GH In The News: The PC Press Club

[HeatLifer]

Does he resent her because he feels his Patrick/Sabrina plans didn't get a fair shake from the audience?

I do think this is a legit point. There's no doubt in my mind that Ron wanted Patrick/Sabrina to work. And I think he was peeved most fans weren't into it. The only reason Ron did Samtrick was because of Twitter talk and because it has the potential to be crazy explosive because of the Jason stuff. It was not something he pushed for before that, IMO. Sabrina and Patrina were his baby in a way.

Also, just because Ron/Frank wanted KMc back for however long doesn't mean that they wanted Robin and Patrick to be together. Because they've done everything to destroy it. Or they're just dumb and think this is an awesome love story, I dunno.

[Chairperson Meow]

I don't know anything about this Ford person, since my only soaps are GH and Days. Can someone give me a thumbnail version of why he's so vile?

Hair model, cardboard, first scene was dumping a bucket of water that played over and over and over and.....

Raped a mentally ill lead legacy character (think a dumbed down Robin ) and then was made her baby's dad. The mentally ill character had DID. Ron likes rape stories and DID. So then character fell for her rapist as an alter. We had every character saying how awesome he was. While he wore a hot dog suit. And then assaulted a nun. And um yeah. Eventually a chandelier killed him. I think he went to hell.

[KerleyQ]

I don't know anything about this Ford person, since my only soaps are GH and Days. Can someone give me a thumbnail version of why he's so vile?

 

Ford was a skeevy guy in his early to mid 20's who seemed to have a preference for barely legal girls.  Among his greatest hits - when Jessica Buchanan had mentally regressed to her teens (after almost being raped by the man she believed to be her biological father), she thought she was still in love with Ford's then roommate - her high school boyfriend, Cristian.  She showed up at their apartment one night, upset at having seen Cris kissing his current girlfriend.  Ford knew Jessica was mentally ill and not really in her right mind (and that she was involved with someone herself who she didn't remember in the state she was in), but he had sex with her.  It was one of those stories Ron loves to tell and then swear up and down "no, that's not rape!"  Jessica ended up pregnant, there was a WTD, and Ford ended up being the father. (I'm still telling myself that Jessica and Brody found out the paternity test was wrong and Brody is the father after all, after the show went off the air).   Jessica's alter, Tess, came out at some point, and Ford enabled her, marrying her to keep her family from having her committed in exchange for her bringing the baby to live with him.  The two of them "fell for" each other (pardon me while I gag), Tess eventually got committed, and when Ford showed up to help her escape, the two of them took down a blind nun and went at it in front of her for a while (because assaulting a nun is hot, apparently) before moving on to the escape.  After Jessica was back in control, they even seemed to be toying with having Jess fall for him, until we started to get to the end of the show.  Thankfully, towards the end of the show, Ford was killed by a falling chandelier* (and it was awesome).  

 

And he was originally just a day player.  But he had a scene where he was shirtless and dumped a bucket of water over himself, and since he had a good body, viewers got to talking about the bucket scene, Ron decided he had the next big thing on his hands, and before we knew it, he was on all the time, he had a whole family brought on for him (two brothers, a sinfully boring mother, and the requisite "evil" daddy to give an excuse for why Ford did bad things), and he was the father of a Buchanan baby.  

 

*I can't wait for Dr. O's chandelier moment.  

[Artsda]

Ford died saving her life from Mitch Lawrence.  They also had Jess in love with him and he was redeemed from the rest of the town. I don't really see any similarities with Obrecht. 

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Hair model, cardboard, first scene was dumping a bucket of water that played over and over and over and.....

Raped a mentally ill lead legacy character (think a dumbed down Robin ) and then was made her baby's dad. The mentally ill character had DID. Ron likes rape stories and DID. So then character fell for her rapist as an alter. We had every character saying how awesome he was. While he wore a hot dog suit. And then assaulted a nun. And um yeah. Eventually a chandelier killed him. I think he went to hell.

Jesus. So basically this was Ron's training ground for writing Franco?

 

No, I am not kidding.

 

Is that chandelier still available?

[HeatLifer]

The only "chandelier moment" Ron would give Dr. O is her singing Sia's song of the same name while swinging on an actual chandelier during the Nurses Ball.

[Cobalt Stargazer]

Great, now I've got that in my head.

 

"1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, drink

 

1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, drink

 

1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3, drink

 

Throw 'em back 'til I lose count..."

