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Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

ArctisTor

By ArctisTor
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bijoux

bijoux

Can someone sum up this storyline? Because the things on Twitter are disconnected and nonsensical. 

 

I also don't see anything weird about Ray getting together with someone after his and Felicity's break up. The thing that was weird was his declaration of love to her, when rebound and comfort would have made more sense.

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apinknightmare
apinknightmare

I mean, I don't want her in a suit so it's not the "never" in this instance that bothers me, but Marc saying that Felicity specifically would make the notion of superheroics "silly." Why? In this show

Carrie Ann
Carrie Ann

And then someone tells him that what he did was okay because of reasons, or that he can't keep feeling guilty, he just has to move forward. Like, no, just...go ahead and feel really guilty for awhile?

SleepDeprived
SleepDeprived

Hey, now... Listen. The practice of proper etiquette during an impromptu wedding officiated by your best friend in a park, right after the funeral of a beloved colleague, is of the utmost importance,

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jay741982

jay741982

I don't know about behind the scenes shenanigans, but if we're talking uselessness of character only, the number one target of that on The Flash has got to be Caitlin, imo. Her acting is terrible, she serves no essential role within the cast, and she doesn't even have any canon stuff protecting her either. As far as I can see, the only thing kinda keeping her now is the fact that she's only one of two female regulars, but that could always be altered by bringing in someone else (like Jesse or Linda).

I wouldn't be surprised at all if they decided to off her in the next couple seasons.

They would probably have her become Killer Frost, maybe be the season's Big Bad then have her be killed or arrested at the end of the season. Jessie is one of the Flashes so they could bring her back and have her replace Caitlin if they wanted. I like Caitlin though

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FurryFury

FurryFury

(edited)

Caitlyn's not the worst character on The Flash. She's not written well, but then, the show's not well-written at all.

 

I'd prefer they killed of Joe and let Iris and Barry develop as their own characters because being connected to Joe and his character being overemphasized really hurts and limits the show.

 

PS And now I've realized I haven't seen any Flash episodes since the Zoom reveal. I guess I'll have to catch up near the finale.

Edited by FurryFury
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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

I don't think even the title characters are safe from being killed off or otherwise exiting.  The shows are called Arrow and The Flash - not Oliver Queen and Barry Allen.

 

I think if the shows are still successful (by CW standards) and either SA or GG wanted to leave for some reason, the CW would continue the show with a new character playing the superhero.  I know MG or one of the EPs said something once about doing Arrow for as long as SA wanted to do it - but really, it's a business.  If the show's still doing well, the network is going to want to continue the show.  From what I understand, various characters have been the Flash and Green Arrow in the comics.

Edited by tv echo
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

Can someone sum up this storyline? Because the things on Twitter are disconnected and nonsensical. 

 

I also don't see anything weird about Ray getting together with someone after his and Felicity's break up. The thing that was weird was his declaration of love to her, when rebound and comfort would have made more sense.

So in the year 2146 (I think) Ray finds out his suit was used as a prototype for these autonomous evil robots that fly around and police (violently) people and will be used by evil Vandal Savage to take over the world. Ray finds this out during a tour when he sees a bust of who was responsible for the tech.  It looks like Ray.  He also discovers the woman in charge is the Great, great, great (ect) granddaughter of the creator. 

 

Somehow that translates to Ray thinking he had a secret child that hadn't known about that since he was off on the Waverider, grew up without a dad, thus hating him and using his tech to make evil robots.  (His last relationship before leaving had ended with the woman ghosting him)  Turns out he has no kid and the statue was of his brother Sydney who Ray immediately declares must have gone to work for Felicity in 2016 and then collaborated with the military.  It honestly makes no sense since Felicity would have proprietary control of his ATOM suit designs through Palmer Tech so I guess Sydney stole the designs? And no one protested?  I have no idea why he thought he had a secret child conceived in 2016.  There was nothing to support that other than the fact he had progeny.  (Well, thought he did.)

