S01.E03: Fight Or Flight

[random chance]

It's 2015 and there are so many inter-racial relationships on TV that you'd think this would no longer be an issue.

I don't think it is, and if they thought it was they wouldn't do it - because it's a pretty cowardly industry when you get right down to it.

[bmoore4026]

I think I know what the problem with this show is - it's a Superman show that references Superman a lot, but won't show him.  And this is aggravating.  You can't completely divorce Supergirl from the concept of Superman, it's just not possible.  It's very hard to angst about being in the Man of Steel's shadow when the character has been little more than a shadow himself.

 

The two haven't had any real interaction and, though everyone gushes about Superman's accomplishments and we the viewers already know he's supposed to be great, we still need to see people actually fawning over Superman instead of just hearing about it and seeing Kara's reaction.  I mean, even Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead had the other Hamlet characters in it, including Hamlet himself, yet the play is still about the two title characters.  Ditto with Wicked.  In the book, Dorothy had more interaction with Elphaba and in the musical, we see her in silhouette.  It's still more substantial than how this show has handled Superman.

 

I know it may be horrible, but we must sacrifice another fine young actor to The Superman Curse for this show.  Yes, misfortune might befall this man, but this show needs Superman as a supporting character in some capacity, because the regular supporting cast is boring! 

Edited November 15, 2015 by bmoore4026

[statsgirl]

If all we see of Superman is texting with Kara, that works for me.  I think (hope) he's so prominent in these episodes because they've been about Kara accepting her powers and trying to make something different of Supergirl while everyone is comparing her to Superman and finding her lacking. Especially Cat.  I think that after this set-up, there will be less talk of  Superman on the show.

 

 

Still, I really didn't warm up to Arrow at all until about the third episode and didn't love it until halfway through the first season.

That's the Felicity Factor.  ;-)

 

I think MB is very engaging, and the Kara/Alex relationship is great.  I don't need another character to bond to, and I hope the show does well enough that it stays on air.

[legaleagle53]

Yes. Maybe even Cousin Kal. The thing is they are cousins, due to their moms being sisters, so Kal is Kara's cousin. In this iteration, the show showed a very young infant. She would barely have had a chance to have any attachment to Kal, but know him mostly as Aunt Lara's son, her new cousin. My brother and sister-in-law, parents of three already, had a surprise baby a couple of years back. The oldest is college-age and the youngest is about Kara's age. They love their baby brother to bits, but they are off doing their own things.  I don't see Kara and Kal bonding before the destruction of Krypton is what I'm saying.

 

Correction:  Their relation comes through their fathers, Jor-El and Zor-El, who were brothers.  Alura was Kal's aunt by marriage, not by blood, and Astra isn't related to him at all -- she is Kara's blood aunt on her mother's side.  Kal's mother was Lara, who was Kara's aunt by marriage.

Edited November 11, 2015 by legaleagle53

[NorthstarATL]

I thought that was a fun episode. The "Superman" thing had to be addressed eventually, and it was O.K., given that in this iteration he apparently had nothing to with her learning to use her powers or assimilating to Earth, making her resentment more appropriate. He can't be everywhere, all the time, though, and if there's room in the fandom's psyche for Flash, Green Arrow, and others to exist upon the same Earth as Superman, then surely there's room for his cousin.

  I liked the swipe at Jimmy Olsen fans of having the red-headed guy removed from Cat Grant's sight! Liked seeing Lucy Lane as well! Too bad we've already had the almost-plane crash in the first episode, though the many Lucys have had many different professions, with the flight attendant being most associated with the Olsen romance. And, as long as Lucy IS here, it might be nice to explore other potential love interests for Kara. Supergirl generally had a bunch of strange suitors back in the Silver Age, when she was first starting out. Jimmy crushed on her, but she rarely noticed.

   As others have said, the sisterly bond is the one that works best thus far. I hope we'll see them return home for the holidays and get a full Danvers Family episode.

[MarkHB]

No, she called and referred to him as Kal-El so she should do so now. It feels like the writers think the audience dumber than a box of rocks and cannot remember their biological relationship.

 

I think it's more that they feel casual viewers won't know who "Cal" or Kal-El is, so they're avoiding having her using it.

[Xenith22]

I think maybe the intent was to imply she wouldn't have died but just have been badly beat up LIKE Superman had, but it was too vague.

Eh...she was injured and lost consciousness right in front of an basically unharmed Reactron with no one around except Max Lord.  That seems like a scenario where her death was pretty imminent.  About the only way she survives that situation is if Reactron is stupid and decides to kill her later like in front of her cousin for maximum emotional impact?  That is not really much of a parallel to Superman taking a beating fighting Reactron to a draw...