[jsbt]

Ron was arguing on Twitter until the last week of OLTL that Ford was not a rapist, yet he told the press it was a redemption story just like that of the Todd Manning character. I think he was deeply enamored of the idea that he personally could replicate that success, that he was finally the true logical heir to OLTL's last glory days. But he wasn't good enough, David Gregory wasn't exciting enough a performer and the character was terrible.

 

They did attempt to finally, somewhat reluctantly thread the needle in the final week of the show, where Ford faces the spectre of his abusive father in spiritual limbo and is taunted about what he did to Jessica, i.e. raping her. Ford vaguely admits he did wrong but is trying to do right. His unspoken penance is to be the character on the brink of death - there were several - who dies at the end of the episode, while others survived and returned to the land of the living. It was a decent wrap-up but it in no way made up for the last two years of forcing him on the audience as a great guy.

 

I imagine that if and when Obrecht, Franco or Nina go they will get a far more sanctimonious treatment - after weeks and months on the backburner due to the rush to wrap up the show (and perhaps the grudging admission that the audience despised him), they didn't have time to really coronate Ford at the end of OLTL, he was summarily and uncharacteristically dismissed after some quick tears from Jessica, and a sop to fans was even given in the final episode, hinting at Jess potentially reuniting in the future with her ex, Brody. At GH I expect weeks of breast-beating about how we didn't understand these tragic antiheroes.

Edited December 21, 2014 by jsbt

[jsbt]

I do think this is a legit point. There's no doubt in my mind that Ron wanted Patrick/Sabrina to work. And I think he was peeved most fans weren't into it. The only reason Ron did Samtrick was because of Twitter talk and because it has the potential to be crazy explosive because of the Jason stuff. It was not something he pushed for before that, IMO. Sabrina and Patrina were his baby in a way.

 

I think Ron wanted it both ways. At one point he clearly adored Sabrina and Patrick/Sabrina and didn't get why the audience wasn't there for it after the Nurses Ball. OTOH he does love Robin, but it's his kind of strange Ron Carlivati love where she's a legacy character he thinks is strong enough to take anything and so he doesn't worry about piling the shit on her. I think he loves them all but I do think that in those types of instances in the past, if something doesn't go as he plans it eventually curdles into a kind of resentment. That is, I suspect, partly the case with Robin. She is always portrayed as the noble heroine martyring herself for a town who doesn't realize what she's done, but at the same time he still seems to relish letting her be dragged through the mud in the meantime. He wants her to be the beloved heroine but he seems to have no restraint in letting her be trashed in the process - I think sometimes his implicit attitude is, she deserves it for telling no one, while at the same time insisting she can't tell anyone. It's nuts. Basically he wants you to like what he wants you to like, and if you don't Robin gets it because hey, Robin can take it. What's she got to really lose? It's his characters like Sabrina who are really suffering!

Edited December 21, 2014 by jsbt

[SlovakPrincess]

Ron's three pet anti-heroes ... Ack. He doesn't get that an anti-hero isn't an evil but self pitying whack job. An anti-hero is nothing if not nuance personified.

Franco was never, ever going to work. With far more subtle acting and writing, Nina I could see working because she has legit reasons to be driven crazy, but it's been ruined by over the top camp.

Dr O - honestly, all they had to do was make her be a lot less cruel and a lot more conflicted about what she was doing to Robin, and maybe try to make conditions better for her while slowly realizing Faison ain't worth it. She could have turned on him, maybe in anger over his not loving her back, claimed to the authorities she'd been forced into it, that she'd tried to help Robin, etc. - Anna and co. would never believe or trust her, but they couldn't prove it.

And instead of trying to kill Liz, maybe trashed Liz's reputation, set her up to get fired or blackmailed her somehow. (And, y'know, not tried to kill a bunch of other people).

ETA: and maybe Robin fans like myself will never turn on her no matter what the writing does to her - but I'm also not going to watch this perverse unpleasantness where she's constantly imprisoned, hopeless and misunderstood. It's too damn frustrating ... why would I find it entertaining? It's like watching a puppy get beaten.

Edited December 21, 2014 by SlovakPrincess

[Chairperson Meow]

With Dr O, it's like if I don't think of what her intro story was, is she evil CoS? Because really, those people are at a hospital, they need to work. Jake needs to pay his damned bill. He was wandering around the hospital and goofing off in the art room, how injured was he? So any hospital would make him leave, especially with no insurance.

Ron screwed up majorly by having Roger Howarth play Franco. If by some miracle he can get JF back or hell, just do the story anyway. DeFranco the character. This is a show with latex masks and no one dies (unless they're fat). I think Ron watched Breaking Bad and SoA and thought "I can do that." No. Not really on a soap. Even with those characters they had other characters that hated them. Todd Manning was hated by most of the town till OLTL wrapped. It was his thing.

