Last Man Standing - General Discussion

[readster]

18 hours ago, ae2 said:

Let's go for the hat trick and replace Eve, next!

Go for a twist and have it where Eve has always been a boy and have him always picking on his sisters since he was old enough to walk. His real name is Elvis, but he goes by Eve because always wanted to be a girl. 

[Suzysite]

I hope Ed's retirement doesn't mean he'll be totally gone from the show.  He provides a nice older-generation anchor.   This episode had finally had the feel of the previous incarnation. The characters are gelling well with each other again.   Well, except for the Mandy actress.  I'm not fully on board with her yet.  Oh, and Eve was barely there, but still.

[readster]

1 hour ago, Suzysite said:

I hope Ed's retirement doesn't mean he'll be totally gone from the show.  He provides a nice older-generation anchor.   This episode had finally had the feel of the previous incarnation. The characters are gelling well with each other again.   Well, except for the Mandy actress.  I'm not fully on board with her yet.  Oh, and Eve was barely there, but still.

Yeah, Mandy is now the main problem. It's Kristin all over again and McCook and Fuller really have an odd feeling with each other. They don't interact well at all. Ed doing his semi retirement was a good way to go. Problem is going into next week with the new foreign exchange student joining the show to make up for Eve not being on the show as much and have a "kid at home". There really hasn't been any build up at all to it. 

[TheRabbi]

Is Ed gone now too? At some point you need to just not bring the show back. Eve and Ed going/barely present, recasting Mandy, etc. It doesn't really matter that all the other minor guys came back (Ryan, Kyle, Chuck), when over half the main characters are leaving.

I did not personally care for this episode. The new Mandy is not doing it for me.

Edited October 13, 2018 by TheRabbi

[jewel21]

Eve is looking really skinny to me. Is the actress playing her sick or is this another trying to fit into Hollywood thing?

[readster]

17 hours ago, TheRabbi said:

Is Ed gone now too? At some point you need to just not bring the show back. Eve and Ed going/barely present, recasting Mandy, etc. It doesn't really matter that all the other minor guys came back (Ryan, Kyle, Chuck), when over half the main characters are leaving.

I did not personally care for this episode. The new Mandy is not doing it for me.

Shows that have done this like: Trapper John MD, Family Matters, 3s Company. Where you got to the point there was barely anything left of the original cast outside maybe 2 or 3 ending up killing the shows. Granted, all three I just mentioned were based on: contracts, health and life style changes. However. there does come a point where you want to go: "Why is this show even still around?" It was recently revealed that Ed will just be making occasional appearances now just like Eve. Trying to bring in this foreign exchange student to fill in the gap and make Vanessa look like she is so desperate to have a life is not the way to go. Oh look another character that Mike will clash with over politics and POV like he does already with: Ryan and Chuck, what's one more right? Even the plot with Kyle and Mandy "not having a kid" fell flat because it made Vanessa look even more desperate. 

[CaptainCranky]

After reading the comments on the last show it looks like I made a wise choice to give this show up.

[seacliffsal]

I really liked this episode.  It was timely (corporate takeovers with lay-offs for the employees) and also reflected the growing trend of baby boomers starting to retire/find their next chapters.  I hope Ed stays around as I like him, but this story acknowledged that lives change and there are ramifications for others.  I agree with others though that nuMandy isn't working for me.  

[readster]

The show is also throwing out more cliches, as of course Kyle would have fertility issues and NuMandy saying: "I'm not ready to be a mom yet?" Which has been going on TV for years. One or the other has a fertility issue or is "not ready" are any of us truly ready? McCook just doesn't gel right with anyone in the cast. Her and Travis couldn't have seen less like a mother/daughter if they were trying. I'm actually glad they kept Mike away from the B story and focused on with Outdoor Man. Because it would have meant they would have to address why Mandy and Kyle are still living with them. When they had a house being built. It doesn't take 2 years to build a house.

[TheRabbi]

I looked him up for the hell of it, and Hector Elizondo is a whopping 81 years old! So I understand if he wanted to cut back. I still say though that if the cast was going to go through this many changes or no-shows, then it probably shouldn't have come back.

