Carole Radziwill: She's a Real Princess!

[RedheadZombie]

Carole said in one of her talking heads that she's a better writer than she is a speaker and I found that odd.

I don't think that's uncommon. Carole is not quick on her feet. When she has her good one-liners, it's in her THs after she's had time to think them up. I think it's part of being an introvert. She also gets flustered during confrontations. She wrote her book over the course of years. No one has that luxury when speaking.

[AnnA]

Unless a ghost writer is ready to hang it up and retire, I doubt they would risk being able to attract future clients by blabbing.  Chances are there's also some kind of confidentiality agreement in place between the GW and the author.

[Trooper York]

If Carole is a better writer than she is a speaker than she is basically a mute.

[film noire]

Thanks.  Odd that they aren't copyrighted and odd that she chose the same title.  The other book was also about death.

 

I think the titles (and Splendor in the Grass -- oh, Natalie)  likely come from this Wordsworth poem:

 

Though nothing can bring back the hour

of splendor in the grass, glory in the flower. 

We will grieve not, rather find

strength in what remains behind.

Edited August 24, 2015 by film noire

[ryebread]

I think the titles (and Splendor in the Grass -- oh, Natalie)  likely come from this Wordsworth poem:

 

Though nothing can bring back the hour

of splendor in the grass, glory in the flower. 

We will grieve not, rather find

strength in what remains behind.

 

Thanks, filmnoire.  I just read the whole poem.  Ohhhh......Natalie.....

Gonna Netflix that next weekend.

 

Splendour in the Grass by William Wordsworth

 

What though the radiance

which was once so bright

Be now for ever taken from my sight,

Though nothing can bring back the hour

Of splendour in the grass,

of glory in the flower,

We will grieve not, rather find

Strength in what remains behind;

In the primal sympathy

Which having been must ever be;

In the soothing thoughts that spring

Out of human suffering;

In the faith that looks through death,

In years that bring the philosophic mind.

[NewDigs]

Thanks, filmnoire.  I just read the whole poem.  Ohhhh......Natalie.....

Gonna Netflix that next weekend.

 

Splendour in the Grass by William Wordsworth

 

What though the radiance

which was once so bright

Be now for ever taken from my sight,

Though nothing can bring back the hour

Of splendour in the grass,

of glory in the flower,

We will grieve not, rather find

Strength in what remains behind;

In the primal sympathy

Which having been must ever be;

In the soothing thoughts that spring

Out of human suffering;

In the faith that looks through death,

In years that bring the philosophic mind.

Thank you.

Beautiful.

[quaintirene]

 

Thanks.  Odd that they aren't copyrighted and odd that she chose the same title.  The other book was also about death.

You can't copyright a title.  But it's never a good idea to use one from a book that was successful or well-known.  When we do titles, we always check via amazon etc to see if anyone came up with it first--and who that person was.  If it was a self-published e-only writer we don't care very much.  If it was, say, John Grisham we would avoid it.

[ryebread]

Slow news day in HW land.  Radzi was at Sunbury Motors in Pennsylvania yesterday selling cars?  Doing a radio broadcast?  What is this? Sales must not be brisk in her jewelry division.

 

Carole Radziwill ‏@CaroleRadziwill  · Aug 22 
I'm in Amish country. So pretty!!!! Selling cars at @SunburyMotorCo  Come down!

 

[zoeysmom]

Slow news day in HW land.  Radzi was at Sunbury Motors in Pennsylvania yesterday selling cars?  Doing a radio broadcast?  What is this? Sales must not be brisk in her jewelry division.

 

Carole Radziwill ‏@CaroleRadziwill  · Aug 22 

I'm in Amish country. So pretty!!!! Selling cars at @SunburyMotorCo  Come down!

 

Where are all her fans?

[ryebread]

That dress is horrible.  And not suited for the 'occasion'.

[Mondrianyone]

Radzi was at Sunbury Motors in Pennsylvania yesterday selling cars?  Doing a radio broadcast?  What is this?

 

 

Well, a girl has to get out occasionally.  You know it must be pretty boring sitting around the apartment all day watching the ghostwriter type.  ;o)

[film noire]

Thank you.

Beautiful.

 

He didn't need no damn spectre with a quill pen

(Who ya gonna call? Ghost writers! :)

Edited August 25, 2015 by film noire

[Jextella]

So, has it been officially proven that Carol had a ghostwriter for book 1?

[WireWrap]

So, has it been officially proven that Carol had a ghostwriter for book 1?

