All Episodes Talk: Celebrating Diversity

[Normades]

4 hours ago, Hellohappylife said:

Meghan has always been my least favorite,she just seemed like she thought she was better then everyone from the start. This season she is becoming harder to watch,I literally cringe everytime she & Steven are together,or video chat. The whole "babe!" "I love you" "we're gonna get married" thing is just weird. I don't recall seeing them ever have legit conversations about anything,instead we get the fake "it's this happening" dramatic kiss scenes where they both giggle & look away...., okay? Meghan & Steven need to realize relationships aren't how they look in the movies. 

This is an issue that I don't think everyone truly understands.  It may be frustrating to us to see the whole movie dynamic between Meghan and Steven, but that is how they understand love.  They are mimicking what they've seen.  They may have adult bodies, but they are not able to intellectually understand relationships like typical people.  Could you expect a 7 year old to understand the give and take of a deep relationship?  This is one of the very difficult situations that those with DS and their families have to try and navigate.  They have sexual feelings physically, but really don't have the ability to navigate them intellectually.  This is what makes people dislike Sean, too.  Explaining and trying to work on the issues can help a bit, but people who think if their parents just talked to them or chastised them it would be resolved truly do not understand.  That's my experience anyway.

I hope you don't take this as criticism toward you because it's not.  This is one of the issues where I think the show does a disservice to everyone.  Those with DS are being judged unfairly and it gives the public the false idea that these behaviors are easily changed.  I don't believe Meghan or Steven are capable of realizing relationships are not like the movies.

[Eater of Worlds]

7 hours ago, Hellohappylife said:

Another thing that that gets me about this show is the Ages of everyone. I know Meghan,Sean,Elena & Steven are young. But aren't Rachel,Christina & John all near 30 or in their 30s? 

I mean I'm 24 & I don't even hang out with people in their 30s? But then again that's just me.

 

I think that's just you to be honest.  When I was in college I had friends that spanned over a decade apart in ages.  Now that I'm older, I have friends that are even further apart in age.  When you share similar interests, your age difference doesn't matter as much.

 

Normandes, my major issue with Sean is that everyone humors his behavior.  No one says that is wrong, no one models the correct behavior to him specifically. Steven and John and Angel are all respectful of women but that hasn't been brought to Sean's attention. When someone complains, they do so in a joking manner so Sean is being told his behavior is funny and thus appropriate.  His father does the same shit and no one says boo.  That's what upsets most of us I think, rather than Sean doing that behavior repeatedly.

Edited June 1, 2017 by Eater of Worlds

[camom]

Quote

I know Meghan,Sean,Elena & Steven are young. But aren't Rachel,Christina & John all near 30 or in their 30s? 

IIRC, when the show started they were all in their 20s except Rachel who was in her early 30s.  Age differences don't mean as much in friendships for people with DS.  

Going back to the discussion last week about conservatorships, it occurred to me that they are earning decent money from the show and, without conservatorships, they could be conned out of it fairly easily.  For example, if someone convinced Sean to sign a contract to buy a Porsche, it would be legally binding because he is a legal adult.  If he was conserved with regard to finances, the contract would be null and void.

[Normades]

32 minutes ago, Eater of Worlds said:

Normandes, my major issue with Sean is that everyone humors his behavior.  No one says that is wrong, no one models the correct behavior to him specifically. Steven and John and Angel are all respectful of women but that hasn't been brought to Sean's attention. When someone complains, they do so in a joking manner so Sean is being told his behavior is funny and thus appropriate.  His father does the same shit and no one says boo.  That's what upsets most of us I think, rather than Sean doing that behavior repeatedly.

I agree that he has not been taught how to behave properly.  I just can't blame Sean for it.  He was taught this way and is probably doing nothing different from when he was a little kid.  The behavior is ingrained and unlike someone typical, Sean will never have the insight to understand that the behavior needs to change or the ability to change it.  Comparing him with Steven is unfair and John doesn't seem to have much interest sexually (from what I've seen).  Angel is probably the closest in comparison, and yes he seems to be such a nice, well behaved young man.  Imagine being in Sean's shoes where your body has these feelings, but you can't act on them, plus the behavior from which you received attention and affection now pushes some people away, but you don't understand why.  I feel sad for Sean and it bothers me when he gets called creepy.  I think he can be funny and sweet, but it appears his parents have done him a disservice.  I also think Kris has done Meghan a disservice in her "don't limit me."  I get allowing her to try things like Christina and Rachel do, but we all live with limitations.  Lots of girls would like to be supermodels, but if they're 5'2", it probably won't happen. 

I don't know if I would have done any better than these parents, though.  It's hard to watch your child struggle and know that they will not be able to accomplish certain things.  I think that is sometimes why bad behavior gets indulged.  There are no easy answers, but the blame belongs with the parents if they are not trying to correct bad behavior and helping the child learn life skills to the best of their abilities. 

