The Business: News, Rumours, Analysis, and More

[DearEvette]

Welp, SAG-AFTRA's National Board Votes Unanimously To Ask Members For Strike Authorization

As the article says, this does not mean a strike is imminent, but if the members vote to authorize a strike that means one can be called in the event their negotiations with AMPTP go badly. 

I would imagine the WGA strike would give them some leverage in their negotiations. I can't imagine what the industry looks like if both SAG-AFTRA and WGA are on strike at the same time.

[Trini]

11 hours ago, DearEvette said:

Welp, SAG-AFTRA's National Board Votes Unanimously To Ask Members For Strike Authorization

As the article says, this does not mean a strike is imminent, but if the members vote to authorize a strike that means one can be called in the event their negotiations with AMPTP go badly. 

Yeah, I was expecting this might happen with at least one other union.

[Spartan Girl]

I really don’t understand why the studios won’t just pay the writers. Literally nobody is on their side, and the strike itself will ultimately cost more than what the WGA is asking for.

Part of me wonders if it will actually help end the strike if SAG decides to strike too.

[Raja]

2 hours ago, Spartan Girl said:

I really don’t understand why the studios won’t just pay the writers. Literally nobody is on their side, and the strike itself will ultimately cost more than what the WGA is asking for.

Part of me wonders if it will actually help end the strike if SAG decides to strike too.

Every extra dollar a writer gets leaves less for the shareholders, actors, etc to split among themselves.

[absnow54]

On 5/18/2023 at 1:15 PM, Spartan Girl said:

I really don’t understand why the studios won’t just pay the writers. Literally nobody is on their side, and the strike itself will ultimately cost more than what the WGA is asking for.

The impacts of streamers on residual checks isn't just a writer problem, the WGA contract was just the first to expire. A lot of actors live off residual checks too, which is why this is snowballing to other unions. The entertainment landscape has changed dramatically over the last 15 years, and the strike is forcing them to redefine the industry. They're going to drag their feet on this, because they're going to be negotiating similar deals with everyone.

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, absnow54 said:

The impacts of streamers on residual checks isn't just a writer problem, the WGA contract was just the first to expire. A lot of actors live off residual checks too, which is why this is snowballing to other unions. The entertainment landscape has changed dramatically over the last 15 years, and the strike is forcing them to redefine the industry. They're going to drag their feet on this, because they're going to be negotiating similar deals with everyone.

Dragging their feet is ultimately not a smart move. Like I said, nobody is on their side.

[DearEvette]

6 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

Dragging their feet is ultimately not a smart move. Like I said, nobody is on their side.

Right.  And the WGA has a lot of solidarity amongst other unions that are not singularly industry related. The Teamsters are massive supporters and they've instructed their trucks not to cross the picket lines.  The LA local Teamster head is very vocal about supporting the WGA.  And it isn't just the trucks, the Teamsters also represent location scouts and crew, prop people, warehouse workers, animal trainers, and casting directors.  So now it isn't just the writers that are striking it is also a lot of physical support that won't show up. And they don't just work on scripted shows.

Now imagine the actors going on strike too.

[scarynikki12]

Now that SAG-AFTRA members are voting wether or not to strike the writers are having fun with the anticipation.

This is my favorite so far

 

[scarynikki12]

No THIS is my favorite:

 

[Guest]

On 5/18/2023 at 1:16 PM, Raja said:

Every extra dollar a writer gets leaves less for the shareholders, actors, etc to split among themselves.

This. Plus Netflix is the only streamer actually making a profit. The others are all so new that they are bleeding cash while trying to build their services. Last year Disney, Paramount and Comcast’s streaming services combined lost over $8 billion. That combined with tv ratings continuously dropping, the box office struggling, China restricting how many movies open there and the massive hit that was Covid means the industry is in crisis on many fronts. 

[Jaded]

This is another thing on the list of reasons why I don't watch his show. I would watch occasionally then he ran his hands through a particular person's hair which got a lot of attention which made me stop tuning in completely. 

‘Fallon’ Is First Late-Night Show to Stop Paying Staff Amid Strike: Report
 

 

Edited May 20, 2023 by Jaded

[Jaded]

 

[Kel Varnsen]

6 hours ago, Jaded said:

This is another thing on the list of reasons why I don't watch his show. I would watch occasionally then he ran his hands through a particular person's hair which got a lot of attention which made me stop tuning in completely. 

