You: The Book and the Sequels and Other Spoilers

[formerlyfreedom]

This is the spot to discuss the books - You and Hidden Bodies by Carolyn Kepnes- as well as make comparisons between the books and the show!

Beware, entering here may spoil you!

[taragel]

I'm a huge fan of the audiobooks, narrated to perfection by Santino Fontana. He really was able to bring Joe's sardonic humor alive. From the previews, it looked like all the humor of the books might be lost  and this would be a more...trademark Lifetime vehicle with the focus on a woman in distress, but Badgley struck the right note.  The voicover was spot-on and really made the whole thing work. I don't recall the neighbor boy's story being in the books, so I'm guessing that was added specifically for the show to try to humanize Joe a little more. I could've done without it honestly, and hope they wrap it up fairly quickly.

I'm excited to see more at any rate.

Edited September 10, 2018 by taragel

[reallymadcow]

I like the audiobooks as well. I didn’t remember the boy either, so between the two of us I think we can agree he’s an add. :) I think that another reason the kid was added was to give Joe another murder with the evil stepdad. Here’s my prediction: evil stepdad dead by midseason.

[Darian]

I read it long enough ago that I'd forgotten some, but I loved the voice and am also glad that's preserved so far. From the little I knew of Penn Badgely, I didn't see him as Joe, but wow, do I now. He's fantastic. 

[NeenerNeener]

I read it last week; Paco and family were added for the tv show.

I found Beck to be as twisted as Joe by the end of the book; I wonder if they're going to try to make her more sympathetic and less manipulative on the show. I sort of hope they write her as she was in the book.

Edited September 11, 2018 by NeenerNeener

[skotnikov]

21 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

I read it last week; Paco and family were added for the tv show.

I found Beck to be as twisted as Joe by the end of the book; I wonder if they're going to try to make her more sympathetic and less manipulative on the show. I sort of hope they write her as she was in the book.

 

From what one reads in series' reviews they will follow to the letter with Beck. Someone even mentions that all characters in the series are horrible manipulative persons.   

Edited September 11, 2018 by skotnikov

[NeenerNeener]

1 hour ago, skotnikov said:

From what one reads in series' reviews they will follow to the letter with Beck. Someone even mentions that all characters in the series are horrible manipulative persons.   

Oh goody! Although so far they haven't made Benji anywhere near as skeevy as he was in the book. And there were a few characters I liked: Ethan, for instance.And with the exception of Peach, Beck's posse were fairly inoffensive 20-somethings. 

[Joimiaroxeu]

I liked the book and expected it to be made into a big screen movie. Seems to me that a TV series will require some dumbing down. I'm open to the possibilities though.

Ditto comments upthread, in NYC do people really do all that personal stuff in front of huge picture windows with backlighting?

They really made Daniel Cosgrove (Ron) look like a scuzzball. I almost didn't recognize him at first.

[TattleTeeny]

2 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

I liked the book and expected it to be made into a big screen movie. Seems to me that a TV series will require some dumbing down. I'm open to the possibilities though.

Ditto comments upthread, in NYC do people really do all that personal stuff in front of huge picture windows with backlighting?

They really made Daniel Cosgrove (Ron) look like a scuzzball. I almost didn't recognize him at first.

What would have to be dumbed-down though? Subject matter aside, this was a fairly "light," uncomplicated read.

I really don't think the uncovered window thing has to do with NY specifically; there are oblivious people (and/or exhibitionists) everywhere.

Edited September 12, 2018 by TattleTeeny

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

What would have to be dumbed-down though? Subject matter aside, this was a fairly "light," uncomplicated read.

Not to get in a book discussion here in the wrong thread but maybe instead of "dumbing down" I might have said "things made more obvious". With this being on Lifetime, so far it's what I would've expected. Perhaps Amazon or HBO or whatever might've taken a more sophisticated approach.

[TattleTeeny]

7 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Not to get in a book discussion here in the wrong thread but maybe instead of "dumbing down" I might have said "things made more obvious". With this being on Lifetime, so far it's what I would've expected. Perhaps Amazon or HBO or whatever might've taken a more sophisticated approach.

