S04.E07: Dr. Adrian Shaw

[MostlyC]

Red directs the team to an individual who provides new identities to criminals on the run; Alexander Kirk's health worsens; Liz seek guidance from Cooper.

[TigerLynx]

Liz:  "I'm not your daughter.  You're not my father."

Me:  "Duh, we all saw that coming a mile away."  The US government will pay off the national debt before it is ever revealed who Liz's father is.

On a lighter note, Dembe and Raymond are still hilarious.

[ottoDbusdriver]

I'm sorry to correct Lizzie, but when did they catch the Thrushes ? All they got was Aram's girlfriend who was the Thrushes mole, but that was it.

Kirk: "You remind me of your mother".
So, was Lizzie's mother bland, dull, gullible, dimwitted, and easy to fool as well ?

On a completely superficial note, damn, Samar, you clean up nice.

Red wants to kill the one doctor that can cure Kirk -- why exactly ?  Just fucking kill Kirk already.
Worst FBI security ever -- how did Kirk's #1 get into his hospital room ? 

Oh Lizzie, why don't you just show the DNA test you have in your possession ?  I'm sure the hospital will be ok with that -- because they take 3rd party testing that they didn't conduct or arrange for ALL THE TIME.  Sure, that should speed things up with the transplant.  But no, we have to wait to see if the genetics test shows "a match".  There's no way they would progress that far on the marrow donation without actual results.  What utter bullshit !!  

And, of course, she's not his daughter.  Who would have guessed ?  </sarcasm>

Red saves Dr. Bloom from the FBI -- and hooks her up with a nifty lab.  For what reason we still don't know.

Why does Lizzie go back to Kirk if she has no relation to him ? Seriously, why ?  Because he is daddy-like ?  FFS !

And no Mr. Kaplan updates.  How long are they going to drag that out ?

Edited November 4, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[ItCouldBeWorse]

Can Adrian Shaw do something temporarily to Red's blood so that his DNA will either match or not match Lizzie's? (Not quite sure which way at this point.)  I feel like I've seen that done somewhere before.

Not sure why Lizzie didn't just ask Kirk for a swab when he was in custody and have her own DNA test done under circumstances where she wouldn't suspect Red of fixing the results.

I know there were times constraints, but I don't think they would have done Lizzie's dialysis before knowing she was a match.

Also, did anyone believe that there was a coincidental, huge bus accident?  It seems like there should have been a top secret medical site where Kirk could have been held that would not accept trauma victims.

Finally, Kirk's known for years that he was ill. If he was willing to consider using Agnes as a donor, why hadn't he tried to create a donor through in vitro fertilization? Parents have done it to create donors for their sick older children. Perhaps he tried and it didn't work.

3 minutes ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Worst FBI security ever -- how did Kirk's #1 get into his hospital room ? 

She said she was his lawyer. That may even be true.

[ottoDbusdriver]

26 minutes ago, ItCouldBeWorse said:

She said she was his lawyer. That may even be true.

I must have nodded off and missed this -- probably because it was so boring.

Wouldn't the FBI have, oh, I don't know, checked out who Kirk's lawyer was BEFOREHAND so someone doesn't just show up and say "I'm his lawyer".  That is so bush league to fall for that.

I'm pretty sure the FBI probably has it's own medical facilities and wouldn't be forced to use a public hospital for a high-value prisoner for plot convenience .

[dwmarch]

So the idea is that if you want to get a commando team into Walter Reed Army Medical Center all you have to do is stage a bus accident and the staff and security at the hospital will ignore the 30 or so swarthy suspicious Russian-accented military-aged males who garrison the lobby. They don't check backpacks and to fool the desk staff all you have to do is put on a coat that says "Doctor" on it somewhere and you're good to go. The FBI, US Marshals and the hospital security (which I would think would consist of actual soldiers for a high-value prisoner) don't find any of this suspicious.

Silly Lizzie (as expected). "He's going to spend the rest of his life in prison!" And if you'd let him just die in custody instead of trying to save him, that would still be true. But since Lizzie is apparently terrible at Easter Egg hunts (something she gets from her real father perhaps?) she's got to keep Kirk alive so she can find out where the rest of the anachronistic coffee cans with sentimental knick-knacks are buried. As soon as Lizzie found out Kirk wasn't her actual father she should have shot him in the forehead instead of moping.

Tom actually got to be the voice of reason for once. Forget the past, let's move on.

