The Duggars: In the Media and TLC

[Minivanessa]

"Payed"?

[Absolom]

4 minutes ago, Jeeves said:

"Payed"?

That and perused instead of pursued.  

[Cinnabon]

22 minutes ago, BigBingerBro said:

EXCLUSIVE! Duggar Sisters Say They’ll Need Lifelong Therapy Plan Due To Release of Molestation Docs; Won’t Seek Lost Wages Due to How Little They Were Payed for “19 Kids & Counting”

Why are they still referring to these now grown women as “girls?” One of my pet peeves. 

And this is BS - I do hope they all get the therapy they need, for as long as they need it, but I honestly don’t think they really want it OR plan on actually getting it. Wouldn’t they have done so before now?

“While the girls aren’t seeking lost wages, they are seeking enough money so that they can have a “life care plan” put together and get into therapy to recover from the emotional distress the scandal caused.

The Ashley can exclusive reveal that, during a Status Conference held back in April, one of the attorneys representing the Duggar girls stated that it was not even worth the trouble for the girls to seek lost wages, since they were paid so little for appearing on “19 Kids & Counting” and its spin-off Counting On.”

[Cinnabon]

It’s very telling that they’re seeking damages only for therapy costs instead of suing Josh for molesting them or JB for not protecting them as it happened over and over. And, they seem to be saying that the abuse itself wasn’t traumatic enough to seek therapy for, but the outing of the abuse by the media WAS. I feel like they’re still not seeing the whole picture. 

[Absolom]

That or the lawyer thinks they can get more money into a therapy fund than any other way.  Can anyone see Jessa going to real therapy?

[Churchhoney]

8 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

It’s very telling that they’re seeking damages only for therapy costs instead of suing Josh for molesting them or JB for not protecting them as it happened over and over. And, they seem to be saying that the abuse itself wasn’t traumatic enough to seek therapy for, but the outing of the abuse by the media WAS. I feel like they’re still not seeing the whole picture. 

Well, you know, JB can't get any money from JB, or from Josh, so he's gotta get money from somebody. So it has to be the insufficient redactors. 

And as for the chances of that money going to therapy for J, J, J, and J.....Well, that'd be a good idea, but I expect it might also be a cold day in hell. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Churchhoney

[irisheyes]

1 hour ago, BigBingerBro said:

EXCLUSIVE! Duggar Sisters Say They’ll Need Lifelong Therapy Plan Due To Release of Molestation Docs; Won’t Seek Lost Wages Due to How Little They Were Payed for “19 Kids & Counting”

OMG, the writing is so bad. It’s like my 3rd graders wrote it. 🤣🤣

[Rabbittron]

If they get any money I want it to go right to the therapist. 

[Cinnabon]

19 minutes ago, Rabbittron said:

If they get any money I want it to go right to the therapist. 

JB is the one who should really be paying for his daughters’ therapy, not the taxpayers. 

[Zella]

I never really thought this lawsuit had much merit--and the fact the number of people and entities being sued have shrunken so dramatically further confirmed it for me--but nothing in that article made it look more feasible. I suspect if they don't settle, they're not getting anything, and if I was the other party, I wouldn't be inclined to settle with them. 

When this news originally broke, there were a fair number of think pieces on/in AR news channels/news papers about whether the report was improperly redacted, and from what I recall, everyone said that the material was redacted according to law. The names and pronouns were blacked out. That was all that was required.

It's unfortunate that the parental names and ages allowed people to correctly guess who the victims were, and I do have sympathy for the Duggar daughters being outed against their will as molestation victims, but I don't think they have a viable lawsuit against anyone. The laws aren't designed with the assumption that your parents have so thoroughly violated your privacy by making you a reality TV personality as a child that random strangers can identify you through a report that is almost unreadable at points due to the redactions. 

In fact, the fact that the one victim who was not a family member has still never been publicly identified is a pretty good indication to me that the redactions would have been adequate if not for the Duggars' fame. 

I think it's worthwhile to have a conversation about whether the laws need to go further in what needs to be redacted as technology makes it easier to disseminate this information, but really, I think the primary people to blame here are Jim Bob and Michelle rather than anyone who is actually being sued. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Zella

[merylinkid]

11 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

he Ashley can exclusive reveal that, during a Status Conference held back in April, one of the attorneys representing the Duggar girls stated that it was not even worth the trouble for the girls to seek lost wages, since they were paid so little for appearing on “19 Kids & Counting” and its spin-off Counting On.”

