S13.E14: Christmas!

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Quote

Featured is a look back at Christmas time in the Klein household.

Are we talking clip show?  Let's see!

Original air date 2018.12.11

[PrincessPurrsALot]

Posters may praise the Kleins; they may criticize the Kleins.  They may find Zoe the cutest little pumpkin ever; they may find her annoying.  They may hold whatever opinions they like, extreme, moderate or varied, and express those opinions on this forum as long as the posters are talking about this family and others as they appear on this reality TV show.

You do not need to point out that your opinion is "unpopular" if you like or dislike them.  Nor is it ever okay to refer to other posters as either extreme fans or haters.  At PTV, we snark the show; not each other.  

Let's let varying opinions reign!  Back to your regularly scheduled posting.

[sATL]

ummm... the trip to china wore them out so they didn't (or couldn't) film a new Christmas episode in FL ? I mean they went back 2 (or was it 3) years...  Next week, my satellite is showing a different show in the 10 PM EST time slot.

Edited December 12, 2018 by sATL

[Bunnyette]

Did Bill drop Zoe on the fireplace?  Good thing Mom is a doctor...

[sATL]

5 minutes ago, Bunnyette said:

Did Bill drop Zoe on the fireplace?  Good thing Mom is a doctor...

no. she was sitting and somehow slid back. Bill could have brushed her when he climbed down from hanging stockings. Will was a good helper during the incident.

Now the tourniquet around the head....

Edited December 12, 2018 by sATL

[sATL]

RE: the first set of teeth on children....

Do the 1st four come in then the molars , then the rest between - leaving a noticeable gap ? I can't remember... Zoey keeps crying and I am noticing her teeth...

Isn't it an option to wear masks, if their immune system was compromised, as opposed to staying in most all of the time? I mean as long as one feels physically up to it , maybe getting out of the house will make a person feel better.

[Absolom]

29 minutes ago, sATL said:

RE: the first set of teeth on children....

Do the 1st four come in then the molars , then the rest between - leaving a noticeable gap ? I can't remember... Zoey keeps crying and I am noticing her teeth...

It's usually the first eight teeth, four on top and four on the bottom, and then the first molars, IIRC.

Masks only protect from some airborne diseases so it's generally preferable for many patients to avoid unnecessary risk of exposure.

Quote

Healthcare workers use them to protect against airborne infectious diseases such as tuberculosis and anthrax. Unlike regular facemasks, respirators protect against both large and small particles. Overall, respirators are considered much more effective at preventing the flu virus than regular facemasks.

[viewer]

1 hour ago, sATL said:

RE: the first set of teeth on children....

Do the 1st four come in then the molars , then the rest between - leaving a noticeable gap ? I can't remember... Zoey keeps crying and I am noticing her teeth...

Isn't it an option to wear masks, if their immune system was compromised, as opposed to staying in most all of the time? I mean as long as one feels physically up to it , maybe getting out of the house will make a person feel better.

They made reference that her teeth were slow coming in because of her nutrition.  She does look so much better.  You wouldn't know it was the same child.

[alegtostandon]

I do not remember seeing this.  Will had no respect for Jen even back then.  When Bill was trying to put the train set together,  Will  took the train remote and refused to give it to Jen. After asking nicely a couple of times & Will refusing to part with it,  Jen pried it from his hands.  He started hitting towards her, he didn't strike her but they showed him twice making the motions.  Jen's reaction, to feed him.  

Poor Zoey, the back of my head hurt watching her fall!  

Edited December 12, 2018 by alegtostandon

[bichonblitz]

Watching Jen in the hospital having chemo treatments reminded me of how much this woman has endured in her life and how gracious she is. I take back every awful thing I ever said about her! Jen, enjoy your huge house and all the fruits of your labor, you deserve it! I hope her kids will someday understand what a special woman she is. 

[SongbirdHollow]

1 hour ago, bichonblitz said:

Watching Jen in the hospital having chemo treatments reminded me of how much this woman has endured in her life and how gracious she is. I take back every awful thing I ever said about her! Jen, enjoy your huge house and all the fruits of your labor, you deserve it! I hope her kids will someday understand what a special woman she is. 

I totally agree! Remember, her cancer was quite advanced and there was a good chance she wouldn’t recover. The whole family has been through so much.   They can have 10 houses as far as I’m concerned. 

[RebeccatheWriter]

12 hours ago, sATL said:

RE: the first set of teeth on children....

