to see the light of day.  I doubt that will stop the studio from making Terminator movies, though.  They'll blame Dark Fate's fate on the female leads and cast some broody generic dude as John Connor when they try again.

It was in competition with Harriet and I think that's what killed Dark Fate.

[benteen]

13 hours ago, junemeatcleaver said:

This movie bombed in North America and overseas, a sequel to Dark Fate is unlikely to see the light of day.  I doubt that will stop the studio from making Terminator movies, though.  They'll blame Dark Fate's fate on the female leads and cast some broody generic dude as John Connor when they try again.

I can't say I'm surprised.  I've been saying this for years...the time to have done a 3rd Terminator sequel was in the mid-90s.  By the time they finally did one, the demand wasn't there, Cameron and Hamilton weren't part of it and Arnold was past his prime as a box office star.  Not helping matters is that it's basically the exact same plot in every movie.  Skynet sending a Terminator back in time to kill so-and-so.  Skynet is like a government program that has never worked but politicians still throw money at.

Edited November 4, 2019 by benteen

[Anela]

I want to see this, I just couldn't afford it this weekend. 

[dwmarch]

I just saw this yesterday and found it to be enjoyable although I have actually liked all of the movies to date.

There were a couple of things particular to this timeline (and it was explicitly called out as a branched timeline at one point) that don't quite fit with what we've seen so far. Carl learns to become more human but this means ignoring the deleted scene from T2 where this was accomplished by switching his chip from read-only mode into learning mode. The time-quakes that precede the arrival of a Terminator are also new. Genisys had Sarah and Pops waiting for the original T-800 to drop in but never said they detected him coming; if they knew exactly when and where it would have made more sense to avoid the T-on-T combat and have Pops on the rifle while Sarah provides the distraction. Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles also had Terminators dropping in every other week and Cameron (the Summer Glau one) never knew they were coming.

Legion was shown as having a different AI from Skynet which is appreciated. However, Legion didn't hesitate to swagger-jack everything else from Skynet, including specific names for things, such as HKs.

There is an XKCD comic, More Accurate, about a modern version of Terminator ending quickly with a drone strike. Someone in the production obviously saw that comic.

Speaking of things that look familiar, didn't I just see a movie recently where the heroine goes into battle against a tentacle-monster machine and she gets shredded by it and has to have her body rebuilt? Alita, is that you?

I guess the John Connor scene at the beginning was supposed to be shocking but there is a very similar opening scene in T:SCC. John Connor gets killed more often than not in the movies. In T3, he gets assassinated in the future by the T-850 they are traveling with in the present. In T4, the T-RIP (prototype for the T-800) kills him and he only survives courtesy of a heart transplant from Marcus. In T5, John dies twice - first, the human version when the T-5000 grabs him and later the Terminator version when they use the time machine to rip him apart. T:SCC also ended with a future war where John Connor was nobody in particular and the resistance was being led by someone else.

I got a kick out of Gabriel Luna's Rev-9 having a sense of remorse. Not only when checking in to the Immigration facility but also when he falls out of the sky and walks through someone's backyard BBQ (while they are listening to the bar music from T2!) apologizing for fucking their shed up. I also loved when he played up a Texas accent and talked about how he's never prayed so much as in the last five minutes while talking to some cops. By and large he never slips up, dogs the heroes the whole time and doesn't die until they jam a future power source directly into his face (kinda like how they killed the T-X in T-3). He's definitely one of my favorite villain Terminators alongside Myron Stark from T:SCC and the T-1000.

[Robert Lynch]

Reasons why Dark Fate failed at the box office

[Anduin]

1 hour ago, Robert Lynch said:

Reasons why Dark Fate failed at the box office

I'm not going to turn off adblock. But when I watched the trailers, they left me cold. I just couldn't muster the enthusiasm to watch it.

[Robert Lynch]

8 hours ago, Anduin said:

I'm not going to turn off adblock. But when I watched the trailers, they left me cold. I just couldn't muster the enthusiasm to watch it.

It was okay. Judging how many screenwriters this had, I knew it was going to be a mess.

