S02.E13: Chapter Twenty-Six: The Tell-Tale Heart

[The Crazed Spruce]

Quote

Betty turns to Jughead for help; Veronica organizes a face-to-face meeting after tensions between Hiram, F.P. and Jughead spiral out of control; Agent Adams takes things a step too far.

[WhosThatGirl]

Yeah Chic somehow has gotten Alice under his thumb quickly. Also ugh.. the more this Chic story goes on.. the less I’m enjoying it? I find it oddly predictable. Omg Alice thinks of him as a son now! But he probably isn’t really going to be her son, see the rebooted 90210 and one tree hill for references.

 

Bughead scenes always and forever. Also yay for telling Jughead something important. But ugh. Now Jughead is in this mess. 

 

Also.. Archie is one of the most naive people ever. One I still think also love his “I asked point blank if he killed that guy and he said no and I believe him” because he would tell you if he did Archie? What?  

 

Does Cheryl care about Betty and her feelings? Because that scene with her mother she kind of acted like she did? It didn’t seem like an act there. And why would she have act around her mom anyway.

 

 

Ha. Love fake FBI agents rain hat and coat. Sometimes I wonder if Jugheads narrative is putting spins on the outfit choices of certain characters ;).

 

But also.. Archie is a moron? These scenes with the More Than Likely Not Real FBI guy just highlight this.

 

And look I love my Bughead scenes but I really hate that they are now covering up a murder and drowning cars and phones now. These aren’t the scenes and stories I wanted for them. It’s things like this that make me hate the Chic story(this and the webcam stuff, seriously.. adding Chic to the show has made it real bad for me). 

 

I don’t care about Mayor Mocoy resigning, except that it puts both she and Josie back in the background. 

 

The Lodges are really boring still. 

 

I’m surprised Cheryl is being so nice to Betty.  

 

And look I want to be all happy Betty told Hal she knows about him and Mrs. Blossom but Hal is right on and Chic is terrible.

 

Seriously.. why is Alice acting kind of stupid? But hey at least betty called  in reinforcements of The Jones.

Kind of love that the Lodges were behind the FBI agent. They are still boring.

 

Also I still miss when this show was fun. I don’t think that’s going to come back ever again. I love my Bughead scenes but this show stopped being fun.

[Dee]

And once again Riverdale's characters of color are stripped of their agency and thrown under the bus for its white characters. Stay classy, Riverdale.

[WhosThatGirl]

1 minute ago, Sonoma said:

Best line of the episode goes to Jughead asking Betty how fast she could hotwire a car. Not IF-- how fast! Because he knows his girl.

Love and romance in Riverdale now includes hiding dead bodies and sinking cars into bodies of water. And I'm here for it! Just bring me more of the Cooper women and Jones men. As annoyed as I was about all the dumb things they had Jughead and Betty doing while they were apart, I'm completely eating it all up as they're doing dumb shit together. No shame!

I don’t know how I feel about it. I love all my Bughead scenes but I kind of dislike immense what this show has become and what that means. Also yes love that Kughead just point blank knew he could Hotwire a car and just how fast.

The previews make me uneasy for the next episode. I hate the wig and Dark Betty.

[Advance35]

It's really rich watching Jughead and Betty campaign for anti-corruption for all other residents of Riverdale when they are hiding dead bodies, incinerating the remains and bleaching bloody floors.   The moral indignation just makes me roll my eyes.

The Lodges are SO twisted. I love it.  The last scene made me question whether Hiram is REALLY in charge or whether it's Hermione.   Though I'm glad we know the truth about Agent Adams and glad there was a reason he never really added up.  I knew Hiram and Hermione didn't just accept Archie because Veronica thinks she's in love.   It makes me wonder what they would have done had Archie NOT passed their test.

LMAO.  A dead body turns up and Veronica is lamenting about how she was just getting to a good place?!?!?! I LOVE her for comedic value alone.  In her own way, she's so extra.  On the other hand, dead bodies aside, Veronica continues her campaign of helping her Father and Mother manipulate the rest of Riverdale, even the Jones family.  And Veronica finessed the situation very well when it came to getting Mayor McCoy out of her families way with little fuss and fight.

I swear Hermione reminds me of a Novella actress I know but I don't think there are any credited to the actress.

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, Sonoma said:

If it was a normal show I would feel more concerned. But to me Riverdale is a cross of fantasy, reality, and camp so I don't take this part of the show that seriously.

Yeah. I don’t know, it’s just not my favorite thing. And a season ago, this show felt very different and more lighter than what it is now.

[SeanC]

10 minutes ago, Dee said:

And once again Riverdale's characters of color are stripped of their agency and thrown under the bus for its white characters. Stay classy, Riverdale.

If you're referring to Mayor McCoy, the Lodges aren't white.

Edited February 8, 2018 by SeanC

[jay741982]

Kinky Bughead when the show returns LOL. LOVE Bughead doing shit and getting shit done together. Also Jug asking how fast Betty can hotwire a car he knows his girl lol and kudos to whoever called Agent Adams being fake and working for the Lodges and it does look like Hermonie is the Boss lol. I'm betting what looks like a Jeronica kiss in next Epsiode is like a dare thing or a hey Archie/Betty kissed let's try it sort of thing 

[Dee]

9 minutes ago, SeanC said:

If you're referring to Mayor McCoy, the Lodges aren't white.

The Lodges function as white latinos.

[WhosThatGirl]

10 minutes ago, jay741982 said:

Kinky Bughead when the show returns LOL. LOVE Bughead doing shit and getting shit done together. Also Jug asking how fast Betty can hotwire a car he knows his girl lol and kudos to whoever called Agent Adams being fake and working for the Lodges and it does look like Hermonie is the Boss lol. I'm betting what looks like a Jeronica kiss in next Epsiode is like a dare thing or a hey Archie/Betty kissed let's try it sort of thing 

Yeah.. the previews don’t have me looking forward to the next episode. I don’t like the Wig or Dark betty unlike a lot of people who seem to. So I’m not looking forward to that.

