S05.E18: All Roads Lead...

[Raja]

13 minutes ago, TVSpectator said:

I am not a fan of Daisy either but other than the writers (and some fans) wanting her in charge, why should she become the director?  Almost every decision she has made on the show has lead to bad outcomes? The only real good decision she has made was to keep Fitz locked up. 

Ultimately Daisy becomes the favored surrogate daughter the S.H.I.E.L.D. Director who becomes the Director of S.H.I.E.LD.  for the same reason Captain America remained frozen just a little longer from the original book to the MCU movie and Tony Stark was captured in Afghanistan instead of Vietnam. It is a legacy from the comics, they decided to keep, instead of Fury's girl she is Coulson's . Now on a TV schedule with no knowledge exactly when cancellation would come  the story line was added now since by all reports even if Disney forces ABC to add one more season later the show runners are treating this story as the series finale.

Edited April 21, 2018 by Raja

[Raja]

2 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

Were FitzSimmons being selfish there? Yeah but I get it. The world wasn't in imminent danger and they couldn't risk the other based on what might happen. It puts them on a slightly bad light but they were at least honest. It's not like a scenario where they promise to put the world before themselves then at the last moment one of them decides they couldn't sacrifice the other. And It's not like the end of Cabin of the Woods where a character does something INCREDIBLY selfish yet we the audience are supposed to think he's on some moral high ground while the another character is a jerk! I'm still pissed off about that one.

I think it is how the culture has changed in my lifetime. I saw it with the cursing of the Deputy at Parkland and President Trump talking about Senator McCain getting captured in real life as we now think it is the duty to resist, to the death. Anything else is selfish.

[NeenerNeener]

So how did Yo Yo kill Ruby, anyway? I watched the scene a few times and I never caught what she did.

[Terrafamilia]

She used Ruby's chakram to slit her throat at superspeed.

[NeenerNeener]

Ah, thanks Terrafamilia!

[Lobsel Vith]

2 hours ago, Enigma X said:

I don't blame Yo-yo for killing Ruby either. 

Yeah, I don't get why some people on twitter and elsewhere are expressing hatred for Yo-yo, or blaming her for everything. You'd think Ruby was some innocent civilian rather than the Hydra member who brutally cut off Yo-yo's hands.

2 hours ago, Enigma X said:

Can someone tell me again why May or Mack could not have been in charge and have Daisy  shadow for training? I know the real reason is that the writers deemed it so, but in actuality it makes no professional sense.  Even if I felt she was written as doing a great job, it would still make no sense.

Mack is one step away from leaving (which was pointed out on the show before this - he's only staying because of Yo-yo, and I don't know how things are going to turn out now that she betrayed him), and I don't blame him (after everything he's been through, I'd feel the same way if I were in his shoes). May has never wanted it, and Daisy seems to be more of a mirror for Coulson given that she's dedicated her life to S.H.I.E.L.D. while May would be willing to leave (she left to pursue a normal life with Andrew, for example, while Lincoln had to join S.H.I.E.L.D. in order to stay with Daisy).

I'd almost say that May would want to spend what little time Coulson has left with him, but there seems to be an odd trend of this show wanting to pursue a romance between the two of them while simultaneously not actually devoting much time (if any, depending on the episode) to them. It has lead to some conflicts between the people who ship Fitz and Simmons and the people who ship Coulson and May. It's... a weird approach, to say the least. I don't pretend to understand the logic of it.

[Raja]

27 minutes ago, Lobsel Vith said:

Yeah, I don't get why some people on twitter and elsewhere are expressing hatred for Yo-yo, or blaming her for everything. You'd think Ruby was some innocent civilian rather than the Hydra member who brutally cut off Yo-yo's hands.

 

Hatred is one thing, blaming a character  is another. As conversations go on people start with their own pet theory of what causes the destruction of the world. In this case thinking probably that if Daisy and General Hale could have talked down Ruby then General hale would not have run to the Confederacy  which may prove to be the significant event.

 

In any case Yo-Yo was never a SHIELD trained agent. She is an Inhuman who used her powers to rebel against her government and has independently taken lethal actions when she joined the SHIELD fugitives after the watchdogs went after her. So her not waiting for orders works in character. 

[Quark]

Superb episode. I really don't want this season to end. How many more episodes do we have left?

[Lobsel Vith]

15 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

Were FitzSimmons being selfish there? Yeah but I get it. The world wasn't in imminent danger and they couldn't risk the other based on what might happen. It puts them on a slightly bad light but they were at least honest. It's not like a scenario where they promise to put the world before themselves then at the last moment one of them decides they couldn't sacrifice the other. And It's not like the end of Cabin of the Woods where a character does something INCREDIBLY selfish yet we the audience are supposed to think he's on some moral high ground while the another character is a jerk! I'm still pissed off about that one.

