S08.E09: One Month Down, Forever To Go

[Drogo]

2 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

That is Left Dude..the nice guy standing to her left at the reception....

He was in the red, white, blue plaid shirt at their house party.

He was the one with the arm around a girl that wasn't Kate.  Oh no wait, that was Kate's husband Luke.  [Fuck you, Luke.]  I want Kate and Left Dude (the same gent who told Luke that Kate looks beautiful and not uncomfortable in her wedding gown) to have a weekend of utter hedonism after Decision Day.   I believe Left Dude would whole-heartedly appreciate some snuggle kisses and clean countertops.

11 minutes ago, Jaclyn88 said:

If anyone deserves a "second chances" show, it's Kate. But if I were in her position, I'd run in the other direction if this network approached me again.

Kate is to MAFS as Melissa Rycroft was to The Bachelor.  Screw me once, shame on you/screw me twice, shame on me; they offered Rycroft The Bachelorette spot but she said um no you fucked me over too badly, put me on a different show with no love/marriage. 

[aphroditewitch]

1 hour ago, Empress1 said:

Yes, I've often wondered why Will gets grief for not wanting to be a provider when none of the men on this iteration of the show want to be providers. AJ has said expressly that he's attracted to Stephanie's professional drive. Keith doesn't want to be a provider either. I think I recall Luke saying that he got married at first sight to find someone to "build an empire with" (I think he fancies himself an entrepreneur). He and Kate are clearly doomed* but I don't think he'll want to support whoever he does end up with.

I guess the difference is that Jasmine WANTS a man who is a provider and the other three women don't appear to (especially Stephanie), but Will isn't any different from the rest of the men on the show re: not wanting to be one.

The reality is that the days of one partner being the provider are pretty much over for most people. It is just not realistic. Most of the women on the show get that. Jasmine as shown on the show seems to be not accepting of reality. I think it probably has been exaggerated by the show but it seems odd that she seems stuck on having a breadwinner husband. 

Whoever Luke ends up with will end up supporting him because he is constantly trying a get rich quick scheme. I would bet he sunk money into at least one MLM like Primerica at some point in his life too.

[dirtypop90]

1 hour ago, Ohwell said:

I think Will can be protective and assertive with the right woman, but maybe he realizes that that woman isn't Jasmine.  

And i still say we'd see a much more animated Will with, say, Kristine.

I've read this a couple times and don't understand why people think this.

For one, I don't think Kristine would be the same way with Will as she is with Keith. I don't think she would be attracted to Will physically or to his personality.  Keith, with all his faults, is objectionably attractive, nice beard and hairline, tall, friendly smile.  I don't think Kristine (or most 20-year old women) would like Will, at all.  And Kristine doesn't walk around in glasses or her hair pulled back, like Will desires to see women.  I can't see them working, either.  

[humbleopinion]

Kristine would be okay with 30 year old Will...not 37 years old, old man Will Guess.

 Will is fit...he runs, watches what he eats. Keith is a self described couch potato with a food belly.

Will cooks, he cleans...he has his own home so knows how to run a house.

Keith has been catered to by his mother, sister, grandmother and is clueless and a self described scaredy cat in the kitchen....

Keith wants kids now even though he can't really afford the time to take care of a baby, leaving it for Kristine to pull the bigger load while he works and goes to school...

Will would be fine waiting for Kristine to get her career going before having kids.

Kristine seems fine with sharing bills, sharing cooking, a marriage partnership....like Will.

Matching Will is not the problem...he could be successful because he seems more flexible and open minded.

Jas is the tougher person to find a suitable match with all her preconceived, written in stone ideas about marriage and gender roles.

[Annamz]

I think Luke recognizing Kate from the moment he seen her killed the entire experience for him. I think he's that petty and since it wasn't married at first sight for him, he shut himself completely off after realizing he had seen her before. 

[lh25]

2 minutes ago, Annamz said:

I think Luke recognizing Kate from the moment he seen her killed the entire experience for him. I think he's that petty and since it wasn't married at first sight for him, he shut himself completely off after realizing he had seen her before. 

I kind of agree, I think it's that she didn't instantly recognize him that killed it for him.  He wants to think he's that special, that no one would forget him.

[Soup333]

2 hours ago, Claire Voyant said:

I hope when they make their decisions that Kate looks at Puke and says something on the order of:   Your breath reeks of your dead insides and you're not only repulsive, you're ugly both inside and out.  

I would love this but I agree that it probably won’t happen. Sadly. 

[Annamz]

On 2/27/2019 at 8:01 AM, Elizzikra said:

I think when Kate basically said it for him - "if I just don't do it for you, that's ok" he could have answered honestly. Actually - I think if he could answer a direct question, honestly, it would go a long way. Jaime asks him "what was up with telling Kate you felt repulsed and dead inside after kissing her" and he rambles on about "I wouldn't want to put two people in a situation where they were uncomfortable, blah, blah, blah" - just total obfuscation. Be polite, but honest. Own your shit. Be kind. Think about how you would want to be treated and treat the other person accordingly.

Me too - sort of. I always liked Stephanie and still do but A.J. is cringey. But I do root for them. Also Kristine and Keith - I LOVE Kristine. She tells it like it is. She should be put in charge of confronting Luke.

I would love to see Kristine host a Tell All!!!! She'd be asking all the questions we all want the answers to. 

[Annamz]

6 minutes ago, lh25 said:

I kind of agree, I think it's that she didn't instantly recognize him that killed it for him.  He wants to think he's that special, that no one would forget him.

Yeah you're probably right, he does seem the type. 

I've never seen someone actually enjoy hurting someone they way he does. The look of satisfaction on his face is disgusting.

