Mind Your Surroundings: Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow and Other Superhero Universes

[bijoux]

10 hours ago, LeighAn said:

I'm thinking no Green Arrow and that Evil Oliver is actually Prometheus in this time line. But I've been wrong before haha.

I got the impression that the crossover EarthX is supposed to be the same one as in Freedom Fighters: The Ray. In the trailer that was posted earlier in this thread. There is definitely an evil Oliver wearing a GA suit with Nazi insignia on the arm sleeve there. I don't think he'll be EarthX Prometheus as well. Either it'll be someone else from Earth1 or, and this seems very likely to me, the same scenario as with Deathstroke last year, a stunt guy in a suit.

[BkWurm1]

10 hours ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Love the Arrow poster.

In the Legends poster, why does everyone look ready to fight while Ray looks so sad? 

Because they make him hang out with Nate all the time.

[Miss Dee]

He misses Mick. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

[BkWurm1]

2 hours ago, BkWurm1 said:

Because they make him hang out with Nate all the time.

1 minute ago, Miss Dee said:

He misses Mick. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

Two sides of the same coin if you ask me.  :D

[Velocity23]

[tv echo]

CROSSOVER: THE FLASH & ARROW’s Stephen Amell at Burnaby’s Former Youth Detention Centre
By Susan Gittins September 28, 2017  
http://hollywoodnorth.buzz/2017/09/crossover-the-flash-arrows-stephen-amell-at-burnabys-former-youth-detention-centre.html

Quote

The Flash began production on its crossover episode last Friday. And set up at Burnaby’s Former Youth Detention Centre earlier this week. There are jail cells but production likely chose the site for its outdoor privacy not far from The Flash and Arrow studios.
*  *  *
I drove by today and spotted Stephen Amell’s airstream in among The Flash trailers. And Amell later tweeted this photo from the grass.
*  *  *
(After filming overnight, Amell flew to Alberta in the morning on no sleep).

Likely Legends of Tomorrow’s Caity Lotz has spent a night or two filming there too.

Edited September 30, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

I watched the 2-hour premiere of Marvel's Inhumans last night. The good news is that I want to watch the next episode. The bad news is that I don't know why I want to continue watching because the show was mediocre (maybe to get closure?). The major characters were unlikeable and uninteresting, the CGI effects were bad, and many elements were derivative (I've never read the comics so maybe it's just comics canon?). The only characters I liked and found interesting were two supporting characters - Karnak (Ken Leung) and Gorgon (Eme Ikwuakor). I was going to write my own review, but then I read A.V. Club's review and it pretty much said almost everything I wanted to say (warning: SPOILERS)...

Weak acting and unlikable protagonists plague Marvel’s Inhumans
Caitlin Rosberg    Sep. 29, 2017
https://www.avclub.com/weak-acting-and-unlikable-protagonists-plague-marvel-s-1818969818

Some additional thoughts:

For Black Bolt, they needed to cast an actor who could convey thoughts, emotions and intentions nonverbally and create a compelling character without using words. I know this is possible because I've watched other actors portray compelling characters who couldn't talk (like Marlee Matlin in Children of a Lesser God and Patricia Arquette in Wildflower). Instead, they cast Anson Mount, who portrayed Black Bolt like a large block of wood who wasn't very bright and who seemed uncaring.(*)

(* I know that some have compared SA's portrayal of Oliver Queen in S1 of Arrow to a block of wood, but I never thought so. I thought SA did a good job of playing two very different Olivers, pre-island playboy and post-island survivor. I also think that SA manages to convey a lot just through his eyes. Marvel's Inhumans needed a Black Bolt actor with expressive eyes.

WIth respect to the human, Louise, she had a bigger part in the premiere than I expected. Her visual look did remind me a lot of Felicity (shape of face, blond ponytail, and glasses), especially from a distance, so that was a little disconcerting. However, Louise's personality was very different from Felicity's - no babbling, no effervescence, no personality - just a straightforward scientist type. Unfortunately, Louise (as portrayed by Ellen Woglom) was also bland, uninteresting and had zero screen presence.

Edited September 30, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

Here's another Felicity Smoak reference in this Marvel's Inhumans review (though, as I said above, I didn't think Louise was anything like Felicity except in visual look)...