Fitz and Simmons both openly admit the risks in the actual episode, so it's not like neither of them were not cognizant that they could be bringing about the end of the world. I'd say the issue goes back to how Fitz handled the situation with Daisy, where he acted like he couldn't speak to her about the situation with the rift and handled things in a way that was incredibly poor, while here he's willing to risk the world if it means that Ruby doesn't kill Simmons.

Edited April 22, 2018 by Lobsel Vith

[Raja]

57 minutes ago, Quark said:

Superb episode. I really don't want this season to end. How many more episodes do we have left?

Four more, episode 22 "The End" is may 18th

[Lobsel Vith]

1 hour ago, Raja said:

Hatred is one thing, blaming a character  is another.

Some of the comments involve people saying they "hate" Elena now, and there are other comments where people are placing all the blame on things on Elena for how poorly things turn out for the world.

1 hour ago, Raja said:

As conversations go on people start with their own pet theory of what causes the destruction of the world. In this case thinking probably that if Daisy and General Hale could have talked down Ruby then General hale would not have run to the Confederacy  which may prove to be the significant event.

Sure, but Fitz and Simmons gave Ruby that power, yet those people are absolving Fitz and Simmons of any responsibility for giving Ruby that power and are putting all the blame on Elena's shoulders. I find the double-standard to be a bit much.

1 hour ago, Raja said:

In any case Yo-Yo was never a SHIELD trained agent. She is an Inhuman who used her powers to rebel against her government and has independently taken lethal actions when she joined the SHIELD fugitives after the watchdogs went after her. So her not waiting for orders works in character. 

I think Elena viewing Ruby as the Destroyer of Worlds, along with losing her arms to Ruby, explains why she took that particular action.

[Froippi]

ok so we only need May, Mack, and Daisy to make stupid decisions now Seems everyone else has why not join the crowd

[AKA...CJ86]

Outside of the lemons, Deke can go.  There is no use.  Although I can see where his thing can be an angle he's working... that's where I am, I think he's playing a role, biding his time, for what... I don't know...

Well, so I guess the rest of the season is the Agents of SHIELD vs A Mother's Revenge until Doomsday... Quakeday...

I'll say I'm on the side of Yo-yo's actions were warranted... regardless of if Yo-yo's actions were revenge... regardless of if her actions were she really thought Ruby was the Destroyer of Worlds... regardless of whether Hale/Daisy could talk Ruby down... Ruby was kinda going uncontrollable super person on that facility... I mean, she gave her boy toy a final mind crushing headache... she was going Darth Vader on Fitz and Simmons, and Daisy...

Edited April 22, 2018 by CyberJawa1986

[TVSpectator]

3 hours ago, Lobsel Vith said:

Fitz and Simmons both openly admit the risks in the actual episode, so it's not like neither of them were cognizant that they could be bringing about the end of the world. I'd say the issue goes back to how Fitz handled the situation with Daisy, where he acted like he couldn't speak to her about the situation with the rift and handled things in a way that was incredibly poor, while here he's willing to risk the world if it means that Ruby doesn't kill Simmons.

Well, I am now confused because, on one hand, you mentioned that they openly admit the risks but one the other hand you're saying that they weren't aware of the risks? I would say that neither wanted to be the ones that set things in motion but they kind of did with the whole, "we broke Fitz out of prison so we can stop the apocalypse but we are still invincible because we are destined to have a daughter....." kind of deal. I mean IF they did break the machine and Fitz just refused to fix it because again, it's the whole, "we are invincible because we are destined to have a daughter not yet born.... " (okay granted this was mostly Simmons)  then they won't need to worry about dying nor fixing the machine. Also, they are SHIELD agents and SHIELD is designed to protect the world/humanity as a whole so they are right now acting pretty shitty and selfish, in my opinion.  Then again, these characters never really made right choices in the series. In earlier seasons I got the impression that Simmons was more or less the type of person that would be more willing to sacrifice herself for the greater good and Fitz being the one that would pick the selfish option (which would lead to Simmons being alive) but this season they both have been very selfish, reckless, and careless. 

6 hours ago, Raja said:

Ultimately Daisy becomes the favored surrogate daughter the S.H.I.E.L.D. Director who becomes the Director of S.H.I.E.LD.  for the same reason Captain America remained frozen just a little longer from the original book to the MCU movie and Tony Stark was captured in Afghanistan instead of Vietnam. It is a legacy from the comics, they decided to keep, instead of Fury's girl she is Coulson's . Now on a TV schedule with no knowledge exactly when cancellation would come  the story line was added now since by all reports even if Disney forces ABC to add one more season later the show runners are treating this story as the series finale.

