S09.E00: One-on-One With Luann de Lesseps

[BBHN]

Slim. For sure.

[NeverLate]

26 minutes ago, Almost 3000 said:

and no need to stir up resentments when the state has yet to stamp those papers as final. B could have saved herself a lot of cash and drama if she would have handled it more this way but she'll probably just make fun of Lu.

B loves the drama dahling. 

[BBHN]

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B could have saved herself a lot of cash and drama

Giving in to extortionists and people who believe they are entitled to things they aren't entitled to only encourages to ask for more, and rewards their sense of entitlement by encouraging them to act like assholes.

Edited September 7, 2017 by BBHN

[Emmeline]

10 hours ago, BBHN said:

Probably the day after the wedding...

I thought she said at the end of the interview that she wrote it six months ago.

[hoodooznoodooz]

4 hours ago, KungFuBunny said:

Tisnley and her eyebrows are wondering why she failed to get a mention. Is Luann still pissed off about Palm Beach vs West Palm Beach? You'd think they could bond while sharing a bush during stake out time

I completely forgot about Tinsley until I read your post!

[chenoa333]

I thought Lu looked great. She has a fabulous body IMO! 

[hoodooznoodooz]

10 hours ago, KungFuBunny said:

Luann: We were madly in love. It only got bad in the last couple of months.

KFB: Luann, you were only married for a couple of months

Who is this incredibly cute and expressive baby, KFB?

[zoeysmom]

1 hour ago, Celia Rubenstein said:

Was the yacht even rented?  I thought someone just took pity on Tom and loaned him the use of it for one night.

Actually, thinking about it, it's unlikely Tom actually knows someone with a yacht so he probably did have to rent it.   But apparently all he could afford was to use it as a party space while docked.  I guess it would have cost too much to actually take it out into the water. 

It was actually a friend of Luann's who lives in Palm Beach that had the yacht.  The woman was gracious and stuck around for the impromptu filming opportunity.

My take on the "we got the yacht" is the women had their big vacations to Hawaii and Mexico cancelled and Luann found a way for the ladies, for at least one night, to have a yacht.  The party looked fun-it is not as if they were locked in a basement somewhere.  Of all the places they went last season the yacht was the highlight.

I don't think Tom had anything to do with it.  The other thing Bethenny had boycotted the party so she could serve Luann up a big dish of Tom making out with Debbie.  It was a very dark, depressing season.

[Celia Rubenstein]

23 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

It was actually a friend of Luann's who lives in Palm Beach that had the yacht.  The woman was gracious and stuck around for the impromptu filming opportunity.

Oh wait, that blonde woman, you're right.  I'd actually forgotten about her.   She was loving the camera!  Not quite the person I would have expected Luann to be friends with, but screw it!  She has a yacht so she's good enough for the Countess, I guess.

[KungFuBunny]

2 hours ago, hoodooznoodooz said:

Who is this incredibly cute and expressive baby, KFB?

No clue hoozdooznoodooz

[SuburbanHangSuite]

I noticed that Lu managed to drop in a plug for her bedding line.  No shit, I saw some "Countess Luann" sheets in Ross just last week.  Queen size set was 19.99.  Somehow I don't think Ross is the demographic she was aiming for.  

Andy kept revisiting the Missy questions and I feel like that's a really sensitive topic with Lu.  I think she knows Tom was probably hugged up with Missy before the ink was dry on the divorce filing (ok, who am I kidding - - - he was probably hugged up with her throughout their whole relationship!) and it's hard for her to stay on script when Andy keeps picking that scab. But good for her for facing the music.  

Edited September 8, 2017 by SuburbanHangSuite
Spelling is good

[NeverLate]

4 hours ago, chenoa333 said:

I thought Lu looked great. She has a fabulous body IMO! 

She's in great shape..:)

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, SuburbanHangSuite said:

I noticed that Lu managed to drop in a plug for her bedding line.  No shit, I saw some "Countess Luann" sheets in Ross just last week.  Queen size set was 19.99.  Somehow I don't think Ross is the demographic she was aiming for.  

Andy kept revisiting the Missy questions and I feel like that's a really sensitive topic with Lu.  I think she knows Tom was probably hugged up with Missy before the ink was dry on the divorce filing (ok, who am I kidding - - - he was probably hugged up with her throughout their whole relationship!) and it's hard for her to stay on script when Andy keeps picking that scab. But good for her for facing the music.  

Luann's Countess Collections are for the masses-not the classes, according to Sonja.  I didn't know her collections had been released.  

I find it strange (not impossible) that Ramona kept buddying up with these women chasing around with Tom.  Not excusing Tom by any means, but these women know he is married -why hang out with him?  As to Ramona buddying up-she is someone who was deeply affected by infidelity, I would think the last thing she would do is buddy up these women.  If he is prone to "flirting" and unacceptable behavior-why go around him?

Of course my guess is next season any event Ramona holds will be at The Regency to rub a little salt in Luann's fresh wounds.  

[BBHN]

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She has a yacht so she's good enough for the Countess, I guess.

And she lives in Palm Beach proper!

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but these women know he is married -why hang out with him? 

They knew it was a bullshit marriage?

[zoeysmom]

4 hours ago, BBHN said:

And she lives in Palm Beach proper!

They knew it was a bullshit marriage?