Marvel’s Inhumans series premiere review: Is there any hope?
by Rob Wolkenbrod  Sep. 30, 2017
https://bamsmackpow.com/2017/09/29/marvels-inhumans-premiere-review-reaction/

Quote

... There’s even a Felicity Smoak-type character, no doubt to bring in the Arrow audience. ... 

Edited September 30, 2017 by tv echo

[tv echo]

I got a kick out of this article - it's reacting to that Vulture article, "DC Rethinks Its Universe," that I previously posted upthread...

Johns and Nelson: WHAT DC Cinematic Universe?
09/29/2017 4:30 PM BY HEIDI MACDONALD 
http://www.comicsbeat.com/johns-and-nelson-what-dc-cinematic-universe/

Quote

So it is that Abraham Riesman’s profile of Geoff Johns, Diane Nelson and WB/DC/DC Entertainment’s movie efforts for the last 10 years or so, is the emergence of the final , polished narrative of What Happened: from Dark Knight to BvS to Greg Berlanti to Wonder Woman. And along the way the triumphant Nelson/Johns duo start the whole new narrative namely, “Oh, we don’t need to try to do what Marvel is doing with that whole cinematic universe thing.”  
*  *  *
Like I’ve said many a time, there is only one Kevin Feige and trying to imitate him is not a winning strategy. So this new, “Let’s make more movies like Wonder Woman!” idea is an easy one to get behind. The story also firmly plants Nelson/Johns as uneasy sideline prophets whose dire warnings were ignored during the dark Man of Steel/Green Lantern/Batman V Superman years....
*  *  *
I’m not going to do a paragraph by paragraph annotation of the piece, but it very much names the winners and losers and sets everyone off on a hopeful note for Aquaman and the “Arrival of the TV people” as The Ankler is always calling the still not finalized ATT take over  of WB.
*  *  *
I’m still a little wary of the whole idea of the “Designer DC Cinematic Universe” with unrelated  takes on familiar characters. Until a little while ago I would have been thrilled to see a Darren Aronofsky styled DC picture, but he seems to have thrown out the baby with the bloodbath water with Mother. But yeah, a good idea in principle until fanboys become enraged.

So there you have it. After years of strife, misunderstanding and miscues, the right people are in charge at DC for the moment and Aquaman’s waters are as placid as Jason Momoa’s thought process. Just gotta get through this Justice League thing and all will be well…for a little while.

Edited September 30, 2017 by tv echo

[Velocity23]

To complete the other DCTV posters

[Velocity23]

I have a question regarding Ray? Was it ever revealed on either Arrow or LOT if Ray Palmer is Jewish in Arrowverse? 

[Morrigan2575]

I'm watching a documentary on Showtime called The Death of "Superman Lives", what happened?

They just talked about casting options. O always knew about Nick Cage as Superman which I never understood but, they auctioned Julianne Moore and Sandra Bullock for Lois Lane. They wanted Sandra (she turned them down) and now I can't help but imagine Sandra and Julianne as Lois and think perfect casting.

They also wanted Chris Rock for Jimmy Olsen which is interesting. I could almost see it, if he played Jimmy the same way he played Lethal Weapon 4.

The wanted Kevin Spacey for Lex Luthor which I still think was perfect casting, just needed the right script.

Edited September 30, 2017 by Morrigan2575

[way2interested]

Just now, Morrigan2575 said:

I'm watching a documentary on Showtime called The Death of "Superman Lives", what happened?

Oh yeah, I've seen that before. Really good documentary with lots of insight and concept art/footage/bts info. It made me really want them to make a documentary on the death of Justice League Mortal or something like that.

[statsgirl]

4 hours ago, tv echo said:

Here's another Felicity Smoak reference in this Marvel's Inhumans review (though, as I said above, I didn't think Louise was anything like Felicity except in visual look)...

