S01.E07: Chivalry

[Eliot]

Re Connie Britton's voice, it seems like she's using the breathy, babylike effect in a more pronounced way to demonstrate how Debra is falling apart emotionally and mentally as a result of John's escalation of hostilities. The character is disintegrating and retreating into her little cocoon of denial.

[mythoughtis]

6 hours ago, yourmomiseasy said:

It isn't supposed to be a documentary though, it's just supposed to be inspired by or based on.

I don’t see it that way. We are flooded with commercials for this show ... which tout how crazy this all sounds and then say ‘it’s 100% true’.  The end of every episode has the disclaimer about dramatizations or FICTIONALIZATION. 

Based on, inspired by, dramatized or  fictionalized is not 100% true. Somewhat close? Yes, probably.  

But I still feel free to say ‘this or that’ didn’t happen. 

[yourmomiseasy]

4 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

I don’t see it that way. We are flooded with commercials for this show ... which tout how crazy this all sounds and then say ‘it’s 100% true’.  The end of every episode has the disclaimer about dramatizations or FICTIONALIZATION. 

Based on, inspired by, dramatized or  fictionalized is not 100% true. Somewhat close? Yes, probably.  

But I still feel free to say ‘this or that’ didn’t happen. 

Dramatization or fictionalization is not a documentary.  Like by definition.

[Neurochick]

20 hours ago, crgirl412 said:

I don't think he would've be sitting pretty in recovery.  Not only did he have addiction issues but he had a sadistic streak that sobriety won't cure.

But that is what a dope fiend is.  A dope fiend will do anything, anything to get high.  Getting high is the ONLY priority.  And when a dope fiend isn't getting high, they can be VERY nasty.

[Moose135]

39 minutes ago, yourmomiseasy said:

Dramatization or fictionalization is not a documentary.  Like by definition.

What Dateline did is a documentary (I assume, I haven't seen it yet.)  This is a dramatization, and I'm OK with it, I've enjoyed it so far.

[mythoughtis]

1 hour ago, yourmomiseasy said:

Dramatization or fictionalization is not a documentary.  Like by definition.

Which is my point. The network ads are  saying 100% true. It’s not 100% true. It would be a documentary if it was 100% true. So the network ads need to either say inspired, based on OR say 100% true. It’s not both. 

Edited January 10, 2019 by mythoughtis

[chocolatine]

On 1/8/2019 at 4:27 PM, CharlizeCat said:

I wanted to see the "picture" of Debra that John sent to all of her clients.  The tentative way in which her assistant was talking about it made it sound like a nude photo or sex tape.  John seems the type who'd put hidden cameras in the shower as well as secretly tape Debra and him having sex. 

I think we were meant to believe that it was a nude/pornographic picture, the kind that John sent earlier in the episode to a woman's husband. I think it was the woman who called him on his lies and broke up with him and he sent the pictures as revenge porn. That seems to be his m. o.

I always thought it was ridiculous when lawyers spell out the most obvious things to me, but now I know it's because of clients like Debra who don't possess a shred of common sense. 

[hoosiermom]

If you don’t know how this ends, DON’T watch Dr. Phil today. He knew the final episode of the Bravo series was airing this coming Sunday and still happily let his guest Debra, tell the entire story. What an ass.

Edited January 10, 2019 by hoosiermom

[biakbiak]

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

But that is what a dope fiend is.  A dope fiend will do anything, anything to get high.  Getting high is the ONLY priority.  And when a dope fiend isn't getting high, they can be VERY nasty.

I think the point is that there is no indication that getting high was the reason he did a lot of the shit he did, a lot of which had absolutely nothing to do with getting high. He has personality traits that made him a horrible person that most likely would have manifested regardless if he were a junkie. 

[Barb23]

30 minutes ago, hoosiermom said:

If you don’t know how this ends, DON’T watch Dr. Phil today. He knew the final episode of the Bravo series was airing this coming Sunday and still happily let his guest Debra, tell the entire story. What an ass.

I'm with you . Why couldn't she have been on the following week after both the Bravo finale &  the Oxygen special which airs Monday.  I don't think Dr. Phil did a spoiler alert either. 

[Starlight925]

1 hour ago, hoosiermom said:

If you don’t know how this ends, DON’T watch Dr. Phil today. He knew the final episode of the Bravo series was airing this coming Sunday and still happily let his guest Debra, tell the entire story. What an ass.

