Love It Or List It - General Discussion

[shapeshifter]

2 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

I'd argue that that's the profit but not the value. The value is for how much it is appraised for.

If it is appraised at 500,000 and after the remodel for 600,000 that's an increase in value of 100,000. If they spent 50,000 on the remodel then their profit of the remodel/increase in value is 50,000.

But it is misleading as it suggests they get 100,000 more for the house even though they had to invest 50,000 so their net gain is less than the increase of value.

Not to mention expenses like closing costs and continuing to pay taxes until it closes etc.

[buttersister]

Quote

But it is misleading as it suggests they get 100,000 more for the house even though they had to invest 50,000 so their net gain is less than the increase of value.

This show🤣. My math speed has increased watching those scenes--I always subtract the amount they paid for the remodel from the added value. 

[CheshireCat]

On 6/30/2022 at 4:18 AM, CrazyInAlabama said:

You explained it better than I did.    

I cheated - my dad had the same comment as you did a little while ago 😁

[CrazyInAlabama]

On 11/26/2021 at 9:35 AM, shapeshifter said:

I just started binging a few of these property shows because at 68-years I just bought my first property to be near a daughter, and it was a huge mistake. I am hoping to sell it and buy something else near her and her growing family, and I look at these shows as the crash course I should have taken before purchasing (in the middle of a sellers' market with no equity of my own, just an unexpected inheritance).

This past week I saw an episode in which the house being renovated was not the house the couple were currently living in.
Instead, it was a house they had rented out for 25 years to just 2 renters. (Maybe a rerun?)
The house was in shambles due to lack of upkeep. 
In my mind, as a life-long renter and recent first-time home buyer, the couple were suburban slum lords.

David and Hillary (assuming I'm recalling the correct show on which I saw this) had a brief remark about knowing when a house is a rental that there will be problems related to lack of upkeep. And the first thing they pointed out was the rotting siding--which is never something a renter should be expected take care of. And the camera briefly caught a shot of the owners faces looking a bit embarrassed. But then they went inside and the owners somewhat indignantly declared that they would never have painted a room purple. Sure. Whatever, slumlords.

So I can't help wonder if most viewers were left thinking that the renters were slobs or worse.
Admittedly, I am an obsessive cleaner who always strives to leave a rental better than when I moved in, even if (or maybe especially if) I've been there 5-10 years.
IDK. I wish it had been a teensy bit more obvious that the owners were negligent and *should* feel guilty for renting a "home" to people that they themselves would not want to live in.

If I recall correctly (I don't always), that house was on Unsellable Houses, and had been rented out for 25 years.   My guess was it was a family rental, and no inspections or upkeep were ever done.     I still hated that house after the remodel.  

I looked at some reruns this weekend, and tonight, I still think the 'gain' in value is figured incorrectly.   It's the original appraised price, plus the rehab budget, and that equals the value of the house, the new appraised price is the real gain in value.   I suspect a lot of the home owners are financing the remodel, with either a HELOC, or some other kind of loan, so it's really not a gain in value the way the show says it is. 

Edited August 2, 2022 by CrazyInAlabama

[65mickey]

That house was on Unsellable Houses. Like a lot of landlords the couple who owned the house just collected the rent checks and never bothered to do any upkeep or updates to the home. And the renters probably didn't care either. 

I don't know of anyone who sinks $100,000+ into a home to sell it  unless the place was falling apart. What gets me are the home owners who get mad when they are confronted with a leaky roof, electrical problems, rotten beams, or foundation issues and Hillary tells them that they have to fix it.  They act like we'll just sell it well good luck with that when the home is inspected. 

[annzeepark914]

So, Hillary is going to live in Raleigh? Or was that in Durham? I didn't see the start of the show (to see the downtown in the distance). Wow. That house looks like a church from the outside & doesn't fit into the neighborhood of mostly colonial style houses. Didn't she have the house inspected before buying? The only thing I liked was that filigreed pocket door in the dining room. That was stunning!