[MV713]

On 2/26/2019 at 10:42 PM, EctoGammat said:

Previews show AJ and Stephanie getting into an argument while driving like it spells doom for them. As someone from the area... driving on Philly roads/highways will make anyone get into an argument lol

having just drove through Philadelphia streets yesterday in midafternoon, I can attest to that!  The traffic and construction delays were making me angry!

I hate that DDay preview is probably just Steph & AJ having a mini-argument.  Its pretty obvious they are still together today.  I want to watch Kate walk out on Luke.

[Lacy4u]

On 2/27/2019 at 10:48 AM, Jaclyn88 said:

Ever since someone on this board said that Stephanie looks like Beavis from Beavis and Butthead, I can't get it out of my head every time I look at her. 

Stephanie and AJ do seem very happy together , but AJ is a ticking time bomb. His moods go from 0 to 60 and his over the top happy personality comes off a little fake. Stephanie seems awesome to hang out with and very down to earth. She surely can find negatives in AJ's personality, but she's embraced him as a whole since day 1. 

My apologies! I'm the person who shared that my fiance' said Stephanie looks like Beavis. I sympathize with you because ever since he pointed that out, that's all I see when I look at Stephanie, too. It's also hard for me to focus on what she's saying because of the strong resemblance, as well. How will you ever forgive me?? Probably, not until the show ends. lol

[humbleopinion]

All is forgiven....

[Kiss my mutt]

38 minutes ago, Annamz said:

I would love to see Kristine host a Tell All!!!! She'd be asking all the questions we all want the answers to. 

She could totally replace Jamie on Unfiltered!

[humbleopinion]

JamieO will fight the Devil to keep her basic cable hosting gig...Kristine doesn't have a chance.....

[Kiss my mutt]

15 minutes ago, humbleopinion said:

JamieO will fight the Devil to keep her basic cable hosting gig...Kristine doesn't have a chance.....

I don’t know. Kristine could probably give her a run for her money. 

[Jeanne222]

I wonder if Dr Jessica knows the problem and that's why she gave Luke  a pass?  Could be what a previous poster alluded to re hygiene!  Something's up!

I also wonder how long Will will be able to play the 'I need to get to know Jasmine before I have sex with her card at the meeting we know is coming up with the Doctor who will ask 'are you doing it yet?  Are you just friends'?

[Empress1]

On 2/26/2019 at 10:42 PM, EctoGammat said:

Previews show AJ and Stephanie getting into an argument while driving like it spells doom for them. As someone from the area... driving on Philly roads/highways will make anyone get into an argument lol

This is a fact. Traffic on 76 will piss anybody off.

[humbleopinion]

Kristine has youth on her side...but JamieO is a FameHo and this Lifetime gig helps to pay the bills because Doug is perpetually under employed...so she is doubly motivated....

[aphroditewitch]

14 minutes ago, Jeanne222 said:

I wonder if Dr Jessica knows the problem and that's why she gave Luke  a pass?  Could be what a previous poster alluded to re hygiene!  Something's up!

I seriously doubt it. Dr. Jessica just always gives the guys a pass because she doesn't give a damn about what is going on in a relationship. If Kate had bad hygiene, then no one else would be around her either. Kristine is honest, she would have pulled Kate aside and said something if that was the issue. Instead, Kristine had nothing but scorn for Luke. 

[Ilovepie]

5 hours ago, Empress1 said:

Yes, I've often wondered why Will gets grief for not wanting to be a provider when none of the men on this iteration of the show want to be providers.

I also agree. Quite frankly, this seems like something that should be worked out privately IF you elect to stay together after the "experiment" is over. Until then, I think 50/50 for shared expenses is the only way to do it, almost like a temporary roommate (which is what most of them are even if sex is involved). Maybe it's fine to discuss long term how you see the relationship down the road, but for these two people to completely fixate on this subject when they don't even know each other is stupid. It's ridiculous that this is basically the only story with Will/Jas. They must be more boring than we know if this is all the production team could eke out of them......

[Ohwell]

15 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

It's ridiculous that this is basically the only story with Will/Jas. They must be more boring than we know if this is all the production team could eke out of them......

Well, to be fair, the only story with Kristine and Keith is the cooking, and with AJ and Stephanie it's his temper.  I won't even get into Luke and Kate because I'm tired of both of them.

[configdotsys]

On 2/26/2019 at 9:16 PM, gonecrackers said:

Kate should've laughed & told everyone at the table what he's been saying/doing, instead of rating herself down because he makes her feel like crap.

I'm putting on a flame proof suit before posting...

It made no sense to me that Kate rated herself so low when she knows that she was doing everything possible to win over this douche.

On 2/26/2019 at 9:34 PM, ECM1231 said:

Puke gets up early on their 1 month anniversary to hang out with his friends? WTF? Kate is devastated b/c she has feelings for him and wanted to spend time with him. Idk HOW she can have ANY feelings for him after all he has said and done to her.

I have no idea. This is why I just don't have any reaction to her sad sack face. She has no investment in this guy that she met a month ago. If she is that attached to someone who is kicking her around, then she needs some serious help. This is not to let Luke off the hook. I'm only comment on Kate here.

On 2/27/2019 at 2:08 PM, psychoticstate said:

I don't see it as Kate buying it so much as so she desperately wants to believe it because she wanted to be married.  I think she knows deep down; she's said herself they really don't have a marriage.  

She's like a Stockholm Syndrome victim or someone with PTSD, or even codependent.  She's trying to find the slightest thing, no matter how minute, to grasp on to in order to justify staying and continuing to try to make it work.  