I am hardly a fan of Jimmy Fallon but is that on him? He is the host but it isn't like a Letterman situation where he is also the boss of the company that produces the show. That would be Lorne Michaels. Is anyone calling him for not paying the staff? For that matter is anyone calling out Questlove? Or better yet is there anything stopping the WGA from giving money to those workers to keep them on their side, or their own unions to show solidarity with the writers?

[Jaded]

 

[Spartan Girl]

1 hour ago, Jaded said:

 

I’m shocked, just shocked. 🙄🙄🙄🙄

[PepSinger]

On 5/31/2023 at 8:54 PM, Jaded said:

 

This really needs to be emphasized. I am seeing a lot of people coming down hard on actors for filming not understanding that if they do not show up, they will be SUED. 

[AimingforYoko]

DGA reaches deal with studios.

What this means for the writers, who knows? It effectively ended the strike back in '08. We'll see.

[Guest]

4 hours ago, AimingforYoko said:

DGA reaches deal with studios.

What this means for the writers, who knows? It effectively ended the strike back in '08. We'll see.

The WGA has already said they won’t follow suit and take a similar deal. Although they really wouldn’t say anything else. So far the the writer reaction on social media is less than positive. 

[Anduin]

21 minutes ago, Dani said:

The WGA has already said they won’t follow suit and take a similar deal. Although they really wouldn’t say anything else. So far the the writer reaction on social media is less than positive. 

The writers need to keep fighting. Their jobs, and the time and money needed to do the jobs, are on the line.

[scarynikki12]

Let’s goooo!!

[Spartan Girl]

10 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

Let’s goooo!!

If I were the AMPTP, I would think it’s time to make a fair deal with both the writers and the actors NOW.

But I’m smart and greed is dumb.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Spartan Girl

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

If I were the AMPTP, I would think it’s time to make a fair deal with both the writers and the actors NOW.

But I’m smart and greed is dumb.

I’m also seeing a push on social media for DGA members to vote against ratifying their deal. Sounds like there was very little communication with the members before the deal was agreed to and many feel they left too much on the table by not waiting for the SAG-AFTRA to vote on strike authorization. 

I saw one comment that SAG-AFTRA has 10 times the members that WGA has. 

[Kel Varnsen]

1 hour ago, Spartan Girl said:

If I were the AMPTP, I would think it’s time to make a fair deal with both the writers and the actors NOW.

But I’m smart and greed is dumb.

I kind of wonder though how long the studios can hold out for though. I mean maybe it is because I don't watch a lot of network tv, but I feel like other than not being able to watch Seth Myers bits on YouTube, I have enough stuff to watch that I haven't really noticed yet that new stuff isn't being produced. If more people are like that it might be awhile before the studios start feeling pain. 

Also thinking of the last strike how long was it before the networks forced the late night hosts to go back to work without writers. That's when we got stuff like Conan spinning his wedding ring and the Conan-Colbert-Stewart feud.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

I kind of wonder though how long the studios can hold out for though. I mean maybe it is because I don't watch a lot of network tv, but I feel like other than not being able to watch Seth Myers bits on YouTube, I have enough stuff to watch that I haven't really noticed yet that new stuff isn't being produced. If more people are like that it might be awhile before the studios start feeling pain. 

The obvious effect is very minor because we’re in the summer hiatus and other than continuously running shows everything that was supposed to release now finished filming well in advance. But most already written content is being delayed or stopped altogether and nothing new is being written.

We will probably see the impact in fall when the network shows are supposed to premiere. A lot of those shows were just starting or about to open their writer’s rooms when the shutdown happened. It will take longer to see the impact in streaming but there are likely to be longer than normal breaks between seasons. For movies we probably won’t see a substantial impact until next year.

If the strike continues until the public really notices it will be a disaster for the studios. 

[Spartan Girl]

11 hours ago, Dani said:

 

If the strike continues until the public really notices it will be a disaster for the studios. 