 

Tony being captured in Afghanistan instead of Vietnam was just an updated form of his story. Daisy Johnson isn't ready to become the director. She might've been right about locking Fitz up but she has always been making terrible decisions that the writing has shown throughout the series and she seems to have never fully learned from those mistakes, in my opinion. I get that this is most likely the last season but they never really focused on this storyline. Granted she is basically Coulson's foster-daughter but that doesn't automatically make her the only choice to be the director either. Hell, if this is the last season then they have done a crappy job of setting up the plot line and just gave into fanfiction wish fulfillment desires. 

 

Also, I find it depressing that this is probably the last season of the show since I have been disappointed with the story and the all of the main characters since at least Season 4. 

3 hours ago, Lobsel Vith said:

Some of the comments involve people saying they "hate" Elena now, and there are other comments where people are placing all the blame on things on Elena for how poorly things turn out for the world.

Sure, but Fitz and Simmons gave Ruby that power, yet those people are absolving Fitz and Simmons of any responsibility for giving Ruby that power and are putting all the blame on Elena's shoulders. I find the double-standard to be a bit much.

I think Elena viewing Ruby as the Destroyer of Worlds, along with losing her arms to Ruby, explains why she took that particular action.

I don't get the Elena hate either but since Fitz and Simmons are the popular couple on this show, they are just (flatly) trying to lay blame on Elena. Pretty much everyone on this show has (at times) suffered (in terms of character) because of these two "romance" and/or to further their so-called 'romance" as well. Which is why we have a character like Deke talking about lemons instead of well, what he did. 

1 hour ago, CyberJawa1986 said:

Outside of the lemons, Deke can go.  There is no use.  Although I can see where his thing can be an angle he's working... that's where I am, I think he's playing a role, biding his time, for what... I don't know...

 

 

He is pointless but if he is somehow working an angle then what could it be really? He is a grown man and he isn't a prisoner of SHIELD. He could easily just walk away from things and no one would really care about it. It's not like he is trying to work out some kind of human trafficking scheme or something (since he has no contacts in this world nor to take up any jobs for Kasius and/or his Kree Overlords- who also killed his mother because she was considered to be smart). I mean if he thinks wooing Daisy would somehow sure up things for himself I think maybe he should realize it's not going to happen anytime soon and that maybe he could I don't know, actually help them instead of talking about lemons?

Edited April 22, 2018 by TVSpectator

[jhlipton]

12 hours ago, shrewd.buddha said:

Are we supposed to have some sympathy for Hale and Ruby? Aren't they out and proud Hydra = Nazi? Didn't they kill a bunch of people, many of whom were innocent? Why should we feel any more sympathy for them than Ward? 

Yo-yo should have taken Hale out, too.  She's just as much of a murderous psycho as her daughter.

[dwmarch]

I loved the shot of the Zephyr's escape pod and the missile hitting the Hydra compound. That was some gorgeous work for a TV budget!

Edited April 22, 2018 by dwmarch

[Gothish520]

7 hours ago, Lobsel Vith said:

Sure, but Fitz and Simmons gave Ruby that power, yet those people are absolving Fitz and Simmons of any responsibility for giving Ruby that power and are putting all the blame on Elena's shoulders. I find the double-standard to be a bit much.

I don't hate Yo-Yo, but her actions were entirely her own. Fitz and Simmons were forced to do what they did by Ruby with threats of death and dismemberment. I think that was quite plainly shown in the episode. Not the same situation at all.

[Gothish520]

9 hours ago, Lobsel Vith said:

I'd almost say that May would want to spend what little time Coulson has left with him, but there seems to be an odd trend of this show wanting to pursue a romance between the two of them while simultaneously not actually devoting much time (if any, depending on the episode) to them. It has lead to some conflicts between the people who ship Fitz and Simmons and the people who ship Coulson and May. It's... a weird approach, to say the least. I don't pretend to understand the logic of it.

I wonder why there would be conflicts? Mack/Yoyo, Coulson/May, FitzSimmons - I love them all. I liked Daisy and Lincoln too, and Bobbie and Hunter. 

[thuganomics85]

Man, this was a dark and dreary episode.  It was like they wanted this to be appetizer for the main course that is Avengers: Infinity War.  A bit of a "Hey, here is something to know how it feels to be a little down, so you can get ready and accept that Thanos is going to show up and kill some people you love very soon at the theaters!"