Marvel’s Inhumans series premiere review: Is there any hope?
by Rob Wolkenbrod  Sep. 30, 2017
https://bamsmackpow.com/2017/09/29/marvels-inhumans-premiere-review-reaction/

The visual look had to have been on purpose -- she's a computer genius with midlength blonde hair, in a ponytail, and wears glasses. Even the shape of her face is similar.  (Contrast that to Garcia on Criminal Minds who is also blonde and a computer genius but very different-looking) But her range is grumpy to wooden and it's such a contrast to Felicity's character.

Serena looks so much like Starfire, complete to the red hair and purple dress. Is that on purpose too?

From the review:

Quote

Rheon is a not a big guy, and it does at least lend Maximus an air of Napoleonic resentment that’s useful in filling in the characterization gaps the writers left behind. But Rheon spends most of his scenes acting circles around other people, and he looks a little bored, which further highlights that Mount in particular was a bad choice for his role. Black Bolt’s power is that his voice creates destructive sonic blasts, so he spends the majority of the episode entirely mute; the problem is that Mount seems to have confused “mute” for “stoic” and “stoic” for “confused and maybe a little constipated.” He spends most of the 90 minutes scowling at everything, only showing a little bit of teasing humor by moving his eyebrows half an inch when interacting human police after his exile to Earth.

Mount’s flat affect is compounded by a lack of chemistry with Swan. In other shows with grand scope and large casts, that missing spark might be something easy to overcome, but Black Bolt relies heavily on Medusa to translate for him, and these two are supposed to be a love affair for the ages, if the swelling violins every time they’re alone together are any indication. Swan flings herself into her lines and delivers them with the kind of teeth-clenched, wet-eyed determination that show she could probably do pretty well with a better script, and she and her terrible wig steal every scene right out from under Mount’s nose.

Since Black Bolt communicates in with hand signs, I couldn't figure out why he wasn't trying to sign at the police station since he apparently understand English.  If even the cops couldn't read the signs, they'd know he can't speak rather than just being recalcitrant.

A problem I had with Medusa translating is the Swan says all the translations like she's doing a reading of Shakespeare and knows all of the text to come. In real life 2hen someone is translating, the phrases tend to come out rather flat since the translator doesn't know what the person is going to say next or how to emphasize it.  Medusa's dramatics while she was translating seemed very off.

[Featherhat]

2 hours ago, Velocity23 said:

I have a question regarding Ray? Was it ever revealed on either Arrow or LOT if Ray Palmer is Jewish in Arrowverse? 

They haven't said either way, but he was unable to Heil Hitler and punched a Nazi Officer in 1942, right after telling Jax to ignore the guy's racist comment about black people, so maybe, not that he has to be Jewish to be incapable of raising his arm in a Nazi salute, but it adds subtext to the scene, same with Stein singing Edelweiss at them the same club.  Since they haven't mentioned either way, I've assumed it because I can't see that there's reason to change it in this era of Because  Comics! and it's another way he's theoretically perfect for Felicity on paper (adorkable, goofy nerd genius, handsome *and* same religion) but ultimately not what she wants. 

2 hours ago, statsgirl said:

The visual look had to have been on purpose -- she's a computer genius with midlength blonde hair, in a ponytail, and wears glasses. Even the shape of her face is similar.  (Contrast that to Garcia on Criminal Minds who is also blonde and a computer genius but very different-looking) But her range is grumpy to wooden and it's such a contrast to Felicity's character.

 

I've now seen about half of it and yeah I think the visual was on purpose but the character is currently very different and extremely generic, the Felicity we'd have seen once or twice in S1 and never makes it past day player, which could so easily have happened. She might get more to do in future episodes and to be fair a lot of the acting and writing is so horrible she doesn't stand out as particularly awful, since everyone is flat at best. 

[catrox14]

45 minutes ago, Featherhat said:

They haven't said either way, but he was unable to Heil Hitler and punched a Nazi Officer in 1942, right after telling Jax to ignore the guy's racist comment about black people, so maybe, not that he has to be Jewish to be incapable of raising his arm in a Nazi salute, but it adds subtext to the scene, same with Stein singing Edelweiss at them the same club.  Since they haven't mentioned either way, I've assumed it because I can't see that there's reason to change it in this era of Because  Comics! and it's another way he's theoretically perfect for Felicity on paper (adorkable, goofy nerd genius, handsome *and* same religion) but ultimately not what she wants. 

