Spoilers and Speculation

[OoohMaggie]

Episode 12 trailer,
 

 

Edited March 7, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[mightysparrow]

It looks like Daryl's off the hook and Carol needs an ego boost.  So she screws Ezekiel.  Zeke deserves better; that bitch is only going to break his heart again. 

I wish the show had stuck to the comics and put Michonne and Zeke together.  She would have been a wonderful, LOYAL queen.  Rick and Carol would have made a perfect couple.  Birds of a feather.

[AngelaHunter]

13 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

It looks like Daryl's off the hook and Carol needs an ego boost. 

She did the same thing with poor...what was his name? Coby? Corbin? back in Alexandria. It was obvious she felt nothing for him, but she allowed him to adore her and tolerated his slobbering on her for her own needs. What he saw that was so irresistible in this miserable, morose, cold woman I have no idea. The pickins' are slim in a ZA but I'm sure he could have found someone who returned his feelings at least a little bit.

20 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

Rick and Carol would have made a perfect couple.  Birds of a feather.

They certainly had a lot in common but I doubt Carol would be as malleable as Michonne or willing to walk in Rick's footsteps - not so "stand by your man." In any case it couldn't have happened since in no movie/TV show can a man romantically be with a woman who is older than he is (unless it's some kinky thing) although it's fine and even standard to hook up a man with a woman young enough to be his daughter or even his granddaughter.

[OoohMaggie]

11 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

She did the same thing with poor...what was his name? Coby? Corbin?

Tobin

[shanndee]

I haven't watched last weeks episode and came here to see if I should bother to watch tonights. I'm still on the fence. I'll probably drop by the live chat to see how it plays out. Of course, that may be a bad idea...I enjoy the snark so  much I may feel like I should watch along!

[OoohMaggie]

 

 

 

[Lamima]

Thanks for the 3 sneak peek clips. Don't really need to watch next week as all the pertinent info was in the clips. LOL.

[nodorothyparker]

I guess that's it for the big house at Hilltop then.  

Ahh, Judith. As you would expect with the spawn of Lori and the sister of Carl, she's never where she's supposed to be.  

[OoohMaggie]

2 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

I guess that's it for the big house at Hilltop then.  

Maggie’s gonna be pissed, and those lovely 🤢 paintings of Glenn and Hershy Jr by Anne/Jadis up in flames.......... what a shame  😂

Edited March 9, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[OoohMaggie]

 

[OoohMaggie]

It looks like Carol may be back on normal St, so now we need another character to experience mental anguish and turmoil, the brat has just killed a human, judging by the look on her face, she’s the one 🙄

[nodorothyparker]

Where did the non masked/non dirty faced woman even come from?  She really doesn't look like a Whisperer but Not! Punky Brewster still killed her nonetheless.

I like the using of front loader buckets for catapults.  Without gas, they might as well get what use they can from the parts. 

Quietly competent and lethal Carol is my favorite Carol.

[Mr. Sparkle]

Maybe they should have used those catapults earlier on? 🤷‍♀️

[nodorothyparker]

We've got a big housecleaning episode with a couple of big deaths.  The main takeaways seem to be that the popular theories that Negan was working to take down Alpha/the Whisperers from the inside and that Carol put him up to it after likely helping him escape Alexandria were correct.  Meanwhile, Judith goes full prison Carl.

From TSDF Army. S10.E12: Walk With Us

 

Quote

 

1.) Is Hilltop completely destroyed?

I think so. We see fires, explosions, all sorts of debris, but there's not much of an aftermath to this. Other things take priority.

2.) Does our group scatter or do they stay together?   What groups are there?

They do scatter. These are the groups I can remember: Luke-Aaron, Daryl-Rosita-Jerry-Nabila, Alden-Kelly-Adam-Gamma, Eugene-Carol-Magna-Yumiko, Earl-the children.

3.) Does anyone die? Is anyone severely injured?

Yes and yes.

4.) We see Ezekiel has most of the kids but not Judith. Is RJ with him? Where does Ezekiel take them?

Judith stayed back to fight walkers. Ezekiel apparently disappears in the mayhem after a while, so it's Earl who takes the children to a cabin.