[Hellohappylife]

I am well aware that some of those with DS don't understand relationships the way others do. But my main issue is I feel like the show is trying to push the whole Meghan & Steven relationship thing hardcore this season & so far nothing else. It make me feel like Meghan & Steven have nothing else really going on in their lives right now?or maybe they do but the producers wanna turn the show into any other reality shows where there are love triangles,drama,etc. I wanna see how their daily lives are & how they spend their days/ hours,good & the bad. Not the made up crap of them all having "drama"

i think the tea party (it reminds me of sex & the city,which I love) was planned by the producers but I like when they all sit down & have conversations & hangout Like ADULTS because often times I feel like the show only focuses on the parts of DS that make them seem more child-like,which seems disrespectful in a way because They are adults & should be treated with the same respect. 

[silverspoons]

I have had a harder time watching this season because it seems more scripted and staged. I also think it is showing resources that are not available to most people in this country or at least if you are not living near a big city. I have a son that is developmentally delayed and he graduated from high school this year and we were offered nothing after he left school.  Our city which is not small over 100k, has no services for DS or developmentally delayed adults. I also feel like I have it ok since we have a few friends and family and a decent income and my son is has some real strengths and we have a good rountine to help him when he needs it. I watched a single father who has a 16 year DS daughter that is severe want to see his 18 year old graduate high school. All he was asking for was an hour of respite care, and he got nothing. By the time I found out it was at the ceremony ,I had my youngest take my phone and facetime the dad and he was in tears that we had "helped" him. Besides school hours the father has not gotten a break for over 10 years when his wife passed. There is not centers or programs everywhere. While I'm glad these young people seem to have so much opportunity and help it just isn't the case in many places in America.

 

On the guardianship issue that came up with the surgery, what about power of attorney? When my son turned 18, there was no way he wanted to deal with insurance companies and was still in high school so he couldn't talk to doctors or nurses if they called. I have used the POA in 4 states and the doctors have let me talk, make choices, and get records without issues. Maybe it works because I spend hours talking with my son and know what he wants and he knows I'm 100% his voice and advocate. Sean seemed to either not be prepared for his surgery properly by his parents or doctor or he really wants control? I just wondered if his parents had explained the IV, the medicines, what to expect step by step and he had just forgot or they just never told him out of fear he would be angry?

 

My son's developmental delay makes him not understand emotions well.  When he finally was able to really express himself, he admitted that he smiles because happy people are liked more then angry/sad people. He has a numerical system that tells him how much he should care about someone. I had wondered about love or since we live in Utah, watching so many friends get married young. He has always said that he thinks his friends that spend so much on dating and marriage are fools because they could have a better computer or travel. A doctor I saw that had a son with autism years ago told me to be careful about tv or movies that my son watched. My son really mimicked or learned everything about emotions via watching others or TV. We started out with the Brady bunch and would discuss basic family relationships, moved up to Step by Step (modern brady bunch with more social issues), and then moved on to shows on CNBC like the profit or shark tank. It is really scary how much watching one show or movie can affect my son. One episode of the biggest loser and he was on the scale every hour checking his weight.  I understand the stress of being a parent to a child with a disability. Yes it would be easy to let him watch TV or movies a lot but I don't give in. Ill sit up till 1am playing a board game and be tired the next day instead of just saying watch a movie. It does seem like many of the Young adults on this show watch a lot of TV or movies and are getting their ideas of life and love from it. While it is hard to avoid 100%, it seems like maybe only Christina's parents are really listening and understanding where her ideas are coming from and carefully helping her understand reality vs TV. I also wonder how confusing it is now that they are on TV, if they think they are stars on the same level as the movie stars they mention? Also now that they are paid for reality TV, do they lose some of the benefits or programs they attend? I know the preschool Rocco was in was private insurance but what about the housing , is that based on income in any way?

 

I really hope this show goes back to reality a bit more. I would like to see more about independence , jobs, and real life issues. I would like to see maybe an episode on health issues they have faced.

Edited June 1, 2017 by silverspoons

[Eater of Worlds]

Silver, power of attorney covers you if you can't speak for yourself in the matter.  Sean obviously could, and having power of attorney would do nothing to change the situation if he had refused the surgery.  They can't override him unless he were unconscious, for instance.

 

Normades, why is there the assumption that he can't change his behavior?  We don't know that it's so ingrained he can't change a bit.  No one has been seen trying.  We've seen Sean change his behavior before when he's given an explanation (like when it was explained that he could just tell people he is hard of hearing) and once they found out he was afraid of the IV and not the surgery itself, he calmed down and allowed things to proceed. 

[Eureka]

8 hours ago, Eater of Worlds said:

 

I think that's just you to be honest.  When I was in college I had friends that spanned over a decade apart in ages.  Now that I'm older, I have friends that are even further apart in age.  When you share similar interests, your age difference doesn't matter as much.

I didn't have friends much older than me when I was 24. With the exception of my now-husband, who is almost 9 years older, but we went to school at roughly the same time so were in the same stage of life. Which I guess is the point with this group on the show. I think Rachel said at one point she's the oldest and was about to turn 34. (Maybe we should call them OG (lol) because they could very well be getting another group together of little kids like Rocco.)