I've now seen about half of it and yeah I think the visual was on purpose but the character is currently very different and extremely generic, the Felicity we'd have seen once or twice in S1 and never makes it past day player, which could so easily have happened. She might get more to do in future episodes and to be fair a lot of the acting and writing is so horrible she doesn't stand out as particularly awful, since everyone is flat at best. 

Poor Man's Felicity Smoak

[Primal Slayer]

Just finished Inhumans and wow it was so generic and bland, I don't think there was anything surprising about any of it. I think big part of it is that Blackbolt and fam are over thrown so quickly yet I don't know any of these characters so I have a hard time actually feeling anything for any of them. 

[statsgirl]

2 hours ago, Primal Slayer said:

I think big part of it is that Blackbolt and fam are over thrown so quickly yet I don't know any of these characters so I have a hard time actually feeling anything for any of them. 

And what we did see of them showed that they were entitled, often self-centered people so it's hard to feel sorry that they were overthrown.  They happily lived in their bright world while people those who didn't show some capacity were forced to work int the mines  and live in some bad housing.  If Maximus hadn't been a moustache-twirling villain, he would have been the hero of underground movements everywhere.

 

On 9/28/2017 at 11:38 PM, Primal Slayer said:

It was definitely of its time and I guess the "Golden Age"? of superhero tv? lol

It was so cool to watch back then but soooooo corny and laughable now. 

Corny and laughable, ,yes, but it seems just like the Arrowverse stunts are right now.   Especially the supermodelhero V.

[BkWurm1]

I miss Bart.  

[Starfish35]

I see the finished version of the Arrow poster is out - has anyone seen the finished version of the Legends poster yet?

[tofutan]

I've been wondering, with Olicity and Westallen both begin married people after the crossover, anybody else feel kind of suspicious? Like it seems hard to believe that they would really allow both of them to be happy. So I'm kinda waiting for "oh, wedding gets erased from history, dark secret from the past destroys everything, woman gets killed off or fridged so hero can angst" anvil to drop (more likely on Westallen because they already talked about the challenge to stay married). 

[Featherhat]

14 minutes ago, tofutan said:

I've been wondering, with Olicity and Westallen both begin married people after the crossover, anybody else feel kind of suspicious? Like it seems hard to believe that they would really allow both of them to be happy. So I'm kinda waiting for "oh, wedding gets erased from history, dark secret from the past destroys everything, woman gets killed off or fridged so hero can angst" anvil to drop (more likely on Westallen because they already talked about the challenge to stay married). 

I doubt it will be plain sailing just because they're married, hell one or both couples might well have cliffhangers for the MSFs that are one episode later. IIRC The Flash writers have already teased that it won't necessarily be happily ever after for WA right now, though it's more likely to be something Barry does to mess with the universe than a break up because of a lie/trust issues ala Arrow S4. It's the 4th season of a show they hope could go 10+ seasons and even though its been low key about romance I'd be surprised if there weren't some major bumps for them. 

For Olicity it's one of the reasons I didn't want them to get married so early in the season, it ups the possibility of shit going FUBR in the 2nd half ala S4 or Felicity being Fridged/teased as fridged (again) as a cliffhanger, though I hope they're done with the OTT BMD style storylines they got bashed so hard for in S4 since their getting back together was/is relatively low key. But zero chance both couples will be happy from here on out. If nothing else it theoretically gives them the opportunity to have another celebration on their own shows as well as their big crossover double weddings. 

2 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

I see the finished version of the Arrow poster is out - has anyone seen the finished version of the Legends poster yet?

Not that I've seen. It should appear within the next couple of days though since it premieres before Arrow. 

[FurryFury]

Ooh, so Cassidy from Veronica Mars was Bart Allen? Haha, I wonder if they'll find a cameo for him on The Flash now.

[Velocity23]

[Chaser]

Goodbyes to Legends / Danvers.

Does that mean its only the Arrow and Flash crew at the weddings?

[apinknightmare]

They all come together for Barry and Iris’s wedding and then don’t even stay for it? LOL  

[Starfish35]

16 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

They all come together for Barry and Iris’s wedding and then don’t even stay for it? LOL  

Ok that's weird.

