S05.E14: Charlotte Brontë and a Backhoe

[paulvdb]

Bonnie locks horns with Jill’s "inner strength" coach, Miranda. Also, Christy struggles to bounce back after being rejected from law school.

[AnimeMania]

Look there's Kristin Chenoweth, I hope she returns to "American Gods".

[qtpye]

1 hour ago, AnimeMania said:

Look there's Kristin Chenoweth, I hope she returns to "American Gods".

Only person in the world that can make Anna F look huge.

I am not really happy that Christy is going to spend another year trying to get into law school.  I kind of hoped she would find something else to pursue.

[bobby2018]

Kristin Chenoweth made me laugh so hard and I need a good laugh so badly.  

[SunnyBeBe]

I LOVED this episode.  I've been missing the last few, so, I was so happy to finally catch it.  No mention of Adam. Is he still in the picture?  

Is Chenoweth going to join the show or was that just a guest appearance?  I don't normally like her, but, she was great last night. Good fit, imo.

Once again, this is really one of the few shows that makes me LOL.  

If Christy does get into law school......she won't have time for much of anything else.  However, it could open up the possibility of storylines set at the school, instead of the restaurant. 

Edited March 9, 2018 by SunnyBeBe

[iMonrey]

I was kind of disappointed that Bonnie fell for Miranda's new age crap. And that Marjorie's jealousy was showing over everyone's adoration of Miranda and her energy cleansing. Someone needed to point out that it was just pure bullshit - even Miranda had to admit it when she found Jill passed out drunk. 

[chocolatine]

So everyone's back at the bistro after last week's arc? I wish there'd been a quick explanation, like maybe they decided to splurge on the bistro once a week and go to the cafeteria the rest of the time. Otherwise, what was the point?

It always makes me sad when one of the ladies relapses, and it still bothers me that Jill's weight gain was played for laughs. She's obviously been spiraling since her fostering experience. She needed serious help, not just a weight loss spa with a hokey "inner strength coach." 

[SmithW6079]

30 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I was kind of disappointed that Bonnie fell for Miranda's new age crap. And that Marjorie's jealousy was showing over everyone's adoration of Miranda and her energy cleansing. Someone needed to point out that it was just pure bullshit - even Miranda had to admit it when she found Jill passed out drunk. 

And that the "life coach" charged Christy $500 (when last week they worried about going to a restaurant once a week after their meetings). However, I did agree with Miranda's rejection of the concept of  "powerlessness" that is the foundation of 12 Step programs.

[sugarbaker design]

38 minutes ago, SmithW6079 said:

However, I did agree with Miranda's rejection of the concept of  "powerlessness" that is the foundation of 12 Step programs.

It was easy for Miranda to disagree with it since she's not an alcoholic.

[Blakeston]

It was a little odd that Christy and Bonnie assumed that someone with Kristin Chenoweth's height and frame was a man. I guess someone people assume motorcycle = male.

I liked this episode a lot. I was worried they were going in the direction of "AA is the only real source of help for alcoholics, and listening to anyone else = falling off the wagon." (With Miranda as a lunatic strawman representing anyone who takes issue with AA's ideology.) 

But in the end, I think the only stance the writers took was that trying to drink in moderation isn't really possible for alcoholics. And I can't argue with that.

And I liked that Miranda, for all of her nuttiness, was fairly intuitive.

[MissLucas]

This felt a bit uneven. One moment Miranda was completely over the top with her New Age stuff and the next she was actually getting results - though I guess the later won't be lasting and both Bonnie and Wendy will be back to normal next episode. Nevertheless the cold read on Bonnie was impressive (thanks Leverage) and I thoroughly enjoyed Wendy's new voice.

Marjorie feeling insecure and threatened was odd. She's been a sponsor for 37 years so she must have met with people offering different sometimes even opposite advice. I would like to see an episode that challenges the AA approach with less crazy. I'm not critical of AA but I know that it's not working for everyone and it would be interesting to see the show tackle that. I guess they came close with Octavia Spencer's character.