Ah, got it. I feel like it's well above the standards of typical Lifetime endeavors, and the voiceover seems to have the "how"s covered pretty well. I'm not someone that needs everything super-obviously spelled out on a platter for me, but there are definitely times I find it frustrating when a movie or show practically hides what they're getting at; I watch stuff to chill out and have a good time, not do extra digging around for clues ad whatnot (I just watched the movie Hereditary the other night and it was OK, but it only made total sense with some subsequent internet sleuthing, which annoyed me a bit).

Edited September 12, 2018 by TattleTeeny

[Door County Cherry]

10 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Not to get in a book discussion here in the wrong thread but maybe instead of "dumbing down" I might have said "things made more obvious". With this being on Lifetime, so far it's what I would've expected. Perhaps Amazon or HBO or whatever might've taken a more sophisticated approach.

I thought the book was pretty obvious too.  The show has moved faster to raise Joe's level of creepiness but that makes sense considering it sounds like they're planning to cover the whole first book in the first season.

And count me among the audio book fans.  I don't know that I would have stuck with the book (it could be so unrelenting at times) if it weren't for the narration. 

[NeenerNeener]

I finished the second book tonight. The casting for season two should be interesting. I read book one 2 weeks ago, and in my head Beck looked like Hilary Duff even though I knew the the age wasn't right, just the tiny size. Now I'm thinking Duff would a better fit in the 2nd book.

[taragel]

On 9/14/2018 at 8:22 PM, NeenerNeener said:

I finished the second book tonight. The casting for season two should be interesting. I read book one 2 weeks ago, and in my head Beck looked like Hilary Duff even though I knew the the age wasn't right, just the tiny size. Now I'm thinking Duff would a better fit in the 2nd book.

For next season, Annie Murphy (from Schitt's Creek) should absolutely play Love. I had her (or maybe her Schitt's Creek character at least) in my head the entire time I was listening to the audio. 

Was the bookstore owner abusive to Joe in the book? I didn't recall that exactly. I remember him being tough maybe but...hitting him and locking him in the cage? IDK I have the worst memory after I finish a book.

Edited September 17, 2018 by taragel

[Door County Cherry]

2 hours ago, taragel said:

IDK I have the worst memory after I finish a book.

I do too.  In my mind, I swear the kid was in the book even though everyone else is saying he's an add on.

But I do think that happened which is funny because someone speculated about that in the episode thread and I was like "nah" but seeing that flashback, I do seem to recall that happened. 

[NeenerNeener]

On 9/16/2018 at 11:49 PM, taragel said:

Was the bookstore owner abusive to Joe in the book? I didn't recall that exactly. I remember him being tough maybe but...hitting him and locking him in the cage? IDK I have the worst memory after I finish a book.

Yeah, it was mentioned in the first book. When Joe first started working for Mr. Mooney he took a rare book out of the cage to read, and left it on the counter upstairs where it was, of course, stolen by a female customer*. Mr. Mooney locked him in the cage for several days as punishment. 09/11/01 was included in those several days, so Joe missed the Twin Towers coming down.

 

* Joe has the worst luck with women ripping off the bookstore. You'd think he'd learn to be more suspicious after that first time.

Edited September 18, 2018 by NeenerNeener

[taragel]

23 hours ago, NeenerNeener said:

Yeah, it was mentioned in the first book. When Joe first started working for Mr. Mooney he took a rare book out of the cage to read, and left it on the counter upstairs where it was, of course, stolen by a female customer*. Mr. Mooney locked him in the cage for several days as punishment. 09/11/01 was included in those several days, so Joe missed the Twin Towers coming down.

 

* Joe has the worst luck with women ripping off the bookstore. You'd think he'd learn to be more suspicious after that first time.

Ah thanks. I guess I maybe glossed over it in the book. The inclusion in the show makes it seem as though that treatment is his reason for his terrible behavior a little bit.

[kj4ever]

On 9/10/2018 at 11:58 AM, taragel said:

I'm a huge fan of the audiobooks, narrated to perfection by Santino Fontana. He really was able to bring Joe's sardonic humor alive. From the previews, it looked like all the humor of the books might be lost  and this would be a more...trademark Lifetime vehicle with the focus on a woman in distress, but Badgley struck the right note.  The voicover was spot-on and really made the whole thing work. I don't recall the neighbor boy's story being in the books, so I'm guessing that was added specifically for the show to try to humanize Joe a little more. I could've done without it honestly, and hope they wrap it up fairly quickly.