[Advance35]

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The Lodges function as white latinos.

I. Cant. Even.

 

14 minutes ago, jay741982 said:

I'm betting what looks like a Jeronica kiss in next Epsiode is like a dare thing or a hey Archie/Betty kissed let's try it sort of thing 

I question whether Veronica and Betty are really friends.  At least on Veronica's end at this point.  Maybe their lack of scenes is intentional.  Maybe Veronica kind of turned off after she found out that Betty and Archie kissed.   She didn't even go to check on Betty when she ran from the circle in this episode.  Or maybe I'm giving the writers too much credit.  But for some reason I found Betty and Veronica's lack of interaction very noticeable this episode.

I am no fan but I had to laugh because Jughead is very much Veronica proof.   She's a good saleswoman but Jughead was in no way buying.  When he accused her of trying to "handle him."  I don't know, the whole thing made me giggle.

[HunterHunted]

Hiram and Hermione should possibly think about soundproofing the office and maybe conducting their shady business deals during the 8 hours a day when Veronica and Archie are in school. Also perhaps come up with a cover business. If they did that minimal amount of work, they perhaps wouldn't have to worry about testing Archie. Just a thought.

Also if you have all of these capos maybe you should stop doing the shady stuff yourself.  There is no reason that the statue decapitation led from Tall Boy directly to the Lodges.

[WhosThatGirl]

2 minutes ago, Advance35 said:

I. Cant. Even.

 

I question whether Veronica and Betty are really friends.  At least on Veronica's end at this point.  Maybe their lack of scenes is intentional.  Maybe Veronica kind of turned off after she found out that Betty and Archie kissed.   She didn't even go to check on Betty when she ran from the circle in this episode.  Or maybe I'm giving the writers too much credit.  But for some reason I found Betty and Veronica's lack of interaction very noticeable this episode.

I am no fan but I had to laugh because Jughead is very much Veronica proof.   She's a good saleswoman but Jughead was in no way buying.  When he accused her of trying to "handle him."  I don't know, the whole thing made me giggle.

I think the lack of Veronica and Betty friendship scenes is intentional right now. I don’t think Betty knows that Veronica knows about the kiss, so Betty probably thinks things are fine. She can’t think about it, she has other things to worry about it that take precedent- dead body’s, new brother,etc- but I think Veronica has made a conscious choice to distance herself.

[UNOSEZ]

If I'm josie.. I'm leaving Riverdale to go to a new town with Reggie.. Wally west.. Jefferson Jackson and Jimmy Olsen

Maybe they can join Chuck in Freedland over on black lightning that show let's their colored Folk do stuff. 

 

On a diff note I hope this isn't the end of mayor McCoy I hope she comes back with a vengance.. The Lodges(who are like Italian Mafia now or something..seriously I think there was more Italian than Spanish..then again we've got two Latinos who's only Spanish seem to be mija and who's names are Hiram and Hermione)  can't keep winning.. 

[HunterHunted]

I get that an affair is scandalous, but Kevin's mom is on a naval base in Bahrain.  We've never seen her or even had another character mention talking to her for 2 years. And Mayor McCoy's estranged husband is musician in recovery who is constantly on the road. I suspect everyone in town would be entirely sympathetic to Mayor McCoy and Sheriff Keller.

[AdorkableSars]

52 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Bughead scenes always and forever. Also yay for telling Jughead something important. But ugh. Now Jughead is in this mess. 

I abhor that Betty brought Jughead into this murder cover up. And then I further abhor that they all brought FP into it. The Jones' boys have enough going on with out adding "helped cover up a murder" into their lives. I mean COME ON (a la Gob Bluth). That being said, I did like that Betty finally let Jughead into her life (though I dislike that it had to be this). And I adore how devoted Jughead is to Betty. He immediately went to her when she needed him. He called just to say good night and that he loves her. I maintain that Jughead deserves so much more than Betty at this point. And (pre-murder coverup), this was the closest to season 1 Jughead that we got this season so far, which I loved. The scene where he confronted Mayor McCoy about the drive in, Southside High, and the trailer park land deals and how he deducted Hiram was behind it...it was just so badass how he used his smarts and investigative skills to confront her. And hey...he didn't need Betty to do it. 

I always think this, but this episode (particularly the scene where Hiram and Veronica met with FP and Jug at their trailer) made me so damn grateful to whoever made the final call on casting Skeet Ulrich as FP. He and Cole look and act so perfectly as father and son. Their cheeky grins when they told Hiram no deal. And then the ANGST at Pops after FP took care of the body. Also, Skeet is just so DAMN good at playing FP. He brings levity, but he also acts out the drama so well. Also, I really appreciated the eye candy in the Lodge v. Jones scene. It was almost hot dad overload with FP and Hiram in the same room, but you can\t have too much of a good thing, right? I won't say no to hella eye candy!

Alice Cooper was the absolute WORST this episode. Acting like nothing happened after allowing her high school daughter help he clean up a crime scene? And allowing Betty to help her in the first place? But Madchen Amick crushed the acting game all episode. Especially the end, when she finally acknowledged what happened and how FP had to step in and help. Hal was the Cooper that I most liked this episode, and it was a weird feeling. But as already stated, I didn't like Alice this episode. And (as kind of stated, I guess) didn't like Betty either. I hated how cold she acted towards Cheryl, especially in the bathroom when Cheryl just came to see if she was OK. And I'll say it...I ship Hal and Penelope! 

