S11.E09: O Brother Where Art Thou?

[Tara Ariano]

Amara unleashes her power on local townspeople and issues a shocking challenge. Dean tries to better understand the hold Amara has on him, while Sam and Crowley come up with a plan that could have disastrous consequences.

[catrox14]

 

 

 

 

 

Unlesss.....somewhere........

 

[SueB]

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[Demented Daisy]

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Wait... what?  ;-)

[catrox14]

In for the assist ! :) Here you go, Sue B :)

 

Edited December 8, 2015 by catrox14

[Mick Lady]

Ah, catrox! I didn't get to give you your count down, but you never fail us!

 

Thank you My Lady! You are Supernatural!

[SueB]

Thanks Catrox!

Edited December 9, 2015 by SueB

[Demented Daisy]

Dammit.  I just realized I drank my last beer last night.  I probably could have used it tonight.  

[placate]

How did Michael and Adam get out of the cage?

[Demented Daisy]

How could they have gone this entire episode without even mentioning Castiel?  And where the hell is Michael?  Fail, show.  Huge fail.

[Jediknight]

The Darkness can't be resisted?  She's not Eve Torres, Brooklyn Decker, Kate Beckinsale or Natalie Portman, she can be resisted.

 

Sam is kind of an idiot, he should have known something was up.  Hopefully Rowena was going to get her Mega Coven or Michael to help get Sam out.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Jediknight

[Demented Daisy]

The Darkness can't be resisted?  She's not Eve Torres, Brooklyn Decker, Kate Beckinsale or Natalie Portman, she can be resisted.

 

Sam is kind of an idiot, he should have known something was up.  Hopefully Rowena was going to get her Mega Coven or Michael to help get Sam out.

 

Oh, I'm pretty sure Rowena's plan from the moment she heard Lucifer's name was to get him out of the cage.

[chick binewski]

Was it just me or did Jared look like he was actively rejecting the script while he was reciting his lines? All I could think of was "The French Mistake"...'If there is a key, then there has to be a lock'.

 

No matter. Whatever those coming attractions were made up for the entire episode. "Mom! I got a Sam!"

[catrox14]

I'm gonna have to re-watch this later...but right now I'm just left with  WTF was that??

 

It's just like everyone here figured that the visions were all from Lucifer. Cheers to the board for calling that. And fuck BuckLemming for making both Sam and Dean idiots for never ONCE thinking that was the case. Like not even a fucking thought bubble about it. Ugh. C'mon.  I don't fucking get it. There better be a damn payoff for that stupidity.  

 

I'm not really impressed with the actress playing Amara. Never mind that I hate the Dean/Amara thing but it would have been more interesting with a better actress.  I'm glad that Dean tried to kill her, but not one bit of that made any sense. Like I don't understand why she zapped him into the middle of nowhere for what reason? To prove her power? To fight in a pretty spot....like why did she go to a playground to begin with? So like did she try to take his soul but couldn't or it wasn't there or what was that about? Was it just a stupid fake out for the kiss that we all knew was coming anyway? 

 

Was that  knife that  the one left behind by the chick that was killing the Zanna? Was the witch that gave it to her Rowena??

 

Where the fuck is Michael? Why wasn't he even talked about? If there was a crack in the cage, did Michael get out?

 

Correct me if I'm wrong but God didn't put Lucifer in the Cage. That was Sam (and Dean) wasn't it?? Have I lost my mind about that point? God didn't even show up for that fight. ETA: I mean God put Lucifer in the Cage the first time but not the second time when he didn't show up for the fight.

 

 

Can't believe they had a midseason finale without Cas or even a damn mention of him.

 

Also where was the music cue Jensen was talking about?

 

So did Rowena know more than we thought she did? I'm thinking yes she did.

 

I WANT to like the episode....but man I'm gonna have to rewatch...but I sure feel like a bunch of canon just went into the shitter. Am I wrong?

Edited December 10, 2015 by catrox14

[2Old2BAFangirl]

I need to watch again too because that was one disappointing episode!