5.) We see Eugene running back towards the fire during the battle. What is he going back for?

To try and salvage the radio.

6.) Do we see any other communities?

No.

7.) What is going on in the scene where Aaron encounters Negan?

We see Aaron dragging an unconscious Luke on a makeshift stretcher, and he comes across Negan who is looking for Lydia. Aaron intends to kill Negan, Negan tries to explain to him that "it's not like that," but he shuts him down. They are interrupted by walkers who are attracted by Aaron's yelling at Negan. Negan walks away, leaving Aaron alone to deal with the walkers. He can't pursue him because of Luke's situation.

8.) Do we get more insight about Negan and who’s side he’s really on or his plan?

A huge yes. More on this later.

9.) What’s going on with the cabin Alpha is headed towards?

Negan takes her there, telling her that he has found Lydia and that she's in there.

10.) Does Alpha die this episode? How?

YES! Negan slits her throat. It turns out, he has taken Lydia to a different cabin and led Alpha to another one to kill her.

While they are walking towards the cabin where Lydia supposedly is, Negan tells Alpha about how his wife died of pancreatic cancer. He tells her that he wasn't able to feel anything at all after her death. He says that that was his strength, but Alpha's pretending that they don't have any emotions and that they are animals is bullshit. He's clearly upset about her obsession with killing her own child. It seems he actually tries to talk her out of it up until the very last moment. Before going inside the cabin where Lydia supposedly is, they kiss, she thanks him, she opens the door to find the cabin empty, she turns around to face him, and he slits her throat. He holds her, kisses her, and continues to hold her until she falls on the ground.

11.) What is Beta doing?

Beta kills Gamma. She rips off half of his mask while fighting back. After he kills her, another Whisperer approaches and apparently recognizes him, saying "It's you". He says that he had thought his voice sounded familiar, but he is interrupted when Beta kills him too. Then, Beta waits for Gamma to turn, only to witness her getting an arrow in the head, shot by Alden from a distance. He then flees before Alden can put one in him too.

12.) Are Magna & Connie discussed this episode?

Magna enters Hilltop, walking among the horde. She later tells Yumiko that they were moving with the horde, but she lost Connie in the commotion.

13.) What is Lydia doing out in the woods all alone?

I'm not exactly sure. While at Hilltop, Gamma urges her not to go back outside because she knows what Alpha wants. Lydia says she will never walk with her and goes outside on her own. Negan catches her later and has her tied to a chair in a cabin.

14.) Why are Kelly, Alden, & Adam trapped in a car? How do they escape?

They get inside the car to avoid a bunch of walkers. Gamma doesn't get in the car with them, she stays outside to lure the walkers away. That's when Beta gets her. Kelly, Alden and Adam apparently make it out later, we see them alive and safe when Alden kills walker Gamma.

15.) Where is Earl hiding with the children?

In a different cabin, I think because the one they agreed upon beforehand had walkers in it.

16.) Does Judith talk about having to kill a human? Does she have another heart to heart conversation with Daryl?

No, but she's visibly shaken. She kills a Whisperer, mistaking him for a walker. No to the second part, there's a more pressing matter regarding her scene with Daryl. More on this the final Q.

17.) Does anyone have any flashbacks, dreams or hallucinations?

There's no time for any of that, actually.

18.) Does Carol find Lydia's staff in this episode? How does Lydia lose it? Is Carol alone?

Yes. Negan takes it from her when he grabs her. Carol's not "alone," this happens while she is with Yumiko, Magna and Eugene, but they are not around at that specific moment.

19.) How does the episode end?

Negan has Alpha's head in a sack. He's seen walking with it in his hand, then he opens the sack, and we see Alpha's head rolling on the floor, stopping at someone's feet. Lo and behold, it's Carol! She says "Took you long enough." The end.

20.) Anything else interesting?

Many things!

- With Kelly's encouragement, Alden lets Gamma hold and comfort Adam. He asks her what her sister's name was, it was Frances. Gamma expresses regret over her actions.

- Yumiko punches Carol in the mouth because she thinks Carol is being dismissive towards Magna and the shit she's put her through.