I like that Veronica actually still seems like she wants to be good. She warned Mayor McCoy about her nefarious parents so they wouldn't drag her through the mud. And I still really enjoy her and Archie's relationship.

Hmmmmm........so Hermoine is the boss, eh? Pulling all the strings? GIRL POWER!!!!! But for real, that was kind of a twist, and I liked it. I less like that Archie seems to be being pulled into the Lodge family's web of lies/crime/deceit/betrayal. Especially since I think he's one of the main reasons why Veronica is still trying to be a good person.

Chic is creepy as hell, but I'm kind of into it. 

I am happy that Cheryl was at least IN this episode. She still wasn't in it enough for my liking. Nor was Kevin present enough for my liking. (Hey writers! You can write storylines for more than just the Core Four and their parents, OK, thanks, bye!) I missed Toni this episode. How about a spinoff where Cheryl/Kevin/Toni/Josie/Reggie/any other neglected character you'd like are like a vigilante crime fighting squad. I mean, that's the CW's specialty, so you know they'd pick it up. And Cheryl had mad skills with that bow and arrow. Reggie is strong, Kevin can wrestle, we know Josie can kick some ass (see: St. Clair, Nick) This show would serve the action AND the snark. Anyone wanna co-create this with me?

Overall, I liked this episode. I hated the murder and the coverup, but I also loved to hate it and it was pretty intriguing to watch.

Andre is hot. But I still miss Smithers. He can be on my spinoff show...

[WhosThatGirl]

Honestly I really hate everything with the Chic plot. To me, it’s only brought stories I don’t want to see. Webcamming, and more dead bodies.

I don’t care about The Lodges at all. 

The one thing this episode did that I could say is this is an episode that really pushed for me to think that the powers that be view Bughead as endgame. I just don’t see Barchie being able to handle the type of situation Bughead did tonight.

Edited February 8, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[Guest]

I was really hoping that the car wouldn't sink and would just kind of bob in the water.  It would have been interesting to see Bughead get out of that.

While I admittedly do not watch Riverdale for reality, I have a very hard time buying that millionaire mafioso Hiram Lodge would be that concerned over what Jughead would write in a student newspaper.

Did Josie do anything this episode other than stand beside her mother during the resignation speech?  I have to give the actress (or her agent) credit for getting contract wages for what must be the easiest acting gig on primetime television.  Its amazing she is credited as a regular cast member when a whole array of supporting players get much more screen time than she does.

[WhosThatGirl]

8 minutes ago, RogerDodger said:

I was really hoping that the car wouldn't sink and would just kind of bob in the water.  It would have been interesting to see Bughead get out of that.

While I admittedly do not watch Riverdale for reality, I have a very hard time buying that millionaire mafioso Hiram Lodge would be that concerned over what Jughead would write in a student newspaper.

Did Josie do anything this episode other than stand beside her mother during the resignation speech?  I have to give the actress (or her agent) credit for getting contract wages for what must be the easiest acting gig on primetime television.  Its amazing she is credited as a regular cast member when a whole array of supporting players get much more screen time than she does.

Yeah. It’s funny that Josie is a main cast member but such a non entity. That’s probably best though. When she does get screen time she’s suffers like most of the characters do when they get actual story/screen time. I think it’s best if her only scenes are her not speaking or doing much. 

[AdorkableSars]

50 minutes ago, Sonoma said:

Betty has been there unconditionally for Jughead as well. And twice she has saved his father, when everyone else in town had given up on him, including himself. Also, even after completely icing her out, Betty was still there for Jughead 100% in the last episode when he needed her. Even after finding out that dude "cut" (MUTILATED) someone during his Serpent recreational activities. The only thing Betty has done to not show her devotion to Jughead is kiss Archie after she had been dumped, had her heart smashed into a billion pieces, and thought she was probably going to die by the end of the evening.

I also think they've both done enough to hurt each other and show how much they love each other. I know a lot of people are giving Betty crap about how she didn't tell him about kissing Archie. But, Jughead didn't tell Betty about hooking up with Toni (not just a kiss) when they got back together the first time, and I didn't hear people saying that she deserved better than him when that happened. Had Betty not straight out told Jughead that she put two and two together and figured something that happened between him and Toni, he would not have told her.

And yes I'm a Betty stan. LOL My "argument" also comes with love towards a fellow Riverdale watcher, ADORKABLESARS. =)

Your "argument" is very well put, and you're totally right! How soon I forget...but you are completely, unequivocally right: Betty HAS been there for Juggie multiple times, and shown how much she loves him. I don't even care about the kiss with Archie so much - that's not the reason why I think Jughead deserves better. And 100% agree that Jughead probably wouldn't have told Betty about Toni if Betty hadn't of asked. I'm just blinded by things that are likely irrational to anyone but me because I am a Jughead stan, in case you couldn't tell?! But you make incredibly valid points, and I shall simmer down now. Although this just makes me even more riled up with the writing this season because they've been doing such a disservice to Betty lately that I forgot how amazing she usually is. I was a huge Betty fan too. I hope to get back to that soon. They've done so many character assassinations this season (Jughead included - I say that as his biggest stan!) it's too easy to forget the good times/positive character traits.

Love right back to ya Sonoma! Thank for respectfully and eloquently debating your point. People like you are the reason I like posting here!!

[WhosThatGirl]

1 hour ago, Sonoma said:

Betty has been there unconditionally for Jughead as well. And twice she has saved his father, when everyone else in town had given up on him, including himself. Also, even after completely icing her out, Betty was still there for Jughead 100% in the last episode when he needed her. Even after finding out that dude "cut" (MUTILATED) someone during his Serpent recreational activities. The only thing Betty has done to not show her devotion to Jughead is kiss Archie after she had been dumped, had her heart smashed into a billion pieces, and thought she was probably going to die by the end of the evening.