 

So I get why Kara was upset about james calling in the big gun. But honestly Kara, you lost conciousness three seconds after Clark showed up. If he hadn't she'd probably have been killed. I get that she wants to be independent but she's actually very lucky that Supes is there for her.

This.  And at no point did she ever acknowledge this.  I am fine with her having insecurity regarding her cousin.  It makes perfect sense.  I could accept if part of her was mad at Jimmy for calling for help.  But it just bugged the shit out of me that at no point did she EVER acknowledge that in this one instance his calling for help probably saved her life.  She never thanked him, or apologized to him for the way she snapped at him.  In the end the show treated it like he was the one who was 100% wrong for what he did, to the point where the writers felt it necessary to turn the issue into his own insecurity as a way to make what he did more wrong.  I'm sorry but that just felt like a load of bullshit to me that made me actually dislike Kara for the first time. 

[wayne67]

"Any plans to start a family?"

"Nobody ever asks my cousin those questions."

 

LOL A woman had input into that.

 

Actually that's the question that always bugs me about the last male of his species trope. Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ? Did they ever address that with Lois and Superman? Did they ever have super offspring? or children at all?

 

My point being. I'd totally ask that of Superman, because it's far easier for him to single ... handedly help repopulate his lost alien species than it would be for SuperGirl. I may have spent far too much time thinking that if Kal El and evil Aunt hooked up they could probably have some non incest pure bred Kryptonians to add to the 'family'. 

 

 

I am fine with her having insecurity regarding her cousin.  It makes perfect sense.  I could accept if part of her was mad at Jimmy for calling for help.  But it just bugged the shit out of me that at no point did she EVER acknowledge that in this one instance his calling for help probably saved her life.  She never thanked him, or apologized to him for the way she snapped at him.  In the end the show treated it like he was the one who was 100% wrong for what he did, to the point where the writers felt it necessary to turn the issue into his own insecurity as a way to make what he did more wrong.  I'm sorry but that just felt like a load of bullshit to me that made me actually dislike Kara for the first time. 

 

 

I didn't mind that Kara was initially annoyed at having to be bailed out by Jimmy & Superman but it grated that she never seemed grateful for having her life saved by Jimmy reacting that way. She was unconscious for HOURS afterwards. Reactron could have done anything with her limp unconscious body during that time.

 

I really hope they stop the whole needs to be given a pep talk every episode routine. That was one of the tropes that drove me crazy about Flash. How many pep talks about your heart do you need to hear before you get some self esteem. 

 

This was a meh episode for me. I liked the first 2 episodes far more. Hopefully they don't rely too much on stupid nonsensical things like having a fight with a guy who is currently out of ammo and not following him... 

[pennben]

I look forward to the reveal that Cat knew Kara was Supergirl from day one, and that all of her attitude was Cat's way of helping Supergirl grow.

 

I meant to circle back to this before.  I think they certainly have left that possibility open to this point.

 

I noted while watching when Cat saw Supergirl (after Supergirl hijacked her for the interview), her first line was "It's you", said in a somewhat vague voice, before she segued into her interview questions.

 

I wonder whether they knew when they filmed that whether or not Cat knew that Kara was Supergirl.  That line, and how it was read, was completely ambiguous so as to allow them to go either way down the road.

Edited November 11, 2015 by pennben

[MarkHB]

Actually that's the question that always bugs me about the last male of his species trope. Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ? Did they ever address that with Lois and Superman? Did they ever have super offspring? or children at all?

 

They did in various "imaginary stories," as well as Superman Returns (the Brandon Routh movie).  In mainstream comics and TV continuity, even in the versions where they've gotten together it has never gotten to the kids stage.  Many years ago, Larry Niven wrote a piece titled "Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex" in which he argued that Superman trying to have a child with Lois was doomed to tragedy, as a Kryptonian baby doing normal kicking in a human woman would rupture the uterus, if not Lois's abdomen.

[wayne67]

They did in various "imaginary stories," as well as Superman Returns (the Brandon Routh movie).  In mainstream comics and TV continuity, even in the versions where they've gotten together it has never gotten to the kids stage.  Many years ago, Larry Niven wrote a piece titled "Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex" in which he argued that Superman trying to have a child with Lois was doomed to tragedy, as a Kryptonian baby doing normal kicking in a human woman would rupture the uterus, if not Lois's abdomen.

 

Do we know if enhanced Kryptonian women could survive the foetal kicking? Have they ever explored whether Kryptonian insides are similarly bullet proof? 

 

Has anyone ever shot Superman in the mouth while he was talking? 

 

Would a fetus even absorb the gravity/solar radiation that causes Kryptonians to develop super powers ? 

 

These are the questions that comics refuse to answer probably because the implications of the human race being completely obsoleted by a more potent alien race would probably make too many people uncomfortable considering history. 

[lion10]

Actually that's the question that always bugs me about the last male of his species trope. Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ? Did they ever address that with Lois and Superman? Did they ever have super offspring? or children at all?