No. LOL

[Mozelle]

So, has it been officially proven that Carol had a ghostwriter for book 1?

No. It's all speculation of the "Let me pull a name out of a hat and say that this person is the ghost writer" variety.

[Freckledbruh]

Or people using common sense where a writer doesn't go from writing a critically acclaimed bestseller to only interviewing celebs like the Kardashians and then a novel that got mixed reviews at best. Oh no, couldn't be that.

Edited August 25, 2015 by Freckledbruh

[Mozelle]

Or people using common sense where a writer doesn't go from writing a critically acclaimed bestseller to only interviewing celebs like the Kardashians and then a novel that got mixed reviews at best. Oh no, couldn't be that.

 

It is speculation. Where was the lie? The names change depending on who's making the accusation. Aviva tried with Bill Whitworth, and that didn't stick. Now LuAnn is trying with Carole's sister-in-law. 

[Freckledbruh]

 

Where was the lie?

Who said you lied?  I posted an alternative reason for the speculation.

[Mozelle]

"Oh no, it couldn't be that" after saying that people are using common sense when talking about this situation didn't seem like you were speculating. Honestly, it seemed that you were asserting something other than speculation. Like, someone asked if there was definitive proof about Carole using a ghost writer, and I responded that it was still all speculation. That's all.  

 

It is interesting to me that it took Aviva fighting with Carole and accusing her of having a ghost writer for this suddenly to become "important" speculation. I was a long-time poster on TWoP, and I do not recall this being a topic of conversation during Carole's first season. Not for one moment. It speaks directly to how rumors spat out in anger over someone can linger. I remember those who didn't like Carole spoke about how they didn't like her too-cool-for-school behavior, or how dismissive she was of LuAnn. But there was never talk about her not writing her first book.

Edited August 25, 2015 by Mozelle

[stinkogingko]

Or people using common sense where a writer doesn't go from writing a critically acclaimed bestseller to only interviewing celebs like the Kardashians and then a novel that got mixed reviews at best. Oh no, couldn't be that.

Why has M. Night Shyamalan only made one good movie?

VH1's top 100 one-hit wonders:

http://rateyourmusic.com/list/fierystage/vh1s_100_greatest_one_hit_wonders/

I wonder how many of those performers are still traveling around, doing the one big hit in ever smaller venues? Stil, some great tunes there....

[Freckledbruh]

Why has M. Night Shyamalan only made one good movie?

VH1's top 100 one-hit wonders:

http://rateyourmusic.com/list/fierystage/vh1s_100_greatest_one_hit_wonders/

I wonder how many of those performers are still traveling around, doing the one big hit in ever smaller venues? Stil, some great tunes there....

Didn't M. Night make several movies after that hit?  And most "one hit wonders" in music have had sophomore albums fairly soon after their hit?  Carole took like 10 years before her next book with fluffy celeb interviews in between.

[stinkogingko]

One success does not mean subsequent success, material or artistic. The lack of follow up doesn't itself negate the prior achievement. Ralph Ellison worked on his second novel for 30 years, never finished. Maybe one heart-felt memoir is all Carole has in her. Still more than most.

[motorcitymom65]

Not responding pro or con in the Ghost Writer debate (I wrote out that words because GW always makes me do a double take, I know it has a W in it but it is hard to speak an R when you see a W so I always stumble over GW when reading. Y'all need to stop and just spell it out, just for me). But this is a faulty comparison. There are many authors who have one great book, followed by nothing. I think What Remains was a success because it one of those once in a lifetime experiences. If she has another one, I think it will be as successful if she writes about it. If it weren't for what is probably a no you can't write about your experience contract with Bravo, I have no doubt that she would be able to spin a wonderful, best selling tale about RHNY.  I just think that when she writes non fiction, she can speak it. When she ventures into fiction, she can't speak it. She does well with interviewing, because it is a real experience. So just because she writes well when she is experiencing real life moments, doesn't mean she can write well for made up stories. 

 

There are many careers where this is true. Take the show Fixer Upper. Jo can do that shabby chic look in her sleep. She had to do a mid century modern look once. It was a pretty good attempt, but not a classic one and would have been picked apart by a notable mid century modern expert. Does that mean she had a ghost decorator for her shabby chic jobs? If she can do one, why can't she do it all? 

 

Again, I am not in the debate for yes or no in the ghost writer circles of conversation. I just don't think it is correct that if you write a best sellers, you have to always be able to write a best seller. It doesn't always happen that way.