I'm excited to see more at any rate.

Thank you for the shout out to the audiobook.  I've tried several and hate them.  When a woman narrates and does a comical deep voice when a man is speaking or the other way around it just takes you right out of the story.  This audiobook was perfectly done, with just a slight variation between characters and Santino didn't try to totally change his voice when a woman was speaking so it didn't sound absurd.  I have a long commute so I'm definitely going to have to find more books this man has done.

On 9/10/2018 at 7:00 PM, NeenerNeener said:

I read it last week; Paco and family were added for the tv show.

I found Beck to be as twisted as Joe by the end of the book; I wonder if they're going to try to make her more sympathetic and less manipulative on the show. I sort of hope they write her as she was in the book.

Oh how I hope they don't "good" her up.  I think that was one of the best parts of the book.  It is really conflicting that by the end you can almost see why he wants to choke her.

So did I read this wrong or did she pretty much know he was kind of a stalker from the beginning?  The fact that she said she knew he was at her reading the night she fell on the tracks and the new email address....Did she know he was reading her stuff all that time, but just didn't know how bad he really was?

[taragel]

30 minutes ago, kj4ever said:

Thank you for the shout out to the audiobook.  I've tried several and hate them.  When a woman narrates and does a comical deep voice when a man is speaking or the other way around it just takes you right out of the story.  This audiobook was perfectly done, with just a slight variation between characters and Santino didn't try to totally change his voice when a woman was speaking so it didn't sound absurd.  I have a long commute so I'm definitely going to have to find more books this man has done.

You're welcome! The sequel, Hidden Bodies, is also great. He's narrated some other books as well, mostly multi-cast recordings, but I haven't listened to the others. 

[Door County Cherry]

On 9/23/2018 at 11:03 AM, taragel said:

You're welcome! The sequel, Hidden Bodies, is also great. He's narrated some other books as well, mostly multi-cast recordings, but I haven't listened to the others. 

Yeah.  I think I like the sequel even more.  I like Penn on this show but I certainly hope, when they do the third book, that they won't switch things up and have the person doing the TV/film start reading the books they way I think they have with Bosch.  I still prefer Santino's narration.

Moving onto the book vs. show, in the book, didn't Joe cut Benji up into little pieces?  

[kj4ever]

13 hours ago, Door County Cherry said:

Yeah.  I think I like the sequel even more.  I like Penn on this show but I certainly hope, when they do the third book, that they won't switch things up and have the person doing the TV/film start reading the books they way I think they have with Bosch.  I still prefer Santino's narration.

Moving onto the book vs. show, in the book, didn't Joe cut Benji up into little pieces?  

I think you're right - he did.  He also had zero problems disposing of the body as opposed to the show which had him throwing up and acting like it made him sick.  I think they are trying to make him more sympathetic for the TeeVee crowd.

[NeenerNeener]

On 9/23/2018 at 11:30 AM, kj4ever said:

So did I read this wrong or did she pretty much know he was kind of a stalker from the beginning?  The fact that she said she knew he was at her reading the night she fell on the tracks and the new email address....Did she know he was reading her stuff all that time, but just didn't know how bad he really was?

I don't think it ever occurred to her that he was a stalker; she just didn't think about him at all early on (and she didn't know he had her old phone). She also seemed pretty oblivious to how Peach felt about her.

[Spartan Girl]

Just finished the book. Ho-ly shit. So fucking twisted. Already I can see how the TV show watered down the book version.

I wonder if the season will end with Joe murdering Beck and framing the skeevy shrink too. Good choice with casting Stamos for that part since I find him repellent these days too.

Now I have to read the sequel!

[skotnikov]

I wish they wouldn't kill Peach. I loath later seasons of PLL, but I find Shay really good in You. Unfortunately according to ep. 7 description they probably will

:( 

  I'd also like to see another season of Beck. The actress was so good in Dead of Summer! 

Edited October 11, 2018 by skotnikov

[Door County Cherry]

I wish they hadn't changed the way Peach died.  They even brought in the ghost of Candace so I was expecting flashbacks to him killing her while killing Peach.  I wonder why that was.  

