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Premature Unfurling: TV spoilers & speculation

Happy Harpy

By Happy Harpy
in Lucifer [V]

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Sakura12
Sakura12

Why couldn't they bring in Lilith? I'm sure the Queen of demons would be a thorn in Lucifer's side. Then we can have Maze dealing with her mother. 

Mabinogia
Mabinogia

This is what makes me frustrated more than anything. Here they have this amazing pantheon to choose from, so many amazing mythic stories to expand upon, and they choose "what if the Devil fell in love

Sakura12
Sakura12

I wasn't upset when this show was canceled, then I was surprised it got picked up by Netflex. I thought maybe they can do more with a company that gives more freedom, make it more supernatural with mo

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

Scoop on Lucifer http://tvline.com/2018/03/02/lucifer-season-3-spoilers-lucifer-chloe-pierce-triangle/

Quote

Have any scoop on the Pierce/Chloe romantic relationship on Lucifer? —Emily
“After Monday’s episode, Chloe and Lucifer seem closer than ever, don’t they?” co-showrunenr Joe Henderson tells Inside Line. “What better time for a wrench to get thrown in the works?? Expect Pierce/Chloe to start heating up very soon… and Lucifer may be partially to blame for it!

 

What is this? A soap opera? Now, all we need is Charlotte's ex-husband back in the mix and then every character on the show is involved in a love triangle. Maybe they need some fresh blood on the creative team because this one seems to be out of ideas.

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johntfs

johntfs

1 hour ago, CheshireCat said:

Scoop on Lucifer http://tvline.com/2018/03/02/lucifer-season-3-spoilers-lucifer-chloe-pierce-triangle/

 

What is this? A soap opera? Now, all we need is Charlotte's ex-husband back in the mix and then every character on the show is involved in a love triangle. Maybe they need some fresh blood on the creative team because this one seems to be out of ideas.

See, my thing is that I don't really see much in the way of love triangles.  Lucifer and Chloe seem to have pretty well "friend-zoned" each other.  I can see Lucifer getting concerned about Chloe and Pierce but only because Pierce is an immortal who wants to die so he's not really good relationship material for Chloe.  Maze isn't attracted to Amenadiel or Linda in a real romantic way.  She just didn't like them deceiving her and doesn't like Amenadiel "poaching" her friend.  If you wanted to squint, you could see Chloe's attraction to Pierce and Ella weird hero crush on him as a kind of "love triangle" but it very much feels like writer fiat since both women should be realizing "He's my boss.  There's no way this won't end badly for me, him or likely both of us."

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Ria

Ria

On 3/2/2018 at 7:18 PM, CheshireCat said:

What is this? A soap opera?

Sure seems like it. What happened to this show? The writers have no idea what to do with any of the characters so they’ve fallen back on romantic plot lines. Not what I tuned into this show for. 

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

On ‎02‎.‎03‎.‎2018 at 9:03 PM, johntfs said:

See, my thing is that I don't really see much in the way of love triangles.  Lucifer and Chloe seem to have pretty well "friend-zoned" each other.  I can see Lucifer getting concerned about Chloe and Pierce but only because Pierce is an immortal who wants to die so he's not really good relationship material for Chloe.  Maze isn't attracted to Amenadiel or Linda in a real romantic way.  She just didn't like them deceiving her and doesn't like Amenadiel "poaching" her friend.  If you wanted to squint, you could see Chloe's attraction to Pierce and Ella weird hero crush on him as a kind of "love triangle" but it very much feels like writer fiat since both women should be realizing "He's my boss.  There's no way this won't end badly for me, him or likely both of us."

I'm actually not sure that Maze isn't supposed to be attracted to Amenadiel. I was under the Impression that she was jealous when she first discovered Linda and Amenadiel together.

Yes, there isn't much attraction between Chloe and Pierce but that might be due to German more than due to TPTB's intention since I get a friend vibe from Lucifer and Chloe and not a romantic vibe even though that's clearly what TPTB want. Ella was also pushing the idea of Chloe and Pierce and since Lucifer is supposed to be in love with Chloe, there'll automatically be a love triangle when Pierce and Chloe get closer.

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johntfs

johntfs

45 minutes ago, CheshireCat said:

I'm actually not sure that Maze isn't supposed to be attracted to Amenadiel. I was under the Impression that she was jealous when she first discovered Linda and Amenadiel together.

Maze was jealous, but she was jealous of Amenadiel for "stealing" her friend, Linda.

