S06.E05: They All Bow Down

[thewhiteowl]

Quote

Jake and Vanessa’s messy relationship poses a threat to the campaign, forcing Olivia to take action. Meanwhile, a game-changing revelation about the conspiracy surrounding Francisco Vargas’s assassination is revealed.

[chick binewski]

Jake is such a damn drama queen.

[maraleia]

33 minutes ago, chick binewski said:

Jake is such a damn drama queen.

and a murderer. This timeline is so damn annoying. I'm sick of the time jumps on this show and HTGAWM.

[LeeLeePanda]

I was bored for most of it, but really liked the reveal in the last 5 minutes. I really didn't like the idea of Jake and Papa Pope being behind Vargas's murder, if only because it would be so obvious and cliche. 

I was on the edge of my seat during those last few minute. I knew Jake wouldn't kill Liv, but it still made me feel uneasy. Also, I thought Mama Pope was going to be in the cabin when he opened the door. I kinda think she's behind all of this now. 

[Happytobehere]

55 minutes ago, LeeLeePanda said:

I was bored for most of it, but really liked the reveal in the last 5 minutes. I really didn't like the idea of Jake and Papa Pope being behind Vargas's murder, if only because it would be so obvious and cliche. 

I was on the edge of my seat during those last few minute. I knew Jake wouldn't kill Liv, but it still made me feel uneasy. Also, I thought Mama Pope was going to be in the cabin when he opened the door. I kinda think she's behind all of this now. 

I co-sign on this entire post.

It was both sad and funny when Jake's wife told Liv and Jake she wanted her husband back, because it was so clear even from her own narrative that she never had her husband in the first place. A man who refuses to share his life/past with you really isn't in a relationship with you. You just think you are in a relationship with him.  This also applies if the partner in question is female.

I don't know which reality was worse for Jake (and by extension, his wife) to live in -- The one where he faked happiness with his wife because he felt totally abandoned/betrayed by Olivia, but was in many ways dead inside and visibly faking to anyone who knew him; or the one where he hears Liv's explanation for her actions, he becomes rudderless and detaches from his wife, which leads to her downward spiral.  Either option has Jake being cruel to her but for completely different reasons and with vastly different outcomes.

Olivia remains awful.  SHe knows Cyrus didn't orchestrate the crime he is in prison and likely to be executed for, but hey, freeing him doesn't fit her agenda, so screw him.  However, since 'tis is not the first time we have seen this from her, I am not surprised.  As in previous cases, it was other members of her team who pushed Olivia to do right and she ran with it and pretended she was a "Gladiator."  

Best line of the night was when Jake called Liv on who she is and told her she is nothing more than her father's daughter.  IMO, she is worse than Rowan because she continues to lie to herself about being a gladiator.

[Athena5217]

Have we ever seen the woman with Papa Pope before? 

[weathered1]

When Olivia got in Vanessa's face with her long-winded spiel of self-righteousness, I was very much rooting for Vanessa to haul off and punch her. Olivia's delusions of grandeur - especially given all that she's done - are nauseating at this point. And to think I used to like the character. 

So we're supposed to root for Jake - a man who willingly targeted his wife by virtue of her last name and her family's bank account and connections, all the while screwing around on her, killing her father, then at a point when he got tired of pretending to care about her, proceeded to treat her with abject cruelty and blamed her for all of her/their problems (and sent her down the path toward alcoholism)? And he has the audacity to call her disgusting?

Oh, but he's a good guy because he didn't actually kill the woman Papa Pope wanted him to kill. Gee, Jake's a real saint. 

I wonder if the writers really don't have a clue about what they've turned these characters into or if they simply don't care. 

[WhosThatGirl]

Well, that was boring. I feel like I say that enough.

Also damn it, I wanted Terri Schuster to be the evil mastermind! Damn it.

Is there anyone not worth hating? 

[Dowel Jones]

45 minutes ago, weathered1 said:

Olivia's delusions of grandeur

Really.  She wanted to run a clean campaign to make up for Defiance?  What a laugh.  Of course, what constitutes a clean campaign in the Scandal world is a jail-able offense in the real world. 

If that is supposed to be the start of a redemption arc for Jake, forget it.  He needs to die.  I knew as soon as they pulled up to yet another isolated cabin that Jennifer was going to be alive.  She looks remarkably fresh for someone confined to a cabin for the last week or so.  And Liv - never hand your phone over to the creepy guy driving the car.  Have you never ever seen a crime movie before? Maybe they'll stop on the way out and pick it up. 

They incinerated Vanessa's car?  Damn, I would have taken it.  Kept my mouth shut as long as they paid for the repairs.

