S03.E02: Don't Be Ridiculous

[scrb]

Melbourne is a modern, cosmopolitan city.

I don't think too many people are getting around on horseback there.

Now maybe it was the outback, which is a whole different part of Australia where kangaroos are roaming around all over the place where they get hit by cars?

[Pallas]

8 hours ago, maystone said:

Didn't Grace say something like "The four waved?" Because I was thrown when she went on to say that He put the stone to his chest and jumped in the water - which is what happened when he bumped into Evie and her friends.

Grace said (paraphrased) "He waved, but they made no response."  And lo, the three girls did not.

8 hours ago, maystone said:

I doubt that this is significant, but another point of comparison between Kevins who are the chief of police is that our Kevin ran into a deer with his car and then killed it with his sidearm; Aussie Kevin ran into a kangaroo and put it down.

Sure it was. Our-Chief-Kevin fought against his father and colleagues on the force to save the deer, until Kevin Sr. shrugged and ordered Kevin a tranquilizer gun (yes) so he could possibly rescue it. He went flying out of the house (for the last time before the Departure) to beat his colleagues to a site it was reported. After the deer, too, went flying out of the house and was struck down in the street, Kevin was manifestly miserable seeing and hearing it in distress. Other-Chief-Kevin made no attempt to avoid the 'roo, dispatched it without ado and joked about the mess it left on his cruiser. 

Links between The Guilty Remnant and the Particle Accelerators: Mark to Nora: "Then I guess I am just wasting my breath" (The Remnant's sign at the Mapleton Memorial Day observance); Nora to Mark: "They were incinerated" (like Gladys, other members of the Remnant in the season 1 finale, and more recently Evie, Meg and the others); Nora's white robe and cigarette as she reviews the records; the Remnant's stating they too were ghosts, and Nora's seeming to lose her earthly, electromagnetic signature. I'm surprised her hotel key card worked for her. And the links to other apocalyptic cults: the time-dated video testimonials echoing those of contemporary Islamic suicide bombers, as well as the Christian Millerites' serene, pre-Rapture farewell scenes with their neighbors.

15 hours ago, scrb said:

replaced with an old flip phone -- who has those any more.

People still living in the time before the Sudden Departure...And, it was given Nora to receive the call that she chose to accept, just as she and Kevin were agreeing they were happy. 

[Juliegirlj]

Loved Mark Linn Baker's comment: 

    " It is just the hardware-everything is stored in the clouds"

[Mindthinkr]

55 minutes ago, Pallas said:

I'm surprised her hotel key card worked for her

Good catch! You should have been in the writers room as I bet they overlooked this opportunity to continue with the theme. 

[Juliegirlj]

I am betting that in next week's episode, everything goes smoothly for Norah on her journey to Australia! No kiosk issues, no security hang ups....even with $20 grand strapped to her body!! 

[tennisgurl]

Just...why Perfect Strangers? Of all the shows in the entire world, why a goofy sitcom that I've only heard of in the context of people on the internet making jokes about it? Why make that show a major part of the shows mythology? Not that I'm complaining, I find it delightfully bizarre, in the way that this show does so well, but I would just love to know which writers decided to build a big, dramatic segment of this shows final chapter around the Perfect Strangers guy? Who, surprisingly, is actually a solid actor. Can he get some more roles not playing a Darkest Timeline version of himself, because he made a big impression in his one, weird scene.

Anyway, I still have no idea what the hell is going on at any given second of this show, other than the universe apparently likes to contribute to Nora's Terrible Horrible No Good Very Bad Day. I love Nora, even when she's being kind of a huge bitch. And when she's possibly leaving her new family to find her old one, somewhere in the foreign backwater known as Australia, where kangaroos and accents reign supreme! Alright, I'm just going to assume that what we saw here was the outskirts of Melbourne, and not the actual gigantic, high tech city that it actually is, and assume that this means the second rapture didn't exactly happen, considering people are still there, and society still seems to be functioning. I have no clue what is going on in Australia, but it seems like the writers do, so I'm along for the ride.

