B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[jenrising]

11 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

Fuck him. I'll help him pack his bags. 

Same here. Thorne came back into town stalking women until he found one that was vulnerable. And shoved his nose where it didn't belong and basically guilt-tripped Katie into trying to take custody from Bill. I can't wait for him to slink his way out with his tail between his legs. I'm just sad he won't take Ridge with him. 

[La di Diva]

I was a teeny bit disappointed with AN when she first came on as Hope. But damn, she has grown and come into her own.  We see the sweetness of Hope tempered with a bit of bitchery (her initial reaction to Sally working for HFTF, and at Ridge stiffing her for Stuffy's bedroom).  Now with this Baby Beth SL she's on fire!  Sad, angry, desperate unbelief, bottomless despair ... all the beats in playing her grief at losing the long awaited baby.  But geez if sweet Hope didn't appear for a moment when she and Wyatt were talking about the loss of their son. AN's Hope is not a one note character.  Yes she's sweet, kind and "good"  but she's more than that. AN is showing us all those layers. Kudos to the writers of the Lope/ foursome scenes this past week.

AN is soooooooo much better at showing us a multifaceted person, which is how Show seems to be writing Hope these days.  Hauxdi is still a one note slattern. She's all cha cha cha and no cattle

Edited January 20, 2019 by La di Diva

[Anna Yolei]

Gotta agree, I never in a million years thought I'd be actively rooting for Hope instead of just for Steffy to lose, and it's because they're finally letting this character mature and grow up. AN is bringing it. I think Kim Matula was more than capable of it too, but the writing insisted on dragging Hope as the ice princess/spoiled haughty high maintainance type. As little as Liam deserved her then, seeing her use Wyatt to dangle over his head to keep his attention got as old as the waffling. 

But this? She's been supportive of him without anything in return when Steffy was pregnant. She didnt play games to get his attention. She didn't even consider rubbing Liam or Steffy's noses in it when learning why they split--compare that to her talk to Steffy when Bill left her high and dry all those years ago. It had fuck all to do with Bill being her uncle and hurting Katie and all to rub in her morality at the worst time. Shit like that was why it was difficult to connect with either of them for years and why most of TwoP viewed them as two sides of the same coin. 

Well done for all these actors. If B&B wants to continue for another ten, fifteen, even 20 years, they need to bolster up this core four. John McCook will not be here forever, KKL will likely want to focus on her business more at some point and as much as Liam irritates me, I'd rather see him as a new patriach/leading man than this version of Ridge who is as miscast as Jason Thompson as Billy Abbott.

Edited January 19, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[La di Diva]

@ Anna Yolei  "... this version of Ridge who is as miscast as Jason Thompson as Billy Abbott." Yes, yes, yes! x 1000 to this.

RM's Ridge did some terrible things throughout the years, but I never outright hated him like I do TK's Ridge.  Most of the time these days I just want to slap the smirk and entitlement off Sludge's face. 

When it finally comes out that "Phoebe" is really Beth, Sludge will be yelling the loudest that it isn't fair for Lope to take away Hauxdi's daughter.  Never mind that Beth is Lope's child. And really never mind that Sludge is the main cheerleader for a child belongs with both her natural parents.  I guess that only applies if Hauxdi is the mother.  I fully expect Sludge to push and browbeat Liam to leave Hope and raise Kelly and Beth with the slattern.

If that happens I want Brooke to punch Sludge in the throat, throw his trifling freeloading butt out of her house, and be done with him forever.

[drivethroo]

57 minutes ago, La di Diva said:

When it finally comes out that "Phoebe" is really Beth, Sludge will be yelling the loudest that it isn't fair for Lope to take away Hauxdi's daughter. 

Yes, when the truth about Phoebeth comes out and Ridge advocates for Steffy to keep Beth, hopefully that will be the last straw between Brooke and Ridge.

One of the reasons I think people enjoyed shows like Sex and the City is because of the friendships between the women.  I enjoyed seeing Sally and Hope.  While they're not friends yet, I think they could be eventually.  There are really no female friendships on this show and there needs to be.  Pam & Donna don't count and neither do Donna/Katie/Brooke (because they are sisters).  All women aren't rivals in real life.  It would be nice if Sally and Hope could be friends because they seem like women who would cherish relationships with other women.

Steffy, on the other hand, is NOT a woman who would have close friendships with other women because she would see all other women as rivals.  Steffy would have more friendships with men.  So I'd be fine with Steffy not having female friends but I think Sally and Hope would have a female friend and I think that needs to be written in the show.

[RuntheTable]

I think one of the main reasons I was so turned off by those scenes with Katie and family is I have no desire to see Batie 3.0, and clearly that is where we are headed. 

15 hours ago, La di Diva said:

We see the sweetness of Hope tempered with a bit of bitchery

I second this. There is nothing wrong with getting your bitch on now and again, and considering that Hope has to deal with Steffy? Nuff said.

8 hours ago, La di Diva said:

RM's Ridge did some terrible things throughout the years, but I never outright hated him like I do TK's Ridge.  Most of the time these days I just want to slap the smirk and entitlement off Sludge's face. 

Seconding this too. I have always disliked the Ridge character, but it was more like a love/hate thing because Ronn was just that charming. TK has no charm. He is a bully and a brute, and perfectly illustrates the rich, elitist, playboy, who is used to getting his way, and if he doesn't, he will browbeat you to death. And Ridge Forrester was always so put together; even in his worst getups, and he had plenty of those, he still looked smashing. I find that I really do miss Ronn. 

8 hours ago, La di Diva said:

If that happens I want Brooke to punch Sludge in the throat, throw his trifling freeloading butt out of her house, and be done with him forever.

I picked this gif deliberately; she just blew up one of those dirty, disgusting, snake like creatures in Tremors. 

5 hours ago, drivethroo said:

One of the reasons I think people enjoyed shows like Sex and the City is because of the friendships between the women.  I enjoyed seeing Sally and Hope.  While they're not friends yet, I think they could be eventually.  There are really no female friendships on this show and there needs to be.  Pam & Donna don't count and neither do Donna/Katie/Brooke (because they are sisters).  All women aren't rivals in real life.  It would be nice if Sally and Hope could be friends because they seem like women who would cherish relationships with other women.