[WhosThatGirl]

For a second there, I thought Jake was driving Liv up to some sort of romantic cabin filled with jam or some crap. Remember when she always talked about how making jam was her romantic dream with Fitz? I really thought that was happening. I never thought Jake was going to kill het, I have a soft spot for Jake but he is a wimp and he would never kill Olivia.

The only people who actually might is whoever works for/with that woman in the red dress who came to Papa Pope. Now can this show be about those people?!?!

[walnutqueen]

And now it seems cold and dark in all your gooyey places.

R.I.P.  Scandal

[ShowPolish]

So Jake was  being super creepy towards Olivia for no reason?  Are we supposed to root for him?  To me he is the absolute most despicable character, Papa Pope included.  Completely irredeemable.  Just kill him already, please.

And the big reveal is that a character we don't care about and know very little about is still alive?

This show really grinds my gears sometimes.

The jake-centric episodes always seem like a different show.  Give me some Mellie and Fitz please.

Edited March 10, 2017 by ShowPolish

[slade3]

I really wish they had edited, rewritten or cut that scene with Jake and Olivia in the car. Yes, it was full of tension, but Tension shouldn't be more important than Character 6 seasons into a show. If I'm still here, watching, it means I'm here for the characters. I'm certainly not here for B613 or the convoluted, extra-violent storytelling. Having Jake utter that line about the second location was just stupid.

This is the second episode in a row that Olivia is acting out-of-character to me. With Cyrus, I simply didn't understand how/why she would be so gung-ho about letting her friend get the death penalty for a crime he swore he didn't commit. We know Cyrus was very capable of doing it, but I thought it was weird for Olivia to just jump in and act all "He's guilty, hang him!" especially after he called to beg for her help. (Though she did turn her back on Jake when he begged her to save him in season 3.) 

Now we have Olivia believing Jake was actually taking her to "the second location" to harm her? I knew Jake wouldn't kill her; Olivia should have known this, too. It would have made for more interesting TV. Though Jake was acting really weird, I'll give her that.

So for me, the car ride at the end was overly dramatic for no reason. I knew Jake wasn't taking her somewhere to hurt or kill her, and I was just annoyed that it was being played that way. It was also really obvious to me that he was taking her to show her that someone was alive - though I really love that @WhosThatGirl thought he was taking her to a romantic cabin! This show would be 1000x better if that really happened because it would have been more WTF than any B613 plot ever. I actually thought he was taking her to see an alive Frankie Vargas - don't ask how I thought this was possible and now that I wrote that, I realize that would have been more WTF than the romantic dinner considering we saw Frankie flatline in the hospital.

The woman in the red dress is Jeff Perry's daughter in real life and this was the first time we saw her. I like the new twist that someone else is pulling Rowan Pope's puppet strings, but the idea that there's a new B613, or some other spy organization, crushes me. I've never liked the B613 story line and really don't want to deal with another one like it. Rowan also seemed out of character to me and I didn't like it. I dislike him intensely and don't want to see a cowed Rowan.

In any case, what I got from this is Jake was not behind Frankie Vargas's assassination and possibly didn't know it was going to happen. The timeline in this episode was very messy, but my understanding is that Rowan gave Jake the order to kidnap and kill Jennifer Fields (?) before Frankie was shot - Jake was called out into the hall before the assassination. I had the impression Jake didn't know why he was given that order because he told Olivia he was given a task and he did it. And he was probably already looking for Jennifer while Frankie was being assassinated. I assume he learned of the assassination and decided to keep Jennifer alive. I wasn't sure if that was a Rowan/Jake plan, or just Jake's plan after learning Frankie was shot. (What we'll probably learn is that Jennifer is a B613 agent Jake used to date and she was tasked with trailing Frankie on his campaign by this Lady in Red, and setting Cyrus up for his murder. As soon as she found out she was also going to be disposed of, she contacted Rowan and/or Jake for help.)

Vanessa is a mess. I'm not enjoying the new casting either. I don't believe Rowan would have chosen this Vanessa for Jake. She's too high-strung and messy. Jake was really cruel to her, too, so I hated their scenes together. I guess Mellie will be president and Jake will be VP, so Vanessa is here for the long-haul and I'm sorry about that. I had known the actress was from Glee, but I couldn't remember what role until she started shrieking. I really hated her character on Glee and I can see I will hate her character on Scandal, too.

Scandal really makes it hard to stick around. But I will say I'm eternally grateful that Olivia believing Jake was behind the assassination (and vice versa)didn't last longer than half an episode.