[markx]

Maybe it's just me, I can't help thinking the reviews were better until the under-performing US opening ("We can't go giving a good review to something that's flopped!")

I wonder what the expectations of Terminator sequels are. To me it seems obvious that Terminator - although well known - just doesn't have anywhere near the reach or number of fans as something like Star Wars. To me, that alone answers why The Force Awakens was going to make a whole load more, even if it was a copy of the original storyline far more than Dark Fate was.

Terminator 3/4/5 made $433m/$371m/$441m - all less than T2 (especially factoring in inflation), and not massive hits, but are they commercial flops? Other films (including series say The Expendables) have made less. It seems the problem is they spend so much on marketing for Terminator that it's hard to break even. (E.g., Wikipedia quotes a source saying Genisys needed $450m to break even - I don't understand how that comes from a $155m budget and $50-100m on marketing?)

The other problem is this repeated cycle where it's decided Terminator is a flop and the plans for sequels are scrapped, until a few years when someone else decides to have enough go, so continuity suffers. Imagine if Marvel gave up after The Hulk's $263m!

Well, I liked it, I'd be happy to watch it again. It suffered a bit of too many main characters making it hard for the new main character to shine through.

The idea of an evil AI rise being inevitable was covered in both T3 and the TV series, but it seemed better done here, e.g., that it would change which people were important in the future timeline. Cameron's vision for sequels was that Sarah would find a way to end this ever happening, and I guess we'll never see how now. (It seems to me the only options are to either prevent such a super intelligence ever arising by destorying all technology, or make sure that a good super intelligence arises.)

I was fine with not making John Connor part of it. There were already too many main characters. The first two films were really about Sarah not John. If people want to see sequels with John, that's Terminator 3/4/5. And I think they suffered because it's hard to show the reality of the character growing up into the myth that was made of him - especially in an altered future.

The idea of a terminator growing a conscience and living a family life seems funny, but I'm reminded of the scene in T2 where the T1000 has murdered John's foster mum, and is meanwhile at home cooking and preparing dinner.

There were a couple of things particular to this timeline (and it was explicitly called out as a branched timeline at one point) that don't quite fit with what we've seen so far. ... The time-quakes that precede the arrival of a Terminator are also new.

That's a good point. To be honest, I took the intention to be that Terminator/T2/Dark Fate should be considered an entirely separate story, i.e., nothing in the other films or TV series were canon to this story. However, they did indeed make the "separate timeline" argument, and as you say, this doesn't work. Personally it's a pet hate of mine when writers use the "separate timeline" argument rather than just saying it's a different story (unless it's explicitly part of the plot, e.g., Star Trek's reboot). I can happily watch separate Batman film series without having to pretend they all exist in different parallel universes or timelines.
 

[bluvelvet]

Saw it today and enjoyed it. I did figure a part of the plot point, that Dani was the savior. Loved Linda Hamilton in this, she did a great job and yes I enjoyed seeing Arnold and figured he would die in the end.

Also loved the new Terminator and the double body concept.

[ICantDoThatDave]

On 11/9/2019 at 9:17 AM, markx said:

It seems the problem is they spend so much on marketing for Terminator that it's hard to break even. (E.g., Wikipedia quotes a source saying Genisys needed $450m to break even - I don't understand how that comes from a $155m budget and $50-100m on marketing?)

It's because the studios only get about half the box office take.  It's an approximation, but a pretty reliable one.

[greekmom]

Saw it yesterday at a 3 pm show.  Theatre was barely full. 

The plot seemed recycled. Hated that 

Spoiler

they killed John early in the film and wish he grew up and because they missed Judgement Day he and Sarah would help Dani be the new saviour.

Alot of plot points were far fetched.  I was curious to know if the army guy who gave Sarah the weapons was Dyson's son.  Anyone !??!?!  They never explained how she knew him.

I only saw it for Linda Hamilton and she delivered. Everyone else and plot was meh.

[stealinghome]

Quote

Alot of plot points were far fetched.  I was curious to know if the army guy who gave Sarah the weapons was Dyson's son.  Anyone !??!?!  They never explained how she knew him.