Say what you will about her motives, but since using her speed with those metal arms causing immeasurable pain, Yo-Yo went to extra mile to put down Ruby!  I'm guessing it was 51% "Maybe this will save the world" and 49% "Time for some sweet, sweet revenge!", although that could easily be flipped.  Either way, I have a feeling it did not stop the end of the world and, if anything, will play a part in what is to come.  Because as every time-traveling show as taught me, there is nothing sweeter then self fulfilling prophecies!

Again, I love how once their lives are threatened, Fitz and Simmons' "We're invincible!" act suddenly goes right out the window.

I would find it hilarious if Daisy's conclusion about the "mutiny" ends up being "Hey, maybe this time I should lock up Fitz, Simmons, AND Yo-Yo!"

Daisy and Melinda kicking ass together then bring back good memories.

At least Talbot only got iced and was prevented from doing anything too bad (yep, on this show, kidnapping a kid briefly is a mild offense), but I can only imagine how this is going to effect him going forward.

It is strange that the show is trying to make me feel bad for Hale and Ruby, since they're pretty one-note as far as villains go.  And it ending with Hale preparing to tell the Confederacy/Peter Mensah where SHIELD is hiding, isn't that big of a moment to end the episode.

The best part about Deke's newfound obsession with Daisy is how much Coulson and Mack clearly just want him to fail.  After the lemons stunt fails, they'll probably tell him to listen to The Lonely Island/Justin Timberlake's "Dick in a Box", to really impress her!  

[Lobsel Vith]

4 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I don't hate Yo-Yo, but her actions were entirely her own. Fitz and Simmons were forced to do what they did by Ruby with threats of death and dismemberment. I think that was quite plainly shown in the episode. Not the same situation at all.

Fitz and Simmons were responsible for giving Ruby the power that put Elena in the situation where she felt that killing Ruby was a serious option (aside from her own desire for revenge, she does genuinely think that Ruby was the Destroyer of Worlds). You can say you understand why they took that action, but they are ultimately responsible for giving in to Ruby and bestowing her with the power that lead Elena to think that Ruby had become the Destroyer of Worlds (my personal issue with the scene has to do with how Fitz acted towards the crew and Daisy when it came to the crisis of the rift, since it's clear now his priority wasn't the town or the world but his wife).

Therefore, I have issue with some of the comments I've read on twitter and in places like reddit where people put all the blame on Elena's shoulders. And I really don't think that Daisy could have handled Ruby for the long-term; she was seriously messed up and had powers that were beyond her control, along with two people vying for control (something that is driving Creel into a type of madness).

4 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I wonder why there would be conflicts? Mack/Yoyo, Coulson/May, FitzSimmons - I love them all. I liked Daisy and Lincoln too, and Bobbie and Hunter. 

There have been conflicts before this over how little Coulson and May were getting (from the people who shipped them) because they feel that Fitz and Simmons are getting all the story, and it's bled into other communities as well (reddit tends to be a haven for Ward, Deke, and Fitz fans so not so much there).

9 hours ago, TVSpectator said:

Well, I am now confused because, on one hand, you mentioned that they openly admit the risks but one the other hand you're saying that they weren't aware of the risks? I would say that neither wanted to be the ones that set things in motion but they kind of did with the whole, "we broke Fitz out of prison so we can stop the apocalypse but we are still invincible because we are destined to have a daughter....." kind of deal. I mean IF they did break the machine and Fitz just refused to fix it because again, it's the whole, "we are invincible because we are destined to have a daughter not yet born.... " (okay granted this was mostly Simmons)  then they won't need to worry about dying nor fixing the machine. Also, they are SHIELD agents and SHIELD is designed to protect the world/humanity as a whole so they are right now acting pretty shitty and selfish, in my opinion.  Then again, these characters never really made right choices in the series. In earlier seasons I got the impression that Simmons was more or less the type of person that would be more willing to sacrifice herself for the greater good and Fitz being the one that would pick the selfish option (which would lead to Simmons being alive) but this season they both have been very selfish, reckless, and careless. 

No, I meant that it isn't as if they weren't aware of the risks. Typo on my part.

[Froippi]

1 hour ago, Lobsel Vith said:

Fitz and Simmons were responsible for giving Ruby the power that put Elena in the situation where she felt that killing Ruby was a serious option (aside from her own desire for revenge, she does genuinely think that Ruby was the Destroyer of Worlds). You can say you understand why they took that action, but they are ultimately responsible for giving in to Ruby and bestowing her with the power that lead Elena to think that Ruby had become the Destroyer of Worlds (my personal issue with the scene has to do with how Fitz acted towards the crew and Daisy when it came to the crisis of the rift, since it's clear now his priority wasn't the town or the world but his wife).