[Primetimer]

It's layers upon layers as Jake continues to complete missions for Eli, but is caught by Liv, but then getting caught may be part of his mission, but then he reveals to Liv that he hasn't achieved Eli's goals, so who is he working for, or is he hardly working?

View the full article

[WhosThatGirl]

3 hours ago, slade3 said:

I really wish they had edited, rewritten or cut that scene with Jake and Olivia in the car. Yes, it was full of tension, but Tension shouldn't be more important than Character 6 seasons into a show. If I'm still here, watching, it means I'm here for the characters. I'm certainly not here for B613 or the convoluted, extra-violent storytelling. Having Jake utter that line about the second location was just stupid.

This is the second episode in a row that Olivia is acting out-of-character to me. With Cyrus, I simply didn't understand how/why she would be so gung-ho about letting her friend get the death penalty for a crime he swore he didn't commit. We know Cyrus was very capable of doing it, but I thought it was weird for Olivia to just jump in and act all "He's guilty, hang him!" especially after he called to beg for her help. (Though she did turn her back on Jake when he begged her to save him in season 3.) 

Now we have Olivia believing Jake was actually taking her to "the second location" to harm her? I knew Jake wouldn't kill her; Olivia should have known this, too. It would have made for more interesting TV. Though Jake was acting really weird, I'll give her that.

So for me, the car ride at the end was overly dramatic for no reason. I knew Jake wasn't taking her somewhere to hurt or kill her, and I was just annoyed that it was being played that way. It was also really obvious to me that he was taking her to show her that someone was alive - though I really love that @WhosThatGirl thought he was taking her to a romantic cabin! This show would be 1000x better if that really happened because it would have been more WTF than any B613 plot ever. I actually thought he was taking her to see an alive Frankie Vargas - don't ask how I thought this was possible and now that I wrote that, I realize that would have been more WTF than the romantic dinner considering we saw Frankie flatline in the hospital.

The woman in the red dress is Jeff Perry's daughter in real life and this was the first time we saw her. I like the new twist that someone else is pulling Rowan Pope's puppet strings, but the idea that there's a new B613, or some other spy organization, crushes me. I've never liked the B613 story line and really don't want to deal with another one like it. Rowan also seemed out of character to me and I didn't like it. I dislike him intensely and don't want to see a cowed Rowan.

In any case, what I got from this is Jake was not behind Frankie Vargas's assassination and possibly didn't know it was going to happen. The timeline in this episode was very messy, but my understanding is that Rowan gave Jake the order to kidnap and kill Jennifer Fields (?) before Frankie was shot - Jake was called out into the hall before the assassination. I had the impression Jake didn't know why he was given that order because he told Olivia he was given a task and he did it. And he was probably already looking for Jennifer while Frankie was being assassinated. I assume he learned of the assassination and decided to keep Jennifer alive. I wasn't sure if that was a Rowan/Jake plan, or just Jake's plan after learning Frankie was shot. (What we'll probably learn is that Jennifer is a B613 agent Jake used to date and she was tasked with trailing Frankie on his campaign by this Lady in Red, and setting Cyrus up for his murder. As soon as she found out she was also going to be disposed of, she contacted Rowan and/or Jake for help.)

Vanessa is a mess. I'm not enjoying the new casting either. I don't believe Rowan would have chosen this Vanessa for Jake. She's too high-strung and messy. Jake was really cruel to her, too, so I hated their scenes together. I guess Mellie will be president and Jake will be VP, so Vanessa is here for the long-haul and I'm sorry about that. I had known the actress was from Glee, but I couldn't remember what role until she started shrieking. I really hated her character on Glee and I can see I will hate her character on Scandal, too.

Scandal really makes it hard to stick around. But I will say I'm eternally grateful that Olivia believing Jake was behind the assassination (and vice versa)didn't last longer than half an episode.

They seem to like to do a lot of Jake misdirections, have us viewers think he's evil or something. Remember the episode two seasons ago when the group, minus Olive, thought Jake was going rouge and killing b216 members, and then at the very last second, bait and switch, we find out all along both Liv and Jake knew what the group was doing and he wasn't the one, it was some random lady who worked in the White House. 

Its just.. they tend do this a lot. It's why I know Jake will never fully go rouge. I really was just watching the final scenes feeling annoyed that they were doing this. I really truly didn't believe for one second Olivia was in danger. 

[dippydee]

9 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

Is there anyone not worth hating? 

I still like Mellie but I think that's just mostly because I adore Bellamy Young and it's always nice to see her on tv.

This show is such a freaking mess. I'm mostly just watching to see them all suffer at this point. I miss when this show was fun.

