S35: Chrissy Hofbeck

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

Essentially, those scenes (and Desi's interview) point to an alliance of 3 (JP, Chrissy, and Ryan) that was really tight and felt comfortable ignoring everyone else. That includes the other four people in their alliance of seven ... They were too comfortable, which led to crappy social game play and an easy blindside.

Yea. Initially, as much as I can't stand her, I really thought Chrissy was playing a great game, but I think it's clear now she wasn't. She's smart, but she's terrible socially and that is what's actually important in Survivor. 

ETA: I just went back to watch the "That was an incredibly tight alliance," scene and there was no eye roll, but her face in general is super hilarious when she says it.

Edited December 6, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[LadyChatts]

Quote

Essentially, those scenes (and Desi's interview) point to an alliance of 3 (JP, Chrissy, and Ryan) that was really tight and felt comfortable ignoring everyone else. That includes the other four people in their alliance of seven. Chrissy had some conversations with Ashley and Ben, Ashley spoke to her about Ben and Chrissy went to Ben, but not Lauren and Devon. Ryan talked to Devon but it does not appear that he had much of an alliance with anyone else. They were too comfortable, which led to crappy social game play and an easy blindside.

This is a crucial error that many have (and will continue) to make: when in the majority, especially if you have a tight sub alliance in that majority, always check in with your other members and make sure they feel comfortable.  Chrissy and Ryan just got way too confident (and probably JP, although we didn't see it).  I've said before I haven't seen this supposed great game Chrissy has been playing.  It was almost like WA post merge, except the majority alliance broke up earlier this time, and we don't have a Mike Holloway type going rogue and becoming the ultimate underdog.  But the group just got together, had a majority, and did a Pagonging.  I feel like that's been Chrissy's game all season.  Looking back, I don't know if there was ever a point where she was ever in real danger of going home.

[NutMeg]

5 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

Yea. Initially, as much as I can't stand her, I really thought Chrissy was playing a great game, but I think it's clear now she wasn't. She's smart, but she's terrible socially and that is what's actually important in Survivor. 

ETA: I just went back to watch the "That was an incredibly tight alliance," scene and there was no eye roll, but her face in general is super hilarious when she says it.

In reply to the bolded part (bolding mine), and with the big difference that I do like Chrissy, I'm having flashbacks to China's Amanda, who run the game but didn't get credit because she stayed far away from people she knew she'd have to eliminate. And of course tanked FTC, which is not something I expect of Chrissy should she make it.   

[LadyChatts]

Where I think Chrissy might lose it in a FTC is in her manner of speaking.  All season, I have felt like Chrissy speaks as thought she's smarter, better than, and above some of the people she's playing with in terms of intellect.  If she goes off at FTC in the same manner, she might turn people off that are actually undecided.  Especially if she talks about why she was put on the Hero tribe and having her back against the wall during the game (which up until last week really wasn't the case).  If Ben flips back to her and Ryan, she'll again regain control and finish picking people off.

But that's believing that people are undecided, and that they don't already have their minds made up when they get there.  No matter what, this season will end like most, with the winner basically winning a popularity contest.  There may be a couple of jurors who will actually vote for someone they don't like but who they felt played the best game.  At any rate, the only winner that will get me excited is Lauren or Devon.  I can't say the rest have gotten the best edit.  Devon's even cocky, but I can't say is as bad as the rest.

Edited December 6, 2017 by LadyChatts

[peachmangosteen]

1 hour ago, NutMeg said:

I'm having flashbacks to China's Amanda, who run the game but didn't get credit because she stayed far away from people she knew she'd have to eliminate. And of course tanked FTC, which is not something I expect of Chrissy should she make it.   

I think Chrissy will (and has) get credit for her strategic game, but the social game is a very big aspect of Survivor and she sucked royally at it.

Like you though, I do not expect Chrissy to have an Amanda like FTC performance. It'll be more like what @LadyChatts said:

40 minutes ago, LadyChatts said:

Where I think Chrissy might lose it in a FTC is in her manner of speaking.  All season, I have felt like Chrissy speaks as thought she's smarter, better than, and above some of the people she's playing with in terms of intellect.