- Magna apparently breaks up with Yumiko. She says she was pissed at first, but now she understands that Yumiko was right to kick her out. They joke about having peaceful nights at last, not having someone stealing their pillows and no more snoring. They hold hands, it's completely amicable.

- Eugene and Carol have a really nice scene. He comes to check up on her after seeing the punch. She asks him if he knows how it feels to want something so bad, to have everyone pissed at you and possibly to have had people killed over it, but still have nothing to show for it, he says he actually does know. He vaguely tells her about his upcoming meeting and him obviously no longer being able to attend due to his obligations at Hilltop, but she urges him to "just go to her". He tells her that he sincerely hopes she gets what she wants.

- Earl takes the kids to a safe place and comforts them. He then goes into the other room and drives a big metal rod onto a wooden table, intending to kill himself because he's been bitten. Judith comes in and tells him that she can stay with him so he won't be alone when it happens. He tells her that he won't be alone, he has Tammy and his son. He tells her that she's so strong and so brave, and he asks her to go back to the other room to keep the other kids safe from him. Judith squeezes his hand and leaves. Later on, she comes back inside, finds him turned, and she kills him. Daryl comes and finds her sitting on the floor, takes her sword off her hands, sits down next to her and holds her.

 

 

[mightysparrow]

I knew Earl was a goner.  But Yumiko is suddenly my favourite character.

Edited March 11, 2020 by mightysparrow

[Ohwell]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

I knew Earl was a goner.  But Yumiko is suddenly my favourite character.

Mine too.  I can't wait to see that.

[OoohMaggie]

19 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

Negan has Alpha's head in a sack.

I never thought I’d be so happy to imagine Elpha’s head in Negan’s sack. Thank God, this nonsense nightmare might be over soon 🙏

Edited March 12, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[AngelaHunter]

Quote

 

5.) We see Eugene running back towards the fire during the battle. What is he going back for?

To try and salvage the radio.

 

Can't leave without the fap fodder.

 

[OoohMaggie]

                                        ‼️WARNING‼️

 THIS CLIP IS SO ENJOYABLE YOUR HEAD COULD EXPLODE 🤯
( I’m not referring to the kiss )

 

That’s how to do it Ricky boy 

Edited March 14, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[OoohMaggie]

Aaaahhhhh 😭

Way to go Alden, good choice of target 🙄

Edited March 15, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[nodorothyparker]

I'm sort of sad to see Mary/Gamma go.  I like the actress and think her character had potential trying to reacclimate to whatever normal life is with our ragtag crew.  At least she was recognizable to the point that I knew her name.  I guess we'll see where this leaves Beta, still alive and with whatever Whisperers are left but without an Alpha to direct him.

But damn, Alpha's ending is gloriously twisted and carries that same twisted energy she and Negan had right to the end.  I saw a longer clip on Youtube that spliced together all the buildup to it but I won't post it here because of unclear sourcing.  I'm also seriously digging that Carol seems to have snapped back there at the end to a character I recognize and am curious to see what kind of arrangement they might have had since it seems she clearly knew what he was doing with the Whisperers all this time.  I just realized this is the first scene those two actors/characters have ever shared.

And one more clip for viewing pleasure:

 

[OoohMaggie]

Ep 13

 

[mightysparrow]

20 minutes ago, OoohMaggie said:

Ep 13

 

It looks like Michonne is going out the way she came in.  I'm just glad that Danai has something so much better to move on to.  A woman with her talent shouldn't be wasting her time on this show.

[OoohMaggie]

 

 

[OoohMaggie]

Supposedly ‘Bayda’ 
 

 

[Mr. Sparkle]

21 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

Supposedly ‘Bayda’ 
 

 

That'll be an interesting take. Per the comics, he was a famous basketball player who later appeared in movies and commercials. He was supposed to be very wealthy. Picture Shaq in a walker mask. I have the feeling the show won't go too far with this. 

Edited March 17, 2020 by Superclam

[nodorothyparker]

TSDF doesn't have a Q&A up for S10.E13: What We Become yet and probably won't for a couple of days yet if past history is our guide, but they did drop this nugget:

Quote

 

We have received a little scrap of information regarding Michonne’s exit.