Edited March 10, 2017 by dippydee

[slade3]

1 hour ago, WhosThatGirl said:

They seem to like to do a lot of Jake misdirections, have us viewers think he's evil or something. Remember the episode two seasons ago when the group, minus Olive, thought Jake was going rouge and killing b216 members, and then at the very last second, bait and switch, we find out all along both Liv and Jake knew what the group was doing and he wasn't the one, it was some random lady who worked in the White House. 

Its just.. they tend do this a lot. It's why I know Jake will never fully go rouge. I really was just watching the final scenes feeling annoyed that they were doing this. I really truly didn't believe for one second Olivia was in danger. 

Yes, I remember that. It was a strange episode in my opinion. I think episodes like that are why it's easy to get confused watching this show. I rewatched that episode recently, but I didn't really understand why they wanted the audience to think Jake was going rogue.

Same with last night's. If these character-centic episodes are really just about trying to give Kerry Washington less screen time while she was pregnant, I would understand. Otherwise, it would have been easier to make everyone seem like a suspect in just a couple of episodes. The fact that both Cyrus and Jake are innocent make the last two episodes pointless to me.

[WhosThatGirl]

That's the only reason I can come up with trying to give KW less screen time. Which I understand as well but the story is suffering. More so than if already does. 

[Ohwell]

While I knew it wasn't going to happen, I had dreams of Jake burying Olivia's murdered ass in the woods.  I did like the look of terror on her face though. 

[Kathcart]

Quote

I thought Jake was driving Liv up to some sort of romantic cabin filled with jam or some crap.

I totally did, too! Maybe next week the not-dead girl will step back and reveal the jam.

So Papa Pope was busy paleontologizing when Red Dress came in and hollered at him ... but ? Where is he "working" now? Surely the Smithsonian did not hire him back after he was sent up the river for embezzling all that money. Maybe he is working now at the Jeffersonian to set the stage for a very special crossover episode with "Bones" for sweeps week.

This has probably been mentioned before, but how ridiculous is it that every character on Scandal calls it "the oval" and nobody no one ever says "the oval office" like any normal person would. I can see it being sort of jargony for the President or White House people but I do not buy that Vanessa called it "the oval."

[WhosThatGirl]

I mean.. I'm still just annoyed that they do the bait and switch with these characters. Jake isn't the only one but since last nights episode was his, obviously I see examples from the past as it pertains. But it bugs the hell out of me how much this show is slowly becoming "the boy who cried wolf" with its characters. 

[chick binewski]

20 hours ago, weathered1 said:

When Olivia got in Vanessa's face with her long-winded spiel of self-righteousness, I was very much rooting for Vanessa to haul off and punch her. Olivia's delusions of grandeur - especially given all that she's done - are nauseating at this point. 

I know (and I would have loved to see Joelle Carter smack Olivia into next Tuesday). And I like how all the characters who have had a hand in murdering approximately 5,678 people get all pearl-clutchy over Vanessa getting her drink on.

The fact this ep started with a Vanessa car crash cover-up made me hopeful about a return to the scandal-of-the-week format. The show really went off the rails for me when Olivia murdered Andrew, partly because Jon Tenney was fabulous during the last of his episodes & it would have been great to have a real villain instead of a bunch of bad guys who do bad stuff to each other and then forget about it the following week. 

[tabbybear]

I have been such a fan of scandal.  It was always one of my go to shows.  What worries me is it kind of looks like Shonda is tanking her own show on purpose.  Don't any of TPTB read these boards?   Don't any of them have a creative thought like ever?  It was such a good show and it still could be with just tiny bit of effort.  My son passed away 7 months ago and the only thing that takes me out of that is my tv shows.  I really don't want to lose another one Damn it!  Somebody do something PLEASE.  Oy yea I can't stand Olivia anymore she isn't even remotely likeable or human.  I liked it when OPA was like a family.  Good scandal of the week and some personal stories explored was a good formula can't we please just have that back.

Edited March 11, 2017 by tabbybear
added a bit

[walnutqueen]

16 hours ago, WhosThatGirl said:

It's why I know Jake will never fully go rouge

I am picturing him now, with overly pinked cheeks.  :-)

And is it my imagination, or is Jake beginning to sound like a bloviating Papa Pope?

[Vyk]

15 hours ago, dippydee said:

I still like Mellie but I think that's just mostly because I adore Bellamy Young and it's always nice to see her on tv.

Did Bellamy do anything before Scandal?  I don't remember her from anything I've seen in the past.

Is this a different Vanessa?  I thought it was the same one from last season.