Not enough likes in the world for this! Female friendships have always been a rarity on Show, but we did have some before Junior took over with his ham fisted desire to shove Bridge down our collective throats at the expense of nearly every other character/couple. We did have some friendships early on: Brooke/Caroline, Brooke/Megan; Brooke/Sheila; Brooke/Karen. Stephanie had friends too, although I don't remember their names, but I do remember that one was a homeless woman Stephanie met when she lost her memory. 

I have been pulling for a Sally/Hope friendship ever since they recast the roles. And what do they do? Pit them against one another over Liam. So stupid. But it seems like these two have come full circle, and are exactly where they need to be. Hope and Liam are clicking on all cylinders; they are completely believable as a young couple going through something unbearable. More importantly, Liam didn't bring Hope home and unceremoniously dump her on the couch to go and seek out Steffy. And Wyatt and Sally are a match made in heaven. If Show new what was good for it; it would bond these four as it's future foundation. But we all know this is now the Steffy show. 

[mightysparrow]

17 hours ago, La di Diva said:

 

AN is soooooooo much better at showing us a multifaceted person, which is how Show seems to be writing Hope these days.  Hauxdi is still a one note slattern. She's all cha cha cha and no cattle

Very well said.  I've always liked Hope and even though I hate this storyline, I'm so proud of AN for BRINGING IT!  And truer words were never spoken aboIut Hauxdilox.  How long did her independent woman act last?  Wasn't it long enough for her to cut 'Hope For the Future'?  As soon as she stuck it to Hope, Hauxdi threw out her Helen Reddy albums and burned her '#MeToo' t-shirt.  She's back to being the slattern she always was.  But Steffy's a woman in her 30s now; she's not a vixen.  So the ol' 'cha cha cha' isn't enough.  She's added using babies to her arsenal, something she learned from her killer mommy.

I've been calling for female friendship on this show for years and I'm happy to hear about the 'makeup' scene between Sally and Hope.  One of the great things about Sally is that she knows what it's like to be down, to lose everything.  Losing a company isn't anywhere near losing a baby but she did see her dreams die and had to pull herself back up and build new dreams.  She would be a great support for Hope and I pray they put the two of them together more often as friends.  Sally will also be a great Auntie for little Beth when she finally comes home.

Hope also needs to have someone she can count on in her corner.  It's great that Liam is there for her now but we all know he can turn on a dime.  It's really unfortunate, but Brooke won't stand up to her brute of a husband, even when he's bullying her own daughter.  I'm hoping that will change when her grand-daughter is the issue, but who knows.  Sally's suffered at Hauxdilox' hands; more than she even knows because I don't think she found out about Hauxdilox work to break Sally and Thomas up (another one of the slattern's crimes that was just swept under the rug).  Sally would be a good ally for Hope.  And maybe Wyatt will step up too and tell his brother to man up and stand by his WIFE.

[Anna Yolei]

12 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

If Show new what was good for it; it would bond these four as it's future foundation. But we all know this is now the Steffy show. 

Absolutely this!

That said, I don't wonder if TPTB realize this already and that's why Steffy wasn't jumping all over Liam again...? Baby or no baby, I like that so far she seems to have stuck to her guns about being over his waffling BS (the couples portrait on her wall notwithstanding).

I really would like for Eric III to return...have him interact with Steffy while bonding with his sister Hope, who of course warns him about her being trouble. And of course a good reason to bring back Deacon and/or Amber whose daughter has got to be old enough to cause trouble for a young RJ or Dino or  Logan (theres a seven year spread in RL between them, but eh) 

10 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Hope also needs to have someone she can count on in her corner.  It's great that Liam is there for her now but we all know he can turn on a dime.  It's really unfortunate, but Brooke won't stand up to her brute of a husband, even when he's bullying her own daughter.  I'm hoping that will change when her grand-daughter is the issue, but who knows. 

She saddled up on the Stallion after all Bill had done to Hope AND Katie, and also the circumstances about Hope's very existance.

I'm not optimistic on this being the straw to break the camel's back. 

Edited January 21, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[A-Lo]

While I get that losing a baby creates a bottomless well of grief in the bereaved parents and we have seen all of that acted out beautifully by AN and SC, can we please have a brief break from it, Show?  Let Hope and Liam continue grieving but give us something else to watch in the meantime.  I want to move on to cheering them on from the sidelines as they discover that their little Beth is alive and well.  And please don't let it drag on for as long as it did with Hammertoes and Nick.  End of my requests.  Anyone else have any?

[Anna Yolei]

52 minutes ago, A-Lo said:

And please don't let it drag on for as long as it did with Hammertoes and Nick. 

While I'm all for cutting this story as short as possible, that Sage/Sharon/Nick/Dylan  clusterfuck was a disaster right out the damn the damn gate. Eight days would've been too many,  let alone 8 months (or longer if you consider Nick got the double whammy of later finding out Christain was his nephew instead).

I'm pretty sure the one with Lauren was even longer than that and while I can't find more than a handful of clips, I'm under the impression that that was far better received, even for Lauren having to bury baby Dylan after a few months. I'm sure it helped to know the story was at it's core all about Lauren and Sheila and not a vehicle to redeem some other character(s) who has all the emotional intelligence of a dildo.

Which is what truly pisses me off most. It'll be all about Steffy at the end, and probably Saint Taylor, with everyone proclaiming Steffy deserves to raise the baby of two people whose lives she's come between over and over again, and who she'll eventually fuck over again in the future.

[Waldo13]

A night to themselves?  Isn't Donna in the house?  It looks like Kate's scar is missing again. No, I'm not a dirty old man looking at Katie ample cleavage. I was just searching for the scar and I don't find Katie sexy; but Sally is a different story. 

Condor/Katie vs Wyatt/Sally and their pillow talk. Condor/Katie = Bill Bill Bill. Sally/Wyatt = her beauty and sexiness. 

[Anna Yolei]

It's hard for me to give any shits about anything re: Thorne when hes been such a fucking complete shitheel.

Still, the acknowledgment of losing Darla and then Aly was long overdue.

[Joimiaroxeu]

I guess in B&B time it's only been a few days since Hope lost her baby but you'd think someone would suggest she get grief counseling. Puppies and platitudes aren't going to help her heal emotionally.

Heh, Wyatt, you weren't following your gut when you decided to get with Sally. Look a little further down, fella.

Interesting dialogue from Thorne today. To me it sounded kind of like he's expecting doom in some way. Wonder if they're going to kill Thorne off?

Quote

Sally would be a good ally for Hope.  