Edited June 2, 2017 by Eureka

[kathyk24]

3 hours ago, silverspoons said:

I have had a harder time watching this season because it seems more scripted and staged. I also think it is showing resources that are not available to most people in this country or at least if you are not living near a big city. I have a son that is developmentally delayed and he graduated from high school this year and we were offered nothing after he left school.  Our city which is not small over 100k, has no services for DS or developmentally delayed adults. I also feel like I have it ok since we have a few friends and family and a decent income and my son is has some real strengths and we have a good rountine to help him when he needs it. I watched a single father who has a 16 year DS daughter that is severe want to see his 18 year old graduate high school. All he was asking for was an hour of respite care, and he got nothing. By the time I found out it was at the ceremony ,I had my youngest take my phone and facetime the dad and he was in tears that we had "helped" him. Besides school hours the father has not gotten a break for over 10 years when his wife passed. There is not centers or programs everywhere. While I'm glad these young people seem to have so much opportunity and help it just isn't the case in many places in America.

 

On the guardianship issue that came up with the surgery, what about power of attorney? When my son turned 18, there was no way he wanted to deal with insurance companies and was still in high school so he couldn't talk to doctors or nurses if they called. I have used the POA in 4 states and the doctors have let me talk, make choices, and get records without issues. Maybe it works because I spend hours talking with my son and know what he wants and he knows I'm 100% his voice and advocate. Sean seemed to either not be prepared for his surgery properly by his parents or doctor or he really wants control? I just wondered if his parents had explained the IV, the medicines, what to expect step by step and he had just forgot or they just never told him out of fear he would be angry?

 

My son's developmental delay makes him not understand emotions well.  When he finally was able to really express himself, he admitted that he smiles because happy people are liked more then angry/sad people. He has a numerical system that tells him how much he should care about someone. I had wondered about love or since we live in Utah, watching so many friends get married young. He has always said that he thinks his friends that spend so much on dating and marriage are fools because they could have a better computer or travel. A doctor I saw that had a son with autism years ago told me to be careful about tv or movies that my son watched. My son really mimicked or learned everything about emotions via watching others or TV. We started out with the Brady bunch and would discuss basic family relationships, moved up to Step by Step (modern brady bunch with more social issues), and then moved on to shows on CNBC like the profit or shark tank. It is really scary how much watching one show or movie can affect my son. One episode of the biggest loser and he was on the scale every hour checking his weight.  I understand the stress of being a parent to a child with a disability. Yes it would be easy to let him watch TV or movies a lot but I don't give in. Ill sit up till 1am playing a board game and be tired the next day instead of just saying watch a movie. It does seem like many of the Young adults on this show watch a lot of TV or movies and are getting their ideas of life and love from it. While it is hard to avoid 100%, it seems like maybe only Christina's parents are really listening and understanding where her ideas are coming from and carefully helping her understand reality vs TV. I also wonder how confusing it is now that they are on TV, if they think they are stars on the same level as the movie stars they mention? Also now that they are paid for reality TV, do they lose some of the benefits or programs they attend? I know the preschool Rocco was in was private insurance but what about the housing , is that based on income in any way?

 

I really hope this show goes back to reality a bit more. I would like to see more about independence , jobs, and real life issues. I would like to see maybe an episode on health issues they have faced.

Where do you live? Transition services should have been provided for your son in his IEP before he graduated. Wrightslaw.com has some good information.

[auntjess]

3 hours ago, Eureka said:

I didn't have friends much older than me when I was 24. 

When I was in college, most of my friends were about the same age, but when I started working, you made friends with people who shared some same interests, and some were quite a bit older, some not.

[camom]

A 30 year old who has Down syndrome may be near her age level for some things and more like a pre-teen in other areas.  It varies widely.  Once they reach adulthood, chronological age isn't much of a factor in friendships.

[Bastet]

I think for most people, once they reach adulthood, age isn't a huge factor in friendships.  Via work, college/vocational school, social activities, and other shared interests, don't most adults form bonds with people based more on those connections than age?  I think high school was the last time all my friends were the same age as me, and I believe my life wouldn't be as rich had I only ever associated with people in my age cohort.

Being of similar age is a factor in who one connects with, of course, but that's largely about being statistically more likely to be at the same stage in life than having a similar number of candles on a birthday cake.  So it stands to reason having DS would similarly bridge the age gap.

Rachel is noticeably older in some ways, but in a lot of ways it's irrelevant.  As is true for anyone, but I imagine DS would be a significant bond.

[ChaChaSlide]

7 hours ago, kathyk24 said:

Where do you live? Transition services should have been provided for your son in his IEP before he graduated. Wrightslaw.com has some good information.

This ^^^. Silverspoons I know in my state transition services have to be addressed in the student's IEP by age 14, which ranges between 7th and 9 grade. The transition portion of the IEP addresses not only student's vocational/collegiate goals, but also postsecondary living plans, recreation and leisure, and community based services available for transportation and respite care. Also, at this point if there hasn't been any communication with Medicaid and the waiver system before, it's pushed heavily because the waitlist for said waivers is LONG; last I heard for the intellectual disability waiver, which gives the most amount of money for nursing staff, respite care and assistive technology, the wait was 7-10 years. This differs by state of course and I've known of individuals to receive less comprehensive waivers while on the ID wait list. 