Sam trapped in the literal cage with Lucifer - again?! Blech!

Amara and Dean was not only bad, it was boring!! The only thought I had after their whole exchange was "Of course you want to become one with Dean!! Get in freakin' line, sister!"

I hope it's better the second time around because I've never been so bored by a mid season finale as I was tonight.

Well, at least Dean was as pretty as always.

[Wynne88]

The music cues for the scenes in hell sounded like something out Spartacus or something when the armies come marching in.  Too heavy handed for me (and I'm usually oblivious to such things).  Just out of curiousity, what happened to the rings that Sam used to open a gate into the cage in Swan Song?

[Demented Daisy]

I'm not sure they're even really trying anymore.  No reason given for Castiel not being around or Michael not being in the cage.  They ignored those things and (I assume) are expecting us to, too.

 

I once said that I think that Carver and Co. expect us (the fans) to love the show so much that we're not going to question what they give us.  That we will love unconditionally, so it doesn't matter if they give us a story full of holes.  That we'll be so distracted by the pretty -- or the shock value -- that we won't notice what's missing.

 

I don't know, maybe they're right.  Maybe we, here at PTV, are the anomalies.  It's too depressing to think about.

 

ETA  I want to wonder if that bird thing from the season premiere was Michael escaping from the cage.  But I'm not sure if they're capable of planning that far ahead for the "cage weakening" story.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Demented Daisy

[catrox14]

[snip] Just out of curiousity, what happened to the rings that Sam used to open a gate into the cage in Swan Song?

 

This is a great question that we need answered for sure. Last I knew Dean had them....

[Tippi Blevins]

Was there some particular reason why Sam couldn't wait a while until he got in touch with Dean before talking to Lucifer? Was there only a five minute window of opportunity that would be lost forever?

 

They couldn't have asked Cas to poke around in Sam's noggin a bit? "Say, does it feel like God visions in there or what?" Did they not want to interrupt whatever TV marathon he was enjoying?

 

And why were they so casual about using the Book of the Damned again?! 

[Hana Chan]

Except for an abundance of Winchester pretty of both flavors to enjoys and the return of Luci, this ep was a whole lot of meh. The talk between Amara and Dean was endless and boring and went absolutely nowhere. Instead of getting a primordial being with deep and profound motivations, she comes across like the bitchy ex-wife. And I kept getting distracted by her awkward cleavage. It was hard to take her seriously, with her whiney complaints about God ignoring her and her boobs on prominent display all the time. And the bond between her and Dean was about as compelling as a stale bagel.

 

I don't think it was any question that Sam going down to the cage was a monumentally bad idea and that was very apparent very quickly. Still... I do enjoy me some Luci and he was entertaining as always so at least their scenes weren't putting me to sleep.

 

Not sure where the season is going to go after this, but the promo was a hoot.

[Frost]

 

How could they have gone this entire episode without even mentioning Castiel?  And where the hell is Michael?  Fail, show.  Huge fail.

Exactly!  I shouted out "where's Michael?" so often my throat is sore.  The cage stuff made no sense whatsoever.  I have to admit, it looked cool.  That first shot where Lucifer's eyes were glowing in the dim interior of the cage was really well done.  The torch lit pathway was downright cheesy though.

 

It was odd that Amara tried to suck out Dean's soul and couldn't.  I hope they're not implying that he doesn't have one.  I was proud of Dean both for trying to understand Amara and also for trying to kill her once he was clear on her plan for humanity.  I liked that he was being thoughtful about Amara.  As opposed to Sam's trip through Hell.  Trusting Rowena?  If Sam and Crowley can't read the book and they've been double crossed and/or out witted by Rowena several times before, why would they be so block headed?  Surely with the codex someone else could translate the Book of the Damned.  Castiel maybe?  Or perhaps he could find someone else in the whole entire world.  How about un-hamstering Rowena's old boss?

 

I like the actress playing adult Amara.  I thought her scenes in the church were good.  Although I still hate the whole "God has a sister" storyline (because I think it's stupid stupid stupid), I thought her searching for God because she's so hurt and angry with him was well played.