Glad that we got conformation that Lily is alright, even if its really sad that she was taken from Nora. No wonder she and Kevin are having issues, no matter how much they try to convince themselves they aren't. I think that's the show in a nutshell. People are in two categories in times of trauma and grief, the people who cant let it go and let it consume them, and the people who try to pretend everything is fine, when it so obviously isn't.

[maystone]

10 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

And again this show is reminding me of the film, The Rapture. The movie incuded a scene of the Four Horsemen descending from the clouds and that scene is a visually stunning moment. The effect was probably helped by CGI technology not being as good then as it is now.

As heartless as convincing people to give all their stuff away because they're about to be called to heaven. Not only do they remain here on earth, now they're in abject poverty having to see other people with their former stuff.

..

Yes, I flashed to The Rapture, too! That movie certainly left it's mark.

If this is a scam (and how can it not be), I think the con-group is pretty smart to charge on a sliding scale. They don't actually wipe out their victims' bank accounts that way, which means 1) if they're scammers they're not sending off immediate warning flares to the families left behind by draining the whole bank account, and 2) if they're legitimate, the newly Departed have left money behind for their family/significant others.

[Wouldofshouldof]

On 4/24/2017 at 0:44 AM, acid burn said:

I thought she was trying to hide the Wu Tang tattoo more than the fact she covered up the old tattoo.

They have these things called sleeves . . . 

[Wouldofshouldof]

On 4/23/2017 at 11:04 PM, ottoDbusdriver said:

So, these 4 women just murdered a cop named Kevin .... possibly based on the ramblings of Kevin's dad.

What I didn't understand was if they know Kevin's dad, they know he's not Australian, so why was the leader so convinced that this Australian man was the right Kevin?

[maystone]

2 hours ago, Pallas said:

Grace said (paraphrased) "He waved, but they made no response."  And lo, the three girls did not.

<snipped>

. . . Nora's seeming to lose her earthly, electromagnetic signature. I'm surprised her hotel key card worked for her. And the links to other apocalyptic cults: the time-dated video testimonials echoing those of contemporary Islamic suicide bombers, as well as the Christian Millerites' serene, pre-Rapture farewell scenes with their neighbors.

People still living in the time before the Sudden Departure...And, it was given Nora to receive the call that she chose to accept, just as she and Kevin were agreeing they were happy. 

Yup, I caught that on the rerun. I don't remember him waving at the girls, and that scene with the apparent GR members stopping to talk with Kevin before the actual Sudden Departure happened has always stuck with me, so I was just projecting all over the place.

I'm probably off base on this, too, but it seemed to me that Nora's electronics troubles were all linked to her wanting to track down Lily: the question about traveling with an infant, the GPS to get to Christine and Lily's home, and the gate out of the parking lot.

Edited April 25, 2017 by maystone

[Mindthinkr]

4 hours ago, Wouldofshouldof said:

What I didn't understand was if they know Kevin's dad, they know he's not Australian, so why was the leader so convinced that this Australian man was the right Kevin?

Great point. It could be that the book has been copied (perhaps edited) incorrectly or the spoken word has fallen to that mechanism we can best be described as the kids game of telephone. 

Edited April 25, 2017 by Mindthinkr
An oopsie

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Who Is The Leftovers Trying Hardest To Kill In Episode 2?

If your name is Kevin, you have a 50/50 shot at making it.

[scrb]

Looks like it could be from The Man Show.

Have women wear tight clothes and film them jumping on a trampoline in slow motion.

Lindelof gave an interview to Andy Greenwald and Chris Ryan of The Ringer about the season and mentioned that the writers brainstormed the idea of the trampoline, played with Wu Tang Clan music and they just worked it into the plot.

[Blakeston]

21 hours ago, scrb said:

Technology in general doesn't have the impact that it has in our world.  For instance, Jarden is a small town but given all the activity and humanity in there, there would be tons of surveillance cameras recording that square and they would have caught him falling off that pillar.

We briefly saw some footage of him falling, early in the episode. I think the idea was that the footage was out there, but people didn't know about it or were choosing to ignore it.

As for Nora's tattoo, she was expecting the tattooing process to hurt - but she said that it didn't. I think she felt like she deserved some kind of punishment for covering up her kids' names, and when the needle didn't provide it, she came up with a different method.