In your post you said you lived in Utah? Here are some web resources that might help

Info about Utah's Medicaid waiver program

http://medicaidwaiver.org/state/utah.html

Utah department of services for people with disabilities

https://dspd.utah.gov/

Utah disability advocate groups. I would contact them first and foremost as they're familiar with navigating all of the resources within your state and can walk you through it. 

http://www.utahparentcenter.org/about/

http://disabilitylawcenter.org/

I'm sorry the school system failed both your son and your friends daughter with DS; there is no way that in a community with more than 100k people there is no access to adult services for people with disabilities.

[silverspoons]

13 hours ago, kathyk24 said:

Where do you live? Transition services should have been provided for your son in his IEP before he graduated. Wrightslaw.com has some good information.

I live in Southern Utah which is very different then SLC. His final IEP meeting was 18 months late, because there was no special education teacher. Our district cut health insurance to many teachers and is from what I understand the 3rd lowest salary for high school teachers in the nation and a very high cost of living area and had no one to fill the openings.  When we finally got a teacher assigned , she was overwhelmed with workload and frustrated she had no support services to offer.  She was so frustrated  that she could not help us with anything. She knew we were considering moving and left it that my child could need services after high school. It had to be carefully worded since, I understand my child has a right to certain services. If she wrote a specific service and then there is nothing in the area , there could be legal ramifications. The general feeling I got was almost all kids go on disability. Another big obstacle is we lack doctors , most families drive 600-800 miles to most of their medical care for kids and many adults that need specialist drive this too. My child has neurology needs , as well as many others so since we have no neurologists locally most people opt for disability over driving 600-800 miles for treatment to get a child or young adult well enough to work. My husband and I have been driving the 800 miles trip this year and it is getting very tiring.

@ChaChaSlide, I appreciate your links. It seems like all the services are in Northern Utah, SLC, Ogden, Provo.  When I first looked at special education preschools here in 2001, there were 3 kids in special education preschool, now it is close to 1,000. My son is one of the "firsts" and when I went to support groups I get chewed out for mentioning the lack of services for older kids. Almost all the families are of kids under 10 and I know are scared and worried. Myself and another mom of an older kid were kind of pushed out of the group. As for legal help, there is basically none down here. It is the reason I'm here. I originally came to this area years before I had kids to research and then work with FLDS women. There is one legal aide clinic per month and they take 1-2 people for a free 30 minutes. The line is packed with abused women. Myself and another women learned how to fill out divorce paperwork have helped countless women file because there it is either have $2k retainer or be one of the lucky 1-2 a month that get 30 minutes of help to file. My husband and I both have jobs or do work here that no one wants to do so we feel bad leaving knowing, no one will be left to help.

 

We are actually about to drive cross country, sounds crazy but we are going to try and find the "perfect" place. One that offers services for our son, we have a daughter in high school that is gifted and is desperate for a more challenging school, a place that has more doctors locally and health insurance options, and decent cost of living and safe. Who knows if this place exists in 2017? I just feel bad for my husband. He has a great job he loves here that is so flexible with hours and he feels like he is making a difference. Oddly the way it works even though he does not work in education at all, there will be cuts in education programs due to the rates he charges versus the only other option out of state contracted companies. If we move he will be working 80 hour work weeks  but he is willing to do it because he doesn't want to see our child just sit at home on disability. I know he would qualify and so many people just say take it. My son can't write a few sentences about himself or fill out forms with out help, has medication resistant seizures up to 50 some days, and is able to control his bowels but on the flip side which  is so confusing he has a pile of Microsoft certfications like programming, security  and repair (he usually ends up fixing or imporving the computers at all his doctors) and can do certain types of math faster then a calculator.

[Former Nun]

On 6/1/2017 at 4:33 PM, Eater of Worlds said:

Normades, why is there the assumption that he can't change his behavior?  We don't know that it's so ingrained he can't change a bit.  No one has been seen trying.

This is a television show.  These participants were chosen because they are generally easy to work with.   I cannot imagine how many times Sean's parents and the other DS parents have wept, screamed, argued, made themselves ill--DIVORCED, and wanted to give up throughout the very difficult years of their kids' lives.  The show is a great service giving some insight into this disability...but it is definitely NOT everyday life.   A television show or documentary that shows REAL life would not interest a large enough audience to acquire funding.  

[Normades]

21 hours ago, Former Nun said:

On 6/1/2017 at 7:33 PM, Eater of Worlds said:

Normades, why is there the assumption that he can't change his behavior?  We don't know that it's so ingrained he can't change a bit.  No one has been seen trying.

This is a television show.  These participants were chosen because they are generally easy to work with.   I cannot imagine how many times Sean's parents and the other DS parents have wept, screamed, argued, made themselves ill--DIVORCED, and wanted to give up throughout the very difficult years of their kids' lives.  The show is a great service giving some insight into this disability...but it is definitely NOT everyday life.   A television show or documentary that shows REAL life would not interest a large enough audience to acquire funding.  