They have been married for 30 days. I think Stockholm Syndrome is a stretch. She's not being held captive in some undisclosed location with no way out. She's not a housewife with young kids, no job skills and nowhere to go. She's immature and so desperate to be married that she'll accept a defective dickwad like Luke and do everything she can to make it work. She is fully aware of his dickishness but has decided-- whether for contractual reasons or because she lacks intelligence-- to stick around and hope that it works out. I just cold not muster up any reaction to her running off in tears to the bathroom because this is nothing new. He has treated her like shit from day one so where the hell would she get the idea that it would be any different on their one month anniversary?

As far as asshole Luke, someone upthread mentioned pulling the wings off of a fly. That is what we are watching and the producers should be ashamed of themselves if they are holding Kate hostage to a contract. I wonder what the contract says. Would anyone really agree to go on a show that says, "If you walk off the show you will pay us $50 grand"? What could they do to her? I'd say if there was a monetary fine, she could make that easily and more if she put up a Go Fund Me with clips of Luke's Greatest Hits.

On 2/27/2019 at 2:14 PM, Gem 10 said:

Continuation of my last post.

Thats why Dr. Jessica was blatantly picking on A.J.and Stephanie’s marriage when there is nothing going on.  She was actually insinuating that there might be trouble ahead for them two when there is none it seems.  She put a bug in their head which was not merited.  Not a nice thing to do.  That conversation was to take the heat off Puke and Kate.

I think there is trouble ahead for them too but it's currently shielded by all the googly eyed kissing, hand holding and over the moon behavior of two people so desperate to be married that they went on this show.  AJ strikes me as one of those guys that is high strung, laughs in an exaggerated way and is always making jokes to the point that people think he's comical but are grateful that they don't have to go home with him.

I can see compatibilities with them though, unlike Will and Jasmine. I don't see Jasmine getting into a go kart and laughing and having fun. Come to think of it, I don't see Jasmine genuinely laughing and having a good time doing anything. As far as AJ and Stephanie go, I think once the googly dies down and AJ's daily personality overtakes the giddiness, and stresses like kids or bills or taking time off from work enter the picture, AJ's ticking temperament will cause problems. If he gives that incredibly pissy and cutting tone to Stephanie over a picture on the wall or a shower caddy, I'd hate to see what he'd be like if sleep deprived or Stephanie having to cancel dinner plans because something came up at work. I think Stephanie will suck it up because she doesn't want to lose the ability to say "my husband" 50 times a day.

Keith's dinner was not a rocket science meal, but it was what Kristine liked. I appreciated his effort but don't see him doing this on the regular. I also find it very hard to believe that he's in real nursing school. Anyone who has been through it knows how intense it is: 500+ pages of reading per week, tons and tons of work, clinicals, etc., There is incredible stress and exhaustion due to all the work involved. Plus he works full time at night? Just not buying it because those two things would consume nearly 16 hours of each day if he was in a real nursing program and that would have to be mentioned on the show because it would have quite an effect on the marriage. I think this is one of those times that "in school" is thrown out generically to describe everything from a career school or certificate program all the way through grad school. 

God I hope Will gets away from Jasmine. He should have given her a 3. Jasmine's tone of voice when she said, "6.8?" was exactly the same tone she used when she said, "50/50?" She seems astonished at anything Will says that she doesn't agree with and makes no effort to engage in any sort of real conversation about it. He should have owned his rating and not backed down with the "based on 9" thing. Jasmine wants to control everything and while Will is no bubbly, effervescent type of person, it's written all over his face that he's just not into her. 

[aphroditewitch]

12 minutes ago, Ilovepie said:

I also agree. Quite frankly, this seems like something that should be worked out privately IF you elect to stay together after the "experiment" is over. Until then, I think 50/50 for shared expenses is the only way to do it, almost like a temporary roommate (which is what most of them are even if sex is involved). Maybe it's fine to discuss long term how you see the relationship down the road, but for these two people to completely fixate on this subject when they don't even know each other is stupid. It's ridiculous that this is basically the only story with Will/Jas. They must be more boring than we know if this is all the production team could eke out of them......

Many platonic roommates do have something different than 50/50 on rent, especially if one bedroom is larger than the other. 

Both Kristine/Keith and Stephanie/AJ also have their chemistry and romantic aspect to their storyline too though. The problem is that each week, there is roughly 10 or so minutes devoted to each couple, less than previous seasons because there are four couples instead of three and there hasn't been an increase of time for the show. Condensing 40ish hours of filming each week down to to minutes is limiting in terms of what we know about each couple. 

[JapMo]

16 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

I think there is trouble ahead for them too but it's currently shielded by all the googly eyed kissing, hand holding and over the moon behavior of two people so desperate to be married that they went on this show.  AJ strikes me as one of those guys that is high strung, laughs in an exaggerated way and is always making jokes to the point that people think he's comical but are grateful that they don't have to go home with him.

He's exhausting. 

[Empress1]

4 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

Stephanie having to cancel dinner plans because something came up at work.

Because AJ told y'all he is never! Eating! Alone! Again!

5 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

They have been married for 30 days. I think Stockholm Syndrome is a stretch. She's not being held captive in some undisclosed location with no way out. She's not a housewife with young kids, no job skills and nowhere to go. [snip] Would anyone really agree to go on a show that says, "If you walk off the show you will pay us $50 grand"? What could they do to her? I'd say if there was a monetary fine, she could make that easily and more if she put up a Go Fund Me with clips of Luke's Greatest Hits.