[AwesomO4000]

Sam is kind of an idiot, he should have known something was up.  Hopefully Rowena was going to get her Mega Coven or Michael to help get Sam out.

 

Yeah, Carver seemed to have forgotten that Sam is supposed to be smart. He generally makes Sam an idiot.

 

And I suspect that Rowena's plan was for the warding to fail. The way she was acting towards Crowley's question, she had a pretty good idea what was going to happen.

 

So is Amara / The Smog Monster gone / dead / whatever? That was it?

 

And I supose now Dean is going to have to go save Sam... again. I hope at least Sam holds out and soesn't say "yes," because if he does say "yes", Carver's assassination of Sam will be complete, and I finally will be done with this show.

 

It's just like everyone here figured that the visions were all from Lucifer. Cheers to the board for calling that. And fuck BuckLemming for making both Sam and Dean idiots for never ONCE thinking that was the case. Like not even a fucking thought bubble about it. Ugh. C'mon.  I don't fucking get it. There better be a damn payoff for that stupidity.

 

I agree - that Dean didn't think of it either was almost as bad as Sam not thinking of it. It was like Carver decided it was going to be some huge reveal, so therefor neither Sam or Dean thought of it... Except that I knew that it was Lucifer after the first episode, so instead Sam looks stupid... and egotistical. At least Dean only looks mildly stupid. I so hate it when I'm right with this show.

 

Was that  knife that  the one left behind by the chick that was killing the Zanna? Was the witch that gave it to her Rowena??

 

Why would Dean use that? It wasn't the demon knife?

 

And I kept getting distracted by her awkward cleavage. It was hard to take her seriously, with her whiney complaints about God ignoring her and her boobs on prominent display all the time.

 

Oh, good. I thought it was just me.

 

 

The only thing that I didn't expect was Sam getting stuck in the cage again... probably because he had to be stupid for it to happen. And I was one who didn't think it was actually that stupid for Sam to go down to the cage... it was the trusting Rowena again that made it stupid... And the fact that they made it maybe entirly moot? Really? So Sam and Dean didn't have to take care of Amara? But I thought someone said that they were the ones that had to do it, or did I remember that wrongly?

 

Dammit show! Stop making Sam (and Dean) idiots!! It's not fun for me when the secondary characters are the smart ones and minor characters save the day. And this season sarted out so well for me, too.

 

*Le Sigh*

[Triskan]

My theory for the absence of Michael and Adam is that Rowena's spell was meant just to make Lucifer materially appear in front of them.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Triskan

[catrox14]

 

It was odd that Amara tried to suck out Dean's soul and couldn't.  I hope they're not implying that he doesn't have one.

 

 

It wouldn't be the first time, considering that was implied by Famine or that he was already dead inside. I thought she might have taken his soul from the beginning but now I just don't know.

[catrox14]

 

Why would Dean use that? It wasn't the demon knife?

 

Maybe Dean figured it was useless against her? To me it looked bigger and shinier than the demon knife and it looked like it didn't have the sigils that the demon knife has. I'll actually be really pissed off it was was the demon knife :(.

[catrox14]

My theory for the absence of Lucifer and Adam is that Rowena's spell was meant just to make Lucifer materially appear in front of them.

 

So you're saying that wasn't THE actual Cage but more like a hologram or something?

[SueB]

Surprise! I loved it!  My only issue was the lack of Cas. It's practically criminal to not use him or at least EXPLAIN why he's not there.  

 

But onto the good stuff (so look... if you hate this episode, this write-up is not for you...also first thoughts only, I have to rewatch about 10 times for final thoughts).

 

Loved:

- That Dean tried to stab Amara. That he ACTUALLY was able to do that.  Loved the effect of the knife shattering.  Note: it was just a normal big blade versus anything special as far as I could tell.

- That the Angels tried to make a stand.  It may have been completely pointless (just like I think Amara is going to kick the rest of the Angel's collective 'smiting' assess) but I appreciate the rank and file trying to do the right thing.