Because JB kept all the money that show made, and from all the other deals connected to the show in order to financially control his children.   Why we need Coogan laws for reality shows.   Although some of them were adults when the show was cancelled as a result of the allegations.   but TLC was too freaking lazy to do separate contracts with the adults.  The adults, other than JB, never knew they could have separate contracts thanks to be kept as intellectual children by JB.    So this is on TLC too why the adults have no separate lost wages.

[Ohiopirate02]

8 hours ago, Zella said:

I never really thought this lawsuit had much merit--and the fact the number of people and entities being sued have shrunken so dramatically further confirmed it for me--but nothing in that article made it look more feasible. I suspect if they don't settle, they're not getting anything, and if I was the other party, I wouldn't be inclined to settle with them. 

When this news originally broke, there were a fair number of think pieces on/in AR news channels/news papers about whether the report was improperly redacted, and from what I recall, everyone said that the material was redacted according to law. The names and pronouns were blacked out. That was all that was required.

It's unfortunate that the parental names and ages allowed people to correctly guess who the victims were, and I do have sympathy for the Duggar daughters being outed against their will as molestation victims, but I don't think they have a viable lawsuit against anyone. The laws aren't designed with the assumption that your parents have so thoroughly violated your privacy by making you a reality TV personality as a child that random strangers can identify you through a report that is almost unreadable at points due to the redactions. 

In fact, the fact that the one victim who was not a family member has still never been publicly identified is a pretty good indication to me that the redactions would have been adequate if not for the Duggars' fame. 

I think it's worthwhile to have a conversation about whether the laws need to go further in what needs to be redacted as technology makes it easier to disseminate this information, but really, I think the primary people to blame here are Jim Bob and Michelle rather than anyone who is actually being sued. 

Even if the ages of the victims were redacted, the family was famous enough that people would have figured out Josh molested his sisters.  It wasn't too hard for me to connect the dots when the story first broke.  

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

Even if the ages of the victims were redacted, the family was famous enough that people would have figured out Josh molested his sisters.  It wasn't too hard for me to connect the dots when the story first broke.  

That would hold true for famous folks who don't exploit their children. How unfair and wrong that would be if kids of an athlete, politician or celebrity were outed because their parents were famous.

[cmr2014]

15 hours ago, Churchhoney said:

Well, you know, JB can't get any money from JB, or from Josh, so he's gotta get money from somebody. So it has to be the insufficient redactors. 

And as for the chances of that money going to therapy for J, J, J, and J.....Well, that'd be a good idea, but I expect it might also be a cold day in hell. 

They are trying to sell the idea that they need therapy because the report was released, but did not need therapy as a result of the actual molestation?"

This may be totally logical in Gothard-world, but it is completely bonkers in the real world.

[GeeGolly]

6 minutes ago, cmr2014 said:

They are trying to sell the idea that they need therapy because the report was released, but did not need therapy as a result of the actual molestation?"

This may be totally logical in Gothard-world, but it is completely bonkers in the real world.

I respectfully disagree. Trauma is very personal.

For example two folks could serve during war, one on the front line and one in the mess tent. Either, both or neither could come home with PTSD.

Its easy to assume anyone who has been molested, assaulted or seen combat, has developed mental health issues, but that's just not the case.

[Zella]

Yeah I don't doubt that the release was genuinely traumatizing for them, and as I said earlier, I do think it is worthwhile to consider if the redaction laws need to be updated/broadened. I just feel like the daughters are largely misplacing the blame. The officials redacted the documents and released them according to law. The Duggars are arguing that it wasn't, and they should be compensated for that. That literally makes no sense to me, though I certainly can empathize with their pain over the fallout from that release. 

If their parents had actually handled the situation properly when it happened, the documents would have truly been sealed and never released. If the Duggar parents hadn't done robocalls about trans people being predators in bathrooms, nobody likely would have tipped off InTouch that there was a police report that showed how hypocritical they were. Their parents are the ones, to my mind, who created this situation, out of their own hubris and selfishness, not the officials who were just doing their job. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Zella

[cmr2014]

17 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I don't doubt that the release was genuinely traumatizing for them, and as I said earlier, I do think it is worthwhile to consider if the redaction laws need to be updated/broadened. I just feel like the daughters are largely misplacing the blame. The officials redacted the documents and released them according to law. The Duggars are arguing that it wasn't, and they should be compensated for that. That literally makes no sense to me, though I certainly can empathize with their pain over the fallout from that release. 