Sad to see Jill relapse, the character needs a break.

I'm also not too keen on seeing Christy stay in school for another year. 

Edited March 9, 2018 by MissLucas

[qtpye]

3 hours ago, chocolatine said:

So everyone's back at the bistro after last week's arc? I wish there'd been a quick explanation, like maybe they decided to splurge on the bistro once a week and go to the cafeteria the rest of the time. Otherwise, what was the point?

It always makes me sad when one of the ladies relapses, and it still bothers me that Jill's weight gain was played for laughs. She's obviously been spiraling since her fostering experience. She needed serious help, not just a weight loss spa with a hokey "inner strength coach." 

I hate the trope of a thin actress being in a fat suit (sometimes to hide pregnancy) and then she "magically" loses the weight and it is played for laughs. It was don with Monica from Friends, Daphne from Frasier, Betty from Mad Men and now they have tiny Jamie Presley doing it. I appreciate that This is Is actually hired a lovely actress of some size to play the character with weight issues.

2 hours ago, SmithW6079 said:

And that the "life coach" charged Christy $500 (when last week they worried about going to a restaurant once a week after their meetings). However, I did agree with Miranda's rejection of the concept of  "powerlessness" that is the foundation of 12 Step programs.

What was that? I imagine that amount of money would be a good portion of Christy's weekly paycheck and Bonnie was right, she really can not afford to lose that much to New Age BS like their rich friend.

31 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

It was a little odd that Christy and Bonnie assumed that someone with Kristin Chenoweth's height and frame was a man. I guess someone people assume motorcycle = male.

I liked this episode a lot. I was worried they were going in the direction of "AA is the only real source of help for alcoholics, and listening to anyone else = falling off the wagon." (With Miranda as a lunatic strawman representing anyone who takes issue with AA's ideology.) 

But in the end, I think the only stance the writers took was that trying to drink in moderation isn't really possible for alcoholics. And I can't argue with that.

And I liked that Miranda, for all of her nuttiness, was fairly intuitive.

It was a pretty mature statement.  Everyone has to find their own path to recovery.  Also, no way in heck that Kristin Chenoweth looked anything like a man in that tight motorcycle outfit, so the surprise reveal fell a little flat.

[msani19]

I laughed so hard when Bonnie referred to Miranda as the elf on the shelf, it just cracked me up.

I was so sad the Jill fell off the wagon. I can empathize with the idea that if you can eat half a cookie, why not just one drink...sadly that's not how their brains work as addicts.I'm not an alcoholic, but there are times when I say ok I'm only having 2 drinks at this event and end up having 4. Not quite along the same lines but I kinda get it. Who hasn't had the whole darn ice cream container?  

I don't necessarily have an issue with Christy doing the law school thing for another year, what I do have an issue with is her getting consideration from sitting there all day and getting the admissions director a restaurant reservation. That's not how any of this works, and it's frustrating to suggest that all they need to do is just meet you and they would change their minds about admitting you. This is LAW school. I have several lawyer friends (god help me!) and I have a friend who didn't get into the very prestigious law school everyone in the family had gone to for several generations (maybe it rhymes with Hale Law School).No amount of pleading and calling pledging a new library and possible, alleged donations changed that for her. She went somewhere else for law school. I'm just saying that scene irked me, but the show has been playing fast and loose with Christy and law school since it became a storyline. 

Miranda's whole process was nonsense from the get-go, but I think the pay-off for me was the role reversal between Bonnie and Wendy. Even if everything is back to normal next week, I will still enjoy "she's being so mean to me"! 

[LucyEth]

I liked this episode, although I was sad for the Jill character.  I am not a fan of the fat suit and the miraculous quick weight loss either.  Jill thinking she could have one drink and stop reminded me of the Regina character who we never saw again.  They don't do a very good job of blending the storylines.  They either go with Adam/Bonnie Christy and the brother or they go with the women and no mention of the guys.  This is week two where Christy hasn't mentioned Adam's brother or their relationship at all.  

