S06.E03: Urban Transport Planning

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

In the aftermath of a disastrous operation, Philip and Elizabeth clash about how to handle things with Paige. Stan struggles to contain the growing risks of Sophia and Gennadi’s fraying relationship. Written by Tracey Scott Wilson; Directed by Dan Attias.

[skippylou]

Surprise, Surprise, Surprise!  The FBI hasn't gotten anything useful from the airport rest room x-rays.

[jjj]

I have seen some painful things on this show, but in the top five is going to be Philip as carnival barker/QVC host at 2:00 AM, frenetically pushing his apathetic office staff to "SUCCEED!". It just hurt.  

1 hour ago, skippylou said:

Surprise, Surprise, Surprise!  The FBI hasn't gotten anything useful from the airport rest room x-rays.

"It's been three years.  How many times do you think he can fake a shit in an airport crapper?"  StanLogic.  Apparently this was their only trick; I thought then tended to mix up these mission methods. Seriously, three years of that? 

Edited April 12, 2018 by jjj

[crgirl412]

Yay!!! Elizabeth said Glasnost and Perestroika!!

[CaliCheeseSucks]

This is where a significant season bridging time jump hurts a show.

We are meant to assume that over three years, Philip, able to concentrate on actually running the travel agency - instead of running around doing everything *but* running the travel agency - turned it into a flush money machine.

But now, out of the blue, and in the wake of one client failing to repeat business? The situation is so dire, he doesn't have the monies for Henry's tuition.

Much in the same way, we're meant to believe Paige has been under her mother's tutelage during that time (even though the second generation illegal plan wasn't supposed to involve Elizabeth's kind of work). Paige is taken to a late night meeting in an isolated area, and acts/reacts like, well, we might have expected her at the start of this journey three years ago. 

And Stan's wife waits three years to make her sketchy (to suspicious viewers, who've suspected her of being a mole/spy from the outset), "I wish I did something that made me proud to be an American - say, can I join the FBI?" play. Uh, okay.

The showrunners wanted to get to 1987, come hell or high water, regardless of whether or not the characters had earned any growth in that unshown period. It reminds me a lot of Downton Abbey, where they quite often took time leaps while the characters behaved as if they were frozen in time after each jump.

To reiterate my feeling from last week's thread, this is where the imbalance of the season five vs. six episode order shows most clearly. We treaded endless amounts of waterwheat last season, and now there's no time left for believable atmosphere and character building during the period of history that clearly makes most sense for the endgame. How much time was lost with Philip working Kimmie, which resulted in very little (if any) return on investment; meanwhile, Elizabeth's Air Force asset ends up dead, so she quickly switches gears to Plan B, complete with a jazzy new wig and fake name, and the surely much more complex operation of running a phony security audit on warehouse workers that would have taken some significant time to set up/roll-out.

It's disappointing, as I care about the fates of Oleg, Stan, and Phillip. I've lost interest in Paige's development with the cringeworthy turn into the teenage spy curve. (Full disclosure: I've never cared for Elizabeth and just hope her story ends with her getting her just deserts.) I had high hopes when Brandon Dirden was promoted to regular cast that Aderholt would get more to do but nope. I'm not sure why they bothered to cast a recognizable face (Peter Jacobson) as Gaad's replacement, when that role has gone nowhere.

But hey, Margo Martindale got to give a Russian cooking lesson tonight. Time well spent.

[JFParnell]

33 minutes ago, jjj said:

I have seen some painful things on this show, but in the top five is going to be Philip as carnival barker/QVC host at 2:00 AM, frenetically pushing his apathetic office staff to "SUCCEED!". It just hurt

That was just sad to witness. Philip has done some groveling tonight. Henry better not get too attached to that school.

[Primetimer]

Philip's reaction to Elizabeth's fury about Paige's, uh, normal human frailties leads Elizabeth to wonder whether there might be some ways to solve her problems other than barking or murdering her way out of them. Plus: is Dupont Circle Travel circling the drain?!

View the full article

[AimingforYoko]

41 minutes ago, jjj said:

I have seen some painful things on this show, but in the top five is going to be Philip as carnival barker/QVC host at 2:00 AM, frenetically pushing his apathetic office staff to "SUCCEED!"

Yeah, here's a better way to motivate your staff:

[Tetraneutron]

2 minutes ago, CaliCheeseSucks said:

Much in the same way, we're meant to believe Paige has been under her mother's tutelage during that time (even though the second generation illegal plan wasn't supposed to involve Elizabeth's kind of work). Paige is taken to a late night meeting in an isolated area, and acts/reacts like, well, we might have expected her at the start of this journey three years ago. 

 

But hey, Margo Martindale got to give a Russian cooking lesson tonight. Time well spent.

They FINALLY  addressed that in the show. That Paige has to be familiar with the stuff Elizabeth does and be OK with it. Even if she won't be doing that herself. Although you would think if the job is to get Paige secured in a high-ranking state department job, you would think they'd want her to study and make friends at Georgetown. Not hanging out with her mother and an old lady learning how to make Russian peasant food (which is a lot like American peasant food of a few generation ago). 

I'm not sure where they're going with Philip and his business. Are they trying to make a point about how he/the audience shouldn't idealize America too much, that the American dream is hard and a lot of entrepreneurs fail and end up with nothing? Is it some kind of thematic thing? 