Could work. Hope doesn't seem to want girlfriends though. For example, note that every time she gets married it's her much older mommy and aunts serving as her wedding party. (Meanwhile, has Steffy even ever had a maid-of-honor?)

[RedRockRosie]

3 hours ago, A-Lo said:

While I get that losing a baby creates a bottomless well of grief in the bereaved parents and we have seen all of that acted out beautifully by AN and SC, can we please have a brief break from it, Show?  Let Hope and Liam continue grieving but give us something else to watch in the meantime.  I want to move on to cheering them on from the sidelines as they discover that their little Beth is alive and well.  And please don't let it drag on for as long as it did with Hammertoes and Nick.  End of my requests.  Anyone else have any?

Yeah,it is pretty hard to watch Hope & Liam's deep grief (& I agree 1000% that both AN & SC are doing a fantastic job with this storyline) but it's becoming more obvious where they are going. Liam is wanting to begin to heal but Hope is not even close yet so of course this will cause a rift between them big enough for Steffy  and her "new puppy baby" to slip in. (How anyone could even think of doing this while her step sister has just lost a child still baffles me. Not to mention why would she even consider this when she has an infant of her own under 1 year.)

I can see the split coming so that by the time they find out Beth is alive & now she has bonded with & is Steffy's daughter, Hope & Liam will be long over. I can hear Steffy saying that Phoebeth should stay with me & her Daddy! Cause we all know he'll waffle on back to Hauxdi by then. Man, I seriously hope I am all wrong about this cause I like the way they have Hope & Liam supporting each other....but we never get nice things.

[CharlizeCat]

I heard this morning that the third Monday in January is the most depressing day of the year. The show lived up to that. Between Mope and Sally's ongoing whining/self-flagelation  about Puppygate, I'd had enough. 

I agree. Hope needs to follow-up with Lippy (or preferably somebody else) about the grief support group. 

Then ... more bedroom romps with Wally and Katie/Thorne (do we have a name for them?)  I felt during some of the conversation, that Thorne was trying to dump Katie or give her an out from the marriage. 

The only bright spot was in the opening scene where Sally assured Wyatt that the animal shelter had another family waiting in the wings to adopt that poor puppy.  BTW, whatever happened to Bu the cat?

I feel sorry for Hope and Liam, but I am tired of watching this.  Liam, at least, is trying to move forward -- which unfortunately, will probably be directly to Hauxdi sooner than later.  We need to either have a new story or move this along.  At this point, I'd welcome Donna/Eric/Quinn.  Watching Pam and Donna bicker at the reception desk. Bridge fighting. Anything. (Well, not the interns.) 

[Anna Yolei]

2 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Could work. Hope doesn't seem to want girlfriends though. For example, note that every time she gets married it's her much older mommy and aunts serving as her wedding party. (Meanwhile, has Steffy even ever had a maid-of-honor?)

That more than likely is because this show has always sucked at friendships than anything else. Bridget never had friends either, and she was far warmer than either version of Hope.

Like, between Hope and Steffy, I think there's far more potential for a friendship for Sally with Hope, who for all her faults has the capability for self reflection and kindness. For Steffy, that ship began to unmoore from the pier the minute she stuck her tongue in Rick's mouth and only got worse from there.

[AngelKitty]

16 hours ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

Wonder if they're going to kill Thorne off?

This is what I've been wondering. I hope they don't, although it's probably the easiest way to get rid of him but there's been too much dying and crying on this show lately.

[CountryGirl]

The Batie anvils couldn't be anymore obvious and though I feel bad for Ingo, I'll be happy to help pack Thorne's bags as well.

Them's the breaks, Horney Thorney.

Elsewhere, the scenes between Annika and Courtney were so powerful and I, too, wish TPTB would capitalize on these two talented ladies and have their characters develop a true friendship, you know, the way women can and do in real life? Steffy doesn't have any female friends besides her whackado mother and I'm sure if you asked her, she'd be one of those women we've all crossed paths with a time or two who remark that their only friends are men because women just don't "get" them. Yeah, sure.

But enough about that trifling trick, back to AN and CH.

I'll cut to the chase because as good as their scenes were inside of the bedroom, what happened later was even better.

Liam returns to the living room after talking to Hope: "Hey. I'm glad you guys didn't leave yet, um..." He looks at her, Wyatt sitting next to her on the couch. "Sally...Hope wanted to talk to you again." Sally looks concerned as does Wyatt.

Wyatt isn't anxious for the two women to resume their conversation and stands up: "Okay, bro, um, look, everyone's been feeling a lot of things tonight. I -- I think it's better if we just go and take the puppy with us." 

But then Hope is there, in the doorway, looking like a fragile ghost (and kudos to lighting here) as she says, some steel still in her spine, "Please don't."

A stunned Sally tears up just to see her.

Hope moves further into the room: "I -- I feel, um, terrible about the things I said to you, and I don't know why I reacted the way I did." She almost smiles here, surprised by how off the rails (though totally understandable) she went. But again, I think it was good for her to get some of that out.

Liam steps closer to her and rubs her arm for support as she continues: "You were just trying to be kind to me, and I -- I went off on you, and I don't know why I did it. I don't know why I said those things. You were being a friend. And I -- I need all the support I can get right now, so, um..."

She takes in both Sally, still sitting there, and Wyatt, standing close by. She tears up then, looking truly miserable for how she reacted and so, so remorseful. "I'm so sorry, Sally. Um... can you -- can you please forgive me?"

It's almost more than Sally can bear, that this woman who has been through so much hell, should be apologizing to her? But that's who Hope is - she is in unimaginable pain but doesn't excuse how she treated Sally when a lot of people would. She's owning every inch of this and making amends and for the first time, there's a glimmer of hope that she can work through this, that she can see beyond her pain to others.

She looks down, ashamed of how she behaved.

But Sally, whose heart is as big as the ocean, is quick to reassure her: "Hope. Hope, you should not be apologizing for anything right now."

She stands and approaches her while the two men watch the women they love.

Sally: "You are going through a really terrible time. I should be the one apologizing for being my normal impulsive self."

Sally continues: "I mean, I should have at least run the idea by Liam first, but... instead, I just came waltzing into your bedroom with a puppy, and I ended up making things worse." Hope just lets her talk, knowing how badly Sally feels and her part in it.

Sally: "So... can you forgive me?"

Hope fights back tears here.

She reaches out to take Sally's hand as Sally gasps.

Sally squeezes Hope's hand, so touched: "You have no idea how much I wish I could take away your pain. . . ." And I believe she would, in a heartbeat.