Do the 1st four come in then the molars , then the rest between - leaving a noticeable gap ? I can't remember... Zoey keeps crying and I am noticing her teeth...

Isn't it an option to wear masks, if their immune system was compromised, as opposed to staying in most all of the time? I mean as long as one feels physically up to it , maybe getting out of the house will make a person feel better.

Masks don't stop everything. It is by far better to stay in and get as much rest as possible before a chemo treatment. Assuming that she was referring to a low white cell count, we're talking about something serious enough that a simple cold could have killed her. It is clear that Jen and Bill were aware of the seriousness of her condition and were trying to balance that with normalcy for the children. 

Additionally, there are very few masks that are a good enough fit for a little person or child. It's not like Jen could have just worn a surgical mask. Most of those leave a huge gap that basically leaves you just as exposed as no mask at all. Even more expensive respirator masks are not designed to fit smaller faces and heads. On an average size person there is a failure rate of 25-30% on the seals on these things. It has to be far higher for people of Jen's stature. 

[Cherrio]

I remember after she was cleared by her doctor and rang the bell to celebrate she had decided to ignore the doctors advice to lay low and rest. 

She had been offered a keynote at a conference.  The doctor clearly advised against it.  There was a scene (imo producer/Jen driven) where a group of people wanted to take a photo with her and she didn't do it. 

So it seems it was more important to her to give her speech, than to stay home, recover her strength and most important bond with her new daughter.

[walnutqueen]

I enjoyed the trip down memory lane.  I'd almost forgotten how young the kids were on their first family Xmas; it's nice to see how much they've both blossomed and grown.

It was a hoot seeing Bill's monstrous blow-up yard figures, and Jen's refusal to let him put those huge "vintage" lights on the little tree (he got the outside, she got the inside).  Zoey explaining to the adoption event puppy how much she loved him, but her Daddy wouldn't let her bring him home was priceless; she's become such a little chatterbox.  Then there was Will shopping for other kids at the toy store, and asking for a BOOK - such a pleasant surprise.

Seeing Jen have to go in for chemo the day after Xmas reminded me how much she had to go through in those early days of creating a new family, and what a rock Bill was for her.  These people have been through a lifetime of hardship, but remain positive and happy, which amazes me.

[Quilt Fairy]

I don't understand how they can take 2 old Christmas shows, bundle them together and call it a "new" episode.

[Libby]

In the second hour, Jen did that nervous laugh of hers at every single thing that she said in the talking heads. I feel bad for her having that habit.

[Absolom]

The clip show did not make the top 150 cable shows of the day.

[RebeccatheWriter]

On 12/12/2018 at 11:45 AM, Cherrio said:

I remember after she was cleared by her doctor and rang the bell to celebrate she had decided to ignore the doctors advice to lay low and rest. 

She had been offered a keynote at a conference.  The doctor clearly advised against it.  There was a scene (imo producer/Jen driven) where a group of people wanted to take a photo with her and she didn't do it. 

So it seems it was more important to her to give her speech, than to stay home, recover her strength and most important bond with her new daughter.

Speaking as a cancer survivor and as the daughter of one, we don't always make the best decisions. I would probably say that normalcy was more important to her at that moment. When you have spent months being poked, prodded, told that you might not make it, experiencing highs and lows, never quite feeling like the old you, etc., the one thing you want more than anything is to have a normal day or do something that would have seemed so easy before your diagnosis. My mother wanted to go to her family's annual reunion picnic. Doctors said she shouldn't. I said she shouldn't. She insisted and ended up winning out so that she could sit in a chair under a tree and visit with the same people who visited at the hospital. For me, it was a writing conference I had promised myself I would go to if I lived until that next year (5 years cancer free now and going strong). My doctor wanted me to avoid public places and people for a while longer. I went to the conference and sat toward the back of the sessions. I went to and napped in my hotel when I needed to do that. It was my reward to myself for making it that far and I wasn't going to give it up if I could help it. Sounds silly, but it was a big step for me from cancer patient to cancer survivor. I took other time to rest, spend time with my daughters, and enjoy the sensations of taste, smell, etc. again that go haywire with all those meds. 