[slade3]

6 hours ago, tabbybear said:

I have been such a fan of scandal.  It was always one of my go to shows.  What worries me is it kind of looks like Shonda is tanking her own show on purpose.  Don't any of TPTB read these boards?   Don't any of them have a creative thought like ever?  It was such a good show and it still could be with just tiny bit of effort.  My son passed away 7 months ago and the only thing that takes me out of that is my tv shows.  I really don't want to lose another one Damn it!  Somebody do something PLEASE.  Oy yea I can't stand Olivia anymore she isn't even remotely likeable or human.  I liked it when OPA was like a family.  Good scandal of the week and some personal stories explored was a good formula can't we please just have that back.

I'm very sorry about the loss of your son, @tabbybear. My brother passed over a year ago and I use TV shows as a way to take me out of reality. I've been rewatching older episodes of Scandal and really enjoying them. I hope something happens to make Olivia a bit more likeable.

[nara]

On 3/9/2017 at 11:05 PM, Athena5217 said:

Have we ever seen the woman with Papa Pope before? 

 

On 3/10/2017 at 4:48 AM, slade3 said:

The woman in the red dress is Jeff Perry's daughter in real life and this was the first time we saw her. I like the new twist that someone else is pulling Rowan Pope's puppet strings, but the idea that there's a new B613, or some other spy organization, crushes me. I've never liked the B613 story line and really don't want to deal with another one like it. Rowan also seemed out of character to me and I didn't like it. I dislike him intensely and don't want to see a cowed Rowan.

Vanessa is a mess. I'm not enjoying the new casting either. I don't believe Rowan would have chosen this Vanessa for Jake. She's too high-strung and messy. Jake was really cruel to her, too, so I hated their scenes together. I guess Mellie will be president and Jake will be VP, so Vanessa is here for the long-haul and I'm sorry about that. I had known the actress was from Glee, but I couldn't remember what role until she started shrieking. I really hated her character on Glee and I can see I will hate her character on Scandal, too.

Thank you both for your comments.  I had no clue who that woman was.  However, I've taken to paying bills while watching Scandal, because it's not been worthy of my full attention in a long line, so I thought I'd missed something.  I didn't even realize there was a casting change for Vanessa, and the 2 actresses don't really look alike!  Scandal, please do something to make me stop multitasking while watching you!

6 hours ago, Vyk said:

Did Bellamy do anything before Scandal?  I don't remember her from anything I've seen in the past.

LOL, I was home sick earlier this week and saw her on a very old episode of Law & Order (Angie Harmon timeframe) in which she played a conniving young woman from Niagara Falls.

[Oblique Angle]

"You are not going to come for me. I am not here for it. Not today!"

It was interesting to me that they had Olivia going street with Vanessa. Usually she just raises her voice level and starts talking speaking really fast but with her usual clipped manner. I can't remember ever hearing Liv talk like she did to Vanessa and half expected her to kick off her shoes and start taking off her earrings.

Edited March 11, 2017 by Oblique Angle

[dippydee]

9 hours ago, Vyk said:

Did Bellamy do anything before Scandal?  I don't remember her from anything I've seen in the past.

She's been random episodes of a lot of shows. I remember her from Scrubs and she was in an episode of Drop Dead Diva I watched recently. But the main thing I know her from was Dirty Sexy Money where she played the wife of a cheating politician.

[thewhiteowl]

I may be misremembering but didn't Eli bloviate and speechify a whole lot of "I AM God" stuff? Now GOD works for another shadowy organization?  Assuming the lady in red was their representative. Man, that's just tiresome and redundant. I'm not here for that crap.

[nara]

5 minutes ago, thewhiteowl said:

I may be misremembering but didn't Eli bloviate and speechify a whole lot of "I AM God" stuff? Now GOD works for another shadowy organization?  Assuming the lady in red was their representative. Man, that's just tiresome and redundant. I'm not here for that crap.

Maybe she's his split personality.  I don't think they've done that yet on scandal.  And the fact that she's dressed in red is symbolic of the devil?  JK.

 I agree with you 100%-- it's like the opposite of Matryoshka dolls and is boring

[reggiejax]

Quote

Really.  She wanted to run a clean campaign to make up for Defiance?  What a laugh.  Of course, what constitutes a clean campaign in the Scandal world is a jail-able offense in the real world. 

Not to mention, running a "clean" campaign doesn't make up for Defiance. If Liv wanted to make up for Defiance she would go to the authorities, turn herself in, and come clean about her actions. As well as those of each and every one of her conspirators, up to, including, and especially the entitled idiot she is trying to get elected "cleanly".

Speaking of the entitled idiot, leave it Mellie to have the most groan worthy moment of the episode That entire speech she gave to Vanessa was too ridiculous for words. So her big advice to her is to suck it up for about a decade, and one day she too can be just like Mellie. No thanks.