[Spartan Girl]

Read Hidden Bodies. Wow, there really IS someone out there for everyone...or at least a disturbing amount of women that are willing to overlook stalking and killing.

[taragel]

So this week's episode (and the preview for next week) seems to be taking it in a different direction from the book... It makes me wonder if they're going to stretch out the Joe-Beck relationship for two seasons rather than just go into the events of Hidden Bodies for a second season.  I think I'd prefer them to maybe end the You storyline in s1 and then just take it to LA. The sequel really had two separate storylines that they could easily mold into two seasons--it didn't really get going until he met Love and her family. But if they could make the stuff in the first half of Hidden Bodies a bit more interesting and purposeful, I could see that being season 2 and then him meeting Love at the end to launch a season 3. They could probably get two seasons out of everything that happens with Love and her family actually.

[Door County Cherry]

There are 3 episodes to go in this season and not much story left from the book.  I think next week is the beginning of their last hurrah as a couple, with the Dr. Nicky affair being exposed in episode 9 and the season ending with her death.

It will be interesting how much time they spend in NY next season as there was always the frame job lurking in the background.

[JD5166]

On 10/19/2018 at 5:50 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Read Hidden Bodies. Wow, there really IS someone out there for everyone...or at least a disturbing amount of women that are willing to overlook stalking and killing.

I just started reading this and after the first awesome 15 or so chapters, it veers off the edge for me. I am still enthralled, love her writing....it’s just very far fetched in the shallow LA scene...if only it were so easy to meet the beautiful and famous!!! I LOVE her riffing on the beautiful and famous tho.  It’s just how I imagined it, even worse than NY where I spent the last almost 30 years, thank god for the midwest...HOME! I am also a little more aware of my exclaimatiom point useage, Joe would kill me for such an annoying habit. Heh 

[Door County Cherry]

Man, I'm going to be so disappointed when Dr. Nicky invevitably falls for Beck.  He's cooler here than he is in the book. 

[NeenerNeener]

Well, it looks like Season 2 isn't going to follow Book 2, since they brought Candace back from the dead instead of introducing Amy Adam. I was looking forward to seeing who they cast as 40 and Love, but I guess they aren't going that way.

By the way, Lenny Jacobson would have been an awesome 40.

Edited November 12, 2018 by NeenerNeener

[BooBear]

32 minutes ago, NeenerNeener said:

Well, it looks like Season 2 isn't going to follow Book 2, since they brought Candace back from the dead instead of introducing Amy Adam. I was looking forward to seeing who they cast as 40 and Love, but I guess they aren't going that way.

Don't be too sure. I got the feeling they were faking us out and "Candice" will be an illusion of Joe, but the real person under there could be a new person. After all, where could the show go with Candice?

[Door County Cherry]

Or Candace could play the Amy role---bummer that we'd miss out on those Amy Adams jokes, tho.

Clearly Candace has a skill to disappear so Joe could follow her to LA and lose her. Paco and his mom heading to CA can't be a coincidence.

Not that I'm really thrilled with this change.  I suspect they wanted a surprise ending and they didn't find a big enough surprise star to play that role in the reveal.

[Spartan Girl]

Yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about Candace replacing Amy (supposedly) either. I do hope we still get Love and her family though.

I must say, the show made Beck a tad more likable than she was in the book. In the book she ghosted Joe after their first disastrous sex, and started cheating on Joe with Dr. Nicky after they got back together, and basically admitted that she only wanted to break up Dr. Nicky's family like her dad did to her. Yeesh. I guess that wouldn't have gone well with Show Beck's image as the perpetual victim.

[methodwriter85]

Was Blythe transgender in the book, or did they just decide to go with a transgender actress and thus the character is now trans? I thought it was interesting that no one seemed to comment on Blythe being transgender because there's usually always some kind of soap box moment that comes up with LGBT characters on shows. I thought that was pretty cool, and it made sense for people who live in a big city and attend liberal universities.

Edited January 5, 2019 by methodwriter85

[Save Yourself]

On 06/01/2019 at 4:43 AM, methodwriter85 said:

Was Blythe transgender in the book, or did they just decide to go with a transgender actress and thus the character is now trans? I thought it was interesting that no one seemed to comment on Blythe being transgender because there's usually always some kind of soap box moment that comes up with LGBT characters on shows. I thought that was pretty cool, and it made sense for people who live in a big city and attend liberal universities.