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

(edited)
49 minutes ago, UNOSEZ said:

Chloe.... Is still on the show 

And it looks like she's about to get closer to Lucifer. This is Tom Ellis' response to someone who wanted a comment about being "excited" about Lucifer "conquering" Chloe romantically and Lucifer telling Chloe who he is.

Edited by CheshireCat
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johntfs

johntfs

After the Winter break, I had to choose between Lucifer and Legends of Tomorrow because they were in the same time slot, I work those hours and can only record one of them.  Because it came back first, I picked LoT and I feel kind of relieved but sad that I clearly very much backed the right horse.  WTF happened to my cool show about The Devil in LA?

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Notwisconsin

Notwisconsin

(edited)

Okay, a couple of general notes. Maze is a DEMON. Her job is to punish people horribly for minor infractions. She cannot forgive as that's not how she was wired. This is the basis of her character. She is capable of "like" but not "love." The humans in the know do not realize that.

Second: Peirce does not want to die. That, he knows, would send him to Hell for an eternity of punishment and pain. He wants what eastern religions call Nirvana, joyous oblivion with the destruction of the self. By helping Chole, who has magic powers she doesn't now about, attain enlightenment, he thinks he can achieve Nirvana and cease the eternal suffering.

Edited by Notwisconsin
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rainsmom

rainsmom

7 hours ago, Notwisconsin said:

Okay, a couple of general notes. Maze is a DEMON. Her job is to punish people horribly for minor infractions. She cannot forgive as that's not how she was wired. This is the basis of her character. She is capable of "like" but not "love." The humans in the know do not realize that.

What infraction has everyone other than Linda or Amenadiel committed? Because she's acting like a spurned teenager, NOT a demon. She hasn't brought demonic wrath upon Linda or Amenadiel. She is mostly just acting immaturely pissy. Plus this arc has been stretched out way too far with no progress. She has been acting this way for months. MOVE ON. Progress! Hell, bring on the demonic wrath. Just DO something beyond acting like a brat.

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Ria

Ria

(edited)
1 hour ago, Notwisconsin said:

It doesn't matter. She is constitutionally incapable of forgiveness. She cannot grow emotionally.

 She’s exhibited a great deal of emotional growth until now. She was originally resentful and jealous of Chloe and not only forgave her but became friends with her. 

Edited by Ria
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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

55 minutes ago, MostlyC said:

I'm wondering if it's Maze  (and god I hope not).

In the TV Line comment section someone pointed out that Maze, Lucifer and Chloe are all mentioned in the following episode's summary.

 

2 hours ago, TVHappy9463 said:

Pretty sure Pierce is the death.  Chloe learns the truth.  Which works as a series finale or a set up for next season. 

I've read the descriptions that Lucifer receives a "tragic phone call". Why would Lucifer receive a phone call about Pierce's death and why would it be tragic? From that description, I'd say Amenadiel, but Amenadiel is still immortal, isn't he? That leaves Linda or Charlotte.

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TVHappy9463

TVHappy9463

18 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

In the TV Line comment section someone pointed out that Maze, Lucifer and Chloe are all mentioned in the following episode's summary.

 

I've read the descriptions that Lucifer receives a "tragic phone call". Why would Lucifer receive a phone call about Pierce's death and why would it be tragic? From that description, I'd say Amenadiel, but Amenadiel is still immortal, isn't he? That leaves Linda or Charlotte.

I don’t think the phone call and the death are related.  He is the devil. No matter who dies he doesn’t get a phone call.  I think it’s a red herring.  

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

2 minutes ago, TVHappy9463 said:

I don’t think the phone call and the death are related.  He is the devil. No matter who dies he doesn’t get a phone call.  I think it’s a red herring.  

What else other than a death would a tragic phone call be about? Because it does very much sound like he is getting a "tragic phone call".

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enoughcats

enoughcats

Tragic phone call?  do not let it be Trixie.  

Speaking of, I have been copying this year's episodes, and Maze said to Douche,

"I am sick of your ex-wife and that stupid little brat of yours." 

And Maze looks at the open door, Douche turns around and they both see Trixie's stricken face before Trixie turns and runs away.

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

16 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

What else other than a death would a tragic phone call be about? Because it does very much sound like he is getting a "tragic phone call".

Oh please let it be the call that says Chloe was killed in the line of duty. Please, please please!!!!!! I mean, it wouldn't be tragic to me, but I'm sure Lucy and Trixie would be sad about it.

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ProudMary

ProudMary

2 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

Oh please let it be the call that says Chloe was killed in the line of duty. Please, please please!!!!!! I mean, it wouldn't be tragic to me, but I'm sure Lucy and Trixie would be sad about it.

LMAO!