The worst part was Mellie talking about having to subvert herself for so long to people inferior to her. Granted, she was speaking of Fitz, so what she said is technically true. But Fitz is inferior to Mellie the way Harry Dunn was inferior to Lloyd Christmas. So I wouldn't go bragging on that, Smellie. 

Edited March 11, 2017 by reggiejax

[slade3]

6 hours ago, nara said:

Thank you both for your comments.  I had no clue who that woman was.  However, I've taken to paying bills while watching Scandal, because it's not been worthy of my full attention in a long line, so I thought I'd missed something.  I didn't even realize there was a casting change for Vanessa, and the 2 actresses don't really look alike!  Scandal, please do something to make me stop multitasking while watching you!

I was paying 100% attention and I still thought I missed something when she showed up. Later, I read she was Jeff Perry's daughter and someone commented (here, or on another forum) that Shonda tweeted this is the first time we've ever seen her. So, most viewers were confused. I had also expected Jeff Perry's daughter to look and sound younger, so it didn't even cross my mind that she was already making her first appearance.

 

6 hours ago, Oblique Angle said:

"You are not going to come for me. I am not here for it. Not today!"

It was interesting to me that they had Olivia going street with Vanessa. Usually she just raises her voice level and starts talking speaking really fast but with her usual clipped manner. I can't remember ever hearing Liv talk like she did to Vanessa and half expected her to kick off her shoes and start taking off her earrings.

I read some commentary (probably on Tumblr) that Olivia has been called a whore by Mellie numerous times, but never reacted, yet when Vanessa called her a whore she got physical. I don't remember what the commenter's conclusion was, but I'm wondering if that's because Olivia knew any number of secret service agents would have taken her down if she shoved the first lady, or if deep down she did believe she was Fitz's whore. It could also just be Olivia thinks Vanessa's tacky and felt "going street" was the only way Vanessa would calm down.

[Vyk]

1 hour ago, slade3 said:

I read some commentary (probably on Tumblr) that Olivia has been called a whore by Mellie numerous times, but never reacted, yet when Vanessa called her a whore she got physical. I don't remember what the commenter's conclusion was, but I'm wondering if that's because Olivia knew any number of secret service agents would have taken her down if she shoved the first lady, or if deep down she did believe she was Fitz's whore. It could also just be Olivia thinks Vanessa's tacky and felt "going street" was the only way Vanessa would calm down.

Olivia barely reacted to Mellie calling her that because it was true.  She'd been with her then-husband over and over and over again, something that wound up badly and greatly humiliating her.  No point in biting back to something that's true.  But Vanessa's claims were false.  Olivia hadn't been with Jake since he'd married Vanessa, so I can see how she'd get angry at accusations toward her that were untrue.

[buttersister]

Huck's still pretty much in character. That is all. Currently the only character who's entertaining me is Charlie. I did not see that coming.

[slade3]

11 hours ago, Vyk said:

Olivia barely reacted to Mellie calling her that because it was true.  She'd been with her then-husband over and over and over again, something that wound up badly and greatly humiliating her.  No point in biting back to something that's true.  But Vanessa's claims were false.  Olivia hadn't been with Jake since he'd married Vanessa, so I can see how she'd get angry at accusations toward her that were untrue.

But would a woman stand by and allow herself to be called a whore? Even a woman who is being called out by her lover's wife. I would think anyone would say "I'm not a whore." Viewers may believe Olivia is a whore for sleeping with a married man, but, technically, she is not. She was not paid for her services. And I doubt she would allow anyone to think she thinks she is.

I think Olivia's reaction to Vanessa vs. her reaction to Mellie could be because Olivia is never sure of Fitz's love for her as anything other than his mistress (as she has called herself), but is very clear that Jake loves her and she loves Jake as equals. It could also have been that Olivia needed to take control of Vanessa in that moment because she needed Vanessa to stop misbehaving. With Mellie, as you say, Olivia didn't need anything from her and there was no point in reacting to Mellie's pain and anger.

But whatever Olivia's reasons were, I hope this isn't going to be a regular thing.

Edited March 12, 2017 by slade3

[Ohwell]

2 hours ago, slade3 said:

Viewers may believe Olivia is a whore for sleeping with a married man, but, technically, she is not. She was not paid for her services. And I doubt she would allow anyone to think she thinks she is.

Oh, I"d say she was paid for her services "in kind." 

[reggiejax]

4 hours ago, slade3 said:

Viewers may believe Olivia is a whore for sleeping with a married man, but, technically, she is not. She was not paid for her services. And I doubt she would allow anyone to think she thinks she is.

I don't know what it says that we're down to using technicalities to defend Olivia Pope, but it can't be any good. 