[CattyK]

On 9/12/2022 at 9:37 PM, annzeepark914 said:

Didn't she have the house inspected before buying? The only thing I liked was that filigreed pocket door in the dining room. 

I too wondered how she didn’t know about any of the structural problems.  Seems like she would have had somebody look at it before buying even if there wasn’t a required inspection for a mortgage.  
I didn’t love the exterior of the new house but I liked most of the interior, agree those filigree doors were cool.  I think there was also something else similar , maybe on the deck.  
I enjoyed this episode, but  it would’ve been more interesting if she had renoed the original house and had to squeeze in what she wanted into the small space.  I’d have liked to see her make those kind of decisions for herself.  
I thought the houses David showed her were really off the wall, I never thought she’d choose any of them.  
Their interactions were a lot more chummy than usual, it felt kind of weird to see that. 

[Panopticon]

I assume it was supposed to feel less scripted than usual (Hilary and David portrayed as friends more than rivals), but it ended up feeling more scripted than usual to me. I couldn’t accept that Hilary didn’t notice all on her own that the house was a tear-down job; or that she didn’t consult with any of the myriad professionals she knows; or that she didn’t do any research about various aspects of the market and the rebuild. And of course the alternatives David chose had nothing in common with the original house… the point was for them to talk about how she would rehab one ill-suited house and how much they admired the quirky mansion in the woods. 

That said, I enjoyed the episode. It was just odd and past my willing suspension of disbelief. 

[CheshireCat]

14 hours ago, Panopticon said:

I assume it was supposed to feel less scripted than usual (Hilary and David portrayed as friends more than rivals), but it ended up feeling more scripted than usual to me. I couldn’t accept that Hilary didn’t notice all on her own that the house was a tear-down job; or that she didn’t consult with any of the myriad professionals she knows; or that she didn’t do any research about various aspects of the market and the rebuild. And of course the alternatives David chose had nothing in common with the original house… the point was for them to talk about how she would rehab one ill-suited house and how much they admired the quirky mansion in the woods. 

That said, I enjoyed the episode. It was just odd and past my willing suspension of disbelief. 

In situations like this, I always wonder if it's either scripted or part of the deal/contract to get more drama/unpredictability.

It's like the lists that couples give Hilary. You just know that she can't do it all when you hear the budget, so I think the mismatch between budget and list is done on purpose so that it's not as predictable. I'm assuming couples would choose to stay too often if Hilary did everything they ask for.

[Soapy Goddess]

5 hours ago, CheshireCat said:

In situations like this, I always wonder if it's either scripted or part of the deal/contract to get more drama/unpredictability.

It's like the lists that couples give Hilary. You just know that she can't do it all when you hear the budget, so I think the mismatch between budget and list is done on purpose so that it's not as predictable. I'm assuming couples would choose to stay too often if Hilary did everything they ask for.

Exactly. If they didn't have their usual banter, unknown issues, and even liking the last home that David picks out...it would just be like any other reno show. 

Either way, I enjoyed it too!

[ajsnaves]

When did they go back to North Carolina? I thought they were in Canada now. Or are they splitting locations?
 

While I question the truthyness of this episode, I still enjoyed it. I like when we get to see smug David. And that last house was fantastic. But I think I prefer Hillary’s in the end. 

[shapeshifter]

54 minutes ago, ajsnaves said:

When did they go back to North Carolina? I thought they were in Canada now

Assuming we’re discussing the episode with Mia, April, and their hockey twins, they all had strong Canadian accents.

If not this👆👇episode, I am just so confused.🙃

I didn’t understand why they would go through the expense of drilling holes in the new support beams for the new wiring.
Since they were replacing the aluminum(?) wiring anyway, why not just bundle it and run it however they’re doing it nowadays rather than redo the wiring in the mode of the 1960s?

Edited September 15, 2022 by shapeshifter

[ECM1231]

On 9/15/2022 at 5:30 PM, shapeshifter said:

Assuming we’re discussing the episode with Mia, April, and their hockey twins, they all had strong Canadian accents.