My point being. I'd totally ask that of Superman, because it's far easier for him to single ... handedly help repopulate his lost alien species than it would be for SuperGirl. I may have spent far too much time thinking that if Kal El and evil Aunt hooked up they could probably have some non incest pure bred Kryptonians to add to the 'family'.

It's not Superman's style to hit it or quit it. And I feel like your idea has the potential to horribly backfire. Superman goes around creating a bunch of mini-gods and what happens 16-20 years down the line? Superman's the way he is because of the Kents' upbringing. What if one of the kids has a terrible childhood or a group of them decide to rule the world one day?

[Kromm]

Actually that's the question that always bugs me about the last male of his species trope. Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ? Did they ever address that with Lois and Superman? Did they ever have super offspring? or children at all?

 

My point being. I'd totally ask that of Superman, because it's far easier for him to single ... handedly help repopulate his lost alien species than it would be for SuperGirl. I may have spent far too much time thinking that if Kal El and evil Aunt hooked up they could probably have some non incest pure bred Kryptonians to add to the 'family'. 

This issue was ducked by the comics because at least after the first few years, in most versions, Kandor still existed. A whole city of Kryptonians who are just kept out of the regular universe by contrivance, but who'd answer the "how the species continues" question. 

You've also had times where Argo City also still existed rather than having later been destroyed (again, magically out of reach but out there somewhere), as well as the splinter race, the Daxamites (who some version simply say are LIKE Kyrptonians, but others seem to act like they were a splinter colony--the excuse for them not being "out" in the galaxy being that they're mega-xenophobic and so all stick to their planet). 

[Winston Wolfe]

 

She was unconscious for HOURS afterwards. Reactron could have done anything with her limp unconscious body during that time.

Guess I'm already too into this show and Kara/Melissa as this thought made me very uncomfortable.  Throughout main stream comics only DC (JLA-Identity Crisis) and Marvel (either FF or the Avengers, I forget which) have touched upon the issues of rape and sexual abuse.  And, IIRC, non-meta human females were the victims (that was certainly the case with Sue Dignby in Identity Crisis).  Girl power trope aside, I think SG is too much of a "feel good" show to go down that dark path.

[lion10]

Guess I'm already too into this show and Kara/Melissa as this thought made me very uncomfortable. Throughout main stream comics only DC (JLA-Identity Crisis) and Marvel (either FF or the Avengers, I forget which) have touched upon the issues of rape and sexual abuse. And, IIRC, non-meta human females were the victims (that was certainly the case with Sue Dignby in Identity Crisis). Girl power trope aside, I think SG is too much of a "feel good" show to go down that dark path.

I think they meant Reactron could have killed her while she was out which makes her being mad at James fairly dumb. She doesn't possess Superman's level of experience or the same amount of strength and goes up against a guy who's fought Superman to a draw multiple times. How was that fight supposed to go?

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

I Kent With This
The world learns that Supergirl has a famous cousin, and apparently so does he.

[Winston Wolfe]

 

I think they meant Reactron could have killed her while she was out

Possibly.  Wayne 67's comment was open-ended and it read a certain way to me.  There were a lot of different things that could have happened to Kara while she was out cold, and I think that was the commenter's primary point.

She doesn't possess Superman's level of experience or the same amount of strength

We know that for sure about experience, but the strenght level differential hasn't been determined as far as I can tell.  As far as Supes is concerned, sometimes it appears he's as strong as the writers need him to be in a particular situation.  Only Byrne went out of his way to clearly define Kal's strength level and various other abilities.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Winston Wolfe

[NorthstarATL]

Possibly.  Wayne 67's comment was open-ended and it read a certain way to me.  There were a lot of different things that could have happened to Kara while she was out cold, and I think that was the commenter's primary point.

We know that for sure about experience, but the strenght level differential hasn't been determined as far as I can tell.  As far as Supes is concerned, sometimes it appears he's as strong as the writers need him to be in a particular situation.  Only Byrne went out of his way to clearly define Kal's strength level and various other abilities.

It depends upon whether the writers define the powers as triggered by the yellow sun or if the sun acts as a solar battery. The latter is most common, and Kara's relative size should imply that she can store less energy than her cousin.

 

Actually that's the question that always bugs me about the last male of his species trope. Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ? Did they ever address that with Lois and Superman? Did they ever have super offspring? or children at all?

Initially he didn't feel the allegiance to his lost planet, but, just in case he did, Kara was introduced as a fifteen-year-old first cousin, and her youth precluded them waiving the incest for the sake of the race. (Also, this was still before advances in genetics had taken place, which might allow for non-sexual repopulating.)

[statsgirl]

 

Shouldn't Superman be spreading his super oats? To try and preserve something of his lost heritage ?