Therefore, I have issue with some of the comments I've read on twitter and in places like reddit where people put all the blame on Elena's shoulders. And I really don't think that Daisy could have handled Ruby for the long-term; she was seriously messed up and had powers that were beyond her control, along with two people vying for control (something that is driving Creel into a type of madness).

There have been conflicts before this over how little Coulson and May were getting (from the people who shipped them) because they feel that Fitz and Simmons are getting all the story, and it's bled into other communities as well (reddit tends to be a haven for Ward, Deke, and Fitz fans so not so much there).

No, I meant that it isn't as if they weren't aware of the risks. Typo on my part.

Yea when I made my comment for Fitz it was about saving the world but I did not expect this later on and the Invincible 3 have all had bad actions now

 

Am I the only one getting Evil vibes from Robin 

Edited April 22, 2018 by Froippi

[jhlipton]

6 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

It is strange that the show is trying to make me feel bad for Hale and Ruby

It didn't feel sorry for Hale, and certainly not for Ruby.  Dove Cameron never gave her any real emotion, so for me it just like switching off a robot.  And Hale has done some ghastly things, including killing and attempting to kill a bunch of people.  Yo-yo should have taken her out, too.

Edited April 22, 2018 by jhlipton

[TVSpectator]

4 hours ago, Lobsel Vith said:

There have been conflicts before this over how little Coulson and May were getting (from the people who shipped them) because they feel that Fitz and Simmons are getting all the story, and it's bled into other communities as well (reddit tends to be a haven for Ward, Deke, and Fitz fans so not so much there).

No, I meant that it isn't as if they weren't aware of the risks. Typo on my part.

1

Reddit loves Fitz and Daisy though and I have seen people on Reddit saying that May should die. Honestly, I understand what you are saying here but after 4,722 Hours was done people were complaining that Simmons was getting shafted (in favor of Fitz) in her own story (you know like why didn't she do research on Will, or even go back to the alien planet herself, etc....) but the ships are strong with this show and honestly, I would say that it destroyed this show as well. When you have just shippers and fan fiction come to life (i.e. Coulson's team is part of a prophecy, they are yet again going to save the world unbeknownst to the Avengers Coulson/May declearing their love for each other, Fitz/Simmons hooking up, Simmons wainting to leave Will behind, Deke liking Daisy, Yo-Yo/Mack hooking up Hunter showing up randomly to save Fitz, Ghost Rider showing up randomly at the end of Season 4, etc....) but at the same time there were shippers there saying that Simmons should just bend over (okay, more like to give him head but there was a lot of people on Reddit saying that Simmons owes Fitz for rescuing her and that she should hook up with him because of it) for Fitz and a few months after that well, they got hooked up, etc....  Honestly, the community on Reddit is just a circle jerk (at best) where people just ship everyone. I would say that it's not a good place to have a discussion nor to have an opposing opinion (like mentioned how you don't like Fitz and Simmons together or that Daisy isn't really that great of a character). In my opinion, it's probably just best to ignore everything on Reddit. Although, it's hard to do since I feel like this is where the show responds to the most. 

Also, thanks for answering my question. 

 

3 hours ago, Froippi said:

Yea when I made my comment for Fitz it was about saving the world but I did not expect this later on and the Invincible 3 have all had bad actions now

 

Am I the only one getting Evil vibes from Robin 

 

I am not getting evil vibes from Robin, 

 

As with the Invincible 3, I really do kind of hate them. Fitz and Simmons clearly fixed the machine when they didn't need to and it leads to this. So I feel like they are the ones more likely than not responsible for this mess. 

9 hours ago, Gothish520 said:

I don't hate Yo-Yo, but her actions were entirely her own. Fitz and Simmons were forced to do what they did by Ruby with threats of death and dismemberment. I think that was quite plainly shown in the episode. Not the same situation at all.

Simmons can clearly refuse to do it since she feels that they were invincible and won't die. Why the hell won't she bring that up to Ruby and Baby Von Strucker, even as a gloat to Ruby?

I have to agree once Ruby got the Gravitrioum, Yo-Yo did the right thing, even though she was partially motivated by revenge. Although, this could be a 12 Monkeys thing where they all will witness the end of the world and will have a hand in it. Maybe this is why Deke's mother never bothered to talk about her parents?

Edited April 22, 2018 by TVSpectator

[Froippi]

I think the confiderancy would have have gone after shield without Hale she just escalated the situation 

[Ceindreadh]

13 hours ago, jhlipton said:

Yo-yo should have taken Hale out, too.  She's just as much of a murderous psycho as her daughter.

Yes, I was thinking that Hale was going to kill Yo-yo.  And now that her daughter is gone she’s going to be even more dangerous. 