Hope believes it, too.

She pulls Sally into her arms.

A tiny bit of her scarred heart begins to heal as we see a tiny hint of a smile on Hope's face.

It's such a sweet, heart-rending moment between my girls and seriously, these two absolutely could be friends and what a great foursome they could - and should - be. 

Outstanding work by both ladies.

[Cindylou]

Thorne needs to find out how Ally died

[mightysparrow]

46 minutes ago, Cindylou said:

Thorne needs to find out how Ally died

He most certainly does!

It's time Hauxdilox answered for what happened that night and what happened after. 

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, AngelKitty said:

This is what I've been wondering. I hope they don't, although it's probably the easiest way to get rid of him but there's been too much dying and crying on this show lately.

Good God, no! I'm fine pretending the last year didn't exist but Thorne is, as far as men on this trash show go, not entirely unredeemable. Why can't they kill Ridge instead?!

[RedRockRosie]

56 minutes ago, Cindylou said:

Thorne needs to find out how Ally died

 

8 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

He most certainly does!

It's time Hauxdilox answered for what happened that night and what happened after. 

Now that would make for some good drama!! Finding out your niece killed your daughter!!

Instead we will get the "drama" of Steffy yet again getting exactly what she wants without having any consequences for what she has done along the way.

Steffy=2 (babies). Hope=0

Edited January 22, 2019 by RedRockRosie

[ByTor]

Why am I thinking that Thorne does know about Aly?

[nkotb]

FINALLY! Ugh, that was the longest-held non-mystery (from the viewers) ever!

This Flo might actually be the one to bring the scam down; she looked disgusted & asked questions immediately as to who Hope was. I still kinda think either Liam will blog about it on the Spencer or Forrester website, & the actual bio-mom will read it & start adding it up, or Hope will meet the actual bio-mom of the stillborn baby in a grief support group & they'll become friends & the details will naturally trickle out. I'm just concerned with JMW's due date fast-approaching, we're in this for the long haul.

[A-Lo]

2 hours ago, nkotb said:

FINALLY! Ugh, that was the longest-held non-mystery (from the viewers) ever!

This Flo might actually be the one to bring the scam down; she looked disgusted & asked questions immediately as to who Hope was. I still kinda think either Liam will blog about it on the Spencer or Forrester website, & the actual bio-mom will read it & start adding it up, or Hope will meet the actual bio-mom of the stillborn baby in a grief support group & they'll become friends & the details will naturally trickle out. I'm just concerned with JMW's due date fast-approaching, we're in this for the long haul.

I couldn't believe that Reese told Flo the truth!  How stupid is he?  Still, I was over the moon that he did.  Now the unraveling can start...

[mightysparrow]

Okay.  I watched and I have a few questions.

I lived in California for a while and as far as I know, Catalina Island is part of the State of California, subject to the laws of the state.  It's not in the middle of nowhere or even the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  And my understanding is that TWO WOMEN gave birth in a clinic during a windstorm.  Not on the side of the road in the middle of a tsunami.  Nobody assisted Dr. Wayne Shady with TWO births?  He didn't even work at the clinic.  Is there just some open-door policy at clinics where doctors can walk in and conduct major procedures without notifying ANYBODY?  I know California is laid-back but it ain't that laid-back. 

And there's NO record of NotBeth's birth.  I understand that women give birth and abandon babies at churches, hospitals, or other place but the authorities are usually able to track the mother down because it's fairly easy to identify a women who has just given birth. 

The Botox is clearly eating away at Taylor's brain.  She barely knows this man and she's willing to buy a baby from him without any idea about the child's history.  You can't buy a dog that way in most places.  Taylor is too fucking stupid to live. 

4 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Good God, no! I'm fine pretending the last year didn't exist but Thorne is, as far as men on this trash show go, not entirely unredeemable. Why can't they kill Ridge instead?!

As far as I'm concerned, Thorne needs to take off those horrible shirts and sweaters he's been wearing more often. Why would you hire a man who looks like IR and not have him take his shirt off. IR needs to be shirtless.  A LOT.  And Ridge should have died the first time $Bill tossed his grimy ass out of a helicopter. 

I thought the scene between Katie and Thorne today was nice.  It would be great if Katie helped Thorne investigate his daughter's death.  It's not like she owes the slattern a fucking thing.

I'm happy that the truth has come out about Beth.  Now it's time to end this storyline and reunite the family.  AN and SC have enough footage for their Emmy reels.  We've seen that Liam and Hope have a strong bond and deserve a chance to build a family.  Liam and Hauxdilox would never have made it this far through a crisis like this.  Correction:  they've never made it this far through a crisis like this.  There's no point in having Liam waffle back to the slattern's house because he'll be gone the second he learns the truth.  The only way that Liam will end up back with Hauxdi is if Hope SENDS him back.  He won't go of his own accord because Liam WANTS TO BE WITH HOPE.

[jenrising]

19 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

I lived in California for a while and as far as I know, Catalina Island is part of the State of California, subject to the laws of the state.  It's not in the middle of nowhere or even the middle of the Pacific Ocean.  And my understanding is that TWO WOMEN gave birth in a clinic during a windstorm.  Not on the side of the road in the middle of a tsunami.  Nobody assisted Dr. Wayne Shady with TWO births?  He didn't even work at the clinic.  Is there just some open-door policy at clinics where doctors can walk in and conduct major procedures without notifying ANYBODY?  I know California is laid-back but it ain't that laid-back. 

And there's NO record of NotBeth's birth.  I understand that women give birth and abandon babies at churches, hospitals, or other place but the authorities are usually able to track the mother down because it's fairly easy to identify a women who has just given birth. 

He did work at the clinic. He mentioned multiple times that he took shifts there. But somehow everyone else working that day was gone or couldn't get there? That part definitely doesn't make sense. But Dr. Shady was on staff there. 

And I guess that's why there was no paperwork because he was the only other person in the building. One wonders where the woman whose baby died went, if it was so impossible to get in and out of the clinic.

[mightysparrow]

8 minutes ago, jenrising said:

He did work at the clinic. He mentioned multiple times that he took shifts there. But somehow everyone else working that day was gone or couldn't get there? That part definitely doesn't make sense. But Dr. Shady was on staff there. 

And I guess that's why there was no paperwork because he was the only other person in the building. One wonders where the woman whose baby died went, if it was so impossible to get in and out of the clinic.