 

eta stinkogrinko said it better with less words. I am cursed with the stream of conscious thing.

I completely agree. Carole's successful career was built originally on telling people's stories. She was a journalist, and that is what she did. She was good at it, and no doubt used those same skills to tell her own story in What Remains. I'm not sure why anyone would think that because she was good at that, her not having the same ability to write Fiction would mean that she wasn't damned good at the other stuff.  They are two very different things. Even the fluff pieces with the celebrities goes to her skill set. 

[Higgins]

How about Harper Lee? One and done.

[KFC]

The debates about Carole were so much more interesting when we accused her of being "too cool for school."

[Rhetorica]

How about Harper Lee? One and done.

I'm reading number two now.

[KFC]

Well Aviva did remind us that word on her street was Truman Capote ghostwrote "To Kill A Mockingbird." 

[Higgins]

I'm reading number two now.

I did hear about that but if it takes Carole that long she will be dead.

[bagatelle]

The HWs have no idea what they will be asked prior to filming their THs. It is not like the producers give each HW a list of questions to go over before filming so they can prepare their answerers first. They also tell the HW what the other HW(s) are saying about them in their questions all in order to up the drama. Then the THs are edited to fit what the producers want and finally they are slipped into which ever scene they choose. The THs are used to amp up the women after filming ends so that the reunion has big drama/fights which pulls in more viewers. How many here would watch the reunion if everyone, the HWs, worked everything out by the season Finale. There would be no need for a "reunion" show at all if that happened IMO. This season, they were filming THs up to the day before the reunion was filmed, which is something new.

 

Funny, because the THs  often sound scripted to me.  Not with everyone, just the less verbal ones, who are suddenly witty.

[RedheadZombie]

I'm reading number two now.

 

It's from the same original work.  What you're reading was edited out, and Harper Lee never wanted it published.  Her elder sister was her attorney, and she's died.  This new attorney is taking advantage of Lee who has dementia.  If I had any interest in the "second" book, I lost it with the news that

Gem is dead, and Atticus is a card carrying racist.

[Rhetorica]

It's from the same original work. What you're reading was edited out, and Harper Lee never wanted it published. Her elder sister was her attorney, and she's died. This new attorney is taking advantage of Lee who has dementia. If I had any interest in the "second" book, I lost it with the news that

Gem is dead, and Atticus is a card carrying racist.

Yeah, I know all that. That's why I'm reading it. I can see why the publisher wanted the side story from the book. This one is good, reflects the times, just as the Mockingbird.

[Former Nun]

If Carole has a ghostwriter, her book would probably be progressing.

[jaybird2]

i am not a fan of carole !!  i just finished her book and it was as if she was speaking.  it 'sounds' like carole.  no way was it ghostwritten.   

 

she really has come a long way from her 'humble' beginnings.  she really didn't mention her family much after became an adult.  it was all her husband and his family

[quaintirene]

i am not a fan of carole !! i just finished her book and it was as if she was speaking. it 'sounds' like carole. no way was it ghostwritten.

I'm not taking a stand either way. But a decent ghostwriter is well able to mimic a subject's voice. That's a huge part of the job. I will say this: in my experience an ability to write non-fiction does not guarantee an ability to write fiction. And I do remember Carole talking about her 'writing partner' or some such in her first season. That having been said, I thought The Widow's Guide was drivel. Whether she had help with it or not.

[jaybird2]

quaintirene, i've not read widows guide ...don't want to either.  i have no doubt that it takes a different type of writer for fiction.

 

i found what remains interesting because i live in woodstock which 8 miles from where carole spent her summers with her grandmother.  i pass that area a couple times a week.  she definitely has come a long way from her childhood.

 

 

[quaintirene]

Yeah I think she's a climber for sure.  I wonder what her relationship is with Bethenny.  Because that's who seems to be the most successful and well-connected of the bunch.  She appears to be friendly with Heather, but that is only going to take her so far.  After all, Heather is Yummy Tummy.  She's not Spanx...

[tulip555]

Thanks, filmnoire. I just read the whole poem. Ohhhh......Natalie.....

Gonna Netflix that next weekend.

Splendour in the Grass by William Wordsworth

What though the radiance

which was once so bright

Be now for ever taken from my sight,

Though nothing can bring back the hour

Of splendour in the grass,

of glory in the flower,

We will grieve not, rather find

Strength in what remains behind;

In the primal sympathy

Which having been must ever be;

In the soothing thoughts that spring

Out of human suffering;

In the faith that looks through death,

In years that bring the philosophic mind.