Which is why I really don’t understand why they’re continuing to be so stupid when it’s clear that the writers aren’t going to crack. And now the actors might strike unless they get their act together. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[Kel Varnsen]

11 hours ago, Dani said:

We will probably see the impact in fall when the network shows are supposed to premiere. A lot of those shows were just starting or about to open their writer’s rooms when the shutdown happened. It will take longer to see the impact in streaming but there are likely to be longer than normal breaks between seasons. For movies we probably won’t see a substantial impact until next year.

Which makes me kind of surprised that the union didn't kind of hold off a bit and strike in say August. Because like you said most TV shows for this season are done and all the summer blockbusters are well past the writing stage so people have lots of stuff to watch. If things went on long enough for people to notice it would be bad for the studios, but people not getting paid from May to say August is also a big hit for someone financially. Have the strike just before the new season starts and people notice right away.

Edited June 7, 2023 by Kel Varnsen

[angora]

11 hours ago, Dani said:

We will probably see the impact in fall when the network shows are supposed to premiere. A lot of those shows were just starting or about to open their writer’s rooms when the shutdown happened. It will take longer to see the impact in streaming but there are likely to be longer than normal breaks between seasons. For movies we probably won’t see a substantial impact until next year.

For movies, we'd also get news of release dates getting moved before we'd see the impact in the actual theater. As we saw early in the pandemic, delays will be especially disruptive for Marvel, because moving one film back even 2-3 months forces the next 3 or 4 films in the schedule to get pushed back too.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Which makes me kind of surprised that the union didn't kind of hold off a bit and strike in say August. Because like you said most TV shows for this season are done and all the summer blockbusters are well past the writing stage so people have lots of stuff to watch. If things went on long enough for people to notice it would be bad for the studios, but people not getting paid from May to say August is also a big hit for someone financially. Have the strike just before the new season starts and people notice right away.

Their contract ended on May 1st so waiting until August wouldn’t really work. But I disagree that would be a better time. If the strike happened just before the new season starts people still wouldn’t notice right away. At that point the studios would have those shows ready to launch and they could stretch out that banked content. But striking now means the shows can’t premiere at all. 

[proserpina65]

A lot of people here know a good bit about the industry so maybe one of you can answer this question: what effect would the SAG-AFTRA strike have on overseas productions currently filming?  I'm specifically thinking of House of the Dragon, but obviously it's not the only show which could be affected.

[BetterButter]

SAG-AFTRA and Hollywood Studios Still at Odds Over Higher Residuals for Hit Streaming Shows

[Guest]

On 6/9/2023 at 10:04 AM, proserpina65 said:

A lot of people here know a good bit about the industry so maybe one of you can answer this question: what effect would the SAG-AFTRA strike have on overseas productions currently filming?  I'm specifically thinking of House of the Dragon, but obviously it's not the only show which could be affected.

If it involves SAG-AFTRA members they would have to immediately stop working. That would also include stunt performers. 

[absnow54]

8 hours ago, Dani said:

If it involves SAG-AFTRA members they would have to immediately stop working. That would also include stunt performers. 

Interestingly enough, not all AFTRA members would be a part of the strike. There's a separate contract for talk show hosts, gameshow hosts, variety performers, and daytime actors, so Soap stars, SNL cast members, and actors who host game shows will still be contractually obligated to work. 

Edited June 27, 2023 by absnow54

[scarynikki12]

Hee

 

[BetterButter]

Jennifer Lawrence, A-List Actors Threaten to Strike in Letter to SAG

Quote

In a letter signed by 300+ actors, including Meryl Streep, members of the Screen Actors Guild say they’re ready to strike for the best deal possible

 

[methodwriter85]

On 6/27/2023 at 8:39 AM, absnow54 said:

There's a separate contract for talk show hosts, gameshow hosts, variety performers, and daytime actors, so Soap stars, SNL cast members, and actors who host game shows will still be contractually obligated to work. 

I wonder if that's why People magazine seems to have had an uptick in talking about soap stars.

[BetterButter]

SAG-AFTRA & AMPTP Agree To Extend Contract To July 12 As Negotiations Continue

[Shannon L.]

Both of my kids wanted to do this, but one won't be able to get out of work.  The other one already has the tickets for both on opening day.   They told me that they were seeing a lot of talk about this online in the last couple of months or so.