Thanks for correcting me.  It doesn't make any sense that he would be the only person working.  One thing California takes very seriously is LIABILITY and they wouldn't have a new doctor working alone, no matter how bad the storm is.  Like I said, it wasn't a TSUNAMI!

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, mightysparrow said:

I'm happy that the truth has come out about Beth.  Now it's time to end this storyline and reunite the family.

For once, I'm glad this this show is putting us out of our misery, but it begs the question as to why it was even done in the first place if it ended so quickly (assuming this wraps up once JMW goes on leave)

The last baby switch story that was ever received well was the one on ATWT, and there were a whole lot of moving parts that made it entertaining to watch:

*Craig who wanted custody of his son, so he switched his child with the one he and his wife were about to adopt before said wife goes into coma

*Jennifer, who struggles with her baby's death and eventually turns to hard drugs (which leads to her death from a rate complication that can occur months or years after use)

*Carly who some sort of way became the baby's legal guardian, and her holding onto het presumed only sister's legacy

*Gwen, the bio mother of Rosanna's baby who decided she did want to raise her child, coming into conflict with Carly.

*Paul, wanting to keep Jen safe from Craig and getting his girlfriend Emily to help keep the secret 

....all that is just the direct players in that story and without digging into the splinters this story took in the five months it played out. We got a break from the sadness. There were no less than three romances to spring from this and the custody debate went on until literally the last month before it's end.

This whole thing here on B&B is OItNB-level tragedy porn. I could get the misguided logic if Steffy or Taylor found out and got to play hero in doing the thing any decent person would do as a way of "amends," which would be cringy on it's own. But apparently it looks like newbie #4 is gonna blow the cover on this quack that even Dr. Nick from The Simpsons would feel embarrassment for?

What was the point of any of this when everyone is gonna be in the same place they we're a month ago? Steffy doesn't seem interested in Liam (thank God) and Liam doesn't seem interested in her, which is a true Christmas miracle in itself. That will change, but it doesn't seem like this will be the catalyst. Not even the anti Hope crowd will be happy when she gets Phoebeth back and Liam hasn't reunited with the slattern.

So why was my time wasted?

48 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

One thing California takes very seriously is LIABILITY

As a California resident, I can confirm this. Not medical related, but we have a Bureau of Automotive Repair that keeps people from being ripped off. Like, those instances where you leave your car for an oil change and come back to a $500 bill for brake drums and spark plugs? Doesn't happen here, not least of all because they'll have to eat that cost if it's discovered they did not contact you. (A fact I learned in auto class and got my mom a full refund because her last service forgot to record the odometer. Whoops!)

[Waldo13]

So now we have a very contrived story of how the babies were switched.  How coincidental that two woman, on a fairly small island in a small clinic, are in labor at the same time.  The woman, who had the still birth, is able to walkout within minutes of giving birth and doesn't give a crap of what happens to the baby.  If she felt no remorse, than why did that woman carry the baby to term?  So the still birth had the beauty mark is that now a red herring or will become somehow useful in the future?  Now that Flo knows the baby mother's name, is that another red herring or will Flo use that information to get Beth back to Hope?  

I really can't put into words how much I hate the whole baby switch story. First of all it's having to watch Taylor's and Dr Wayne Shady's shit ass acting and days and days of Hope's despair.  It's a little over done but it's breaking my heart.  What is the real purpose of this story though?  Is it to elevate The Wicked Queen of The West and her Flying Monkey to make Dorothy and the Scarecrow to follow The Yellow Brick Road?  I'm waiting for Hope to sing "Somewhere Over the Rainbow".  Stuffy has been elevated enough to the detriment of many characters that have fallen in her wake. 

Every time I hear the name Phoebe, I think of "Smelly Cat".  

[Gam2]

Can we finally be done with this story and give Beth back to her parents? I just cannot watch Hope in such despair and “hopeless” any longer. Please get her out of that dark cabin and out into the sunshine with her baby!!

[bannana]

As difficult as it is to watch, I do think that for once this soap is portraying the actual grief that Hope would be expected to be going through.  The writers are doing a good job with presenting her perspective, as well as everyone around her, who are trying to drag her out of the pit of depression she is in.

I don't think this story is over, because what then was the point?  One of our PTV'ers laid out some of what will now be the likely scenario, and here is my speculation:

• Steffy adopts Phoebe, and she and Taylor and Ridge fall in love with her.
• Liam drifts away from a desperately grieving Hope, to a much happier environment with Kelly and Phoebe.
• Hope in her depression cannot even care about holding on to Waffle Boy.
• Taylor finds out the truth, or maybe Ridge does, or both, and they decide to keep it from everyone so poor Kelly won't lose another sister she doesn't even know, and so that Steffy and Liam will end up together.
• Eventually the truth comes out, and Brooke will dump Ridge when she learns of his nefarious doings as regards her own granddaughter.  But Bill is with Katie by now, whoops.
• Liam eventually learns the truth and wants to keep the Steffy, Kelly, Phoebe fam together, see ya later Hope.  Or, he wants to get back with Hope and Beth, but Hope realizes he is a Waffle and dumps him entirely.

[mightysparrow]

I don't buy the 'Steffy falls in love with Beth' theory.  Hauxdilox and her killer mommy aren't adopting a child because Hauxdi always wanted to have more kids or to add to their family.  Hauxdi and TayTay are buying a companion for Kelly.  That's been the point from the very beginning; to provide Kelly with a playmate.  This new baby is coming in to the home as a second-class citizen.  There was a time when women like these two could actually purchase a child for that specific purpose.  It was called slavery.  I don't think it's possible to 'fall in love' with a slave. 

If and when Beth gets taken from Hauxdilox, she's going to be upset because one of her possessions (a very expensive one) was taken away.  The fact that it will make Hope (and Brooke) happy will add to her displeasure.  It will probably drive her mother crazy, or crazier, and people better start taking cover because we know what happens when Killer Taylor loses her mind.

The best case scenario would be for Hauxdi to adopt Sally's puppy.  She and her mother are looking for a 'pet' for Kelly.  But I think that people would be more upset that the puppy was treated as second-best than if Hope's child gets that treatment.  Beth needs to get back to her mother and father as soon as possible because she needs to be loved for who she is, not for the service she provides.

[SweePea59]

They're really starting to make me hate Beth. Saint Beth.

[ByTor]

13 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Ridge should have died the first time $Bill tossed his grimy ass out of a helicopter. 

I think Ridge should have never come back after leaving Brooke over Deacon and "textgate".