But I don't know I still think Chrissy might be the winner. I can't really figure out how she would accomplish it, but I just think there's a good chance she does.

Edited December 6, 2017 by peachmangosteen

[LadyChatts]

9 minutes ago, peachmangosteen said:

I think Chrissy will (and has) get credit for her strategic game, but the social game is a very big aspect of Survivor and she sucked royally at it.

Like you though, I do not expect Chrissy to have an Amanda like FTC performance. It'll be more like what @LadyChatts said:

But I don't know I still think Chrissy might be the winner. I can't really figure out how she would accomplish it, but I just think there's a good chance she does.

I think there's a chance, but it's going to really depend.  After last week, I can see where Ben might start rubbing people the wrong way.  If he flips back to Ryan/Chrissy for no good reason (or hell, even if it's because he heard he was a target, because I don't expect bitter jurors to use logic), then he might alienate some on the jury.  I don't think it'll be close.  I wonder if this might be a case of best of the worst of the final 3, and that's why it could tie or be a close vote.  I think Ryan and Ashley are easily beatable.  I think Lauren would be the toughest to beat.  Devon and Ben I'm on the fence with.  Again, regardless of jurors saying they are voting for the best game player, it's usually a popularity contest in the end.  Or whoever has a bigger sob story.

[LadyChatts]

I've always had Survivor contestants I couldn't stand, but in most cases I either come around to them after the fact (Corinne and Rodney) or find some shred of redeeming quality about them (Scot from KR probably wouldn't have been so bad had he not teamed up with Jason).  But Chrissy is in Dan Foley territory for me in that I absolutely despise her and can never, ever, see myself liking her long after the fact.  I don't even want her to make the final 3 only to sit there and have it handed to her and get zero votes (assuming that happens, which would be my dream sceanrio).  But I dislike her to the point that I just want her and her smug grin off my TV.  I don't even care if it's a blindside.  I just want her gone.

And I don't really think highly of Ben, but I didn't even care he went off on her.  I'm thinking she leads a very pampered princess life at home.  She just seems so oblivious to her social game out there, and exactly how this jury will work.  And if by some miracle she does wind up on the jury, I expect her to be a bitter one, or to do most of the talking and interrupt everyone.  If she makes the final 3, I see her doing the same thing.

[GenerationX]

Chrissy was admittedly not in on two of the last votes, which could hurt her if she makes the final three with someone who was in on all of the votes.  "I didn't vote for Joe, because I was clueless that he was being targeted" ... wouldn't sound good to a jury.

[NutMeg]

8 hours ago, LadyChatts said:

But Chrissy is in Dan Foley territory for me

Wow, that's harsh...

[ProfCrash]

13 hours ago, peachmangosteen said:

But I don't know I still think Chrissy might be the winner. I can't really figure out how she would accomplish it, but I just think there's a good chance she does.

I think we are seeing how Chrissy could win. Lauren and Ben just went to war. Ben is now totally on the outs, he was already seen by some as being a dictator and now he is a traitor who gave up info about Lauren he shouldn't have. Combine that with Ben's reveal to Devon that Ryan has an idol and we now have someone who is really stabbing his alliance in the back. Ben is a bull in the China shop. He sees something legit problematic, three of his alliance mates whispering and discussing booting him, and his proceeds into hulk mode. Ben should have gone to talk to Lauren, who probably would have told him that Ashley was targeting him and worked with her instead of going into straight target Lauren mode. So Ben has probably lost Ashley, Devon, and Lauren's vote. I doubt he ever had Joe, JP, or Cole's vote.

Ryan is seen as a snake. People have said the exact same thing to Ryan as they have to Chrissy except that Ryan actually tried to play a social game and came off as disingenuous. I actually think that will both people more then Chrissy's lack of a social game, at least she didn't come off as kissing peoples ass for a vote at the finals.

Mike and Devon are posers and hangers on. I have a hard time seeing people voting for them. Devon talks like he is running the game but he is not and everyone knows that. He is a nice guy but not someone doing much in the game and as much as people might not like Chrissy but at least she has been playing. Mike gets points for hanging in there but he is a vote and only a vote. I think his show boating behavior is more likely to hurt him with the Jury then anything and it is clear he cannot read the room. He was blindsided with the Joe vote out and was only included in the mess tonight because the alliance of four was at each others throat.