If not this👆👇episode, I am just so confused.🙃

I didn’t understand why they would go through the expense of drilling holes in the new support beams for the new wiring.
Since they were replacing the aluminum(?) wiring anyway, why not just bundle it and run it however they’re doing it nowadays rather than redo the wiring in the mode of the 1960s?

The episode you described, yes, it was in Canada.

What was being discussed was the most recent episode with ONLY Hilary and David. Hilary WAS the homeowner. She had bought a small bungalow in the Raleigh NC area and intended to renovate. Unfortunately, the foundation had live termites and a lot of damage. It wound up being a tear down.

I'm also confused as to why Hilary bought a home in NC, when the show has resumed filming in Canada. ??? 

[deirdra]

31 minutes ago, ECM1231 said:

I'm also confused as to why Hilary bought a home in NC, when the show has resumed filming in Canada. ??? 

COVID shutdowns and mask mandates have lasted a lot longer in Canada and many offices are only now reopening. It was probably simpler to film in the US.

[annzeepark914]

I've seen two episodes, one today, one yesterday, in which the houses do not look like any houses in the US. Today's show was S15 E9 with Megan and Trevor. Were they going back and forth between Canada and NC in 2015? I thought they stayed in one place for several years.

[ECM1231]

2 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

I've seen two episodes, one today, one yesterday, in which the houses do not look like any houses in the US. Today's show was S15 E9 with Megan and Trevor. Were they going back and forth between Canada and NC in 2015? I thought they stayed in one place for several years.

Are you sure? I looked it up and this is the synopsis for S15 E9:

Danielle & Eli

Sep 17, 2018

After buying their first home together, a family grew by three young children; while the home has been improved, she's had enough of the small space and is ready to expand into a house with plenty of room to raise their family.

No mention of a Megan or Trevor.

From what I had read the current season is supposed to be in Canada. probably Toronto. The first episode had the 2 moms with the hockey player son's. Definitely in Canada.

That's why I was so confused about the stand alone episode that had Hilary  renovating her new purchase in Raleigh.

[annzeepark914]

I looked up the info while watching today and noted that it was S15 E9 and was first aired on 9/17/18. Maybe I got the names of the couple mixed up with the other episode. Hillary did a great job but they said "list it".  The wife looked like Diane Keaton!  How did you find this info?

Edited September 25, 2022 by annzeepark914

[ECM1231]

2 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

I looked up the info while watching today and noted that it was S15 E9 and was first aired on 9/17/18. Maybe I got the names of the couple mixed up with the other episode. Hillary did a great job but they said list it.  The wife looked like Diane Keaton!  How did you find this info?

I just Googled the show title. They list all the seasons.

Love It or List It https://g.co/kgs/BroxkN

[Pine]

I went to HGTV to watch Love It Or List It.  Looks like you have to join/subscribe to Discovery Plus to watch repeats.  Bummer.

[pep4]

How come they quit showing 'List it' episodes?

We've watched about 15 shows in the last couple of months, and all but one have been 'Love it'.  I'm on 8 in a row since the last 'List it' episode.

Obviously that's all anecdotal since 15 in 2 months isn't a huge sample size, but I'm pretty sure they're not showing a balance.  Don't they film both endings for each episode?  Is there anything about this show that isn't fake?

Edited November 1, 2022 by pep4

[Soapy Goddess]

3 hours ago, pep4 said:

How come they quit showing 'List it' episodes?

Because it's a phony premise. People are just calling Hillary for their reno and have no desire to move. I don't know many folks who would invest over 100K in a house they're seriously thinking about selling. Doesn't make much sense when you think about aggravation and 6-8 weeks they need to be gone during the reno.

Anyway, the LIOLI producers wanted to combine viewers favorites: renos and house porn. By creating LIOLI, they have the best of both worlds...and (supposedly) no one's the wiser.

[CheshireCat]

1 hour ago, Soapy Goddess said:

Because it's a phony premise. People are just calling Hillary for their reno and have no desire to move. I don't know many folks who would invest over 100K in a house they're seriously thinking about selling. Doesn't make much sense when you think about aggravation and 6-8 weeks they need to be gone during the reno.