He can preserve his lost heritage by means of making back-up copies of whatever information came in his spacepod.  He was too young to be able to remember any of what he went through on Krypton.

 

As for wanting to preserve his species, that would be pretty arrogant of him.  Why should they be preserved?  They were feeble/uncivilized to blow up their own planet, and the only reason they're "super" in Earth is because of Earth's sun. There's nothing so special about them to preserve them as a species and a very bad idea to create a super race on Earth.

[lion10]

He can preserve his lost heritage by means of making back-up copies of whatever information came in his spacepod. He was too young to be able to remember any of what he went through on Krypton.

As for wanting to preserve his species, that would be pretty arrogant of him. Why should they be preserved? They were feeble/uncivilized to blow up their own planet, and the only reason they're "super" in Earth is because of Earth's sun. There's nothing so special about them to preserve them as a species and a very bad idea to create a super race on Earth.

There's a variety of reasons in comics for why Krypton exploded. It's natural to want to propagate the species, why should Superman be denied that? How is that arrogant? As for the WHY...Kryptonians are fucking amazing. They're natural biological solar batteries that gain powers based on how much and what type of sun they've been exposed to. They're faster than a locomotive, able to jump tall buildings in a single bound, etc.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

It's 2015 and there are so many inter-racial relationships on TV that you'd think this would no longer be an issue.

Any relationship Kara has on this show is going to be inter-racial. She's of a Kryptonian race, passing for one of Earth's races, so it's unavoidable.

[william0102]

I don't remember all the details, but on Lois and Clark, they couldn't have a baby- he was too alien for it to work.

I don't know if that helps, and is that really something that matters anyway? It's not like Kara would be having a baby anytime soon anyway.

[Winston Wolfe]

 

The latter is most common, and Kara's relative size should imply that she can store less energy than her cousin.

Yeah, that's my thinking as well, but the writers stating that might fly in the face of this show's feminist trope.

 

Any relationship Kara has on this show is going to be inter-racial. She's of a Kryptonian race, passing for one of Earth's races, so it's unavoidable.

Interesting take.  Would that be inter-racial or intra-species?  We've seen numerous Black Kryptonians over the years.

Edited November 11, 2015 by Winston Wolfe

[ratgirlagogo]

What the hell, I'm really enjoying this show and don't understand all the kvetching.  They're moving briskly along with the plotting, answering just enough questions every episode so that questions are answered without every episode turning into a FAQ.  I'm even beginning (I would have said it was impossible) to like Callista Flockhart in this role - even had a small chuckle at Mrs. Harrison Ford describing Supergirl as the "Millennial Falcon."

 

I love the idea of adding Batgirl as a recurring character.

[wayne67]

Possibly.  Wayne 67's comment was open-ended and it read a certain way to me.  There were a lot of different things that could have happened to Kara while she was out cold, and I think that was the commenter's primary point.

 

In response by what I meant by my actual comment. I meant ANYTHING... could have happened. She could have been beaten, mutilated, raped, had her organs harvested, had her wig taken off and Reactron could have taken photos of her mutilated corpse to post online so that Superman could feel the pain he went through. This is often the problem of this disney type superheroics, the heroes are never really in danger of experiencing any real consequences for interacting with psychotic people with super powers.

 

I thought the whole point of the whole "Stronger together" was that she wouldn't go off half cocked like the Flash into dangerous situations without a plan and some backup (preferably her sister with some super weapons to continue one of the best relationships on this show). 

 

Reminds me of when Flash was knocked unconscious and they glossed over why his highschool bully didn't check to see if he was dead or not.

 

Do Kryptonians have super healing ? They don't tend to take much damage normally so I can't remember if they recover quickly from damage. At least from this show it took 2 hours for Kara to recover from nuclear blasts.

 

As for the Kryptonians and whether Superman should repopulate his people... Well they have crystal based technology that tends to be superior than human tech, they can also send babies throughout space which could revolutionize space travel and they have SUPER POWERS. Also Superman is a popular famous superhero so there should be some public interest in whether he's going to have some rugrats or not. He doesn't have to have a million kids but he could at least have a few children. Superman apparently already alters the balance of world power by himself so having a few kids could provide a new challenge that he can't beat into submission. Parenthood the ultimate challenge. Also if his kids go rogue, there'd be so much angst and it would give his super cousin an excuse not to have kids herself. 

Edited November 11, 2015 by wayne67

[FortKnox]

Winn must be making some bank to afford all that hi-tech equipment and computers. That or he stole them from the company.

[lion10]

In response by what I meant by my actual comment. I meant ANYTHING... could have happened. She could have been beaten, mutilated, raped, had her organs harvested, had her wig taken off and Reactron could have taken photos of her mutilated corpse to post online so that Superman could feel the pain he went through. This is often the problem of this disney type superheroics, the heroes are never really in danger of experiencing any real consequences for interacting with psychotic people with super powers.