If their parents had actually handled the situation properly when it happened, the documents would have truly been sealed and never released. If the Duggar parents hadn't done robocalls about trans people being predators in bathrooms, nobody likely would have tipped off InTouch that there was a police report that showed how hypocritical they were. Their parents are the ones, to my mind, who created this situation, out of their own hubris and selfishness, not the officials who were just doing their job. 

Exactly, I don't doubt that the release of the documents was traumatic, but no one broke the law in releasing them.

I hope they agree to a settlement, because if they go to trial, I don't see this being successful.

The "Wisdom Booklets" available to "counsel" victims of sexual assault are widely available. I would have a hard time following the logic that says that reading these documents to abused children was considered adequate "counseling," but now they will need a lifetime of real counseling to deal with the fact that the abuse became public knowledge.

I'm sure that it's very possible for different people to process trauma in different ways, and it's possible that the release of these documents was more traumatic than the original molestation for some of the victims, but I doubt it.

What we are getting here is 100% what was traumatic for JB. I'm sure that the original molestations were traumatic for JB (harmed his standing in IBLP), but, as we know, he "hardly remembers" them now and they were "no big deal." The release of the documents was a huge blow to JB and cost him his television show and speaking engagements. His brand was blown up publicly and nationally. He will certainly need counseling for the rest of his life to deal with the fallout . . .

[Zella]

Just now, cmr2014 said:

I hope they agree to a settlement,

I honestly would be shocked if there was a settlement. I think the people being sued are well aware they are in the clear. What incentive do they have to settle? 

[GeeGolly]

1 hour ago, Zella said:

If the Duggar parents hadn't done robocalls about trans people being predators in bathrooms, nobody likely would have tipped off InTouch that there was a police report that showed how hypocritical they were. Their parents are the ones, to my mind, who created this situation, out of their own hubris and selfishness, not the officials who were just doing their job. 

I get what you're saying but personally I have a problem with this.

Freedom of speech is not free of consequences but if a tabloid is going to cosign a retaliation, do it to the person, in this case, Michelle, and not others. I'm sure they could have snooped out something else aimed more specifically at Michelle, or JB and Michelle.

I'm thinking they could have found pictures of her knees, or blanket training stories to get back at her.

The pen is mightier than the sword and those wielding the pen need to wield it responsibly. 

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I get what you're saying but personally I have a problem with this.

Freedom of speech is not free of consequences but if a tabloid is going to cosign a retaliation, do it to the person, in this case, Michelle, and not others. I'm sure they could have snooped out something else aimed more specifically at Michelle, or JB and Michelle.

I'm thinking they could have found pictures of her knees, or blanket training stories to get back at her.

The pen is mightier than the sword and those wielding the pen need to wield it responsibly. 

None of those other stories (her knee, etc) would’ve brought down the show and JB.  It’s truly awful that exposing the daughters’ abuse came out and they absolutely should get therapy, but exposing their dangerous facade is still more important imo. 
 
and whether they need therapy because they still have trauma over the abuse, AND/OR trauma related to the abuse being made public, why haven’t they gotten any by now (maybe Jill has)? Is going to therapy contingent on winning this case and having the taxpayers pay for the therapy? If so, their claims of trauma don’t feel very honest to me. And I think JB has insisted that they don’t want payment for any lost wages due to the original show being canceled because JB REALLY doesn’t want that amount to be estimated. That would mean exposing exactly how much each kid’s share of the show money was, and that’s the last thing JB wants to come out. Because if the daughters were paid, what’s stop any of the other kids from demanding their fair share, someday?

[Zella]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I get what you're saying but personally I have a problem with this.

Freedom of speech is not free of consequences but if a tabloid is going to cosign a retaliation, do it to the person, in this case, Michelle, and not others. I'm sure they could have snooped out something else aimed more specifically at Michelle, or JB and Michelle.

I'm thinking they could have found pictures of her knees, or blanket training stories to get back at her.

The pen is mightier than the sword and those wielding the pen need to wield it responsibly. 

