For The People - General Discussion

[TV Anonymous]

So the episode ended with a feel good story that Knox needed Mr. Garcia as a witness as Knox rescinded the plea deal agreement with the defendant. But what about the defendant? The assistant U.S. Attorney reneged on a plea deal made on good faith for reason not related to the defendant? How was that fair?

[preeya]

S02:E03    Minimum Continuing Legal Education

Seth becomes committed to taking an immune international diplomat to trial so he can get out of general crime and onto a more senior unit. Sandra works on a kidnapping case and is convinced the kidnapping was an accident. Meanwhile, Jay is certain that taking a different route to work will determine how successful he will be in the courtroom.

[UNOSEZ]

Well Allison got to speak more... And pairing Sandra with Ted seems like ita made her much more bearable... Oliver is a bit of a sadsack so its hard to root for him.. Tho I did laff at the dream he had... But ima need more Leonard and Kate.. Even of the show doesn't put em back together as a couple or whatever the banter those two had was fun

[tennisgurl]

All the lawyers being totally convinced that their routines and superstitions will affect their success in court, while Allison is just baffled, was hilarious, and seems like something thats probably based on reality. "We already have the federal government against us. We dont need the universe against us too."

[greekmom]

Finally saw this episode last night.  So I am gobsmacked that the ambassador has total immunity. In essence, he can just go out in the middle of the street and start killing with no repercussions from the American government and probably next to none in his own country.

Still loving Kate Littlejohn. 

[Janie430]

On 3/18/2019 at 1:13 PM, TV Anonymous said:

So the episode ended with a feel good story that Knox needed Mr. Garcia as a witness as Knox rescinded the plea deal agreement with the defendant. But what about the defendant? The assistant U.S. Attorney reneged on a plea deal made on good faith for reason not related to the defendant? How was that fair?

Did they forget the sixth amendment right to a speedy trial as well?

[txhorns79]

10 hours ago, greekmom said:

Finally saw this episode last night.  So I am gobsmacked that the ambassador has total immunity. In essence, he can just go out in the middle of the street and start killing with no repercussions from the American government and probably next to none in his own country.

There probably would be serious repercussions for both the person and his country if a diplomat started randomly murdering citizens of the host country.  He may not be subject to arrest, but there are plenty of other ways a host country can make its displeasure known.  The storyline in the episode was a little strange.  If the whole idea from State was that they would not allow the diplomat to be charged, why did they allow Roger and Seth go to the Embassy to argue for having the immunity waived?   

[preeya]

S02.E04:   The Vast, Immovable Object

Summary

The team in the public defender's office takes on the case of a young man accused of strangling a woman to death and are determined to prove him innocent. Meanwhile, Tina and Sandra go head-to-head after a man is arrested while transporting a body part through the airport. Elsewhere, Seth and Leonard grow closer after they are tasked with speaking to a conference of an unusually young group of future lawyers.

Edited March 29, 2019 by preeya

[tennisgurl]

The body smuggling story was kind of funny, which was helpful because the other story was just super depressing. Poor guy will have his whole life ruined because one cop didnt want to do his job well and based his whole investigation around "He seems weird" and thats it. 

[preeya]

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

The body smuggling story was kind of funny, which was helpful because the other story was just super depressing. Poor guy will have his whole life ruined because one cop didnt want to do his job well and based his whole investigation around "He seems weird" and thats it. 

IMHO, law enforcement has too much leeway in what they can say or do when questioning a suspect. In this case, it was tantamount to torture. 

[JasmineFlower]

Though heartbreaking, I'm kinda glad they did a guilty verdict. It was much more realistic, not necessarily for this case where the police pushed for a specific suspect with no evidence and seemed to investigate nothing and they didn't give us a background to suggest he was otherwise a suspicious guy, but in general, weak cases regularly wind up with convictions.

Did I miss Hope trying to get the confession suppressed through procedural rules with the judge? It seemed all she did was poke holes into the police's case in front of the jury, but never tried to get the confession and any mention of it thrown out.