Yeah, I was TOTALLY waiting for the reveal that the Major was Dyson's son, and then it never came! I would love to know if it ended up on a cutting room floor someone or if that was never the intent....

[Robert Lynch]

On 11/10/2019 at 5:58 PM, greekmom said:

Saw it yesterday at a 3 pm show.  Theatre was barely full. 

The plot seemed recycled. Hated that 

  Reveal spoiler

they killed John early in the film and wish he grew up and because they missed Judgement Day he and Sarah would help Dani be the new saviour.

Alot of plot points were far fetched.  I was curious to know if the army guy who gave Sarah the weapons was Dyson's son.  Anyone !??!?!  They never explained how she knew him.

I only saw it for Linda Hamilton and she delivered. Everyone else and plot was meh.

I think the major reason for Edward Furlong's short cameo is because of his drastic weight gain and all the drug abuse he endured over the years. However, I think the damage was done when Edward hooked up with that 20 something tutor of his during the Terminator 2 days. And you know that would not have worked due to their age difference, despite their first eight years together.

[MrsR]

Just came back from seeing it and I'm pretty damn happy with it. 
Loved that they incorporated Sarah's crazy talk video into the logos at the start especially because it was a great way to include Dr. Silber!!! What would a T movie be with out Silber!!!

The CGI during the assassination scene was killer.

Loved Linda through and through. Had no problem believing Dani could be the leader of the Resistance since they made it clear that she was the alpha in her family.

The action scene in the factory/industrial setting being placed at the beginning (rather than the end like T1 and T2) was a lovely touch. 

Set in Mexico and no "Asta la vista baby". Thank you for showing restraint.

 SCC established that a Terminator with a lot of time on his hands could evolve and be a do-gooder, so no problem with Carl.  Myron Stark for President!

When the T1 music started up I got all verklempt.

Missed opportunity: Kyle Reese would have been alive and well in this world.  Just saying.

Favorite line: "Yeah, cause otherwise, this might be dangerous!"

[dwmarch]

1 hour ago, MrsR said:

 SCC established that a Terminator with a lot of time on his hands could evolve and be a do-gooder, so no problem with Carl.  Myron Stark for President!

I'd say Myron Stark adapted more than he evolved. His hallmark was that he wasn't concerned with the societal mores of the day. So in order to get the job done he hired non-white labor and paid his workforce double the usual wages. As I put it elsewhere, he's still out to end humanity but he's not going to be a dick about it.

We did see some Terminator evolution on the show though. Cameron is certainly not a typical Terminator and she went beyond her programming a few notable times on the show. Vick Chamberlain played house for a while, replacing his human counterpart and fooling his wife. Catherine Weaver did some things that weren't mission-critical as well.

[shrewd.buddha]

Just rented it ... and I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for this movie. 
The entire story is stuck on repeat: Killer robot and also a protector come from the future to kill/save someone: running and fighting ensue. 
None of the tweaks and twists to that story made it feel any fresher: gender swaps, current immigration issues, human enhancements, etc. 

The action sequences even started to feel repetitive and numbing. It did not help that the over-the-top sequences near the end of the movie were somewhat confusing with regards to who was doing what to whom (at least to me). 

One of the most irritating aspects of these Terminator movies is that we are shown how lethal the robots are - taking out a a small army of guards - but the target character (who is to be terminated) always ends up in face-to-face combat with the robot that could easily kill them at any moment. 

Someone in the always-apocalyptic  future really needs to address the endless amount and constant use of time-travel technology. It's like Amazon levels of time-displaced package delivery. 

Edited February 10, 2020 by shrewd.buddha

[BetterButter]

 

[Grumpymonkey]

Watched this the other night. I enjoyed LH and AS. LH still kicks ass.  I didn't mind Dani but really didn't buy the relationship between her and Grace. Grace was actually my least favorite part. Story was predictable, action was good though some scenes did drag. I enjoyed this more than I thought considering the reviews.