 

I thought the whole point of the whole "Stronger together" was that she wouldn't go off half cocked like the Flash into dangerous situations without a plan and some backup (preferably her sister with some super weapons to continue one of the best relationships on this show). 

 

Reminds me of when Flash was knocked unconscious and they glossed over why his highschool bully didn't check to see if he was dead or not.

 

Do Kryptonians have super healing ? They don't tend to take much damage normally so I can't remember if they recover quickly from damage. At least from this show it took 2 hours for Kara to recover from nuclear blasts.

 

Wait, in universe is she wearing a wig or is that just her character's hair not in a ponytail.  And I think Kryptonians do have healing powers.  I don't know if they can regenerate organs or limbs but IIRC, in the first episode as soon as Alex pulled out the bit of axe metal that was in Kara's arm her wound healed up immediately.

[wayne67]

Wait, in universe is she wearing a wig or is that just her character's hair not in a ponytail.  And I think Kryptonians do have healing powers.  I don't know if they can regenerate organs or limbs but IIRC, in the first episode as soon as Alex pulled out the bit of axe metal that was in Kara's arm her wound healed up immediately.

 

I thought she decided on wearing a wig after her first outing when her hair was wet and slightly darker so she could it as part of her disguise. That said I don't actually remember because this is background watching for me and I'm not sure if I'll continue watching if they continue with hero needs a pep talk every episode and has a talk with her boss about who SuperGirl is every episode as well. There is only so much stupid I can tolerate. 

[Winston Wolfe]

 

This is often the problem of this disney type superheroics, the heroes are never really in danger of experiencing any real consequences for interacting with psychotic people with super powers.

Thanks for clarifying Wayne 67.  Did you happen to read Infinity Crisis, and if so, what are your thoughts?  As we get more super-hero shows, it would be interesting if one dealt with the more psychotic aspects of super-villians and the moral dilmena they often put the characters through.  When Norman Osbourne finally went over the brink in the Avengers and started wrecking major chaos, I remember one character (Hawkeye maybe?) telling Spider-Man, "this is basically your fault because you had countless opportunities to kill this guy and you didn't."  Given how "disneyfied" SG is Kara will likely never face to challenge of having to kill a bad guy, but it would be interesting to see a SH show put that issue on the table.

[Kromm]

I thought she decided on wearing a wig after her first outing when her hair was wet and slightly darker so she could it as part of her disguise. That said I don't actually remember because this is background watching for me and I'm not sure if I'll continue watching if they continue with hero needs a pep talk every episode and has a talk with her boss about who SuperGirl is every episode as well. There is only so much stupid I can tolerate.

I'm sorry, nothing on the show came even close to saying this. All we got was someone noting they couldn't tell the color of her hair from the plane footage, but there was absolutely NO followup on that from any direction.

[wayne67]

Thanks for clarifying Wayne 67.  Did you happen to read Infinity Crisis, and if so, what are your thoughts?  As we get more super-hero shows, it would be interesting if one dealt with the more psychotic aspects of super-villians and the moral dilmena they often put the characters through.  When Norman Osbourne finally went over the brink in the Avengers and started wrecking major chaos, I remember one character (Hawkeye maybe?) telling Spider-Man, "this is basically your fault because you had countless opportunities to kill this guy and you didn't."  Given how "disneyfied" SG is Kara will likely never face to challenge of having to kill a bad guy, but it would be interesting to see a SH show put that issue on the table.

 

Do you mean Infinite Crisis ? If so, I can't say I've read any DC Comics. I'm in Australia and comic books aren't as big a thing as they apparently are in the US. I've just recently started reading Marvel comics this year because of an Xmen fan fic I'm writing which is more about lampooning how useless/ineffective Iceman was. 

 

From the wiki I'd say it suffers from classic superhero/villain dynamics. The bad guys have to do the hero's dirty work so that the heroes can claim moral superiority. I don't necessarily want superheroes to kill every bad guy because that would escalate fights to an unreasonable level because the villains would need to step up their game from what essentially is elaborate and convoluted trolling to death matchs but it is a bit ridiculous how often the same villains get recycled. 

 

This show would be vastly improved if Kara got some off screen training/advice from Clark as to how to deal with a Krypton prison ship worth of alien bad guys. It's one thing not to have Superman help her with fights it's another to have him incidentally painted as an incompetent hero by not noticing the upswing of alien menaces in the area. There's been two in the last 2 weeks. I wonder if Kara told Kal El that there's another Kryptonian General on the loose ?  

[Winston Wolfe]

 

Do you mean Infinite Crisis ? If so, I can't say I've read any DC Comics.