This episode was mostly place setting. Nothing happened, but pieces were moved for the coming weeks. I can't make myself care about Stan or his girlfriend. And I reiterate my one complaint about this otherwise excellent show: YOU CAN'T JUST GO AROUND MURDERING PEOPLE, ESPECIALLY NOT HIGH-RANKING, CONNECTED WHITE MEN. THE POLICE WILL NOT JUST SHRUG AND SAY, "EH, SUICIDE." I'm glad Paige asked about that. Finally. A General AND a senior-level security person? /it should be a concern. 

[jjj]

Oh, Stan is so, so close.  He could smell Philip's cologne on Oleg if he just took a sniff. 

Edited April 12, 2018 by jjj

[chocolatine]

The opening scene of Elizabeth washing the general's blood off her face had a Lady Macbeth quality about it - "out, damned spot!"

1 hour ago, jjj said:

I have seen some painful things on this show, but in the top five is going to be Philip as carnival barker/QVC host at 2:00 AM, frenetically pushing his apathetic office staff to "SUCCEED!". It just hurt. 

 

Poor Philip, he thought leaving the KGB and living like a regular American would make him happy, but he's still miserable. And he didn't even get to enjoy the zharkoye properly because he'd already filled up on kung pao chicken and lo mein.

I laughed at Elizabeth's dismay that the there might be a Pizza Hut opening in Moscow. I hope she lives to see 1990, when Moscow got not only a Pizza Hut, but also a McDonald's. I still remember how big of a deal it was at the time, and I wasn't even living in Moscow.

Was the ponytailed man who Elizabeth was talking to in the cemetery the batyushka who did P&E's vow renewal last year? I forgot that he's also KGB.

Edited April 12, 2018 by chocolatine

[Sader87]

Wouldn't Henry be a better potential asset to the Soviets down the line....ingratiating himself in American power circles etc by going to an elite prep school than Paige is? Just sayin'

[Pickles]

How does Elizabeth dispose of that guy's body? He is a big guy. So random that Stan's wife suddenly wants to work for the FBI. What is her story?? I just don't buy the whole storyline of Paige being a spy or even wanting to be a spy. 

[jjj]

11 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Was the ponytailed man who Elizabeth was talking to in the cemetery the batyushka who did P&E's vow renewal last year? I forgot that he's also KGB.

 

That must be the same person, or we are meant to believe he is the same person.

In that last shot, I got a whiff of the end of Casablanca; the knowing look, then walking off into the dark.  "Oleg, I think could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship."

5 minutes ago, Pickles said:

So random that Stan's wife suddenly wants to work for the FBI. What is her story??

She will be the big reveal, I swear!  Or I will be so disappointed!

Edited April 12, 2018 by jjj

[JFParnell]

28 minutes ago, CaliCheeseSucks said:

I had high hopes when Brandon Dirden was promoted to regular cast that Aderholt would get more to do but nope

Yeah, his role seems to be nudging Stan to do stuff and then shuffling off to do ... whatever it is Aderholt does when he's not nudging Stan.

[Erin9]

I almost yelled at the TV at the end: of course we end with Philip and Oleg meeting again. I want to see what happens next....now. Lol 

I don’t quite get the point of Philip’s business difficulties. Long run-or very short run more likely- I doubt it’ll matter. If it’s to bring Henry back home- why send him away to begin with? 

I have to hand it to Elizabeth- she did finally tell Paige directly about at least one of her mistakes. With the General’s situation anyway. And acknowledged she didn’t handle the situation well either. Philip noting that the General was an idealist summed up in one word everything that Elizabeth did wrong with handling him. 

Nice to see Philip get to have a conversation with Paige finally. Even a small one. 

Elizabeth’s effort with the Russian food for Philip was nice. At least he tried some, stuffed and all. It is rather sad that they can’t have Russian leftovers in their fridge. 

Elizabeth really associates any change, especially any that the US applauds, as bad. That’s sad. Life is about change. Things do change.  Everything western doesn’t have to be bad. Truth is- as they both pointed out-neither one of them have a clue what the average Russian wants because neither have gone home, but I think Philip has the right idea. Some change and openness can be positive. Doesn’t mean Russians will become Americans. And I think he’s right to assumepeople back home want it . 

Oleg seems pretty mad at Stan. Of course- had Stan never made the tape and turned it in, Oleg never would have been in trouble. Regardless of how he- rather unrealistically imo-pulled off damage control. But- it was nice to see them remember who brought them together to begin with. 

Stan was right to end the op that had yielded nothing. (I can’t image risking my life for years for absolutely nothing. How awful.) Sofia was a fool to talk to her new boyfriend. It was rather amusing that she said Soviets are good at keeping secrets. Yeah- clearly. 

What is up with Renee? That was....bizarre. If she’s a spy, this was one poorly planned mission. Or she’s desperate. 

Edited April 12, 2018 by Erin9

[dubbel zout]

1 minute ago, Pickles said:

So random that Stan's wife suddenly wants to work for the FBI.

I had to laugh at that. She might not have known the exact age maximum for new agents, but she's no spring chicken. Did she really think Stan could get her past that? Maybe if she were a few months away from it, but she's obviously years too old.

Could she be some sort of IA for the FBI or the feds or something? Stan told Oleg he tried to protect him in Moscow, and I don't think that was just to let Oleg know.