I didn’t know that the actress who played Blythe was transgender until I Googled her, I think the character of Blythe could be cis-gendered or trans-gendered, since it wasn’t mentioned I would think cis as rightly or wrongly that is the default assumption in the general population. I’d actually like it if a transgender actress is playing a cis woman as it’s the same as when a cis woman plays a transgender woman, there’s no reason why they have to stick to one or the other IMO. 

[Lurky McLurkerson]

On 11/13/2018 at 7:19 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I must say, the show made Beck a tad more likable than she was in the book. In the book she ghosted Joe after their first disastrous sex, and started cheating on Joe with Dr. Nicky after they got back together, and basically admitted that she only wanted to break up Dr. Nicky's family like her dad did to her. Yeesh. I guess that wouldn't have gone well with Show Beck's image as the perpetual victim.

I am very late to the party and just finished the book (and anxiously awaiting the second from the library hold queue), but I completely agree with this.  Show Beck is too nice and lacked the flaws of the one in the book, and one of the things I thought was most effective about the book was that Joe's homicidal tendencies came not only from trying to remove obstacles to his being with the object of his obsession but also following their inevitable fall from the pedestal he put them on.   I felt the inserted Paco sidestory was unnecessarily shoehorned in when it felt like they were already rushing and simplifying the actual plot of the book - that's the beauty of doing a multi-episode TV series instead of a movie: more time to tell the story and develop more nuanced characters.

I also had no idea that the actress who played Blythe was transgender - I don't think that was supposed to be a plot point.  I thought it was weird that they turned Show Blythe into almost a friend instead of a competitor/critic, but I loved Hari Nef's portrayal of Show Blythe.

Edited March 11, 2019 by Lurky McLurkerson

[Atlanta]

Finished the sequel. Didn't disappoint. Will there be a third?

[Spartan Girl]

On 9/16/2019 at 7:00 PM, Atlanta said:

Finished the sequel. Didn't disappoint. Will there be a third?

Yup and a fourth!

[Door County Cherry]

So how did we feel about how the show adapted Hidden Bodies? There were some parts I loved. Some changes I hated.  And some changes I didn't like that might not have been changes but it has been a while since I read the book.

Now, I say I hate some of the changes now but I didn't like that Candace was shown alive last season yet I ended up kind of liking that she became the "Amy" from the book---although Amy is still alive in the book series and I always suspected she might reappear in Book 3.

I don't think I'm going to come around on the decision to make Love a serial killer, though. I thought the way the book did it--with her basically accepting him--was enough and could have done similar things for future seasons.  

So do you think they'll do some of the things they basically excised from Hidden Bodies next season?  

[Spartan Girl]

6 hours ago, Door County Cherry said:

I don't think I'm going to come around on the decision to make Love a serial killer, though. I thought the way the book did it--with her basically accepting him--was enough and could have done similar things for future seasons.  

You can't deny it's a brilliant comeuppance, giving Joe his own obsessed stalker. It sucks that they killed off Candace, so setting up Love as Joe's wife/enemy as he stalks the neighbor has some potential.

[DanaMB]

Did Hidden Bodies end with Joe fixating on another woman like season 2 ended?

[blueroses]

31 minutes ago, DanaMB said:

Did Hidden Bodies end with Joe fixating on another woman like season 2 ended?

No, it didn’t. 

[Skyline]

Some people think the woman at the end is his mother. 

[taragel]

I thought S2 was MUCH heavier than S1 somehow. Lacked a lot of the humor from the books and especially missed capturing the hypocrisy of who Joe turns into once he's firmly entrenched in LA culture and Love's family. They changed so much about Love and the whole nanny backstory that it just felt like kind of a different character to me, so her being a serial killer was a nice twist for the show.  They def. put a Gone Girl kind of ending to it. It'll be interested to see what Kepnes does for a book 3. Are we gonna see Joe in Jail or will it pick up after he gets out somehow? Whatever the plot, I guess the show will diverge from it. 