Also, maybe, again I wasn't paying attention long enough, but she seemed to gloss over the harsh conditions of the confession with the jury - the length, the lack of food, minimal water, etc. And went instead with you got the wrong guy because we said so, not because we have proof of it, but we have enough of a suggestion.

Don't get me wrong, it was plenty in theory to get him off of the charge, but this is how people end up in jail everyday. The reasonable doubt barrier gets lowered substantially when it shouldn't by juries and they are very willing to convict despite holes in a prosecution's case.

Nate Torrence is great and happy to see him breathing a comedic tone into the show. Wouldn't mind it on a much more regular basis. And I liked Sandra and Kate being cordial and then downright friendly by the end, if only for a brief moment in time.

[preeya]

5 minutes ago, JasmineFlower said:

And I liked Sandra and Kate being cordial and then downright friendly by the end, if only for a brief moment in time. 

Yes, and almost human.

[clyo22]

I want Jill to be victim of a crime just so that she will understand that the prosecutors aren't monsters. I don't understand that a reasonable mind wouldn't see that the judiciairy needs both sides. I don't want her to suffer but her holier than thou attitude is so annoying. As an adult and a lawyer she should be able to see the purpose of the prosecutors.

I was disappointed that they didn't show us how the public defendants tried to get the confession thrown out. It was downright torture what police did to the guy. I know life is unfair and they are many innocent people in prison but I have a hard time to believe that the jury would find this guy guilty.

[childeroland]

Could that guy get off on appeal?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Britt Robertson discusses S2 of For the People

[JasmineFlower]

9 hours ago, childeroland said:

Could that guy get off on appeal?

Yes, rather unlikely since appeal success rates are very low, but yes he could technically get off on appeal. It's a verdict not a plea, so an appeal is in play and one is always filed in a case like this. His chances of a successful appeal would skyrocket if anyone bothered to test the alternate suspect's anything against the crime scene evidence. Or if that cop was exposed publicly for a unjustly pursuing specific suspects without enough evidence, all his related cases would come into question.

So, if you're wondering if we haven't seen the last of this guy? Maybe.

[TV Diva Queen]

They should have saved money on production and just used the confession footage from the Netflix doc about Avery and his nephew. Jeez, they even had the same exact set up in the interrogation room. 

[ursula]

On 3/29/2019 at 8:12 PM, JasmineFlower said:

Did I miss Hope trying to get the confession suppressed through procedural rules with the judge? It seemed all she did was poke holes into the police's case in front of the jury, but never tried to get the confession and any mention of it thrown out.

Also, maybe, again I wasn't paying attention long enough, but she seemed to gloss over the harsh conditions of the confession with the jury - the length, the lack of food, minimal water, etc. And went instead with you got the wrong guy because we said so, not because we have proof of it, but we have enough of a suggestion.

You are right. I also noticed that she seemed to hinge her summary more on ... emotions, for lack of a better word than technical/hard legalese. 

[Princess Sparkle]

On 3/29/2019 at 7:12 PM, JasmineFlower said:

 Did I miss Hope trying to get the confession suppressed through procedural rules with the judge? It seemed all she did was poke holes into the police's case in front of the jury, but never tried to get the confession and any mention of it thrown out.

It was blink and you miss it - Hope didn't do it, we find out through dialogue that Allison and Jay wrote a brief and presented it, but couldn't get it suppressed. 

[Samwise979]

I didn't know this was back on! Have to catch up. Just about 10 min into S.2 E.1 and all I have to say for now is, hello Marcel Gerard!!

[TV Diva Queen]

This show is as corny AF, but damn it...I really like it. And how have I never seen that investigator before?  Wow is he hot!

[hoosiermom]

This was a wonderful feel good episode which I needed tonight. I was shocked to see how old Dabney Coleman looked. Was that makeup or really him? Either way, it was great to see him.

[TV Diva Queen]

4 hours ago, hoosiermom said:

This was a wonderful feel good episode which I needed tonight. I was shocked to see how old Dabney Coleman looked. Was that makeup or really him? Either way, it was great to see him.