Seriously, it is easy seeing a Chrissy win.

I would be happy if she won but I would not want to play with her. She is not an easy person to be watch and it is only getting worse. She is clearly annoyed that she was knocked from her power position at 9 and has not recovered. She does not take betrayal well.

[peachmangosteen]

2 hours ago, ProfCrash said:

I think we are seeing how Chrissy could win.

Oh yea, it's super easy to see now, after that disaster of an ep lol.

It's either her or Ben for sure.

[LadyChatts]

1 hour ago, peachmangosteen said:

Oh yea, it's super easy to see now, after that disaster of an ep lol.

It's either her or Ben for sure.

Lauren said in her Ponderosa vid that Ben isolated himself after last night.  However, he might be a Mike Holloway 2.0 and immunity run his way to the end if he feels his back is against the wall.  Up against more unlikable opponents, he could make a case for himself.  I'd still like to hold on to the slim hope that neither of them wins, but I know that isn't happening.  Chrissy winning is my worst nightmare.  I'm actually surprised her edit isn't better for being a winner, unless this is the best they can do.

[Guest]

I'm starting to wonder if Devon wins, based on the edit.  

[Lamb18]

I finished rewatching the Caramoan season last night. One thing I have to say for Chrissy: SHE DOES NOT CRY!!!! Every day!

[Daisy]

On 12/6/2017 at 10:27 AM, peachmangosteen said:

Yea. Initially, as much as I can't stand her, I really thought Chrissy was playing a great game, but I think it's clear now she wasn't. She's smart, but she's terrible socially and that is what's actually important in Survivor. 

ETA: I just went back to watch the "That was an incredibly tight alliance," scene and there was no eye roll, but her face in general is super hilarious when she says it.

 

While I am totally team social game. I will do a tiny correct on this
It's what;'s actually important in survivor... for that season. 

There are people who have won that I don't think they were social savants - but they won. and there were people who were really friendly and connected with everyone and they didn't. I think, despite Jeff and some others screaming "MAKE BIG MOVES" I do believe the season does determine what the strength will be focused on. 

I feel Chrissy's social game is basically an amplified version of what Parvarti did. Like Chrissy had her friends, (as did Parv) and if/when Parv didn't like you you kinda realised it where as Chrissy is I DO NOT LIKE YOU SO YOU ARE GONE. (which is totally what you shouldn't do). 

[hyukx3]

I dont like Chrissy at all. She's rude to you if she found out that you lied to her like Ben did. It's Survivor, what do you expect? She's just another potential bitter jury, after 35 seasons, you'll never get rid of bitter juries. Like in that episode where she ask Ben why after it was outted that he was a spy, she accused him of being rude or something all the whilst herself being rude about it, but she justified it for herself in confessionals. It's Survivor, that's the game. The game is people get played, they get lied to. I thought she said she's a fan of the show for 16 years. I cant stand that kind of behavior. Where she's so ignorant of how she's behaving and her backwards logic behind it. Backwards logic where she's rude to you because you lied to her and but she accuses you of being the one that is rude for lying to her. I hate those kinds of people.

 

She did that with Ali and Ashley as well. Where she acts like if you're not working with her, then she dont like you and she wants to get you out. She cant separate between gameplay and personal feelings.

[marys1000]

Chrissy is a huge fan and had a great time playing.   Im sure the pain of being a disliked contestant will fade but I wonder if it was sort of a shock.  She sermed slightly subdued at the reunion.  I cant imagine  it not being at least a little bewildering.  I wonder sometimes if the edit is a big shock.  

[LadyChatts]

11 minutes ago, marys1000 said:

Chrissy is a huge fan and had a great time playing.   Im sure the pain of being a disliked contestant will fade but I wonder if it was sort of a shock.  She sermed slightly subdued at the reunion.  I cant imagine  it not being at least a little bewildering.  I wonder sometimes if the edit is a big shock.  