[methodwriter85]

5 hours ago, taragel said:

I thought S2 was MUCH heavier than S1 somehow. Lacked a lot of the humor from the books and especially missed capturing the hypocrisy of who Joe turns into once he's firmly entrenched in LA culture and Love's family. They changed so much about Love and the whole nanny backstory that it just felt like kind of a different character to me, so her being a serial killer was a nice twist for the show.  They def. put a Gone Girl kind of ending to it. It'll be interested to see what Kepnes does for a book 3. Are we gonna see Joe in Jail or will it pick up after he gets out somehow? Whatever the plot, I guess the show will diverge from it. 

They can't really follow the books now, can they? It seems like no matter what the show has officially diverged from the source material by going with the Gone Girl theme. I didn't read the books but making Love a killer when she wasn't seems like a big-ass divergence that I don't think you can really walk back from.

Edited December 29, 2019 by methodwriter85

[Door County Cherry]

On 12/28/2019 at 8:33 AM, Spartan Girl said:

You can't deny it's a brilliant comeuppance, giving Joe his own obsessed stalker.

I liked the jail twist better.  And maybe I don't think Love is going to be a formidable opponent for him once he decides he's done with her.  Her reprieve likely only lasts as long as she's pregnant. 

On 12/28/2019 at 8:35 AM, DanaMB said:

Did Hidden Bodies end with Joe fixating on another woman like season 2 ended?

No, in the final two episodes, the series diverted quite a bit from how the book ended  probably because it'd be easier to write another season with how they chose to end it compared to how the show tried to end it.  

 

14 hours ago, methodwriter85 said:

They can't really follow the books now, can they? It seems like no matter what the show has officially diverged from the source material by going with the Gone Girl theme. I didn't read the books but making Love a killer when she wasn't seems like a big-ass divergence that I don't think you can really walk back from.

There isn't a third book yet.  I know the author was considering writing a third book but it's unlikely that it'll be out before the next season goes into production.  I think that's why the show diverted from how the book ended since there wasn't a path, yet, of how to get Joe out of his legal troubles. 

But they could come back to the books if she publishes another book before the fourth season.  The New York murders, which were touched on more in the book and eventually led to Joe's arrest, could get more focus in the third season but they'll have to create an independent story to fill the rest of the time.  The third season could leave off where the second book leaves off. 

[Skyline]

The author said she’s working on two more books. 

[AllyB]

I have to agree with the posters who preferred how Love's story went in the book. It's been a good few years since I read it but I also remember the toxicity of Love's parents being less overt. Their family was far from healthy but they weren't as blatantly selfishly evil as they, especially their mother, were in the series. I felt that Love and her mother almost reached cartoon levels of villainy here whereas the book had them as much more real level of fucked up. The exception being Forty, who was a far nicer character in the series. Overall I think all of the Quinns were much more real in the book and I actually loved the story being one of Joe finding this perfect love in Love, of "good fortune" just striking and ridding him of Forty. Of him finding this perfect, too good to be true level of happiness and then losing it all because his crimes caught up with him in a way that he hadn't accounted for. It was so much more satisfying than this soapish, shocking conclusion.

I did enjoy the series, and understand why it couldn't end as Hidden Bodies did. But Hidden Bodies was still the superior work for many reasons.

[nkotb]

I'm super late to the party, but I just finished both books, You, & Hidden Bodies. I read both books in less than 3 weeks, & I didn't order Hidden Bodies from the library until I finished You. Rookie mistake, I should've reserved it while I was reading & enjoying You, because it took 3 days to arrive. Anyway, I'm sort of embarrassed at how much I loved them. The first thing that I tell people about them is how hilarious they are. In particular, I'm remembering a scene in You, where Joe is describing in great detail why he bought a caution tape shower curtain. It was hysterical, as are several other scenes. 

We just watched the first episode of the show, You, last night. I'd warned my husband that it's a bit naughty, but he was a little surprised. It was very difficult to not binge-watch it all night. In watching the show, I was driving myself nuts about how I could forget that Joe had a neighbor kid, Paco, who had an abusive home life. Finally, I Googled, & was relieved that I wasn't wrong, that they were just characters added to the show. 

I knew that PB was cast as Joe, so as I was reading, I pictured him. However, I'm surprised at the others. Specifically, I pictured Peach to be far less attractive, & far more dowdy. Maybe I'm misremembering, but I thought she was not as attractive as her portrayer on the show.