I guess one could tell themselves it is okay to cheat-but it was a marriage that has to be dissolved legally.  It is okay to say-no, I don;t want to be seen hanging out with my old boyfriend who is now married.  Life has a funny way of paying back.  I guess the Missys of the world will always be willing to settle for a creepy married guy.  Why spend your time with a creep?  Tom burned many of these women once why go back for seconds?  The guy has shown his hand he is incapable of fidelity or change.    

[BBHN]

It was a marriage that should never have happened to begin with.

[Jextella]

2 hours ago, BBHN said:

It was a marriage that should never have happened to begin with.

Yeah, but people make mistakes.  I was impressed with Luanne's objectivity during the interview.  She knows where she went wrong and admitted it.  Live and learn.  Life is nothing but an adventure.

[BBHN]

Yeah,,,she went wrong by going ahead with the wedding lol

Live and learn? I guess the message is, don't delude yourself by ignoring all the warning signs flashing and flashing and flashing in front of you.

Barbara (sp?) was right in the end. Regardless of what kind of friend you feel she was, she called it.

Edited September 8, 2017 by BBHN

[psychoticstate]

I watched the program last night.  Honestly, I don't really get why some posters are all up in arms and thinking she was being deceitful or less than truthful.  I think she was sad and disappointed and came across that way.  She said she wished she had listened to what her friends were saying and had picked up on the red flags.   She doesn't believe Tom cheated - - maybe she does believe that or maybe she doesn't want to discuss it.  Maybe she and Tom are splitting amicably right now and she wants to keep it that way.  Regardless, her statement of Tom not wanting to let go of the bachelor lifestyle equates to me that he didn't want the commitment of marriage.  Whether that included infidelity or not really isn't important; he wasn't invested in the marriage so of course it failed.

As I said yesterday, I feel sorry for Luann.  She's a romantic, she was crazy about Tom and she wanted to believe he was The One and believe in him.  It didn't work out for her but she doesn't look bad for it, IMO - - he does.   I also noticed, as at least one other person here did, that she seemed let down by the fact that Carole didn't reach out to her and the other ladies apparently did.  While she and Carole haven't been best buddies or anything, they seemed to have mended their differences and I think if the situation had been reversed, Lu would have called Carole to lend support.  I think that's why she's probably let down by Carole's lack of contact - - because Lu herself would have reached out.

I'm glad she's been able to enjoy her summer and is spending time with her kids.  It seems like she's nurturing herself and not worrying about dating again, which is important.

I also thought she looked good.  Tired, maybe, and (as I said) sad and disappointed but she still looked stylish and put together.  Totally Team Luann. 

[Jade Foxx]

1 hour ago, Jextella said:

Yeah, but people make mistakes.  I was impressed with Luanne's objectivity during the interview.  She knows where she went wrong and admitted it.  Live and learn.

 

19 minutes ago, psychoticstate said:

As I said yesterday, I feel sorry for Luann.  She's a romantic, she was crazy about Tom and she wanted to believe he was The One and believe in him.

C'mon....LuAnn is a middle-aged woman, a divorcee, with a myriad of relationships under her belt. If she's still starry-eyed and that much in denial after all the wisdom she should have gained after all these years/experiences - then yeesh.  She's lived but hasn't learned shit. I think she looks like a fool.  

IF this is the story we're going with...

[film noire]

2 hours ago, Jextella said:

I was impressed with Luanne's objectivity during the interview.  

I agree - she didn't throw up her hands and play victim/martyr, and she was much more forthright than I expected.

Edited September 8, 2017 by film noire

[WireWrap]

1 hour ago, Jade Foxx said:

 

C'mon....LuAnn is a middle-aged woman, a divorcee, with a myriad of relationships under her belt. If she's still starry-eyed and that much in denial after all the wisdom she should have gained after all these years/experiences - then yeesh.  She's lived but hasn't learned shit. I think she looks like a fool.  

IF this is the story we're going with...

I have yet to meet the person that doesn't have stars in their eyes when they fall in love no matter their age, not one!  

[psychoticstate]

Just now, WireWrap said:

I have yet to meet the person that doesn't have stars in their eyes when they fall in love no matter their age, not one!  

Exactly!  Age and relationship status doesn't always factor in.

[BBHN]

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C'mon....LuAnn is a middle-aged woman, a divorcee, with a myriad of relationships under her belt. If she's still starry-eyed and that much in denial after all the wisdom she should have gained after all these years/experiences - then yeesh.  She's lived but hasn't learned shit. I think she looks like a fool.  

IF this is the story we're going with...

She wanted the wedding more than she wanted the marriage, and she was in love with the idea of Tom more than she was in love with Tom himself.

Which is about as charitable as I can be with regards to her motives.

[Jade Foxx]

14 minutes ago, WireWrap said:

I have yet to meet the person that doesn't have stars in their eyes when they fall in love no matter their age, not one!  

Okay, okay...even despite ALL those red flags? If you say so!

I sit at the jaded and cynical table. :)

[BBHN]

Save a seat for me...

[Jade Foxx]

1 minute ago, BBHN said:

Save a seat for me...

TABLE FOR TWO. AT THE REGENCY HOTEL!

[BBHN]

If not there, then a on a (rented/borrowed) yacht in West Pum Beach!

[Jade Foxx]

8 minutes ago, BBHN said:

If not there, then a on a (rented/borrowed) yacht in West Pum Beach!

[zoeysmom]

33 minutes ago, film noire said:

I agree - she didn't throw up her hands and play victim/martyr, and she was much more forthright than I expected.