 

25 minutes ago, Barb23 said:

I'm with you . Why couldn't she have been on the following week after both the Bravo finale &  the Oxygen special which airs Monday.  I don't think Dr. Phil did a spoiler alert either. 

OMG EXACTLY!!!

I listened to the podcast, so I know the story.  But I'd be SO PISSED off if I hadn't!

DO NOT WATCH DR. PHIL if you've recorded it, until after Sunday's episode!

And no, he did not do a Spoiler alert!!!  What the H was he thinking?  Oh yeah, he had to promote frozen-faced Robin's charity.

[crgirl412]

On 1/9/2019 at 4:22 PM, Neurochick said:

That's because John is a dope fiend.  All he cares about is getting high.  Had he been sober, he could have been sitting pretty, married to a wealthy woman and never having to work a day in his life, if he wanted to start a business Debra probably would have given him the money.  John's a stupid idiot.

 

On 1/9/2019 at 7:28 PM, crgirl412 said:

I don't think he would've be sitting pretty in recovery.  Not only did he have addiction issues but he had a sadistic streak that sobriety won't cure.

2 hours ago, biakbiak said:

I think the point is that there is no indication that getting high was the reason he did a lot of the shit he did, a lot of which had absolutely nothing to do with getting high. He has personality traits that made him a horrible person that most likely would have manifested regardless if he were a junkie. 

Edited January 11, 2019 by crgirl412
I messed this up! Yes, I meant what BIAKBIAK said!!!

[yourmomiseasy]

5 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Which is my point. The network ads are  saying 100% true. It’s not 100% true. It would be a documentary if it was 100% true. So the network ads need to either say inspired, based on OR say 100% true. It’s not both. 

I apologize, I haven't seen a network ad in months.  I haven't been watching anything in real time.

[MsTree]

8 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

The network ads are  saying 100% true. It’s not 100% true.

They probably mean the premise of the story is 100% true, which it is. Beginning, middle, ending...all true. Everything in between...drama.

[918lux]

13 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Which is my point. The network ads are  saying 100% true. It’s not 100% true. It would be a documentary if it was 100% true. So the network ads need to either say inspired, based on OR say 100% true. It’s not both. 

 

Did you believe Red Bull would really give you wings? 

Edited January 11, 2019 by 918lux

[Barb23]

13 hours ago, Sterling said:

 

OMG EXACTLY!!!

I listened to the podcast, so I know the story.  But I'd be SO PISSED off if I hadn't!

DO NOT WATCH DR. PHIL if you've recorded it, until after Sunday's episode!

And no, he did not do a Spoiler alert!!!  What the H was he thinking?  Oh yeah, he had to promote frozen-faced Robin's charity.

Quote

 

Oops

[Barb23]

14 hours ago, Sterling said:

 

 

 Oh yeah, he had to promote frozen-faced Robin's charity.

I'm all for charities and organizations that help women, including Robin's.  But he could have promoted it AFTER Debra's story, not in the middle of it.  One minute he's describing Debra leaving & then he segued into Robin's charity & her advice about how women (or a man) should leave a dangerous person. He also promoted her charity by telling us she has appeared on Capitol Hill.  That's fine & dandy but I think it could have waited til after they finished with Debra's story. 

[Door County Cherry]

Please take the Doctor Phil talk to either the media thread or fact vs. fiction thread.

[Tabbygirl521]

Eric Bana in this role reminds me of the Trivago guy. 

[Ohwell]

2 hours ago, Tabbygirl521 said:

Eric Bana in this role reminds me of the Trivago guy. 

Now that you mention it, he does kind of remind me of him.

[Shellbell59]

On 1/7/2019 at 6:52 AM, EdnasEdibles said:

I'm confused as to what was going on with the Narcotics Anonymous leader. From what I can gather - John slept with the leader's wife. Took photos of her. And was now blackmailing the Al-Anon leader to keep getting clean pee or he'd send the photos to everyone. Is that right?

John was actually DOING the NA counselor himself....and their brief exchange when counselor gave him money indicated that was the case...mentioning the photos..

DJ asked something like “bet you wonder how I got all those angles while it was happening ..right?”

end of scene DJ says “now it’s time to drain the lizard”

he played counselor BIG TIME...horrible person 

[Starlight925]

34 minutes ago, Shellbell59 said:

John was actually DOING the NA counselor himself....and their brief exchange when counselor gave him money indicated that was the case...mentioning the photos..