[Raja]

On 2/10/2020 at 10:05 AM, shrewd.buddha said:

Just rented it ... and I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for this movie. 
The entire story is stuck on repeat: Killer robot and also a protector come from the future to kill/save someone: running and fighting ensue. 
None of the tweaks and twists to that story made it feel any fresher: gender swaps, current immigration issues, human enhancements, etc. 

The action sequences even started to feel repetitive and numbing. It did not help that the over-the-top sequences near the end of the movie were somewhat confusing with regards to who was doing what to whom (at least to me). 

One of the most irritating aspects of these Terminator movies is that we are shown how lethal the robots are - taking out a a small army of guards - but the target character (who is to be terminated) always ends up in face-to-face combat with the robot that could easily kill them at any moment. 

Someone in the always-apocalyptic  future really needs to address the endless amount and constant use of time-travel technology. It's like Amazon levels of time-displaced package delivery. 

Amazon Prime had been advertising so I finally caught up having dropped the franchise after John Conner and Catherine Weaver jumped to a new future. Especially irritating here at the end when the Terminator has his robot hand around the target's neck, not dragging her to get in a killing position like in the original movie. It was an easier kill than squeezing a trigger yet somehow it's hand wouldn't close before Carl rebooted and interfered. 

Those new terminators always have that target lock. Given its ability you would think take out the terminator, then the cyborg and the human is then an easy target. But no they ignore them meanwhile take on hordes of bystanders instead of infiltrating

[Rushmoras]

IMHO, it was no worse than any other Terminator past Judgment Day. Still, the best Terminator is the second one. Somehow, no other T movie was able to surpass that (and T2 came out in, what, 1991? So almost twenty years ago).

Edited December 2, 2020 by Rushmoras

[paramitch]

It took me awhile to see this (I loved the trailer so much I was almost afraid to watch!), but I was pretty happy with it. It wasn't perfect, and as always with these kinds of movies nowadays, the final third of the film was just one big bloated (if extremely cool) combat setpiece after another (see also WONDER WOMAN -- SOO MANY CARS TOSSED IN SLOW MOTION! AGHGHGH!).

But I thought it was a great, fun candybar movie, and a worthy entry in the TERMINATOR series. And compared to the abysmal GENISYS, this was practically Shakespeare. (RANT WARNING: Look, I'm a TERMINATOR franchise fan, and am pretty forgiving. I liked T3. I even liked T4 with Bale. But, to this day, GENESYS is one of the worst, most insulting movies I've ever seen -- it badly rewrites TERMINATOR to be all about Reese, not Sarah, and laughably turns Sarah into a disempowered damsel. The worst offense for me was that they even changed the iconic picture of Sarah to now be looking RIGHT AT US versus off into a forbidding future because God forbid the movie have an iota of subtlety. I haaaaaated it. So. Damn. Much. And oh, God, the acting! I thought it was comically bad.)

But I thought DARK FATE was terrific, if slightly silly fun. The opening genuinely shocked the hell out of me, but I appreciated the chutzpah of the move. I loved all three lead women, who were all interesting, strong, and fascinating (and beautifully acted), and most of all, I loved the softer energy of it, and every single time the movie slowed down to allow for conversations between such genuinely interesting characters.

I was so impressed with the lead female trio. Linda Hamilton was such a badass, but also funny, complex, and vulnerable. Mackenzie Davis was a freaking goddess as Grace, and I loved the slow reveal of her backstory, sacrifice, and determination. And Natalia Reyes was a wonderful addition -- believably innocent, but also brave, kind, and swift to evolve. I've always loved Davis and expected her to become a star, ever since the first episode of "Halt and Catch FIre" (one of the smartest, best shows in TV history), but seeing her so strong and kickass here was incredible. She must have worked incredibly hard to prepare for the film, and the payoff was that her physical transformation was almost as big as Hamilton's back for T2.

