S04.E06: A League of Her Own

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Quote

After coming out of the closet to Honey and Jessica, Nicole struggles with telling Marvin, fearful that her father will be disappointed in her. Meanwhile, Louis wants to manage the Cattleman’s Ranch softball team on his own, so Jessica decides to coach the rival team from The Denim Turtle to prove that she is the superior manager. Chaos is sure to ensue when everyone gathers for the big game at the Greater Orlando Bar and Restaurant tournament.

[memememe76]

I absolutely loved this episode. All around wonderful. Also, anything involving the Saturn is gold.

[mortonsalt]

1 minute ago, memememe76 said:

I absolutely loved this episode. All around wonderful. Also, anything involving the Saturn is gold.

Yes, this was a great episode. Evan wasn't bratty, no mention of the bad year subplot, and Jessica wasn't obnoxiously written. Loved that Marvin was fine with Nicole coming out and that he was only upset about what he had said earlier to her.

Loved the bar scene too, but I really wanted to know what the other song would have been if Honey hadn't been happy with Nicole coming out.

[Star Aristille]

5 hours ago, mortonsalt said:

Loved the bar scene too, but I really wanted to know what the other song would have been if Honey hadn't been happy with Nicole coming out.

I did, too.  Not to mention what the cot in the back Deb called to have prepared would've been for.  But I'm ashamed to admit that the first thing I thought about when they played the song after Honey did accept Nicole was Mr. (then Mrs.) Garrison's scissoring scene on South Park (as that song played seconds before it).

That said, I like that this episode focused on Honey and Marvin's family, for once, and that the Huangs got all of the subplots instead of the main plot.  That's . . . probably why this episode was so good.  The Huangs weren't the focus.

I find it hard to believe that someone Jessica's age wouldn't know that women can be gay, too.  But then again, it looks like it took her only until this episode for her to finally realize that the Denim Turtle is a lesbian bar, so maybe I shouldn't be so surprised.

I liked the little subplot of Louis and Matthew and thought that it was sweetly resolved with him keeping the team intact regardless of them losing the game in the end.

Honestly, Eddie was so materialistic about his new jersey, I was more than fine with it getting ruined at the end.

Very little Evan and Emery, and no Jenny at all.  Wonder where she was?

Edited November 8, 2017 by Star Aristille

[Mr. Sparkle]

I totally did not mist up when Marvin was waiting at home plate for Nicole. You can't prove it. 

[Rockstar99435]

7 hours ago, Star Aristille said:

I did, too.  Not to mention what the cot in the back Deb called to have prepared would've been for. 

I assumed the cot was to give Nicole a place to stay if Honey's reaction was to kick her out. I loved all the women in the bar immediately getting quiet and watching the exchange. And I loved how happy they were for her and how much support she got from them. 

 

4 hours ago, Superclam said:

I totally did not mist up when Marvin was waiting at home plate for Nicole. You can't prove it. 

Me too! I loved how supportive he was while still tagging her out. Plus, his "the pun was right there. I had to take it" made me giggle more than it should.

[Blakeston]

11 hours ago, mortonsalt said:

Yes, this was a great episode. Evan wasn't bratty, no mention of the bad year subplot, and Jessica wasn't obnoxiously written.

I found Jessica a lot more tolerable than usual. But she definitely irritated me with her insistence on coaching against Louis.

His team was obviously extremely important to him, and he'd been told he needed a victory to keep it going. And she had no reason to oppose him, other than her delusions.

[Racj82]

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I found Jessica a lot more tolerable than usual. But she definitely irritated me with her insistence on coaching against Louis.

His team was obviously extremely important to him, and he'd been told he needed a victory to keep it going. And she had no reason to oppose him, other than her delusions.

I was waiting for her to support him by letting him win since there was no reason to actually oppose him anyway. But, nope, Jessica wins and/or is right again. No, I still don't like her at the moment. 