The show didn't delve very far into Jen's diagnosis other than to say she was sick and how hard the treatments were, but I would be willing to bet that she had many of the same feelings that many patients get. Looking back at this episode now, I recognize that in her. She was clearly trying to be positive, especially in front of the cameras, but there is a part of you with that kind of diagnosis that craves both normalcy and the mundane. There's a little voice in many of our heads during treatment that this may be the last... (fill in the blank). During chemo my appetite was zilch and even talking about food made me sick. If I had been receiving treatment over the holidays like Jen, I would have been excited to have Christmas sans chemo just so I could participate in things like breakfast casserole while opening gifts and sneaking my mother's potato salad (my favorite) while she insists on cooking everything herself for the big meal. 

Thankfully, Jen was able to beat her issues and continue on with her life. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by RebeccatheWriter

[BW Manilowe]

23 hours ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I don't understand how they can take 2 old Christmas shows, bundle them together and call it a "new" episode.

Live with Kelly and Ryan does a similar thing all the time when they’re on vacation; they’ve been doing it since before Kelly Ripa either joined the show as Regis Philbin’s Co-Host, when Kathie Lee Gifford left, or when she became the top-billed Host after Regis either retired or was pushed out, possibly due to his age, depending on who’s opining on the departure. Their producers repackage old interviews that weren’t originally on Live in the same Live eps into a different ep, which airs during their vacation weeks, thereby making the ep seem “new”.

[Libby]

I am extremely relieved that Jen made it through her cancer treatment. It was a wonderful result to that horrible episode in their lives.

However, if they were willing to continue filming the show during that awful time, forget them ever stopping filming in the best interest of their children.

They had two newly adopted children, Jen was extremely ill, and the show continued to go on.

The TLC/Klein partnership seems to be carved in stone, no matter what.

[Mom2twoNonna2-3]

If you recall they did have the cameras banned for a period of time while they bonded with Zoey. Eventually they did let them back in and it was towards the end of her treatment, as well.

[SMama]

8 minutes ago, Mom2twoNonna2one said:

If you recall they did have the cameras banned for a period of time while they bonded with Zoey. Eventually they did let them back in and it was towards the end of her treatment, as well.

They did the same when Will came home, IIRC it was just Jen, Bill and Will. That is extremely important because post institutionalized children do not have the concept of a nuclear family. They have so many caretakers that they will latch on to anyone they see. I give them credit for having that family only time and not even show home videos on the show.

[Libby]

5 minutes ago, Mom2twoNonna2one said:

If you recall they did have the cameras banned for a period of time while they bonded with Zoey. Eventually they did let them back in and it was towards the end of her treatment, as well.

They kept the cameras out for a short while with both kids. Less time than the expert recommended both times. Even if they followed the expert's recommendations, a lot of people would have stopped filming for much longer (a year or so), to let the children adapt to their new family without spectators.

I don't know where Jen was in her treatment during filming. I didn't see anything that indicated that it was towards the end.

[SMama]

37 minutes ago, Libby said:

They kept the cameras out for a short while with both kids. Less time than the expert recommended both times. 

Did I miss something? They had an expert on camera recommending the length of nuclear family bonding time? How do we know how long the cameras were gone? And how long were they supposed to be exclusively as a nuclear family? Because I counsel IA parents and must be messing the whole thing up. 

We had our period of alone time with SBaby, then went on with our lives, with the exception that no one but us held, fed, bathe (etc) her until she was clear we were Mama and Baba. 

Edited December 14, 2018 by SMama

[Libby]

27 minutes ago, SMama said:

Did I miss something? They had an expert on camera recommending the length of nuclear family bonding time? How do we know how long the cameras were gone? And how long were they supposed to be exclusively as a nuclear family? Because I counsel IA parents and must be messing the whole thing up. 

We had our period of alone time with SBaby, then went on with our lives, with the exception that no one but us held, fed, bathe (etc) her until she was clear we were Mama and Baba. 

 

I can't remember exactly, but in anticipation of adopting Will, there was a meeting with an expert. The counselor prepared them that Will would probably be behind. They also talked to them about the alone period and gave a minimum amount of time that it would be necessary.

When the Kleins resumed filming, Bill said that the counselor said whatever time (I can't remember), but Will was doing so good, that he and Jen didn't think that that much time was necessary, and that they cut it short.

When you were done your private time with Sbaby, would you have let a camera crew into your house to broadcast her on nationwide TV? The Kleins did that to both of their children. As the Kleins have made very apparent, they don't need the money. They are greedy.