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bijoux

bijoux

... Okay. That does not make much sense. Not what you said, but what the show is trying to sell. Although I guess that could be the reason why he goes to see Felicity in 2016. Don't let a dude who looks like me into the building.

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Sakura12

Sakura12

When does he go see Felicity?

 

It'll be on LoT at some time. Telling her not to hire his brother makes sense as a reason he goes to see her and making sure his tech stays with her. 

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

I think

he goes back when their younger selves are being targeted (so that they die before ever getting on the ship). There is a Sara flashback to before the Gambit as well.

 

I'm guessing there will be no payoff in Arrow. 

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

I don't think they said he was a twin but the bust of his head was supposed to look just like Ray (though I didn't see the resemblance ) so your guess is probably better than mine. 

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Genki

Genki

I don't think they said he was a twin but the bust of his head was supposed to look just like Ray (though I didn't see the resemblance ) so your guess is probably better than mine. 

 

Ahhh...thanks. I think twin was mentioned upthread but now that I reread your summary twin isn't a certainty. 

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Delphi

Delphi

Not that I'm trying to defend Ray, but Felicity slept with Oliver like 3 minutes after she and Ray broke up. Ray also has a history of moving on quickly. Who's Anna again?

I was going to mention this, because I agree.

I'd also like to mention that sex can be very cathartic after a breakup. Let's not slut shame Ray for wanting some action.

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way2interested

way2interested

I was going to mention this, because I agree.

I'd also like to mention that sex can be very cathartic after a breakup. Let's not slut shame Ray for wanting some action.

I agree with the idea as well. My whole issue really isn't even that he had sex. It's just that the mentioning of it was so random and threw me for a loop. Like, the reason why I thought he meant Felicity initially was that she was the last person I saw him with, so telling me he had a sexual encounter with someone else when I did see him have a relationship with someone just somewhat contradict each other.

It's just random and for plot which is why I kind of didn't like it. It would be like telling me that Diggle had a sexual encounter with someone between him trying to get with Carly and him getting back together with Lyla. He doesn't have to be completely single in that time, but randomly telling me he had sex with someone would just throw me off and make me have a lot of follow-up questions.

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tarotx

tarotx

I agree with the idea as well. My whole issue really isn't even that he had sex. It's just that the mentioning of it was so random and threw me for a loop. Like, the reason why I thought he meant Felicity initially was that she was the last person I saw him with, so telling me he had a sexual encounter with someone else when I did see him have a relationship with someone just somewhat contradict each other.

It's just random and for plot which is why I kind of didn't like it. It would be like telling me that Diggle had a sexual encounter with someone between him trying to get with Carly and him getting back together with Lyla. He doesn't have to be completely single in that time, but randomly telling me he had sex with someone would just throw me off and make me have a lot of follow-up questions.

Felicity hasn't really been a character Ray has talked about on LOT. And they broke up Last April/May. Ray mentions this last girl was in January and that was right before he left for the Legends mission. It does say something about Ray that this girl ghosted him which is kind of what Felicity was doing in her own way. And now Kendra was all no I want nothing from our life in 1960 and is now having love memories of Carter. Ray really should reevaluate his romantic choices since Anna died. 

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statsgirl

statsgirl

Caitlyn's not the worst character on The Flash. She's not written well, but then, the show's not well-written at all.

 

I'd prefer they killed of Joe and let Iris and Barry develop as their own characters because being connected to Joe and his character being overemphasized really hurts and limits the show.

OMG, you're right.  As much as I think Jesse Martin is a really good actor and sometimes I like Joe as a person, having him around buffering Barry from not only Iris but growing up really hurts the characters.  It keeps Barry at about a twelve year old level emotionally because it seems that's where Joe wants him to be. I think he'd like that with Iris too given how he reacted to her relationship with Eddie. Now he gets to have both his kids at home.  Run, Wally, run.

 

I keep reading how cute Barry and Kara were on the Supergirl show with that ice cream and all and if only Barry could be her relationship.  SMH because while they were very cute, they were also like 12 years old with each other and I want so much more on my shows.