Michonne will learn that Rick is still alive when she is at Virgil’s island. Inside a boat that has washed ashore, Michonne finds Rick’s boots. She also finds a cell phone that has what looks like a chalk drawing of Judith and Michonne. She radios Judith and tells her that the Brave Man might still be alive. Judith encourages her to pursue the possibility.

 

They also pointed to several episode pics AMC made available, including these.  I know everybody wants to know about the black helicopters and what they did with Rick.  It now has to be the longest running tease in TV history.  But I'm not a fan if they make Michonne's exit entirely about Rick and she just ... disappears leaving two kids behind with nothing else to go on.  That's not a great ending for an almost OG character.

 

[rmontro]

I wonder what will come of this show once it finishes all the comic-based stories.  There's really only one big storyline left in the comics, and then it ended.  I wonder if they will try to continue the series with their own ideas (makes me very nervous), or if they will just rely on their spinoffs to carry it forward.

[Smad]

I'm sticking to my prediction that Carol dies this Season. Episode 14 is titled 'Look at the flowers' after all.

[Ohwell]

Yeah look at the flowers, Carol.

I'm down with that.

[nodorothyparker]

From TSDF Army S10.E13 "What We Become" Q & A

 

Quote

 

1.) Did Virgil lie to Michonne? Are there actually weapons on the island?

Yes. No, there aren’t weapons on the island. He brought her there to have her put his walker-ified family out of their misery. He says that there have never been many "Rippers" where he is, so he's never really gotten good at what it is that Michonne does.

2.) Who are the “others” that Virgil refers to? What has happened on the island?

They are Virgil's ex-colleagues. They say that they were taking in stray people once, and it got crazy with food supplies running low and everything, so a fight broke out and some newbie died. Virgil decided to lock all the doors after this, not knowing that his wife and children were inside. The others say that Virgil also locked them up after that.

3.) Who set the boat on fire?

Virgil

4.) Why do we hear Michonne scream, “What did you do?”

She thinks Virgil must have done something to Rick, to set a trap for him, but apparently he didn't know anything about him, just that some boat with some of his stuff in it washed ashore after a storm.

5.) Why is Michonne locked in a room? How does she get out?

Virgil locks her in there. It turns out he actually wanted to set the others free but feared they would kill him, so he was going to try to break it to Michonne gently, to have her there to protect him when he releases them. When Michonne goes out by herself in the middle of the night, she finds them first, that's why Virgil locks her in too. She actually stabs him in the leg. Then she runs outside. Virgil gets away too, at first. They catch him soon after.

6.) Andrea appears in the opening minutes. Do we see any other previous characters?

Yes lots. Everyone from 6x16, specifically.

7.) Can you explain the hallucinations that Michonne has?

She has the hallucinations after drinking a tea given to her by Virgil. The hallucinations are the story of what would have happened to Michonne if she hadn't helped Andrea and met Negan instead, becoming a Savior. There are scenes into which she's added digitally, being on the other side this time. The Lucille scene is Negan asking her to do what he did in 6x16, her being his right-hand-woman. She's actually pointing Lucille at herself and swinging it at herself.

There's also one from when they passed a hitchhiker without helping him (orange backpack guy) But this time, Michonne is the hitchhiker begging for help and Daryl is the one ignoring her.

Later on, during a chase in the woods, she's shot in the chest by Daryl with an arrow and shot in the face by Rick with the pistol.

8.) Do we see anything with the other communities?

Nope.

9.) What ends up happening to Virgil? Does he live?

Yes. Michonne gets the others to spare him and they are willing to let him leave with them. He chooses to stay back because he promised his wife flowers every day.

10.) Can you describe the scene where Michonne discovers Rick might still be alive?