[readster]

16 minutes ago, TheRabbi said:

I looked him up for the hell of it, and Hector Elizondo is a whopping 81 years old! So I understand if he wanted to cut back. I still say though that if the cast was going to go through this many changes or no-shows, then it probably shouldn't have come back.

Right and now they want to do a "cousin Oliver" with the new foreign exchange student starting in episode 5, who will be on the rest of the season. There has been no build up at all to them showing up and the main plot of the story is: "Have someone from another country clash with Mike's politics." 

[Keywestclubkid]

New Mandy seriously needs to be replaced 

[readster]

Apparently LMS is trying too hard to be Home Improvement at Halloween now. Also, all the cop had to do was: "Ma'me, here is my damn badge and this is a real gun, do you want me to shoot your fucking pumpkin to prove I have people in the back of a REAL police car?" My God! McCook is horrible as Mandy. I mean, after 4 episodes, she is horrible! Plus, next week we get the new Chineese exchange student and there has been ZERO build up to it. She is planned on being on the rest of the season. Yeah, just end the show for good now.

[Ringthane]

10 hours ago, Keywestclubkid said:

New Mandy seriously needs to be replaced 

I watched one episode and all she did was mimic all the moves of the old one, without adding anything of her own.  It was like watching a tribute band - they can mimic the originals, but there's nothing original or new.  

[readster]

59 minutes ago, Ringthane said:

I watched one episode and all she did was mimic all the moves of the old one, without adding anything of her own.  It was like watching a tribute band - they can mimic the originals, but there's nothing original or new.  

That's the problem, she isn't even trying. McCook is just copying everything from her Ephram's moves to even how she treats Kyle. All she is being is a 5'10, blonde version of Mandy and it's JUST NOT WORKING! This isn't like when they replaced both Ryan and Kristin in season 2. Nick Jonas was in ONE episode. Masterson taking over the role, they just flipped the entire background of the character. He just acted what they gave him, he is Ryan in his sense of the character. After everything with Fuller, they just threw everything out and just made her a moron and Fuller ran with that.  Only thing McCook has been for four episode is just copying Mandy. Even if TPB kept saying she would make Mandy her own character, she has not. Now, they are putting in a completely new character and have pushed Ed and Eve off as reoccurring due to schedule and health reasons. 

  The episode also falls apart with: Kyle, Mandy, Ryan and Kristin instead of Mike and Chuck's plot and trying to prank Vanessa and Jay Leno. So, the reason why Mandy and Kyle don't have their house built is because they have been just leaving the trailer there until they felt like doing something with the land for the house. It's been almost 2 yeas since that plot was talked about with Kyle's mother dying and leaving him the property. Plus, Kyle dealing with wondering why a parent just leaves their kid. Instead of having that deal with Ryan's old crap leaving everyone early on. They turned it into Mike: "Get out of my damn house!" Now, it's: "Hey, I'm Mike trying to be Tim Taylor from the 90s Halloween episodes on pranks when two years ago, I HATED Halloween for some stupid reason!" This foreign exchange student plot coming in next episode if they continue the trend for the past 4 episodes, is going to crash on them. 

[iHateAmpersands]

16 hours ago, readster said:

Plus, next week we get the new Chineese exchange student and there has been ZERO build up to it. She is planned on being on the rest of the season.

Game 3 of the World Series is next Friday so the show won't be back until November 2nd.

[readster]

21 minutes ago, iHateAmpersands said:

Game 3 of the World Series is next Friday so the show won't be back until November 2nd.

Proving more that the character is going to be introduced and everyone will be: "Who is this and why should we care if they are just going to argue politics and the American Way with Mike?"

[ElsieJ]

I was so negatively stunned by the choice of a short, dark haired Mandy being replaced by a tall very thin blonde, my enjoyment of all that went on with the other characters was thrown off.  If such a huge replacement mistake could be made, I wonder if so many more story-line goof ups will be made with each of those coming that, even though I'm a fan of Last Man Standing, I'll be driven to change channels?