With this show lately?  The "tragic call" is probably about some random character from Lucifer's past that we haven't even met yet.  :eyeroll

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

27 minutes ago, ProudMary said:

With this show lately?  The "tragic call" is probably about some random character from Lucifer's past that we haven't even met yet.  :eyeroll

Maybe someone banged up that beautiful car of his? That actually would be a tragedy to me.

Yes, my TV morals are screwed up. Kill a person, no big, damage a vintage car, I will cut you! haha

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enoughcats

enoughcats

2 hours ago, Mabinogia said:
19 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

What else other than a death would a tragic phone call be about? Because it does very much sound like he is getting a "tragic phone call".

Oh please let it be the call that says Chloe was killed in the line of duty. Please, please please!!!!!! I mean, it wouldn't be tragic to me, but I'm sure Lucy and Trixie would be sad about it.

I just had the strangest flashback to the horrible TV show "My Mother The Car".  (After Charlotte ended up being the Mother's repository, what if there had only been a car available?) Because I really dislike the writers.

More Lucifer 'kung fu' fighting and co-singing "I will survive", please.

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katmax

katmax

On 5/3/2018 at 10:14 AM, TVHappy9463 said:

Pretty sure Pierce is the death.  Chloe learns the truth.  Which works as a series finale or a set up for next season. 

They'll drag out Pierce's death till the last episode as he is the 'big bad' of the season.  I think that the death will be Charlotte or Amenadeil.  The writers have gone out of their way to keep Charlotte as a positive character when they have trashed everyone else, which puts her on the chopping block for me. Chloe will find out the truth about Lucifer within the next 2 episodes. There will be a cliff-hanger "bigger than mom". It will be a terrible way to end the series if there is no season 4.

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enoughcats

enoughcats

Could we maybe find that the Sinnerman arc isn't over?  For all the angst that went into it, all the glances at files, all of a sudden, poof, dude is blinded by himself (with help fromCaine) and its solved/resolved.  So many opportunities lost, there.

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katmax

katmax

2 hours ago, enoughcats said:

Could we maybe find that the Sinnerman arc isn't over?  For all the angst that went into it, all the glances at files, all of a sudden, poof, dude is blinded by himself (with help fromCaine) and its solved/resolved.  So many opportunities lost, there.

I have to agree here.  When Caine admitted that his protégée went off the reservation to start killing people and he didn't know why I thought it was a big red flag they should have followed up.  However, with Chloe in the dark they didn't seem to be able to progress those type of story lines.  Its one of the many reasons I think they would have been better of bringing Chole into the fold mid-season and avoiding the whole love triangle nonsense.  It still looks like there's an unfound third party involved here that lured away Cain's partner and also gave Lucifer his wings and took his devil face, neither of which I think was done by "Dad". Who did it though....nobody seems to have been bothered to go look which is a mistake in this season I think.

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

22 hours ago, katmax said:

They'll drag out Pierce's death till the last episode as he is the 'big bad' of the season.  I think that the death will be Charlotte or Amenadeil. 

 

I was thinking Charlotte, too, except that this is the summary for the next episode:

Quote

When Lucifer and Chloe investigate the death of a woman, they discover that they may be pursuing the wrong suspect. Then, Charlotte risks her safety when she decides to take matters into her own hands, and just as Lucifer makes a huge confession, he gets a tragic phone call that changes everything in the all-new “Quintessential Deckerstar” episode of LUCIFER airing Monday, May 7 (8:00-9:00 PM ET/PT) on FOX.

https://cartermatt.com/304952/lucifer-season-3-episode-23-preview-life-changing-phone-call/

Charlotte makes the most sense but the summary makes me believe it's not Charlotte.

Is Amenadiel mortal?

 

Up until right now, I've assumed that Lucifer's confession is to Chloe so, consequently, the phone call would have to be about someone who is connected to Lucifer in order for Lucifer to get the call and not Chloe. But if it's not Chloe he confesses to, it could be Chloe who calls him with the tragic news, so the death could be Dan or Ella, too.

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wilnil

wilnil

On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2018 at 9:54 PM, MostlyC said:

I'm wondering if it's Maze  (and god I hope not).

Me too. From the Real Life perspective, it's certainly possible Lesley-Ann Brandt has decided she'd rather spend more time with her child than work full time; from the in-show perspective, what could be more tragic than the death of the one soulless being among the characters? Remember, as a demon, if Maze dies, that's it; she's gone.

I don't see it as a sure thing by any means, but it's definitely plausible.