The assumption is based on living with a sibling with DS.  I don't think I've said that no one should try to encourage better behavior from Sean because it's a lost cause, I've said that it isn't an easy thing to do.  I get the impression that some people think if he were corrected the behavior would change after a few corrections.  I  wanted to share my experience with my sibling in an effort to promote empathy and understanding from those who have not had the same experience.  As Former Nun pointed out, we are seeing such a small fraction of their lives, it's hard to say that he isn't ever being corrected.  We've seen him begin to have meltdowns and I believe his parents don't correct him while filming to keep the stress at a minimum.  Someone else on this board said that they have met Sean and know that he is not being corrected.  If that is the case, then I would disagree with not trying to work on his behavior.  

We have no idea what these people and their families have been through.  I know that loving someone with DS can be difficult, challenging and heartbreaking, but at the same time it's wonderfully rewarding and fulfilling.  Personally, I find the judgement of these individuals unfair, especially toward Sean.  I know they've been set up for this by signing on to a show, but  do these individuals really understand the ramifications?  Either way, these are people with intellectual disabilities, so name calling and hating on them is just wrong in my book.  They are not the Real Housewives.

[woodscommaelle]

On ‎5‎/‎31‎/‎2017 at 11:54 AM, princelina said:

On another note - Elena's best line for me was when the job trainer thanked her for coming in, and she said "You're welcome" so graciously, as if she was the one doing the favor :)

LOL.  This made me giggle.

"I'm gonna be a Michals Coffee Girl Barista!!!!" Get that girl a cape!  Love her.

Edited June 6, 2017 by woodscommaelle

[Normades]

11 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

On 5/31/2017 at 1:54 PM, princelina said:

On another note - Elena's best line for me was when the job trainer thanked her for coming in, and she said "You're welcome" so graciously, as if she was the one doing the favor :)

LOL.  This made me giggle.

"I'm gonna be a Michals Coffee Girl Barista!!!!" Get that girl a cape!  Love her.

Edited 11 hours ago by woodscommaelle.

These are the kinds of things I really love about the show.  The best part is that Elena probably believes that she really was doing the favor.  It's so nice to see their victories!

[chenoa333]

Silverspoons...I wish you and your family all the best with your move. It sounds like you have a very solid, caring relationship with your husband and kids. Life can be so peculiar at times...the challenges that can make one person stronger and, for some, ruin their lives. You chose to be strong. What a beautiful role model you are for your children! 

[Former Nun]

On 6/5/2017 at 6:48 AM, Normades said:

We have no idea what these people and their families have been through.  I know that loving someone with DS can be difficult, challenging and heartbreaking, but at the same time it's wonderfully rewarding and fulfilling.  Personally, I find the judgement of these individuals unfair, especially toward Sean.  I know they've been set up for this by signing on to a show, but  do these individuals really understand the ramifications?  Either way, these are people with intellectual disabilities, so name calling and hating on them is just wrong in my book.  They are not the Real Housewives.

This bears repeating!   Bolding is mine.  I'm particularly sensitive about the judgment of Sean.  

[woodscommaelle]

1, 2, 3 Smile.  1, 2, 3 Smile. 1, 2, 3, Smile

What a cute scene.

Edited June 7, 2017 by woodscommaelle

[Eater of Worlds]

Is Megan still working with Best Buddies?  I don't know how many people are aware of it, but the guy who interviewed her is one of the Kennedys/Shrivers.  His mother created the Special Olympics so it's not surprising he's involved in the work he does.

[Bastet]

Oh jeez, Tim Tebow.  And I thought hearing John’s booty song again was going to be the most annoying part of the episode.

Watching Steven and Megan be supervised on their dates is causing serious second-hand embarrassment.   I understand why the parents are there (especially if they’re already dropping I love yous and talking about moving in together), but it’s just so awkward.  And WTF with the matching outfits - more evidence of having the mindset of a young teen when it comes to romantic relationships?

I did get a kick out of Claudia’s diplomatic efforts at telling Kris that Steven is nowhere near as serious as Megan is and has other things going on in his life.  Also Megan’s reaction to learning Steven is a Three Stooges fan. 

I don't blame Steven in the slightest for breaking up with Megan, but he owed her an in-person conversation to end it, and all along he owed her better than crap like his rainbow wish and participating in or even not discouraging her 50 steps down the road five minutes after the first date talk. 

Rachel is so otherwise wonderful, I’m going to let it slide that she’s a Cowboys fan.  I always love watching her with her brother and brother-in-law.  I like watching her with her family, period, but especially them.

How John’s father fits into the family dynamic has always been a bit of a mystery to me; initially, I thought he was a doddering grandpa who’d wandered in for a visit, so learning he was the father and still married to the mother was a bit of a surprise, and there never seemed to be the connection with him there was with the mother and sisters.  So hearing how little John Sr. and John Jr. know each other wasn’t surprising.

Here are all these people with DS being honest about the jobs they have and the work they do in those jobs, and then comes Megan's "I have a business" delusion.

Random note: I want to trim Steven’s fingernails.

Okay, for only the second time in a while, I made myself watch another episode in its entirety, but it was a slog, and I just can’t stick with this show like that.  I’ll always appreciate the first season, and will continue to watch this when I happen to catch it and read here to see what’s happening, but the typical reality show nature of seasons two and three just isn’t for me.