I also laughed when Elizabeth snapped that she had been talking to Paige and she was yelling at Paige everything she did wrong. I'm kind of sorry we didn't see more of Elizabeth reaming out Paige. That was a huge mistake, even if it was understandable.

[shura]

I laughed at Stan being shocked that Sophia told Bogdan she works for the FBI. Dude, that's what she does! That is exactly how you got Gennady, remember?

2 minutes ago, Pickles said:

So random that Stan's wife suddenly wants to work for the FBI. What is her story??

Oh, she's got to be Russian, with this utter incomprehension that rules and procedures matter. She probably thinks that Stan can arrange for her to skip the academy training (which, surprisingly, is only 20 weeks long - who knew?) and get her assigned to the same unit he works in. Like, tomorrow.

[JFParnell]

4 minutes ago, jjj said:

In that last shot, I got a whiff of the end of Casablanca; the knowing look, then walking off into the dark.  "Oleg, I think could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship."

I thought that too! lol. Nevermind that it was "Grrrrr!! Gotta wait until next week to see their next meet." For me Oleg's story, and whatever evolves from his collaboration with Philip, is the most compelling thing going right now.

[Erin9]

8 minutes ago, jjj said:

That must be the same person, or we are meant to believe he is the same person.

In that last shot, I got a whiff of the end of Casablanca; the knowing look, then walking off into the dark.  "Oleg, I think could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship."

She will be the big reveal, I swear!  Or I will be so disappointed!

I think he is the same guy that married him. Nice to see Elizabeth chatting about their sad separate lives. 

That was a total Casablanca moment! I hope it is a beautiful friendship. 7 episodes left. I’d like to see these two, who are so much alike, talk. 

[sistermagpie]

I thought Henry was on scholarship?

So it looks like the travel agency is in trouble--2 weeks after we learn it's booming. (Although it may actually be more of a cash flow problem, which I only mostly understand because it was an effective story on Mad Men. The story was actually interesting to me on Mad Men.) This is upsetting only because omg it's boring and cringeworthy to watch. I have how many episodes left to spend with Philip and you're forcing me to watch him be Michael Scott? He's officially only interesting in scenes here he's poking around Elizabeth's work. And he's still going to EST/The Forum? Please don't make me sit through more of that too. It's been like 5 years, I think Philip should be able to speak about emotion without always referring to EST.

Clearly they actually are committed to a "capitalism is hard" storyline for Philip and unless that's going to drive him back to his spywork very quickly (even if only for the money) I am not looking forward to it. I'm guessing he'll be telling Henry he might have to drop out of the school, which will force him back home for the finale, and make me wonder why they gave Henry the full scholarship thing last season. What, did Henry also struggle with school the way Philip is now? Did he lose his scholarship? Are they both finding this stuff harder than they thought? Is the whole family? WILL THIS BRING ALL FOUR OF THEM BACK TOGETHER??

Sophia blabbing to her buddy is not only an obvious plot point to get her and Gennady killed, but I guess it's also paralleling Philip and Elizabeth talking to other people. Or Elizabeth talking to other people. Philip doesn't get those friends because he quit. Although he didn't really get them before either so it works out. I wonder if all KGB officers have it in their training to be there for Elizabeth if she wants to talk. I do like that joke with Sophia being all, "You know us Soviets, we keep secrets. It's what we do." While being the worst secret-keeper the show has ever seen.

Love how Oleg uses fake trouble in his marriage to distract Stan, even bringing Nina into it. Oleg is the man. Philip, get off your Michael Scott Paper ass already. Or use your spy skills to just rob something and then get back in the game.

Spoiler

There is a future episode titled Rafifi, after all!

Elizabeth's still way too optimistic about everything Paige, imo. Seems like her yelling at her now is the same as her covering her before. Both times she seems mostly motivated by shielding Paige from the bad parts of the job--she didn't want Paige to see her with the guy she shot in the face. I hope there's something to Elizabeth's line that anyone else who had done with Paige did would have been finished because yeah, nepotism. Doesn't always get you the best candidates. (But that comes in handy when you need them to buy your story that the guy you met in the woods shot himself in the face with two gunshots.) Especially when they get endless chances that other people don't get. And Paige still doesn't seem to really get it. I mean, she gets it that she did wrong, but she isn't exactly shook by how much she put everyone in danger. It's just her and Mom again. Mom's speaking to her sternly. That's what's wrong. And she didn't even mention her breaking her cover as well as leaving her position.

Also it's actually not very nice at all that Elizabeth loves her little Russian parties with Claudia and Paige and then gets hit in the face by how much she hates America because her kids are American no matter how many cheerful stories Paige hears about how that stew is a cheerful reminder of how to get through famines and wars in the sour cream-less years. They really ought to have Philip come over and whip up some of that black moldy sawdust bread. He can explain how every prisoner gets the one handful because during a famine you don't have anything you put in that stew. Paige might be up for the whole "America--pfui!" stuff now but eventually she'd get annoyed. Even Aleksei eventually admitted he loved his home. That really ought to bite her in the ass because she's basically telling Paige to replace a large part of her identity with second-hand memories.

Interesting how Philip's sad little hopeful suggestion of coming together just gets shot down--Elizabeth wants to be in Russia in 1960, dammit! She doesn't believe the Washington Post with their lies about black market blue jeans and Russian kids listening to rock n' roll. They're just as disgusted by everything American as she is! And then he goes to see Oleg.