[nkotb]

I honestly think that what we'll see is Steffy getting PhoeBeth, & playing happy family for a very few weeks. Something will happen to Steffy, an accident or something innocent, to where she's in a coma, to facilitate JMW's maternity leave, which is coming up pretty soon. During Steffy's medical crisis, Liam & Hope care for Kelly & PhoeBeth, which makes sense as Liam is Kelly's dad, & the whole point of PhoeBeth is for her & Kelly to be close. Hope bonds with her daughter during that time. 

Best case scenario is that Taylor finds out about the switch from Flo, most likely after Steffy miraculously recovers & tells Ridge, who doesn't think they should tell. However, Taylor knows what it's like to lose a child, so she eventually makes things right & tells the truth. This would be twofold; Taylor is partially redeemed for shooting Bill (I have no idea how that would work, but I could see them thinking that, maybe even Bill saying that since she returned PhoeBeth to his son, all is forgiven, as long as she stays in therapy), as well as facilitating the latest Bridge blowup, because you know Brooke will be furious that Ridge knew & didn't tell. The only fly in the ointment is that by then, Batie will be in full swing, so Brooke won't have a safety net. There is seriously a lack of available, datable men in BelLA, & now Dr. Shady isn't redeemable, so he's out, too.

Call me, Bell, this is better than half of the dreck you allow to air.

[Joimiaroxeu]

Are we supposed to feel sorry for Dr. Waterloo Bridge? Yah, nah. There's always a choice not to do something illegal when immediate dire consequences aren't at stake. He could've told Zoe her life was in danger and she could've acted accordingly without involving an innocent woman's baby.

Why is it so important for Kelly to have a sister RIGHT NOW? A pair of new shoes? Okay. A new dress? Okay. A new human being? WTAF, Steffy and Taylor.

Quote

I couldn't believe that Reese told Flo the truth!  How stupid is he?  

She might not be too bright either. Now she knows a life-altering secret involving, among other things, a kidnapping. Her life is now in huge jeopardy.

[mightysparrow]

5 hours ago, ByTor said:

I think Ridge should have never come back after leaving Brooke over Deacon and "textgate".

Damn Skippy!

When Brooke looked up to see who was showering her with rose petals and the camera zoomed up to reveal TK, who looked like a slob even though he was wearing a tuxedo, it was the beginning of the end for Ridge Forrester.   I've seen TK on chat shows and he seems to be a charming man and is well liked.  But that charm doesn't translate into his acting.  Zach was a neanderthal, just like Ridge.  Some see that as 'manly'.  It's the same with $Bill, when he was bullying anything with two 'x' chromosomes.  Some mourn that $Bill isn't like that anymore.  I think it's evolution.  It's unfortunate that TK's Ridge has devolved into the 'missing link'.

[mightysparrow]

11 minutes ago, Joimiaroxeu said:

She might not be too bright either. Now she knows a life-altering secret involving, among other things, a kidnapping. Her life is now in huge jeopardy.

Flo-Rida needs to beat feet to the nearest Catalina PD station and start talking witness protection.

11 hours ago, SweePea59 said:

They're really starting to make me hate Beth. Saint Beth.

Damn that diabolical newborn for being kidnapped at birth.  She really is scheming Logan, isn't she?

[RuntheTable]

Need to get some things off my chest.

I am pissed off with all this Phoebe talk. Phoebe has been dead since 2008, and there has been barely a whisper about her since. Ridge never mentions her, and up until recently neither did Steffy or Taylor. Oh, but now that Steffy is hell bent on giving Kelly a sister all we hear is Phoebe, Phoebe, Phoebe! And that shit yesterday about how much Steffy misses her and how she always thinks about her? Rubbish! Steffy has been far too busy interfering in Liam and Hope’s happiness, bludgeoning cousins, harming other cousins, getting married and divorced for all the wrong reasons, waging a hate campaign against her ex-MIL, being gifted CEO positions, and most recently, being our new Everywoman, to have ever given her late twin a second thought. And all this talk about her concern for how Liam and Hope will handle her adopting a child right after they lost their’s rings false and hollow. The very fact that Steffy is laying voice to her concerns shows how wrong and insensitive it is; so, of course she will go forward with this hackneyed plan.

Hey, Dr. Whatthefuckever, you can just shove those crocodile tears MMMMKAY? Fucker. You know, I don’t care all that much about Zoe, but I certainly don’t want to see her hurt, or see her pay for her father’s idiocy. I also understand that Dr. W’s back was against the wall and he was concerned for his daughter’s safety. But listen up pal, that is why you live a clean life and don’t get involved with people who come looking to break your knees if you don’t pay up. And the fact that you were stupid enough to get yourself in this mess in no way gives you the right to fuck with Hope and Liam’s happiness. I didn’t give you the right to bring that dead child into Hope’s room and lay her in Hope’s arms. It didn’t give you the right to screw with baby Beth’s future. You are rotten. You stink. I don’t know how far this Flo person is willing to go for you, but I can only hope she understands how devastating this series of events have been for one person who has already lost one child.

How do Steffy and Taylor plan to explain this baby to everyone? It can take a very long time to adopt a child in the US, and infants can take years. I know folks who gave up on US adoptions and went overseas so they could adopt before they retire. But Steffy just has this perfect, healthy infant magically fall into her arms? I mean, what are they gonna say? “Oh, we met this woman who didn’t want her newborn?” or “They were having an overstock sale down at Babies-r-Us?” or “Well, we were able to cut some corners because we are Forrester after all.” There is no way they can explain this away. It doesn’t make sense that they would get this baby so quick unless she was a black market child. Plot fucking holes.

 

I hate this SL with the heat of more than a thousand suns and then some. Hope has been tortured enough and Steffy gets two healthy babies. It is just too, too much. And it will only get worse when Hope, and no doubt Brooke, are seen as the bad guys for wanting to take Beth from Steffy. That will be more than I can bear and I suspect I will be tuning out again.

[CountryGirl]

Yesterday's show was just so much tomfuckery, which is saying something for this show.

First, we have Brooke at the cabin, trying to get Hope to eat and Hope continues to refuse food, saying "Liam can have it." Um, you have to eat sometime, Hope.

Brooke suggests that Hope put down the sonogram photograph she's been holding since Beth's "death" and go back to work.