Interesting movie....saw it years ago Edited September 8, 2015 by tulip555

[motorcitymom65]

Yeah I think she's a climber for sure.  I wonder what her relationship is with Bethenny.  Because that's who seems to be the most successful and well-connected of the bunch.  She appears to be friendly with Heather, but that is only going to take her so far.  After all, Heather is Yummy Tummy.  She's not Spanx...

I think that Carole's connections run much deeper than those of Beth, or anyone else on the show. 

[Higgins]

It's from the same original work.  What you're reading was edited out, and Harper Lee never wanted it published.  Her elder sister was her attorney, and she's died.  This new attorney is taking advantage of Lee who has dementia.  If I had any interest in the "second" book, I lost it with the news that

Gem is dead, and Atticus is a card carrying racist.

No interest in that version.

[quaintirene]

 

I think that Carole's connections run much deeper than those of Beth, or anyone else on the show.

I think they did run deeper.  In the 90s.  Now not so much.  If she was that well-connected I'm not sure why she's doing this show full of wannabes (and Heather and Bethenny busily promoting their brands).  I could believe she went on to promote her book.  But that book is out now and has been for ages.  And the new one--the one that was always gonna be a book of essays but which she pretended would be a sequel to The Widow's Guide and is now pretending it'll be a collection of thoughts about her dating experiences--isn't even written never mind published.  So what's her excuse right now?

[bagatelle]

she really has come a long way from her 'humble' beginnings.  she really didn't mention her family much after became an adult.  it was all her husband and his family

 

I doubt she would have many interested in reading her book if it wasn't about the Kennedy connection.

[motorcitymom65]

I think they did run deeper.  In the 90s.  Now not so much.  If she was that well-connected I'm not sure why she's doing this show full of wannabes (and Heather and Bethenny busily promoting their brands).  I could believe she went on to promote her book.  But that book is out now and has been for ages.  And the new one--the one that was always gonna be a book of essays but which she pretended would be a sequel to The Widow's Guide and is now pretending it'll be a collection of thoughts about her dating experiences--isn't even written never mind published.  So what's her excuse right now?

I think that Carole is still plenty connected. Her affair with Clooney wasn't that long before she came on the show, so I would say she knows people. She counts the Director Joel Schumacher as one of her closest friends, close enough that he was willing to come on the show for her book launch party, and according to him, he gave her the advice that she should have the new experience of doing the show. She is close enough to the person who designs frocks for Michelle Obama that she can go to his home, plop down with her feet on the couch and have a cup of tea. Diane Sawyer and Mike Nichols (RIP Mike) are no slouches in the "knowing people" department either, and they are close friends.  These are all people who know people, and relatioships (well, who knows about Clooney) that still exist for her. That doesn't even count the Radziwill's or Kennedy's. Last season after Aviva said she had no relationship with the Kennedy's any longer, she blogged that she had just returned from a Kennedy family wedding that weekend. I would say she is still pretty connected. I would argue that the reason people like Beth, Andy Cohen and Lu (back in the day) were impressed with Carole to begin with was the fact that she is so connected. I think she is fascinating with or without knowing anyone, but I think that for them, this was a major reason in why they gave her a look at all.

[Pollock]

I think that Carole is still plenty connected. Her affair with Clooney wasn't that long before she came on the show, so I would say she knows people. She counts the Director Joel Schumacher as one of her closest friends, close enough that he was willing to come on the show for her book launch party, and according to him, he gave her the advice that she should have the new experience of doing the show.

OT but the guy who thought a Batman suit with nipples was a good idea shouldn't give advice to anybody, really.

Never forget.

[ryebread]

I think they did run deeper.  In the 90s.  Now not so much.  If she was that well-connected I'm not sure why she's doing this show full of wannabes (and Heather and Bethenny busily promoting their brands).

 

And doing radio spots from a car dealer at some remote location in Pennsylvania.  I think she had connections.  I did, too, at one time. Like Jill, I ran with a fabulous circle of people.  People come and go from your life all the time. 

 

It would be hard for someone like Diane Sawyer to be friends with Carole now.  Diane fought hard to make it where she is today - paved the way for many female new anchors.  I think it probably pains her to see a woman, like Carole, go from serious journalist and novelist to the moron that we see today. 