Elizabeth seemed to sum up the whole Paige/Elizabeth spying plot by talking about how it was okay if random people got shot in the face as long as she wasn't afraid. Because that's basically what all this is about for her for Paige. (And for Paige too, it seems, given the storyline in season 5.)

Pastor Tim's been replaced by Father Andre--LOL.

So is Renee's sudden desire to be an FBI agent at 40-something just a comment on the Jennings also not being interested in each others' day or something that should ping me as wrong? Or just something that will unexpectedly lead somewhere unexpected. Although I guess Philip's interested in Elizabeth's day. She just doesn't care about his. Also if Henry's calling it's for Philip and nobody else even says hi. They just pretend they're not there.

I've never been so happy to see Philip in a mustache in my life.

These days when Elizabeth meets somebody I just assume he'll be her next victim. Here's a big, young guy. She'll have no trouble killing him with her tiny bare hands, I'm sure. There's been so many killings in the show it's hard to tell whether we're supposed to be seeing things going badly for Elizabeth. Like she did say that she didn't have time to work the General, but does anyone care that she obviously murdered a General in the park? (Obviously to those not Paige, that is?) Are we supposed to see her getting desperate and sloppy or is this just the fault of how difficult this situation is? Yup, there we go. She just had to literally jump up off the floor a little bit to get her arm around his neck. Even in the panic of his death thoes the guy had no instinct to even to twist his body in any inconvenient way.

Oleg and Philip meeting in the park was the sexiest thing in the episode. Good thing Oleg didn't see Philip at the travel agency earlier. He would have sent Arkady an abort signal double quick.

43 minutes ago, CaliCheeseSucks said:

Much in the same way, we're meant to believe Paige has been under her mother's tutelage during that time (even though the second generation illegal plan wasn't supposed to involve Elizabeth's kind of work). Paige is taken to a late night meeting in an isolated area, and acts/reacts like, well, we might have expected her at the start of this journey three years ago. 

Yes, we know she's advanced because she's wearing hats and glasses and being on stake outs, but everything she's saying and doing could have happened last season. It's not like we're told this is her first time in the field by far, but she still seems like she's just on one long Take-Your-Daughter-To-Work-Day.

 

19 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

Was the ponytailed man who Elizabeth was talking to in the cemetery the batyushka who did P&E's vow renewal last year? I forgot that he's also KGB.

Yup, that was him.

6 minutes ago, Erin9 said:

I don’t quite get the point of Philip’s business difficulties. Long run-or very short run more likely- I doubt it’ll matter. If it’s to bring Henry back home- why send him away to begin with? 

Exactly!

6 minutes ago, Erin9 said:

Truth is- as they both pointed out-neither one of them have a clue what the average Russian wants because neither have gone home, but I think Philip has the right idea. Some change and openness can be positive. Doesn’t mean Russians will become Americans. 

And Philip has been reading about events over there, which are not all lies even if they're in the Washington Post. Sure the West's view of Gorbachev isn't the Russian one, but things are changing and it's coming from within. It's not an American plot.

5 minutes ago, dubbel zout said:

I also laughed when Elizabeth snapped that she had been talking to Paige and she was yelling at Paige everything she did wrong. I'm kind of sorry we didn't see more of Elizabeth reaming out Paige. That was a huge mistake, even if it was understandable.

And if Philip was dealing with another agent who'd done it he would have kicked them to the curb. He certainly wouldn't be encouraging them to feel feelings about it. I like how his answer to Paige's question about how he dealt with things was basically just...I sucked it up, buttercup.

4 minutes ago, JFParnell said:

I thought that too! lol. Nevermind that it was "Grrrrr!! Gotta wait until next week to see their next meet." For me Oleg's story, and whatever evolves from his collaboration with Philip, is the most compelling thing going right now.

Me to. It's pretty much the show for me right now.

Quote

That was a total Casablanca moment! I hope it is a beautiful friendship. 7 episodes left. I’d like to see these two, who are so much alike, talk. 

Yeah, Elizabeth's good at making people her confidantes. These two so need to talk.

Edited April 12, 2018 by sistermagpie

[jjj]

This episode had to be set around October 10 or 11; the Tigers still have a shot at beating the Twins, but those playoffs ended on October 12.  And is Elizabeth going to conduct espionage at the World Series viewing party that at least one Russian will attend?  This is about a week after last week's episode -- so far, they are in "real time", going from week to week in 1987. 

[Dev F]

44 minutes ago, CaliCheeseSucks said:

We are meant to assume that over three years, Philip, able to concentrate on actually running the travel agency - instead of running around doing everything *but* running the travel agency - turned it into a flush money machine.

But now, out of the blue, and in the wake of one client failing to repeat business? The situation is so dire, he doesn't have the monies for Henry's tuition.

I actually thought they made a better case for that this week than I was expecting. Last week I was so convinced a "the agency is running out of money!" storyline would make no sense that I figured Phil's double-take at the ATM was just him stalling so he could deliberately run into his old client. But it makes sense, I think, now that they've explained that their fancy, upgraded agency is struggling because Philip sunk a bunch of money into the upgrade.

I believe part of the issue is that travel agencies -- not just the agents, but the agencies themselves -- work on commission. Forgive me if I'm getting this wrong; it's based on my vague memory of what a friend who was a travel agent once told me and some very quick Google searches. But if I'm understanding things correctly, the agencies are paid by the hotels and whatnot for the business that gets directed their way, which means the agencies don't get paid until their clients are actually on their trips. Since people tend to book big, expensive vacations way ahead of time, that means cash flow can be a huge problem; if Philip blew a lot of money on expanding the business, he wouldn't see any return on that investment for months and months.