Plus, as my mom always points out, if you move you have no idea what to expects with regards to the plumping. Whereas, once Hillary is done with the owners' home, they either have new pipes/HVAC etc or there weren't any issues, so they're likely okay. Why'd you want to spend hundreds of thousands on a home where you don't know when you do know with your current home? (And if what can't get done really was on the list and wasn't on it for dramatization only then invest a few thousand more and get it done and you have your dream house without the hassle of moving).

[Lady Lucy]

Last night there were at least 2 episodes in a row where they decided to list. (Both stated they had growing families and needed more space even though Hillary's renovation was fabulous.)

Spoiler

It's my understanding that they film it both ways and what's shown may or may not correlate to what the actual home owners ended up doing.

Spoiler

[Moose135]

@Lady Lucy, I've heard the same thing about your hidden comment.

[buttersister]

12 hours ago, Lady Lucy said:

2 episodes in a row where they decided to list

One of them had a remodel budget of $65, so buh-bye (small remodel budgets more frequently list it, by my count;-) The other had an insane increase in value after the remodel (like more than 6 figures), so who exactly calculates that? LOL!

[LuvMyShows]

On 9/14/2022 at 6:49 AM, Panopticon said:

 I couldn’t accept that Hilary didn’t notice all on her own that the house was a tear-down job; or that she didn’t consult with any of the myriad professionals she knows; or that she didn’t do any research about various aspects of the market and the rebuild. And of course the alternatives David chose had nothing in common with the original house… the point was for them to talk about how she would rehab one ill-suited house and how much they admired the quirky mansion in the woods. 

Finally saw the Hilary House episode.  Totally agree that there's no way those problems with her house were a surprise.  And the final house David chose was a head-scratcher.  Given how huge it was, the kitchen had almost no storage and was like something you'd see in a medium-size apartment, rather than in a mansion.  Also, whoever built the house made a very odd choice for the siting of the pool, since it was about as unattractive a view as possible for that property.  However, the house Hilary built was freaking gorgeous top to bottom (with the exception of her dark design choices for two of the bathrooms/powder rooms).  It was so obvious that there was no way she would choose to list it, after just having designed every single aspect and apparently already moved her stuff in.

[Grrarrggh]

2 hours ago, LuvMyShows said:

 (with the exception of her dark design choices for two of the bathrooms/powder rooms).  

Dark? Really? Just because something isn't all white doesn't mean it's dark. The photos on the website sure don't look dark www.hgtv.com/shows/love-it-or-list-it/tour-hilary-farrs-renovated-home-pictures

[annzeepark914]

1 hour ago, Grrarrggh said:

Dark? Really? Just because something isn't all white doesn't mean it's dark. The photos on the website sure don't look dark www.hgtv.com/shows/love-it-or-list-it/tour-hilary-farrs-renovated-home-pictures

I don't know about dark, but it sure was stark!  

[jcbrown]

On 11/2/2022 at 12:23 PM, Grrarrggh said:

Dark? Really? Just because something isn't all white doesn't mean it's dark. The photos on the website sure don't look dark www.hgtv.com/shows/love-it-or-list-it/tour-hilary-farrs-renovated-home-pictures

Thanks for that link. I loved her design choices in the primary suite and the powder room and the kitchen. I'd want to see the guest bath in person to know how I feel about it--it photographed a bit busy for me. Don't like the fireplace, however.

[LuvMyShows]

On 11/2/2022 at 3:23 PM, Grrarrggh said:

Dark? Really? Just because something isn't all white doesn't mean it's dark. The photos on the website sure don't look dark www.hgtv.com/shows/love-it-or-list-it/tour-hilary-farrs-renovated-home-pictures

On the show, the black in the two black-and-white bathrooms overwhelmed the rooms, especially the wavy patterned one.  It doesn't have anything to do with not being all white.

[LuvMyShows]

On 11/2/2021 at 8:30 PM, MartyQui said:

I was really surprised when last night’s couple decided to list it!  I though the remodel solved pretty much every problem (except for the teeny closets).  The loftice was great!