Yeah, she's an adult with a support system (she has friends who clearly want her to leave Luke) and a job, and odds are good she still has whatever place she had before she got married. Odds are also good that they haven't joined finances in any meaningful way - they're not even paying rent on the place they live in, the show is. They may be legally married but they're playing at marriage at this point. She can walk right out of this situation. And there are ways to game the system. If the contract requires them to live together, one of them can sleep on the couch. If the contract requires that they stay married for a period of time (and that seems like it wouldn't be enforceable to me - what if there were physical abuse? - but I'm not a lawyer), she could move out and wait to file for divorce until the time is up. Lots of people live separately while they're going through a divorce; some states require that you live apart for a year before you can even file.

I doubt Kate can quit the show, as in refuse to be filmed, before the time is up (production would pull a Heather and have her writing letters to Luke and dragging her friends out to rehash why the relationship didn't work and shit) but the show and the relationship, such as it is, aren't the same thing. Molly and Jon were over before the show was. On the flip side, if the show grew a conscience and said "We refuse to film this," that doesn't mean anything for their relationship - they'd still be married. 

[JapMo]

2 hours ago, Kiss my mutt said:

1 hour ago, humbleopinion said:

Kristine has youth on her side...but JamieO is a FameHo and this Lifetime gig helps to pay the bills because Doug is perpetually under employed...so she is doubly motivated....

My money is on Jamie.  Kristine doesn't have a chance.  Jamie grew up in a trailer park with an absentee drug addicted mother.  She learned from the streets.

[princelina]

On 2/27/2019 at 10:48 AM, Cammi said:

I concur with pretty much everyone's opinion that Luke is a gaslighting, POS. But I was asking myself: What IS the appropriate way to handle this type of situation if you pretty much know it isn't going to work out? I remember a previous female cast member named Sam who was married to Neil, and she was almost as bad as Luke. Almost. Her personality was all over the place and very hard to watch. Some of these cast members decide from the very start it isn't going to work out, but I won't fault them for it. I have been set up on a couple dates, and even though the person was nice, I already knew there was no romantic connection. Sometimes it can grow, but sometimes it is just dead in the water from the jump. 

Personally, I think Will is doing the only thing one CAN do when faced with the knowledge it isn't going anywhere. He knows he isn't into Jasmine. But he is being very respectful by keeping his distance and biding his time until it is over. I give him credit for not forcing sexual intimacy when there isn't an emotional connection. Looking at YOU Jephte. 

Obviously marrying a stranger is a gamble, but I think Will has a gentlemanly manner with the way he is approaching his obvious disinterest in Jasmine. I don't blame him one iota, as I find her unappealing as well. 

Luke could take a page from Will's playbook, if he was a normal human with emotions. I hope future cast members also take notes on Will's method of handling this awkward situation. It could be a train wreck, but Will's patience and attitude are keeping it from turning into a dumpster fire, culminating with Jasmine crying her heart out in the bathroom like poor Kate. Will is the true hero of this show imo 

What did Jamie Otis do?  She went along with it and I don't believe she's staying with Doug and having kids just to do Unfiltered a couple times a year.  That is supposed to be the premise of the show, after all - that you don't immediately dump someone who turns you off and you get to know them to see if they really are a match.  It has seemed to me that that is what Will was trying to do, but Jasmine keeps shooting herself in the foot.  I think you do have to be prepared to kiss, hold hands, etc. but can put off the sex for a while if you are doing fun things and trying to get to know each other.

3 hours ago, lh25 said:

I kind of agree, I think it's that she didn't instantly recognize him that killed it for him.  He wants to think he's that special, that no one would forget him.

Bingo!  This is what I have thought since day 1.

1 hour ago, aphroditewitch said:

I seriously doubt it. Dr. Jessica just always gives the guys a pass because she doesn't give a damn about what is going on in a relationship. If Kate had bad hygiene, then no one else would be around her either. Kristine is honest, she would have pulled Kate aside and said something if that was the issue. Instead, Kristine had nothing but scorn for Luke. 

Kristine's side-eye there was a beautiful thing 😄

[aphroditewitch]

2 minutes ago, Empress1 said:

Because AJ told y'all he is never! Eating! Alone! Again!

Yeah, she's an adult with a support system (she has friends who clearly want her to leave Luke) and a job, and odds are good she still has whatever place she had before she got married. Odds are also good that they haven't joined finances in any meaningful way - they're not even paying rent on the place they live in, the show is. They may be legally married but they're playing at marriage at this point. She can walk right out of this situation. And there are ways to game the system. If the contract requires them to live together, one of them can sleep on the couch. If the contract requires that they stay married for a period of time (and that seems like it wouldn't be enforceable to me - what if there were physical abuse? - but I'm not a lawyer), she could move out and wait to file for divorce until the time is up. Lots of people live separately while they're going through a divorce; some states require that you live apart for a year before you can even file.

I doubt Kate can quit the show, as in refuse to be filmed, before the time is up (production would pull a Heather and have her writing letters to Luke and dragging her friends out to rehash why the relationship didn't work and shit) but the show and the relationship, such as it is, aren't the same thing. Molly and Jon were over before the show was. On the flip side, if the show grew a conscience and said "We refuse to film this," that doesn't mean anything for their relationship - they'd still be married. 

I'm guessing the contract would fine her a significant amount if she tried to break significant portion of it. And as I  stated in a previous thread, if she had left but still agreed to be filmed it wouldn't have helped much because the audience would never have heard about the "repulsed and dead inside" comment Luke made and it would have been unclear as to why Kate disliked him so much. It also would have been edited out of any Unfiltered discussions. So even if she brought it up in an interview with someone else, people would just accuse her of lying. I kind of wonder if the show agreed to keep references to the comment in the final edit in exchange for Kate continuing to pretend that she wanted to be married to Luke. 

I don't think the show can force people to not file for divorce before a certain date, however the show does provide a divorce fund which would likely be forfeited if someone filed before a stipulated date. 