Yes I understand completely but that's not on the officials who are being sued. The tabloid should and could have shown more discretion.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Zella

[GeeGolly]

22 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

None of those other stories (her knee, etc) would’ve brought down the show and JB.  It’s truly awful that exposing the daughters’ abuse came out and they absolutely should get therapy, but exposing their dangerous facade is still more important imo. 
 
and whether they need therapy because they still have trauma over the abuse, AND/OR trauma related to the abuse being made public, why haven’t they gotten any by now (maybe Jill has)? Is going to therapy contingent on winning this case and having the taxpayers pay for the therapy? If so, their claims of trauma don’t feel very honest to me. And I think JB has insisted that they don’t want payment for any lost wages due to the original show being canceled because JB REALLY doesn’t want that amount to be estimated. That would mean exposing exactly how much each kid’s share of the show money was, and that’s the last thing JB wants to come out. Because if the daughters were paid, what’s stop any of the other kids from demanding their fair share, someday?

I think Michelle beating crawling infants would have gotten the same results. 

[GeeGolly]

7 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yes I understand completely but that's not on the officials who are being sued. The tabloid should and could have shown more discretion.

Oh yes, I didn't mean to imply it was.

I was referring to blaming Michelle's robo call for it happening in the first place. It was a complete shit-show storm that made the redactions even necessary, from beginning to end, including InTouch's shady 'journalism'.

[Zella]

6 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Oh yes, I didn't mean to imply it was.

I was referring to blaming Michelle's robo call for it happening in the first place. It was a complete shit-show storm that made the redactions even necessary, from beginning to end, including InTouch's shady 'journalism'.

I mentioned it because my understanding is that the robocall is in fact what directly triggered the tip to In touch. I could be mistaken on that, but if that is the case, then it was Michelle's actions that triggered the report being released because I doubt they would have known to request the police report without that local tip from someone who was pissed at the family's hypocrisy.

I was living in Fayetteville when Michelle did the robocalls and to say they pissed off the locals on that one is the understatement of understatements. I remember one of my milder mannered classmates getting one and going off about that hateful bitch having the audacity to call his phone when he was recounting it to us. 

[Cinnabon]

19 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I think Michelle beating crawling infants would have gotten the same results. 

Weren’t  the blanket training stories already out there though? Lots of people knew and that never affected the show.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Zella said:

I mentioned it because my understanding is that the robocall is in fact what directly triggered the tip to In touch. I could be mistaken on that, but if that is the case, then it was Michelle's actions that triggered the report being released because I doubt they would have known to request the police report without that local tip from someone who was pissed at the family's hypocrisy.

I was living in Fayetteville when Michelle did the robocalls and to say they pissed off the locals on that one is the understatement of understatements. I remember one of my milder mannered classmates getting one and going off about that hateful bitch having the audacity to call his phone when he was recounting it to us. 

Yes, I believe it was a gay couple from the area that tipped them off. But, I stand by what I said, the sisters did not make the robo call. That's some hell of a lot of collateral damage in my opinion.

[Cinnabon]

13 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Oh yes, I didn't mean to imply it was.

I was referring to blaming Michelle's robo call for it happening in the first place. It was a complete shit-show storm that made the redactions even necessary, from beginning to end, including InTouch's shady 'journalism'.

I guess it depends on how damaging you feel the show was, in whitewashing their abhorrent, hateful beliefs. The ends justify the means here, for me. And again, OF COURSE I feel for the daughters and they all deserve therapy. And should have been getting it already.

[GeeGolly]

1 minute ago, Cinnabon said:

Weren’t  the blanket training stories already out there though? Lots of people knew and that never affected the show.

In the same way the Josh stories were out there. Lots of folks knew the real story there, but it wasn't until the rumors were confirmed that anything was done about it.

I think confirming the Pearl Method was being used would have gotten a lot of traction that TLC couldn't have ignored.

[Zella]

7 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Yes, I believe it was a gay couple from the area that tipped them off. But, I stand by what I said, the sisters did not make the robo call. That's some hell of a lot of collateral damage in my opinion.

Oh yes I agree the sisters didn't make the call and were collateral damage, and it isn't fair to them at all. I just feel like the lawsuit against the officials is misguided and placing blame away from where it should rest, which could include the tabloid and the tipsters but also, in my opinion, the parents. 

Edited to add: and I think it is more of a moral issue than a legal one. Was it ethical to release it is quite different from was it legal.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Zella

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

I guess it depends on how damaging you feel the show was, in whitewashing their abhorrent, hateful beliefs. The ends justify the means here, for me. And again, OF COURSE I feel for the daughters and they all deserve therapy. And should have been getting it already.

I actually don't think the show was whitewashed all that much. The Duggars talked openly about patriarchy, including a dad owning his daughters' purity, training up children to obey, being anti reproductive choice, modesty, stereotypical old school gender roles, and having no trust of secular beings.