After they decide to spare Virgil, Michonne asks him to take her to her stuff. Michonne sees the boots first on a shelf. She puts them up against her nose and cries. She pins Virgil against the wall and questions him on where he got the boots. They go to this military-looking boat that has washed ashore during a storm. Michonne starts looking at the stuff on a table and finds an iPhone with a drawing of her and Judith on its screen, with the word "Rick" on the top right corner. She questions Virgil again, to no avail. He tells her that their meeting may not have been accidental, that he can get the boat running again with help from the others, and maybe she can find this person again.

11.) How does Michonne plan on finding Rick? Does she find any clues about where he is?

Yes, there is a location marked on the ship's logbook which I can't remember right now, unfortunately. She tells Judith she's going to head north.

12.) Does anyone else besides Judith learn about Rick possibly being alive?

No.

13.) What are Michonne’s last words to Judith?

She tells her that she will call her on the radio as long as it's possible, and that she loves her and RJ so much. And Judith will listen to Uncle Daryl.

14.) Does Michonne talk to RJ or anyone else?

Only Judith and RJ. Her conversation with RJ is adorable. He has his own call sign, Little Brave Man. He actually has quite a few lines here.

15.) How does the episode end?

Michonne gets herself two new pet walkers. While traveling, she comes across a man and a woman who ask her for help, saying "they'll leave without us." When Michonne says who, they point towards the horizon and we see a large army-like group moving in formation. At this point, she remembers Carl and Rick trying to decide whether to help her or not, she kills the two pet walkers and offers the two help.

 

 

[raven]

I guess I'll reserve judgement till watching, but that is some BS on the Michonne spoilers.  Bye kids!!  Off to find Rick!!  Good luck with everything!  Cripes.

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, raven said:

I guess I'll reserve judgement till watching, but that is some BS on the Michonne spoilers.  Bye kids!!  Off to find Rick!!  Good luck with everything!  Cripes.

Good grief.

 

22 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

At this point, she remembers Carl and Rick trying to decide whether to help her or not, she kills the two pet walkers and offers the two help.

Does she remember Judith and her own kid?

In all these loooonnnng years, she hasn't learned not to put total and complete trust in some dodgy-acting stranger? I mean, she had all trouble in the world trusting the 90210 kids who showed up with the little pudgy ex-music teacher with a fondness for osso bucco, but instantly trusts Virgil (whoever he is) and goes off alone on a sailing expedition with him to parts unknown so hastily she doesn't even bother bidding adieu to her son. Can TPTB please dumb these characters down just a little more?

[nodorothyparker]

Yeah, I kept thinking when first reading that does Michonne not remember that she went with the dodgy stranger in the first place because he promised her weapons they'd need in their neverending war with the Whisperers?  But the minute she gets to sniff Rick's boots (seriously!) she says oh to hell with it, I'm sure the kiddies will be fine with the corpse wearing freaks who just recently sawed a bunch of other people's kids' heads off?  I'm sure the 10-year-old who befriends psychopaths will be sure to let everybody know so they don't think I just abandoned my kids.

[AngelaHunter]

3 hours ago, nodorothyparker said:

But the minute she gets to sniff Rick's boots (seriously!)

I swear sometimes I read the spoilers about scenes here and refuse to believe them until I see them. Does the scent of Rick's feet still linger and is the aroma enough to make the thought of the kids whoosh out of her head? Well, better his boots than his boxers, I guess. But then, Michonne and Rick were never exactly model parents with their, "Oh, they'll be fine" method of rearing young 'uns.

[OoohMaggie]

 

Don’t they make a lovely couple

Edited March 20, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[nodorothyparker]

Did he seriously "rhyme" head with head thinking he was clever or do I need more morning caffeine?

[Nashville]

48 minutes ago, nodorothyparker said:

Did he seriously "rhyme" head with head thinking he was clever or do I need more morning caffeine?

Think he was referring to “said head”.

[mightysparrow]

17 hours ago, raven said:

I guess I'll reserve judgement till watching, but that is some BS on the Michonne spoilers.  Bye kids!!  Off to find Rick!!  Good luck with everything!  Cripes.

THANK YOU!  I refuse to believe that Michonne would EVER just sail off with a complete stranger and leave her children alone.  The writers might have forgotten about the Peanut and what happened to him, but I haven't.  Fuck them all.