Eve has become even more unpleasantly snarky.  I think the substitute Kristen/Christene-? is fine.  Ryan--trim the hair hanging over your forehead please. :)

Venessa annoyed me with the 'I'm beautiful' comments" she made in a couple of episodes.  Her self-involved 'I'm mom and I must (bug) know, get involved in, every single thing about my daughters' troubles' (drove me nuts.)

I half enjoyed the last shown episode.  Ignored the substitute Mandy as much as was possible.. 

[seacliffsal]

I laughed quite a few time during the Halloween episode.  However, nuMandy is annoying and brings down whoever else is in the scene with her.  If they replaced here with some who acted more natural it would improve the siblings and partners scenes.

[Lady Calypso]

Hello everyone. This thread has been edited from a Last Man Standing Revival thread to a general Last Man Standing in the Media thread. 

Reminder: no personal politics are allowed around here so keep any personal political commentary out of your posts. If you notice a post violating this, please report it. Thanks! 

[Suzysite]

Well, Cousin Oliver can go home any time now.   Ganging up on Mike with Vanessa, and the endless geology puns will get old fast.  

[readster]

31 minutes ago, Suzysite said:

Well, Cousin Oliver can go home any time now.   Ganging up on Mike with Vanessa, and the endless geology puns will get old fast.  

I like how the writers thought this would be such a great idea, including there was no build up to this. All of a sudden Vanessa is: "But I love this program and the kids are basically all gone, I need a teenager in the house again." Umm... why? Plus, you can't seem to get Kyle and Mandy out of the house.

[Disappointed fan]

Ugh they messed with the whole dynamics of the show. The new Mandy sucks!!! It would have been better to have killed the character off or shecleft to Paris etc., I cringe at the girl pretending to be Mandy; which did they make her stupider or is the actress trying to - the other girl was SO MUCH better. And that damn laugh track!!! Every friggin second in the background I here hahaha, hahaha, hahaha, and a lot of the writing isn’t that funny - what the hell are they laughing at??? Just crap. And now they spilt the kids up and the parents up so they’re never really interacting anymore, wtf??? Must be new writers thinking they know everything. I suggest they go back and actually watch the other seasons to learn why the shoe became so successful before they tank it, which is exactly what they’re doing. I hope Tim Allen puts a boot in someone’s ass and gets better writers, I mean he’s gold, such a solid actor and funny to watch, but his lines are terrible-  it’s like somebody is purposely sabotage on the show, does no one else see this??? I am sooooo disappointed that they lost almost ALL the dynamics of what made the show great.

 

So to sum up, fire the writers, they suck at story telling, get rid of the horrible god awful laugh track and plz kill off terrible Mandy actress, (just horrible), oh yea, and bring back the youngest daughter - that where Tim’s character showed his best colors was in their interactions of her becoming a young woman despite him raising her basically like a boy. So sad to see another great comedy sitcom go in the trash - oh ya “F” ABC, they can suck it for canceling the show in the first place. Such a piece of crap network. #boycottABC 

[Steff]

I'm out.  I gave the show a fair shot and I'm done. 

[DucksFlyTogether]

It’s almost as if the show had run its course when the girls grew up and didn’t need a reboot...

 I like Tim Allen as an actor, but I think he’s very arrogant.  He clearly sees all his young costars as disposable based on how many recasts have gone on. I bet he was livid that JTT was too popular to be recast on Home Improvement. 

[Happenings12]

So sick of the f@#k ABC nonsense. F@#k Tim Allen. The show got cancelled in the first place because it was too expensive to keep making and Timbo refused to take a pay cut to keep his darling on the air or give the other actors a bump in pay. It wasn't cancelled cause of some right wing conspiracy. It came down to $$$ as always. Why do you think Eve and Ed are part time now? Why do you think OG Mandy left? If anyone really thinks it's because she had a scheduling conflict then they're as gullible as can be. But they had no problem securing Meathead and wife cause Timbo desperately wants this show to be All in the Family part 2. And God forbid Allen's good buddy Jay Leno not get his guest appearance fee. The character is SOOOO necessary and funny too.