I really don't understand how anyone could have watched the show and not thought the Duggars were fringe whackadoodles. 

And, IMO, its not a given that any or all of the sisters need therapy.

[Cinnabon]

11 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I actually don't think the show was whitewashed all that much. The Duggars talked openly about patriarchy, including a dad owning his daughters' purity, training up children to obey, being anti reproductive choice, modesty, stereotypical old school gender roles, and having no trust of secular beings.

I really don't understand how anyone could have watched the show and not thought the Duggars were fringe whackadoodles. 

And, IMO, its not a given that any or all of the sisters need therapy.

I agree that all may not need therapy, but that’s not what they’re saying to the judge in this case.  They’re saying that they aren’t seeking repayment for any “lost income,” but only for a lifelong therapy plan. 
 

The girls' attorney, Steven Bledose, told their judge Timothy Brooks: "We’re not going to seek any damages for lost wages, lost past earnings or lost future earnings.

He continued: "We want a life care plan involving the cost of therapeutic intervention in these four women’s lives over a period of time to address the emotional issues that are arisen from this nationwide disclosure since they’re public figures. 
 

Duggar sisters admit to needing ‘lifelong therapy plan’ over brother Josh’s molestation scandal in lawsuit against cops

https://www.the-sun.com/entertainment/4422567/counting-on-duggar-sisters-lawsuit-lifelong-therapy-arkansas-police/amp/

 

 

 

 

[Cinnabon]

31 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I actually don't think the show was whitewashed all that much. The Duggars talked openly about patriarchy, including a dad owning his daughters' purity, training up children to obey, being anti reproductive choice, modesty, stereotypical old school gender roles, and having no trust of secular beings.

I really don't understand how anyone could have watched the show and not thought the Duggars were fringe whackadoodles. 

And, IMO, its not a given that any or all of the sisters need therapy.

this article says it better than I could.
Josh Duggar’s Shame and Ours Why did America fall in love with a family of extremists?

[Rootbeer]

2 hours ago, GeeGolly said:

I get what you're saying but personally I have a problem with this.

Freedom of speech is not free of consequences but if a tabloid is going to cosign a retaliation, do it to the person, in this case, Michelle, and not others. I'm sure they could have snooped out something else aimed more specifically at Michelle, or JB and Michelle.

I'm thinking they could have found pictures of her knees, or blanket training stories to get back at her.

The pen is mightier than the sword and those wielding the pen need to wield it responsibly. 

I get that, but do we know that the people who tipped off the tabloids actually knew what the redactions would be and that it would clearly identify 4 of the girls as having been molested by their brother?  Perhaps the people who blew the whistle thought that it would show that JB and M covered up their son's crimes but didn't realize that it would allow the public to know exactly who 4 of the 5 victims were.  Perhaps they might not have told In Touch about it if they'd realized that the victims were going to be identified.  Of course, they're not defendants in the suit and neither is In Touch.  Instead, it's a couple of low paid public officials who obeyed the letter of the law, a poor law, it turns out.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Rootbeer

[Churchhoney]

10 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

this article says it better than I could.
Josh Duggar’s Shame and Ours Why did America fall in love with a family of extremists?

Thanks. What a great article. Somebody writes the actual stark truth about the horror of the Duggs' antediluvian mean-spirited shit being whitewashed, presented and accepted as "family entertainment." For years and years.  

Edited January 8, 2022 by Churchhoney

[Rootbeer]

As far as the tipsters being angered by the robocall and choosing the Josh molestation story to give to the press, a couple of things: 1. The entire purpose of the robocall was for Michelle to spread the lie that transgendered people are child molesters and would be attacking children in public bathrooms.  Meanwhile, Michelle knew for a fact that there was a child molester in her own family, one who had assaulted multiple young girls, and, yet, she and her husband protected that criminal at the expense of the victims.  So, Michelle's crusade where she pretended to be such an advocate for kids and fighting against child molestation, was complete and utter BS to hide her hateful religious beliefs.  2.  The whistle blowers obviously knew not only about the molestations, but also were aware that the Duggars themselves reported it to the police and there was a written, reliable record of the assaults from the entire Duggar family.  There just wasn't the obvious connection and verifiable documentation available as to the use of the Pearl Method.