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katmax

katmax

20 minutes ago, Snow Fairy said:

I'm surprised no one wrote it here

Lucifer is canceled

https://www.google.hr/amp/variety.com/2018/tv/news/lucifer-canceled-fox-1202800382/amp/

Check out Lucifer in the media. There's a long thread there. There's also a very active fan campaign on twitter #savelucifer.  Brooklyn 99 was also cancelled by Fox in their scripted bloodbath this year, but managed to get picked up by ABC for season 6 after a fan meltdown over the net. It looks like people are trying to do the same thing for Lucifer. You never know they might be able to move stations it wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened.

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ItCouldBeWorse

ItCouldBeWorse

22 hours ago, katmax said:

Check out Lucifer in the media. There's a long thread there. There's also a very active fan campaign on twitter #savelucifer.  Brooklyn 99 was also cancelled by Fox in their scripted bloodbath this year, but managed to get picked up by ABC for season 6 after a fan meltdown over the net. It looks like people are trying to do the same thing for Lucifer. You never know they might be able to move stations it wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened.

NBC.

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ProudMary

ProudMary

Joe Henderson and Ildy Modrovich discuss a bit about what they had planned for S4, although not showing all their cards should they get picked up by another network.
http://deadline.com/2018/05/lucifer-series-finale-future-joe-henderson-ildy-modrovich-fox-1202391114/
 

Quote

DEADLINE: What did you have planned for season 4?
HENDERSON: As you saw in the finale, Chloe saw Lucifer’s devil face. Finally, proof that Lucifer really is who he said he was. No turning back. Chloe knows the truth.

So that was the big thrust of season 4 – exploring Chloe dealing with those ramifications, and how it affected her relationship with Lucifer. Both professionally and personally. Can you work with the Devil? Can you LOVE the devil?

MODROVICH: And we also had an exciting character from Lucifer’s past who was going to come in and mix everything up. A very personal, intimate figure who we won’t reveal the identity of yet… until we find out if we get the chance to tell the tale on a new network.

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Ria

Ria

12 hours ago, ProudMary said:

So that was the big thrust of season 4 – exploring Chloe dealing with those ramifications, and how it affected her relationship with Lucifer. Both professionally and personally. Can you work with the Devil? Can you LOVE the devil?

I don’t think I would want to watch this. Linda realistically took a couple of weeks to process what she had learned and then to decide to accept her friends for the “people” they were rather than “what” they were. And never looked back. With Chloe we would have gotten a whole season of her going back and forth with the “love” story back to being will they/won’t they.  

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Gigi43

Gigi43

Uhg they were going to shake things up with another new character? They learned nothing from this year? After shelving the supporting cast so much this season the focus should have squarely been now on how everyone functions together with the truth open to everyone , tell Dan fast. He formed a friendship with Amenadiel (wonder if they would have brought him back? ), he and Maze aren't strangers by any means and Maze has been living with his kid. He should have a story and it's not just with Lucifer. Ella too but my interest would rely on which of her two seasons theyd write her like.

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

19 minutes ago, Gigi43 said:

Ella too but my interest would rely on which of her two seasons theyd write her like.

I would love to have seen Ella's reaction to it being true because she was the truest believer in Dad. Chloe's total lack of reaction is exactly what I expected from her. She's not a person, she's a cardboard cut out. To expect her to react to anything is folly. But it would be interesting to see someone who wears her belief on her sleeve, and for whom believe is kind of anchored in actual belief, rather than actual knowing. how would she react to finding out it was true? I can't figure out what Dan's reaction would be to Lucifer, but OMG imagine, someone said this a ways back, but imagine finding out the chick you hooked up with was actually God's wife. YIKES! Talk about a lot to live up to. lololololol

Linda's, I think, was the average person reaction. She believed in God and all but wasn't as gung ho as Ella. So she didn't have to wrap her head around accepting that God was real. That is the only thing I would have liked to see in Chloe, whom I feel is an atheist? Did she ever say outright? IDK for some reason that's the impression I had. So not only would she have to accept that he is the Devil, she'd have to accept that the concept of the Devil is an actual thing, that the concept of God is real, etc. I would like to have seen that played out. Not with her character since I think it would just be blank stares and a shrug, but I wish there was an atheist character who is confronted not just with this guy he/she knows being the Devil, but the fact that all that stuff is actually real. (I am an atheist and have often wondered how I would react if I'd be in this shows universe because it wouldn't just be accepting that lucy has been telling the truth, it would be accepting a completely different reality to the one I believe in. That's some heady stuff.