BTW I'm pretty sure it's the same staff, thus same writers. No one is sabotaging the show except Allen's greed.

 

PS: If I remember correctly Allen was pissed at JTT when he left Home Improvement and they didn't talk for years. That's why JTT wasn't in that series finale.

Edited November 4, 2018 by Happenings12

[readster]

On 11/3/2018 at 11:58 AM, Disappointed fan said:

Ugh they messed with the whole dynamics of the show. The new Mandy sucks!!! It would have been better to have killed the character off or shecleft to Paris etc., I cringe at the girl pretending to be Mandy; which did they make her stupider or is the actress trying to - the other girl was SO MUCH better. And that damn laugh track!!! Every friggin second in the background I here hahaha, hahaha, hahaha, and a lot of the writing isn’t that funny - what the hell are they laughing at??? Just crap. And now they spilt the kids up and the parents up so they’re never really interacting anymore, wtf??? Must be new writers thinking they know everything. I suggest they go back and actually watch the other seasons to learn why the shoe became so successful before they tank it, which is exactly what they’re doing. 

Yeah, and thinking bringing in this "cousin Oliver" to fill in the holes from Eve, the Old Mandy and just gang up on Mike just because is not going to pan out and the ratings were down. Something that really jumped at me was Vanessa saying: "I'm putting my foot down on this!" Then Mike going: "You can do that?" The writers admitting that Vanessa has been a doormat to Mike's crap the last few doesn't mean the story has any merit. Same with apparently Vanessa in the year and a half the show was gone she got a job as a Geologist again some place. After the fact she quit because Ryan's was an asshole about it and talked Boyd into guilting Vanessa. Followed an episode later with Eve's high school friends going: "Eve, your mother's company is destroying the planet with their damn fracking technology, you should protest." Even out of nowhere went: "you are right, I should!" Then Vanessa quits her job and then says: "I'm going back to my first love of teaching. Which she couldn't deal with due to the politics, then all the crap about how they laid her off, but oh no, the principal didn't have the heart to tell her. Somehow she kept going to class and no one didn't go: "Umm... you don't work here anymore." Then you know, cancel her class and reassign the students, but why would a school do that? Then Vanessa always going to bat for Ryan over every stupid thing he did. Yet, she choose now to put her foot down on a foreign exchange student because she misses having her other two girls in the house. 

Plus she was protesting Mandy not wanting to have a baby by now. Then go hang with our only grandson before he is too old to go: "I don't want to hang around my grandparents, they are old." Yeah, time for the show to end. 

[seacliffsal]

Welp, I seem to be the only person who enjoyed this episode.  Weak scenes for sure-NuMandy, etc.  But, I thought there were several laugh out loud moments.  Loved Mike holding his tongue when the visiting father was baiting him.  And, sad to say, I do like some of the geology puns.  However, I wish people would call Vanessa Dr. Baxter instead of Mrs. Baxter as she does hold a Ph.D.

[CaptainCranky]

On 11/3/2018 at 1:26 PM, Steff said:

I'm out.  I gave the show a fair shot and I'm done. 

I quit after the second show.

[readster]

Nancy Travis opens up about the Shows "Conservative" Political Views

[readster]

Ryan and Kristin being accused of being too "stern" parents? Since when? Boyd pulling one on his aunt and uncle? That isn't new. Oh look, a child in their 50s who still wants the approve of their parent who is in their 70s that they are a success. Funny how the show just wants to always rewrites history and or completely dig up cliches. Oh, the foreign exchange student that was suppose to be this "bright new character" where were they? How were ratings up from this episode?

[Neiman]

I love the idea of bringing Susan Sulivan on the show.  She will make a good match for Ed.  

Cute seeing Kyle and Mandy as babysitters and the thought of them helping with homework was funny.  Hope to see more of them helping with Boyd and less of Boyd's parents.  

[Neiman]

I'm enjoying the show and getting used to the new Mandy.  Hope they keep Susan Sullivan on for a while as Vanessa's mom.  I've enjoyed most of her work in other shows and think she can add much to this one if they give her the opportunity.

[MoreCoffeePlease]

Quote

Hope they keep Susan Sullivan on for a while as Vanessa's mom.