[auntjess]

28 minutes ago, Bastet said:

And WTF with the matching outfits - more evidence of having the mindset of a young teen when it comes to romantic relationships?

I assumed that they were Megan's shirts, and he figured she wanted him to wear it.
As to the breakup by phone, maybe Steven feels cornered in person, so I can understand him taking the easy way out.

29 minutes ago, Bastet said:

Here are all these people with DS being honest about the jobs they have and the work they do in those jobs, and then comes Megan's "I have a business" delusion.

You knew it was coming though, didn't you?  Someone who also runs a business should tell her about what it really entails, the facts and figures, things that Kris doesn't explain to her.
It's one thing for her not to know them, but I don't think she knows that they exist, and that to actually run a business, you'd have to know them.
I was so glad to see how happy John was, that his father came to see him work.  That was touching.
And aren't there ways that actors kiss, especially when they dislike each other, or don't want to really kiss.  There's probably a youtube on it.

[Bastet]

4 minutes ago, auntjess said:

As to the breakup by phone, maybe Steven feels cornered in person, so I can understand him taking the easy way out.

There are people breaking up via text message, so it could have been worse, but to me this is a "Suck it up, Buttercup" situation -- yeah, it's more difficult for him in person, but it just smacks of disrespect to me.  I subscribe to the general Seinfeld philosophy on when one owes an in-person break-up, and given their existing friendship even before their few dates, I think Megan qualifies.

11 minutes ago, auntjess said:

And aren't there ways that actors kiss, especially when they dislike each other, or don't want to really kiss. 

Yes, stage (or screen) kisses are often different (Reader's Digest version: no tongue), although sometimes not.

13 minutes ago, auntjess said:

You knew it was coming though, didn't you?

Oh, yeah - it's so predictable.  I'm surprised she didn't work in a "Don't limit me," but maybe Kris hadn't written that down for her.

I missed Cristina (who only briefly appeared) and Elena (whom I don't think was featured at all) this episode, and would have happily swapped some of the Steven/Megan storyline time for them, but it was nice to get some insight into John.  I also liked his "WTF is this?" reaction to the sonogram picture.  His complete lack of shits to give about others fawning over babies and kids is so appealing to me.

[Former Nun]

11 hours ago, auntjess said:

Someone who also runs a business should tell her about what it really entails, the facts and figures, things that Kris doesn't explain to her.

I think Kris did try explaining a lot of this stuff when they were filmed in Colorado.  We can't expect people with limited intellectual capabilities to understand everything we do...and often WE don't.

11 hours ago, Bastet said:

There are people breaking up via text message, so it could have been worse, but to me this is a "Suck it up, Buttercup" situation -- yeah, it's more difficult for him in person, but it just smacks of disrespect to

Disrespect is a concept that may be difficult for him to comprehend.  It may be "disrespect" in your eyes, but not in the minds of DS people.  It's better to discuss hurting someone's feelings...or making someone sad.  And these discussions are often after the fact.

[gunderda]

aww they broke up already?  I haven't watched the episode yet but I come here to read about it anyways lol 

They lasted a hot minute!  But good for him for not sticking with it if he didn't want to. I kinda figured him to be a push over and would probably stay in that relationship wayyyyyyy longer than he wanted. 

[anonymousgirl]

I think its better for Steven to be truthful than to have Megan strung along. its obvious they want different things she wants marriage and he said he just wants sex in the  past, its obvious they wouldn't have lasted.  With all that said I don't know real their relationship was or was it just for the show?  Either way she doesn't seem to take the rejection too well as she  was throwing a tantrum after their talk about the end of their relationship   and she starts  throwing things  around in the previews.

I like the insight in John's and his Dad's relationship. I can understand theres seems to be a disconnection in that relationship, perhaps more due to his dad age than anything, but his dad does seem proud and supportive. I missed Elena she wasn't in this episode. 

Edited June 7, 2017 by anonymousgirl

[camom]

In an ideal world, Kris would talk with Megan about her expectation vs Steven's expectations.  It's a perfect opportunity to talk about moving slowly, listening to what the other person wants, etc.  Unfortunately, I doubt that will happen.  These seven young adults have been thrown into a situation where they are spending a lot of time together (they are together for a lot of public appearances besides being on the show).  It's only natural that things won't always go well.

[Former Nun]

Sometimes all younger people want (DS or not) is to be able to SAY and believe they have a boyfriend or girlfriend.   The responsibility is lost in the hype.

[camom]

From what we saw in the previews, I think Steven was smart to break up with Megan via facetime.  He knew that there would be drama and histrionics.  I'm anxious to see what he actually says to her.  

Although I think both Steven and Megan have gotten their idea of "romance" from movies and TV, they're not watching the same things.  Steven is more You've Got Mail and Megan is more Dirty Dancing.

[princelina]

Megan may not know much, but she sure knows how to flirt and be a sexy little thang!  I wonder if she scared Steven with that :)

[crazycatlady58]

What I was like to know what Kris thought when she saw this. I would think Kris needs to have a talk with her or she may be raising a grandchild. I have no problem the the women taking the lead so to speak, but I wonder if Megan truly understands what may happen. She cannot raise a child.