[peachmangosteen]

I think Ron wanted it both ways.

 

He always does.

[KerleyQ]

Ron's three pet anti-heroes ... Ack. He doesn't get that an anti-hero isn't an evil but self pitying whack job. An anti-hero is nothing if not nuance personified.

Franco was never, ever going to work. With far more subtle acting and writing, Nina I could see working because she has legit reasons to be driven crazy, but it's been ruined by over the top camp.

Dr O - honestly, all they had to do was make her be a lot less cruel and a lot more conflicted about what she was doing to Robin, and maybe try to make conditions better for her while slowly realizing Faison ain't worth it. She could have turned on him, maybe in anger over his not loving her back, claimed to the authorities she'd been forced into it, that she'd tried to help Robin, etc. - Anna and co. would never believe or trust her, but they couldn't prove it.

And instead of trying to kill Liz, maybe trashed Liz's reputation, set her up to get fired or blackmailed her somehow. (And, y'know, not tried to kill a bunch of other people).

ETA: and maybe Robin fans like myself will never turn on her no matter what the writing does to her - but I'm also not going to watch this perverse unpleasantness where she's constantly imprisoned, hopeless and misunderstood. It's too damn frustrating ... why would I find it entertaining? It's like watching a puppy get beaten.

 

This is so true.  Especially about Nina - I keep feeling like I should have more sympathy for the character than I do.  Her husband cheated on her, she was put into coma for years by her own mother, and she lost her baby.  She should be someone you can at least feel for, someone whose anger and resentment seems perfectly understandable.  But between MSt's acting choices and Ron's writing, I just can't.  

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

I was on the Nina train so to speak, I didn't like or dislike her, I even sympathized with her somewhat, that is until she went after Ava and her baby the way in which she did. The gruesome labor inducing is one of the most horrifying things I've sen play out on soaps in a long time. The last time was Y&R Adam's gas lighting Ashley into miscarriage and burring the remains in the fireplace. I will argue that even wasn't as gruesome as Nina did to Ava. 

 

I could accept Nina as a disturbed character until that gem. Well done Ron.

 

 She is always portrayed as the noble heroine martyring herself for a town who doesn't realize what she's done, but at the same time he still seems to relish letting her be dragged through the mud in the meantime. He wants her to be the beloved heroine but he seems to have no restraint in letting her be trashed in the process - I think sometimes his implicit attitude is, she deserves it for telling no one, while at the same time insisting she can't tell anyone. It's nuts. Basically he wants you to like what he wants you to like, and if you don't Robin gets it because hey, Robin can take it. 

 

I agree with how he views and writes for Robin but I am missing the bold. How is Robin trashed? She is pretty much a hero or a victim since he took over writing her. When she is not saving people, she is being victimized by villeins.

 

Add to that, she is victimized by her loved ones too because they don't realize how self sacrificing she is, or how nobel.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[TeeVee329]

Ford died saving her life from Mitch Lawrence.  They also had Jess in love with him and he was redeemed from the rest of the town. I don't really see any similarities with Obrecht. 

 

The show definitely was trying to sell that Ford died as a hero, but I didn't see it.  When he arrived at the church, John had a gun pointed at Mitch, who was holding Natalie hostage.  When he was wheeled out of the church, John had a gun pointed at Mitch, who was holding Natalie hostage.  He accomplished nothing.  In fact, he ended up giving Mitch more leverage (which Mitch weirdly didn't use). And that all came after he screamed at Viki and Clint about Mitch, never mind Viki and Clint have been dealing with Mitch for eons.

 

And even in hell with Papa Ford, he (and the show) were shoveling a line of bullshit with all his claims that he was a terrible person BEFORE he found out he was a father, but that changed him into the "cuddly" and "super nice" guy he was now.  Never mind all the terrible stuff he did AFTER he found out he was a father - marrying Tess to keep Jessica from getting proper medical treatment so he could get his hands on Ryder's trust fund, purposefully provoking Jessica until she turned back into Tess, hiding the fact that a second woman (Viki) had had a mental breakdown, ASSAULTING A NUN, etc.

 

Lord, I hated him.  And yes, Franco most of last year and this was getting similar writing.

Edited December 21, 2014 by TeeVee329

[dubbel zout]

And then assaulted a nun.

 

AND LAUGHED ABOUT IT. That's what really pushed it beyond reprehensible. Ford (and Tess, to be fair) thought it was the funniest thing imaginable. Because punching women is so hilarious. UGH.

 

Franco was never, ever going to work. With far more subtle acting and writing, Nina I could see working because she has legit reasons to be driven crazy, but it's been ruined by over the top camp.