- That Dean flat out asked her what she wants and she didn't hold back.  I have no freaking clue what "everything" means but since she said "bliss" again, I'm going with she's anti-free-will and she intends to turn God's creations into her mind-controlled bliss monkeys.  

- That the kiss actually started out as a soul-suck maneuver. I think she COULDN'T suck his soul and then went for the kiss.  I'm not sure why he's immune (unless God is actually helping HIM out or, as catrox speculates, his soul is already in absentia).

- That kiss was hot IMO.  Yes, it's got 1000% CONSENT issues, but it was still pretty.  More importantly, I'm glad that Dean flat out turned her down for this "one-ness".  So, while I can see why she thinks this is going to happen, I'm glad he's not buying what she's selling.

- Rowena and Crowley just kibitzing while Sam chats up Lucifer.  

- Rowena being a Lucifer fangirl.  She's TOTALLY in cahoots with him. In fact I suspect she let herself be caught to aid in Lucifer's plan.  If he can communicate with Sam, why not Rowena as well?? He's a rock star to her.

- The "neutral" field plan.  That was a cage-substitute. The real Cage has different walls.  This was a different Cage in the Limbo part of hell (new canon there) that Rowena transferred him too. 

- SAM SAID NO!!!!!  Yes.  At freaking last.  He said No to Lucifer.

- JP's tear at the end.  Poor Sam.  One again he's been played. He must feel so freaking abandoned by God.  

- EPIC preview with Crowley in Christmas PJ's and Rowena with a Red Nose. I'm sure it's a Lucifer torture activity in the cage with Sam but I want a Funko doll of PJ Crowley.

 

NOPE

- No Cas or explanation of his whereabouts.  That's pissing me off.  

- The holy rollers. Very cardboard.

- Rapey vibe.  Amara is kissing Dean and telling them they are going to be together and become one. Lucifer asks Sam if they are going to share a bunk.  Seriously BL... what is it with you and sexual violence against the boys?  Isn't there some tags you can use over at the fanfic sites and put that stuff there?  If you are going for 'rape as a metaphor for loss of will', it's not working. It's coming across as salacious.  But I agree with Tippi... at least there were no dogs implied.

- Zip logic for moving so quickly without Dean.  I could drive a bus thru that plothole and get lost forever.

 

 

 

 

That's my short thoughts. I'll have more as they come up.

[Ferniesfreckles]

You would think the guys would know to answer each other's phone calls by now, Jesus.

Sister needed a more supportive dress. Talk about sag. It was distracting. Her hair early in the episode looked really damaged. The highlights looked great towards the end of the episode, though.

Poor Sammy, he so wanted to believe that God was communicating with him.

I thought Amara just paused before she kissed Dean. I didn't think she was trying to suck his soul out. Or maybe she was thinking about it but ultimately didn't.

I didn't think the episode was missing anything, All the useful players were there.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Ferniesfreckles

[catrox14]

 

You would think the guys would know to answer each other's phone calls by now, Jesus.

 

 I don't think Dean was able to answer that call because, conveniently, it came right when Amara was freaking out and Dean was COMPELLED to attend to Amara and not Sam. 

 

Surely that's not just a plot contrivance? Right? Maybe?

[Commando Cody]

On the positive side, Dean looked really good in this episode.

 

As for the rest, all I could think was Michael got out when the cage was damaged. I don't know. I was waiting for an explanation. 

 

I was so glad when Dean finally got rid of the Mark Of Cain. I guess it was a be careful of what you wish for moment because now we're stuck with this stupid Amara story. Their scenes together were so boring. I don't really like the actress and she really needed a different outfit.  Did we need to see that much cleavage? 

 

It was good to see Mark Pellegrino again. Not so good to see Crowley's mother. 

 

A better title for this episode would have been 'Oh Brother'. 

Edited December 10, 2015 by Commando Cody

[Ria]

Mark Pellegrino is always entertaining but otherwise WTF? So Sam and Dean have completely forgotten that the cage was built by God and the archangels and it was Gabriel who told them how to open and close it and they were the ones who retrapped Lucifer? So they go to Crowley for information and he has to tell them he doesn't have a key because God created the cage? The cage has nothing to do with hell

I'm also really tired of Rowena and these all powerful spells.