[ottoDbusdriver]

19 minutes ago, dwmarch said:

But since Lizzie is apparently terrible at Easter Egg hunts (something she gets from her real father perhaps?) she's got to keep Kirk alive so she can find out where the rest of the anachronistic coffee cans with sentimental knick-knacks are buried. As soon as Lizzie found out Kirk wasn't her actual father she should have shot him in the forehead instead of moping.

So much this -- Lizzie is keeping Kirk alive even after she discovers he's not her father because needs to re-stock her supply of shitty childhood bracelets.  That's as good a reason as any on this show.

Edited November 4, 2016 by ottoDbusdriver

[mertensia]

Oh, who cares who her father is? She's a drain on the show any way you look at it.

[desertflower]

For a mother who just got her kidnapped baby back about five seconds ago, Lizzie sure was quick to leave her and spend her day at the hospital helping Kirk. Then Tom showed up there too. Good luck Agnes; you're on your own. Might I suggest finding some more stable parents? And while you're at it go ahead and change your name to something from this century. 

[mytmo]

13 minutes ago, desertflower said:

For a mother who just got her kidnapped baby back about five seconds ago, Lizzie sure was quick to leave her and spend her day at the hospital helping Kirk. Then Tom showed up there too. Good luck Agnes; you're on your own. Might I suggest finding some more stable parents? And while you're at it go ahead and change your name to something from this century. 

Agnes is hanging out with the dogs.  She's ok I'm sure

[Primetimer]

Just maybe steer clear of the Bloody Marys, unless you're a DNA match.

View the full article

[ottoDbusdriver]

26 minutes ago, desertflower said:

For a mother who just got her kidnapped baby back about five seconds ago, Lizzie sure was quick to leave her and spend her day at the hospital helping Kirk. Then Tom showed up there too. Good luck Agnes; you're on your own. Might I suggest finding some more stable parents? And while you're at it go ahead and change your name to something from this century. 

Yeah, without Mr. Kaplan who's doing the babysitting ?  Are they still living in the fake house inside the warehouse or did Tom/Lizzie find a new apartment/house already ?

12 minutes ago, mytmo said:

Agnes is hanging out with the dogs.  She's ok I'm sure

And much like Richie's brother Chuck on 'Happy Days' (and the dogs on this show), Agnes is never seen nor spoken of ever again.

[Khat]

12 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Why does Lizzie go back to Kirk if she has no relation to him ? Seriously, why ?  Because he is daddy-like ?  FFS !

Maybe she figures he's the only one who'll tell her about her mother or something.  Or, there's the possibility that she thinks that if he's not her father, and Red's not her father (Yeah, I know the jury's still sort of out on that one, honestly, though, at this point, that'd just be a cop-out, imo) maybe he'll be able to give her a clue as to who it really is.  Her mother certainly did get around, didn't she...

1 hour ago, desertflower said:

For a mother who just got her kidnapped baby back about five seconds ago, Lizzie sure was quick to leave her and spend her day at the hospital helping Kirk. Then Tom showed up there too. Good luck Agnes; you're on your own. Might I suggest finding some more stable parents? And while you're at it go ahead and change your name to something from this century. 

That was my first thought too.  They didn't even toss an aside in there, like, 'Hey, Honey, I know we've spent the better part of the season chasing your baby around, but I decided to just leave her with some random babysitter/neighbour/guy I used to hang out with, instead of, y'know, maybe bringing her with me, like a normal parent who should be at least a little paranoid now that they finally have their baby back, because new parents, who haven't had their baby kidnapped, even sometimes have that problem'.   Even a 'Where's the baby?', 'Oh, <Insert Red's henchman/woman's name> is watching her.  She'll be fine.' would have done. 

I'm surprised they didn't have him bring her, actually, and then have one of Kirk's goons grab her while they're storming the place, to 'up the tension'.

 

And, as an add-on, what the hell kind of instruction books/videos/whatever are those two reading that say 'when your baby's crying let her cry herself to sleep'?  I know, sometimes, this is the only option if they won't settle after you've exhausted all the others, including rocking them, but the scene was handled REALLY badly.

 

11 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Wouldn't the FBI have, oh, I don't know, checked out who Kirk's lawyer was BEFOREHAND so someone doesn't just show up and say "I'm his lawyer".  That is so bush league to fall for that.
.

There's always the possibility that she actually IS his lawyer.  There's probably some conflict of interest thing about sleeping with your lawyer or something, but does she and Kirk really seem the types to care?

Edited November 4, 2016 by Khat

[ottoDbusdriver]

44 minutes ago, Khat said:

 

 

There's always the possibility that she actually IS his lawyer.  There's probably some conflict of interest thing about sleeping with your lawyer or something, but does she and Kirk really seem the types to care?