I'm sure it is.  Jerri Manthey didn't expect it during Outback, and AS was really a disaster for her.  Not to mention most of the WA cast was really surprised that there was so much ugliness in their season, despite many of them saying they were close and had a lot of fun.  Unless the contestant goes out there to play a villain, coming across as one, or being disliked, probably is a shock.  Ryan seemed kind of miserable last night, too.  My impression is Chrissy probably thought she would be viewed as some kind of hero or super mom, inspire others, and since she knew she tied an immunity record and played a decent game (I didn't think so, but I know others will disagree), she was likely expecting a different reaction.  I also doubt she was expecting the reaction from some of her tribe mates.  I especially go back to Desi, because I feel like something big had to have happened for Desi to have that reaction to Chrissy in her interviews, especially since she didn't seem like she had a ton of ill will towards her during the jury round table last night.

I will say that I wasn't impressed with Chrissy's jury performance, as it seemed staged and rehearsed, and I could tell some of the jurors were thinking she wasn't being genuine (or perhaps showed she was trying too hard, like remembering personal details about Survivor contestants).  I think the castaways want to know she was being sincere and genuine about getting to know them, not doing it for game purposes.  I wouldn't be surprised to see her back, though.  Then when Ben started in on his sob story, I felt like her talking about being a mom and hoping to inspire others seemed kind of desperate.  But I hate sob stories in general and don't think they should win the game for someone, if that's ever the case.  Though it was speculated to possibly be a tie vote, I was still surprised Chrissy only got 2 (and not from JP).

[OutOfTheQuestion]

With Chrissy having applied since almost day one, it's odd thinking about her chances if she'd been in cast in past seasons, and interacting with everyone from Colby to Sandra to Coach to the Anderson twins.  It could be that "losing finalist" is her best possible result, given the obvious flaws in her social game.

[KimberStormer]

Funny thing about Chrissy, I enjoyed her on this season, but I also think we've seen the best we're ever gonna get from her and she shouldn't come back.

[marys1000]

Social games can not just be good or bad or awkward  ut just..different.  Some guy that is fun and jokey and an easy bud has a good social game.  Lots of variations on what makes one.  Chrissys was, I think, to talk very personally.  Desi's tripping point was when Chrissy swore on her sons about something.  Not sure why that was a trigger for Desi but it was one example given.  Maybe she was just trying to hard but it worked up to a point the sermed to backfire.  She seemed the point person for alliances and votes pre merge.

Edited December 28, 2017 by marys1000

[violet and green]

I think her strategic game kind of sucked, as well as her social game. Her strategy seemed to hinge on get all the other women out, which to my mind was madness. Even with Ben as big as a threat as he was, she was still eager to get Ashley out before him at one point, though granted she didn't push it through then.

I think if Devon had won the fire challenge instead of Ben, he'd have beaten her, and I don't think Chrissy factored that in. Keeping Ashley around would have been a better choice, from that angle. She just seemed so determined to be able to say, I am the last woman standing! Well, yeah... But I think it cost her.

[KimberStormer]

I would never say Chrissy was a great player.  She was terrible.  Only slightly less terrible than most people this season.  I did enjoy her as a Survivor Villain, as a character on TV.

 TBH I think, watching Devon's Ponderosa, that she would have lost regardless of the twist by voting out Dr. Mike, similar to Lisa and Skupin voting out Abi at F5.  IMO keeping someone because you think they're more likely to win the final immunity challenge against an unbeatable FTC threat is a terrible idea.  You need to have faith in yourself and the Survivor Gods, and bring your goat, not another threat.  It doesn't matter if you get to the end if you can't win at the end, so take the chance that you'll win -- especially if you are the challenge beast of the season, like Chrissy!

[SVNBob]

6 hours ago, violet and green said:

She just seemed so determined to be able to say, I am the last woman standing!

Thing is, she never said that.  Peachy did, and the jury did, but she never mentioned it.  And I'm fairly sure that if she'd uttered the phrase, it would have been included.

[violet and green]

16 minutes ago, SVNBob said:

Thing is, she never said that.  Peachy did, and the jury did, but she never mentioned it.  And I'm fairly sure that if she'd uttered the phrase, it would have been included.

Well, I didn't mean literally! For whatever reason, it seemed terribly important to Chrissy to get every other woman besides herself out of the game before final three.

Edited December 23, 2017 by violet and green
accidental echo of phrase!