Tom and Luann's paths crossed when Luann was very vulnerable for kind words and attention.  Ramona was all over Luann for one thing or another, cementing herself up Bethenny's butt (what a difference a year makes), she was stuck defending Sonja from Bethenny, we saw her cry when Bethenny went after her at the beginning of the season, her actually flee a party after Ramona was asking for the dirt on Luann with a creepy former boyfriend that had actually frightened Luann and of course the whore/slut diatribe courtesy of Bethenny.   I do think Tom told Luann things she wanted to hear.   She was pretty beaten down and desperately needed someone to be attentive and build her back up.  Sonja did nothing to help the situation making herself Tom's lover of 10 years-not too terribly long after Sonja/Luann had been on the outs after the Harry situation and the facialist.  

After the original disaster last February, which of course didn't go public until July, they had time to recoup and regroup.  From her Instagram, last summer. they were busy as a couple, travelling to Europe, skiing, golfing, boating, staying in West Palm Beach, while enjoying life in Palm Beach and of course Luann's home in the Hamptons.  By the time filming rolled around Luann was deep into finalizing the wedding plans.  Tom asked Luann to marry him.  I just think she should have adopted more of a now that we are getting married, and you have been bashed in the press, you will need to behave in such a manner as to not cause commotion within the press or our relationship.  So for the better part of year things were uneventful between the two. (we saw stuff on a five month delay.)  She seemed to resign herself to the fact he would haunt The Regency occasionally and then said in this show-but every week?  I found her fairly conversational, in the interview.  It is tough when you care so much for someone to doubt what they are telling you-especially when there was a fair amount of BS in the press.  What bugged me is Tom acted as if going out and hanging at The Regency was akin to going golfing on Saturdays.  It would be one thing for Luann to ask him to give up a weekly golf game-quite another to stop hanging out at The Regency.  I would say the former is a bit of a sacrifice for the golfer and the latter is pretty much presumed.

There is a timeline that doesn't make sense-the weekend before the Reunion stuff.  The story reported claimed it was the weekend of Jill's event-he was at some dive bar with an old girlfriend and a group of friends, which was two weeks after The Reunion filmed .  http://pagesix.com/2017/07/31/luann-defends-marriage-to-tom-he-hits-on-blond-at-dive-bar/ After the Reunion filmed Tom and Luann were spotted in Rhode Island n a weekend trip.  I do think after seeing the Missy footage before the Reunion, Luann, after hearing from Tom, was still committed to making it work and Missy story was a big nothing.

I am hoping what Luann took away from this is there is more to life than her intuition.  What worked for years with Alex, probably won't happen again.  I don;t see Luann as wanting to dwell on Tom, the marriage her choices, and I am hoping Bethenny will STFU about it.  I wish Carole would have sent her note-just so there is no chance it becomes a story line.  I don;t see Luann being jaded here on out, but I think she needs to be a little more cautious and not make decisions when she is vulnerable.  

At the end of the season what is remembered?  Not Carole and the election,  Bethenny's divorce woe, or Ramona's on going boorish behavior, Sonja getting naked, we got  Dorinda's "clip", "clip" and Luann falling in the bushes and keeping a smile on her face.   No one can take that moment away from Luann or take credit for it.  The woman falls down with a smile on her face.

[BBHN]

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Tom and Luann's paths crossed when Luann was very vulnerable for kind words and attention.

I think their paths crossed when Luann was just horny and needed to get her rocks off.

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I am hoping Bethenny will STFU about it

You mean Ramona.

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At the end of the season what is remembered?  Not Carole and the election,  Bethenny's divorce woe, or Ramona's on going boorish behavior, Sonja getting naked, we got  Dorinda's "clip", "clip" and Luann falling in the bushes and keeping a smile on her face.

Actually, most of that stuff is remembered, for better or for worse, and the sum total of it all is what made it a great, memorable, season. The high point was the trip to Mexico, in which Luann was one factor of many, many, many others.

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The woman falls down with a smile on her face.

A lot of drunk people usually do...

Edited September 8, 2017 by BBHN

[zoeysmom]

7 minutes ago, BBHN said:

I think their paths crossed when Luann was just horny and needed to get her rocks off.

You mean Ramona.

Actually, most of that stuff is remembered, for better or for worse, and the sum total of it all is what made it a great, memorable, season. The high point was the trip to Mexico, in which Luann was one factor of many, many, many others.

A lot of drunk people usually do...

You don't need a marriage proposal or even a serious relationship to get laid.

No I mean Bethenny.  Bethenny makes me nuts because she comments and answers for everyone.  Andy asked Luann a question about Tom and Bethenny interrupted and gave her view of the situation.  I am ready for Bethenny to STFU.  Bethenny was no where near when Luann fell in the bushes and she takes that situation and makes it all about her and insulting Luann for taking it in stride.  I do really mean Bethenny needs to STFU.

I though the trip was pretty tame.  Bethenny screeching at people doesn't make for entertainment for me and talking about people being late-when there was no assigned time. Even Bethenny taking her clothes off just smacked of someone doing something outrageous for camera time.  

Luann falling down with a smile on her face was part of the bigger picture-when she gets knocked down she does it with a smile.  It is so refreshing with this group not to hear a person drone on and on about how miserable they are.  Or how rich they are. Or how they need to be real and be miserable to make a certain cast member happy.  As Bridget Everett said on WWHL-"Bethenny doubles down on others' pain."  Luann does not.