Edited April 12, 2018 by Dev F

[jjj]

Philip, if you want to know the moment your marriage stopped having any chance of recovering, it was the moment you declined to eat the stew that Elizabeth carried back in a drippy container in her good handbag and presented to you so shyly and proudly.  Then she looked at you with such hope in her eyes when you came over and took ONE BITE.  It was not really stew, Philip, it was a plastic container of the last chance at love. 

[Erin9]

15 minutes ago, JFParnell said:

I thought that too! lol. Nevermind that it was "Grrrrr!! Gotta wait until next week to see their next meet." For me Oleg's story, and whatever evolves from his collaboration with Philip, is the most compelling thing going right now.

Yep. It’s the most compelling thing going for me too. Not just Oleg’s story, but Philip’s too. I hope the show makes this wait worth it. 

[AntiBeeSpray]

45 minutes ago, jjj said:

Oh, Stan is so, so close.  He could smell Philip's cologne on Oleg if he just took a sniff. 

 

Yep. It's like he's Wile E. Coyote at this point and Philip is the Roadrunner.

 

5 minutes ago, jjj said:

Philip, if you want to know the moment your marriage stopped having any chance of recovering, it was the moment you declined to eat the stew that Elizabeth carried back in a drippy container in her good handbag and presented to you so shyly and proudly.  Then she looked at you with such hope in her eyes when you came over and took ONE BITE.  It was not really stew, Philip, it was a plastic container of the last chance at love. 

Yep. But yet he did eat a full meal earlier...

That said, I agree. It's so sad  :(.

Edited April 12, 2018 by AntiBeeSpray

[kikaha]

The most interesting part of the episode for me was when Philip and Elizabeth talked about Perestroika.  They couldn't see things more differently.  That made me wonder, again, how the two of them can stay together.  Philip wants to pursue the American dream; Elizabeth wants to bury it. 

[sistermagpie]

9 minutes ago, jjj said:

Philip, if you want to know the moment your marriage stopped having any chance of recovering, it was the moment you declined to eat the stew that Elizabeth carried back in a drippy container in her good handbag and presented to you so shyly and proudly.  Then she looked at you with such hope in her eyes when you came over and took ONE BITE.  It was not really stew, Philip, it was a plastic container of the last chance at love. 

Very true--but I think she would have been okay with the one bite (dude was already stuffed) if he hadn't then failed to join her I Hate America and Gorbachev and Perestroika club. That was maybe the moment Philip considered that there were other things more important than whatever small drippy plastic container of love Elizabeth could manage to offer.

Of course, if he was really handling this right he'd have agreed with her so she'd tell him all about the coup. So he still loves her.

Quote

The most interesting part of the episode for me was when Philip and Elizabeth talked about Perestroika.  They couldn't see things more differently.  That made me wonder, again, how the two of them can stay together.  Philip wants to pursue the American dream; Elizabeth wants to bury it. 

I disagree. Their conflict isn't about The American Dream, it's about the dream of the end of the Cold War. The two countries being able to come together openly.

Edited April 12, 2018 by sistermagpie

[Erin9]

1 minute ago, sistermagpie said:

Very true--but I think she would have been okay with the one bite (dude was already stuffed) if he hadn't then failed to join her I Hate America and Gorbachev and Perestroika club. That was maybe the moment Philip considered that there were other things more important than whatever small drippy plastic container of love Elizabeth could manage to offer.

Of course, if he was really handling this right he'd have agreed with her so she'd tell him all about the coup. So he still loves her.

Would she have believed him though? Philip’s views were pure Philip. Agreeing with her would’ve been weird imo. 

I think Philip showed he was trying when he took a bite, when already stuffed. The bigger problem was he predictably disagreed with her. But it was predictable. 

[TaurusRose]

I bet Paige is wishing she hadn’t been such a snoopy, pain in the ass because she’d be living the life of a normal teenager now like Henry if she hadn’t. Gawd! I can’t stand that girl. I did like Elizabeth chewing her ass though, but that woman is really going off the rails.  The more I see of Elizabeth, the more I think “I’m so tired of this bitch, would she just die already?”

Stan and the “we’re soviets” woman... man, she needs a serious smack down. And her sad sack hubby?  Geez, Team Stan really picked a couple of winners with those two. Claudia is manipulating Elizabeth as well as Paige with all the Russian cooking and movies and music.  

I’m surprised Elizabeth can’t see that, but she’s so far off her game it’s amazing she is functioning at all. If I worked for Phillip, I’d hang myself. I can’t stand bosses like him with their pep talks and school teacher “tell the class how you did...” antics.  Now Stan’s wife wants to be a FBI agent? How the hell are all these illegals getting in the country and close to people in sensitive positions?

And finally, Phillip has decided to meet with Oleg again.  The plot thickens. LOL

[Shriekingeel]

Elizabeth is just seething with rage at the USA at this point, and it comes out in her weekly murders of Americans. 

Phillip declining to eat the stew because he’d filled up on take-out was such a metaphor.

I was on on the fence before but Laurie Holden’s character’s demand to get into the FBI had all the red flags flying. 