[slade3]

I don't like Olivia at the moment, and I'm disappointed with the path her character is taking, but I've never considered her a whore.

5 hours ago, reggiejax said:

I don't know what it says that we're down to using technicalities to defend Olivia Pope, but it can't be any good. 

In the context of the original discussion, I thought that technicality was important. I doubt Olivia's silence when Mellie calls her a whore, as opposed to her reaction when Vanessa called her one, is because when Mellie calls her a whore, it's true.

[Oblique Angle]

Quote

I read some commentary (probably on Tumblr) that Olivia has been called a whore by Mellie numerous times, but never reacted, yet when Vanessa called her a whore she got physical. I don't remember what the commenter's conclusion was, but I'm wondering if that's because Olivia knew any number of secret service agents would have taken her down if she shoved the first lady, or if deep down she did believe she was Fitz's whore. It could also just be Olivia thinks Vanessa's tacky and felt "going street" was the only way Vanessa would calm down.

What struck me wasn't what Olivia or why she said, it was how she said it. Some commenters on another site said they thought Olivia acted like she was on the Real Housewives of Atlanta or something. I've never watched RHOA but have seen enough clips from it and memes based on it to understand the sentiment and sort of agree. We've watched Olivia--who we've been repeatedly told grew up in European boarding schools with the children of royalty, diplomats, and CEOs--confront people for five seasons and this particular moment seemed almost OOC to me. Nothing wrong with the behavior, especially if it's justified, but IMO Olivia in particular has no foundation for the way she expressed herself. Hope this isn't Shonda's way of trying to get the fleeing audience back, not unless she's going to explain where Olivia suddenly acquired the ability to code-switch.

[slade3]

4 hours ago, Oblique Angle said:

What struck me wasn't what Olivia or why she said, it was how she said it. Some commenters on another site said they thought Olivia acted like she was on the Real Housewives of Atlanta or something. I've never watched RHOA but have seen enough clips from it and memes based on it to understand the sentiment and sort of agree. We've watched Olivia--who we've been repeatedly told grew up in European boarding schools with the children of royalty, diplomats, and CEOs--confront people for five seasons and this particular moment seemed almost OOC to me. Nothing wrong with the behavior, especially if it's justified, but IMO Olivia in particular has no foundation for the way she expressed herself. Hope this isn't Shonda's way of trying to get the fleeing audience back, not unless she's going to explain where Olivia suddenly acquired the ability to code-switch.

I think Olivia behaved this way once before. It's a scene I really dislike in 4x22, "You Can't Take Command." She's telling Jake she doesn't want to be her father's little girl anymore, or something like that, and she pacing back and forth screaming "I want this. I want this and I'm going to take it." It seemed like the Vanessa scene to me, and Jake is just standing there, staring at her, waiting for her to get it out of her system.

[Anela]

On 3/11/2017 at 2:00 AM, tabbybear said:

I have been such a fan of scandal.  It was always one of my go to shows.  What worries me is it kind of looks like Shonda is tanking her own show on purpose.  Don't any of TPTB read these boards?   Don't any of them have a creative thought like ever?  It was such a good show and it still could be with just tiny bit of effort.  My son passed away 7 months ago and the only thing that takes me out of that is my tv shows.  I really don't want to lose another one Damn it!  Somebody do something PLEASE.  Oy yea I can't stand Olivia anymore she isn't even remotely likeable or human.  I liked it when OPA was like a family.  Good scandal of the week and some personal stories explored was a good formula can't we please just have that back.

 

On 3/11/2017 at 8:33 AM, slade3 said:

I'm very sorry about the loss of your son, @tabbybear. My brother passed over a year ago and I use TV shows as a way to take me out of reality. I've been rewatching older episodes of Scandal and really enjoying them. I hope something happens to make Olivia a bit more likeable.

I'm sorry. ♥ After losing my mum, I've had trouble focusing on much, but when something does take me out of it all, I'm really grateful. 

I was thinking about the first season or two of Scandal, and how I was surprised that I liked it. I was watching it on-demand, in 2012, and caught up with what I'd missed online. I wish they hadn't gone the super-spy/assassin route with anyone - Olivia's dad could have been a really sleazy reporter, or something, if they wanted to keep him mean. 

I liked seeing him nervous, though. I also think it's her mother's doing. Agreed with those who think that Jake is a drama queen (and since I can't afford a phone like that, I thought he could at least have had her leave it in her car). I knew he wouldn't kill her, so the tension was weird. I figured his car might be bugged, but then couldn't they follow him with a signal of some sort, if that were the case? 