I also seem to recall that the reason that the records were not automatically sealed was because the Duggars, while filing the report, made it clear that the incidents were in the past, had been successfully handled and therefore, none of the girls were going to cooperate in any prosecution.  Because of that, the case never made it to juvenile court where the records would've been sealed.  In addition, we also know that the Duggars could've made a request on behalf of the victims that the report be destroyed, but, apparentlly either because they thought they were in the clear or because they really didn't spend much time thinking about the effects of the story becoming public on their daughters; they never bothered to do this until after the horse was out of the barn.  I would think that most parents involved in such a situation, would've requested the records be destroyed as soon as possible and followed up to be sure it was done.  Not JB and M.

[Zella]

31 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

Instead, it's a couple of low paid public officials who obeyed the letter of the law, a poor law, it turns out.

Yeah I feel like a campaign/activism to revise/change the law would make more sense than suing the officials and incorrectly claiming what they did was illegal and malicious. 

5 minutes ago, Rootbeer said:

As far as the tipsters being angered by the robocall and choosing the Josh molestation story to give to the press, a couple of things: 1. The entire purpose of the robocall was for Michelle to spread the lie that transgendered people are child molesters and would be attacking children in public bathrooms.  Meanwhile, Michelle knew for a fact that there was a child molester in her own family, one who had assaulted multiple young girls, and, yet, she and her husband protected that criminal at the expense of the victims.  So, Michelle's crusade where she pretended to be such an advocate for kids and fighting against child molestation, was complete and utter BS to hide her hateful religious beliefs.  2.  The whistle blowers obviously knew not only about the molestations, but also were aware that the Duggars themselves reported it to the police and there was a written, reliable record of the assaults from the entire Duggar family.  There just wasn't the obvious connection and verifiable documentation available as to the use of the Pearl Method.

I also seem to recall that the reason that the records were not automatically sealed was because the Duggars, while filing the report, made it clear that the incidents were in the past, had been successfully handled and therefore, none of the girls were going to cooperate in any prosecution.  Because of that, the case never made it to juvenile court where the records would've been sealed.  In addition, we also know that the Duggars could've made a request on behalf of the victims that the report be destroyed, but, apparentlly either because they thought they were in the clear or because they really didn't spend much time thinking about the effects of the story becoming public on their daughters; they never bothered to do this until after the horse was out of the barn.  I would think that most parents involved in such a situation, would've requested the records be destroyed as soon as possible and followed up to be sure it was done.  Not JB and M.

That police report was not from the Duggars reporting anything. That was fallout from the Oprah interview being cancelled and someone else reporting them to police. When the Duggars claim they reported it to police, I believe they are referencing the off-the-books chat Josh had with the state trooper who ended up being a pervert himself. As far as I know, there is no police report stemming from them voluntarily reporting anything. Things weren't sealed because it was reported after the statue of limitations had expired, if I'm not mistaken, and never advanced beyond that cursory report. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Zella

[Cinnabon]

32 minutes ago, Zella said:

Yeah I feel like a campaign/activism to revise/change the law would make more sense than suing the officials and incorrectly claiming what they did was illegal and malicious. 

I honestly don’t think JB cares about any other victims being exposed by inadequate redactions. He also doesn’t care if any of his daughters get the lifelong therapy he’s claiming they need so much . In fact, I bet he doesn’t want any of them to get therapy, because that would mean they would examine the whole situation more closely. He absolutely doesn’t want them to do that. He’s a lying hypocrite in all things. 

Edited January 9, 2022 by Cinnabon

[lascuba]

1 hour ago, GeeGolly said:

I actually don't think the show was whitewashed all that much. The Duggars talked openly about patriarchy, including a dad owning his daughters' purity, training up children to obey, being anti reproductive choice, modesty, stereotypical old school gender roles, and having no trust of secular beings.

I really don't understand how anyone could have watched the show and not thought the Duggars were fringe whackadoodles. 

And, IMO, its not a given that any or all of the sisters need therapy.

While they show wasn't technically whitewashed, I'd argue that providing an unchallenged  platform has the same result. Nothing was hidden, but the editing deliberately made them look like a loving, harmless family, which was a way to say that their beliefs are harmless. 

1 hour ago, Zella said:

Oh yes I agree the sisters didn't make the call and were collateral damage, and it isn't fair to them at all. I just feel like the lawsuit against the officials is misguided and placing blame away from where it should rest, which could include the tabloid and the tipsters but also, in my opinion, the parents. 

Edited to add: and I think it is more of a moral issue than a legal one. Was it ethical to release it is quite different from was it legal.