[shura]

45 minutes ago, Erin9 said:

Truth is- as they both pointed out-neither one of them have a clue what the average Russian wants because neither have gone home, but I think Philip has the right idea. Some change and openness can be positive. Doesn’t mean Russians will become Americans. And I think he’s right to assume people back home want it . 

 

He is not even claiming anything, really - he is telling her what he is reading in the papers. Elizabeth is the one whose point requires actually having been in contact with people back home. And she throws it in his face that he has not been in Russia in years and doesn't know what he is talking about?

29 minutes ago, jjj said:

Philip, if you want to know the moment your marriage stopped having any chance of recovering, it was the moment you declined to eat the stew that Elizabeth carried back in a drippy container in her good handbag and presented to you so shyly and proudly.  Then she looked at you with such hope in her eyes when you came over and took ONE BITE.  It was not really stew, Philip, it was a plastic container of the last chance at love. 

That was cooked by Claudia. That Elizabeth only chopped the onions for. That's got to be symbolic of something, no?

Edited April 12, 2018 by shura

[ruby24]

I just don't believe that Paige would want to become a Soviet spy. That whole thing is completely absurd. Hasn't Philip talked to her about why he quit? What made her decide she loves the Soviet Union (as it's collapsing)?

I don't buy it. It's stupid. And I wasn't a Paige hater before, because she always seemed incredibly skeptical and wary of her parents activities, but now she's all in? What?

[zibnchy]

Was the show intentionally trying to be funny tonight? I laughed out loud 3 times, at least.

1. Phillip: I told Paige she'd have you to talk to. Elizabeth: What do you think I was doing? (If Paige lives, she is going to need so much therapy.)

2. Elizabeth with ridiculous 80s girl group hair eating an enormous slice of pizza listening intently to that conversation about baseball.

3. Renee and her new dream of being an FBI agent. (I prayed she'd say she wants to work for the CDC.)

Also funny, 3 generations of russian women bonding over a pot of stew. I'm certain Claudia hid the box from the takeout in the bottom of the garbage.

Not funny, Oleg. I swear they are going to kill him and I am going to wail.

The look on Elizabeth's face when she realized she'd have to kill shlubby warehouse guy. "Not again! Can't I get thru one day without having to kill some guy? Is there a car around here I can drop on him?"

[PinkRibbons]

So much second-hand embarrassment during Philip's speech the only way I got through it was with the firm belief that Mathew Rhys screwed up a bunch of takes with that hysterical laugh of his before they got it right. I think he at least had fun during that scene.

Why is it so hard for these people to stress the correct syllable with Russian words? I'm not asking for soft and hard Ls, but jeez, it's not OH-leg, it's o-LEG. (Although what was worse was Ar-KAH-dy being ARK-ady last episode.) It was Golubtsiy that got me this episode. It's gu-loop-TSIY, not gu-LOOP-tsiy.

I've said it since the very beginning -- Elizabeth is stuck in 1960s Russia when everyone was just glad that they were building housing and people didn't have to live in bombed out sheds anymore. You know, an optimistic time in Russia.

Elizabeth's little "I can't stand the America of it all" moment reminded me of a story my father tells -- his first year in America he was quickly employed by an English-speaking company, which wasn't too bad because he had been taking English for years before immigrating. But one week he took off and spent at home with his wife and mother and baby and friends, and when he came back to work on Monday, he said it was like he'd forgotten every word of English he'd ever known. His mind had reset to Russian mode and it took a few days to get back to America in his head.

[Tetraneutron]

6 minutes ago, ruby24 said:

I just don't believe that Paige would want to become a Soviet spy. That whole thing is completely absurd. Hasn't Philip talked to her about why he quit? What made her decide she loves the Soviet Union (as it's collapsing)?

I don't buy it. It's stupid. And I wasn't a Paige hater before, because she always seemed incredibly skeptical and wary of her parents activities, but now she's all in? What?

That's the problem with time jumps. They let the narrative cheat. They're trying to sell it as Paige wants something to believe in + the general leftiness she displayed working at the food pantry + she wants her mother's approval + the entire Soviet spy community is working her pretty hard. Besides, WE know the USSR is collapsing and a lot of people back then HOPED  it was collapsing and Gorbachev was opening it up but it was far from a known fact. 

There's always been this layer of dramatic irony to this show. WE know Philip and Elizabeth are destroying themselves and everyone they care about and it's ultimately for nothing. (Although if Elizabeth survives the show I bet she's pretty happy about how much the Russians own the US President). But they don't know it. They, especially Elizabeth, think this all ends with the communists victorious and they're living the good life in Odessa. 

[Erin9]

Everything that’s wrong with Elizabeth training Paige was summed up when Elizabeth said she couldn’t spend the night in the home she grew up in with her parents because it was a work night. Seriously? 

I did like Philip more or less saying he just dealt with the difficulties of spying.....Not sure Paige really has that ability. 

[NitneLiun]

1 hour ago, jjj said:

Philip, if you want to know the moment your marriage stopped having any chance of recovering, it was the moment you declined to eat the stew that Elizabeth carried back in a drippy container in her good handbag and presented to you so shyly and proudly.  Then she looked at you with such hope in her eyes when you came over and took ONE BITE.  It was not really stew, Philip, it was a plastic container of the last chance at love. 

You just won the internet this week.

[NitneLiun]

45 minutes ago, Tetraneutron said:

(Although if Elizabeth survives the show I bet she's pretty happy about how much the Russians own the US President). 