I feel so bad for Jake's wife. Not interested in yet another new character, even if she makes the dad nervous. Glad Jake didn't kill the woman. 

Edited March 13, 2017 by Anela

[walnutqueen]

3 hours ago, iheartET said:

I like seeing Jake have power and call the shots.

Eeewww.  Apparently Shonda likes that ish, too.  He makes my skin crawl these days.

 

1 minute ago, Anela said:

 

I'm sorry. ♥ After losing my mum, I've had trouble focusing on much, but when something does take me out of it all, I'm really grateful. 

I'm sure I've said this before, but my brain doesn't even function after losing my Mum last year, so I feel you, Anela.

[slade3]

6 hours ago, Anela said:

 

I'm sorry. ♥ After losing my mum, I've had trouble focusing on much, but when something does take me out of it all, I'm really grateful. 

I was thinking about the first season or two of Scandal, and how I was surprised that I liked it. I was watching it on-demand, in 2012, and caught up with what I'd missed online. I wish they hadn't gone the super-spy/assassin route with anyone - Olivia's dad could have been a really sleazy reporter, or something, if they wanted to keep him mean. 

I liked seeing him nervous, though. I also think it's her mother's doing. Agreed with those who think that Jake is a drama queen (and since I can't afford a phone like that, I thought he could at least have had her leave it in her car). I knew he wouldn't kill her, so the tension was weird. I figured his car might be bugged, but then couldn't they follow him with a signal of some sort, if that were the case? 

I feel so bad for Jake's wife. Not interested in yet another new character, even if she makes the dad nervous. Glad Jake didn't kill the woman. 

Thank you. I'm sorry for your loss, as well.

I actually didn't like Scandal when it first aired, but I continued to tune in because I was curious where it was going. I've stopped watching it several times over the years, but always came back to it. It wasn't until I decided to rewatch all the seasons over this past hiatus that I realized how enjoyable seasons 1 and 2 are. And, yes, the B613 story line is really what hurt the show for me. I really enjoy watching Jake/Scott Foley though, so my hope is that he's able to move away from B613 and work at OPA the way Huck does. I know the show can't "go back", but I'd really like to see it do cases of the week again.

[Guest]

Highlight of the episode (only highlight) was Vanessa reading Liv for the filth she is. Her whole spiel about needing to win honestly to make up for Defiance? NEWSFLASH - you lost, Liv.  If you manage to get Mellie in the White House now, it's only because you're covering evidence that an innocent man (who was once your friend and mentor) is sitting in jail.  You won nothing.  Even as unrealistic as this show is, I can't believe they're acting like it is a foregone conclusion that Mellie will win.  In real life, the party who won would be trying to unite their electors around their second choice.  

I am curious about who the woman with Eli was.  

[Kathcart]

Drinking game: take a drink whenever a character says "on national television." No fair drinking if they say only "on television," but don't worry -- they NEVER say "on television." It's always "ON NATIONAL TELEVISION!!!"

[KaveDweller]

23 hours ago, iheartET said:

Questions:

1) On the way to the cabin, why did Jake tell Liv that he killed Jenifer when she is still alive?! And why is she being kept at a cabin?

Apparently he just meant that he staged her death and killed her to the world. I assume she's being kept at the cabin so no one finds out she's alive.

[love2lovebadtv]

On 3/11/2017 at 9:27 AM, nara said:

 

Thank you both for your comments.  I had no clue who that woman was.  However, I've taken to paying bills while watching Scandal, because it's not been worthy of my full attention in a long line, so I thought I'd missed something.  I didn't even realize there was a casting change for Vanessa, and the 2 actresses don't really look alike!  Scandal, please do something to make me stop multitasking while watching you!

LOL, I was home sick earlier this week and saw her on a very old episode of Law & Order (Angie Harmon timeframe) in which she played a conniving young woman from Niagara Falls.

Yes, I remember seeing that old episode after I had already been watching Scandal. I remembered that episode partly because I liked Bellamys character but I didn't make the connection years later when I saw Bellamy with longer hair on scandal until I was home one day and caught the old law & order episode one day. 

I also saw her on an old episode of NCIS. 

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

Is Jake Scandal's Worst Spy, Or Best Spy?

It's layers upon layers as Jake continues to complete missions for Eli, but is caught by Liv, but then getting caught may be part of his mission, but then he reveals to Liv that he hasn't achieved Eli's goals, so who is he working for, or is he hardly working?

[Ohwell]

Looking at that pic above reminds me that I've never understood Olivia's wardrobe.  It looks like the clothes overpower her smallish frame.  As the designers say, she's not wearing the clothes; the clothes are wearing her.  And that hideous plaid cape...ugh.