The producers on these shows are very skilled at manipulating people into doing what they want. Which is why I don't believe Dr. Pepper's weak defense that they didn't know Luke's true personality until after the wedding. 

[psychoticstate]

40 minutes ago, configdotsys said:

I'm putting on a flame proof suit before posting...

It made no sense to me that Kate rated herself so low when she knows that she was doing everything possible to win over this douche.

They have been married for 30 days. I think Stockholm Syndrome is a stretch. She's not being held captive in some undisclosed location with no way out. She's not a housewife with young kids, no job skills and nowhere to go. She's immature and so desperate to be married that she'll accept a defective dickwad like Luke and do everything she can to make it work. She is fully aware of his dickishness but has decided-- whether for contractual reasons or because she lacks intelligence-- to stick around and hope that it works out. I just cold not muster up any reaction to her running off in tears to the bathroom because this is nothing new. He has treated her like shit from day one so where the hell would she get the idea that it would be any different on their one month anniversary?

Kate is blaming herself for the failure.  The "experts" should get in there and put a halt to this shit before any more damage is done to her.   As she told Luke, she's always been a 9.8/9.9 girlfriend in the past.  Suddenly she's married to a man who is not attracted to her (even telling her something as mind numbingly crushing as being repulsed and feeling dead inside after kissing her) and nothing she's doing is helping at all.  

We don't know much about Kate pre-MAFS.  Maybe she's been in codependent relationships.  Maybe she's blamed herself before.  Maybe she's gotten attached very quickly in the past and had her heart broken.  All things the "experts" should have vetted.  

Regardless, when I mentioned SS before, I didn't mean literally.  I meant she's been so traumatized by Luke's treatment, even 30 days in, she probably doesn't know WHAT to do.  Yeah, I'm screaming from the privacy of my living room to pack up and leave that prick pronto but she signed a contract, she's got cameras following her and she truly wanted to be married.  And it's possible he's acting one way to her at one way and another way at another time.  One thing I am certain of is that he's gaslighting her and totally mindfucking her.  Not cool. 

[Ilovepie]

26 minutes ago, aphroditewitch said:

Many platonic roommates do have something different than 50/50 on rent, especially if one bedroom is larger than the other. 

That is not the case here though, as they are usually sharing a bed, let alone a bedroom. My point is more that they don't know each other, and despite the fact that they are now married, it's more like getting a new roommate. Usually in that case, you just split things evenly because it's the fairest and easiest. Honestly, I wouldn't want to share my personal financial info with my stranger spouse until the tv show was over. I know they always film them doing that, but it would make me uncomfortable.

[aphroditewitch]

1 minute ago, Ilovepie said:

That is not the case here though, as they are usually sharing a bed, let alone a bedroom. My point is more that they don't know each other, and despite the fact that they are now married, it's more like getting a new roommate. Usually in that case, you just split things evenly because it's the fairest and easiest. Honestly, I wouldn't want to share my personal financial info with my stranger spouse until the tv show was over. I know they always film them doing that, but it would make me uncomfortable.

I'm aware that this is a different situation but you mentioned roommates being at 50/50 which is not always the case. The financial conversations as presented are stupid, especially since the couples don't have any joint expenses at the moment. But that is partially on the show. It would be one thing if it had been a one time thing where they had out their budgets, spreadsheets, and monthly bills. But instead it has been a recurring conversation that makes no sense. The producers could have had them doing more couple activities to have something to film and keep in the final edit but the show is being cheap this season. Instead the financial conversation is being beaten to death and then resurrected so they can go through the the process again. 

[dirtypop90]

4 hours ago, humbleopinion said:

Kristine would be okay with 30 year old Will...not 37 years old, old man Will Guess.

Matching Will is not the problem...he could be successful because he seems more flexible and open minded.

Well  I'm talking about the 37 year old log we see on our screens.  He is not a match for most 20-year-olds.  He would not work with a younger woman.  He needs a woman at least 35, who has had all her fun, or maybe a woman older than him actually.

Edited February 28, 2019 by dirtypop90

[configdotsys]

2 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

Kate is blaming herself for the failure.  The "experts" should get in there and put a halt to this shit before any more damage is done to her.   As she told Luke, she's always been a 9.8/9.9 girlfriend in the past.  Suddenly she's married to a man who is not attracted to her (even telling her something as mind numbingly crushing as being repulsed and feeling dead inside after kissing her) and nothing she's doing is helping at all.  

We don't know much about Kate pre-MAFS.  Maybe she's been in codependent relationships.  Maybe she's blamed herself before.  Maybe she's gotten attached very quickly in the past and had her heart broken.  All things the "experts" should have vetted.  

Regardless, when I mentioned SS before, I didn't mean literally.  I meant she's been so traumatized by Luke's treatment, even 30 days in, she probably doesn't know WHAT to do.  Yeah, I'm screaming from the privacy of my living room to pack up and leave that prick pronto but she signed a contract, she's got cameras following her and she truly wanted to be married.  And it's possible he's acting one way to her at one way and another way at another time.  One thing I am certain of is that he's gaslighting her and totally mindfucking her.  Not cool. 

I totally agree with you about the gaslighting. It drives me absolutely crazy to see his smug ass face sitting there talking like a therapist, "Why'd you rate yourself so low?" "Why do you think...." and never answering a question that he is asked. I don't watch the Unfiltered shows so I have no idea what goes on there. He's sociopathic and disgusting. But as a woman, I just cannot stand to see someone sit there and take that. She pussyfoots around him. Even when she said he threw up and got wasted a week before or whatever, it was spoken in such a meek tone. This is a guy that has discovered from her giggly "hiiieeeeee" when she reached the alter that she was prime for being gaslighted. 