Oh god.

[jjj]

Why did Stan and the FBI have to offer "asylum" to Sofia and Gennady publicly?  I assumed that "we hear you requested asylum" was a prearranged code for "all is known, come with us or die".  And I know they had to pick up Gennady in the airport.  But why make Sofia's capture so public?  And these days, what kind of shit would an elementary school give to two apparent FBI agents wanting to whisk off a small child?  (Even back in 1987,  just the badges might not have been convincing enough.) 

And there was a tiny, tiny head shake from Sofia's new love interest in the office when the FBI stood there and said "do you want asylum?". 

Edited April 12, 2018 by jjj

[jjj]

We are all hoping for the beginning of a beautiful friendship:

Edited April 12, 2018 by jjj

[tennisgurl]

Elizabeth's lecture to Paige the other day about how the world isnt black and white and is actually grey is seriously hilarious on every level coming from Elizabeth, who has the most black and white thinking of any person this entire show. Almost everyone else can at least somewhat see the grayness of this conflict, and that its more complicated than Team A is Good Always and Team B is Bad Always, to varying degrees, but Elizabeth is just "USSR is good and the US is bad" over and over, even in the face of the complete freaking obvious. Anything bad about the USSR is just American propaganda, and anything American is bad because...West is bad. Its to the point where it almost seems like more of a coping method, like she just cant deal with the idea that she has spent her whole life, has killed people, slept with endless weirdos, suffered mentally and physically, and had to wear SO MANY bad wigs, all for a country that doesn't even exist anymore, and maybe never existed in the way that she has idealized. Because there is no other way that an intelligent person who has lived in the US for most of her life now could be that ridiculously narrow minded. I know its been awhile since shes been at home (Russia in the 60s was certainly a different place than Russia in the 80s) but come on Liz! Maybe she should meet with Oleg, and he can tell her about the groceries with three cans in them, the endless hoops he has to jump through to get one damn thing accomplished, and the fact that they still cant afford proper lighting in the whole freaking country! 

I really just want the show to know something. If Oleg gets killed off, I would scream. A lot. At you. I will find you, and I will yell at you. Really, his story is the best one as of now, and I want to see more of it. But, without shooting. Can you do that for me? Please? I think we`ve known each other long enough that I can ask a favor of you.

[KarenX]

When Paige finally ends up in prison and gets to talk to a counselor, she will finally be free.

Nothing says Mother Country Peasant Food like Claudia’s Crock Pot.

[Umbelina]

2 hours ago, kikaha said:

The most interesting part of the episode for me was when Philip and Elizabeth talked about Perestroika.  They couldn't see things more differently.  That made me wonder, again, how the two of them can stay together.  Philip wants to pursue the American dream; Elizabeth wants to bury it. 

I honestly don't see how they can, but really, I was never in this for the romance.  I do keep saying Philip will die to try to save her, and probably the barnacle Paige as well.  Maybe then Elizabeth can buy a vowel.

2 hours ago, taurusrose said:

 

Stan and the “we’re soviets” woman... man, she needs a serious smack down. And her sad sack hubby?  Geez, Team Stan really picked a couple of winners with those two. Claudia is manipulating Elizabeth as well as Paige with all the Russian cooking and movies and music.  

I’m surprised Elizabeth can’t see that, but she’s so far off her game it’s amazing she is functioning at all. If I worked for Phillip, I’d hang myself. I can’t stand bosses like him with their pep talks and school teacher “tell the class how you did...” antics.  Now Stan’s wife wants to be a FBI agent? How the hell are all these illegals getting in the country and close to people in sensitive positions?

And finally, Phillip has decided to meet with Oleg again.  The plot thickens. LOL

Remember the long boring, and fruitless spy conversions Stan went though last year?  At that point, he would have taken any biters, even if they were undersized and out of season.

Philip is desperate, he's found out the economic systems, whether capitalist or communist, are not a piece of cake. He's obviously overextended with the upgrade of the offices, all the computers, and the increased staff.  Where is "home" for Philip?  When can this guy get a break.  (Hint, I don't think it's going to be on this show, but I would love it if he doesn't die.)

Any Oleg is good show.

I don't care much about Renee anymore, she was introduced on my most hated season, and frankly, speaking as an experienced woman?  At this point, fuck it, and hand me the vibrator, delayed gratification only goes so far.

2 hours ago, Shriekingeel said:

Elizabeth is just seething with rage at the USA at this point, and it comes out in her weekly murders of Americans. 

Phillip declining to eat the stew because he’d filled up on take-out was such a metaphor.

I was on on the fence before but Laurie Holden’s character’s demand to get into the FBI had all the red flags flying. 

It's ridiculous.  Does she have to murder someone every single show?

2 hours ago, ruby24 said:

I just don't believe that Paige would want to become a Soviet spy. That whole thing is completely absurd. Hasn't Philip talked to her about why he quit? What made her decide she loves the Soviet Union (as it's collapsing)?

I don't buy it. It's stupid. And I wasn't a Paige hater before, because she always seemed incredibly skeptical and wary of her parents activities, but now she's all in? What?

I loved that Elizabeth finally told that little wanna-be loser off.  That's all.

2 hours ago, PinkRibbons said:

So much second-hand embarrassment during Philip's speech the only way I got through it was with the firm belief that Mathew Rhys screwed up a bunch of takes with that hysterical laugh of his before they got it right. I think he at least had fun during that scene.