[meep.meep]

16 hours ago, maystone said:

 

I thought of the Four Horseman of the Apocalypse, too, when I first saw the women. And when Grace started to recite from the Book of Kevin, I at first thought she was talking about that time in S1 when Kevin was taking a break from his morning run, sitting on a curb and smoking a cigarette when a car with four women stopped in front of him; they waved and asked if he was ready. He had no idea what they were talking about, so he didn't answer; they laughed and drove on. 

 

Being ready also links back to this season's first episode with the Millerites and the background music of "If we'd only been ready."  The four women were the first Guilty Reminders.

I'm sorry, but the "Book of Kevin" cracks me up, just like Scott Evil or Life of Brian do.  The banal contemporary name associated with something that's supposed to be important.

 

5 hours ago, Juliegirlj said:

Loved Mark Linn Baker's comment: 

    " It is just the hardware-everything is stored in the clouds"

I thought it was "everything important is in the cloud, right" - meaning that she had backed up her important things.  And of course all the other implications of "the cloud".

[stagmania]

5 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Just...why Perfect Strangers? Of all the shows in the entire world, why a goofy sitcom that I've only heard of in the context of people on the internet making jokes about it? Why make that show a major part of the shows mythology? Not that I'm complaining, I find it delightfully bizarre, in the way that this show does so well, but I would just love to know which writers decided to build a big, dramatic segment of this shows final chapter around the Perfect Strangers guy? Who, surprisingly, is actually a solid actor. Can he get some more roles not playing a Darkest Timeline version of himself, because he made a big impression in his one, weird scene.

Lindelof actually goes into that in the interview I mentioned. In a nutshell: they liked the idea of the entire cast of some obscure sitcom departing and having that be a running background gag, and one of the writers came up with Perfect Strangers because her husband mentioned he used to love it and it worked as an offbeat choice. From there they decided it would be more interesting if one of the cast faked his departure, so they built that in. Then when they were breaking this Nora story they realized it would work to tie it into the Mark-Linn Baker thing. The writers room of this show sounds pretty interesting. They have a good balance between letting ideas develop organically over time and planning ahead to make sure things come together.

[Keepitmoving]

So that's what happened with Lily, good to know she's OK. 

It was good to see Erika, and I breathed a sigh of relief for Nora that she could go to Erika. It just seemed so peaceful and liberating being able to jump on that trampoline, it was like they were flying. 

In other news, I guess we can conclude that Kevin's life is in danger, but then again, is it really in danger? Clearly, he can't seem to die, which is why those women were trying to sacrifice "him," they'd expect him to rise again. Good lord this show. 

I liked this episode as well as the first, but I'm not sure I'm going to like the next one. I don't really care for Kevin's father. I don't know what it is, I can't stay focused when he's on.

[Pallas]

7 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Alright, I'm just going to assume that what we saw here was the outskirts of Melbourne, and not the actual gigantic, high tech city that it actually is, and assume that this means the second rapture didn't exactly happen, considering people are still there, and society still seems to be functioning.

Last season Kevin Sr. said he was in Perth -- near the outback -- while transmitting from a hotel room in "International Assassin." And in this week's chapter with the four horsewomen, the late Chief Kevin and Kevin Sr., we are still a week from the 7th anniversary of the Departure: thus sayeth the weatherman (on view in the local stationhouse), and the weatherman, he doth not fail us.

6 hours ago, maystone said:

I'm probably off base on this, too, but it seemed to me that Nora's electronics troubles were all linked to her wanting to track down Lily: the question about traveling with an infant, the GPS to get to Christine and Lily's home, and the gate out of the parking lot.

Yes, but then the parking lot was in Austin -- she was driving home from the airport. The gate should have waved her right through. "Hurry up, Nora Curst!  You don't want to miss your boyfriend suffocating!" 

2 hours ago, Blakeston said:

As for Nora's tattoo, she was expecting the tattooing process to hurt - but she said that it didn't. I think she felt like she deserved some kind of punishment for covering up her kids' names, and when the needle didn't provide it, she came up with a different method.

And having just shrouded her children's names, she may have wanted to mirror the broken leg (she gave herself) after they first disappeared. As Kevin said: "I want to know I can...feel..."