[Chaser]

I can't remember, do they say everyone comes together for the WA or did we all assume it?

I feel like they said something but maybe the first wedding is just Arrow/Flash with the others crashing

[bijoux]

Didn't a pap say Alex was Kara's plus one? That implies an invitation to me.

[Featherhat]

3 minutes ago, bijoux said:

Didn't a pap say Alex was Kara's plus one? That implies an invitation to me.

Yeah. It's weird if they gather for the wedding and it gets crashed only to shoot right after the funeral and before the actual weddings. Doesn't that defeat the entire purpose of wanting everyone together for the double weddings?

15 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I can't remember, do they say everyone comes together for the WA or did we all assume it?

I feel like they said something but maybe the first wedding is just Arrow/Flash with the others crashing

I thought they had said that but it might be that EX crashes the wedding and they call for back up like the last big crossover. 

[insomniadreams88]

So that means Ray and Sara won't be at O/F's wedding. Thank. God. I never wanted exes at their wedding. 

I guess after the Legends and Kara and Alex leave, the couples realize, "let's get married." Maybe since the Legends are losing a member of their team, they don't feel like sticking around? Which makes sense. 

[tv echo]

Another Felicity Smoak reference in another article about Marvel's Inhumans...

Inhumans Photos: “Make Way For… Medusa”
Sep 25, 2017  Craig Byrne
http://www.ksitetv.com/inhumans/inhumans-photos-make-way-medusa/161958/

Quote

Apparently, the show also succeeds in perfecting the bad wig by cutting off Medusa’s hair. Okay. You can see Medusa (Serinda Swan) in several photos from this episode alongside Not!Felicity Smoak.

 
 

Edited October 1, 2017 by tv echo

[BkWurm1]

3 hours ago, insomniadreams88 said:

So that means Ray and Sara won't be at O/F's wedding. Thank. God. I never wanted exes at their wedding. 

I guess after the Legends and Kara and Alex leave, the couples realize, "let's get married." Maybe since the Legends are losing a member of their team, they don't feel like sticking around? Which makes sense. 

I don't mind the exes since they are pretty far removed at this point, but it makes so much more sense to have the wedding if the ones most affected by the funeral have left.  

Definitely speaks to which are the two most important shows in the line up.  

[way2interested]

7 minutes ago, BkWurm1 said:

Definitely speaks to which are the two most important shows in the line up.

Yeah, so basically like last year where they ended the whole crossover with Barry and Oliver despite being the LoT episode.

[Trini]

10 hours ago, tofutan said:

I've been wondering, with Olicity and Westallen both begin married people after the crossover, anybody else feel kind of suspicious? Like it seems hard to believe that they would really allow both of them to be happy. So I'm kinda waiting for "oh, wedding gets erased from history, dark secret from the past destroys everything, woman gets killed off or fridged so hero can angst" anvil to drop (more likely on Westallen because they already talked about the challenge to stay married). 

I'm not suspicious; it's TV, and in particular comic book shows, so there will always be something going on. With WestAllen we know they stay married until at least 2024.

 

4 hours ago, Chaser said:

I can't remember, do they say everyone comes together for the WA or did we all assume it?

I've seen it phrased slightly differently on different sites, but they're reporting the same basic premise: "While heroes from the four CW shows gather in town to celebrate Barry and Iris’ nuptials, villains from Earth-X crash the festivities with a deadly agenda."

[way2interested]

13 minutes ago, Trini said:

With WestAllen we know they stay married until at least 2024.

Until they change the future byline again for dramatic purposes, I guess.

[Lily-n11]

20 minutes ago, Trini said:

I'm not suspicious; it's TV, and in particular comic book shows, so there will always be something going on. With WestAllen we know they stay married until at least 2024.

 Or... Somewhere between 2017 and 2024 they will get a divorce and then get married a second time. It is a comic book show after all. 

Edited October 1, 2017 by Lily-n11

[insomniadreams88]

1 minute ago, way2interested said:

Until they change the future byline again for dramatic purposes, I guess.

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if The Flash MSF ends with a glimpse at the byline changed. I'm not saying it will, but I wouldn't be surprised if it does. Especially with the tease out there about whether they can stay married or whatever the quote was. Sort of like how Arrow 410 showed Felicity without the ring. 