[film noire]

14 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

I do really mean Bethenny needs to STFU.

 

I await a #STFUbethenny t-shirt :)

14 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

Luann falling down with a smile on her face was part of the bigger picture-when she gets knocked down she does it with a smile. 

I agree, she's not a moaner or whiner (and even Andy made note of her elegance when falling - it really was one of the highlights of the season.)

Edited September 8, 2017 by film noire

[BBHN]

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You don't need a marriage proposal or even a serious relationship to get laid.

No, Luann and Tom proved that when they met...

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No I mean Bethenny.  Bethenny makes me nuts because she comments and answers for everyone.  Andy asked Luann a question about Tom and Bethenny interrupted and gave her view of the situation.  I am ready for Bethenny to STFU.  Bethenny was no where near when Luann fell in the bushes and she takes that situation and makes it all about her and insulting Luann for taking it in stride.  I do really mean Bethenny needs to STFU.

Yeah, I suppose that was much worse than researching Tom's ex-girlfriends and inviting them to the same parties Tom was at...even after promising Luann they would drop the issue.

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I though the trip was pretty tame.

I thought it was one of the best trips in HWs history.

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Even Bethenny taking her clothes off just smacked of someone doing something outrageous for camera time.  

Some people like to drink and have fun...

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Luann falling down with a smile on her face was part of the bigger picture

I think it might have been part of the booze she had guzzled down...*hic*

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 Or how rich they are.

Yeah, it isn't like Luann has never flaunted her wealth, or privilege, or title ever before...

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 As Bridget Everett said on WWHL-"Bethenny doubles down on others' pain."  Luann does not.

Personally, I'd like to see Luann defended without having to drag Bethenny or another HW into the conversation, but to each their own...

Edited September 8, 2017 by BBHN

[Cherrio]

Bethenny had nothing to do with the marriage.  She also kept her word and did not comment on WWHL when asked about the slap. 

Luann said herself that looking back that Bethenny was sincere when she pleaded with her not to marry Tom.

 I thought it was really low of Luann to make a dig at Ramona by deflecting and talking about her divorce.   It was ridiculous. Ramona had a real long term marriage. 

Ramona is no prize, but Luann made a fool of herself thinking her 7 month marriage ( with how many separations?) could be compared to Ramona's.

Luann, less is more. No more interviews, no book, please no stupid song.  You have access to so many interesting people in NYC.  Quit drinking, read some books and meet some non losers.

[KungFuBunny]

Sneak Peek - Season 10 Luann Tagline

It's Awesome!!!!

[zoeysmom]

NOthing says taking the high road like dating a month after you get divorced:  http://www.usmagazine.com/celebrity-news/news/luann-de-lesseps-focusing-on-herself-amid-tom-dagostino-divorce-w501960

 

What a weenie.

1 hour ago, BBHN said:

 

Personally, I'd like to see Luann defended without having to drag Bethenny or another HW into the conversation, but to each their own...

Simple solution Bethenny needs to STFU when it comes to Luann and her life.  They are not close or friends, even though Luann did donate to her charity.  If Bethenny STFU she won't be mentioned when it comes to Luann.  

[BBHN]

Well, as someone else said:

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Bethenny had nothing to do with the marriage.  She also kept her word and did not comment on WWHL when asked about the slap. 

Luann said herself that looking back that Bethenny was sincere when she pleaded with her not to marry Tom.

Also, that isn't really a solution.

Edited September 8, 2017 by BBHN

[zoeysmom]

3 minutes ago, BBHN said:

Well, as someone else said:

Also, that isn't really a solution.

It is. Bethenny isn't asked for an opinion.  So she doesn't need to comment.  She met the Tom after he and Luann married.  BTW I would say the same thing to Luann if she was going on and on about Dennis to Bethenny.

It worked as Bethenny met Tom once and worked off a lot of inaccurate data.  She had Tom complaining "over the summer" about Luann.  Tom and Luann were on vacation and there were no wedding stories.  She makes stuff up as she goes along and calls Luann thirsty (see Bethenny thread on real thirst) so she should STFU when it comes to Luann and the other women she is not close to.  She is close to Carole.  Her opinions are meaningless and most of the time designed to hurt at a maximum level..

What Luann was saying is she thought Bethenny flipped the script and made it all about her (as usual).  In retrospect without the bawling and hysteria maybe she should have taken note.  Bethenny's bawling wasn't specific she was saying Luann could call the wedding off.  Luann and Tom weren't at odds at that moment.  Luann also said that.

Collectively for two seasons these women made the seasons about Tom.  Not that it had an impact on the marriage-but get a life ladies moment.

[Jextella]

31 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

It is. Bethenny isn't asked for an opinion.  So she doesn't need to comment.  She met the Tom after he and Luann married.  BTW I would say the same thing to Luann if she was going on and on about Dennis to Bethenny.

It worked as Bethenny met Tom once and worked off a lot of inaccurate data.  She had Tom complaining "over the summer" about Luann.  Tom and Luann were on vacation and there were no wedding stories.  She makes stuff up as she goes along and calls Luann thirsty (see Bethenny thread on real thirst) so she should STFU when it comes to Luann and the other women she is not close to.  She is close to Carole.  Her opinions are meaningless and most of the time designed to hurt at a maximum level..

What Luann was saying is she thought Bethenny flipped the script and made it all about her (as usual).  In retrospect without the bawling and hysteria maybe she should have taken note.  Bethenny's bawling wasn't specific she was saying Luann could call the wedding off.  Luann and Tom weren't at odds at that moment.  Luann also said that.