I’m okay with Yo-yo killing Ruby, if for no other reason than it pissed off Daisy. 

[Froippi]

Not taking Hale out is a huge mistake 

[Froippi]

Also add the fact that Even though Robin is a seer I feel like she is hiding something on purpose whether it be she is the real destroyer of worlds or something else but she just gives off that werid vibe that is uncomfortable 

[Raja]

3 hours ago, Froippi said:

I think the confiderancy would have have gone after shield without Hale she just escalated the situation 

I am thinking just like only a religious sect in Hydra knew about Hive that similarly since Hydra controlled the transporter they didn't have a choice of of who was available to talk to

[TVSpectator]

2 hours ago, Froippi said:

Also add the fact that Even though Robin is a seer I feel like she is hiding something on purpose whether it be she is the real destroyer of worlds or something else but she just gives off that werid vibe that is uncomfortable 

Maybe she is but right now she is only a child (and a very young one at it. She has to be no more than 2 1/2 to 3 years old as of now) so her being evil and/or holding back something is a bit off, IMO.  Young children, in my opinion, really don't hate people the way adults do (they can hold grudges but they do soon forget about them and it's not in the same way adults would hold a grudge. Hell, Robin can barely form memories at this stage in her life) so unless someone who is older than her telling her to not tell someone would be the only way possible. 

[Raja]

2 minutes ago, TVSpectator said:

Maybe she is but right now she is only a child (and a very young one at it. She has to be no more than 2 1/2 to 3 years old as of now) so her being evil and/or holding back something is a bit off, IMO.  Young children, in my opinion, really don't hate people the way adults do (they can hold grudges but they do soon forget about them and it's not in the same way adults would hold a grudge. Hell, Robin can barely form memories at this stage in her life) so unless someone who is older than her telling her to not tell someone would be the only way possible. 

True, but then she is an Inhuman who went through terrigenisis and now has the science defying abilities.

[TVSpectator]

3 hours ago, Raja said:

True, but then she is an Inhuman who went through terrigenisis and now has the science defying abilities.

Yeah, but she is still a 2/3-year-old girl. I doubt that she has superhuman intelligence, a la Star Trek or something?

[tessaray]

I thought Robin was around 7 or 8.  IMDB says the actress was born in 2009, so I was close. 

[Pepper the Cat]

Can someone recap the final scene for me? My PVR cut out just as Hale was talking  to the aliens. She said “shield” and that is where my recording stopped.

 

thanks

[CaptainTightpants]

Robin is definitely 7 or 8. She is listed as "7 year old Robin" in one of the earlier episodes. 

I don't get an evil vibe off of her. I think she is just weird because she sees the entire timestream simultaneously. 

[TVSpectator]

34 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I thought Robin was around 7 or 8.  IMDB says the actress was born in 2009, so I was close. 

Robin was an infant in Season 3, right? I mean didn't we literally see her as her mother held her in her arms while she told Daisy that Charles couldn't hold their newborn daughter because of his Inhuman powers. We only are like 2 or 3 years past that date and this show seems (for the most part) follows real-world time. So they are only like 2-3 years apart from Season 3, unless the present means like being sent to 2024/2025 or something?

Edited April 23, 2018 by TVSpectator

[CaptainTightpants]

30 minutes ago, Pepper the Cat said:

Can someone recap the final scene for me? My PVR cut out just as Hale was talking  to the aliens. She said “shield” and that is where my recording stopped.

 

thanks

Hale tells the alien overlords that SHIELD has the gravitonium, and won't give it up willingly. 

So presumably she is setting SHIELD up to get murdered by Peter Mensah.

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, TVSpectator said:

Robin was an infant in Season 3, right? I mean didn't we literally see her as her mother held her in her arms while she told Daisy that Charles couldn't hold their newborn daughter because of his Inhuman powers. We only are like 2 or 3 years past that date and this show seems (for the most part) follows real-world time. So they are only like 2-3 years apart from Season 3, unless the present means like being sent to 2024 or something?

Robin was less than two years old in season 3, yeah. They definitely seemed to age her up because she should have been about 4 this season. I imagine they wanted a slightly older actress to portray Robin, so instead of trying to feed lines to a 3 year old, they chose a 7 year old (one that also allowed her sister to portray a pre-teen Robin). Sometimes, shows do age up the characters, even if it doesn't make much sense. I don't really blame them for doing this, only because they seemed to have a set idea on how to use Robin and using a 4 year old was probably going to be harder. 