I also think they've both done enough to hurt each other and show how much they love each other. I know a lot of people are giving Betty crap about how she didn't tell him about kissing Archie. But, Jughead didn't tell Betty about hooking up with Toni (not just a kiss) when they got back together the first time, and I didn't hear people saying that she deserved better than him when that happened. Had Betty not straight out told Jughead that she put two and two together and figured something that happened between him and Toni, he would not have told her.

And yes I'm a Betty stan. LOL My "argument" also comes with love towards a fellow Riverdale watcher, ADORKABLESARS. =)

 

 

18 minutes ago, AdorkableSars said:

Your "argument" is very well put, and you're totally right! How soon I forget...but you are completely, unequivocally right: Betty HAS been there for Juggie multiple times, and shown how much she loves him. I don't even care about the kiss with Archie so much - that's not the reason why I think Jughead deserves better. And 100% agree that Jughead probably wouldn't have told Betty about Toni if Betty hadn't of asked. I'm just blinded by things that are likely irrational to anyone but me because I am a Jughead stan, in case you couldn't tell?! But you make incredibly valid points, and I shall simmer down now. Although this just makes me even more riled up with the writing this season because they've been doing such a disservice to Betty lately that I forgot how amazing she usually is. I was a huge Betty fan too. I hope to get back to that soon. They've done so many character assassinations this season (Jughead included - I say that as his biggest stan!) it's too easy to forget the good times/positive character traits.

Love right back to ya Sonoma! Thank for respectfully and eloquently debating your point. People like you are the reason I like posting here!!

Both of you are right and I love both your posts and points,I’m a Stan for both Betty and Jughead but I complently agree that the show has done terrible things to the characters this season.

I don’t care about the kiss with Archie at all really. In fact I find it to be pretty meaningless at this point and I hope the show does when it comes out too. I do however think it’s funny that Barchie shippers were/are pushing hard enough for Barchie that they were willing to believe that ship was meant to be on that one kiss and that the scenes that preluded said kiss were Betty and Archie during things that in season 1 Betty and Jughead did. It wasn’t an original way for them to get together.

And as I said this episode is the episode that made me think the powers that be view Bughead as the endgame pairing as well as some viewers. I feel like Jughead in the scene with the car helped Betty more than Archie could have or would have. 

I’m unsure about Varchie being endgame though. They never seem to be on the same page to me. Yes, they seem to say the right things and agree with each other about what’s good and what’s bad, but I also feel that Veronica herself is willing to overlook the bad because it’s her family. I also think she’s willing to see more gray in certain areas and while Archie can too, I don’t think he will. 

I miss the core four having scenes together and being friends though. I’m excited for the cabin episode.

All the same the preview for the next episode makes me worried only because as I said I don’t get the hype  or Fascination around the wig and Dark Betty. I just don’t. I know others do but I don’t and I never have.

Edited February 8, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[Snookums]

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I don’t care about Mayor Mocoy resigning, except that it puts both she and Josie back in the background. 

I'm hopeful that it means both Mayor McCoy and Josie are actually going to be more integrated now that they have less to lose, but I am also hopeful that a shiny pink unicorn will appear on my balcony and be my best friend, so. I did enjoy Veronica both having the knowledge of the affair on her own, and not sharing it with her parents so that she could use it for her own power play, and that she warned her so that Josie wouldn't suffer (more) public humiliations. Since she's being played by a mute cardboard cutout these days, though, maybe she wouldn't care.

Ronnie's growing into quite a thorny little rose in her own right, one that is getting beyond the control of her parents, and they know it. When Hiram asked her if she warned McCoy and she looked right at him, just like he did to her earlier, and lied to his face, they understood each other. It's going to be Archie and Ronnie vs her parents pretty soon. 

Having called out Faux Agent Adams from his first appearance, I'm grateful they didn't drag that out any longer--the envelope full of thousands and thousands of dollars was cluing in even Archie: Raised In A Skinner Box By Amish Kittens that things were not exactly kosher. And Hermione's reveal as the Boss, while not the dramatic *GASP!* moment I think the show was intending--it's been pretty damn obvious from the beginning of the season that she's been in charge for a while while Hiram, who's already compromised, is the "face" of the shady business--knows how to threaten with one hand and promise with the other. And the show still knows to throw in touches like misty cliffs and branches scraping the car doors, which is what you need for this florid gothic ridiculousness.

(Query, though: exactly what kind of mob is this? Are they Hispanic or Italian or what? Because the It's A Small World After All appearance of these people's business is getting confusing.)

And now the BIG STORY! Betty having to make sure a murder ISN'T solved, turning her Trixie Belden method of coping on its head. How she can't stop investigating even when it's causing more problems than its solving because Alice is in full Queen of Denial mode, here (that gigantic breakfast with the huge heaps of pancakes after a night of hiding a body in the woods? Inspired.) And even after she tells Jughead, the nightmare continues. "Do you kids know whose car that is?" and BOOM both their stomachs hit their socks, and Juggie immediately steps up to the plate and proves he knows his girl by asking how fast she can hotwire it. 

And then they're watching said car sink slowly, slowly, slooooowly, feeling every second panting down their necks with cold wolfy breath, and even when it's gone, it's not gone. What else have they forgotten? How long before another crack appears? 

So the Cooper women, shattered and reeking of bleach and Hal's suspicions, turn to FP, who basically says, I'd say I was being pulled back in but let's face it, I was never out and gets rid of that guy good and proper. Everything's fine now. Everything is just fine. Never mind that Chic had about three lines in this whole thing, and even Betty, when she wasn't crazed with Type A Overdrive was calling him out on his crying routine and he's happily plotting Hal's future exit. EVERYTHING. IS. FINE.