[camom]

In many ways, Megan is a pre-teen in an adult body.  Since it was filmed for all the world to see, Kris has a perfect opportunity to "critique" Megan's behavior (in a non-judgemental way) to help her act more appropriately in the future.  While watching Steven and Megan in his bedroom, I kept laughing when they would show Kris's pained expressions.  I don't think they were going to do too much with a camera crew there (at least Steven wouldn't, not so sure about Megan).

[gunderda]

1 hour ago, princelina said:

Megan may not know much, but she sure knows how to flirt and be a sexy little thang!  I wonder if she scared Steven with that :)

I think if I were steven I would have been scared by the constant "i'm going to get you... i'm gooooing to get you.... can I get you....?"  Like settle down there Megan - the parents are downstairs! lol 

At first I thought Megan's mom was a little over dramatic always keeping a watchful eye on Megan with her boyfriends.. but now I think I get it... Megan is a little horndog... and swept off her feet easily... all it could take is for Kris to take her eyes off megan for a second and a guy could easily take advantage of her.  There's no way she can leave megan alone with a guy!!

[Normades]

I haven’t seen the most recent episode, but I feel badly for Megan about the break up.  I also wonder if the relationship was a production set up and Megan (and maybe Steven) didn’t realize it wasn’t for real.  Seeing the way they’ve taken the ideas from movies and modeled them as a relationship makes me think they don’t realize tv and movies are make believe.  The show has moved from what it was in season one toward manufactured reality and I think it could really be harmful to these kids.  I hope their parents are not seduced by fame and are looking hard at the effects on their children.

Seeing Steven and Megan play out their romcom movie as a relationship made me remember how my sister was really attached to certain tv shows.  She LOVED Batman (the old 60’s show).  She would call herself Robin and my grandfather was Batman.  My father had a corvette and it was the batmobile.  It was cute and it gave her lots of joy, but there were times when she would act out and think it was okay to punch like Batman and Robin.  Of course we tried to explain that hitting is wrong and help her understand that.  This is an example of what I’ve tried to explain in other posts, there are some things that certain people with DS cannot grasp.  We explained and corrected behaviors over and over again, but there were instances where it made no difference.  I know some people will say that she should not have been allowed to watch the show.  Of course it was not my decision, but I can’t imagine taking something away that gave her so much joy when she experienced hardship every day.  This is a line that some parents have to walk.  This is also an example of just because we don’t see Kris or Sean’s parents explain and correct bad behavior, the fact that it persists does not mean that they do not do it.

[Neeners]

Rachel asking her Brother/BIL if they'd ever french kissed before and their reactions made me giggle. Also when she told her brother he sounded "good like a girl" and their reactions. When she was practicing the lines and actually left the apartment and knocked to come back in. I think they all adore each other and it's very sweet to watch. 

[booboopbedoo]

This is a good learning experience to explain to Meagan the do's and dont's of boys and dating.

Steven wanted a girlfriend and Meagan wanted a Husband and a baby.

She says she runs a business but cab't even take care of herself. When Kris took her to the store she freaked with the idea os simple shopping.

I think Kris has sheltered her too much

[woodscommaelle]

nm

Edited June 9, 2017 by woodscommaelle

[woodscommaelle]

Oh my god I ❤️ John's dad. What a seriously wonderful family.

Rachel's brother and brother-in-law are simply awesome. I adore the relationship between those two and with her. So sweet. Sign me up for a show just about these three.

Haha. Steven just needs to make the right mistakes. Way to put a positive spin on that. Love it.

Edited June 9, 2017 by woodscommaelle

[kathyk24]

I have more sympathy for Kris than most people do. She's the only single parent on the show and it seems like Megan's dad hasn't really been involved in her daily life. It's hard to be the only parent provider and teacher.  I think we forget that people with cognitive disabilities don't live in a bubble. They see family members getting married and having children and they want that as well.

[Hellohappylife]

Just got around to watching the new episodes.

I could just watch Rachael with her brother & his husband all day. I thought it was great how they kept reminding Rachael that there is a chance she wouldn't get that role but not to get discouraged by it & helped her practice. You can tell they both care for her. They are so fun!

it blew my mind when I realized johns dad was in his 80s.  Forgive me if I sound stupid,but could his fathers age be a reason or factor of john being born with DS? Or does age not matter with men? Or does that only count for women?

I never have any issues with kris but it annoyed me how when Meghan & Steven were alone & kris was talking to his parents & bring up the topic about sex & kris was "well I have the girl,the daughter" I took it as kris thinking if Meghan get pregnant she's stuck raising another child,meanwhile Steven walks free.....It just reminded me of my aunt who's teenage daughters end up pregnant & she blamed it on the mother of the sons.  It takes 2 people to make a baby, the egg doesn't get fertilized by itself. 

[Normades]

19 hours ago, crazycatlady58 said:

What I was like to know what Kris thought when she saw this. I would think Kris needs to have a talk with her or she may be raising a grandchild. I have no problem the the women taking the lead so to speak, but I wonder if Megan truly understands what may happen. She cannot raise a child.