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CheshireCat

CheshireCat

2 hours ago, Ria said:

I don’t think I would want to watch this. Linda realistically took a couple of weeks to process what she had learned and then to decide to accept her friends for the “people” they were rather than “what” they were. And never looked back. With Chloe we would have gotten a whole season of her going back and forth with the “love” story back to being will they/won’t they.  

Well, it probably would have gone like the big revelation. How many times have we have heard Lucifer tell her who he is and/or tell him that he'll tell her everything? I'm sure they would have found a way to drag this out.

In theory, it makes no sense to drag it out for a whole season, no matter how many episodes. She's gotten to know Lucifer. Sure, she didn't believe him but she knows the person, she knows who he is beyond the devil and that is the person she cares deeply for/has fallen for. So, the question that needs to be asked isn't if she can love the devil. She already (probably) does. The question is if she can accept that the man she has fallen for is the devil.

 

1 hour ago, Gigi43 said:

Uhg they were going to shake things up with another new character? They learned nothing from this year?

I think if it had concerned Lucifer's family like in S2 it would have been okay. Unfortunately, this past season leads me to believe that they don't have the most creative team. Whether it's the writers or showrunners, I don't know but I think they failed miserably on the creative front and, as I said above, I think they would have taken the wrong approach to Chloe's reaction to the revelation.

 

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

I would love to have seen Ella's reaction to it being true because she was the truest believer in Dad.

I would have loved to see that, too. More so than Chloe's reaction. I also would have liked to explore the "where does it stop" angle. Now, Chloe knows. Then Trixie may know, then Dan, then Ella. Who's next or can you contain it? If not, what does that mean?

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HunterHunted

HunterHunted

2 hours ago, Gigi43 said:

Uhg they were going to shake things up with another new character? They learned nothing from this year? After shelving the supporting cast so much this season the focus should have squarely been now on how everyone functions together with the truth open to everyone , tell Dan fast. He formed a friendship with Amenadiel (wonder if they would have brought him back? ), he and Maze aren't strangers by any means and Maze has been living with his kid. He should have a story and it's not just with Lucifer. Ella too but my interest would rely on which of her two seasons theyd write her like.

I've always wanted to see how Dan would react, more so than Chloe. Amenadiel is one of Dan's best friends. Dan is friends with Maze and the Mother of All Creation had fallen for Dan. 

I've been a big Trixie truther since season 1. In Catholic theology, Mary is the one born without original sin. I think a similar thing could be posited about Chloe given her blessing. Coupled with the way supernatural beings seem drawn to Dan and how Trixie wasn't fazed by Maze's demon face, I think Trixie is or should have been more important than she was.

But after Chloe, everyone else in their lives needed to be told about God, angels, demons and celestial beings including Dan, Trixie, and Ella.

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

2 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

I also would have liked to explore the "where does it stop" angle. Now, Chloe knows. Then Trixie may know, then Dan, then Ella. Who's next or can you contain it? If not, what does that mean?

That would have been interesting, if they went with the angle where he's no longer unknown, that he's well known for being the Devil. Will people be lining up to make deals with him, will he do the talk show circuit, would he hate the fame or wallow in it? And what would Dad thing of it all? Would he step in and try to contain it? Would he find himself surrounded by devil worshipers? Have a religion built around himself? What would it do to society, if we had actual proof of God's existence? Any of that would be more interesting than Chloe finding out which is as anti-climactic as possible.  

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Pondlass1

Pondlass1

14 hours ago, Mabinogia said:

That would have been interesting, if they went with the angle where he's no longer unknown, that he's well known for being the Devil. Will people be lining up to make deals with him, will he do the talk show circuit, would he hate the fame or wallow in it? And what would Dad thing of it all? Would he step in and try to contain it? Would he find himself surrounded by devil worshipers? Have a religion built around himself? What would it do to society, if we had actual proof of God's existence? Any of that would be more interesting than Chloe finding out which is as anti-climactic as possible.

If they'd got the green light, it was going to be a completely different show surely?  The main cast all knowing the truth would change everything.  It could have been interesting (or not).

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Mabinogia

Mabinogia

19 minutes ago, Pondlass1 said:

It could have been interesting (or not).

Yeah, it would all depend on the writing, and after this season, I'm not optimistic they would have handled it well at all. Maybe it's best it ended now before they further destroyed the characters. I'm most bitter that several characters were decimated because they had a story they wanted to tell and rewrote the characters entire personalities to fit that story rather than creating a bunch of amazing characters (which they did) and writing stories for them.

I just do not buy for a hot second that the characters we met in Season 1 would behave the way these characters were in season 3. They didn't grow, they devolved to fit a storyline.

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