Actually I meant Identity Crisis, by Brad Meltzer and Rags Morales.  Its an interesting study in the depths to which super heores have to go to in order to protect their loved ones. Which is partly why Alex's advice of "stop telling everyone who you are," rang so true, and Kara seemed to blow her off.  Probably part of her learning curve.  On that note, if I were Supes, I'd be toooo pissed that my "Pal" James let my secret identity slip so thoughtlessly.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

Winn must be making some bank to afford all that hi-tech equipment and computers. That or he stole them from the company.

The equipment was probably retired from service. Companies replace tech equipment on a schedule since it's more costly for something to fail unexpectedly than what they save trying to squeeze more years out of it.

[wayne67]

Actually I meant Identity Crisis, by Brad Meltzer and Rags Morales.  Its an interesting study in the depths to which super heores have to go to in order to protect their loved ones. Which is partly why Alex's advice of "stop telling everyone who you are," rang so true, and Kara seemed to blow her off.  Probably part of her learning curve.  On that note, if I were Supes, I'd be toooo pissed that my "Pal" James let my secret identity slip so thoughtlessly.

 

Oh okay. Identity Crisis sounds like a much more entertaining plot judging solely by the wikipedia entry on it. Those superheroes are awfully quick to violate people memories to get their own way. 

 

I think there is a fine line between being all alone with your super secret and telling basically everyone you meet (like Flash). So far Kara's super identity is known by at least 4 people, one of which has evil red eyes and it's the 3rd episode. Honestly I find it unbelievable that her boss hasn't clued in to Kara's identity considering that Kara keeps asking how Super Girl should act and Super Girl acts that way. Also Cat? has a tape recording of her assistant's voice. It's one thing not to notice similar face and hair. It's another not to recognise the voice of your assistant. 

 

Also Kara seems to be quite ignorant of how interviews work considering she works at a newspaper. *sigh* I'm hoping these are merely teething issues and this stuff will be slowly phased out. 

[Winston Wolfe]

 

Oh okay. Identity Crisis sounds like a much more entertaining plot judging solely by the wikipedia entry on it. Those superheroes are awfully quick to violate people memories to get their own way.

The interpersonal dynamics alone would make a great movie.  In particular, I found it interesting how Superman kept his distance from everything until it was inevitable that he would have to become involved.  Makes it easy to see how Ka-El could go years without seeing Cousin Kara.  To your comment, I found it very insightful that once Zatanna (who I wouldn't mind showing up in Supergirl) decides she'll no longer perform the wind-wipes, the other JLA members automatically assume that Martian Manhunter will.  If Supergirl lasts as long as Smallville, we need to see Kara faced with those kinds of ethical decisions.  In ten seasons of Smallville, Clark never faced those kinds of life-altering dilemnas, which is rather unrealitic given his powers and the bad guys he faced who were often out to kill his loved ones.  That's why Kara needs to hold the line at four as far as non-family who knows who she really is.

[wayne67]

The interpersonal dynamics alone would make a great movie.  In particular, I found it interesting how Superman kept his distance from everything until it was inevitable that he would have to become involved.  Makes it easy to see how Ka-El could go years without seeing Cousin Kara.  To your comment, I found it very insightful that once Zatanna (who I wouldn't mind showing up in Supergirl) decides she'll no longer perform the wind-wipes, the other JLA members automatically assume that Martian Manhunter will.  If Supergirl lasts as long as Smallville, we need to see Kara faced with those kinds of ethical decisions.  In ten seasons of Smallville, Clark never faced those kinds of life-altering dilemnas, which is rather unrealitic given his powers and the bad guys he faced who were often out to kill his loved ones.  That's why Kara needs to hold the line at four as far as non-family who knows who she really is.

 

Didn't Clark from Smallville Universe benefit from a whole bunch of convenient amnesia's whenever his super identity got compromised? I hope this show doesn't do that every time someone finds out about her. 

 

Back on topic. Are Red Eye Guy and Kara's sister the only people that work at DEO ? That organisation seems poorly staffed considering the threat level to the  city/world. Do we know what Kara's stance on villains are ? I can't actually remember (wasn't paying attention to)  what happened to Villain 1 & 3. I remember bug guy got shivved by Kara's sister for being shanghaied into service which seemed like massive overkill. Does she prioritize capture like Flash or incidental death like Batman comics ?

[Chicago Redshirt]

I think I know what the problem with this show is - it's a Superman show that references Superman a lot, but won't show him.  And this is aggravating.  You can't completely divorce Supergirl from the concept of Superman, it's just not possible.  It's very hard to angst about being in the Man of Steel's shadow when the character has been little more than a shadow himself.

 

The two haven't had any real interaction and, though everyone gushes about Superman's accomplishments and we the viewers already know he's supposed to be great, we still need to see people actually fawning over Superman instead of just hearing about it and seeing Kara's reaction.