Totally.  Loved her on Castle.

I love Nancy Travis and that episode let her shine.

[Runningwild]

I will have to go back and watch the episodes I missed due to high school football. I enjoyed tonight’s show. 

[Suzysite]

I have really enjoyed the last couple of episodes.  The show seems to be finding its rhythm again.  Still dreading the upcoming addition of Cousin Oliver, whenever that may be.  I even put something on Tim Allen's Twitter page saying how bad an idea this is.   Maybe if they get enough negative feedback, they'll make that story line a short one and move on.  

[readster]

I had the house to myself, which is really a rare situation. I decided to see what was going on and this was a pretty decent episode. However, I found Ed's story the best out of everything. They are still harping on Kyle and Mandy's house not being built still. After the stupidity that was the Halloween episode on what is going with the property. Of course Mike and Vanessa were pissed about the trip. Of course, the problem is, it is Kyle and Mandy's money. It wasn't like they took money from the Baxter bank account and were going to blow it. However, after five years, they still are trying to justify Vanessa quitting her job at the Energy Plant. 

  I completely can believe that Vanessa got her PhD and then didn't know what to do with it (which is a big duh!). However, now it was the fact that Vanessa wanted to quit her job and it was Ryan, Boyd and Eve that gave her the final push with then: "your company is destroying the planet" crap. However, Mike talks about how her tutoring business is so successful. Yet, he has never taken a moment to joke about it. Plus we NEVER see her with students anymore, I get they are on a tight budget, but at least show Vanessa going over mini lesson plans or looking up information on subjects. 

Edited November 17, 2018 by readster

[Subrookie]

4 hours ago, readster said:

Of course Mike and Vanessa were pissed about the trip. Of course, the problem is, it is Kyle and Mandy's money. It wasn't like they took money from the Baxter bank account and were going to blow it.

I don't know. My wife and I let my brother in law live with us rent free for a year to save money for his own place. I told him it was time to find a place ASAP when he brought home a 55" 4k TV for his bedroom. 

It may not be Mike and Vanessa's money but it is pretty naive to plan an expensive European vacation given the reason Mike is letting them live there. 

[Neiman]

Loved the way Ed's commercial got a voiceover.  ?

But I'm not thrilled with plot focusing on the oldest daughter.  She goes around all "miss know it all" the last few seasons then asks how to make a video?  New Mandy is emerging as my favorite daughter.  

[Neiman]

Seems like the writers aren't sure where to go with some of the characters and story.

[readster]

2 hours ago, Neiman said:

Loved the way Ed's commercial got a voiceover.  

But I'm not thrilled with plot focusing on the oldest daughter.  She goes around all "miss know it all" the last few seasons then asks how to make a video?  New Mandy is emerging as my favorite daughter.  

The problem is, McCook is still trying to be "the old Mandy" instead of truly taking on the role. The character of Mandy is still the same from: "I read the book better on my phone" to thinking an appendectomy is a kidney treatment. Plus, her chemistry is off with the other characters, especially Kyle.

2 hours ago, Neiman said:

Seems like the writers aren't sure where to go with some of the characters and story.

No they don't. Even with Vanessa wanting the foreign exchange student and saying how much she loved the program and was an exchange student in high school. Which was 40 years ago. They already explain that they have Mike and Vanessa in their 50s even though Tim Allen is 65. They have Kristin being this "know it all" yet she doesn't know how to make basic film editing with her phone or a computer. She also keeps doing: "My dad and Ed gave me this awesome job and I know it all." When they keep proving they don't. Mike and Ryan and still arguing over the SAME stuff after 6 years. Chuck has to pick a fight over stuff he knows he is in the wrong about, because he can't resist an argument. 

3 hours ago, Subrookie said:

I don't know. My wife and I let my brother in law live with us rent free for a year to save money for his own place. I told him it was time to find a place ASAP when he brought home a 55" 4k TV for his bedroom. 

It may not be Mike and Vanessa's money but it is pretty naive to plan an expensive European vacation given the reason Mike is letting them live there. 