Just saw this episode, and I really wondered if there was something hinky going on.  The homeowners' adamant refusal to put in any walls in the basement -- which was large enough that they could have made the husband's office, the guest room (with at least a modicum of privacy, which the big open room didn't give at all), and the exercise area (since the open room means that the exercisers intrude on the guests) -- made me suspect that they knew all along that they were going to sell it.   I did think the loftice was a great solution.

I was surprised also that they decided to sell, because IIRC, their "open" kitchen was tiny, with almost no storage.  Also the backyard had no usable space, and of course the new house didn't have an office.

On 11/5/2021 at 10:32 AM, TattleTeeny said:

I liked it too, but I kept wondering about getting up there with a cup of coffee, haha! 

Put a little coffee maker up there and you're all set!

Edited November 7, 2022 by LuvMyShows

[LuvMyShows]

I saw an episode yesterday where I was stunned they decided to list it.  Not sure I'll be able to give enough detail for anyone to remember.  I thought the house was gorgeous as it was (original value @$570K, they put in $100K and it appreciated $25K more on top of that), and really wondered what on earth they would need to change.  A lot of the reno money was already budgeted to go to new windows and doors.  There was no plan to upgrade the kitchen, but Hilary did refinish the cabinets to white, and the kitchen looked fantastic, whereas I seem to remember the new house had a very outdated kitchen.  Hilary gave the wife a great walk-in closet and a huge office when you first came in the front door.  I can't remember all the areas that the new house seemed lacking in, compared to the reno'd house, but I thought there was absolutely positively no way they would list it, which is generally when I am wrong!

[jcbrown]

The couple in the f episode I just watched with the slanted house built on sand confounded me. Did they have the same hair stylist, to both have those same curled-under heavy bangs?

[shapeshifter]

4 hours ago, jcbrown said:

The couple in the f episode I just watched with the slanted house built on sand confounded me. Did they have the same hair stylist, to both have those same curled-under heavy bangs?

Hah! I noticed the matching bangs too!

I am currently living in a condo I hate with sloping floors, which is not the main reason I hate it, but I was interested in the solution. I can't do anything about it here (because condo) so I'm looking to move (for other reasons too). I've been to open houses with sloping floors here near Lake Ontario. 

Did they say it cost $10K to jack up the house and level the floors? 

[Chit Chat]

11 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Did they say it cost $10K to jack up the house and level the floors? 

One of my neighbors had some serious foundation issues and it cost her at least $20K to fix it (approx. 2000 sq. ft. home).  She tried to cover the cracks in the interior walls by adding plaster to add texture to the walls, but unfortunately for her, she had no choice but to fix the foundation.

On 11/2/2022 at 12:14 PM, LuvMyShows said:

Totally agree that there's no way those problems with her house were a surprise. 

The termite infestation should've been spotted on an initial inspection long before purchasing the home.  I liked the plan Hilary chose for the new house.  I admire her for not wanting a huge house but stuck to something more manageable for her.  It's still a big house to me though!  One thing that I worry about is those front doors.  Double doors seem like more of a security risk than a single door.  I worry about those kinds of things!  

[annzeepark914]

Another worry about front doors for me: all those glass doors that we see on these shows. Are they a security risk? Give me a strong wooden door and no window, please!

[shapeshifter]

12 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Did they say it cost $10K to jack up the house and level the floors? 

44 minutes ago, ChitChat said:

One of my neighbors had some serious foundation issues and it cost her at least $20K to fix it (approx. 2000 sq. ft. home).  She tried to cover the cracks in the interior walls by adding plaster to add texture to the walls, but unfortunately for her, she had no choice but to fix the foundation.

Thanks, @ChitChat! Probably even more now with recent inflation. Plus, did they even mention the engineer's fee?

Also, what are the odds that the sand bank beneath the house was done settling? Maybe pretty good if no other houses in the area were wonky?