 

In this very episode we got some of the actual fawning -- when Team Supergirl were remembering how Superman saved millions from nuclear terrorism, when Max Lord went on TV talking about how he owed Superman his life, and Winn's reaction to Clark being Superman.

 

Like another poster said, I'm fine if we just get the occasional IM from Clark. But I would have prefered that their way of communicating be more secure/covert than messaging through computers at her work.

 

Speaking of which, a) seems like Team Supergirl is doing more talking in public about Supergirl business and b) setting up in an "abandoned" section of Catco seems like it would be pretty foolish.

 

We know that for sure about experience, but the strenght level differential hasn't been determined as far as I can tell.  As far as Supes is concerned, sometimes it appears he's as strong as the writers need him to be in a particular situation.  Only Byrne went out of his way to clearly define Kal's strength level and various other abilities.

I can't think of a representation of Supergirl where it was suggested that she and Superman were literally equal in their powers, whether it was because of sexism or because almost by definition, few people are Superman's equal when it comes to his powers. (Darkseid is about the only person who is typically depicted as stronger than him). In one of the cartoons, Supergirl was recruited by Darkseid and seemed very much a match for Superman but that was in part because he was fighting with some level of restraint and she wasn't.

 

They were feeble/uncivilized to blow up their own planet, and the only reason they're "super" in Earth is because of Earth's sun. There's nothing so special about them to preserve them as a species and a very bad idea to create a super race on Earth.

I might be wrong, but for most of the versions of the Superman legend, Kryptonians were not directly responsible for the destruction of their own planet. Mainly, there was some sort of instability of the core of the planet, or its sun went nova. In "Man of Steel," Byrne threw in the notion that Kryptonians had grown cold and aloof and so didn't act to preserve themselves. The only main version of the mythos where Kryptonians actively caused the doom of their planet was "Man of Steel," where it was said to be the result of lots of war.

 

Winn must be making some bank to afford all that hi-tech equipment and computers. That or he stole them from the company.

 

Or he might have a fair amount of money from his daddy, albeit illegally gotten money. 

If Supergirl lasts as long as Smallville, we need to see Kara faced with those kinds of ethical decisions.  In ten seasons of Smallville, Clark never faced those kinds of life-altering dilemnas, which is rather unrealitic given his powers and the bad guys he faced who were often out to kill his loved ones.  That's why Kara needs to hold the line at four as far as non-family who knows who she really is.

 

I think it's somewhat contradictory to say Supergirl would need to face these ethical dilemmas if it runs as long as Smallville and then say Smallville didn't.

 

I would say, though, Smallville Clark was faced with these and other ethical dilemmas. The writers though simply weren't interested in exploring them. Who cares if Clark is throwing ordinary people 30 feet and risking brain damage or worse? It's all good that Clark's bad guys often die without his direct involvement.

 

Do we know what Kara's stance on villains are ? I can't actually remember (wasn't paying attention to)  what happened to Villain 1 & 3. I remember bug guy got shivved by Kara's sister for being shanghaied into service which seemed like massive overkill. Does she prioritize capture like Flash or incidental death like Batman comics ?

 

Villian 1, Vartox, had been beaten but committed suicide rather than being captured. Which was somewhat a cheat because even though he lost his axe and was injured because of that, it seems like he could still fight.

 

Villain 2, the Hellgrammite, was actually beaten by Alex. I am assuming he's chilling in a DEO cell somewhere. (Astra was able to fly away even though she had a Kryptonite dagger in her. For plot reasons, Supergirl didn't pursue.)

 

Villain 3, Reactron, was beaten and captured.

[wayne67]

Villian 1, Vartox, had been beaten but committed suicide rather than being captured. Which was somewhat a cheat because even though he lost his axe and was injured because of that, it seems like he could still fight.

 

Villain 2, the Hellgrammite, was actually beaten by Alex. I am assuming he's chilling in a DEO cell somewhere. (Astra was able to fly away even though she had a Kryptonite dagger in her. For plot reasons, Supergirl didn't pursue.)

 

Villain 3, Reactron, was beaten and captured.

 

Thanks for that. The fights aren't particularly memorable for me. Did we find out if Reactron got sent to a normal person jail or a super jail ? 

 

I'm guessing they are going for a combo of contrived Batman type deaths and capture. I doubt they'd want to address whether SuperGirl would kill until it comes to the season finale where Alura and Kara fight each other to the death for... reasons.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Don't remember for 100 percent sure, but Henshaw had made a point of saying that the DEO was only supposed to address alien threats originally, and at the end Henshaw told Supergirl that going forward the DEO would also help with enhanced humans.