Edited December 14, 2018 by Libby

[Foghorn Leghorn]

The Kleins were told a period of several weeks if not a few months and I believe it was a requirement of their adoption contract likely due to the fact they were already filming a show as a couple.  .  It had to do with the adoption agency.  Jen had an expert from TCH she was getting additional counselling from to help guide them through a successful transition.  For some reason I think Jen took 6 weeks off work and they were to bond just the 3 of them.

 Jen got sick while in India getting Zoey and flew back early for treatment.  When Zoey arrived home Jen was doing her treatments and most of the bonding was with Bill who Zoey hated!  It was a difficult transition for her and different than Will’s.  

I seem to recall it was either strongly recommended or contractually driven.

Edited December 14, 2018 by Foghorn Leghorn

[SMama]

44 minutes ago, Libby said:

 

When you were done your private time with Sbaby, would you have let a camera crew into your house to broadcast her on nationwide TV? The Kleins did that to both of their children. As the Kleins have made very apparent, they don't need the money. They are greedy.

No, we didn’t have a camera crew, but I’m a bit ashamed to admit there’s an excessive amount of film and pictures of SBaby since the second we met her. 🤗SBaba and I are intoverts and the thought of being filmed makes us ill. I only got through being a forensic interviewer (sessions are filmed) because I knew my discomfort was nothing compared to the abuse the children endured. 

FWIW, many parents have to return to work within two weeks after returning home, and the child goes to daycare.  Some parents won’t take FMLA because of the consequences. You also won’t believe how many wealthy parents, with a SAHM who do not observe a single day of nuclear family bonding. Including taking grandparents to China and pass the baby around like a novelty item. That truly saddens me.

[toodles]

Jen and Bill were on the Dr. Oz show and went into detail about the nature of Jen's cancer.  It was on a rerun the other day.  When the cancer was active, they chose to film because they wanted to show the bad with the good.  They mentioned it in an interview at the time and it might be on one the Q & A programs.

Edited December 15, 2018 by toodles

[toodles]

This is an addition to my previous post.  There were multiple articles at the time the cancer was active since the cancer happened long before the cancer episodes were shown.  The internet is forever and I'm sure they are out there somewhere.  I'm guessing the dr. Oz episode is on YouTube as well.  The cancer started in her uterus and spread quickly.  She had a hysterectomy as soon as she returned from India and started cancer treatments immediately.  When she announced her remission she thanked her parents for all their help.

The morning reruns that were on recently were the cancer episodes.  The initial bonding with Zoey was rough.  She had a much more difficult time than Will did.  I think the Christmas episode the other night was the first time Zoey was on since India.  

I can't imagine what they went through at that time.  Do I think it's time to stop filming?  Yes I do.  But I admire the Kleins. They don't complain and they take life as it comes.

For the record, I like the Houston house better.  It's my dream house.

[CaliCannoli]

On 12/11/2018 at 11:27 PM, alegtostandon said:

I do not remember seeing this.  Will had no respect for Jen even back then.  When Bill was trying to put the train set together,  Will  took the train remote and refused to give it to Jen. After asking nicely a couple of times & Will refusing to part with it,  Jen pried it from his hands.  He started hitting towards her, he didn't strike her but they showed him twice making the motions.  Jen's reaction, to feed him.  

Poor Zoey, the back of my head hurt watching her fall!  

 

I'm pretty sure this is normal cranky behavior for a 3 year old who is hungry & tired and has very few, if any, verbal skills. It seemed to me Jen was busy & forgot lunch for the kids. Funny how we can see the same exact thing yet interpret it so differently. :)

Edited December 15, 2018 by CaliCannoli

[CaliCannoli]

On 12/13/2018 at 7:37 AM, RebeccatheWriter said:

Speaking as a cancer survivor and as the daughter of one, we don't always make the best decisions. I would probably say that normalcy was more important to her at that moment. When you have spent months being poked, prodded, told that you might not make it, experiencing highs and lows, never quite feeling like the old you, etc., the one thing you want more than anything is to have a normal day or do something that would have seemed so easy before your diagnosis. My mother wanted to go to her family's annual reunion picnic. Doctors said she shouldn't. I said she shouldn't. She insisted and ended up winning out so that she could sit in a chair under a tree and visit with the same people who visited at the hospital. For me, it was a writing conference I had promised myself I would go to if I lived until that next year (5 years cancer free now and going strong). My doctor wanted me to avoid public places and people for a while longer. I went to the conference and sat toward the back of the sessions. I went to and napped in my hotel when I needed to do that. It was my reward to myself for making it that far and I wasn't going to give it up if I could help it. Sounds silly, but it was a big step for me from cancer patient to cancer survivor. I took other time to rest, spend time with my daughters, and enjoy the sensations of taste, smell, etc. again that go haywire with all those meds. 