(But honestly, Chic. I know you think you know the dark side and all, with your caved in cheeks and eyes that don't blink, but you don't know what you're getting into. Even when he's not hooking up with the widow courtesan of his former greatest enemy who's the grandmother of his oldest daughter's twins [GAHHHHH] this guy is fucking dangerous, okay? When he was asking about the bleach smell, and where's the rug, and what happened to that lamp? He's not asking out of bewilderment. He's tallying up the tell-tale signs of an act smothered and covered over. Signs he knows all about. Your cam boy past has not prepared you for this.)

 

 

Quote

 

[WhosThatGirl]

I mean.. these episodes are becoming okay. They’re definitely better than what we got in the first half of this season that’s for damn sure. But this show will never be what it was in the first season. That magic isn’t even really here for me anymore- Bughead kind of is but even still.. they’ve done a lot to both Betty and Jughead(equally, they’ve messed up both characters) this season that that they can’t just pull back from. So yeah.. these episodes are okay but I feel like there’s a magic they may not be able to recapture for me.

[thefreeair]

So... I guess this season is the origin story for the hardened criminals Archie and the gang all eventually grow up to be. Cool.

[WhosThatGirl]

7 minutes ago, thefreeair said:

So... I guess this season is the origin story for the hardened criminals Archie and the gang all eventually grow up to be. Cool.

This comment sums it all up because yeah.. I’m not sure where else the characters can go from here at this point. 

Although next season all the characters might do another 180 and be totally different people again. Who knows.

[thefreeair]

2 minutes ago, WhosThatGirl said:

This comment sums it all up because yeah.. I’m not sure where else the characters can go from here at this point. 

Season 3 opening. Veronica is putting on her veil, while Archie rehearses nervously in the church. Nearby, in a dimly lit office, an ever-inscrutable Hiram Lodge sits behind a desk stroking a cat and to a proudly pleading Alice Cooper (and only Mrs. Cooper her damn self could be at once prideful and pleading) he continues his speech, "You don't ask with respect. You don't offer friendship. You don't even think to call me Godfather. Instead, you come into my house on the day my daughter is to be married, and you ask me to do murder for money."

"I want justice for my daughter!" Alice shouts.

Cut to said daughter in the middle of a striptease for a very old, very rich man. Watching via camera is Jughead, and into her earpiece he gives the cue for her to slit his throat. As she leaves the dying man behind, she throws off her black wig. "How much did that get us, Jug?"

"We'll count the money after the wedding, toots."  

... I may have had too much to drink while watching this one. On a Wednesday night. That's the life I'm all about.

[twoods]

Why are four people sticking their necks out for creepy Chic again? He doesn't lift a finger with getting rid of the body, then immediately turns on the tears to detract from his stupid ass mistakes. I just can't with this storyline. 

At least we got great Bughead scenes out of this mess. They really are there for each other, and it's nice to see. I hate that FP is involved because he doesn't deserve to get in trouble again. I also liked that Cheryl was looking out for Betty. 

Figured that the agent was taking Archie to Hiram, so seeing Hermoine was a bit of a shocker. I liked that despite Veronica knowing about the business, she still has a heart. I wonder who is going to be the mayor now- maybe Hermoine?

[WhosThatGirl]

27 minutes ago, thefreeair said:

Season 3 opening. Veronica is putting on her veil, while Archie rehearses nervously in the church. Nearby, in a dimly lit office, an ever-inscrutable Hiram Lodge sits behind a desk stroking a cat and to a proudly pleading Alice Cooper (and only Mrs. Cooper her damn self could be at once prideful and pleading) he continues his speech, "You don't ask with respect. You don't offer friendship. You don't even think to call me Godfather. Instead, you come into my house on the day my daughter is to be married, and you ask me to do murder for money."

"I want justice for my daughter!" Alice shouts.

Cut to said daughter in the middle of a striptease for a very old, very rich man. Watching via camera is Jughead, and into her earpiece he gives the cue for her to slit his throat. As she leaves the dying man behind, she throws off her black wig. "How much did that get us, Jug?"

"We'll count the money after the wedding, toots."  

... I may have had too much to drink while watching this one. On a Wednesday night. That's the life I'm all about.

Honestly I really have no idea what this show is about anymore. And I wish I could enjoy the crazy of it all.. but I can’t? I got invested in the characters last season and now they are becoming caricatures and badly so. 

24 minutes ago, twoods said:

Why are four people sticking their necks out for creepy Chic again? He doesn't lift a finger with getting rid of the body, then immediately turns on the tears to detract from his stupid ass mistakes. I just can't with this storyline. 

At least we got great Bughead scenes out of this mess. They really are there for each other, and it's nice to see. I hate that FP is involved because he doesn't deserve to get in trouble again. I also liked that Cheryl was looking out for Betty. 

Figured that the agent was taking Archie to Hiram, so seeing Hermoine was a bit of a shocker. I liked that despite Veronica knowing about the business, she still has a heart. I wonder who is going to be the mayor now- maybe Hermoine?

Also yes.. Chic is just a bad character and plot point in general if you ask me. Sadly nothing about him is original and Riverdale you were better than this. I can’t wait until his reveal is that he’s not Chic Cooper and everyone can be all shocked by it. Or not.

As much as I like the cast of this show (and used to like the characters), I don’t know. I think I might have to bail out after this season. Nothing about this show really holds my interest, it’s reminding me a lot of how ridiculous One Tree Hill got after season 2 and I’m just not really into that? I might be too old for it now. I’ll stick it out for the rest of the season but then I might be done.

Edited February 8, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[sweetandsour]

Arg, this show. I still like some parts of it, but I keep wondering what in the hell is going on in the writers' room.