[ahrtee]

Just out of curiousity, what happened to the rings that Sam used to open a gate into the cage in Swan Song?

 

This is a great question that we need answered for sure. Last I knew Dean had them...

 

.

Dean gave Death's ring back in Appointment in Samarra.  I don't know what happened to it when Death died.   Since it was the "one ring," the others wouldn't work without it.

 

Lots of bad thoughts and yelling at the TV on this one, but pretty much everything has already been covered by others.  My only other comment (to the characters and us, too):  Who was it who said the definition of insanity (or stupidity) is to keep doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome?

[catrox14]

Mark Pellegrino is always entertaining but otherwise WTF? So Sam and Dean have completely forgotten that the cage was built by God and the archangels and it was Gabriel who told them how to open and close it and they were the ones who retrapped Lucifer? So they go to Crowley for information and he has to tell them he doesn't have a key because God created the cage? The cage has nothing to do with hell

I'm also really tired of Rowena and these all powerful spells.

 

See this is just more of LOLCANON CARVER...I just can't believe it's real. I guess I keep circling back to this being some kind of "OTHER" experience than reality because so much is wrong here and the only way it makes sense to me is that this like a long ass Zachariah kind of altered reality because otherwise....this is fucked.

 

Remember back when Cain said Lucifer was talking to his Abel trying to make him his pet...I'm wondering if we are going to loop back to that with the Mark of Cain. I wonder if Dean might take it on again to get Sam out of Lucifer's Cage. I mean shit that would the perfect time for a Knight of Hell to get his slaughter on, amirite??

[AwesomO4000]

Surprise! I loved it!  My only issue was the lack of Cas. It's practically criminal to not use him or at least EXPLAIN why he's not there.  

....

- Zip logic for moving so quickly without Dean.  I could drive a bus thru that plothole and get lost forever.

 

I didn't hate this... yet. It remains to be seen what happens. As I said, if Sam ultimatey says "yes" - especially if Amara is done already - then I will hate it.

 

I think all of the dead people was supposed to be the reasoning? It just didn't translate well, especially because Rowena was the one saying they had to do it now, and they should believe Rowena why?

 

Seriously BL... what is it with you and sexual violence against the boys?

 

That was mild compared to Ben Edlund's references. I love most of Ben's stuff, but there was no question after his episodes "Hello, Cruel World" and especially "Repo Man" what hapened to Sam in that regard.

 

The bunk sharing talk here was a call back to Edlund's' "You're my bunkmate, buddy." (followed by "You're my little bitch in every sense of the term.")

 

Weirdly I'm in the position of being disappointed either way. I'll feel awful for Sam if that happens to him again, but if they go the "funny torture" route - as the previews seem to be implying - they'll be throwing yet more canon out the window. Espeially since if this "anti-chamber" is still in hell, Sam is likely to be in the cage with Lucifer for a looong time from his perspective. Also he's going to be dead...

 

Which, now that I think about that, how in the hell are they going to deal with that? Sam is going to be dead - either via Lucifer's torture or he's gonna die of thirst or starve to death - so how they hell are they gonna keep the reapers from sending him to oblivion? This isn't soul Sam... It's Sam in his body... which is gonna die.

 

It's gonna be some pretty fancy footwork for the writers to get out of this one.

[SueB]

I presume that body functions don't ... function... in the cage.  At least that's what the wizard said.

[catrox14]

 

The bunk sharing talk here was a call back to Edlund's' "You're my bunkmate, buddy." (followed by "You're my little bitch in every sense of the term.")

 

The difference for me is the tone in which Edlund treated the consent issues. He used "darkly comic" lines to let us know how horrible, disgusting and frightening both Lucifer and Alistair were with Sam and Dean respectively.  I was always terrified with those scenes you described. I think it was never intended to be thought of as anything but horrifying and uncomfortable.  I just think Edlund had a bit more of a deft touch in that area (Wishful Thinking notwithstanding).