[TVSpectator]

2 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Robin was less than two years old in season 3, yeah. They definitely seemed to age her up because she should have been about 4 this season. I imagine they wanted a slightly older actress to portray Robin, so instead of trying to feed lines to a 3 year old, they chose a 7 year old (one that also allowed her sister to portray a pre-teen Robin). Sometimes, shows do age up the characters, even if it doesn't make much sense. I don't really blame them for doing this, only because they seemed to have a set idea on how to use Robin and using a 4 year old was probably going to be harder. 

I could swear they said she was a newborn baby (and not a toddler) because of the way Charles was saying he couldn't hold her because it was making her upset. 

Edited April 23, 2018 by TVSpectator

[CaptainTightpants]

7 minutes ago, TVSpectator said:

Robin was an infant in Season 3, right? I mean didn't we literally see her as her mother held her in her arms while she told Daisy that Charles couldn't hold their newborn daughter because of his Inhuman powers. We only are like 2 or 3 years past that date and this show seems (for the most part) follows real-world time. So they are only like 2-3 years apart from Season 3, unless the present means like being sent to 2024/2025 or something?

I find the whole timeline hard to follow (even with out the time travel). I thought Daisy was still in her mid-twenties but apparently she is 30 now. 

[TVSpectator]

2 minutes ago, CaptainTightpants said:

I find the whole timeline hard to follow (even with out the time travel). I thought Daisy was still in her mid-twenties but apparently she is 30 now. 

In Season 2 Cal specifically stated what year she was born in and he said 1988. So, yeah, she would be 30 this coming July. Also, according to the MCU wiki ( wanted to look up Robin's age and I think it said she was supposed to be like 18 months old during Spacetime BUT that would put her in her young toddler years and not infant years) characters like Fitz and Simmons are listed to be like 30 going on 31, and Deke is supposed to be 24, and Coulson is like 54. 

Edited April 23, 2018 by TVSpectator

[CaptainTightpants]

1 minute ago, TVSpectator said:

I could swear they said she was a newborn baby (and not a toddler) because of the way Charles was saying he couldn't hold her because it was making her upset. 

It has been a long while since I've seen the episode. But I thought that was the reason Charles left his family, which had happened a year or two before Daisy found him.

[TVSpectator]

3 minutes ago, CaptainTightpants said:

It has been a long while since I've seen the episode. But I thought that was the reason Charles left his family, which had happened a year or two before Daisy found him.

I thought that the Outbreak started only 6 months from that point on because Simmons was sucked up in that Monolith for 6 months and it was the same day as when Skye-Daisy pushed that Quinjet full of crystal into the sea. Then you have the flashforward of "3 months later", in Bouncing Back, and a return to the present- which only put things, IMO, no more than 6-7 months after the start of the Outbreak (not to mentioned that Lincoln asked Fitz "how is Simmons doing" which to me implies that it was really close to Maveth as well. And in the earlier season 3 you only had people going, "well in the past 6 months" for reference). So, you have a time frame of only 6-7 months to work from, IMO. 

Edited April 23, 2018 by TVSpectator

[Enigma X]

53 minutes ago, tessaray said:

I thought Robin was around 7 or 8.  IMDB says the actress was born in 2009, so I was close. 

Tell me something. So did I. I am thinking that is a big three-year old if the posters are correct. 

[CaptainTightpants]

5 minutes ago, TVSpectator said:

I thought that the Outbreak started only 6 months from that point on because Simmons was sucked up in that Monolith for 6 months and it was the same day as when Skye-Daisy pushed that Quinjet full of crystal into the sea. Then you have the flashforward of "3 months later", in Bouncing Back, and a return to the present- which only put things, IMO, no more than 6-7 months after the start of the Outbreak (not to mentioned that Lincoln asked Fitz "how is Simmons doing" which to me implies that it was really close to Maveth as well. And in the earlier season 3 you only had people going, "well in the past 6 months" for reference). So, you have a time frame of only 6-7 months to work from, IMO. 

I guess it is "magical timeline" in that case. Because the actress is about 3 times older than that. 

And I can see why they did that from a writing perspective. You can't have Talbot holding a toddler at gunpoint. And they can barely talk at that age so it would be really hard to give her any lines. 

[TVSpectator]

59 minutes ago, CaptainTightpants said:

I guess it is "magical timeline" in that case. Because the actress is about 3 times older than that. 

And I can see why they did that from a writing perspective. You can't have Talbot holding a toddler at gunpoint. And they can barely talk at that age so it would be really hard to give her any lines. 