 

Agreed. Franco never should have been resurrected for RoHo, but Nina could have been a decent character. But as usual, Ron goes for the quick, cheap writing, so Nina is as ruined as Franco.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

Fair point about Robin, Deputy Deputy COS. But I don't trust this regime not to try and have it both ways should she ever come home - like, having people tell her she should have tried harder to get an SOS message out, or just told Patty the truth when he found her at the lab, danger be damned. Or acting like she just has to suck it up that her family moved on.

 

I wasn't making a point. It was a genuine question. I see Robin fans say she is being trashed, not just here. I don't see that but would appreciate if someone could explain it to me.

 

To respond to the italics, if people attempt to hold her responsible,  it will be more of a pile on. It won't be because they are right. JSBT stated perfectly why. Robin is the hero who was kidnapped and kept from her family. Anyone who questions this would be in the wrong. That to me is not trashing. It is, to a lesser degree, victimizing.  Whoever the naysayer is would be the character being trashed.

 

Only time will tell if Robin really is the victim in the writers'/Ron's eyes

 

I am pretty certain Ron's said in interviews that she is a self sacrificing hero, unbeknownst to her loved ones.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Deputy Deputy CoS

[OnceSane]

I moved several posts to the History thread.

[HeatLifer]

I am pretty certain Ron's said in interviews that she is a self sacrificing hero, unbeknownst to her loved ones.

I usually don't take Ron's interviews seriously. A lot of the time he contradicts what I see on-screen.

If she's such a hero, though, her family and friends will probs feel craptastic when they learn the truth. Or Ron will let them all completely off the hook for whatever reason he concocts. Or he'll purposely make them all look like a-holes for blaming her. I guess we will see.

[jsbt]

It's not that Robin isn't a self-sacrificing heroine. It's that I think Ron believes that, yet wants us also to see it from the POV of Patrick, or Sabrina or Felix - 'Robin sacrificed everything but her family are the ones who are truly suffering! Isn't she just too self-righteous? Look, Emma's crying again! How can she do this for Jason; though she is Jason's only hope; though she put Jason before her daughter; though Victor kidnapped her; though she had a choice!' And on and on.

 

It's an endless loop of confused doublethink, IMO, but what it adds up to for me is, he wants Robin the legendary heroine but also wants her to be kept in a place subservient to either his plot needs or his own characters he is trying to put over. Or both. Robin is the heroine, but that is his narrative trap - she's so much the heroine that her innate heroism makes her (in Ron's eyes) just a little self-righteous or inconsiderate to her family. Unlike, say, the pious Sabrina or whoever else.

Edited December 22, 2014 by jsbt

[HeatLifer]

jsbt, yes! You said that better than I ever could. Exactly what I thought in my brain but couldn't really articulate.

[yowsah1]

Ugh, fuck off SOD. That child (the character obviously) needs to be launched into the sun. 

 

Yeah, that was an eyeroll moment for me as well.  The worst is that now TIIC will be all, "Look at how incredibly popular Spencer is!  SOD named him Most Entertaining Character!*  Clearly we need to up his screentime!"  Which is just... ugh.

 

 

* - There is always the hope that GH fans inundate SOD with letters and e-mails about this with one word emphasized, "No", thus killing that line of thought straight off.

[jsbt]

I'm glad you think so, but it makes less sense to me the more I try to articulate it. He did it at times at OLTL, too - someone would be 'right,' but there would always be something negligible they did designed to make them also 'wrong.'

 

It's different than, say, a custody battle storyline where you root for or feel for everyone, feel everyone has made mistakes while also meaning well or having their reasons - that, to me, is the sort of thing where no one on a soap is 'right' or 'wrong', and I think that's very healthy and good storytelling. Ron used to do that better. But I feel that what he often does now instead is very calculated, and sort of willfully obtuse. I guess the best way to put it - which is very vague - is that he wants you to remember something about a character, and then immediately ignore the personal context of their choices and go with the next moment in which they are castigated. There's a fine line between being even-handed with all of the characters on the show and just handicapping some to help others, and I think Ron crosses that regularly.

Edited December 22, 2014 by jsbt

[yowsah1]

I do think this is a legit point. There's no doubt in my mind that Ron wanted Patrick/Sabrina to work. And I think he was peeved most fans weren't into it.