[SVNBob]

4 minutes ago, violet and green said:

Well, I didn't mean literally! Thing is, for whatever reason, it seemed terribly important to Chrissy to get every other woman besides herself out of the game before final three.

This has been a big sticking point all season.  Some say this was a deliberate intention on Chrissy's part.  Others say it's a coincidence and/or wise strategy since the men were all relatively weaker players (Ben finding idols left and right notwithstanding) and the only real competitors this season were the women.  So Chrissy had to attempt to eliminate the others, just as they had to try to eliminate her, but she was the successful one in the end.  The former argument has mainly gut feelings and opinion, but little evidence beyond just the chain of events that happened.  But many of those events can have an alternate strategic explanation as pointed out by the latter side. 

For example, other than Cole's solitary win, only women won individual immunity this season.  And by Survivor strategy, those physical threats are the people you vote out as soon as you can, meaning when they are not immune.  So the Desi and Ashley votes do have some strategy behind them.  As did the Jessica vote when she was put forth as the Edgardo in a Healers Horsemen alliance (by Ryan, iirc.  Chrissy suggested that they vote for a Plan B instead of Cole or Joe, but not necessarily who that Plan B was.)

Which leaves Lauren.  Even though Chrissy did not vote for Lauren when she was voted out (thanks Ben),  Chrissy would have eventually tried to do so.  Because Lauren was not just a physical threat (also with 2 II wins), but she was also the leader of the alliance opposing Chrissy's.  Eliminating someone like that is wise strategy in Survivor, regardless of gender.

However, I'm not saying either side is right or wrong.  I stand neutral on the subject.  I was not there, so I don't know if Chrissy said or did anything during the game to justify the feelings of the other contestants that have said that they think Chrissy was attempting to be the last woman standing.  All I know is what we were shown, and it honestly could go either way in my view.

[JudyObscure]

4 hours ago, SVNBob said:

For example, other than Cole's solitary win, only women won individual immunity this season.  And by Survivor strategy, those physical threats are the people you vote out as soon as you can, meaning when they are not immune. 

Yes, I thought from early in the season that the challenges were favoring women's skills of balance and puzzles.  If Chrissy noticed this it would have been a good reason to vote out women over guys like Devon.

 

On ‎12‎/‎21‎/‎2017 at 10:41 PM, marys1000 said:

Im sure the pain of being a disliked contestant will fade but I wonder if it was sort of a shock.  

I think it probably was.  I imagine Chrissy expected most women fans to be like the woman and daughter in the audience who were gushing with excitement over Chrissy's performance.  While many of us were rolling our eyes over her speeches about housewife-heroes, Chrissy probably thought we would all be saying, "Yay for us!" 

I'm glad to see some of that girl-power fan grouping die out.  Survivor has been a relatively even contest since the beginning and I'm always going to root for the person, of either gender, who plays hard, works hard,  and interacts well with others, all while maintaining a bit of humility.  This year both Ben and Chrissy were arrogant and personally nasty from time to time, but by the end Ben seemed to be trying harder and Chrissy's smugness had peaked to an obnoxious level.

[himela]

Anyone who bothered to listen to interviews, did Chrissy mention anything about her being accused of hating women? I was expecting Probst to ask her in the reunion but he didn't.

[ProfCrash]

She said it is silly to think anyone would play a strategy that targets a specific demographic, it would not make much sense. She pretty much blew it off as being ridiculous.

[fishcakes]

In her Gordon Holmes interview, she basically calls it fake news, a response which I find entirely unsurprising coming from her:

Quote

No, I think I was more well liked than the exit interviews let on. Shortly after those exits were coming out, I had a number of people in the cast call me and I also reached out to some people, I think some people in the cast were surprised by the exits. And I also think Roark got a raw end of the deal too. I was told by some other people in the cast, that it was a story that was thoughtfully crafted to remove any and all blame from people who potentially wanted to play again, extend their fifteen minutes. I think it’s human nature to want to blame someone else. But, I don’t think while the game was going on that that existed. Apparently that was a story that was crafted afterwards by recruits. I feel like in the game of “Survivor” nobody has ever come up with a strategy to vote only based on demographics. And so to assume that someone was voting based on demographics does a disservice to the game and does a disservice to me. It was hurtful to me, but there were so many flaws in the argument. And I think the better podcasters and “Survivor” reporters, including yourself, Gordon, could realize that there was something off on that.