Right?  It took me a minute to figure him out. I have always got him and Mac (that’s what I call him, can’t think of his full name, lol) confused. Then I remembered Mac is on This is Us sometimes so then I was like “whoa, that’s Dabney”

[tennisgurl]

Thank God we got a feel good ending for our cases this week after last weeks super depressing ending. Yeah it was bittersweet, because those kids still lost years of their lives, but at least they got justice, and the judge wont be able to do that to any kids again. I assume this is based on the judge in Florida who went to jail after being convicted in the "Kids for Cash" scandal, who even specifically sentenced a kid to a super heavy sentence for making fun of his principle online, like one of the kids here did. What a despicable piece of garbage that guy is. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Ciavarella

The ending with everyone at the party was nice, and it was interesting to see them mixing character interactions up more. 

[hoosiermom]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

Thank God we got a feel good ending for our cases this week after last weeks super depressing ending. Yeah it was bittersweet, because those kids still lost years of their lives, but at least they got justice, and the judge wont be able to do that to any kids again. I assume this is based on the judge in Florida who went to jail after being convicted in the "Kids for Cash" scandal, who even specifically sentenced a kid to a super heavy sentence for making fun of his principle online, like one of the kids here did. What a despicable piece of garbage that guy is. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Ciavarella

The ending with everyone at the party was nice, and it was interesting to see them mixing character interactions up more. 

I believe you are right about the show being based on this. Thank you for the article. Very interesting.

[preeya]

On 3/31/2019 at 3:02 AM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

?

[preeya]

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Thank God we got a feel good ending for our cases this week after last weeks super depressing ending. Yeah it was bittersweet, because those kids still lost years of their lives, but at least they got justice, and the judge wont be able to do that to any kids again. I assume this is based on the judge in Florida who went to jail after being convicted in the "Kids for Cash" scandal, who even specifically sentenced a kid to a super heavy sentence for making fun of his principle online, like one of the kids here did. What a despicable piece of garbage that guy is. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Ciavarella

The ending with everyone at the party was nice, and it was interesting to see them mixing character interactions up more. 

4

This was one of their best episodes to date. The friendly interactions between foes was a nice reversal of the usual combative situations they encounter.

[2727]

I wanted to see the juvenile officer (or whoever) prosecuted for telling children they didn't need an attorney. What was he/she getting out of that if not money?

I suppose having access to Gramercy Park might be viewed by a jury as something weird that rich people do, but the place isn't that nice -- small two acres of pathways and foliage. Nothing a person would drive across Manhattan to use.

3 hours ago, preeya said:

The friendly interactions between foes was a nice reversal of the usual combative situations they encounter.

I like that both side are being presented pretty evenly -- the prosecutors aren't just heartless hardliners and the defense aren't just trying to get guilty clients off by any means possible.

[Kaiju Ballet]

I loved this episode, and all the friendships that have been springing up. The bit about Jay's parents fawning over Seth was hysterical, and perfectly in line with what we know about Jay and Seth's characters. I was howling at all the food containers that Seth had in the office. I'd be prolonging my stay there too! And not gonna lie, I got a little teary at the housewarming, and seeing how Littlejohn's one of of the gang. She's definitely my favorite.

And Ted has been amazing in terms of what he's brought to the show. He's had aawesome chemistry with every actor he's worked with, and one of the reasons this season FTP has been something I look forward to watching. Plus this:

22 hours ago, TV Diva Queen said:

And how have I never seen that investigator before?  Wow is he hot!

Right? :-)

[preeya]

On 4/4/2019 at 8:25 PM, TV Diva Queen said:

And how have I never seen that investigator before?  Wow is he hot!

If you are referring to Ted, he's been on for a few week's now. His first appearance was a scene joking that his name is Ted and that he replaced another guy named Ted.

[TV Diva Queen]

2 hours ago, preeya said:

If you are referring to Ted, he's been on for a few week's now. His first appearance was a scene joking that his name is Ted and that he replaced another guy named Ted.