I wonder how her other relationships have been. The way Kate presents herself on this show tells me why her past relationships have not bee successful. 

[Kiss my mutt]

Kristine’s side eye > Kristine’s side boob

[psychoticstate]

1 hour ago, configdotsys said:

I totally agree with you about the gaslighting. It drives me absolutely crazy to see his smug ass face sitting there talking like a therapist, "Why'd you rate yourself so low?" "Why do you think...." and never answering a question that he is asked. I don't watch the Unfiltered shows so I have no idea what goes on there. He's sociopathic and disgusting. But as a woman, I just cannot stand to see someone sit there and take that. She pussyfoots around him. Even when she said he threw up and got wasted a week before or whatever, it was spoken in such a meek tone. This is a guy that has discovered from her giggly "hiiieeeeee" when she reached the alter that she was prime for being gaslighted. 

I wonder how her other relationships have been. The way Kate presents herself on this show tells me why her past relationships have not bee successful. 

I despise that he's so passive aggressive about everything and blaming Kate for his own personal reasons for not wanting to get close to her.  Example: telling the production crew that he's not into her because she has a drinking problem.  But then when confronted by Dr. Pepper and Kate, he can't even explain himself.  He just looks away, stammers, and basically acts like a young teenager who can't articulate himself and doesn't know how to say "thanks but no thanks" (when it comes to Kate.)  

I hate that Kate has become so meek around him but I can't throw her too much shade on that because I did that in a relationship in my early 20s as well.  Of course it wasn't someone that I had known for 30 days but still.  I hurt for her.  

I have to wonder if part of the reason Kate is still trying and hanging in there is she doesn't want to admit failure or defeat to people who may have been against her doing MAFS in the first place.  Maybe someone warned her about a situation just like this.  She did mention in the beginning a worst case scenario of there being no attraction.  Maybe that was a bug put in her ear.  

As much as I absolutely cannot stand Luke and am infuriated at what he's doing, I'm even angrier at the "experts" who have done nothing to stop this.  Luke is clearly emotionally stunted (between his making bullshit excuses for not wanting to touch his wife in any way; by shirking off his responsibility for going to hang out with friends on his anniversary by suggesting that he didn't know where Kate was emotionally) and highly manipulative.   For Dr. Jessica to even begin to suggest in the Unfiltered program that they were both to blame makes me want to bitch slap her about a dozen times.  Unless there is footage that is being held back, Kate has NO responsibility in the fuckery that's currently going on.   She doesn't seem to be doing anything wrong, unless you want to say that yeah, she is drinking because she's MISERABLE being matched up with a tool.    To suggest that Luke isn't the villain here is wrong on every level.  Yeah, he is.  He's sending mixed messages, his communication with Kate is nonexistent and he's treating her like shit.   He doesn't act like he wants to be married; he doesn't even act like he wants to be friends with her.  He's not attracted to her and that's okay (although he should at least try to get to know her) but he could be a grown up and gentleman about it, like Will is with Jasmine.  

I really wish Will and Keith could meet Luke in a dark alley and give him a beat down for what he's done and continues to do to Kate.  And maybe throw Dr. . Jessica in there as well, since she seems to be giving Luke a pass on the whole situation.  

[Mazzy]

Luke is CLEARLY gaslighting Kate. He is desperate to make things Kate's fault so that he can leave without feeling guilt. Or more specifically I think it's that he doens't want to have to tell her yet again that he isn't attracted to her because he has told her to my count at least three times now and she ignores it every time.

What I don't understand are all the commentors getting mad at Luke for acting like a guy who doesn't care about Kate. ?? He DOESN'T care about Kate. We KNOW this. And despite all the comments seeming to pretend that he shows caring, I don't see it at all. I see a nut-crusted nutbar filled with nuts called Kate acting like there is something there when there is clearly not. Running into the bathroom and crying... I'm sorry, I didn't feel bad for Kate, I felt like she needed a padded cell and some lithium!! This man shows ZERO interest in her. He OPENLY tells her he isn't attracted to her. And her response is that it's been a month so now she has feelings for him that she can't help?? WHAT?!! What are you talking about, you nut?! Boil any rabbits lately?

So because of all the comments about Kate being a huge victim and Luke being the horrible monster that he truly is, I decided to go back and see if Luke really did lead Kate on at some point and I didn't see it. I checked Luke and Kate clips on YouTube, looking at time stamps of when these things aired. So here's the actual breakdown of events in order:

1. clip from January 24th - Kate says to camera that they had a talk last night and Luke said he wasn't attracted to her. So he told her literally within a week of them getting married that she wasn't his type to the point that he felt nothing for her. (btw I don't agree it's because she didn't recognize him, I think he was being honest right there and he's genuinely just not into her at all)

That sucks and we all know that sometimes the physical can come later, BUT I also feel like people aren't being honest that if you aren't AT ALL attracted to someone it isn't going to "grow over time" (like go into walmart right now, pick out someone you find zero physical traits at all that appeal to you, and then be honest with yourself - would you ever find that person attractive? I'm betting no, even 'over time getting to know them').

Kate's response to hearing that is to tell Luke that sucks for him and that she's lucky because she did get the physical and emotional but he will have more work to do since he isn't attracted to her.

What kind of response is that?! It's bizarre!!!

2. Next week's clip is the "repulsed and dead inside" and it goes in this order: ONE WEEK after he told her he wasn't into her, Kate is on camera saying this is her honeymoon and she expected it to be very different than it was going so far (and it was obv that she was talking about physically - WHY would she expect it to be going differently with a man who openly told her he wasn't into her?). Next jump to the repulsed/dead thing; Kate is understandably upset, Luke tells us the kiss felt unnatural and the entire moment felt "disjointed" (whatever that means), but to me it sounds like the moment was noticeably forced and uncomfortable.