Collectively for two seasons these women made the seasons about Tom.  Not that it had an impact on the marriage-but get a life ladies moment.

"the Tom"....hysterical!

[BBHN]

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Bethenny isn't asked for an opinion.  So she doesn't need to comment

This is a RH show...of course these women are going to give their unsolicited opinion.

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It worked as Bethenny met Tom once and worked off a lot of inaccurate data

Except the data wasn't inaccurate, since we got this:

And it seems most of what everyone else was saying - Bethenny included - turned out to be right...

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Her opinions are meaningless and most of the time designed to hurt at a maximum level

When Beth is right, she is right. And like most others, she was right abut Tom and Luann.

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What Luann was saying is she thought Bethenny flipped the script and made it all about her

That isn't what she said at all; Luann said Bethenny was sincere when she asked Luann not to marry Tom.

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Collectively for two seasons these women made the seasons about Tom

Well, there was other stuff happening in those seasons as well...

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Not that it had an impact on the marriage-but get a life ladies moment.

No, of course not. The combination of Luann rushing into a marriage despite dozens of warning signs and Tom's inability to keep his tongue and penis away from other women is what did the marriage in.

Edited September 9, 2017 by BBHN

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, BBHN said:

This is a RH show...of course these women are going to give their unsolicited opinion.

Except the data wasn't inaccurate, since we got this:

And it seems most of what everyone else was saying - Bethenny included - turned out to be right...

When Beth is right, she is right. And like most others, she was right abut Tom and Luann.

That isn't what she said at all; Luann said Bethenny was sincere when she asked Luann not to marry Tom.

Well, there was other stuff happening in those seasons as well...

No, of course not. The combination of Luann rushing into a marriage despite dozens of warning signs and Tom's inability to keep his tongue and penis away from other women is what did the marriage in.

The women collectively made Tom a huge topic for two seasons.  Regardless of the end of the relationship or marriage-the group constantly brought up Tom.  It is a weird dynamic they were so invested in Tom when Bethenny, Ramona, Carole all loathe Luann.  That was the bad look.  It goes back to Bethenny being the one to double down on another's hurt.  It was like Bethenny saying, "if I saw Tom fucking someone on a street corner," it is not always about the message sometimes it is about the delivery.  Had Luann been bothering the women with her concerns about Tom it would have been one thing-but she wasn't.  Ramona actually was a pretty good example-she viciously attacked Luann over rumors (which were true) about Mario.  Ramona played through with Mario until he didn't want her anymore and just this year admitted he had been a serial cheater.  Something that fell on deaf ears for Ramona for the past ten years.  Ramona sure didn't want to talk about Mario and his disrespectful ways.  She always made excuses for him.  The difference between Luann and Ramona is Ramona attacked others and degraded them claiming some sort of relationship superiority and degraded their spouses and children.

I still don't think an eleven month engagement is rushing into a marriage and I will not let Luann get away with that one.  Nor do I think walking away after two months of turmoil is a rushed decision.  Luann needs to stop making excuses for a man.  Whoever these women meet, can't go backwards and rewrite their own history or settle for someone because they are damaged or led a certain lifestyle.  Damaged Luann she stepped out with a pirate while with Jacques, therefore she has no right to expect fidelity was always on the table.  They need to live in the present and realize what they want out of a relationship and move forward.  No more excuses for bad behavior, or at least behavior they find undesirable going forward.  Luann obviously realized that she didn't have to settle for Tom and his boorish ways, when he couldn't stay on the behaving appropriately wagon.  I don't get this mindset about be right.  The only ones that matter about being right are Luann and Tom.

What is weird, is Sonja, although she has terrible delivery was the one who had some interesting insights.  First there was her ire towards Dorinda over setting Tom and Luann up.  I thought it odd-but Sonja's comment about Dorinda should not have set Luann up with a player but in the end it was true.  I believe Dorinda thought they are both players and will hang out like she and John do.  Sonja also never said Luann was content with an open relationship. The other women (except Dorinda and Sonja) always minimized Luann's relationship by saying she was going into it as an open relationship. I truly believe that Sonja for all her quirkiness knows when a player like she or Luann throw in the towel and commit they are in for a traditional relationship.  Sonja was also the one who said Jacques wasn't right for Luann.  Of all the women I do believe Sonja probably knows more about what Luann wants than the others.  Sonja was all about when Tom hurts Luann she will be there for her.  And she was.  Dorinda got bored with the whole situation early on because it wasn't about her.  I do think Dorinda for how ever long her gnat like attention span lasts will be there for Luann.  

At the end of the situation-I don't think Carole, Bethenny or Ramona ever approached Luann out of concern for her, I always felt they believed it was a storyline and just weren't all that vested in her happiness, more in trying to stick it to her.  Luann got hurt and she has to come back from being hurt quite publicly and without a lot of cast support.  Of course Luann shouldn't ask for any since they weren't invited to the wedding.

[BBHN]

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Regardless of the end of the relationship or marriage-the group constantly brought up Tom

They were less blind about it than Luann.

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it is not always about the message sometimes it is about the delivery. 

Which is what screwed over Luann in the end; she focused on the messengers, and not the message.

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Had Luann been bothering the women with her concerns about Tom it would have been one thing-but she wasn't

Maybe they wanted her to avoid making a mistake that would end in a 7 month marriage.