 

I really don't buy this notion that Sabrina was this massively unpopular character and Patrina this massively unpopular pairing line that TWoP types like to push.  Outside of TWoP, Patrina had a good-sized fanbase - maybe not supercouple sized, but fairly healthy.  Some of them would even show up on TWoP to let the posters there know, in no uncertain terms, that they supported the couple.  (With massively amusing results).  Ron was peeved because a certain fan segment - Scrubs fans mostly - reacted with extremely loud condemnation to the pairing.  If this had been Guza, he would have happily pitted the two fanbases against each other - hey, I've got a Liz vs. Sam 2.0 going, can't let this golden opportunity slide!  Ron, on the other hand, reacted by doing interviews painting the Scrubs fans who were complaining as basically crazy bullies.  (You can imagine how great that went over).

 

I don't think it's an accident that Sabrina is still on canvas.  My guess is she's being kept around so that when the whole Jason reveal comes down and Samtrick break up, Patrick will reunite with her.  (I also think that's why TPTB always make sure to script a Patrick/Sabrina scene every once in a while, to reassure their fanbase that they are not over).

 

DeFranco the character.

 

Great, now I've got this stuck in my head...  ;)

 

he wants Robin the legendary heroine but also wants her to be kept in a place subservient to either his plot needs or his own characters he is trying to put over

 

One of the very earliest posters here mentioned this, but I have to repeat it - RC is doing with Robin what Guza did with Brenda, to much the same effect.

[jsbt]

I hope you're ready for him to get the Dylan Cash slot in the opening.

[jsbt]

I don't know what he did to Brenda, beyond regressing her horribly to ultimately go back to Sonny when she came back from the dead; I wasn't that regular a viewer during her 2010-2011 return. I do think he was obsessed with her up to a certain point and willing to upturn the whole show for the actress, perhaps until VM defied him on the Dante story. Didn't they even originally want her to co-star with Franco in 2009?

 

I think Sabrina and Patrick had a decent little fanbase, but I think numbers are more inflated than ever today with social media. I don't think it was big enough to make a difference, though RC clearly had hoped to at one point. I do think he always intended to eventually end them for Scrubs, and I think he has lost virtually all interest in Sabrina of late as he often does with his latest golden characters, but I may be wrong; it looked a lot like a chemistry test with Chad Duell a week or two ago.

Edited December 22, 2014 by jsbt

[TeeVee329]

It's an endless loop of confused doublethink, IMO, but what it adds up to for me is, he wants Robin the legendary heroine but also wants her to be kept in a place subservient to either his plot needs or his own characters he is trying to put over.

 

That nicely sums it up.  We have Patrick finally acknowledging out loud that Robin was blackmailed, forced, threatened to leave her family and help Victor.  But the show also wants us to focus on Patrick's...whatever...with Sam so Patrick doesn't actually seem upset that Robin was blackmailed, forced, threatened into leaving her family, doesn't even momentarily regret the things he said to her that day at Crichton-Clark now that he knows Victor terrorized her into staying by causing the car accident.

 

And per usual, Ron seems to be sticking his fingers in his ears and "lalalalalalala"-ing away any complaints as whining.  How he views events is the only thing that matters.

I think Sabrina and Patrick had a decent little fanbase, but I think numbers are more inflated than ever today with social media.

 

Totally.  One poster on another board kept boasting how Sabrina and Patrick were on the top of SOD's Couples list all the time or whatever, because that can't be artificially inflated with a few super fans or anything.

Edited December 22, 2014 by TeeVee329

[ulkis]

I don't know what he did to Brenda, beyond regressing her horribly to ultimately go back to Sonny when she came back from the dead; I wasn't that regular a viewer during her 2010-2011 return. I do think he was obsessed with her up to a certain point and willing to upturn the whole show for the actress, perhaps until VM defied him on the Dante story. Didn't they even originally want her to co-star with Franco in 2009?

I remember one Guza quote where he said Franco would be involved in her return, but that was about it. Maybe they couldn't get Franco at that time or Guza just forgot.

[TeeVee329]

I remember one Guza quote where he said Franco would be involved in her return, but that was about it. Maybe they couldn't get Franco at that time or Guza just forgot.

 

I just remember one weird scene with poor, slumming Bruce Davidson doing some ridiculous accent as someone reaching out to Brenda on Franco's behalf.

[HeatLifer]

I really don't buy this notion that Sabrina was this massively unpopular character and Patrina this massively unpopular pairing line that TWoP types like to push. Outside of TWoP, Patrina had a good-sized fanbase - maybe not supercouple sized, but fairly healthy. Some of them would even show up on TWoP to let the posters there know, in no uncertain terms, that they supported the couple. (With massively amusing results). Ron was peeved because a certain fan segment - Scrubs fans mostly - reacted with extremely loud condemnation to the pairing. If this had been Guza, he would have happily pitted the two fanbases against each other - hey, I've got a Liz vs. Sam 2.0 going, can't let this golden opportunity slide! Ron, on the other hand, reacted by doing interviews painting the Scrubs fans who were complaining as basically crazy bullies. (You can imagine how great that went over).