Poor RJ is going to starve to death now that Michonne is gone because nobody's going to remember him long enough to give him any food.

Edited to add:  I will never forgive these assholes for destroying Michonne but I'm glad that Danai is out of this bullshit.

Edited March 20, 2020 by mightysparrow

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

Edited to add:  I will never forgive these assholes for destroying Michonne

I'm trying to think of one main character who lasted until the last couples seasons they didn't destroy but I'm coming up empty. I'm sure there must be someone but I can't think who.

[OoohMaggie]

 

[AngelaHunter]

2 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

 

They shouldn't dredge up scenes like that. It only reminds us of how good this show used to be and how shitty and silly it is now. 😧

[OoohMaggie]

Finding Rick’s boots

 

Trippy scene
 

Tells brat about Rick

Edited March 21, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[OoohMaggie]

10 hours ago, AngelaHunter said:

They shouldn't dredge up scenes like that. It only reminds us of how good this show used to be and how shitty and silly it is now. 😧

I really liked this episode, the usual few niggles but overall I think things are definitely getting better 🤗

[OoohMaggie]

 

 

[mightysparrow]

21 hours ago, OoohMaggie said:

 

My girl.

This seems like a 'what if' scene.  As in, 'what if Michonne had left Andrea to die'.  It's good to see Andrea again and to remember that Michonne DIDN'T leave her to die and that they were good friends until Gimple remembered that women couldn't be friends in his world.

It's unfortunate but not surprising that Michonne doesn't get an exit that's about her.  It sure would have been nice if Virgil's story had triggered Michonne into talking about her own story and what happened with her first family, but Michonne isn't allowed to have a back story. It has to be ALL ABOUT RICK.  We know more about Yumiko and Magna's past than we do about Michonne's.

With the changes brought about with the COVID-19 virus, Danai will probably be spared having to sit on the couch and pretend that she enjoyed working with hacks like Gimple and Kang.  I'm sure that she's going to miss the cast and crew of The Walking Dead but Gimple and Kang fucked up one of the most iconic characters in graphic novels and Danai shouldn't have to pretend that they're anything but no-talent hacks.

[Ohwell]

But Michonne did have a back story.  I don't remember the season it was, but they did show her back story and how she came to have the two walkers with their arms cut off.

I don't know how important she was because I've never read the comics, but on this show, over the years I think she's gotten plenty of screen time.  

I like Danai Gurai, she seems like a decent actress, and I wish her well in her future endeavors.  But I just don't see "poor Michonne didn't get her due" being true at all.  Just my opinion.  

[OoohMaggie]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

This seems like a 'what if' scene.

That whole segment is really good, I’m sure we’ll be seeing her again in the new WD movie

Edited March 21, 2020 by OoohMaggie

[AngelaHunter]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

It's good to see Andrea again

I'm in the minority that liked Andrea. She seemed real to me, with her flaws and mistakes, and I found her actions understandable as a normal human in an abnormal situation. And we go to know her so well we can still talk about her. I doubt anyone years from now will be reminiscing about Magna. 

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

they were good friends until Gimple remembered that women couldn't be friends in his world.

This is true. I don't recall seeing any of the women really interacting with each other, other than the very early scene of them all at the quarry, fooling around, talking and laughing together (as scene I really loved) in a very identifiable way.

[mightysparrow]

1 hour ago, AngelaHunter said:

I'm in the minority that liked Andrea. She seemed real to me, with her flaws and mistakes, and I found her actions understandable as a normal human in an abnormal situation. And we go to know her so well we can still talk about her. I doubt anyone years from now will be reminiscing about Magna. 

This is true. I don't recall seeing any of the women really interacting with each other, other than the very early scene of them all at the quarry, fooling around, talking and laughing together (as scene I really loved) in a very identifiable way.

I liked Andrea too.  Even when she chose to side with the Governor, I understood WHY she did it.  I understood that she was tired of living on the run and wanted hot showers, decent food and sex with a good looking man who wasn't ALWAYS crazy.  The last scene between Andrea and Michonne was one of the best things on TWD.  They had time to forgive each other and remember that they loved each other.  It was beautiful.  I miss that.