The tipster is a private citizen who spread information that was widely known in the community to an organization that could do something with it. I don't think she did anything immoral in calling In Touch. Being collateral damage sucks, but I don't think the tipster had any responsibility to worry about that. It's not any of the Duggars care about the far reaching damage caused by they beliefs they make every effort to spread. Quite the opposite, actually. 

[lascuba]

11 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

I honestly don’t think JB cares about any other victims being exposed by inadequate redactions. He also doesn’t care if any of his daughters get the lifelong therapy he’s claiming they need so much . In fact, I bet he doesn’t want any of them to get therapy, because that would mean they would examine the whole situation more closely. He absolutely don’t want them to do that. He’s a lying hypocrite in all things. 

Yeah, JB and Michelle would have been equally upset if the report had been so well redacted that it was impossible to tell who Josh had abused. That their daughters were exposed gives their outrage some moral legitimacy, but that's never been their main concern. 

[GeeGolly]

45 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

this article says it better than I could.
Josh Duggar’s Shame and Ours Why did America fall in love with a family of extremists?

Good article, but its the author's opinion, which is different from mine.

There's no denying the things the Duggars said on their show, on the Today show, on their blog and in other articles and other interviews.

First their anti-choice feelings were woven into every single episode, some more blatant than others, but still, in every single episode. The Bible and God were also in almost every episode.

• They talked excessively about accountability partners.
• They talked excessively about purity, modesty, temptations, sex, etc.
• Did I mention God, Jesus and the Bible?
• They oppressed, marginalized and suppressed women in every episode.
• All their views were extreme.
• They went on family missions together.
• They went to religious conferences, camps and revivals.

Never mind dressing differently, talking differently and educating their children differently. How these things scream happy, perfect, wholesome family is beyond me. It screams religious zealots to me.

I sometimes feel like I was watching a different show than others.

[crazy8s]

10 minutes ago, Cinnabon said:

I honestly don’t think JB cares about any other victims being exposed by inadequate redactions. He also doesn’t care if any of his daughters get the lifelong therapy he’s claiming they need so much . In fact, I bet he doesn’t want any of them to get therapy, because that would mean they would examine the whole situation more closely. He absolutely don’t want them to do that. He’s a lying hypocrite in all things. 

agree - it's just a way JB and lawyers thought up to try and get some substantial money, without JB disclosing any of the duggar financial stuff.  I highly doubt the girls would use any money for therapy. Most likely any money would go straight in to the JB black hole of financial shenanigans, just like all the show money. Then Derick would have a field day announcing that once again JB stole the girls' money.

[Zella]

4 minutes ago, lascuba said:

 

The tipster is a private citizen who spread information that was widely known in the community to an organization that could do something with it. I don't think she did anything immoral in calling In Touch. Being collateral damage sucks, but I don't think the tipster had any responsibility to worry about that. It's not any of the Duggars care about the far reaching damage caused by they beliefs they make every effort to spread. Quite the opposite, actually. 

I don't disagree with you. My point was simply that I think the ethical dilemmas of the case are more complicated than the legal situation. I think the best way for it to have been handled would have been for In Touch to do some additional redactions, so the victims wouldn't have been so readily identified. 

[Cinnabon]

7 minutes ago, lascuba said:

It's not any of the Duggars care about the far reaching damage caused by they beliefs they make every effort to spread. Quite the opposite, actually. 

THIS. They continue to try and whitewash their beliefs and dupe the public by posting pictures of their cute kids, and becoming more outwardly “normal.” 

[GeeGolly]

3 minutes ago, Zella said:

I don't disagree with you. My point was simply that I think the ethical dilemmas of the case are more complicated than the legal situation. I think the best way for it to have been handled would have been for In Touch to do some additional redactions, so the victims wouldn't have been so readily identified. 

Perfectly said!

And I'll add, or InTouch could have tried to "out" the Duggars in another way.

[Cinnabon]

5 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

 

 

6 minutes ago, crazy8s said:

agree - it's just a way JB and lawyers thought up to try and get some substantial money, without JB disclosing any of the duggar financial stuff.  I highly doubt the girls would use any money for therapy. Most likely any money would go straight in to the JB black hole of financial shenanigans, just like all the show money. Then Derick would have a field day announcing that once again JB stole the girls' money.

And Derick would be absolutely right . 

[lascuba]

4 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

Good article, but its the author's opinion, which is different from mine.