Edited September 10, 2015 by ryebread

[Jextella]

I don't understand the fuss about ghost writers.  Seems even the best writers would want another set of eyes - or more - to assist in the process...I guess it has to do with degree of "participation".  For a fluff book like Carole's, I could really care less one way or another. I'd be more bothered if she put forward in her name only a piece that was ultimately deemed a literary masterpiece. 

 

Seems like crys for validation by all those involved in the debate....and that more self-assured people wouldn't spend time thinking about it.

[lunastartron]

Carole noted on the season 5 reunion that her romance with George occurred prior to the publication of WR - she said he was the first person to whom she "showed the pages," implying either manuscript or galleys. 7 years counts as more than "not long before" joining the show (my subjective opinion, of course). But "connections" is an inherently subjective term with respect to both definition and metric. The Housewives themselves are "connected" by virtue of their affiliation with Andy Cohen, for example, within the context of fame-whoring and enjoying a degree of "fame" and, if not celebrity, then notoriety. Likewise, NeNe Leakes demonstrably has a not insignificant history with Ryan Murphy . . . but is it a "connection" in the widely understood sense of the word if he's no longer casting her in his projects? Carole obviously has friendships and wielded the glamour of being affiliated with two socially storied families when she first appeared on the show . . . and I'd say that she's eroded what mystique she had with every season that she's been part of the program. When her memoir was released, she garnered that Heather-validating spot on Oprah, similarly highly rated television shows, and a multi-page spread in Vogue. Part of this was obviously attributable to the subject matter of her book but I don't doubt that her professional network at the time helped with the media promotion of WR. Fast-forward ten years and WG commands . . . radio silence in comparable press outlets. Gone are the September issue accolades in fashion's most revered magazine and in their place is a spot on the lowest-rated installment of a Bravo franchise, a platform that yields abysmal sales for Carole's novel but does afford her the opportunity to demonstrate her poor grasp of American Indian history and semantics; literally co-opt punchlines from Sex and the City; and establish a bizarrely myopic perspective on current events ("are we the one percent?" she wondered before retreating to her multi-million dollar West Village loft.

[ryebread]

Gone are the September issue accolades in fashion's most revered magazine and in their place is a spot on the lowest-rated installment of a Bravo franchise, a platform that yields abysmal sales for Carole's novel but does afford her the opportunity to demonstrate her poor grasp of American Indian history and semantics; literally co-opt punchlines from Sex and the City; and establish a bizarrely myopic perspective on current events ("are we the one percent?" she wondered before retreating to her multi-million dollar West Village loft.

 

Made me giggle.  Diane Sawyer couldn't have said it better.  In fact, I read it in Diane Sawyer's voice.  Is that you, Diane?

[bagatelle]

 That doesn't even count the Radziwill's or Kennedy's. Last season after Aviva said she had no relationship with the Kennedy's any longer, she blogged that she had just returned from a Kennedy family wedding that weekend. I would say she is still pretty connected.

 

There are no Kennedy connections to brag about these days. The glory days are long gone and that goes for any Radziwill's too, unless Anthony's sister made something for herself.  Stas Radziwill was a horrible business man, died broke broke and even though he insisted on using his title, it was an empty, meaningless one.

 

I really like Carole, but the Kennedy and princess thing is so tired and silly.

[motorcitymom65]

There are no Kennedy connections to brag about these days. The glory days are long gone and that goes for any Radziwill's too, unless Anthony's sister made something for herself.  Stas Radziwill was a horrible business man, died broke broke and even though he insisted on using his title, it was an empty, meaningless one.

 

I really like Carole, but the Kennedy and princess thing is so tired and silly.

I agree about the princess thing, but she doesn't really bother with it, so it's OK by me.

 

My point is that she has connections; probably at least as many as Beth.  My original comment was in response to someone suggesting that she was getting friendly with Beth simply because she wanted to be friends with someone "connected" and I think the very notion is laughable. I certainly don't think she is the most connected person in the world, but I think that in the world of the HW's, she is more than most. I know that people who dislike Carole are bothered by the notion that people of note or respect might like her; how could they when she is such a joke? I am bothered by the fact that Thomas Roberts (who I love) hangs out with Lu, but apparently it is indeed so, and the fact that I don't like it/don't understand it, doesn't really change it at all. 

[jaync]

I know that people who dislike Carole are bothered by the notion that people of note or respect might like her;

And bothered to the point that they believe they know what those people of note/respect actually think about their friend. Pretty hilarious.