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Ramona actually was a pretty good example-she viciously attacked Luann over rumors (which were true) about Mario.  Ramona played through with Mario until he didn't want her anymore and just this year admitted he had been a serial cheater.  Something that fell on deaf ears for Ramona for the past ten years.  Ramona sure didn't want to talk about Mario and his disrespectful ways.  She always made excuses for him.  The difference between Luann and Ramona is Ramona attacked others and degraded them claiming some sort of relationship superiority and degraded their spouses and children.

Luann attacked back as well, calling them all jealous, bitter shrews.

Glad you brought up Ramona; you'd think Luann would have learned from Ramona and her relationship with Mario. But alas, as we have seen, Luann lives but she doesn't learn.

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I still don't think an eleven month engagement is rushing into a marriage and I will not let Luann get away with that one.  Nor do I think walking away after two months of turmoil is a rushed decision.  Luann needs to stop making excuses for a man. 

Weren't they only dating for 6 months before the engagement? She should have waited longer to agree to the engagement.

You're right, she needs to stop making excuses for Tom and accept her own idiocy in this whole ridiculous relationship.

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Damaged Luann she stepped out with a pirate while with Jacques

She wasn't damaged, she was horny and apparently in the mood for sexy pirate cosplay shenanigans.

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therefore she has no right to expect fidelity was always on the table.

I'm not sure I follow the argument that if Luann cheated on Jacques, then that means she should accept that Tom would be allowed to cheat around? She seemed more upset that Tom was caught cheating as opposed to actually cheating, so maybe she was ok with all of his various bed-hopping.

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I thought it odd-but Sonja's comment about Dorinda should not have set Luann up with a player

I always thought Sonja was more upset about losing a fuck buddy/potential ATM to fix and update her home.

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I believe Dorinda thought they are both players and will hang out like she and John do

Is Dorinda a player herself? I haven't seen anything to suggest that she and John's relationship is anything like what Tom and Luann had. Well, from Dorinda's side, John does have wandering hands and like to visit Beautique without her (for business purposes!).

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The other women (except Dorinda and Sonja) always minimized Luann's relationship by saying she was going into it as an open relationship.

The other women were right about Tom...

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I don't think Carole, Bethenny or Ramona ever approached Luann out of concern for her,

Whether they did or they didn't, that really had nothing to do with the end of the marriage. The end of the marriage is all on Luann and Tom.

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Luann got hurt and she has to come back from being hurt quite publicly and without a lot of cast support.

Much as I feel she was in love with the idea of Tom as opposed to Tom himself, and that she was hurt more by him being caught than him actually cheating, I do feel she is hurt more by the public humiliation than anything Tom probably did.

And why should they support her? As you said, all save Dorinda weren't invited to the wedding, and Luann dismissed their many concerns and evidence as them being petty, jealous shrews.

They would certainly be justified if their reactions to all of this was "Fuck it, Luann, you got what you deserve. You willingly ended up marrying a guy we all warned you about and for whom their was actual evidence of his unfaithfulness. You are not a completely innocent victim in all of this".

Edited September 9, 2017 by BBHN

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, BBHN said:

They were less blind about it than Luann.

Which is what screwed over Luann in the end; she focused on the messengers, and not the message.

Maybe they wanted her to avoid making a mistake that would end in a 7 month marriage.

Luann attacked back as well, calling them all jealous, bitter shrews.

Glad you brought up Ramona; you'd think Luann would have learned from Ramona and her relationship with Mario. But alas, as we have seen, Luann lives but she doesn't learn.

Weren't they only dating for 6 months before the engagement? She should have waited longer to agree to the engagement.

You're right, she needs to stop making excuses for Tom and accept her own idiocy in this whole ridiculous relationship.

She wasn't damaged, she was horny and apparently in the mood for sexy pirate cosplay shenanigans.

I'm not sure I follow the argument that if Luann cheated on Jacques, then that means she should accept that Tom would be allowed to cheat around? She seemed more upset that Tom was caught cheating as opposed to actually cheating, so maybe she was ok with all of his various bed-hopping.

I always thought Sonja was more upset about losing a fuck buddy/potential ATM to fix and update her home.

Is Dorinda a player herself? I haven't seen anything to suggest that she and John's relationship is anything like what Tom and Luann had. Well, from Dorinda's side, John does have wandering hands and like to visit Beautique without her (for business purposes!).

The other women were right about Tom...

Whether they did or they didn't, that really had nothing to do with the end of the marriage. The end of the marriage is all on Luann and Tom.

Much as I feel she was in love with the idea of Tom as opposed to Tom himself, and that she was hurt more by him being caught than him actually cheating, I do feel she is hurt more by the public humiliation than anything Tom probably did.

And why should they support her? As you said, all save Dorinda weren't invited to the wedding, and Luann dismissed their many concerns and evidence as them being petty, jealous shrews.

They would certainly be justified if their reactions to all of this was "Fuck it, Luann, you got what you deserve. You willingly ended up marrying a guy we all warned you about and for whom their was actual evidence of his unfaithfulness. You are not a completely innocent victim in all of this".

 

Part of being a messenger is in the delivery.  Bethenny makes it all about how her and she is vitriolic at best so her motives and timing are always questionable.  Both in Miami and in The Berkshires she starts bawling about how difficult it is for her.  

I don't think Luann and Tom's relationship is any more or less ridiculous than Adam and Carole or Bethenny and Dennis'.  What made it tough as a viewer is we left last season with the bombshell and the end of this season she seemed very happy.  