 

I can't get my daughter to watch The Flash any more, not even when the other show on at the same time is a repeat.  I think there's a reason Arrow and LoT are my favourites in this universe and not the two shows AK has his hands on.

 

I'd also like to mention that sex can be very cathartic after a breakup. Let's not slut shame Ray for wanting some action.

I got the impression that it wasn't just cathartic sex but a relationship at least in his mind. He said that she had ghosted him for the week before he left, if it was just meaningless, why was he upset she didn't care?

 

Poor Ray, always second (or lower) choice since Anna.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Freeform [former ABC Family] greenlit Marvel's romance superhero "Cloak and Dagger" straight to series:

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/marvel-cloak-and-dagger-freeform-series-1201747907/

I like you the best, Evil Disney conglomerate.

Wait - I thought that romance had no place on a superhero show?  (Yes, that's sarcasm)

 

On an unrelated note, here's an opinion article that's mostly a Netflix recommendation, praising Daredevil in comparison to Arrow...

 

Marvel vs DC: How Marvel Won the War for Small Screen Dominance

Brian Hadsell+  April 9, 2016

http://www.tvovermind.com/tv-news/marvel-vs-dc-marvel-won-war-small-screen-dominance

Edited by tv echo
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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

Wait - I thought that romance had no place on a superhero show?  (Yes, that's sarcasm)

 

Oh, but it's okay when it's on a network that literally caters to 14-34 year old fangirls, excuse me, "Becomers", let's use the industry ungendered term lest we offend someone.

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tv echo

tv echo

(edited)

Sounds really, really good - Captain America: Civil War comes out May 6...

 

Marvel Just Screened Captain America: Civil War, and the Initial Reviews Are Great
Andrew Liptak  Yesterday 9:42am
http://io9.gizmodo.com/marvel-just-screened-captain-america-civil-war-and-th-1770034257

 

'Captain America: Civil War': First Reactions to the Marvel Blockbuster Are In
BY CHRIS CABIN      1 DAY AGO
http://collider.com/captain-america-civil-war-reviews/

 

Captain America: Civil War: Early reviews are very positive for Marvel blockbuster
'It’s a better Avengers movie than the last Avengers movie'
Jack Shepherd @JackJShepherd 8 hours  ago
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/films/news/captain-america-civil-war-early-reviews-are-very-positive-for-marvel-blockbuster-a6977191.html

Edited by tv echo
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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)

So many think pieces re why BvS "failed," which by industry standards it pretty much has. It seems really obvious to me that it failed bc it's a crappy movie. I mean pajiba destroyed it, and it's not as if pajiba is anti-comic book movie. Zack Snyder just kind of sucks.

 

http://variety.com/2016/film/opinion/batman-v-superman-warner-bros-superhero-suit-1201749164/

I still don't think they understand WHY people had problems with the movie and the approach to the characters in general.  All I took from that article is they were going to make the plot line less complicated in the Justice League movie.

Edited by BkWurm1
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kismet

kismet

I don't think even the title characters are safe from being killed off or otherwise exiting.  The shows are called Arrow and The Flash - not Oliver Queen and Barry Allen.

 

I think if the shows are still successful (by CW standards) and either SA or GG wanted to leave for some reason, the CW would continue the show with a new character playing the superhero.  I know MG or one of the EPs said something once about doing Arrow for as long as SA wanted to do it - but really, it's a business.  If the show's still doing well, the network is going to want to continue the show.  From what I understand, various characters have been the Flash and Green Arrow in the comics.

I think if GG or SA want out than the show could make that happen and still keep the show on the air if it is doing well. However, I do wonder what would happen to the supporting cast. Would the new GA need FS, Dig or TQ? Also depending on how they wrote OQ out of the show would there even be a place for them on the show. Because the Flash crew seems more social but not as close, I could see Cisco & Caitlin hanging around with the new Flash. But I think Iris & Joe would be gone.