DJ asked something like “bet you wonder how I got all those angles while it was happening ..right?”

end of scene DJ says “now it’s time to drain the lizard”

he played counselor BIG TIME...horrible person 

Yes, he played the counselor, but unfortunately, the counselor had it coming.  Rule #1:  maintain professional distance.  Counselor should lose his license for this.

But you are right, DJ saw an angle, and went for it.

[spankydoll]

How sis this idiot of a woman manage to put together such a successful company and net worth> I wouldn't hire her to manage my ice cream truck.

[lezlers]

On ‎1‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 7:22 AM, bichonblitz said:

I had a problem with this episode because the replay's showed John and his crazy antic/ thoughts but how do we know what he was really thinking, who he was contacting, when, what he actually said to the police when he burned the car, etc..... Granted, we know he was batshit nuts but this is supposed to be a true story. That whole re-enactment of what lead up to his showing up late to Debra's charity event is pure speculation. A waste of an episode. 

Well, they can interview people other than John, such as the cops who questioned him, the women he talked to online, the other people he interacted with ect.  Just because they can't talk to him doesn't mean everything is completely made up.   By that logic, you can't take anything Debra or the family say at face value either because John's not there to verify.  Also, it's based on a true story, it's not a documentary.  Some editorializing is to be expected.

I liked this episode.  I always like when shows and movies "rewind" and go over the same events from someone else's perspective.   I don't think that's ever a waste. 

[lezlers]

On ‎1‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 8:04 AM, bichonblitz said:

I saw the real Debra on a talk show the other night and her voice was normal. I don't know where Connie Britton dug up this breathy cutesy voice but it makes me not like her as an actor. 

She probably got it from the podcast.  Debra was VERY breathy and giggly throughout the whole thing.  It was infuriating, given the ultimate conclusion of the story.

[lezlers]

On ‎1‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 9:11 AM, itsadryheat said:

Debra Newell was on WWHL with Andy Monday night. She was behind the bar. Andy asked her a question, something like "what do you want people to know that isn't shown". She said the seven months(?) worth of research she did and my favorite, all the romance she had with John. 

The main reason I still loathe Debra.   Even after everything that happened she can't face the reality that she was being conned.  She still insists it was some great love story that just took a bad turn.  She refuses to accept that he was likely never in love with her at all.  She's completely delusional.

[lezlers]

On ‎1‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 8:04 AM, mythoughtis said:

I don’t see it that way. We are flooded with commercials for this show ... which tout how crazy this all sounds and then say ‘it’s 100% true’.  The end of every episode has the disclaimer about dramatizations or FICTIONALIZATION. 

Based on, inspired by, dramatized or  fictionalized is not 100% true. Somewhat close? Yes, probably.  

But I still feel free to say ‘this or that’ didn’t happen. 

If the standard for "true story" episodes is everything is 100% true, nothing short of a surveillance video would suffice.  The disclaimer on the actual show is what we should go on, not a sensationalized commercial.

[mythoughtis]

10 minutes ago, lezlers said:

  The disclaimer on the actual show is what we should go on, not a sensationalized commercial.

I had to laugh at this. Not at you. 

- I mean no disrespect to you.

It was the sensationalized commercial comment that started my laughter- because the entire 8 episode show had been sensationalized.  I really need to listen to the podcast because I think the writers and producers of this have done the true story an injustice. Of course, I think that about a lot of fictionalized true stories. Having to wonder which scenes are fake and which are true cheapens the entire thing for me. 

For those of you that enjoyed the show - you are of course entitled to do so.  I just didn’t. I wanted the real story. 

Edited January 15, 2019 by mythoughtis
Past tense

[lezlers]

1 hour ago, mythoughtis said:

I has to laugh at this. Not at you. 

- I mean no disrespect to you.

It was the sensationalized commercial comment that started my laughter- because the entire 8 episode show had been sensationalized.  I really need to listen to the podcast because I think the writers and producers of this have done the true story an injustice. Of course, I think that about a lot of fictionalized true stories. Having to wonder which scenes are fake and which are true cheapens the entire thing for me. 

No worries, I'm not offended.  I listened to the podcast (highly recommend, although Deb and her daughters' voices will drive you nuts) and the show actually did a great job at staying true to the story.