I read that as, "oh poor Roark. It's only natural that she'd want to put all the blame on me to make herself look better so she'd get a return invitation but the whole story was made up after the fact by recruits. Of course, the better reporters like youuuu Gordon, are too smart to fall for that." Seriously, who are the "recruits"? She's so full of it.

She essentially says that the producers helped Ben find idols:

Quote

I do feel like the idols were a little too easy to find. They were planted in particular places, but I don’t want to take away from Ben’s game because Ben played an awesome game. It was certainly an interesting season and an unexpected way for it to turn out. I was shown in the edit several times saying, “Nobody’s going to find that many idols.” I don’t think any of us thought an idol was going to be put out at final five. But, that’s the game. And we’ve seen historically that twists have been introduced. As an actuary I’m supposed to think of all of the things that can happen. And I didn’t think there would be a fire-making challenge at final four. Did I think someone could wake up and find an idol after 15 seconds of hunting? No.

"but I don't want to take away from Ben's game." Shut up. If the idols were so easy to find, why didn't she find one?

She also thinks she would have beaten Devon, again mentions her record-breaking electoral coll ... er, immunity challenge win record (and how she's at least twenty years older than the other women with the same record) and complains that the jury was more impressed with Ben's idol plays because they didn't get to see her win immunity. What a ridiculous delusional phony she is.

Edited December 26, 2017 by fishcakes

[LadyChatts]

That interview did not do anything to change my opinion of Chrissy.  Pretty much reaffirms my thoughts of her.  So it's the recruits fault she was bashed?  Also from the above post:

Quote

And I think the better podcasters and “Survivor” reporters, including yourself, Gordon, could realize that there was something off on that.

Is this aka: the people who liked and defended me?  So the ones who didn't aren't legit to her?  

And I know she likes to think she would have had a serious shot against Devon, but I think she underestimates how popular he was.  I believe he would have easily beat her.  It's funny that a super fan doesn't realize that accomplishments in this game typically count for nothing, and it's popularity.  Been that way from the beginning.

Edited December 26, 2017 by LadyChatts

[Superpole2000]

Chrissy was conceited and condescending, and yet I found myself cheering for her anyway. She was never going to be as clever as she thought she was, but I still found her clever. She was very good at puzzles, and she picked a great ally in Ryan. She was somewhat eloquent when speaking to the camera, which I appreciated. I liked her bitterness toward Ben because I thought Ben was a pure asshole on the show. He really enjoyed being a dick, and so I was naturally going to enjoy anyone rivaling him.

[MerBearHou]

Everything annoying (to me) about Chrissy has to do with her being literally a calculator in life in her actuary work.  She is cold and always scheming from a 360 degree angle. She is overly impressed with herself and would be tiresome to be around after about 30 minutes.  

[Jextella]

My take on Chrissy is that she is mostly a control freak, and because she's so smart, she's able to create order out of chaos really, really well.   She does come off as conceited but I'm not sure that's all of it.   Like she said, as an actuary, her job is to assess situations and identify potential outcomes.   In her talking heads, she seemed to be doing just that, i.e. assessing / summarizing - be it good or bad. 

In her mind, she has the equations all worked out and declares equation solutions as logical outcomes.  During times when she was at risk, this approach comes off as humble.  During times when things are going her way, this approach comes off as arrogant. 

It took me awhile to embrace Chrissy because when she was doing well early on, her talking heads made her seem arrogant.

I turned around later when her position was more tenuous. In her talking heads, her confidence level about being at risk was the same as when she felt things were going her way.  Her tone, delivery, etc. was all the same. 

What comes off as arrogance is mostly mathematically-minded Chrissy being mathematically-minded.

I actually think Chrissy is a little insecure.  In fact, some say extreme control is a sign of insecurity.  I can see that with Chrissy.  She seems to have a fragile side to her.  As the season went on, I enjoyed watching her build true confidence by directly owning her successes and failures.  

I do think Ben deserved the win, but she was very close, and I actually really liked her toward the end.

Edited December 30, 2017 by Jextella