But I figure once they have put you in the Box, any lawyering gets tossed out the window.

[morgankobi]

I would watch an hour every week of Red and Dembe reading Highlights magazine. No lie.

[Dowel Jones]

Red (after spearfishing story): "Somehow he wriggled free off the hook."

Liz: "What does this have to do with me?"

Red (paraphrased): "You are going to break Kirk out of the jail."

Me:  Groan.  You have to be kidding.  What else is on tv tonight?

Lizzie, Kirk just offered up his fortune and all his property to you, as his daughter, when he dies.  What the holy hell were you thinking, turning that down?  Just that mansion in upstate NY would be worth it.  But no, you have to throw a borderline temper tantrum because the hospital is taking up precious time treating the injuries of good, honest people instead of working on your freaking blood sample. 

I loved the sight of the hospital hallway with a sign that said "To Elevators", which was posted right.above.the.elevator.

[Khat]

  11 hours ago, Khat said:

 

 

There's always the possibility that she actually IS his lawyer.  There's probably some conflict of interest thing about sleeping with your lawyer or something, but does she and Kirk really seem the types to care?

But I figure once they have put you in the Box, any lawyering gets tossed out the window.

Yeah, that's a good point there. I have no idea how the American justice system works. Actually, I don't have much idea how the Canadian one works, either. lol

[Dowel Jones]

Basically, both sides spend an inordinate amount of time swearing at each other at the top of their voices, and then introduce evidence obtained through illegal, quasi-legal, or sometimes even legal methods to either exonerate or convict the accused.  That is, when they're not sleeping with each other, anyway.  That's what I've learned from the University of Hollywood Law School.

[thuganomics85]

I'm really not sure why I'm watching anymore at this point.  I mean, we basically had an entire episode that features the so-called hero of the show, willing to save a psychopath to the point that she will put herself at risk, and not only does she ignore her husband's pleading, she doesn't even had the courtesy to say that she is going to do it anyway, and has to let him find out when she's having her blood drain from her.  I get it if she thinks he is wrong, but at least call him and be like "Sorry, honey!  Going to save my psycho dad no matter what!  Take care of Agnes!  Kisses!"  It's just coming off like she really doesn't care how this effects her family.  And she's suppose to be the hero... right?

And while it ends up being that the bus accident was a set-up, I was still cracking up over how Lizzie was just like "Ugh, those stupid people getting in a crash might kill my daddy!"  Yeah!  Fuck those.... victims of a bus crash?

Anyway, Blacklister of the week was another case of Red and the FBI wanting different things, and, of course, Red wins.  At this point, Red has to be getting bored with this.  Maybe he should give himself a handicap in these chases, like not allow the driver to go over a certain speed limit, or he can use his phone.  Even then, he would still win.  You poor, silly, stupid FBI!

You better not lie to me, NBC promos!  There better be a damn, final answer about who Lizzie's dad is!  This is just dragging the show down.

[mertensia]

You know, the first episode showed Red being woefully unimpressed with the FBI before he went in to surrender to them. I can see why now. 

[CaptainE]

22 hours ago, Khat said:

Maybe she figures he's the only one who'll tell her about her mother or something.  Or, there's the possibility that she thinks that if he's not her father, and Red's not her father (Yeah, I know the jury's still sort of out on that one, honestly, though, at this point, that'd just be a cop-out, imo) maybe he'll be able to give her a clue as to who it really is.  Her mother certainly did get around, didn't she...

 

Except WHEN does Lizzie want to learn about her mother?   Next year?  Why doesn't she just go in and ask the questions she wants answered. Kirk is right there.  

I am so tired of all this stupid, inane, asinine dragging out of a storyline.  

Im only watching for Red, Dembe, and some hot Navabi at this point.  Who keeps getting saved by Ressler for some crappy writing reason.

Btw, why does Lizzie always wear black pants?  (Rhetorical)

 

C-

[Ottis]

I admit to a very tiny interest in why Kirk thought Lizzie was his daughter. I'm assuming he genuinely thought that, from his reaction, though I could be wrong (and if I am, then his reaction makes no sense and/or was a waste of our time).

That somewhat embarrassing tiny bit of interest is the only F I give, in a vast ocean of curiousity about things Not Lizzie, about Lizzie, her dad and any family-related tie to Red. 

As usual, in this episode Lizzie/family = yawn, and everything else = entertaining, especially Red, Dembe and Highlights..