The show didn't delve very far into Jen's diagnosis other than to say she was sick and how hard the treatments were, but I would be willing to bet that she had many of the same feelings that many patients get. Looking back at this episode now, I recognize that in her. She was clearly trying to be positive, especially in front of the cameras, but there is a part of you with that kind of diagnosis that craves both normalcy and the mundane. There's a little voice in many of our heads during treatment that this may be the last... (fill in the blank). During chemo my appetite was zilch and even talking about food made me sick. If I had been receiving treatment over the holidays like Jen, I would have been excited to have Christmas sans chemo just so I could participate in things like breakfast casserole while opening gifts and sneaking my mother's potato salad (my favorite) while she insists on cooking everything herself for the big meal. 

Thankfully, Jen was able to beat her issues and continue on with her life. 

"...so that she could sit in a chair under a tree and visit with the same people who visited her at the hospital."  If this is an example of your writing style I will be first in line to buy your book. Very moving.:)

[howiveaddict]

On 12/13/2018 at 5:54 PM, Libby said:

I am extremely relieved that Jen made it through her cancer treatment. It was a wonderful result to that horrible episode in their lives.

However, if they were willing to continue filming the show during that awful time, forget them ever stopping filming in the best interest of their children.

They had two newly adopted children, Jen was extremely ill, and the show continued to go on.

The TLC/Klein partnership seems to be carved in stone, no matter what.

It was educational to see Jen's cancer journey.  I'm sure it helped others going through the same thing to see how well she did.  Also, it's not like every second was recorded.

On 12/13/2018 at 6:15 PM, Mom2twoNonna2one said:

If you recall they did have the cameras banned for a period of time while they bonded with Zoey. Eventually they did let them back in and it was towards the end of her treatment, as well.

I remember that also.

On 12/14/2018 at 7:11 PM, toodles said:

Jen and Bill were on the Dr. Oz show and went into detail about the nature of Jen's cancer.  It was on a rerun the other day.  When the cancer was active, they chose to film because they wanted to show the bad with the good.  They mentioned it in an interview at the time and it might be on one the Q & A programs.

I saw that also.  As above it was informative.  Even if it was on the Dr Oz show, whom I find very annoying.

[Bunnyette]

On 2018-12-12 at 9:47 AM, bichonblitz said:

Watching Jen in the hospital having chemo treatments reminded me of how much this woman has endured in her life and how gracious she is. I take back every awful thing I ever said about her! Jen, enjoy your huge house and all the fruits of your labor, you deserve it! I hope her kids will someday understand what a special woman she is. 

I hope Bill teaches his children to respect their mother...I read their biography.  What this woman has accomplished is amazing.  Stilll don’t like the way Will & Zoey are rude to her.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

3 hours ago, Bunnyette said:

I hope Bill teaches his children to respect their mother...I read their biography.  What this woman has accomplished is amazing.  Stilll don’t like the way Will & Zoey are rude to her.

I think Will and Zoey both know they are the boss and can get away with murder including being rude to both Jen and Bill too I am sure although we don’t see it as much.  Jen asking “OK?” After every single request of her kids to do something lets them know she is not in charge so hence their disrespect and behavior.  Bill is not the boss but a playmate so why swat him?!  Respect is earned not deserved and she needs to work on her command skills at home.  

[woodscommaelle]

I liked Jen's observation that their stockings should have said ''mommy' and 'daddy' instead of 'Jen and Bill.'  

Edited December 17, 2018 by woodscommaelle

[AZChristian]

11 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

I liked Jen's observation that their stockings should have said ''mommy' and 'daddy' instead of 'Jen and Bill.'  

But Jen and Bill aren't SANTA's Mommy and Daddy.

[Latenites]

Jen has recently had surgery. Does anyone know what for? I pray it wasn't a return of her cancer.

[Sew Sumi]

24 minutes ago, Latenites said:

Jen has recently had surgery. Does anyone know what for? I pray it wasn't a return of her cancer.

It's bring discussed in the Arnold-Klein thread. She had hip replacement surgery.

Edited December 18, 2018 by Sew Sumi

[Latenites]

Thanks!