3. Next week pastor Cal comes in, Luke is starting to act all fake-smiley, but what I found interesting is that after Pastor Cal the couple is all smiles and talking into the camera but only Kate is being physical. Kate has her arm around Luke's neck. Luke isn't holding Kate in any way that I could see. Kate pulls him in for a kiss, Luke turns his head, and Kate gets the cheek. So, here we see Kate trying to instigate physical contact which Luke rebuffs. Also when she pulled him in he clearly stiffened and pulled back to stop it. So again he openly shows her that he doesn't want to kiss her or be physical with her/that he isn't attracted to her.

4. We are at last week now. BOTH parties tell us the same story - that Kate tried to kiss Luke and Luke didn't want to. Kate's response to that was to basically be like sarcastic-"well I'm sorry" voice, "I didn't realize I was (paraphrased) forcing it on you". Again, WHAT?!!? This man doens't like you! He isn't attracted to you! Stop trying to force physical contact on him. In reversed roles we'd be accusing him of a level of harassment against her.

5. We are to this episode. Kate says it's been a month so she has developed feelings that she can't help. Okay... if she has developed feelings it is only based on a fantasy in her own head because this man has done NOTHING to show any level of affection toward her for her to find endearing.

Luke is gaslighting to keep from telling Kate for the forth time that he doesn't find her attractive because at this point it just comes off as cruel. Meanwhile Kate is STILL saying she wants the marriage to "work" as if it's working at all in any way for them to build on, which it's straight up not.

BOTH of these people are ridiculous.

Random - and Jasmine is just plain lazy and wants someone to take care of her so she can continue to be lazy. Will should run as fast and far as he can!! (it's Will with her right?? whoever)
 

Edited March 1, 2019 by Mazzy

[Mazzy]

2 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

To suggest that Luke isn't the villain here is wrong on every level.  Yeah, he is.  He's sending mixed messages, his communication with Kate is nonexistent and he's treating her like shit.

This is what I'm seeing in most comments so I just want to ask - then where do the "mixed messages" come in? Honestly the only mixed messages I see Kate getting are the ones she's creating in her own mental case head. You said it right there - he doesn't communicate with her and he treats her terribly. It doesn't sound mixed to me, it sounds very straight forward and consistent with the messages. 

[psychoticstate]

1 minute ago, Mazzy said:

This is what I'm seeing in most comments so I just want to ask - then where do the "mixed messages" come in? Honestly the only mixed messages I see Kate getting are the ones she's creating in her own mental case head. You said it right there - he doesn't communicate with her and he treats her terribly. It doesn't sound mixed to me, it sounds very straight forward and consistent with the messages. 

For me the mixed messages are not taking the out when Kate clearly gives him one ("I don't do it for you, it's okay")  and telling her, and the "experts", that he wants to stay in the marriage (or should I say "marriage") and make it work.  

To me, at least, he clearly does NOT want to be in the "marriage" and has no intention of making it work.  That's a mixed message, at least IMO.  He should man up and either peace out, or really try to make it work.  But accusing Kate of having a drinking problem and going out with your buddies on your anniversary is not trying to make it work.  

[CousinOliver]

I’m engaged, but I’d have dated Will in a hot minute.  

I wouldn’t even be interested in being friends with Jasmine.  

[Ohwell]

I don't know if the term "gaslighting" is correct to use here, so I'll just say it's Kate who is basically fucking with Luke.  She knows what she's doing:  getting sympathy from just about everyone on social media for Luke being such an asshole.  She knows he isn't interested (and never will be), but she continues to act like she wants the marriage to work to continue to get more sympathy.  She's a bunny boiler.

[aphroditewitch]

9 minutes ago, Mazzy said:

This is what I'm seeing in most comments so I just want to ask - then where do the "mixed messages" come in? Honestly the only mixed messages I see Kate getting are the ones she's creating in her own mental case head. You said it right there - he doesn't communicate with her and he treats her terribly. It doesn't sound mixed to me, it sounds very straight forward and consistent with the messages. 

This isn't true. Luke repeatedly says things that are contradictory to his actions. He says he cares about her but then talks crap about her behind her back. She flat out tells him it is fine if he isn't into her but then he lies and says the issue is her imaginary drinking problem. He says he doesn't want to beat her down and then does that exact thing. That is not consistent messaging. 

[Mazzy]

4 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

For me the mixed messages are not taking the out when Kate clearly gives him one ("I don't do it for you, it's okay")  and telling her, and the "experts", that he wants to stay in the marriage (or should I say "marriage") and make it work.  

To me, at least, he clearly does NOT want to be in the "marriage" and has no intention of making it work.  That's a mixed message, at least IMO.  He should man up and either peace out, or really try to make it work.  But accusing Kate of having a drinking problem and going out with your buddies on your anniversary is not trying to make it work.  

Okay. I agree with everything you said here and I can see why you'd call that mixed messages. I was focusing on what he tells her about herself rather than what he says about the marriage (wanting to make it work).

Yeah, he doesn't want to make it work and he should bounce. Maybe he wants his 15 minutes of fame or maybe contractually they get nothing ($$) if they don't last at least the season to decision day. I don't know. But if he CAN leave without consequence then he def should have left. And with that I'll say I think the same of Kate. If she wasn't a crusty nutbar of nutty nutness, she too should have left by now.