Hope is having none of it and seriously, Brooke. It's been barely a week since Hope gave birth. Her body is still recovering, not to mention her mental state. While Brooke's heart is in the right place, Hope is in no shape to go back to work just now and if she had given birth to a live baby, no one would be expecting her to.

Brooke goes on to tell Hope that a piece of her will always be missing, but someday, Hope would hold a baby and have children if that's what she wants.

Not fucking helpful, Brooke. There is no guarantee that Hope will ever get pregnant again or carry a baby to term, so quit making assumptions. 

Hope is tired of hearing this, too, telling her mother: "No! No! I don't think I can go through this again. I have already lost two pregnancies. I have already lost two babies. What is wrong with me?" She berates herself for passing out during Beth's birth and that's a key fact there as we'll soon see.

Brooke assures her there's nothing wrong with her but can you blame Hope for being gun shy, especially a week out, when talk turns to another baby. And she could have ten babies and they won't replace the ones she lost or erase the hurt.

Over at Dr. F's, we finally get the truth we've known about before the story even aired - he switched the babies and Hope's baby is alive. Flo is pissssssed.

She's also an idiot to go along with this no matter how much he works her with his kisses and calling her "baby."

Although I do want to LMAO that this is who"I can read people" Taylor is going to get even further involved with.

I really, really hope this storyline is wrapped up by the time JMW goes on maternity leave but I'm betting it won't. This show has proved countless times that it has shit timing - rushing or stalling storylines, regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

We get some never-before-seen footage of Reese talking to the mother of the stillborn baby who apparently waltzed in and out of the clinic as if giving birth ain't no thang.

Then we cut to Reese remembering delivering the baby and Hope passing out as he holds a cooing Beth.

We also see him lying to a newly-arrived Liam that the baby died. 

He is the scum of the fucking earth forever as he admits he put a dead baby in Hope's arms. And I don't want to hear any more of his whining about doing it for Zoe. It's his fault she's in the situation in the first place and this is how he thinks he's going to fix things???

Dr. F: "Hope will never know her baby is alive."

I wouldn't be too sure about that.

And Flo? You are now an accessory to kidnapping and fraud. I'm hoping she comes clean but we know they will drag this out to torture Hope and throw a wrench into a rock-solid-for-months Lope and in that case, have fun sitting in the cell next to Dr. F.

But hey, at least anyone still in denial (ahem - doubt) that the baby is Beth...well, it's Beth.

I'll save the biggest pile of steaming horseshit for last. 

Hauxdi and Whackado discuss how they can't wait to get their hands on a real live baby doll for Kelly to play with.

And remember, kids, the most important thing about adopting a new sister for Kelly is that she's "beautiful." Nevermind that she's the product of human trafficking.

The more I think about this, the more fucked up it becomes. Does Steffy have the right to do as she pleases? Sure, but should she? Anyone with half a brain cell knows this is a bad idea. The timing couldn't be worse and again, it's as if they're picking out a toy for Kelly. This is a baby. A baby whom even if she weren't, I don't know, stolen, is a newborn, one who will take time and energy to raise and how fair is that to Kelly? Kelly won't even "get" for many years what this new baby means. It's one thing if Kelly had been born a multiple, but she wasn't, and how ridiculously unfair it is to her.

Even Kelly is looking up at the ceiling to say, "What did I do to deserve this?"

Then we have Steffy boo-hooing about her fearing the adoptive baby will be a constant reminder of Beth. So she clearly knows that this will be all kinds of fucked-up, but is going to proceed anyway. Same selfish bitch as always. Her getting Liam's "approval" doesn't count because he doesn't speak for Hope and also, looking like one was punched in the gut and the nutsack about 50 times doesn't = approval.

They can also lose me with all the Phoebe lovefest talk. They haven't mentioned her in years ( a good decade at least). Steffy chose to play the Liam's Dead Mom card by naming the baby she should have named Phoebe if she loved her as much as she claims to Kelly instead. Too bad, so sad it backfired in her face.

Also, their so-called love of Phoebe is tainted six ways from Sunday given both of these heifers fucked the only man she ever loved (Rick).

About sums it up...

Edited January 23, 2019 by CountryGirl

[Joimiaroxeu]

Quote

Even Kelly is looking up at the ceiling to say, "What did I do to deserve this?"

Lol, those must be Grandpa Bill's genes. Otherwise she probably wouldn't be doing much more than contemplating her navel and trying to decide what kind of plastic surgery to get. Poor child, to have to suffer being raised by two of the most self-involved women in the world, nevermind L.A.

Quote

The last baby switch story that was ever received well was the one on ATWT,

Not sure when that was since I didn't watch ATWT but AMC had a good one too with baby Miranda ending up temporarily with her mommy's best friend who was trying to use a baby to hold her marriage together. It went on for a couple of years and even branched over to OLTL for a while.

[mightysparrow]

@RuntheTable and @Country girl, AMEN to every word you both said.

I can't believe that people are telling a woman who has been mourning the death of her baby for a WEEK, to pick herself up and move on.  I know that grief is uncomfortable for people to watch but IT DOESN'T JUST DISAPPEAR.  Our family has mourned my father for 50 years; my mother NEVER got over it.  Hope isn't wallowing; she's doing what any NORMAL human being would do when faced with unspeakable heartbreak.  And unlike other characters, she's managed to retain her decency and goodness.  Who would blame her for going off on Sally for bringing a fucking puppy to a grieving couple?  Yet Hope was a decent enough person to step outside her agony and make amends with Sally.  I know that Liam encouraged her to do it but she still made the gesture and I love her for it.

It was hard to watch yesterday because Ray Charles could see what's coming with this story line and it makes me sick.  The 'Poor Steffy' Express is picking up speed and Hope is going to be run over. There will be no dwelling on the unspeakable cruelty and evil of Dr. Shady to put a dead baby in a woman's arms so he can sell her dead baby to cover his gambling debts.  Or the incredible stupidity of a woman who willingly goes along with a plot that's illegal AND immoral all for a man who AIN'T ALL THAT.

Watching Hauxdilox and the creature she calls 'mother' talking about a human child as if it were a pet or a handbag was disgusting.  Maybe it's a trigger for me because I'm a descendant of people who were property not so long ago.  But I can't believe how ANYBODY can watch those two and not only not want them to get another baby.  Not only that but want to pick up poor Kelly and get her as far away from the den of vipers she's trapped in.