[tennisgurl]

That was probably my favorite episode of the season! I loved the focus on Honey and Marvin's family, and how Nicole's coming out to her family went. I loved how Nicole and Honey have gotten closer, and Marvin's reaction to Nicole coming out. It was just so sweet! I also really like Nicole and Eddie being friends, and how they confide in each other. It shows a more mature side to Eddie, when when he acts ridiculous about things like jerseys. 

I also loved how the whole bar was watching super intensely when Nicole came out to Honey, and were so excited and supportive of Nicole. "Get the champagne, and the cot." I assume the cot was if Nicole got kicked out of her house? But dont worry, we have champagne and acceptance! I too am interested in what the song would have been if Nicole hadn't accepted her. 

[partofme]

Didn’t like this episode at all but I’m not a big fan of sports.   Not enough of the kids and I missed Eddie’s friends and grandma.

[smash]

I'm not one for sappy endings, but I totally loved the resolution between Marvin and Nicole. He was obviously distraught upon hearing the news, but it was because he was beating himself up about that comment about playing for the other team. 

Lol at Bev passing out because she stayed up watching the VH1 awards.

[possibilities]

I liked all the same stuff most people liked, but I also thought it was worth noting that both Eddie and his mom think Denzel is super hot.

[MaryHedwig]

16 hours ago, possibilities said:

I liked all the same stuff most people liked, but I also thought it was worth noting that both Eddie and his mom think Denzel is super hot.

I notice that same thing. I was also struck by his comment, "not even in a suit?" Is that a foreshadowing to revelations about Eddie's orientation in the future? 

Edited November 10, 2017 by MaryHedwig

[Blakeston]

13 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I also loved how the whole bar was watching super intensely when Nicole came out to Honey, and were so excited and supportive of Nicole. "Get the champagne, and the cot." I assume the cot was if Nicole got kicked out of her house? 

Oh, wow, that makes perfect sense. I was thinking the cot was for Honey, if she passed out.

1 hour ago, MaryHedwig said:

I notice that same thing. I wasn't also struck by his comment, "not even in a suit?" Is that a foreshadowing to revelations about Eddie's orientation in the future? 

I took it more as recognition that anyone should be able to recognize Denzel's hotness, even straight guys.

[DrSparkles]

Just chiming in to say how much I also loved this episode and I ADORE Constance Wu!!!

[galax-arena]

I'm not one for sappy endings, but I totally loved the resolution between Marvin and Nicole. He was obviously distraught upon hearing the news, but it was because he was beating himself up about that comment about playing for the other team.

Yeah, I was wondering how it would play out with Marvin. Considering his age and the era - the 90s aren't ancient times, but we've really come leaps and bounds since then when it comes to empathy towards gay people - it would have been realistic for him to have a bad reaction, but I couldn't see this show really going there. I don't know how unrealistic it was for Marvin to be as fine with it as he was, but I'm happy with it*. Even in the 90s there were old farts who accepted gay folk. 

IA that the Huangs seem more likable because for once they weren't the focus... on the flip side, it's kinda fucked up that a show that was revolutionary for centering around an Asian-American family has to sideline said Asian-American family at this point to make them more likable. Note, I'm not blaming anyone here, since I feel the same way; it's a fault of the show's writing IMO. 

* Especially if he's going to turn into one of those embarrassing dads who constantly asks Nicole if so-and-so is her girlfriend and tries to set her up. Because Marvin is a supportive dad, dammit! 

[ItCouldBeWorse]

2 hours ago, galax-arena said:

Especially if he's going to turn into one of those embarrassing dads who constantly asks Nicole if so-and-so is her girlfriend and tries to set her up.

And would likely have been much more suspicious of any guy who tried to date her.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

I love that Eddie and Nicole are still having Saturn talks, but I agree with Nicole about establishing what is Saturnworthy. There are lots of things you can talk about outside the Saturn!

I am really enjoying their friendship. Eddie is being supportive of this huge secret in her life and she's trying not to be judgmental about his ridiculous BOOTYMAN baseball jersey. The double zeros are like a butt - oh, Eddie.

I legit laughed when the guy who didn't want to play threw the baseball while it was still in his mitt. I also loved when he said he couldn't throw so Louis told him to just roll the ball to him.