1. Ah, Betty.  After you help your mother and NOT your assumed brother (bc he's useless) clean up a bloody murder, you put on a clean white knit sweater. Why. Why. Why. It doesn't matter that there's no more blood. Why would you wear white after seeing all of that blood and obviously being haunted by it. Naturally, it gets really dirty later when they're cleaning the house bc Betty doesn't change into something else. Why.

2. Chic has the most punchable face I've seen in a long time. If I ever see this actor in something else after this, he's going to have to be amazing to convince me he's a good actor and it's just that Chic was terribly written. (And with terrible makeup.)

3. Every time Betty and Alice touched something (outside of cleaning up the drug dealer's prints in the house), I was dying, like, don't you understand you're leaving prints and DNA behind. Though maybe that's just a smudge added onto their DNA that's totally all over the rug.

4. They needed to manufacture a plumbing leak in the kitchen after they disposed of the body. Yes, it's costly, but you gotta conceal this crime, ladies. The flood allows you to explain why you threw away the rug. It also allows you to replace the flooring (also ruined), so if you ever come under suspicion later, forensics won't find any traces of the blood on the new floor. Bleaching it away isn't enough. And even if they think it's suspicious that you replaced the floor, you have records with the water utility that there was excessive usage/leak and bills to replace the flooring that line up with said leak.

5. Cheryl has forgotten about her obsession with Josie by now???  She's too distracted by her mom's whorishness and actual relationship with Hal Cooper-actually-Blossom. And why is her mom hooking up with regular guys for money? Does she think she's too old or notorious (bc of her deceased husband's crimes) to land a sugar daddy?

6. The one time they don't use a secret to drive a wedge between Betty and Jughead, it's gotta be this.

7. V, I don't think an empty classroom at school is a secure space to be discussing your father's possible commission of homicide.

8. 13 episodes in to s2 and they still haven't explained what the hell was going on with Archie and those wolf masks from s1. I mean, they're obviously not going to, but what was the point of writing that into s1?

[Guest]

Maybe the guy that was killed was the real Chic who came to confront his imposter.  That should really send Alice and Betty over the edge.

[Ruby Red]

Well, this episode was quite entertaining in some ways, the plots feel all over the place but it was not a bad episode to watch. Some weird parts, but okay.

 

I do love Veronica and her playing different sides, but I am not sure what her motives are entirely. She seems to be aware of Hiram's plans and that it could mean the Jones family and others could lose their home, but she also knows her parents are shady as hell and can have a sneaky way of making sure they are not going to humilate Major McCoy.  But what is really her angle?

 So, Archie now became a mobster by accident? Okay. 

Oh no, I could feel Jughead's heart break when Betty hung up on him like that. It was so cute that he called her just because he wanted to wish her good night and told her "I love you." and ouch, she did not say it back. But she was in shock of everything and probably couldn't process a word he was saying. And the next morning he walked her to school and he was cute again and I like how he told her he was a bit nervous and worried that she did not enjoy the night with him. He was so anxious, poor thing. And she reassured him that she had an amazing time. Later Betty telling Jughead about the murder, how she trusts him and he then commited a felony for her and him knowing she can hotwire a car and asking how fast she can do it. Jughead being ride or die for Betty. They are like Riverdale's Bonnie and Clyde, without having murdered anyone. I would have liked for them to have more of a talk about their relationship though than to be involved on a murder drama so quickly after they slept together. She did not even get to tell him about her kiss with Archie. They have gone through quite some stuff lately. I am sure neither of them are going to jail for covering up the murder though, this is Riverdale.

Cheryl really needs to move to a better place than with her abusive parent.

But I also wish they would give these characters a break, some room to breathe. I prefer more character-driven stories than plot-driven ones. Where are more emotionally charged moments? It feels like there are layers of depth missing without more character-driven momemts. 

Edited February 8, 2018 by Ruby Red

[AAEBoiler]

I was wondering if there was something hinky about Agent Adams but I didn't think they were going to "Slugworth" him by having him work for the Lodges.

[Ruby Red]

I wanted to add is that there does not seem to be a cohesive plot. You don't get in depth much of the character motivations or their emotions, you just have to guess at everything. And as a sacrifice of all these plot-driven stuff with not much connection, the relationships between friends get sacrificed - we have not had any proper interaction between Jughead/Archie and Betty/Veronica in 4 episodes and they are supposed to be best friends. We did not even have Betty and Archie talk to each other who are meant to be childhood best friends who had a traumatizing experience because of their connection with a serial killer, they kissed and don't even discuss it. Even if there are no romantic feelings there. There has been a bit of Jughead and Veronica interaction, which will lead to conflict in the future with their families, but we never really saw them becoming friends before besides hanging out by association. And even the romantic relationships have been so divided between Betty/Jughead and Veronica/Archie that it feels like they are not even friends anymore. Where is the emotional impact of everything that happens to those characters? This includes Cheryl who has tried to kill herself, who was almost sexually assaulted (which also happened to Veronica). Those things were never dealt with.

There is like no connection between the characters anymore. They hardly use characters like Josie, Kevin, Reggie, Toni, Sweet Pea etc. and flesh them out more.
And none of these characters even have a moral compass anymore. Except for Cheryl of all the sudden, though she could also be a bully and only three episodes ago she was being elitist towards the Southside High students.

I know this is not a show that is a masterpiece of fiction, but at least have some more character-driven things happening and have characters form meaningful relationships besides the romance and a cohesive plot.

Edited February 8, 2018 by Ruby Red

[WhosThatGirl]

Yeah.. there isn’t any sort of cohesive plot. And no one really talks to each other anymore. I feel like there isn’t a real story going on.. at least not one that flows from one point to the other.