I believe Kris has probably had those talks with Megan many, many times.  I think she needs to continue them and if Megan were my child I would have her on some type of birth control, too.  I would assume there must be health issues for Megan to carry a baby, but I honestly don't know.  It may vary from person to person, but I know there are some health challenges that are more prevalent to people with DS.  Plus, I wonder how carrying and birthing a baby would affect Megan emotionally.  That would scare the hell out of me along with the prospect of a grandchild.

[gunderda]

19 hours ago, Normades said:

I haven’t seen the most recent episode, but I feel badly for Megan about the break up.  I also wonder if the relationship was a production set up and Megan (and maybe Steven) didn’t realize it wasn’t for real. 

No matter if it were a set up... if the two of them thought it was real... then it was real.  Maybe production pushed them together?  But either way they started a real relationship. I doubt their parents would agree to a fake one and I think they would for sure know if it was real or fake.  

13 hours ago, woodscommaelle said:

Oh my god I ❤️ John's dad. What a seriously wonderful family.

I forgot i was going to say that too!! Although it kinda seemed like he was maybe not such a great dad? He talked about not coddling John and wanting him to be tough.  Seems like only recently he's started to express how proud he is of John. Even in the talking head they did together John Jr seemed blown away by what his dad said about him. 

1 hour ago, Normades said:

I believe Kris has probably had those talks with Megan many, many times.

We saw it a lot on the 1st season? (what season are we in now??) But I do hope she had them a lot off camera too.  But like someone else has said about sometimes you can't teach them a different way... I think this is one topic that Megan can't fully grasp.  She thinks the movies are real life. 

[ClareWalks]

Yeah, John's dad seemed very nice but there were definitely indicators that he had been kind of a deadbeat. John was SHOCKED that his dad showed up at the studio, for example. I also cannot remember whether John or his mom had ever even mentioned John's father before this episode.

[Dominii]

On 6/6/2017 at 9:50 PM, Bastet said:

Oh jeez, Tim Tebow.  And I thought hearing John’s booty song again was going to be the most annoying part of the episode.

I know, right? Tebow is totally gagworthy, and please, no more John songs, EVER! Isn't he supposed to be quitting the "music business" pretty soon? It can't come soon enough. I realize he loves it, though, so we'll see what happens there.

I'm surprised at how hard viewers are on Kris. I'm not exactly a fan of her personality, but I think she does the best she can with Megan. She has instilled some (perhaps misplaced) self-confidence in Megan, which is better than making her feel like she's worthless. She keeps an eye on Megan too, and tries to ensure that she stays as safe and as happy as she can be. I'm also pretty sure that she's told Megan practical things a million times about boys and jobs, etc. Megan has a severe intellectual disability, so she probably doesn't retain all her mom's advice and doesn't look at things rationally.

I have grown tired of this series. Something fundamental has changed. I think it's just too scripted now, and it has slipped into mediocrity. I'll try another episode or two, and if it doesn't get better, that's it! I'm out.

[ClareWalks]

I would like John's music better if he were rapping about something a little more meaningful. They say you should write what you know, and keep it real, or whatever. John singing about "shake ya booty booty" and something about not forgetting "the 'hood" rings incredibly hollow. I don't think he is even from "the 'hood."

[camom]

Quote

Yeah, John's dad seemed very nice but there were definitely indicators that he had been kind of a deadbeat. John was SHOCKED that his dad showed up at the studio, for example. I also cannot remember whether John or his mom had ever even mentioned John's father before this episode.

John's dad was definitely not a deadbeat.  He does come from a generation when dad went off to work and mom raised the kids.  He also is not demonstrative.  All of their kids were mainly raised by Joyce, but John Sr. has been there.  He has been seen on a few previous episodes of the show but prefers to stay in the background.

[Bastet]

2 hours ago, ClareWalks said:

I also cannot remember whether John or his mom had ever even mentioned John's father before this episode.

We've seen him several times, and he's talked some, but we hear a lot more from Joyce.

It was sad to see how little they know each other - Joyce, overhearing their conversation, said it was like they were trying to catch up on 30 years in one afternoon - because it sounded like a conversation between an adult child and the father who'd left 30 years ago and just came back into the kid's life, except John Sr. has been a member of the household all this time.  I wonder if he was any more involved with his daughters' lives.

[kassa]

11 hours ago, Hellohappylife said:

 

I could just watch Rachael with her brother & his husband all day. I thought it was great how they kept reminding Rachael that there is a chance she wouldn't get that role but not to get discouraged by it & helped her practice. You can tell they both care for her. They are so fun!

it blew my mind when I realized johns dad was in his 80s.  Forgive me if I sound stupid,but could his fathers age be a reason or factor of john being born with DS? Or does age not matter with men? Or does that only count for women?

 

Agree about Rachel's brother and husband and their relationship with her.  I don't know how long they've been together but the brother in law seems like such a gentle soul and their connection seems just as close.  They get a kick out of her ("Have you ever french kissed?") but at the same time it's all love, support and respect for her as a person.

I looked on pubmed for paternal age and Down syndrome and it looks like it isn't really an issue unless the mother is over 35 and at that point it multiplies the odds.  So if you're a 38 year old woman the odds are higher than a 30 year old, but if the father is 50 the odds are higher than if the father is also 38.