[quarks]

15 minutes ago, Trini said:

I'm not suspicious; it's TV, and in particular comic book shows, so there will always be something going on. With WestAllen we know they stay married until at least 2024.

(raises eyebrows)

Do we? Because it's show canon that the Iris West-Allen byline from 2024 has vanished or changed before this.  Canon to the point where, just last season, no one on the show argued that there was no reason to worry - after all, they had an Iris West-Allen byline from the future showing that she survived.  And meanwhile, that same future paper that initially used the Iris West-Allen byline also mentioned Queen Consolidated, a company that, in Arrow show canon, changed its name to Palmer Tech - and there's been no indications from any of the Arrow showrunners that Felicity and Oliver are going to set up another Queen Consolidated. Another company, sure, but probably not with that name.

And I think Lily-n11 makes another good point - Barry and Iris could always end up divorcing and getting married again in the future. It's television, after all.

[Trini]

Well, I'm not as invested in them breaking up. The byline is there now, so I think it can be taken as a positive sign for them.

[Featherhat]

30 minutes ago, quarks said:

(raises eyebrows)

Do we? Because it's show canon that the Iris West-Allen byline from 2024 has vanished or changed before this.  Canon to the point where, just last season, no one on the show argued that there was no reason to worry - after all, they had an Iris West-Allen byline from the future showing that she survived.  And meanwhile, that same future paper that initially used the Iris West-Allen byline also mentioned Queen Consolidated, a company that, in Arrow show canon, changed its name to Palmer Tech - and there's been no indications from any of the Arrow showrunners that Felicity and Oliver are going to set up another Queen Consolidated. Another company, sure, but probably not with that name.

And I think Lily-n11 makes another good point - Barry and Iris could always end up divorcing and getting married again in the future. It's television, after all.

True, hey then they get a wedding on their own as well. Although I think it's more likely that Barry messes with time or the multiverse again and that has them breaking up somehow rather than a divorce or separation over the time Barry spends superhero-ing etc, though since they like to recycle I guess they might fight/separate over lying and trust at one point. 

Even if they stay together from now until the end of the show I can see that byline changing several times between now and then just to cause cliffhangers. 

[tofutan]

Maybe the couples decide that they want a private, small ceremony wedding after all? But it seems superweird that the Legends would disappear from the wedding when it technically takes place on a Legends episode. And if I was Kara, I'd be kinda pissed if I crossed universes only to have Barry and Iris get married without her after all. 

[Midnight Lullaby]

I hope they stay away from a possible divorce SL..I absolutely expect drama at some point though. It's television..

[scarynikki12]

31 minutes ago, tofutan said:

the Legends would disappear from the wedding when it technically takes place on a Legends episode.

This is exactly why I wish they'd just make a tv movie.  I love LOT and do not want the show to again end with characters (even ones I like) from other shows.  Plus, the network tv movie needs to be revitalized anyway. 

[insomniadreams88]

The more I hear, the more it really sounds like they planned this out with the order being Supergirl (Alex/Sara hookup), The Flash, LoT (Stein could die at some point in hour 3) and then Arrow (Legends leave before the end so it ends with WA and O/F weddings). 

[Mrs. de Winter]

4 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I love LOT and do not want the show to again end with characters (even ones I like) from other shows.

Maybe they leave before the wedding so the show can go back to them in the final scene? 

I keep wondering if the end isn't going to be some sort of montage -- it seems hard to believe they are going to go through two wedding ceremonies at the end of the episode - and it seems like they have a lot of wrap-up (funeral, goodbyes, weddings, etc.) to get done in a fairly quickly.

[Primal Slayer]

23 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

This is exactly why I wish they'd just make a tv movie.  I love LOT and do not want the show to again end with characters (even ones I like) from other shows.  Plus, the network tv movie needs to be revitalized anyway. 

Isn't this just a "modern" tv movie though? At least CWs version. I don't think we will be getting individual openings for each show like in the past since it's suppose to be a true 4hr movie.

[quarks]

29 minutes ago, Trini said:

The byline is there now, so I think it can be taken as a positive sign for them.