I don't think it's an accident that Sabrina is still on canvas. My guess is she's being kept around so that when the whole Jason reveal comes down and Samtrick break up, Patrick will reunite with her. (I also think that's why TPTB always make sure to script a Patrick/Sabrina scene every once in a while, to reassure their fanbase that they are not over).

Oh, everyone and everything has fans. I'm certainly not saying Sabrina or Patrina didn't have any. But I don't know if I agree that there was even a decent sized fanbase. And even if there was, Ron had to realize that those "crazy bully Scrubs fans" have been around since 2005. There's no winning that fight now.

And Ron blasting Scrubs fans is kinda the point I was making; he was resentful the pairing and the character he wanted to work was being trashed.

I'm also unsure that Ron would really go the Patrina route again, but I'm not surprised by anything the man does.

Edited December 22, 2014 by HeatLifer

[WendyCR72]

Gabriel dying a sad twist? Um...no.

Spencer as Most Entertaining Character? Hell to the no.

Most Entertaining Show...oh, God, put down the glue, people!

 

All of these minus the blurb about Michael's name change are complete shit. It validates my decision to have stopped reading SOD as it is now just an ass-kissing rag. Payoffs abound somewhere from where I sit and what I'm reading.

 

Or, more than likely, trying to keep jobs since the pond is so freaking small to choose fishies from now...

[dubbel zout]

I hope you're ready for him to get the Dylan Cash slot in the opening.

 

At least they never put him in the group shot of the men at the end.

 

And I love how we NEVER got the corresponding shot of women in formalwear.

[dubbel zout]

DeFranco the character.

Great, now I've got this stuck in my head...  ;)

 

I'm transported back to fifth grade. The DeFranco family never seriously challenged the Osmonds, heh. Probably because all the Osmonds could actually sing.

[Tiger]

Sabrina as a character and Patrina as a pairing may have worked if Sabrina hadn't been written as Disney Princess: whiney twelve-year-old edition, and if the show had let TCa have the gorgeous locks she is currently sporting.

At least for me, great hair goes a long way.

ETA: Frank needs to send everyone to the person or persons doing FH and VA's hair.

Edited December 22, 2014 by Tiger

[Tiger]

At least they never put him in the group shot of the men at the end.

 

And I love how we NEVER got the corresponding shot of women in formalwear.

Didn't they show the wimmins closing once or twice what that first debuted and then never again?

If they put the Spencer actor on contract when TRo, GF, KW, ISh, JJY, LC, and even current pet KG aren't on contract, it will be the height of ridiculousness.

[dubbel zout]

I think you're right, Tiger, that we saw the women's version once or twice. But that was it, and whenever anyone complained about only showing the men, TPTB made some bogus noises about alternating them, and it never happened.

[Sake614]

 

Saddest Twist:  Gabriel Dies

Best Secret:  Sonny Killed A.J.

Best Triangle:  Nathan/Maxie/Levi

Best Breakup:  Carly and Franco

Worst Breakup:  Patrick and Robin

Best Casting Coups:  Donna Mills, Michaelle Stafford, Billy Miller

Most Entertaining Character:  Spencer

Biggest Lothario:  Sonny

Best New Character:  Jordan

Most Entertaining Show

Ummmm. I agree about Jordan. And kinda sorta Donna Mills. the rest? NOT A PRAYER! Seriously? If spender is the best they could find for 'most entertaining' and Levi/Maxie/Nathan' the best triangle, maybe they should just have skipped those categories.

[Fylaki]

I think part of the problem with Purina was the acting choices of TCe, from Disney Princess to lots of sex she never measured up as a rival for Robin. Say what we will about Sam or Liz as rivals they seem equal. To me it is why breaking up Sam and Patrick is a mistake. Sam may one of the few characters who can stand toe to toe with Robin. Let Liz have Jake since he is not Jason M anyway

Edited December 22, 2014 by Fylaki

[Cobalt Stargazer]

I really don't buy this notion that Sabrina was this massively unpopular character and Patrina this massively unpopular pairing line that TWoP types like to push.  Outside of TWoP, Patrina had a good-sized fanbase - maybe not supercouple sized, but fairly healthy.  Some of them would even show up on TWoP to let the posters there know, in no uncertain terms, that they supported the couple.  (With massively amusing results).  Ron was peeved because a certain fan segment - Scrubs fans mostly - reacted with extremely loud condemnation to the pairing.  If this had been Guza, he would have happily pitted the two fanbases against each other - hey, I've got a Liz vs. Sam 2.0 going, can't let this golden opportunity slide!  Ron, on the other hand, reacted by doing interviews painting the Scrubs fans who were complaining as basically crazy bullies.  (You can imagine how great that went over).