Never  once did Luann call anyone a bitter shrew.  When asked why they kept talking about Tom she said they were jealous.  I think the only jealousy was Luann was getting a lot of press over the engagement and wedding.   These women are like dogs fighting over bones when it comes to press.  I am sure there is probably some displeasure that Luann got a one on one with Andy over the break up.

You can't base your relationship on someone else's.  None of these women have successful marriages/relationships.  Contrast it with  RHOBH where most of them have been married for close to or over 20 years.  

My comment about Luann being damaged is that never a season goes by that someone, including Andy brings up her past indiscretions.  Having someone scream you are a whore and slut in your face does take a toll on one's self esteem.  Had Tom been a good guy they would have been saying the guy should be careful of who he was marrying.  Luann has accepted responsibility for her part in the relationship.  I just don't think she can say she jumped in too quick.  She had 10 months to weigh the humiliation Tom dealt her in February.   It would have been nice to let Dorinda expand on her comments about being around Tom and Luann-but Bethenny butted in as soon as Dorinda used the word "penthouse" so we didn't get her opinion.  It was just another opportunity to slam Luann and Tom. It is not my feeling that Luann because she dated a lot-she has never claimed to have screwed the pirate, she has to give a hall pass to any future partners.  

Luann is not more or less upset because Tom got caught-she is upset that not only was he inappropriate but he did it in such a fashion that not only did he hurt her by his indiscretion (kissing Debbie) but he continues to humiliate her.  Bottom for me about Tom, he is a damn peacock.  I gave this some thought Luann said she and Tom were competitive.  (She also said that about the Count.)  My theory, although Luann never speaks poorly of Tom, here is Luann with this big public platform and as such she has "fans".  (she also has detractors.) Then there is Tom, whose entrance into her world is he is basically that of a weasel  So while Luann is doing fan stuff, Tom needed to be the big fish in the small pond and have his own fans (former girlfriends) around to feed his ego.  Just the stupid ball and chain comment made me think-this guy has a big ego and can't stand the fact Luann gets so much attention.   I don't think it is the show as much as it is the attention (which is Luann's livelihood) that she receives that eats at Tom.  Humiliation is humiliation whether it is aired on a wide public forum or just among your contemporaries.  No one has ever said they thrive on being humiliated.  Nor have a heard many people say they are a bad judge of character.  So any indiscretion be it a too emotional connection, or physical connection always hurts.  I don't think one can say what bothered someone more the act or the humiliation.  It is kind of like asking would you rather be stabbed or shot.  It would be like asking Hillary Clinton, which hurt more the fact your husband received a bow job in the oval office, you believed him and support his lie or when Trump trotted at Paula Jones during the Presidential Debate.  Obviously everything hurt the woman and I don't think she didn't care he got a hummer just about the humiliation.  If Tom didn't behave in an inappropriate fashion he would neither hurt or humiliate Luann.  I believe Luann said she found out about it in the press-so there is the concealing component.  What is weird is this last round-his so called friends were the ones leaking the story.  They don't sound like very good friends.  Bottom line when Luann what was last straw-she cited Tom's meeting up with an ex-girlfriend and the blow back.

Again when you constantly attack someone and their betrothed and have not a single good word to say about them, the relationship it is a huge stretch they are suddenly speaking to you out of concern.  I believe early on this season Bethenny said to Luann, "do you think I care what you think of me?".  It is interesting because then Bethenny played the jealousy card when she was confronted.  No Bethenny people pretty much hate you because you are so obnoxious and mean.  

So that would make someone a bigger person for doubling down on another's pain? I don't find it an attractive quality to rub it in.  Although Carole and Bethenny tend to thrive on it. Luann has not said she is a victim and  denied being a chump.  She said Tom was not a 100% at fault.  She also said she doesn't owe the other women an apology.  After the February of 2016 kiss, there were several uneventful months.  Since none of these women were around first hand (except Dorinda occasionally) and Luann saw the two Missy conversations around them time they were having problems, Essentially they are saying-you are not allowed to forgive.  Since these damn shows revolve around conflict and apologies it would be hypocritical.

[Cherrio]

17 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

with an old girlfriend and a group of friends

The ol "group of friends" line.    Same line she used when caught with the pirate.  A group of Italian friends.

Bottom line, Tom is a cheat, Luann is a cheat.  Two cheaters together?  Zilch chance of anything working out.

Time to rename The Regency, Ye Ol Group of Friends Lounge.

[Cherrio]

7 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

I am sure there is probably some displeasure that Luann got a one on one with Andy over the break up.

I doubt anyone is jealous or upset. Who would want a one on one about a really stupid series of decisions and a marriage that lasted a few months?

Hey, who wants to be on WWHL to talk about how foolish and dumb they have been ?

I don't think so.

[diadochokinesis]

23 minutes ago, zoeysmom said:

You can't base your relationship on someone else's.  None of these women have successful marriages/relationships.  Contrast it with  RHOBH where most of them have been married for close to or over 20 years.  

 

 

I just want to comment on this one thing...  You could say that for most but I have trouble categorizing Carole or Dorinda's marriage to Richard as not being successful.  The only reason they ended when they did was because their husbands died.  Who knows what would have happened if they hadn't died.  Both women could still be happily married to them. 