I know shows do this a lot but honestly, Robin isn't that old, but whatever also Talbot holding a gun to 7-8 years isn't that much better, IMO, either. Just can't win with holding guns to kids, you know. Hell, the comic book writers always made Deadpool (one of the most kill a happy good guy character in the entire Marvel comics) to not want to kill kids because you have to have at least some characters with principals and have them stick with it. That is why people like the MCU Daredevil- he has principals that he just doesn't wave on.  I get that Talbot is brainwashed but still, that isn't any much better)  Whatever, I will just chalk this up to crappy show design and stick with it then, but I get it. If this was actually following any real-world timeline Robin would've been only like 3 or maybe 4 (still you can at least direct kids at that age but you will have to really have the patience. Just speak to any preschool teacher ). 

Edited April 23, 2018 by TVSpectator

[CTrent29]

A woman who even isn't 30 years old yet and only had less than five years experience as a SHIELD agent, is suddenly the right person to become the new SHIELD director?  I've lost my respect for this show.  I don't care anymore.  I don't care if Daisy was a lot younger when she became SHIELD's director in the comics.  It's a stupid and implausible story arc.  It's like facing all of the bad writing I had to endure from the MCU movies between "Ant-Man" and "Black Panther".  You know, when this show first began, I used to ignore the complaints that Skye aka Daisy Johnson aka Quake was the show's Mary Sue.  I know realize they were right and I was wrong.  

 

I've lost any enjoyment I was having for this show.

[TVSpectator]

5 hours ago, CTrent29 said:

A woman who even isn't 30 years old yet and only had less than five years experience as a SHIELD agent, is suddenly the right person to become the new SHIELD director?  I've lost my respect for this show.  I don't care anymore.  I don't care if Daisy was a lot younger when she became SHIELD's director in the comics.  It's a stupid and implausible story arc.  It's like facing all of the bad writing I had to endure from the MCU movies between "Ant-Man" and "Black Panther".  You know, when this show first began, I used to ignore the complaints that Skye aka Daisy Johnson aka Quake was the show's Mary Sue.  I know realize they were right and I was wrong.  

 

I've lost any enjoyment I was having for this show.

I would say that the show became fanservice and only fanserviceable to the shippers' wish fulfillment and fanfiction as well. 

Edited April 24, 2018 by TVSpectator

[CooperTV]

Daisy going all "Poor Ruby, she's just a misguided kid" after Ruby cut off Elena's arms and beat up FitzSimmons is the most contrived writing ever on the face of this Earth. I mean, I didn't expect nothing less from Daisy who is a giant hypocrite and said she will never forgive Fitz for torturing her. But yeah, poor murderous Ruby indeed!

This show turned so bad this season, it's kind of staggering, especially after the last season's near perfection.

Edited April 24, 2018 by CooperTV

[shrewd.buddha]

14 hours ago, CTrent29 said:

A woman who even isn't 30 years old yet and only had less than five years experience as a SHIELD agent, is suddenly the right person to become the new SHIELD director? 

Daisy being appointed director by Coulson is somewhat the tip of the iceberg of implausibility. Coulson is like Marlon Brando in Apocalypse Now - but in an underground bunker instead of a jungle. Coulson's sense of authority is all in his head.  Coulson and AoS are fugitives, not sanctioned by the government and have no chain of authority. General Hale, despite being a Hydra mole, is a legitimate government official. She could give their location to the U.S. government to have them arrested, never mind turning them over to the aliens.
Then  Deathlok (sp?) shows up for one episode, and afterwards tells Coulon he has to leave. Why? Does Deathlok answer to some other SHIELD authority? 
And  where do the these other red-shirt SHIELD agents keep popping up from? 

Edited April 24, 2018 by shrewd.buddha

[Raja]

35 minutes ago, shrewd.buddha said:

Daisy being appointed director by Coulson is somewhat the tip of the iceberg of implausibility. Coulson is like Marlon Brando in Apocalypse Now - but in an underground bunker instead of a jungle. Coulson's sense of authority is all in his head.  Coulson and AoS are fugitives, not sanctioned by the government and have no chain of authority. General Hale, despite being a Hydra mole, is a legitimate government official. She could give their location to the U.S. government to have them arrested, never mind turning them over to the aliens.
Then  Deathlok (sp?) shows up for one episode, and afterwards tells Coulon he has to leave. Why? Does Deathlok answer to some other SHIELD authority? 
And  where do the these other red-shirt SHIELD agents keep popping up from? 

 

Deathlok flew the first batch in. They are the remaining vigilantes who accept Coulson as their leader and did not abandon S.H.I.E.L.D, for sanctioned agencies after the Hydra emergence  like Sharon Carter joining the CIA or go the private sector like Maria Hill joining Stark/The Avengers. Their only legal authority is in people like General Talbot are willing to let them run free sort of like criminal confidential informants are.

 

A few would also remain after the SHIELD reemergence under Director Mace and they then remained as vigilantes.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Raja
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