[Irlandesa]

I found Kristin's character interesting and found it believable she'd get results.   I am not a touchy feely person but every once in a while, due to my work, I meet with people who do believe in energy.  And sometimes, when they hug, all the tension drains from my body.  It's weird.  It's not that I believe in energies but there's something about the way they carry themselves and their charisma that always surprises me a little.

I could see Miranda like that.  She was also very intuitive and knew how to coach people to believe in their capacity to achieve.  A lot of the blocks the women face are psychological.  Her skills is in knowing how to encourage them to change that way of thinking.  It's kind of like a personal trainer.  We know we need to exercise but having a trainer gives people encouragement, motivation and structure to actually do it.  She's like a personal coach for the brain.

 

8 hours ago, chocolatine said:

So everyone's back at the bistro after last week's arc? I wish there'd been a quick explanation, like maybe they decided to splurge on the bistro once a week and go to the cafeteria the rest of the time.

I know.  They ended last week there too and I don't recall what they said.

5 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I liked this episode a lot. I was worried they were going in the direction of "AA is the only real source of help for alcoholics, and listening to anyone else = falling off the wagon." (With Miranda as a lunatic strawman representing anyone who takes issue with AA's ideology.) 

But in the end, I think the only stance the writers took was that trying to drink in moderation isn't really possible for alcoholics. And I can't argue with that.

What I also liked about the episode is that they dealt with different addictions and compulsions and how different strategies might be needed for each one.  For instance, cutting out all alcohol is the way alcoholics usually deal with alcoholism.  Cutting out all food, however, is not a practical way to deal with food compulsion/addiction.  One can try to cut out sugar.  Or stop eating potato chips. But people need food to survive and there are so many traps with food, especially if what driving overeating is an emotional/psychological component.  There will always be something on which to gorge.  

For Miranda, and the people she usually deals with, moderation is an excellent lesson and strategy.  It's something Jill needed but it's not uniformly applicable to her alcoholism.

2 hours ago, msani19 said:

I don't necessarily have an issue with Christy doing the law school thing for another year, what I do have an issue with is her getting consideration from sitting there all day and getting the admissions director a restaurant reservation. That's not how any of this works, and it's frustrating to suggest that all they need to do is just meet you and they would change their minds about admitting you. This is LAW school.

I thought it was the admin assistant who needed a reservation that Christy got.  In return, the admin managed to get Christy an audience with the admissions director.  I found what she did believable if she were really on the bubble.   I thought she approached the low tier law school so her competition wasn't ivy league quality.  And she was given clear direction on what she needed to do in order to be accepted. Law was a hot career path for a while but when the glut became more well known, quite a few lower end law schools started to suffer and admissions standards started to fall.  Those schools might be more willing to meet with a Christy to go over her options than a high tier school.

Edited March 10, 2018 by Irlandesa

[Blakeston]

The one thing that seemed unrealistic to me was the admissions officer telling her that she was on the bubble, and almost got in. I don't think they'd divulge where you ended up in the admissions process.

[qtpye]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

The one thing that seemed unrealistic to me was the admissions officer telling her that she was on the bubble, and almost got in. I don't think they'd divulge where you ended up in the admissions process.

Also, can he really promise her a spot in next years class if she brings her LSAT up?

 

16 hours ago, LucyEth said:

I liked this episode, although I was sad for the Jill character.  I am not a fan of the fat suit and the miraculous quick weight loss either.  Jill thinking she could have one drink and stop reminded me of the Regina character who we never saw again.  They don't do a very good job of blending the storylines.  They either go with Adam/Bonnie Christy and the brother or they go with the women and no mention of the guys.  This is week two where Christy hasn't mentioned Adam's brother or their relationship at all.  

I am the one that originally posted about how this annoys me and I really do not know why.  I mean, I get that actors often have to portray things that they are not (like I do not think anyone on this show is an alcoholic or drug addict in real life). However, the "thin actress in a fat suit who miraculously loses all that weight and never gains it back"  seems just like a round about way to fat shame people in real life that have weight issues.