Quote

And while it ends up being that the bus accident was a set-up, I was still cracking up over how Lizzie was just like "Ugh, those stupid people getting in a crash might kill my daddy!"  Yeah!  Fuck those.... victims of a bus crash?

Is it wrong that I laughed at that?

[Johnny Dollar]

Tom's spin-off will be set up when he finally decides to leave her for being such a dumb fuck. 

[morgankobi]

19 hours ago, Khat said:

Yeah, that's a good point there. I have no idea how the American justice system works. Actually, I don't have much idea how the Canadian one works, either. lol

I'm pretty sure the writers don't either.

[saber5055]

Whether Kirk is her biological daughter is meaningless. Offhand, I'd say a lot of people have a different "real" father than the man who raised them. Just sayin'. In any case, Kirk knows all about her mother, so he could tell Lizzie plenty of info she wants to know (but won't ask ... why?) plus he's willing her his fortune. Rich people don't just do that to random people off the street. Which means IMO, Kirk is Lizzie's dad, whether biological or not. I haven't seen Red open an off-shore trust for Lizzie. Or Agnes. And yeah, I imagine that long-haired bodyguard guy babysitting Agnes. I'd be okay with him bodyguarding me.

Oops, I meant "Whether Kirk is her biological FATHER." Sorry, can't edit posts.

[ottoDbusdriver]

11 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

Whether Kirk is her biological daughter is meaningless. Offhand, I'd say a lot of people have a different "real" father than the man who raised them. Just sayin'. In any case, Kirk knows all about her mother, so he could tell Lizzie plenty of info she wants to know (but won't ask ... why?) plus he's willing her his fortune. Rich people don't just do that to random people off the street. Which means IMO, Kirk is Lizzie's dad, whether biological or not. I haven't seen Red open an off-shore trust for Lizzie. Or Agnes. And yeah, I imagine that long-haired bodyguard guy babysitting Agnes. I'd be okay with him bodyguarding me.

Oops, I meant "Whether Kirk is her biological FATHER." Sorry, can't edit posts.

And by that line of reasoning, Lizzie should be more upset at Red because he killed the man that actually raised her the longest -- her adoptive father.
Lizzie barely remembers her mother and yet, as @saber5055 mentioned, has no interest in peppering him with questions about her mom, and she apparently killed her biological father (based on her memories on the night of the fire) or maybe she didn't because that was a memory plant or who even knows at this point -- Lizzie has so many daddies I wouldn't be surprised if she was the product of genetic manipulation from many male donors so it turns out they are all her daddy.

[saber5055]

Hey Otto, I was thinking yesterday (yes, I'm a time-waster) about Red killing Lizzie's adoptive father so he wouldn't tell her who her real father was. Then, didn't Tom track Red to the hospital and then sit with him on the bench outside as they, strangers to each other, talking about missing people who had passed? THEN we find out later that Red hired Tom to marry Lizzie and "keep an eye" on her? This show's writers ... WTH.

[Khat]

Whether Kirk is her biological daughter is meaningless. Offhand, I'd say a lot of people have a different "real" father than the man who raised them. Just sayin'. In any case, Kirk knows all about her mother, so he could tell Lizzie plenty of info she wants to know (but won't ask ... why?) plus he's willing her his fortune. Rich people don't just do that to random people off the street. Which means IMO, Kirk is Lizzie's dad, whether biological or not. I haven't seen Red open an off-shore trust for Lizzie. Or Agnes. And yeah, I imagine that long-haired bodyguard guy babysitting Agnes. I'd be okay with him bodyguarding me.

Oops, I meant "Whether Kirk is her biological FATHER." Sorry, can't edit posts.

There's a slight fault in your comment, there, (Although it doesn't make any difference to your point, honestly, it's just a side point, and I'm not disagreeing with you) and that's that we don't know that Red 'hasn't' made a trust account for them, or even willed her everything he owns, for as much as he tells her about that sort of thing. He did buy her, what I expect, was a rather expensive condo, since selling it brought her enough to set up a college fund for the harbourmaster's daughter. And, I've heard someone else point out, somewhere, that the brownstone they started out the series in should have been pretty pricey for their income level (I have no clue, personally, as to usual income or rental prices) which could mean Red was influencing that as well. (That might be a bit of a stretch, though, given Tom's defection) To my thinking, if he has done something, and he did tell her, she'd probably twist it around to something bad, like him trying to make her feel better, or guilty, towards him, or just refuse it outright, like with the condo, (because this is Elizabeth, after all,) and since he's not actually dying, like Kirk is, there'd be no real reason to tell her.