Two years out of Yale College, Mark Linn-Baker was getting raves in the Times when he was still a student at the Yale School of Drama. 

[Cardie]

15 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Why make that show a major part of the shows mythology?

According to Lindelof, they were brainstorming in the writers' room for a pop culture touchstone and writer Jacqueline Hoyt mentioned that her husband always watched Perfect Strangers reruns when he was stressed; that it was like comfort food to him. Lindelof pinged on the suggestion and then went to the idea that the whole cast had departed . . . and the rest was history.

Also, if you like Mark Linn Baker, watch My Favorite Year.

Edited April 26, 2017 by Cardie

[shapeshifter]

I love the title of the episode, "Don't Be Ridiculous," specifically the way it encapsulates Nora's (and Kevin's and even Erika's and Tommy's) attitudes towards actions and beliefs based on magical thinking even while they themselves are carrying out "ridiculous" plans and actions.

[Cardie]

^^"Don't Be Ridiculous" was the catchphrase used by the character Balki in Perfect Strangers; that doesn't mean it doesn't fit the themes of the episode as well.

[MyPeopleAreNordic]

The whole thing with Mark Linn-Baker and the Perfect Strangers stuff in this show is really kind of bizarre but also....just so damn perfect. I LOVE it.  Like the show itself, it's a sad, sweet, kind of bizarre perfection.

Justin Theroux is sooooo hot. Yeah, someone who asphyxiates himself regularly to feel or see if he can die (not sure which, really) & the woman who keeps going through so much loss related to her children (departed bio-kids, Lilly....she just has awful luck with kids and the possibility that if she had another she might somehow lose that child would be to much....Nora would just be DONE if that happened & would spend so much time worrying about anything happening).....but I mean, why not just do the practice without it leading to a kid? Wouldn't say no to "trying" if Justin Theroux asked, even if I had just walked in on him ripping a bag off his face. 

Also, I don't think Kevin really wants a baby. He knows Nora is in pain and he thinks having another child will ease that pain (since her pain is so deeply connected to losing 3 children) and it's a "project" or something to do for him (and maybe he misses Jill). He looked longingly at Nora cuddling Noah in the first episode of season 3 and wanted to give that to her. Thing is, that isn't what Nora wants. She wants her kids back. She knows she won't get Lilly back. But maybe she could see her other kids.... Even though they don't say it aloud, I think Nora & Kevin really do at heart know what is hurting the other so badly...they just don't have the right answers for how to fix it. 

Edited April 26, 2017 by MyPeopleAreNordic

[Razzberry]

I need to watch it again because I didn't quite get the part of the picture of Pillar man or what Nora was doing by blowing it up.  It shows a lot of scars in his chest.

[stagmania]

@Razzberry it's a picture of his dead body on a slab at the morgue. She was proving that he died rather than departed.

[AllyS]

3 hours ago, Razzberry said:

I need to watch it again because I didn't quite get the part of the picture of Pillar man or what Nora was doing by blowing it up.  It shows a lot of scars in his chest.

The scars on his chest are autopsy cuts.

[Clanstarling]

On 4/23/2017 at 9:50 PM, Pallas said:

Helena Dax and ClanStarling, and yes, well put: I also didn't think that was who Christine was.

Thanks for remembering. :) But it didn't occur to me she would have another baby. That was interesting.

On 4/24/2017 at 0:48 PM, Gwen-Stacys said:

It was cold, but also the truth. And fairly level headed given that she'd just tried insinuate him in her grief over losing Lily. He didn't leave her for Nora, he left her for his dad because he was the chief of police and probably knew what to do.

Nora's done her fair share of handing out "the truth," so I didn't have a lot of problem with Tommy handing her some. Nevertheless, I did feel for her.

On 4/25/2017 at 7:41 AM, Mindthinkr said:

Great point. It could be that the book has been copied (perhaps edited) incorrectly or the spoken word has fallen to that mechanism we can best be described as the kids game of telephone. 