Ive seen him on the show, I meant that I’ve never see him before, in other things. 

[nilyank]

8 hours ago, TV Diva Queen said:

Ive seen him on the show, I meant that I’ve never see him before, in other things. 

He was Marcel on the CW's The Originals and was my favorite character.

[TVForever]

16 hours ago, nilyank said:

He was Marcel on the CW's The Originals and was my favorite character.

He was also on Younger.

[jalady]

Aside from the wiki article linked above, the judge case was also done on Season 3, episode 1 of Leverage.  But that case involved adult inmates and the Leverage team inflicted their own brand of "justice". 😜

[UNOSEZ]

Loved the episode.. As Leonard is my fave character I was happy.. And as we have a lot in common I understood some of the things he was talking about with Kate.  Main diff being we did talk about race in my immediate family.. Tho I have cousins and such who try to get all post-racial and think that I "harp" on about racial stuff too much.. Not surprisingly they are also more conservative leaning.... Hearing Leonard was a republican did sting my liberal heart.. But I grew up around some black ( and other minority)  repubs like that.. Majority of em did come from some money so that rang true... I do wish they would roped Allison into the "not black enough" debate as I get the feeling she may have heard it in her childhood as well... Kate was a rock for Leonard this episode and she was battling hard at the end to stick to her guns and not go with him.. But she did... The jailhouse lawyer was cool.. Wouldn't mind seeing Randy again... Ted and Sandra were blah... Mainly because Sandra is blah.. Its too bad they saddled ted with Sandra.. Cuz I think he and Allison would do well... But TV rarely puts two of us together on a show anymore.. Plus ted was just shot down ( maybe?)  By Sandra so it would look skeevy

[Samwise979]

I'm sure Ted and Sandra will happen eventually. I was calling that since the second episode. 

[tennisgurl]

I liked that episode a lot, so much good stuff to chew on. Glad that Knox got a win (even if he felt conflicted about it) and that he laid hard into that lawyer to the stars guy. Yeah, such a representative of the common folk, screwing people out of their money in favor of big corporations and letting them get away with killing black children out of negligence. And leaving his dying wife! Wow, real classy there! And after he publicly called Knox an Uncle Tom!  It can be kind of hard to get a read on Knox, as he is rather closed off by nature, so it was nice to see some of his issues and what makes him tick. The feeling of feeling like he has no where to belong to (being a black man from a rich family) and that no one sees him as one "of them" felt like something very real for a lot of people. Kate was really great, being supportive, letting him express his own thoughts, and assuring him that he has a place where he belongs, but without going over the top with it, which is probably just what he needs. 

Jay in the jail was a fun story, if still a bit sad. I liked the in house criminal lawyer, I hope that he shows up again. "Mostly guards and their families." "Guards?" "Everyone is entitled to an attorney." I kind of like the pattern that they have one more dramatic story, that usually touches on some social issue or problem in the legal system, and another story with the other office as a lighter funnier story. 

[TV Anonymous]

On 4/7/2019 at 3:05 PM, jalady said:

Aside from the wiki article linked above, the judge case was also done on Season 3, episode 1 of Leverage.  But that case involved adult inmates and the Leverage team inflicted their own brand of "justice". 😜

CMIIW, but I think Law & Order did it too. I do not remember whether it was the original series or SVU. Tom Skerritt was the judge.

Speaking of this episode, Oliver did not have tenant's insurance? I found it rather hard to believe that for something not his fault he needed to pay for his accommodation himself.

[TV Diva Queen]

9 hours ago, TV Anonymous said:

CMIIW, but I think Law & Order did it too. I do not remember whether it was the original series or SVU. Tom Skerritt was the judge.

Speaking of this episode, Oliver did not have tenant's insurance? I found it rather hard to believe that for something not his fault he needed to pay for his accommodation himself.

They must have done it twice. The one I remember is early SVU. The judge was Swootsie something or other, from Sisters. Stabler played the dad of a bad kid and offered up the bribe. I love the episode. 