I would agree, except that this seems to me to be an absolutely fundamental misreading of The Flash - the very point of which is to argue that the future is not set in stone, and can always be changed by choices people make. As demonstrated by Iris and H.R. last season, when Iris decided that she didn't like her then-future, and H.R. agreed to sacrifice himself so she could change it.

In turn, I think this point is the one of the major reasons why The Flash is generally the most amoral of the four Arrowverse shows (five if we include Vixen), hands down, and even of the DC shows if we're including Gotham and Lucifer. For the most part, granted, it's a hopeful argument - the future isn't set in stone! We can change it! Don't despair!  You, too, can change your future, even if you don't have superpowers (or a friend willing to sacrifice himself on your behalf, but let's move on). But that very hopefulness in turn means that Flash often takes a perhaps unintended callousness towards those changes and decisions. I know we joke around this forum about how death never seems to stick on Arrow (though at least that awful DJ isn't back) but Arrow at least pretends that it can, which means that in turn, for the most part, it takes those decisions more seriously. Legends of Tomorrow and Supergirl like to show the drastic results of those decisions.  But with Flash, that whole "eh, we can change things," along with its casual sense that only Barry (and Team Flash) are capable of taking care of metahumans/the metahuman threat, (in strong contrast to the other three shows, all of which question, in script, whether their protagonists/teams are the best/only available option, with all three shows frequently responding with, well, no), often gives the show an amoral tone. Because does it really matter what decisions you make, if the outcomes of those decisions can be so easily changed later? In some cases, without you even realizing it?

Meanwhile, back to the byline: Flash has also played with the idea of destiny and very specifically Iris by showing Iris, and often only Iris, looking at the future and going, yeah, no.  She knew about the byline back at the end of season one, and still chose to stay with Eddie.  When he died, she spent a full season still resisting that destiny/future.  When she finally gave in to destiny in the third season, it led to her "destined" death in the future - which she looked at and said, yeah, no. It's one of her best character traits and why she's alive: her insistence that she can and will still make her own choices and life no matter what a future computer headline says. 

[tofutan]

The new Chris Wood interview has some hints about the new season, but mostly that he's been sworn to secrecy: 

Quote

How soon do we find out where he went and what he's been doing?
You know, sort of right away. Obviously, that's a central part of the story for Kara (Melissa Benoist), in terms of where he is and if she can get him back and all that. I can't say specifics on when he comes back, but there are some subtle hints that start coming in the first couple moments of the season opener, and they try to piece together what's going on. It sort of comes out of left field, his return, if you will.

Usually when superheroes go missing, it's never into a good place. They never disappear into paradise. It's always some hellhole.
Yeah, there is a long-standing history of that not being a great thing. He's going to be a very different Mon-El than what we saw last year, largely due to the whole mystery surrounding where he went and what he's been doing. It definitely affects him. He's been somewhere, doing something. [Laughs]

That is not vague at all!
But it's completely shrouded in mystery and they've sworn me to secrecy on specifics, but there's going to be a big change in him when he comes back, too, that worries the team.

Without giving anything away, have you been outfitted for a new costume this season?
Believe it or not, I had a costume last season that I did fittings for before we even started! It was built and ready to go, but the way that the story played out, I think that the producers felt that revealing the suit too early, when Mon-El was still figuring it out, wasn't going to be as impactful as getting him in a suit when he's actually had that heroic breakthrough. You know, when he's actually feeling, from his core, motivated to do good, as opposed to being told, "Hey, you should do good," right?

So there always has been a suit, and I can promise that there actually will be sightings of it this year. I wasn't lying last year when I said that there was a suit. It's just they changed it, and we just never saw it. It is around the corner.

TV Insider

I'm guessing that stuff about the little hint in the premiere is about Mon-El being on Titan and the fans figured it out almost instantly (admittedly: together with the behind the scenes spoiler people who revealed that Saturngirl and Titan would play a role). 

[LeighAn]

Also since Candice Patton herself said the writers have dropped Iris as a Journalist storyline  even though she's been pushing for it, I'm going to assume they really don't care or will pay much attention to their past canon byline ?‍♀️