I agree with all those who are giving this 'All Phoebe, All The Time' bullshit the side-eye.  Hauxdilox didn't give a fuck about her twin sister.  She had an opportunity to honour her sister by naming her child after her but Hauxdilox is too committed to her decades-long (and unsuccessful) obsession with Liam.  Phoebe isn't just coming into Hauxdilox' home to be Kelly's playmate.  She's also a last-ditch effort for Hauxdilox to entrap a man who has told her over and over and over again that HE DOESN'T WANT HER.  Hauxdilox learned that shit at her mother's knee, a woman who didn't have the grace and decency to stay away from a memorial service that she had no business attending since, weeks earlier, she had been spraying Hope with spit as she shrieked at her.  I love Brooke but that was a boneheaded thing to do.  She did it to please Ridge but she should have put Hope first.  It was bad enough that Hope held her child's memorial in the home of the woman who contributed to her first miscarriage AND kidnapped and raped her husband.

How much is Hope supposed to endure, all for committing the crime of being a 'good girl'? She can be a pill at times; most nice people can be annoying.  But Hope has NEVER set out to hurt somebody JUST BECAUSE SHE COULD.  When does this young woman get to have something for herself?  I have no plans to watch the 'poor Hauxdilox' episodes or listen to all the people who will line up to tear Hope apart for wanting HER OWN BABY.

[sugarbaker design]

The first baby switch story I watched was epic, it was OLTL at its best.  Heroine Jenny Vernon and prostitute Katrina Karr both gave birth on the same day.  Katrina claimed she didn't know the baby's father, and was set to give up the baby for adoption.  Jenny couldn't wait to be a mom.  Jenny's sister and Katrina's former co-worker Karen Wolek, along with Karen's best friend/former pimp Marco was visiting her new niece in the neonatal unit when Karen noticed her niece was dead.  Did Karen notify the medical professionals?  No way!  She and Marco switch Jenny's deceased infant with Kat's very live one.  What followed was years of drama, with more characters discovering the secret, ultimately ending with Jenny giving her baby to its rightful mother Kat.  It was must see TV.

[Anna Yolei]

1 hour ago, RuntheTable said:

I am pissed off with all this Phoebe talk. Phoebe has been dead since 2008, and there has been barely a whisper about her since. Ridge never mentions her, and up until recently neither did Steffy or Taylor.

And for the rare instance she does bring up Phoebe's memory, it's almost always as a reminder to Hope that she has no sister anymore.

And then, there's the whole bit of her jumping on Rick's disco stick before Phoebe was barely cold, when the very last conversation she had before she died was an argument with that asshole for trying to seduce Steffy for revenge against Ridge. Which (albeit in what looked like a retcon when the story understandably fell flat with fans) is exactly what he was doing the whole time.

I'd box my sister's ears from the grave just for that alone.

1 hour ago, RuntheTable said:

How do Steffy and Taylor plan to explain this baby to everyone? It can take a very long time to adopt a child in the US, and infants can take years. I know folks who gave up on US adoptions and went overseas so they could adopt before they retire.

Sandra Bullock very famously went to adopt a baby about 9 years ago, and even for one she got through the foster care system, it took her four years to get vetted. and that, I'm sure, is even with her name and fame getting her through the system a bit more quickly.

Private adoption can be more quick but even with that, there's a vetting process and it isn't "OK, gimme money and here's your baby." Not even the local animal shelters around here operate like that.

18 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

How much is Hope supposed to endure, all for committing the crime of being a 'good girl'? She can be a pill at times; most nice people can be annoying.  But Hope has NEVER set out to hurt somebody JUST BECAUSE SHE COULD. 

I don't even think it's so much that nice people can be annoying so much as cloying ones who can't read a room and force their own morality and values onto others instead od just living their lives. That was mostly why I got sick of Hope's virginity story where she made it Such a Thing(tm) and announced that decision to remain a virgin on television before talking that over in private with Liam. This is in contrast to Phoebe, who just wasn't ready for sex and it wasn't a marketing ploy or a morality issue, it was just her. I never got tired of her, nor of Bridget who remained decent and kind and good despite all the shit Brooke, Nick, Felicia, Stephanie and Katie put her through.

With that out the say, I agree. She didn't deserve this. Hell, I wouldn't even say I'd want to watch a story where Steffy lost Kelly as "punishment" for screwing Bill.

[bannana]

33 minutes ago, sugarbaker design said:

The first baby switch story I watched was epic, it was OLTL at its best.  Heroine Jenny Vernon and prostitute Katrina Karr both gave birth on the same day.  Katrina claimed she didn't know the baby's father, and was set to give up the baby for adoption.  Jenny couldn't wait to be a mom.  Jenny's sister and Katrina's former co-worker Karen Wolek, along with Karen's best friend/former pimp Marco was visiting her new niece in the neonatal unit when Karen noticed her niece was dead.  Did Karen notify the medical professionals?  No way!  She and Marco switch Jenny's deceased infant with Kat's very live one.  What followed was years of drama, with more characters discovering the secret, ultimately ending with Jenny giving her baby to its rightful mother Kat.  It was must see TV.

@sugarbaker design, I was thinking of this storyline yesterday also. It was not telegraphed, the way this one was, and was so surprising.  Plus, IIRC, we were meant to be torn, that it would be okay cause Kat didn't really want her baby.  Then Kat's life spiralled and a bunch of other things happened leading to the truth to come out.  That was some good soap.

[sugarbaker design]

1 hour ago, bannana said:

@sugarbaker design 

Then Kat's life spiralled and a bunch of other things happened leading to the truth to come out.  That was some good soap.

Word, @BANNANA

[CountryGirl]

Oh wow, that takes me back re OLTL. Judith Light's performance as Karen Woleck on the stand where she was outed as a prostitute is still, IMO, the best performance in soap history.

[Waldo13]

I knew Hope would get around to the fact that Liam is not mourning Beth because he has another daughter.

Stuffy keeps talking about a cute baby. It's a baby you want to adopt not a puppy.  I would say, since I have an adopted grandson and granddaughter, personality is more important than looks.  

  

[ByTor]

3 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Who would blame her for going off on Sally for bringing a fucking puppy to a grieving couple? 

Continuing on the stupidity of the puppy, Sally said that she found from working at an animal shelter that puppies are wonderful at giving people comfort.  I don't disagree with that sentiment, but who in their right mind, who loves animals enough to donate their time to a shelter, would give anyone a puppy as a surprise gift?  Maybe if Hope said "if only I had a puppy to make me feel better" then I could see it, but you never just give one to someone, especially when you have no idea if they even like dogs.