Well, as @RimaTheBirdGirl has pointed out, Matt's a known liar. Bet he's lying about there being only one copy of the Book of Kevin:

On 4/24/2017 at 8:00 AM, RimaTheBirdGirl said:

Matt is now routinely lying, in ways that may foment violent chaos in Jarden, on October 14.

1. Matt lied to Nora this episode, in denying involvement in Pillar Man's post-death dealings.  
2. Matt lied to the community & the world, in supporting the falsehood that Pillar Man departed.
3. He lied to Kevin in last week's premiere, when he denied being the author of the yellow flyers, advertising his church.  (A touch of self-aggrandizement there.)
4. I bet Matt knowingly told a falsehood to Nora, as a child, about their burnt-alive parents feeling no pain.

That first, childhood lie puts the rest in context.  As Matt explains, he lies for the greater good, to bring solace, and ease pain.  But as the Millerite-saga opening of this season illustrates, lying doesn't always do that.  Even from men of faith. 

 And it leads to the unfortunate deaths of police chiefs in Australia.

[Mindthinkr]

@Clanstarling that's a valid point that Matt is a liar and who knows what is written in that book. Hmm.  Or indeed how many copies. I might have missed this...are there no computers to write on? They can spew copies as long as you can feed paper into the printer. I'm also wondering if it made it to Australia and that's why the 4 Women were hunting for a Sheriff named Kevin who allegedly cannot die. So much left to learn before the finale lol. 

[Pallas]

4 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I might have missed this...are there no computers to write on?

Plenty: Michael was researching The Mapleton Gazette on one, Nora used her laptop to scroll through the flashdrive Mark Linn-Baker gave her, Mark Linn-Baker gave her a flashdrive because he knew she'd have a computer, and Matt himself watched each night's video of Mary sleeping, comatose again, on his own laptop. 

4 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I'm also wondering if it made it to Australia and that's why the 4 Women were hunting for a Sheriff named Kevin who allegedly cannot die. 

Neither Kevin nor Nora have read of a word of it yet, have they. Now I'm wondering if The Book of Kevin came from Australia -- describing Kevin's narrative in almost exact detail -- and that's what has Matt awestruck. And why John looked half-quizzical, half-rueful when Nora joked about having read it on the toilet in 20 minutes. ("You're laughing now, Magdalen, but I guess that means you missed the part where a dingo stole your baby..."). Matt may be waiting for Kevin to come back and point out the minor points that the Book got wrong, and then smite Kevin with the news: he, John and Michael didn't write the Book. Someone Down Under did.

[acid burn]

On 4/25/2017 at 10:24 AM, Wouldofshouldof said:

On 4/24/2017 at 1:44 AM, acid burn said:

I thought she was trying to hide the Wu Tang tattoo more than the fact she covered up the old tattoo.

They have these things called sleeves . . . 

True, but I presume Kevin sees her nekkid.

[Cardie]

13 hours ago, Pallas said:

he, John and Michael didn't write the Book. Someone Down Under did.

If that's the case, I would peg Kevin Sr. as the author.

[Milburn Stone]

On 4/23/2017 at 11:26 PM, WaltersHair said:

AND YES. The opening song was terrible.

In its intentional (in this usage) terribleness, it reminded me of the theme song for "Too Many Cooks." Another project that made me feel like I was going insane.

Edited April 28, 2017 by Milburn Stone

[maystone]

One big reason why I believe that Kevin Sr. did not write The Book of Kevin: he was already in Australia when Kevin Jr. had his series of deaths and resurrections. I doubt that KevJ called or wrote his father to tell him all about this; he really didn't want to talk about it or have the story get around. Maybe Matt took it upon himself to tell KevS, could be, but Matt is all about the biblical parallels going on in the present, and he would (imo) keep that biblical parallel going by handwriting the newest sacred text.

I don't know how the Aussie Four found out about a messianic police chief named Kevin, but we don't have the whole story yet. We know that KevS is in Australia when the events of Don't Be Ridiculous take place, but he's been there since before S2 started according to KevJ. It looks like he goes through some sort of metaphysical journey while there, so maybe during that time he has some visions of what's happened with his son. And the word spreads, and as someone above put it, it becomes garbled like when playing the telephone game.

I guess we'll see on Sunday.