 

That all being said, I think the only way that OQ & BA are going to die is if the actors want out. I don't see the writers ever choosing to write those characters out of the show. Meanwhile every other character on all 3 shows have the potential to be killed at any time that works for the writers & the stories.

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BkWurm1

BkWurm1

(edited)

Lowering the IQ level of the film when they really should be raising it?

I'm thinking more than the plot, the tone and flow of the movie needed to be addressed.  I was able to follow the storyline without trouble but I didn't enjoy the fifty brief (to VERY brief) vignettes strung end to end making me feel like the movie was still trying to get started for the first hour.  In lots of movies you get the opening with some action scene or maybe something the bad guy is pulling off, perhaps a brief flash back setting something up and then the movie starts  and follows the main characters as their story unfolds in a fairly linear manner.  And you relax and settle into the movie world. I never got lost in this movie.

 

We really never got that linear straight forward classic feel until halfway through and even that was short lived.  (But probably IMO the best part of the movie.)  Too soon we were back to jumping around from shot to shot and boom, Title fight, bam final battle and then it's pretty much done.   It's all over and I felt in a way that it never started.    

Edited by BkWurm1
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Sakura12

Sakura12

Melissa McCarthy's "The Boss" beat BvS in the box office this weekend. That's shows how much that movie has fallen. It was up against no real competition and it still couldn't hold the top spot for 3 straight weekends. I can see DC scrambling to fix the movies they haven't filmed yet. 

 

So far CA: CW seems to be getting decent reviews and they screened it a month in advance. 

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FurryFury

FurryFury

(edited)

Wow, I don't remember any relatively recent movies having such a hatedom as BvS. Only 50 Shades/Twilight come to mind (and maybe new Ghostbusters? It hasn't come out yet though). It seems that so many people hate it and want it to be unsuccessful. (I don't fall in any camps, but I generally don't care about DC or Zack Snyder).

Edited by FurryFury
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Sakura12

Sakura12

I'm one that was bored by Man of Steel, so I wasn't expecting much from this movie. My friend saw BvS and she doesn't care about Marvel or DC, she just loves good action movies and she hated it. She's the main reason I decided to not waste my money on it. 

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AyChihuahua

AyChihuahua

I'm one that was bored by Man of Steel, so I wasn't expecting much from this movie. My friend saw BvS and she doesn't care about Marvel or DC, she just loves good action movies and she hated it. She's the main reason I decided to not waste my money on it. 

Yeah, Man of Steel, to me, sucked in every way a technically competent movie can suck. I mean it wasn't Sharknado bad, but it was Transformers bad. I'm out of all ZS/DC movies bc of that. I've never been a huge Superman fan, but JFC. Have the Kents pretty much teach Superman not to give a F about helping humanity? What?

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Delphi

Delphi

I believe a whole lot of the hate towards BvS is out of love for the characters, but abject contempt for the people currently in charge of the characters. That's where I come from.

That's pretty much me. I've loved Batman since growing up watching the animated series and begging my parents to get me the comics so I could read more about him. I find everything Snyder did to that character gross and I don't want to watch that.

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FurryFury

FurryFury

Yeah I guess I can understand you guys. I never cared about comic books so I don't care about honoring the characters or anything. OTOH, I'm seriously broken up about an adaptation of my favorite book (or at least the casting), but I just prefer to forget it exists and go on with my life. (Plus, I'd be called a racist if I started writing it up anyway).

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dtissagirl

dtissagirl

For me it's less about honoring comics, and more with I have always thought Snyder was the hackiest of directors, and nothing he's ever done, in or out of the superhero genre, has told me otherwise. The themes he likes to explore mean nothing to me [and also don't fit either Supes or WW in any possible way], and his color palette tends to go from vomit to poo.

 

And then there's the way these movies are written, which: TROLOLOL forever.  The WB hires a bunch of writers, each writer separately works on a treatment, then WB picks a couple of those writers, who then take ALL of those treatments and cannibalize them into a script. I mean. WHAT THE SHIT.

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