[wendyg]

I don't find it unrealistic that an admissions person would meet with a prospective candidate, even one who'd just been rejected. I do find it unrealistic that they'd tell Christy to get her LSAT scores up. There are many reasons to be skeptical about those standardized tests. I'd have found it more believable if the admissions person had suggested Christy take some law-related courses and show she can do the work and get respectable grades. Or do volunteer work at a law center or NGO to add to her references, etc.

[msrachelj]

On 3/9/2018 at 2:43 PM, SmithW6079 said:

And that the "life coach" charged Christy $500 (when last week they worried about going to a restaurant once a week after their meetings). However, I did agree with Miranda's rejection of the concept of  "powerlessness" that is the foundation of 12 Step programs.

no way would she have the extra cash for that. ridiculous.

[SunnyBeBe]

Years ago you could get on what law schools called the "wait list."  Meaning that you were accepted on a contingency basis, only if others who were admitted don't accept. That leaves the door open for others.   So, I think the law school discussion she had and being told to get LSAT up is pretty believable. Maybe, she was close, so I can see it happening.  Supposedly, there is a nexus between LSAT scores and performance in law school.  Not sure how....it's a very odd test, imo.  I didn't see her preparing for LSAT.  I hope she took a prep class. THAT is the key, imo. 

[sugarbaker design]

2 hours ago, msrachelj said:

no way would she have the extra cash for that. ridiculous.

She wouldn't have the extra cash for it but she would do what other people with no sense of financial responsibility do:  pay for the ridiculous stuff with cash and charge everything else (groceries, utilities, cable, phone).

[bichonblitz]

On 3/9/2018 at 9:37 PM, LucyEth said:

This is week two where Christy hasn't mentioned Adam's brother or their relationship at all.  

 

On 3/9/2018 at 9:37 PM, LucyEth said:

They don't do a very good job of blending the storylines.

I love this show but they are getting sloppy with the storylines. Why not have one episode where Christy and Adam's brother break up instead of just dropping it. Same with Regina and her story. Tie up your storylines, writers! 

[sugarbaker design]

On 3/12/2018 at 10:47 AM, bichonblitz said:

I love this show but they are getting sloppy with the storylines.

I don't think they're getting sloppy, as far as I know Christy and Adam's brother are still seeing each other long distance.  Now that JP is back, they can focus more on the Gang of 5 and less on the romantic entanglements of Bonnie and Christy.

Regina's story doesn't need to be wrapped up with a pretty pink bow, sometimes people drift out of our lives, sometimes never to be heard from again, especially in the rooms.

[bichonblitz]

1 hour ago, sugarbaker design said:

Now that JP is back, they can focus more on the Gang of 5 and less on the romantic entanglements of Bonnie and Christy.

They could have focused on the gang just fine without JP for a few episodes. 

 

1 hour ago, sugarbaker design said:

as far as I know Christy and Adam's brother are still seeing each other long distance

If they are still seeing each other then what kind of relationship do they have? My problem with that is that Christy had a huge disappointment happen in her life and her boyfriend was nowhere to be found. She didn't call him, either. So either keep them together and have the boyfriend play a part in her life or have them break up. The writer's have done neither. Sloppy. 

[funky-rat]

On ‎3‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 2:43 PM, SmithW6079 said:

And that the "life coach" charged Christy $500 (when last week they worried about going to a restaurant once a week after their meetings). However, I did agree with Miranda's rejection of the concept of  "powerlessness" that is the foundation of 12 Step programs.

On ‎3‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 5:34 PM, MissLucas said:

Marjorie feeling insecure and threatened was odd. She's been a sponsor for 37 years so she must have met with people offering different sometimes even opposite advice. I would like to see an episode that challenges the AA approach with less crazy. I'm not critical of AA but I know that it's not working for everyone and it would be interesting to see the show tackle that. I guess they came close with Octavia Spencer's character.