[Cardie]

13 minutes ago, maystone said:

One big reason why I believe that Kevin Sr. did not write The Book of Kevin: he was already in Australia when Kevin Jr. had his series of deaths and resurrections.

He did communicate with Kevin Sr. when he was in the purgatorial hotel in "International Assassin."

[Milburn Stone]

One thing I keep noticing about the residents of Jarden that's a positive: They generally give each other enormous leeway to feel whatever they feel. Nora discovers Kevin asphyxiating himself and understands. Nora laughs hysterically at Kevin's wish that they have kids and he understands. Kevin catches Matt lying to him and can't really hold on to any rage about it. Even with the "demonstrators" who put fake poison in the river--yeah, there was a brouhaha, but nobody ended up getting arrested and everyone calmed down and went home. Everyone knows that after what everyone has been through, you have to cut major slack no matter what comes up. Our world could stand to emulate that.

Edited April 28, 2017 by Milburn Stone

[Double A]

Hard to talk about this show. I enjoy a little speculating, but have not been disappointed at how it's playing out. That said, my thought about Nora this season has been "she is choosing her side and it ain't the light". I think everyone is going to have to choose sides. Nora and Kevin may be mortal enemies that don't know it yet. And I may be totally wrong! Whatever - just glad it's back.

[BooBear]

I can't believe they got Mark Lyn Baker and I can't believe he hit it out of the park like he did. I went from smug amazement at the cameo to forgetting all about it and really believing that Mark Lyn Baker was another devastated leftover.  

Love me a Nora episode. As someone said above, her mean streak is a thing of beauty.  I was glad Christine came back for her baby.  That was the most probable thing. Sort of surprised that she isn't allowing Nora to have contact with her.   Why hide her background?  Just tell her that Nora took care of her early on when her mom couldn't.  I enjoyed them tying Tommy back into the storyline about the baby and him noting that he didn't even know Nora existed. I also do enjoy seeing how much Tommy does love Kevin and that he has realized that now. 

I was confused about Nora breaking her arm but sometimes when you are angry and upset you don't make sense.  You just lash out. 

I thought last week was too positive and we would see all the various characters not as great as they were seeming. 

What is it with hotels and this show? I love how they pick really interesting looking hotels. 

Edited June 11, 2017 by BooBear

[Jodithgrace]

Way back when Kevin and Nora were adopting Lily, the clerk at the agency (or whoever he was) offered them another baby in addition to Lily. I thought that was bizarre at the time, but if they had accepted baby #2, they would still have her (or him) now that Lily has gone. White infants are very much in demand by prospective adoptive parents, so it was extra strange that they seem to have an extra one just hanging around, but that baby was never mentioned again. I just thought it was odd. (there may have been speculation about this at the time, but I am just watching this series for the first time)

[shapeshifter]

8 hours ago, Jodithgrace said:

Way back when Kevin and Nora were adopting Lily, the clerk at the agency (or whoever he was) offered them another baby in addition to Lily. I thought that was bizarre at the time, but if they had accepted baby #2, they would still have her (or him) now that Lily has gone. White infants are very much in demand by prospective adoptive parents, so it was extra strange that they seem to have an extra one just hanging around, but that baby was never mentioned again. I just thought it was odd. (there may have been speculation about this at the time, but I am just watching this series for the first time)

I haven't rewatched any episodes since their first airings, so I could be wrong, but did the adoption clerk just want to trade Lilly for a baby that more closely matched Kevin and Nora's ethnicity, and Nora said no because Lilly wasn't just a baby, she was the baby left on Nora's doorstep?

[Domestic Assassin]

No, I'm pretty sure he was offering a second baby.  I think the implication was that after the Departure, people interested in adopting were down.

[Desperately Random]

6 minutes ago, Moose Andsquirrel said:

No, I'm pretty sure he was offering a second baby.  I think the implication was that after the Departure, people interested in adopting were down.

You're correct. He asked them if they would like to adopt a baby boy in addition to adopting Lily.

[Anela]

I know that Christine is the biological mother, but I can't believe that Nora gave Lily back. She abandoned the baby, and Nora and Kevin legally adopted her!

I'm kind of wishing I'd stopped watching at the end of season one.