[AwesomO4000]

The difference for me is the tone in which Edlund treated the consent issues. He used "darkly comic" lines to let us know how horrible, disgusting and frightening both Lucifer and Alistair were with Sam and Dean respectively.  I was always terrified with those scenes you described. I think it was never intended to be thought of as anything but horrifying and uncomfortable.  I just think Edlund had a bit more of a deft touch in that area (Wishful Thinking notwithstanding).

 

Ah, got it. I agree. Edlund's lines weren't supposed to be funny, and they weren't. You were objecting to the too cavalierness of it in this episode - got it, and again I agree...

 

Except in this case, I have a bad feeling that they are going to go with the LOLcanon... literally, in that - based on the previews - they might try to make this "funny" which to me will not only diminish Sam's past cage experience, but it will contradict the tone of the flashes that Sam was getting earlier this season - which were horrifying and not "funny" at all.

 

And thinking on those flashes... I still can't get over that no one - Sam, Dean, Castiel - didn't think that those were from Lucifer.

 

Remember back when Cain said Lucifer was talking to his Abel trying to make him his pet...I'm wondering if we are going to loop back to that with the Mark of Cain. I wonder if Dean might take it on again to get Sam out of Lucifer's Cage. I mean shit that would the perfect time for a Knight of Hell to get his slaughter on, amirite??

 

Do. Not. Want.

 

It's not that I don't want something interesting for Dean. It's that I am sick to death of Sam having to be saved. All. The. Freaking.Time! And I'm sick of Sam the dupe, too, for that matter. I'm almost ready for Sam to just go "fuck it" and start killing everybody out of frustration, because he is NEVER right about anything. Ever.

 

I swear, I'm having fantasies of having Carver stuck in place for about an hour so I can just rant on his ass about what he's done to Sam's character. It would be so sweet.

Edited December 10, 2015 by AwesomO4000

[Zanne]

And I kept getting distracted by her awkward cleavage. It was hard to take her seriously, with her whiney complaints about God ignoring her and her boobs on prominent display all the time.

 

So much yes to this. Supernatural has some weird math where, in many cases, cleavage = evil. Then it got me thinking that it's the opposite for the bad guys since Crowley sold his soul for a bigger penis. Which then got me thinking about the gender dichotomy in which undersexualized men (small penis) are evil, whereas oversexualized women (cleavage) are the evil ones. Then I realized while that made sense to me and I found the message disturbing, I was way overthinking a crappy scene that had obviously driven my brain down any path but watching it.

 

Bullet point thoughts:

1. If neither Winchester pulls Adam out of the pile of shit they dropped him in, I will be pissed.

2. This Amara thing really is sounding more and more like Jasmine with every word out of her mouth.

3. Dean: "What is it exactly you want?" Amara: "Business appropriate attire." - conversation obviously left on cutting room floor

4. Dean, I am so disappointed in you tonight. - something Dean has never heard from a woman before and I'm sorry to be the first

5. So, Sam's still a moron? Good to know some things are forever.   

[Iguana]

OK so it took Lilith centuries of planning, thousands of demons, 66 broken seals, the breaking of the Righteous Man in Hell, and her own death to get Lucifer out of the cage the first time. But it takes Rowena a few hours with the right books to come up with a spell that can do it quite easily. Oooookaaaaaay, way to fuck with canon, show.

I can see how Sam might have could have convinced himself his visions were from God, because he wanted, needed, to believe it so very, very much. He was desperate for some kind of hope to cling to and refused to consider any alternative once he latched onto it. Not very wise, but totally in character. I always thought Sam had no real problem with being "special" or "chosen", just with being evil instead of good. I love the guy, but Sam is entirely egotistical enough to accept without much hesitation that God would single him out like that. But it's a fail on the show's part that Dean could be a doubter and say it wasn't God but not to suggest the visions were from Lucifer. I mean, it's a very obvious alternative explanation.