Honestly, I'm just wondering, since Kirk obviously believed the DNA test to be real, who actually faked it. There is, of course, the obvious suspect, but that would make me wonder why.

[ottoDbusdriver]

3 minutes ago, saber5055 said:

Hey Otto, I was thinking yesterday (yes, I'm a time-waster) about Red killing Lizzie's adoptive father so he wouldn't tell her who her real father was. Then, didn't Tom track Red to the hospital and then sit with him on the bench outside as they, strangers to each other, talking about missing people who had passed? THEN we find out later that Red hired Tom to marry Lizzie and "keep an eye" on her? This show's writers ... WTH.

I thought Tom went to that hospital because Lizzie couldn't go, and Red just happened to start talking to him -- did Tom know who Red was at that point ?  I'd have to go back and re-watch to be sure.

You know, they still haven't explained how/why Lizzie got that scar on her right arm (she never seemed to have gotten it during her flashback memories of the night of the fire), nor have they explained why the box under the floor in her house it Season 1 had the same markings as that scar -- though I am pretty sure they never will explain it.  In fact in this episode when Lizzie was holding her phone to her face, you could clearly see that stupid childhood bracelet on her wrist (are we sure Lizzie just hasn't converted to Kabbalah ?) but the scar was nary to be seen, so maybe the writers forgot about that as well.

[12catcrazy]

Frankly, I think the writers are making up this shit as they go along.  I was also thinking about the Red/Tom scene on the bench at the hospital in season 1.  If I recall, there had been comments on another forum (the late lamented TVWP) at the time about how Tom was looking at Red while Red was giving a little speech about how Lizzie's father will always be watching over her.  At the time, it was a great scene because you could see what a good actor the guy playing Tom was.  He said everything with just his eyes as Red was speaking to him.  At that point, Tom was still portrayed as being the glasses wearing school teacher and not the badass mercenary he was later shown to be.  It later came out that Red had hired Tom to "look after" Liz, so logic would tell you that Tom and Ray knew damn well who each other was when they met at the hospital.  Did the writers remember that?  Do they remember anything previously written in this show, whether Lizzie's scar, dogs, her pick-pocketing skills, The Fulcrum in the stuffed rabbit.... ANYTHING????  

[Johnny Dollar]

Liz had to be very young when she was adopted since she can't even remember her mother. What questions could she possibly need answered by Kirk or anyone else for that matter?  Who cares what happened when they were six months old?  If she has questions about her mother, Red seems perfectly capable of answering them. I swear that if she found out at her mother conceived her through the use of an anonymous sperm donor, she'd literally throw both Tom and Agnes overboard to be able to find the donor. She has questions, you know?

[saber5055]

I agree with you, 12catcrazy, that writers are making this up as they go along. I'm guessing no one thought this show would make it past season 2 so now they're grabbing at flying monkeys to make up each episode. Yeah, Red could have all sorts of trust funds set up for Lizzie and Agnes, but why not tell viewers that so WE don't have to make shit up too, just like the writers. And Johnny Dollar, I'm hoping for your "anonymous sperm donor" twist. That could carry this show for three more seasons of BS writing. Plus then they could make Agnes 16 years old, time-warp her like they do on the soaps, and then she could be an agent/informer too.

[12catcrazy]

"anonymous sperm donor" will be the next "don't miss" twist.   Red supposedly doesn't lie, so either he told the truth when he told Lizzie that he wasn't her father back in season 1, or guess what! Red DOES lie and he really is her Daddy.  Yawn.  Something that could've been figured out if our super-smart special agent Lizzie would've actually done a dna test from the get go.  Like when she had his blood when she stabbed him in the neck with the pen.  

And another thing so sad/annoying about this show: you have a main character who gets outshone by every single other person on this show - whether Red or the DMV guy or even boring Ressler.  And it boils done to a combo of poor writing and an actress who doesn't have the chops to rise above the poorly written part she has to play.  

This could have been a really good show - unfortunately, they are wasting a good cast (with the exception of Meghan Boone) on crap.  This could have been an interesting comic book alternate universe, but even comic books have their mythology in place and continuity in their world.  This show has neither.   And it insults the viewers' intelligence and to me, that's the worst sin of all. 

[Texasmom1970]

On 11/4/2016 at 2:44 PM, morgankobi said:

I would watch an hour every week of Red and Dembe reading Highlights magazine. No lie.

Me too! That was the only thing I liked about this episode!