I'm not disagreeing there, but they trying to find issues of why Kyle and Mandy are still living with Mike and Vanessa and why their house isn't built yet. Because the show doesn't want to build a new set. 

[Johnny Walker]

Our family LOVES the new season.  

We thought the first episode was brilliant in how they made fun of the cancellation, and for how they handled the "new Mandy."

 

If they hadn't addressed it in a silly way, all of you would be gripping that it was weird because they didn't address it at all.  (There is just no pleasing most people.)

 

As far as Kristen's weight, shame on you for "weight shaming." I guess it must be nice to not have to ever deal with weight gain or loss.

 

Who cares if she is small or bigger?  She does a great job with the character.  

 

As far as her not looking like the rest of the family, there are a lot of families where the children don't look alike.  

 

And for those who can't handle that the show isn't "completely real and life like" go watch reality TV.  Oh wait, that's fake too!  Hmmmmm

 

This is entertainment; what are you expecting here?!?  It FUN, not reality.  It's a blend of entertainment and moral ways to handle issues.  It kind of reminds me of how TV shows used to be when I was a kid.

 

Great show!  Great fun!  It is actually a family event for us to get together and watch the latest episode we recorded.  Keep them coming!

[readster]

21 hours ago, MrFluffy said:

Does the actress playing Vanessa bug anyone else? She has one expression, a super-smiley-squinty one that screams "I'M ACT-ING" and she pets everyone like a dog that recoils from your touch. It's super-creepy. Honestly, this is not someone who could possibly have a science PhD under the most make-believe circumstances.

I have no problem with Nancy Travis, but I think the character of Vanessa has been a mess since the second season. Here they her going on with: "I got my PhD because I loved Geology, but then it took me years to realize I wanted to be a teacher, and now what am I?" During season 6 when Mandy and Eve tried to get her mad, she said: "I'm never mad." Then she turns around here and yells at Mandy and Kyle about them wasting money and not getting their house settled on building and having a baby. They've kept Mike consistent since season 2, but Vanessa has been all over the map since the second season because the writers don't know what to do with her character. 

[Gothish520]

New Mandy is growing on me. I thought she was quite good in this last episode. Truth be told, I was never a big fan of Mandy the character, but this actress is making her palatable.

[Neiman]

I pretty much closed the door on Vanessa a few seasons ago.  Loved her in season one, but she's changed.  All her drinking and the puns just aren't that funny to me.  

[readster]

58 minutes ago, Neiman said:

I pretty much closed the door on Vanessa a few seasons ago.  Loved her in season one, but she's changed.  All her drinking and the puns just aren't that funny to me.  

That's all they have her do or defending Ryan even if he set the house of fire. Now, they have made her a: "I need another kid in the house, so either give me another grand child or an exchange student and I'll be happy." 

[Aryanna]

On 11/27/2018 at 12:30 AM, Gothish520 said:

New Mandy is growing on me. I thought she was quite good in this last episode. Truth be told, I was never a big fan of Mandy the character, but this actress is making her palatable.

I loved Mandy. The old Mandy. The new Mandy isn't horrible and it's unfair for me to hate on her and compare her but I so loved the old Mandy. I loved her style and that she started her own fashion business. When the show first started I was afraid Mandy was just going to be the stock dumb character but she really wasn't and I grew to love her. She had a good story arc going. But I never did buy her and Kyle together. 

[Aryanna]

Two things I love about this episode: Mandy's blue dress she's wearing when they're shopping for wedding gowns and how when they finally turn on the TV and the game is over and Mike says Wow, that was some game. I don't know why that just always makes me laugh.

[readster]

Not sure why bringing another dog into the series was a great idea. They really are not sure what to do with Ryan, Boyd and Kristin do they? They either have Boyd learning a "very special" lesson or. Ryan and Kris apparently need to fill their contracts and get a paycheck. Least it was good to know that Kyle does view himself as a failure. He knows he has gotten into real ruts at ODM because he either didn't jump for promotions or when given them, he screws them up. Honestly, I don't know why they didn't make him the General Manager as he was great with sales and on the floor. 

[PumpkinLumpkin]