Like I said, my complaints are minor -- I just get tired of all of these things devolving into big giant fight scenes when I find the dialogue scenes so much more interesting. I'm not saying I don't like action, I'm just saying, does it always have to be 15-20 minutes at a time? Followed, almost always, by 15-20 minutes almost immediately after of ANOTHER big setpiece? Aghghg. It's so boring. But they did it well here, and I admit that the in-flight battle, the fall, and then the bridge battles were all pretty jaw-dropping, as was the final "kill box" battle (the only one I was emotionally invested in).

But some of those quiet scenes were just so beautifully written and acted. Every scene between Grace and Dani (and yeah, I was totally shipping those two -- it seemed fairly obvious to me that there was a romantic undercurrent to them). And the gorgeous hotel conversations between Sarah and Grace (and eventually Dani). I even loved Schwarzenegger as Carl -- he actually ACTED! I mean, he really did. He was subtle and quiet, empathetic and truly interesting in that role. (I mean, look, I love Arnie, but he's not exactly an actor's actor. Seeing his ability actually evolve into some fine work here was really wonderful to see.)

On 5/23/2019 at 5:38 PM, supposebly said:

I like that the trailer puts Sarah Connor and a female terminator in the foreground. I got into this franchise through the Sarah Connor Chronicles. To me, it's her story. I read somewhere, it's supposed to be a direct continuation of T2. That might not be a bad thing.

ETA: Linda Hamilton is over 60. That woman looks impressive.

She was 63 when she made this, and I think she looked amazing. And I loved her performance.

On 10/12/2019 at 3:52 PM, BooBear said:

I just can't get over how horribly she has aged. She looks positively ancient. It puts me off seeing it when I wonder if the kick back from the gun is going to break her arm. 

I don't even know what to say here. "Positively ancient?" Just looking at her "puts you off?" Have you never seen a naturally aging 63 year-old woman before? There are all kinds of ways to be in your mid-60s right now. Depending on your DNA, health and financial circumstance, sure, you can be fit and supple, capable of firing a rifle. Or you may be living with aches and pains and spending most of your time golfing or gardening.

Personally, I think Hamilton looked amazing here -- believably older after decades on adrenaline and alcohol, but still strong and kickass. As an actress, she has also been funny, charming and vocal about why she chose not to use botox or plastic surgery, and I think she is beautiful. Yes, her face has lines and wrinkles, but she is still the beautiful woman she always was.

On 10/12/2019 at 10:52 PM, Anela said:

I read an article in which she said that she wanted people to say, "Wow, she got so old!" I clicked out of the link, so I don't have it handy now. I almost didn't read it, because it said she hadn't had sex in fifteen years, and I thought, "So? Why are they asking her about that?" It turned out she just enjoys being single, she's happy with her life.

Hamilton did a fantastic interview with The New York Times before this came out, and that's where she talked about her age, work, marriages, sex life and lack thereof. I just loved her so much from the interview. She was so funny and open, and so humble. My favorite revelation she shared was that James Cameron basically fell in love with her as Sarah Connor, so she tried really hard to stay in that character, to be Sarah Connor for him, and of course eventually failed, because that isn't who she is. The fact that she still has a lot of affection for him was really so lovely (especially since he famously ended their marriage by cheating on her with Suzy Amis on TITANIC).

On 10/13/2019 at 5:20 AM, BooBear said:

Not buying that. She knows she looks old... trying to save face.  Arnold isn't looking too great either. 

Of course Linda knows she looks old. What I find refreshing is that she embraces it and refuses to feel bad about it. Hamilton is 64. Arnold is 73. What do you expect or demand that they look like in order to be acceptable for viewing? How is her not apologizing for looking old "saving face?" Maybe she just accepts that time marches on for all of us eventually.

I'm happy the movie dared to cast these unsavory older people. I'm just sorry that you had to be subjected to looking at them.

On 10/13/2019 at 7:26 AM, SimoneS said:

The old comments are why Hollywood won't cast mature women in leading roles and pressures women to mutilate their faces to look "younger." I am sure Linda Hamilton could have had cosmetic surgery before she started filming the movie, she just chose not to. Besides cosmetic surgery can do only do so much as you age, look at Arnold.

100% this, Simone. Well said.