[preeya]

3 hours ago, TV Diva Queen said:

They must have done it twice. The one I remember is early SVU. The judge was Swootsie something or other, from Sisters. Stabler played the dad of a bad kid and offered up the bribe. I love the episode. 

Yes. Swoozie Kurtz played Judge Hilda Marsden, (SVU S10.E20) in May 2009. She would target teenagers who had committed minor offenses (urinating in public, public lewdness, etc.), turn the offense into a felony sex offense, and ship them off to a privately run facility. The case was said to have mirrored a real case in Pennsylvania in 2007.

[JasmineFlower]

I liked many parts of this episode, but also had a major problem. Leonard thinks he's earned everything he's gotten on his own? Is he suddenly not a Senator's son who was prematurely handed the Solicitor General position in Texas or are we supposed to forget that happened? Even if I could believe that he believed a lot of what he's gotten he worked for and earned, he knew very well that his mom put him up for that Texas position and questioned that it was too early. That was handed to him and he knew it, that was very far from earned. Not to mention, he floated his mother in the first season often to try to get noticed in the office to get better cases. Clearly not the first time he's used her name in that manner. I get what they were trying to do with him, I'm glad that they had him tell a bit more about himself. But it's like they wanted me to forget a good deal of what we have already seen and heard Knox do in the past.

Not that it was all contradictory, but yeah, that part rang really hollow and felt like the basis for a lot of his ire so it put a dent in what was one of the best scene's in the episode (didn't tarnish Michael Beach's delivery at all though).

[JasmineFlower]

Also, meant to say this a few episodes ago, it's definitely starting to feel like Ted to a great extent and Celia to a lesser one were brought in to lessen the roles of Jasmine and Seth. I'm okay with that in large part, as I think that the former couple are two of the weak links on the show, and certainly when in their official capacity, but I do like the friendship between Jasmine and Sandra a great deal. But Ted has definitely been getting considerably more screen time than Jasmine this season and Celia feels like she's getting more meaty cases and greater legal screen time than Seth, who seems like he's being used more for mild comic relief than as an attorney. If this beats the odds and gets a third season, I'd wonder if they'd make the cut.

[Kaiju Ballet]

On 4/11/2019 at 11:24 PM, UNOSEZ said:

I do wish they would roped Allison into the "not black enough" debate as I get the feeling she may have heard it in her childhood as well

I thought that was a missed opportunity as well, but overall I loved this episode. Leonard and Kate are AFAIC the most developed characters.  I love their friendship.

The jailhouse lawyer and Sandra/Ted boxing were distractions from a really powerful storyline. The actor playing Leonard really did a good job, and Michael Beach's characterisation reminded me a lot of Denny Crane, lol.

I really like the addition of Ted, but right now he's such eye candy that I'm not even annoyed at how he's verging on being a Mary Sue character. Still don't like Sandra's character, but I'll put up with it as they insist on having Ted interact with her the most.

I'm also hoping for a season 3. This show's been getting better and better, with the latest episode the best one for me yet.

[UNOSEZ]

10 hours ago, JasmineFlower said:

Also, meant to say this a few episodes ago, it's definitely starting to feel like Ted to a great extent and Celia to a lesser one were brought in to lessen the roles of Jasmine and Seth. I'm okay with that in large part, as I think that the former couple are two of the weak links on the show, and certainly when in their official capacity, but I do like the friendship between Jasmine and Sandra a great deal. But Ted has definitely been getting considerably more screen time than Jasmine this season and Celia feels like she's getting more meaty cases and greater legal screen time than Seth, who seems like he's being used more for mild comic relief than as an attorney. If this beats the odds and gets a third season, I'd wonder if they'd make the cut.

For clarification you mean Jasmine S.  Browns character?  On the show Allison... And Celia being the Female ADA that went opposite Seth...  Also I agree... Allison hasn't been used much.. I posted earlier I thought it was a mistake not to have her be a part of this debate as I guess she's dealt with challenges to her "blackness " from some places inside and outside the community... 