 

I don't think it's an accident that Sabrina is still on canvas.  My guess is she's being kept around so that when the whole Jason reveal comes down and Samtrick break up, Patrick will reunite with her.  (I also think that's why TPTB always make sure to script a Patrick/Sabrina scene every once in a while, to reassure their fanbase that they are not over).

 

I'm of two minds, which is not unusual. I do think that Ron wanted Patrick and Sabrina to work as a couple, and that he tried too hard to sell them. TWOP was really the only place where I posted before this, and the more Ron worked to sell the pairing, the more the posters there resented/hated Sabrina. Not Patrick who, let's be honest, doesn't have the greatest track record as a boyfriend or husband, and due to Jason Thompson's IMO extremely lackluster performance during the majority of his time with her, Patrick barely seemed interested in Sabrina except as a babysitter with benefits. A few people even said that if he was tanking the material, then they didn't blame him because it was a horrible story and because Thompson was the vet and deserved more focus than he was getting, instead of the newbie pet.So in some ways it kind of lends credence to the idea that Patrick won't be accepted with anyone other than Robin.

 

OTOH, there's been relatively little backlash against Sam (or Kelly Monaco, for that matter) since Samtrick got started. Of course, Patrick has been actively lying to Sam pretty much from the jump, as opposed to his benign, if tepid, feelings towards Sabrina. I have the feeling that that will change if Robin does ever return, but for now, the griping is mostly aimed at him. I don't know if Ron just doesn't realize how awful Patrick looks right now, not that he's ever come off as awesome in the past, or if he does realize it and is just so determined to tell the story he wants to tell that he doesn't care about collateral damage. I am glad that Patrick is finally getting the raking over the coals (from viewers, if nothing else) that he so richly deserves, but at the same time I sort of feel sorry for Teresa Castillo, because it turns out that it really must have been just her that people hated.

[dubbel zout]

is just so determined to tell the story he wants to tell that he doesn't care about collateral damage.

 

This, always this. Ron says this every time he gets snippy with people who call him on inconsistencies and uncharacteristic actions and responses. He thinks "respecting history" means name checking characters and events, not using them to further or deepen current stories.

 

If Teresa Castillo had given Sabrina an edge or a self-awareness of her sugary sweetness, that would have gone a long way to making the character tolerable to me. Of course, it didn't help that everyone at GH, including random day player employees and patients, praised Sabrina to the sky. That's not TeCa's fault.

[Tiger]

From a purely acting standpoint TCa's biggest problems was that she was constantly stepping on her scene partners' lines.

Eh, as far as I'm concerned, TCa at her worst is still worlds better than RHo and MSt at their "best".

[TeeVee329]

I'm of two minds, which is not unusual. I do think that Ron wanted Patrick and Sabrina to work as a couple, and that he tried too hard to sell them...the more Ron worked to sell the pairing, the more the posters there resented/hated Sabrina.

 

That tends to be Ron's modus operandi.  Instead of admitting something doesn't work, he doubles down on it, trying to force the audience into submission.  "See, you thought Patrick and Sabrina were kinda creepy because she acts like a tweenage girl.  But see, she's 27!  And she's had lots and LOTS of sex.  So...not creepy!  All fixed, now you can love them!". 

 

And while most of the failure with Sabrina lies with the writing, I did think Sabrina came off as extremely smug once she landed Patrick and I lay that at TeCa's feet.

[ulkis]

This, always this. Ron says this every time he gets snippy with people who call him on inconsistencies and uncharacteristic actions and responses. He thinks "respecting history" means name checking characters and events, not using them to further or deepen current stories.

 

If Teresa Castillo had given Sabrina an edge or a self-awareness of her sugary sweetness, that would have gone a long way to making the character tolerable to me. Of course, it didn't help that everyone at GH, including random day player employees and patients, praised Sabrina to the sky. That's not TeCa's fault.

 

Taking my reply to the history thread.

[UYI]

At least they never put him in the group shot of the men at the end.

 

And I love how we NEVER got the corresponding shot of women in formalwear.

 

 

I remember reading on the old gossip thread on TWOP that there was an opening that ended with the women in white dresses, but it never actually aired.

 

Of course, if it DID actually air and someone has it on YouTube somewhere, I'd LOVE to see it! 