[BetterButter]

SAG-AFTRA Lays Out Strike Rules: No Shoots, No Press, No Social Media Promos

[scarynikki12]

 

SAG-AFTRA apparently agreed to the mediator and it better be someone who understands the threat of AI rather than someone who is Team AMPTP.

[scarynikki12]

I'm loving SAG-AFTRA's response to AMPTP's behavior:

 

[Trini]

Shots everywhere, man: 'Hollywood Studios’ WGA Strike Endgame Is To Let Writers Go Broke Before Resuming Talks In Fall'

^I think that was obvious anyway, but now they've got quotes from 'insiders'.

[scarynikki12]

Got a few more:

 

 

The general consensus is SAG-AFTRA joining WGA on the picket line is the fastest way to end both strikes. The producers can pretend they have a ton of things to film but if there's no one reciting the lines the entire industry will literally grind to a halt. The studios are losing a shitload of money already but it will skyrocket without actors and Russo's tweet about quarterly numbers is right on point. Give the writers and actors everything they want (which, to remind, amounts to 2% of the billions these companies bring in).

[scarynikki12]

The Deadline piece has pissed people off. Backfiring on AMPTP hard. 

 

 

I’m done now cause I need to sleep.

[Spartan Girl]

If this is really what they're doing, then it's a stupid move on their part. Monumentally stupid. People already are on the side of the writers, and cutting off their nose to spite their own face is not going to win them sympathy any time soon.

[kiddo82]

I'm curious if there's ever been a controlled study on if the average person can tell the difference between an AI generated script and one written by a person.  I'm seriously wondering if the quality between the two is even comparable or studios don't care.  I know the new model is pushing quantity of content above all else, but if no one is watching it because it sucks then they're wasting money to begin with.

Edited July 12, 2023 by kiddo82

[Kel Varnsen]

18 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

 

SAG-AFTRA apparently agreed to the mediator and it better be someone who understands the threat of AI rather than someone who is Team AMPTP.

What is the threat for AI when it comes to actors? It is already illegal to use someone's likeness without paying them ever since back to the future 2. And if you are going to create an entire new character using computers there is already animation that can do that. I guess you could simulate someone speaking with AI but promoting an animated movie with no voice actors could be difficult.

[DearEvette]

I think it depends on how contracts are written and what rights have been granted and whether or not unknown future technologies are covered and even so far as 'Likeness' and what that means.  Contract language is very specific and technology can outpace what is known vs. what is meant.

Reminds me of the big sea change that happened when ebooks came around.  A lot of old publishing contracts where had rights that were based on "print books" or to publishing  houses to “print, publish and sell in book form.” At the time this was to distinguish between print and audio where audiobooks often had a different publisher and different rights and a different revenue stream for the authors. But nobody had thought of ebooks.  So when ebooks took off, there were cases where authors were attempting to contract for ebook rights with different companies and were getting sued by their publishers or publishers selling ebooks and not having to compensate authors because of the 'print book' wording.

I think since in this case it is   WGA and SGA-AFTRA   -- both are unions.  So as a union  they are trying to formalize language plus base compensation and a set of legal rules for everyone and not have  it so bigger names with lots of money can negotiate better terms for themselves while the lesser or newer actors and writers can be taken advantage of.

[kiddo82]

2 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

What is the threat for AI when it comes to actors? It is already illegal to use someone's likeness without paying them ever since back to the future 2. And if you are going to create an entire new character using computers there is already animation that can do that. I guess you could simulate someone speaking with AI but promoting an animated movie with no voice actors could be difficult.

I wonder if it could be applied to phase out the working actor so instead of say, hiring 12 people to make up the jury on Law and Order you just insert Sims?  But even then, is it really cost effective?  

[Shannon L.]

3 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

What is the threat for AI when it comes to actors? It is already illegal to use someone's likeness without paying them ever since back to the future 2. And if you are going to create an entire new character using computers there is already animation that can do that. I guess you could simulate someone speaking with AI but promoting an animated movie with no voice actors could be difficult.

Justine Bateman has a Twitter thread about AI.  It's interesting and not very long. 
 

 

[NUguy514]

1 hour ago, Shannon L. said:

Justine Bateman has a Twitter thread about AI.  It's interesting and not very long. 
 

 

Just as an FYI, those who don't have Twitter accounts won't be able to see her posts.