[AwesomO4000]

I can see how Sam might have could have convinced himself his visions were from God, because he wanted, needed, to believe it so very, very much. He was desperate for some kind of hope to cling to and refused to consider any alternative once he latched onto it. Not very wise, but totally in character. I always thought Sam had no real problem with being "special" or "chosen", just with being evil instead of good. I love the guy, but Sam is entirely egotistical enough to accept without much hesitation that God would single him out like that.

 

I had kind of hoped that Sam had grown past both of those things post season 5 and especially 7. In 5 Sam definitely seemed to think God couldn't care less, and season 7 Sam seemed quite a bit more humble after the cage. But I keep forgetting that Carver doesn't much pay attention to characterisation post season 4. And so once again, Sam must learn a lesson in humility, this time with a trip to the cage for some torture.

 

I can't wait for Dean's "I told you so's" when Sam finally gets out and/or Sam having to apologize for not listening to Dean. (*Sarcasm*)

[millennium]

Pretty awful episode, glaringly so coming on the heels of some good standalone episodes in previous weeks.    This show's greatest misstep (although the Leviathans run a close second) was to create the whole Crowley-sphere as an excuse to keep Castiel in play.  

 

All I could think during the Lucifer scene was, "Not this shit again."

 

But I like Rowena.   I would watch a show called "Rowena."

[smree]

I enjoyed this ep but do feel that they're setting up Dean as Amara V Sam as Lucifer. 

 

I really like the actress playing Amara and thought that all players were on point in this ep. Rowena fan girling Lucifer made me chuckle, I loved the way Jensen really showed all the conflicting emotions Dean was feeling when dealing with Amara, and Sam's tear at the end :( Even though we had all pretty much guessed it was Lucifer sending the visions to Sam, my heart broke for him as he so wants to believe in God.

 

I don't understand why people are asking about Michael not being in the cage as I had thought they made it clear that we weren't seeing/going to the actual cage but that Rowena was doing a spell to manifest Lucifer in a safer place.

[Omegamom]

Um. Unpopular opinion here: I liked it. Yeah, plot holes galore, but, still...

Amara has this weird thing going on with God. She wants to talk to him. Really wants to talk. Like, getting upset in the church. It's more of a spurned lover feeling to me, than angry and vengeful.

ABOUT THE PROMO: guys, the funny stuff is not going to be in the episode, I'll put money on it. They're being cutesy with the "your Christmas wish is to have this settled, hahaha, joke's on you, you have to wait for January 20, but here's some cuteness with all the villains."

Grumps and gripes: why meet Crowley in some weird-ass overpass with homeless people and fires and stuff? Crowley is a bon vivant, he likes his comfort. Why not meet in a cafe? Or just talk to him via Skype? ;-)

Sam going ahead without Dean, oy. What's with the "gotta do it now, this instant, or never" stuff?

Where was Cas, dammit?!?

I think that Dean was going to go deeper into alternatives to God as source of the visions, but Sam jumping the gun like he did put the kibosh on it??? He did, at least, say they could have another source...

And I think Sam was so desperate to fix the Darkness mess that it made him believe more in God as the source.

The cleavage was too much--Amara kept looking like the boobs were about to slip out sideways.

I don't think Rowena was in the know before the boys brought her in, but that as soon as she heard who they were trying to contact, boom, she was in it to help Lucifer. Now, that's something that makes me real grumpy--that the boys didn't think of the fact that most witches get their power from demons, Luci is the father of demons, and maybe, just maybe, Rowena might be a big fan girl?!?

No Michael or Adam is because this was like a extra-dimensional portrayal of the Cage? Lucifer wasn't in it at first, it was empty. So the BOTD spell sort of showed Lucifer, maybe pulled a physical representation to them? The glowing red eyes was kinda cool.

I liked the kibbitzing she and Crowley were doing.

I liked that Sam said "No".

I liked that Sam had so much faith in God that when Luci sucked him into the Cage, and told him he was the source, Sam was so shocked and horrified that we got the "single man tear".

I loved Mark Pellegrino, of course. And I didn't feel like his innuendo was played for laughs at all--I thought it was pretty horror-invoking.