[aphroditewitch]

7 minutes ago, Ohwell said:

I don't know if the term "gaslighting" is correct to use here, so I'll just say it's Kate who is basically fucking with Luke.  She knows what she's doing:  getting sympathy from just about everyone on social media for Luke being such an asshole.  She knows he isn't interested (and never will be), but she continues to act like she wants the marriage to work to continue to get more sympathy.  She's a bunny boiler.

How can she know she is getting sympathy from social media when  the show was filmed last fall? 

Also I call bs on the claim she is pretending to want the marriage to work. She flat out said in the last episode it was fine if he is not into her. 

If anyone is a bunny boiler, it is Luke. He was the one that launched the drinking accusation at Kate that could have consequences for her long after the show finishes airing. He is creepily obsessed with ruining a woman he barely knows. 

[Mazzy]

Just now, aphroditewitch said:

This isn't true. Luke repeatedly says things that are contradictory to his actions. He says he cares about her but then talks crap about her behind her back. She flat out tells him it is fine if he isn't into her but then he lies and says the issue is her imaginary drinking problem. He says he doesn't want to beat her down and then does that exact thing. That is not consistent messaging. 

No, he didn't say that. What he did was squirm at the uncomfortable-ness of being confronted with that statement. Kate said that and his only response was 'don't say that'. He didn't say "no that's not it" or "no, it's the drinking." This is where we are making up our own story that isn't really happening. He didn't say anything except "don't say that" and that was obv because it is uncomfortable for someone to be sitting in front of you saying "it's okay that you aren't attracted to me".

[psychoticstate]

3 minutes ago, Mazzy said:

Okay. I agree with everything you said here and I can see why you'd call that mixed messages. I was focusing on what he tells her about herself rather than what he says about the marriage (wanting to make it work).

Yeah, he doesn't want to make it work and he should bounce. Maybe he wants his 15 minutes of fame or maybe contractually they get nothing ($$) if they don't last at least the season to decision day. I don't know. But if he CAN leave without consequence then he def should have left. And with that I'll say I think the same of Kate. If she wasn't a crusty nutbar of nutty nutness, she too should have left by now.

Mixed messages could be interpreted differently.  But Luke is most definitely not being honest.

Again, this is where I put a lot of blame on the "experts."  If Kate and Luke cannot contractually pack up and go, the "experts" need to step in and stop this.  It's terrible.  

Does anyone remember who it was that was pushing for Kate and Luke?   I remember that Keith and Kristine and Will and Jasmine were the 2 definites and there was a "showdown" between choose Kate and Luke and Stephanie and A.J. for the third couple.  

[jpagan05]

3 hours ago, Jeanne222 said:

I wonder if Dr Jessica knows the problem and that's why she gave Luke  a pass?  Could be what a previous poster alluded to re hygiene!  Something's up!

Maybe the problem isn't Kate. Maybe he's gaslighting her because he has a really weird penis. Or something. 

To be fair about the "experts", a good therapist doesn't take sides. They are supposed to glean what they can from the big picture and try to point things out that hadn't necessarily occurred to the other. Jamie Otis can call him out and she did.

[Mazzy]

1 minute ago, aphroditewitch said:

How can she know she is getting sympathy from social media when  the show was filmed last fall? 

Also I call bs on the claim she is pretending to want the marriage to work. She flat out said in the last episode it was fine if he is not into her. 

If anyone is a bunny boiler, it is Luke. He was the one that launched the drinking accusation at Kate that could have consequences for her long after the show finishes airing. He is creepily obsessed with ruining a woman he barely knows. 

She also said in the last episode that she has developed feelings for him and that she expected them to do something on their anniversary so it isn't "fine" with her for him to not be into her.

I don't think he's obsessed with ruining her, I think his only concern is getting out of this situation and not looking bad in the process, but his attempts at that are doing the exact opposite and making him look terrible.

[aphroditewitch]

Just now, Mazzy said:

No, he didn't say that. What he did was squirm at the uncomfortable-ness of being confronted with that statement. Kate said that and his only response was 'don't say that'. He didn't say "no that's not it" or "no, it's the drinking." This is where we are making up our own story that isn't really happening. He didn't say anything except "don't say that" and that was obv because it is uncomfortable for someone to be sitting in front of you saying "it's okay that you aren't attracted to me".

No that is not what he said. He said " you know what bothers me, that you drink so much". 

[psychoticstate]

2 minutes ago, Mazzy said:

No, he didn't say that. What he did was squirm at the uncomfortable-ness of being confronted with that statement. Kate said that and his only response was 'don't say that'. He didn't say "no that's not it" or "no, it's the drinking." This is where we are making up our own story that isn't really happening. He didn't say anything except "don't say that" and that was obv because it is uncomfortable for someone to be sitting in front of you saying "it's okay that you aren't attracted to me".

I don't remember exactly what either said but I think the OP was saying that in the last episode, Luke said something like "you know why" to Kate and then said it was the drinking.  That's when Kate said that Luke drinks as well, going so far as to be so wasted the week prior that he was puking.   

If Luke were truly sensitive to drinking because of a friend being killed by a drunk driver, I don't know that he would be drinking to that level himself.  Never mind accusing Kate of having a drinking problem. 

[aphroditewitch]

Just now, Mazzy said:

She also said in the last episode that she has developed feelings for him and that she expected them to do something on their anniversary so it isn't "fine" with her for him to not be into her.

I don't think he's obsessed with ruining her, I think his only concern is getting out of this situation and not looking bad in the process, but his attempts at that are doing the exact opposite and making him look terrible.

Except the feelings part was all voice-over. We don't know when she said it and whether that was her complete statement.  For all we know she was annoyed because they were supposed to film the stupid 1 month anniversary stuff and he blew it off and was being a douche about it. 

If he wasn't obsessed with ruining her, then the lies about the drinking would never have happened.