[JasmineFlower]

12 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

For clarification you mean Jasmine S.  Browns character?  On the show Allison... And Celia being the Female ADA that went opposite Seth...  Also I agree... Allison hasn't been used much.. I posted earlier I thought it was a mistake not to have her be a part of this debate as I guess she's dealt with challenges to her "blackness " from some places inside and outside the community... 

Yes, I meant Jasmine that plays Allison. Bad sign when I can't remember her name a season in. And yes, that's a good point that she could've offered something to this discussion. Although she also comes from a good deal of privilege, so maybe they wanted to leave her out for that reason? Not sure. I know her and Knox have had very little interaction, but it seems like there were probably creative ways to have their storylines intersect at least somewhat in this episode. Even if it was even just a reaction to the story in the paper to sympathize and a run-in at the courthouse.

[UNOSEZ]

9 hours ago, JasmineFlower said:

Yes, I meant Jasmine that plays Allison. Bad sign when I can't remember her name a season in. And yes, that's a good point that she could've offered something to this discussion. Although she also comes from a good deal of privilege, so maybe they wanted to leave her out for that reason? Not sure. I know her and Knox have had very little interaction, but it seems like there were probably creative ways to have their storylines intersect at least somewhat in this episode. Even if it was even just a reaction to the story in the paper to sympathize and a run-in at the courthouse.

They shared a scene or two earlier this year which seemed to say they had a mutual friend.. Maybe another well off black friend who also ran in the society circles they did... So it seems like she may also come from his world.. Or one quite similar.. And tho I doubt she's a republican on the show she still may have had some insight... Slightly different with her being a woman.. But a perspective they could shown... 

[Marci]

The problem I had with Sandra’s client-attorney privilege thing is why didn’t she let him talk when the judge asked him to describe what happened? Sandra kept stopping him because she thought he might admit to something.  Let him say it, and then she would have been off the hook. I am not a lawyer, would it have been her duty to stop him from talking?

[Janie430]

Would Sandra have felt any different if the cop had died while she was dithering around?  Sandra is seriously psychologically damaged.  The speech at the end was horrible.  "I'm the one who's always loyal".  Well what if you shouldn't be? What if one of your friends is the Unabomber?  What if you have to make the call his brother did?

Sandra should be asking herself why she's trying to martyr herself.  Is she trying to make herself the perfect lawyer so that she doesn't have to be a person who has to balance life and work and fail like the rest of us, so she almost doesn't have to be human?  Or is she trying to be the most loyal, perfect friend/lawyer ever so no one ever leaves her again?  I could see either, but she seriously is lacking in perspective on anything.

[2727]

34 minutes ago, Janie430 said:

Sandra is seriously psychologically damaged.  The speech at the end was horrible. 

Instead of the victim being "probably dead" when he was dumped, I wanted him to have died during the time Sandra wasted dithering around like the chump she is. Live with that on your conscience, ya nitwit.

[tennisgurl]

Not a great look for Sandra this week, not at all. Yeah attorney/client privilege is really important,but if its between a client going to jail, or a man dying? How is that even a question?! Especially for Sandra, who is all about being miss "lawyer who cares about people" so much? Guess she didnt care about that poor park ranger though! It would have served her right if she found out he died because of her dithering around about what to do, instead of doing what any sane person would do, and try to find this guy and get him help. And as for caring about her client? It seemed like he wanted to confess anyway, and is clearly mentally unwell and is a danger to himself and others. Ideally, he could get help for his sickness while incarcerated, and there wouldn't be as much of a threat for him to kill anyone else. So it seems like this is the best outcome for everyone!I mean, theres a difference between being loyal, and sitting on your ass while people die and calling yourself a hero for it. 

Jay and Seth fighting/bonding over the money was a nice relief from Sandra's dithering at least. The bow tie jokes were funny (that way you can make it to your barbershop quartet) and I love that after all that drama, including the start of the dramatic emotional music, Roger...really didnt care.