Edited February 8, 2018 by WhosThatGirl

[Snookums]

Quote

Every time Betty and Alice touched something (outside of cleaning up the drug dealer's prints in the house), I was dying, like, don't you understand you're leaving prints and DNA behind. Though maybe that's just a smudge added onto their DNA that's totally all over the rug.

Well, it's their house--of course their prints are on stuff. It's going to be more suspicious that there are NO prints, including theirs, on so much of the house, including things like doorknobs and apples.

[Chinders123]

12 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

This comment sums it all up because yeah.. I’m not sure where else the characters can go from here at this point. 

Although next season all the characters might do another 180 and be totally different people again. Who knows.

Came here to say this. There's no way I can believe that all this can happen and there not be some sort of punishment for them all - I mean, jail time seems imminent. If Betty and Jughead get off scott-free then I don't know if I can watch this show anymore, willing suspension of disbelief aside. Who am I kidding? I'll totally watch. But I'll be skeptical the whole time.

[sacrebleu]

Quote

Although next season all the characters might do another 180 and be totally different people again. Who knows.

well, they will be applying to colleges (I don't know the comics well, is there a convenient college in Riverdale?) They've got some bang-up material for college essays. "How I Became a Vigilant" "Wigs and Webcasting: My Dark Journey to Female Empowerment"  "Passively Active: My Life as a Semi-Omniscient Narrator" 

[WhosThatGirl]

Yeah.. I’m probably not lasting another season as I’ve said a few times. It’s just not that fun to watch. It’s a depressing hour and none of the characters are likeable to me. I’m here until the season finale but something has to make me like the show again and sadly not even Bughead moments can keep me here anymore.

[sweetandsour]

36 minutes ago, Snookums said:

Well, it's their house--of course their prints are on stuff. It's going to be more suspicious that there are NO prints, including theirs, on so much of the house, including things like doorknobs and apples.

Oh, I meant when they were disposing of the body.  And when Betty went back to the sewer tunnel and took dude's phone.  She was touching his jacket/zippers and stuff like that.  When I first saw Betty and Jughead pushing dude's car, and the obvious implication they drove it somewhere, I was like, "UGH!  You're touching it all over the place!  Your strands of hair might be in there now!" Until I saw they were pushing it into the lake, so that evidence should have washed away.

I think it's only suspicious that you wiped down things in your own home if you're caught immediately and your house is processed immediately. After a few days, you're going to generate some fingerprints and DNA left behind that you'll be in this medium space of "the house has been cleaned recently, but how can you prove it's nefarious?" Especially someone like Alice who I feel keeps a meticulous house regularly and everyone knows that. (vs. the Jones' trailer being spic and span.) And once that house gets processed anyway, it's the remnants of blood on the floor that are going to get them.

[opus]

24 minutes ago, sacrebleu said:

(I don't know the comics well, is there a convenient college in Riverdale?)

In the comics, anything needed for a story is conviently there.

[Mabinogia]

53 minutes ago, sweetandsour said:

Oh, I meant when they were disposing of the body.  And when Betty went back to the sewer tunnel and took dude's phone.  She was touching his jacket/zippers and stuff like that.  When I first saw Betty and Jughead pushing dude's car, and the obvious implication they drove it somewhere, I was like, "UGH!  You're touching it all over the place!  Your strands of hair might be in there now!" Until I saw they were pushing it into the lake, so that evidence should have washed away.

I still don't get why they didn't just say they had no idea who's car that was rather than lying about the ownership, thereby admitting they knew it was there, then hotwiring it, driving it through town to the conveniently isolated body of water, sinking it, which they clearly weren't sure was going to work, and hoping that it never resurfaces. Jug, you are far from a criminal mastermind, or mastermind of any kind. That jacket has clearly depleted your brain cells. You used to be smarter than this.

I do think it would be hilarious if the cops did dust the Cooper house for fingerprints. "Um, ma'am, why are there no fingerprints on any of these apples?" "We haven't touched them." "Well, how did they get into this bowl?" "They came with the bowl." "yeah, okay."

[WhosThatGirl]

It’s not just Jughead, everyone seems to be taking stupid pills this season. 

[Ruby Red]

To be fair, it probably was a plot device to show Jughead being ride and die for Betty, even if it was not a smart idea... They did both wore gloves when they pushed the car into the water, but they have sat inside the car so not sure if that really matters even in the water if the windows are closed. There still could be hair etc. in the car.

And I mean, Betty called Jughead and told him about the murder scene which makes him an accomplice now. Guess they wanted to have him take some responsibility for it too by having Jughead play his part as him inserting himself in the crime for Betty and her family. The same way Betty used blackmail to help Jughead and FP.

Edited February 8, 2018 by Ruby Red

[PeekaBoo]

The second part of the season is getting so good, it actually makes me forget about the first half!! They really should have started the second season like this!!

Oh god, where to start!

The ending, Archie! Hermione!! OMFG!! I didn't expect that! While I was surprised that Hermione was the intentional mastermind behind the shady stuff, I am surprised that Archie is sort of getting in the business, that he's showing an interest in all of that... Ok, we got more details about the Lodges and their plans but I'm scratching my head and wondering if Hermione was behind all the stuff way before Hiram came to town and is Hiram trying to be the "good cop" guy in all of this? Was she "bad" from the start of the show? As always, it's such a 180 from the first season that i'm more confused than anything else...

And archie, he's getting so much more interesting! Is he really going to fall under the charm of the "Mafioso"-life?!?!