A question: so did the smiting light come from God or from the army of angels? And did Amara kill all the angels? Poor Cas, if so!

Dammit, no Cas. Grrrr.

So I am eagerly awaiting the resolution.

[smree]

I'm with you as I liked it as well.

[Demented Daisy]

It wouldn't be the first time, considering that was implied by Famine or that he was already dead inside. I thought she might have taken his soul from the beginning but now I just don't know.

 

I got the impression that she was going to suck out his soul, but was just as "blissful" or whatever in his presence that she couldn't.  She was compelled to kiss him instead of kill him.  *eye roll*  Not that he didn't have a soul to take.

 

Hey, Sue, I just realized that Amara is a Dementor, except people feel crazy good in her presence instead of crazy bad.  ;-)

[Demented Daisy]

Someone on staff is definitely a Clue fan -- one of the guys that Amara killed was holding a sign that read, "The Kingdom of Heaven is at hand."

 

EVANGELIST
(kindly)
Good evening.
Have you ever given any thought to the kingdom of heaven?

 

PEACOCK
(stunned)
What?

 

EVANGELIST
Repent. The kingdom of heaven IS at hand.

 

SCARLET
You ain't just whistlin' Dixie.

 

EVANGELIST
Armageddon is almost upon us.

 

PLUM
I got news for you--it's already here!

 

Mrs. Peacock tries to shut the door on him.

PEACOCK
Go away!

 

EVANGELIST
But your souls are in danger!

 

PEACOCK
Our lives are in danger, you beatnik!

 

 

Hee!

 

So, quick consensus: white light at the end -- might of God or the combined force of the angels?  I've read a couple of reviews that think it's God, but I'm not convinced.  

Edited December 10, 2015 by Demented Daisy

[KirkB]

The angels Amara killed said if she resisted them all the others would gang up and smite her, and that even she wasn't powerful enough to withstand that. So I'm pretty sure that blast was a combined angel wave motion cannon. Which is still kind of pointless, really, since this is God's sister and he was the one created the angels in the first place, so the most they're likely to do is mess up her hair and piss her off.

 

Sam was an idiot for thinking it was God the whole time, but he was also desperate so I think he can be forgiven. But here's my question. Lucifer was able to get a line out of the cage to send messages to Sam. Fine. Was the whole thing a scheme to get Sam to come to him? How would he even think that was possible? There shouldn't have been any way to get to the cage and there was no reason for Lucifer to think Sam could get a red eye to the depths of hell. Or was he just bored and messing with Sam because he had nothing else to do?

 

When we finally saw into the cage my first thought was also "Where the hell (pun intended) is Micheal?" I suppose part of the answer is the actor wasn't available but in thinking on it I am inclined to agree with those of you who suggested the cage Sam was interacting with wasn't actually THE cage but rather a mystical representation of it. Like a hologram of sorts. Only Rowena either played with the settings, or didn't fully understand, that once he was brought part of the way out Lucifer was powerful enough to yank Sam into the real cage. Maybe.

Edited December 10, 2015 by KirkB

[Primetimer]

Dean really knows how to pick 'em.

Read the story

[Frost]

 

This Amara thing really is sounding more and more like Jasmine with every word out of her mouth

 

So far, it seems like the writers have lifted 99% of this plot straight from Angel.  And unless we get a muppet episode, I must protest!

[Omegamom]

I really do think Amara was trying to suck out his soul; she assumed the position and all. I think that not being able to really intrigued her.

So, given that premise, some thoughts:

1. Dean is newly soulless as a result of the MoC being removed. We know soulless people react differently. It would explain why Dean has seemed "off" to more people than just catrox.

2. (From the Supernatural subreddit) Dean has actually been soulless for a long time--remember what Famine said to him about being "dead inside"?

3. Amara can't hurt him be use they're bound by the MoC. She was thinking that it mostly protected her from Dean, butthe bond means that she really, really can't hurt him. Because mystical hand-waving.

4. God--the real thing--is protecting him.

Another thought: Lordy, angels are just dumb sometimes. Well-intentioned, self-righteous idiots.