Didn't they show the wimmins closing once or twice what that first debuted and then never again?

If they put the Spencer actor on contract when TRo, GF, KW, ISh, JJY, LC, and even current pet KG aren't on contract, it will be the height of ridiculousness.

 

Sorry, I'm having a brain cramp. Who's ISh? I know it isn't Ian Buchanan, because that's IB. 

[ulkis]

I think you're right, Tiger, that we saw the women's version once or twice. But that was it, and whenever anyone complained about only showing the men, TPTB made some bogus noises about alternating them, and it never happened.

 

No, we never did. And I'm pretty positive they never filmed it either.

Edited December 22, 2014 by ulkis

[Tiger]

That's supposed to be KSh for Kin Shriner. Fracking auto-correct.

ETA: it's entirely possible we never did see a wimmins opening. I can remember exact dialogue from the 90's, but I've increasingly discovered that things I think happened on this show in the 00's actually didn't happen, and other things that did happen I have apparently blocked out.

Edited December 22, 2014 by Tiger

[jsbt]

AFAIK there was definitely no women's opening.

[MSquared]

 

I'm of two minds, which is not unusual. I do think that Ron wanted Patrick and Sabrina to work as a couple, and that he tried too hard to sell them. TWOP was really the only place where I posted before this, and the more Ron worked to sell the pairing, the more the posters there resented/hated Sabrina. Not Patrick who, let's be honest, doesn't have the greatest track record as a boyfriend or husband, and due to Jason Thompson's IMO extremely lackluster performance during the majority of his time with her, Patrick barely seemed interested in Sabrina except as a babysitter with benefits. A few people even said that if he was tanking the material, then they didn't blame him because it was a horrible story and because Thompson was the vet and deserved more focus than he was getting, instead of the newbie pet.So in some ways it kind of lends credence to the idea that Patrick won't be accepted with anyone other than Robin.

 

OTOH, there's been relatively little backlash against Sam (or Kelly Monaco, for that matter) since Samtrick got started. Of course, Patrick has been actively lying to Sam pretty much from the jump, as opposed to his benign, if tepid, feelings towards Sabrina. I have the feeling that that will change if Robin does ever return, but for now, the griping is mostly aimed at him. I don't know if Ron just doesn't realize how awful Patrick looks right now, not that he's ever come off as awesome in the past, or if he does realize it and is just so determined to tell the story he wants to tell that he doesn't care about collateral damage. I am glad that Patrick is finally getting the raking over the coals (from viewers, if nothing else) that he so richly deserves, but at the same time I sort of feel sorry for Teresa Castillo, because it turns out that it really must have been just her that people hated.

 

In regards to Samtrick, I think my issue was, this is where the story should have gone in the first place, with no detour through Sabrina.  She was unnecessary to start with for Patrick.  Patrick and Sam, however, coming together with maybe blame first than in friendship and romance, worked on more levels and was a better launching pad for what stupid fucking quad Ron was going to go to with Jason and Robin back.

 

Ron really has a bad track record of putting together couples who make no sense.  I liken Purina to just a nicer Tomas/Blair from OLTL.  It made no logical sense for Blair to be with the man responsible for kidnapping and switching Todd, yet Ron, as the end was winding down, put it out there wondering if Tomas would be freed and get back to Blair.  And, it made no sense that Patrick would fall for tween Sabrina, and even less when it was said she's had LOTS AND LOTS of sex.

[LeftPhalange]

 

OTOH, there's been relatively little backlash against Sam (or Kelly Monaco, for that matter) since Samtrick got started.

 

If Patrick and Sam ever become a legit couple I expect this to change, which is why I'm even hesitant to root for them to get together. She was already thrown under the bus when she had nasty floor sex with Ric and then watched Jake get kidnapped, and that's on top of spending years competing with Liz over Jason. Now if she gets involved with Patrick she will have to go up against Robin. If the Sam vs Liz wars were bad Sam vs Robin will be off the charts.

[HeatLifer]

I wouldn't worry about Sam v. Robin in terms of the writing of the show. The fans may try to do it, but Ron clearly hasn't gone there and most likely never will. 1. Robin would have to be there full-time to even try to make some fucked up competition over Patdick and 2. Sam has been written as the "main" character in all this. She has done no wrong. It's her POV. She's the one suffering. She's the one accepting apologies. This isn't 2007. She ain't going to arrange Emma's kidnapping. Ron will make Sam Emma's new mommy before that happens.

Sam fans just shouldn't even waste time worrying. She's looked the best she has in years, IMO.

Edited December 22, 2014 by HeatLifer