Why is it so hard for these people to stress the correct syllable with Russian words? I'm not asking for soft and hard Ls, but jeez, it's not OH-leg, it's o-LEG. (Although what was worse was Ar-KAH-dy being ARK-ady last episode.) It was Golubtsiy that got me this episode. It's gu-loop-TSIY, not gu-LOOP-tsiy.

I've said it since the very beginning -- Elizabeth is stuck in 1960s Russia when everyone was just glad that they were building housing and people didn't have to live in bombed out sheds anymore. You know, an optimistic time in Russia.

Elizabeth's little "I can't stand the America of it all" moment reminded me of a story my father tells -- his first year in America he was quickly employed by an English-speaking company, which wasn't too bad because he had been taking English for years before immigrating. But one week he took off and spent at home with his wife and mother and baby and friends, and when he came back to work on Monday, he said it was like he'd forgotten every word of English he'd ever known. His mind had reset to Russian mode and it took a few days to get back to America in his head.

I could understand if they stumbled over multiple consonants.  Not bothering to get the syllable stresses correct? Total bullshit. 

Elizabeth has no clue about the USSR, she never did, and she still doesn't.  She was brainwashed, first by mommy, then the KGB.

1 hour ago, jjj said:

Why did Stan and the FBI have to offer "asylum" to Sofia and Gennady publicly?  I assumed that "we hear you requested asylum" was a prearranged code for "all is known, come with us or die".  And I know they had to pick up Gennady in the airport.  But why make Sofia's capture so public?  And these days, what kind of shit would an elementary school give to two apparent FBI agents wanting to whisk off a small child?  (Even back in 1987,  just the badges might not have been convincing enough.) 

And there was a tiny, tiny head shake from Sofia's new love interest in the office when the FBI stood there and said "do you want asylum?". 

 

Probably because they were burned.  Although why the FBI bothers to "save" two dingalings and wouldn't lift a finger for Nina really poses some questions.  Nina would at least have valuable information to share.  These two doofuses have nothing more to offer. 

Edited April 12, 2018 by Umbelina

[Bannon]

I unfortunately was joking when I asked last week if the writers had given Liz a quota of one schlub to be murdered at the end of each episode. Sadly, it appears they have. Lemme see....we have murdered naval security personnel near the Naval Observatory, a murdered Air Force general, pretty obviously dressed up as a suicide, and now a warehouse manager handling classified technology murdered in a hotel room. Good grief, that is lame, and as good as Russell has been on this show, these writers are asking her to be the Golden Gate Bridge of suspending disbelief.

It also still seems pretty strange for Phil to be happily retired from espionage, as his daughter wades in deeper week after week.

Finally, somebody oughta tell Liz that millions of Americans eat and enjoy a stew made with beef, vegetables and herbs, so a Tupperware container of it in the fridge won't tip anybody off.

[Umbelina]

Just now, Bannon said:

I unfortunately was joking when I asked last week if the writers had given Liz a quota of one schlub to be murdered at the end of each episode. Sadly, it appears they have. Lemme see....we have murdered naval security personnel near the Naval Observatory, a murdered Air Force general, pretty obviously dressed up as a suicide, and now a warehouse manager handling classified technology murdered in a hotel room. Good grief, that is lame, and as good as Russell has been on this show, these writers are asking her to be the Golden Gate Bridge of suspending disbelief.

It also still seems pretty strange for Phil to be happily retired from espionage, as his daughter wades in deeper week after week.

Finally, somebody oughta tell Liz that millions of Americans eat and enjoy a stew made with beef, vegetables and herbs, so a Tupperware container of it in the fridge won't tip anybody off.

I never EVER bought that the KGB would let Philip "retire" without being dead, and I still don't.  That's the most unbelievable part of all of this for me, really.  Philip and the Pastor couple?   Would all be dead.  Period.

[jjj]

3 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I never EVER bought that the KGB would let Philip "retire" without being dead, and I still don't.  That's the most unbelievable part of all of this for me, really.  Philip and the Pastor couple?   Would all be dead.  Period.

Yes, that was often the outcome in season one.  

By the way, I think the previouslies had a brief image of Philip and the general (then colonel) from season one, on a bench, which is a nice callback. 

[Bannon]

4 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I never EVER bought that the KGB would let Philip "retire" without being dead, and I still don't.  That's the most unbelievable part of all of this for me, really.  Philip and the Pastor couple?   Would all be dead.  Period.

I don't believe that Phil would allow himself to retire, as Paige was getting more immersed in the life

P

[Umbelina]

Yup, Renee's definitely wearing a ring on the wedding finger.

[Lily H]

If I were Stan, I would have really, really wanted to punch Sophia right in the mouth and wipe that smugness off her face. It would be infuriating to have to deal with such a stupid and stubborn woman. I was hoping they would arrange for her to have an "accident".

Loved the scene with the guy spilling his guts to Elizabeth about security lapses. How very easy it was to find out everything they needed to know. And then he made the fateful mistake of mentioning his girlfriend in Security. So close to getting out of there alive.

Paige is so not cut out for spying. Every time she said "I get it" when Elizabeth was berating her, I thought, "No, I don't really think you do". And I don't think Elizabeth even brought up Paige's worst mistake. Running towards the gunshots was bad enough, but screeching "Mom! Mom!" was beyond stupid and after all this supposed training, you'd think she'd know better.