Edited November 10, 2022 by shapeshifter

[South]

There is an episode on OWN tonight, S16, ep08, This Space is Looking Up.  The woman lover/lister reminds me of a woman on Say Yes To The Dress.  It was years ago.  A threesome arrived at one of the boutiques to try on dresses for the husbands soon to be 2nd wife, who was in tow.  The woman on LIOLI looks (to my memory) to be wife #1 on SYTTD.  I’ve seen this ep of LIOLI 10 times or more, and always think of the other show, but I don’t recall how concertedly I sought the identities of the two women (IMDb, etc) but I wanted to put this out here in case anyone cares to tune in to see if they remember, while it’s on air

[annzeepark914]

I'm watching the old crooked house episode right now. Again, homeowners on the shows filmed this year pronounce "foyer" the French way (unlike Americans, who say foy-er). Also, I've heard some homeowners say "house" the Canadian way. I guess they were doing some filming in Canada & some in NC.  They said "list it" but I wonder if they can make enough selling it with all the other deficiencies in that house. I also wonder if their next door neighbors have any similar structural issues due to the river and sand.

Edited November 20, 2022 by annzeepark914

[ML89]

Who’s the new narrator, does anyone know?

[Grrarrggh]

4 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

I'm watching the old crooked house episode right now. Again, homeowners on the shows filmed this year pronounce "foyer" the French way (unlike Americans, who say foy-er). 

That's not the French way, it's the proper way. ;) Just as library has a two r's in it. 

[annzeepark914]

24 minutes ago, Grrarrggh said:

That's not the French way, it's the proper way. ;) Just as library has a two r's in it. 

It may be the proper way, but it's not the way I've heard it pronounced in the US. February has two r's but how many people pronounce both r's? 

[NUguy514]

I'm American, and I've never in my life said "foy-er"; I've always said "foy-ay."

[shapeshifter]

11 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

It may be the proper way, but it's not the way I've heard it pronounced in the US. February has two r's but how many people pronounce both r's? 

8 hours ago, NUguy514 said:

I'm American, and I've never in my life said "foy-er"; I've always said "foy-ay."

I’m in the US and pronounce both February  and library with 2 r’s, but, more to the point, I can’t recall having ever heard foyer pronounced with an r sound.   
Maybe “foyer” is just not used often enough for me to have heard the “er” pronunciation? 
This video does at least say “many Americans” pronounce foyer with the “ay” sound (at the 33 second mark): 

What I like most about this video is that around the 2:30 minute mark, it is advised to listen to how those around you pronounce the word, and know that if you choose a different pronunciation, you may have to also offer the other pronunciation so your listener will know what you mean.   

[annzeepark914]

Just checked with my cousin, a realtor. She said realtors pronounce it with the "r". We're in the metro DC area, so maybe it's a regional thing. 

[chessiegal]

I grew up outside Philadelphia and have been in Maryland (near DC, now Annapolis) since 1976. I've heard foyer pronounced both ways.

[Moose135]

I grew up on Long Island, and I've heard it said both ways, although 'foy-er' seemed more prevalent. I think some people may think 'foy-ay' sounds too pretentious, like you are trying to be all fancy.

Edited November 21, 2022 by Moose135

[Grrarrggh]

13 hours ago, annzeepark914 said:

Just checked with my cousin, a realtor. She said realtors pronounce it with the "r". We're in the metro DC area, so maybe it's a regional thing. 

I'm in the DC area and have never met a realtor who doesn't pronounce it correctly. Not to get cruel about it, but I wonder if there is a level of 'taste' involved. Then again, apparently ain't has become accepted as grammatically correct.... 

[annzeepark914]

18 minutes ago, Grrarrggh said:

I'm in the DC area and have never met a realtor who doesn't pronounce it correctly. Not to get cruel about it, but I wonder if there is a level of 'taste' involved. Then again, apparently ain't has become accepted as grammatically correct.... 

You're on a roll, GRRARRGGH...

[Grrarrggh]

31 minutes ago, annzeepark914 said:

You're on a roll, GRRARRGGH...

It's been proven people who think white/grey open concept houses are what modern farmhouse AND craftsman AND mid century modern look like are more likely to say "foyER".