On 10/13/2019 at 12:06 PM, BooBear said:

Well maybe they shouldn't if they look like this. This movie is not going to help matters.  If she was playing a mom sitting around talking ok but I am going to have to cringe watching her walking around with the massive machine gun when she looks like she has osteoporosis.

Aside from Sigourney Weaver (who is wonderful at any age, of course)... does this mean that only attractive, fit, able-bodied young people are worthy of attention on film? And only in very specific traditional roles?

For me, not only is this POV genuinely upsetting -- but how boring would that be? Isn't the whole point of film (and fantasy/sci-fi film) the presentation of diverse settings and characters?

On 10/13/2019 at 1:14 PM, shanndee said:

As my husband is fond of pointing out...women are finally taking their power. They are running their own production companies, and roles are finally becoming available that show women over 40 as more than "the mom". 

Strong women being cast in action roles is happening more often. The tide is turning, and I will support any movie to TV series that follows this lead.

Anyway, back to this movie. 

The trailer gives me enough to hope that it will erase the mistakes of the past few entries in the series. I am hoping it will clean up the timeline enough for me to call myself a fan of this series again. 

I heart everything you said in your post. That is all.

On 10/22/2019 at 3:34 AM, slf said:

I love how Linda Hamilton looks. She clearly hasn't gone the plastic surgery route, she's not getting fillers or botox. She looks like a woman in her early sixties who's lived and aged. No fucking way would Sarah Connor, the Mother of the Resistance, look like some weirdly smooth-faced socialite who Hasn't Aged A Day!; not after everything she's seen and done, not with the burdens she carries. She's gonna have wrinkles and age spots and sun damage- she's spent decades on the run from killer robots, including a stint in a mental institution, trying to prevent and then survive the apocalypse and raise her hotheaded son to be the savior of mankind. I highly doubt she'd have a 10 step skin routine. I'd be pissed if they'd plucked and stuffed Hamilton's face until she looked like Madonna.

This.

On 10/25/2019 at 2:52 PM, ApathyMonger said:

I thought it was fine. Good cast, and decent action, but the script was incredibly dull and predictable, and it mostly felt unnecessary. I don’t know when I’ve last seen a movie with such predictable “twists.”

Genisys had many, many problems, but at least it was trying something different.

That said, it’s still one of the better 2019 blockbusters.

I wanted so badly to like GENISYS, but honestly, even after three tries, I have never, ever been able to finish the final 20 minutes. It's one of the worst movies I've ever seen (and I will never forgive the way it retcons Sarah's story and insultingly turns it into Reese's). I thought this was worlds better, flaws and all.

And I loved the way the ending here was full circle and evocative of the original TERMINATOR epilogue -- Sarah darkly looking ahead, yet once again having someone to care for, someone to train for the dark future ahead. And Dani having a protector again, a soldier just as loyal as Grace (and a new mission, to give Grace the happy life she deserves this time around).

Edited January 21, 2021 by paramitch
Clarified ending comment

[BetterButter]

The Tin Man Gets His Heart: An Oral History of ‘Terminator 2: Judgment Day’

[Trini]

11 hours ago, BetterButter said:

The Tin Man Gets His Heart: An Oral History of ‘Terminator 2: Judgment Day’

There is a topic for the Terminator movies in general, BTW:

https://forums.primetimer.com/topic/47317-the-terminator-saga-no-fate-but-what-we-make-at-the-box-office/

 

[Kel Varnsen]

Watched this last night. I liked it, it was fun for a dumb terminator movie which is exactly what I felt like watching last night. I also appreciated that it was R rated. Never saw Genesys but Salvation being PG-13 was stupid. Can't remember if T3 was R or not, but I remember reading once that T2 was the highest grossing R rated movie for a long time.

The only thing I hated was the whole sequence on the plane. First off they got to just fly off in a cargo jet because some Major said it was ok. That was stupid. The fight in the cargo area wasn't very good either. It was just a poorly lit CGI mess. Which was extra disappointing because some of the other fights were really good, like the one in the car plant.