If you're not in the program (like my husband) or the "sister" program (like I am), it's hard to understand the concept of powerlessness, and it's one I hear people talk about a lot.  For me, it was all about not giving power to the monster in the room (alcoholism).  When I stop giving it power, and surrender to the situation as it is, instead of trying to spend all of my energy changing it (which I can't do), then I can think more clearly, and turn my thoughts and energy elsewhere.  It's more to admit that your life has become unmanageable, IMO, and that's an important thing to do.  When you forget just how unmanageable it makes your life, then you do what Jill did - think that just a drink now and then is perfectly fine.  For most, it's not.  My husband was sober for 17 years - he never did AA - just decided to quit drinking.  After 17 years, he thought it would be OK to just drink occasionally.  He never let the drinking get out of hand like he did the first time around, but what happened was that other things in his life started getting out of control, and it snuck up on me because I was so focused on his drinking, and that seemed to be managed to the naked eye.  Until I learned step 1, I was hyper-focused on trying to control and manage everything.  I had to just stop.  I was driving myself crazy, and to a certain degree, not helping his situation in the process.

As a long-time sponsor, Marjorie has likely seen her fair share of relapses, and was right to be concerned that someone charming and charismatic swooped in out of the blue, and threatened to de-rail long-term sobriety for some of the characters.  Add-in that recovering addicts often are easily suggestible, and don't have the money to pay for the exorbitant fees that go along with stuff that contradicts the teachings that have helped them stay on track, and she had every right to feel threatened, and rightly so.

We have people who show up for our meetings, expecting us to tell them exactly what to say and or do to their kids, or their spouses, or relatives who are addicts, and we don't do that.  We can't - everyone's situation is different, and what works for me doesn't work for others.  When they find out we're not that kind of group, we never see them again, and that's OK.  We never take anyone else's inventory, and shouldn't.  I don't want people doing that for me.  

[hnygrl]

I hated this one for the most part. I watched most of it either with the sound off (closed captions) or behind a couch cushion.

Also being "in the program" I found it offensive to the extreme that the food coach (say what? Geeze...) wouldn't get the helpless before the demon thing. She's an alcoholic addict. Nothing  she does is ever just half-way. Addictive personality. She transferred her alcohol addiction to food, and should've been obvious even to this idiot...she's compulsive...she's gonna wanna eat the earth if she can't drink.

But nooooooo.....we get this pipsqueak idiot moron saying "you can do it just a little. I promise!" So she tries eating food she should stay away from for a couple of years, at least till she gets a handle on things, and she feels that hey! Maybe I can drink just a little too!

I hated this one. It was so extra as to be offensive...she (the idiot pipsqueak 'coach'person) just didn't make any SENSE, and it bugged me that everyone catered to her like she was QUALIFIED or something. Everything she "did" was just plain old ordinary run of the mill THERAPY. She SAID the right things, causing the patient to have a breakthrough...she's good at READING people. That don't make her an expert or even qualified.

And now poor Jill is paying for it.

Please, let her be gone this week? Please?

[Judi Sunshine]

On 3/9/2018 at 1:22 PM, sugarbaker design said:

It was easy for Miranda to disagree with it since she's not an alcoholic.

This. 

I love Kristen Chenoweth, but am not really into *WACKY* humor like her character brought to this ep. However, I think this is a really interesting character arc for Jill, and I kind of think that the ensemble works best when they rally around her -- everyone gets to shine. 

Christy holding that shot glass in her hand -- I actually gasped, "No!" It was the first time we've ever seen her struggle with temptation like that. We saw her drink in her dream and allude to the first year's being sucky, but she's always been the one who seems to really love sobriety. To see her struggle like that in that moment, then to acknowledge it to the women (so there was no room for interpretation), was kind of brutal. I really don't want Christy to relapse for the character's sake, but I do think that if they go that way, Anna Faris will act the hell out of it. 

Edited April 3, 2018 by Judi Sunshine

[marriedaniac]

I liked the West Wing reunion between Chenowith and Janney. Their height difference is still giggle-able.

I also like Bonnie & Wendy switching personalities at the end.

I feel genuinely bad when shitty things happen to the characters, like Jill falling off the wagon this ep, and Christy not getting into law school (and being tempted to drink) last ep.