There's no denying the things the Duggars said on their show, on the Today show, on their blog and in other articles and other interviews.

First their anti-choice feelings were woven into every single episode, some more blatant than others, but still, in every single episode. The Bible and God were also in almost every episode.

• They talked excessively about accountability partners.
• They talked excessively about purity, modesty, temptations, sex, etc.
• Did I mention God, Jesus and the Bible?
• They oppressed, marginalized and suppressed women in every episode.
• All their views were extreme.
• They went on family missions together.
• They went to religious conferences, camps and revivals.

Never mind dressing differently, talking differently and educating their children differently. How these things scream happy, perfect, wholesome family is beyond me. It screams religious zealots to me.

I sometimes feel like I was watching a different show than others.

Same, but I'm a big believer in the tolerance paradox. Most people in this predominantly Christian country have a lot of tolerance for extreme behavior in the name of Christianity as long as it's not inconveniencing them. 

4 minutes ago, crazy8s said:

agree - it's just a way JB and lawyers thought up to try and get some substantial money, without JB disclosing any of the duggar financial stuff.  I highly doubt the girls would use any money for therapy. Most likely any money would go straight in to the JB black hole of financial shenanigans, just like all the show money. Then Derick would have a field day announcing that once again JB stole the girls' money.

It would be hilarious if they win their suit, but the judge rules that the money be put in a trust that can only be used for licenses therapists. I have no idea if that's even a thing, legally, but this is the only scenario where I would applaud a Duggar win. 

3 minutes ago, Zella said:

I don't disagree with you. My point was simply that I think the ethical dilemmas of the case are more complicated than the legal situation. I think the best way for it to have been handled would have been for In Touch to do some additional redactions, so the victims wouldn't have been so readily identified. 

I see what you're saying, but I'm not sure In Touch had that responsibility. They published redacted documents they obtained legally. Insofar as it makes any sense for the sisters to sue anyone, I'd say suing the city is the only logical avenue. 

[Zella]

I am thinking this admission they were all paid so little it wasn't worth pursuing lost wages also squashes all the speculation that Jinger and Jeremy had a separate contract, which I never believed anyway. 

1 minute ago, lascuba said:

I'd say suing the city is the only logical avenue. 

Except for the fact that they didn't do anything illegal any more than In Touch did. I just really don't think they have a viable lawsuit against anyone for this. 

[lascuba]

4 minutes ago, Zella said:

I am thinking this admission they were all paid so little it wasn't worth pursuing lost wages also squashes all the speculation that Jinger and Jeremy had a separate contract, which I never believed anyway. 

Except for the fact that they didn't do anything illegal any more than In Touch did. I just really don't think they have a viable lawsuit against anyone for this. 

I agree that no lawsuit over the release of the documents is valid, just that the city is the lease invalid option for them. Ultimately, it's their fame that made them identifiable. Among the few people in my life who would casually watch the show, not one of them could have guessed who the victims were. I'm the only person in my circle ridiculous enough to be that informed on this stupid family. I imagine that no one at In Touch could figure it out either, and didn't expect that anyone was that familiar with these Z-list celebrities. I mean, how many tries did it take before the Sun could correctly identify Jason in court?

[GeeGolly]

17 minutes ago, lascuba said:

Same, but I'm a big believer in the tolerance paradox. Most people in this predominantly Christian country have a lot of tolerance for extreme behavior in the name of Christianity as long as it's not inconveniencing them. 

That could possibly explain the Duggars, but can you explain the Kardashians to me? Are they whitewashed? Because I see who they really are, or more accurately, who they aren't, and I've never watched an episode. 😁

[Cinnabon]

40 minutes ago, lascuba said:

Same, but I'm a big believer in the tolerance paradox. Most people in this predominantly Christian country have a lot of tolerance for extreme behavior in the name of Christianity as long as it's not inconveniencing them. 

 

Exactly this . Substitute another religion there in place of Christianity and I’m certain many would be up in arms.  
 

the Duggars didn’t hide that they were Christian, but they did hide the extremist Gothard/IBLP angle. They didn’t show Meshelle using Gothard’s wisdom booklets to “homeschool” the kids. They hid all that on purpose, and TLC allowed them to hide it. 
 
What makes them different from many other Christians and groups like the Amish and even Scientologists? The Amish and Scientologists have crazy beliefs, but they have no interest in forcing them on me (if they could).  

 

Edited January 9, 2022 by Cinnabon