Loved everyone at the Denim Turtle preparing for both possible outcomes of Nicole coming out to Honey. The joyful celebrating with champagne and Melissa Etheridge was awesome. Yes, the cot in the back was in case Honey rejected her and Nicole needed a place to stay.

The Michael Bolton's Kenny Rogers' Cattleman's Ranch Steakhouse name going all the way down the front of the jerseys cracked me up.

And hey, we got confirmation that it's November 1997!

[Jac]

I loved the episode but I feel that the handling of Nicole’s coming out was very 2017 and not really how things would have gone down in 1997. I am queer and as far as I can figure Nicole’s exact age (I was 15 in 1997) and the coming out felt inauthentic compared to my own experiences. That said I find that o be one of the shows bigger flaws in general, it is a period piece when it suits him but much of the storytelling is sone through an explicitly contemporary lens.

[Camera One]

I remember the first TV episode I watched which dealt with coming out was on the sitcom "Ellen" in 1997, so I wonder if that had any effect on Nicole's realization.  Even though parts of the episode felt contemporary, the issue was starting to become more common at that time.  I think the "cot" comment did acknowledge that many parents would not have accepted their child coming out (even now, a subset of homeless teens were kicked out of their home due to sexuality).  The first TV episode I remember watching about a teenager coming out was "Dawson's Creek" in Season 2, in 1999.  

I enjoyed seeing Honey and Nicole's relationship.  The baseball stuff I wasn't as interested in.  

[Ottis]

On 11/7/2017 at 10:15 PM, mortonsalt said:

Loved that Marvin was fine with Nicole coming out and that he was only upset about what he had said earlier to her.

I struggled with this. Anyone who understood how important this moment was to Nicole would not let their one side comment ruin the moment. Marvin should have expressed support and then apologized for his earlier comment, noting it was a pun, etc. He unnecessarily caused his daughter angst by putting his own embarrassment above what he had to have known was a seminal moment in Nicole's life.

While I think Nicole's story line is the best thing about this show, it stands out in tone from all the silliness. It feels inauthentic. Has the show dealt with any other meaningful theme this sensitively? It made fun of death. It mocked the relationship between Jessica and her dad before passing it off as one that works for them for some unknown reason. Cattleman's Ranch is one long joke.

Also, Eddie seems to have grown the hell up fast - not physically, but in maturity. Pretty much since last season. That, too, seems weird, though I like this Eddie better.

[readster]

1 hour ago, Ottis said:

 

Also, Eddie seems to have grown the hell up fast - not physically, but in maturity. Pretty much since last season. That, too, seems weird, though I like this Eddie better.

It has been a good change for Eddie and even showing when his brother ruined the couch, trying to show despite maturity. All the boys are still young, but I think it came with how the REAL Eddie was in life that by this point he started using his brain more for things. 

[Monx]

On 11/12/2017 at 3:58 PM, Jac said:

I loved the episode but I feel that the handling of Nicole’s coming out was very 2017 and not really how things would have gone down in 1997. I am queer and as far as I can figure Nicole’s exact age (I was 15 in 1997) and the coming out felt inauthentic compared to my own experiences. That said I find that o be one of the shows bigger flaws in general, it is a period piece when it suits him but much of the storytelling is sone through an explicitly contemporary lens.

I understand what you mean. For me though, the coming out (even if it might have been anachronistic for the time period) was such a breath of fresh air. I was so worried it was going to go the other way. And yes, maybe it is unrealistic to the average experience, but it's nice to have T.V shows just normalising minorities. Instead of rehashing the same obligatory angst storyline over and over again.  

It’s sort of the same feeling I have about racism storylines. Like yes, off course poc experience racism, but must every T.V character of colour have to have a horrible storyline regarding racism? Sometimes I just want to watch something fun with people who look like me, and not be reminded off the other stuff. Does this make sense? Anyway, YMMV.

[LisaM]

I thought this was a great episode. My only question: when did Nicole and Honey get so close? Last I recall, Nicole was basically ignoring Honey and didn't like her at all. 

Love the Saturn chats.