THe murder.... My god... How the hell can the Cooper girls and Chic just not go crazy after burying and washing and covering the body!! You know, Betty really scared me after she had taken that phone from the shady guy and had locked herself to her bedroom... For a minute there I thought she was going to go webcamming in order to get her "release", I really did!!! But then she was in total betty-sleuthing-mode and i was so relieved!! lol!! Nah, the whole murder thing was just f--- crazy... I cannot believe that Alice would just go on in total perfect-mode, forgetting anything bad happen... OMG! Same with Chic who easily went along...

All the bughead scenes were just sweet... Loved how Jughead was following up and being the thoughtful boyrfriend and calling her... and getting hurt when betty brushed him off... That do or die thing is sooooo apparent, sigh!

And Jughead is changing yet again ( i know some of you were calling him as Soft!Juggie but i'm going for Classic!Jug!) He's softening up a whole lot and going back to this roots from season 1! Loved that he stood up to both Hiram and McCoy and how he was totally freaked out when Betty told him the truth... I wouldn't expect that type of reaction seeing as all the crap he's done in the first half lol!! But there he was and stuck with Betty and in sleuthing-Jug fashion, he helped out his girl... Sigh...

And Cheryl.... that poor girl.... She's softening to and with reason... Having to live with a horrible person like that and having to see men coming and going...

I was surprised that Peneloppe actually liked Hal... I mean, she seems a bit older than him, right?!?! That's interesting...

and Chic... What the hell is wrong with that boy and when is he going to leave?!?! The whole thing is abit borderline-cheesy...It's been done several times already on other shows... He desperately wants to fit in with the Cooper girls (minus Hal)...

The classic Falice moment at the end, the subtle hand holding.... ohhh sigh... I cannot wait to find out about their past.... but i think that is going to come back and haunt them... I've said it several times, but i cannot see FP (or jughead for that matter) coming unscathed from all of this...

 

10 hours ago, RogerDodger said:

Maybe the guy that was killed was the real Chic who came to confront his imposter.  That should really send Alice and Betty over the edge.

Imagine if that was the truth?!?!

[Mabinogia]

32 minutes ago, PeekaBoo said:

I was surprised that Peneloppe actually liked Hal... I mean, she seems a bit older than him, right?!?! That's interesting...

You know what's funny, I always assumed Penelope was older too, but I looked up the actors ages and she's one of the youngest of the adult actors. She and Hermoine are the same age (born 1973) the rest are like 2-5 years older. Hal is the oldest. Born in 1966 (he looks great for his age, I mean, they all look good, but given he is the oldest and, to me anyway, looks like one of the youngest, he is a well preserved man lol).

[Snookums]

Quote

 Jug, you are far from a criminal mastermind, or mastermind of any kind.

He takes all his cues from movies! When they were shoving the car into the lake he said "Ugh, they made it look so easy in Psycho!" As bizarre as the storyline is, the show does a good job with portraying how regular people, ones who aren't Mafioso or serial killers or whatever, would panic and try to hide a crime. Most people would just be frantically trying to remember what they've seen on TV and in films and running around like chickens who've just heard the sky is falling. The only person who knows to bury a body with quicklime is somebody like FP (and like Hal--I stand by my assessment that that guy is a freakin' killer who knows how to dispose of evidence.)

Speaking of Hal--I really wish they'd get more into why the hell he and Penelope are hooked up. Their entire relationship last season consisted of a hissing contest over Polly's babies and he was enraged over the Blossom connection due to some old family feud or something, right? But Penelope hasn't shown the slightest interest in those kids since that time; neither has Cheryl, come to think of it.

[NeenerNeener]

Chic creeps me out. He must be one hell of an actor though, because I watched him cycle between creepy, terrified of Hal, and back to creepy all without saying a word.

[Zanne]

The most ridiculous thing about Riverdale is the size of the school bathroom stalls. Did you see how huge that thing was with Betty fully sprawled out? A family of 5 plus their pony could live in there with room to spare.

[thuganomics85]

Ha, in the biggest non-surprise of the century, Obvious Fake FBI Agent is totally not a FBI Agent!  But I was wrong about him being a rival for Lodges, but he was actually one of Hermione's capos, and this was all a grand test to make sure Archie was loyal to him.  And he past!  Yay, Archie!  You may not be top of your class in a lot of things, but at least your the best at protecting your girlfriend's clearly, shady, mobster family!  Granted, considering how much I love Veronica, it is one of the few things I respect about him.  He knows he's got a great thing going for him!

Speaking of which, I love that Veronica suspected Hiram of killing the one guy, and her reaction was less "Oh, my God!  Dad killed someone!" and more "Ugh, this going to cause so much drama!  Things were finally calming down!"  You so crazy, Ronnie!  But, hey, at least she prevented McCoy from being humiliated by her affair coming out, so yay?  I mean, she still had to resign.  And judging from her one shot, Josie's soul still seems to have left her.  Either that or the actress is just understandably bored with her scenes.

So, Alice has just gone completely off the deep end with her Team Chic stuff, and now Betty, Jughead, and FP are all accessories towards covering up the dead body.  Yeah, this going to end well for everyone involved.  Also, Chic's totally going to kill Hal, right?

As usual, the Blossoms continue to be the best and Cheryl's attempts to be supportive and protective of Betty was strangely sweet, if crazy in an obvious Cheryl way.  Plus, Madelaine Petsch doing archery was strangely hot.  They better have Cheryl actually shoot someone in a later episode.

I so hope we actually get a war between the Lodges and the Southside Serpents in poor, little Riverdale.  The Mafia vs. the Biker Gang!  Just need to find a way to work in the Russian mafia, the Yakuza, and a drug cartel, and you'd have all of television's greatest criminal organizations in one place!

[AnimeMania]

Excited for the previews:

Looks like Betty is about to put on her leather outfit and break out the whip.

VerJug getting all kissy-kissy recreating scenes from "The Shape of Water".