On a side note... I do think Lu wanted it to work for multiple reasons. I think she was more in love with the idea of the relationship rather than Tom. Think about when she was listing all the great things about their relationship. It was activities like skiing. It wasn't actually anything about Tom (he's smart, he's funny, he's kind, etc). I think the divorce is hard on her because she is so concerned with her public image (even Andy said that she is very concerned about appearances and she agreed) and she's trying to spin it to where it makes her look good and also she just wanted the relationship (not necessarily the man in the relationship).  Unfortunately, IMO, the spinning of it is what backfires. If she doesn't want to bash him, she doesn't have to. She could easily come out and say that she was in love with the idea of the relationship but if the relationship isn't with the right man then it doesn't work.  Tom is a great guy but not the right guy. There are ways phrase things where it would come off better but still leave Tom's reputation intact (if that is what she is concerned about). 

[Dirty Mary]

On 9/7/2017 at 9:11 AM, tvfanatic13 said:

Interesting about Carole not reaching out to her. I think that Lu is truly hurt by that.

I would not be surprised at all if this were true.

Because Luann thinks other people are as phony and fake as she is.  So I can totally see her being hurt that someone she insulted and attacked didn't reach out to her pretend to give a shit about her divorce and send insincere condolences. Because she would have.  It's what inauthentic people like her do, and she expects it of others.

Edited September 9, 2017 by Dirty Mary

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, diadochokinesis said:

I just want to comment on this one thing...  You could say that for most but I have trouble categorizing Carole or Dorinda's marriage to Richard as not being successful.  The only reason they ended when they did was because their husbands died.  Who knows what would have happened if they hadn't died.  Both women could still be happily married to them. 

On a side note... I do think Lu wanted it to work for multiple reasons. I think she was more in love with the idea of the relationship rather than Tom. Think about when she was listing all the great things about their relationship. It was activities like skiing. It wasn't actually anything about Tom (he's smart, he's funny, he's kind, etc). I think the divorce is hard on her because she is so concerned with her public image (even Andy said that she is very concerned about appearances and she agreed) and she's trying to spin it to where it makes her look good and also she just wanted the relationship (not necessarily the man in the relationship).  Unfortunately, IMO, the spinning of it is what backfires. If she doesn't want to bash him, she doesn't have to. She could easily come out and say that she was in love with the idea of the relationship but if the relationship isn't with the right man then it doesn't work.  Tom is a great guy but not the right guy. There are ways phrase things where it would come off better but still leave Tom's reputation intact (if that is what she is concerned about). 

As to the widows, yes they both count those relationships as successes.  But they were not in those relationships for the show.  The relationships albeit tragic have ended.

Luann has said she likes being in a relationship and being married.  She has said it repeatedly so it isn't as if she has made that a big secret.  I don't think "a relationship" is a substitute for a person.  What I get from Luann and she had said she likes attention, is she wants to be loved and to give love.  Problem, as I see it with Luann she needs to find someone who will be satisfied being in the relationship with her and not need more.  Alex travelling the world with a wife and two small children and earning accolades and honors did little for Luann.  

It is almost an oxymoron that any of these women are concerned with their public image and do the RH show.  If you don't care how you come off publicly no one will do it for you.  I find Andy a bit of a tool sometimes.  It is odd that Tom has a spokesperson.  I guess when left to his own devices he stepped in it.    

I do think Luann is willing to do the work it takes in a relationship, but it is like anything else she can only do her part the rest is up to Tom.  This is just me but I do think she needs to develop a little of Bethenny's hard line stance about people changing if they want to be in a relationship/friendship with her.  (Jill, Jason, Dennis, her mom, step-dad).  You are in or you are out with Bethenny if you don't change to suit her.  What Luann was asking of Tom wasn't all that much.  I would never on a show like this say anything subjective about someone I care for.  If she said Tom is smart, someone would whip out Tom's college transcript and ask about the D he got in chemistry, if she funny, someone would say he never made them laugh.  I think she touched bases substituting successful for smart.  I don't know if Tom is flush or not.  ring, she said yes and then added, and he  .  Where I saw a crack was when they were out with the Zarins and talk was about Ramona's outrageous behavior and tom said, "I think Ramona is nice," the guy was more concerned about his popularity than the hurt Ramona was inflicting on Luann and ultimately their relationship.  Luann wanting to be married (no longer the case) had more to do with she was tired of dating.  She wanted a man with whom she could have aserious relationship with a commitment versus just dating around.  Tom on the other hand of marriage sounded like Al Bundy.  Look at my sacrifice.  What a weenie!

I think it is fairly obvious when you file for a divorce from someone that they aren't the right person for you.  I don't think you need to go overboard extolling their virtues.  In this case especially.  I just hope the next ten women Tom dates between now and Thanksgiving realize he is insincere.  

[hoodooznoodooz]

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Luann said she and Tom were competitive.  (She also said that about the Count.)  My theory, although Luann never speaks poorly of Tom, here is Luann with this big public platform and as such she has "fans".  (she also has detractors.) Then there is Tom, whose entrance into her world is he is basically that of a weasel  So while Luann is doing fan stuff, Tom needed to be the big fish in the small pond and have his own fans (former girlfriends) around to feed his ego.  Just the stupid ball and chain comment made me think-this guy has a big ego and can't stand the fact Luann gets so much attention.   I don't think it is the show as much as it is the attention (which is Luann's livelihood) that she receives that eats at Tom. 

 

This is a very interesting theory! I would not be at all surprised if that was a major factor.