[legaleagle53]

She doesn't possess Superman's level of experience or the same amount of strength 

 

The part in bold is only theoretically true.  Because there is no way to adequately measure the full limit of Kryptonian super-strength (since they would both break any machine designed for that purpose before even reaching the limit of their strength), Kara and Kal are for all intents and purposes equal on that point.  However, in theory, yes, he should be stronger, just as an ordinary man is normally stronger than an ordinary woman.

[Xenith22]

The part in bold is only theoretically true.  Because there is no way to adequately measure the full limit of Kryptonian super-strength (since they would both break any machine designed for that purpose before even reaching the limit of their strength), Kara and Kal are for all intents and purposes equal on that point.  However, in theory, yes, he should be stronger, just as an ordinary man is normally stronger than an ordinary woman.

 

Actually Post-Crisis....it was said that Kara was supposedly stronger/faster than her cousin.  This was due to her spending all those years in the ship that was powered by yellow sun energy, thus resulting her absorbing more of the rays than Clark got growing up on Earth.   That plus the fact that she was younger allowed her to better metabolize that energy than her cousin in the present.  Also she was much more willing to cut loose on her foes than her cousin was due to their different upbringing...  Of course over the years this stuff was seemingly tossed aside because of writers stuck on the idea that no one could ever be better than the almighty Superman at anything...

 

 

Edited November 12, 2015 by Xenith22

[fastiller]

And Jimmy can be quite the smooth guy when he wants to be.  Totally get why Kara's all dippy over him.

 

It helps that he looks like Mehcad Brooks.

 

Kara and James getting together was pretty much a foregone conclusion but yeah, I do think they may be going a little fast. Still, I have to admire James' guts, to first date Lois Lane's sister (and thus Clark's sister in law, assuming L&C are married here) and then to go after his cousin.

 

Keeping Up with the Kryptonians sounds like a sitcom I would very much enjoy. 

 

Did someone mention a reality show?

[Lazlo]

That was a lot of fun. I had issues about Alex is the pilot but that sisterly bonding was pretty adorkable. As was the cousinly bonding via IM.

Kara is still very likable. I agree the pep talks are getting a little much but it is still early days yet so I'll give the show the benefit of the doubt there. I'd also argue that Lucy Lane is a strongly established part of the Jimmy Olsen mythos so I was happy to see her aknowleged.

[Canada]

I can't believe how whiny and useless they're making Supergirl seem.  Yes, she's a young woman who may be a little unpracticed at saving the world. but she's still an alien with superhuman powers!! 

[Kromm]

I can't believe how whiny and useless they're making Supergirl seem.  Yes, she's a young woman who may be a little unpracticed at saving the world. but she's still an alien with superhuman powers!! 

So you'd prefer them making her egotistical and overconfident?

[MarkHB]

I don't think she's whiny; I think she's in the "person who isn't used to asserting herself, asserting herself" space and Melissa is pulling it off fairly well.  So far as "useless" goes, I don't think she needs to get her ass handed to her in the second act of every single episode like she's been getting, but she's pulling out the victory in the end.  Part of it might be that we're used to people who wear that \S/ being omnipotent. nigh-omniscient solo operators (including comics Kara), and the fact that the show has chosen to go with the Super Friends ensemble can't help but make her seem more dependent and therefore weaker, and yes, having her cousin fly in to literally save her life didn't help her image any.  But again, at the end of the day she is indeed saving the world and gaining experience along the way.

[CletusMusashi]

There is a lot of fun to be had from this show, but there are three big problems it has to overcome.

 

1. The writers seem more interested in Superman than Supergirl. I know he's an important part of this universe's background, but just acknowledge his existence quickly and explain why he's busy elsewhere. In the pilot, for example, when Ally Kat was going on about what a big deal Superman was to the Daily Planet, she could have rattled off a huge city-saving thing that he'd done a few days ago, another that he did the week before that, and another that he did right before that, and we would be happily filling in the blanks that he's too busy to look for anything else on his workload. Instead, after two episodes of nobody shutting up about him, he's already appeared in the third episode. If you don't want to write a Supergirl show, then get out of the way and let somebody else try. Okay?

 

2. The writers seem way, way, way more interested in James Olsen. Not in a "Hey, that guy and the lead make a cool duo" sense, but more like "those fools told me nobody wanted to watch a show about Jimmy Olsen, but I'll show them! I'll show them all! Mwa ha ha ha!" I think that what they are being paid to write is a Supergirl show, but what they are actually writing is a Superman fanfic in which Jimmy Olsen is  no longer a geeky white guy who everybody laughs at. And, hey, maybe there's a market for The Jimmy Awesome Show, but I think it's dishonest to accept a paycheck for writing something else entirely. Folks were skeptical about an hour of Commissioner Gordon fighting crime in the Mustachemobile or whatever the hell he does on Gotham, but at least the show was honest about who they'd be writing as the star. James is not only not the character anybody tunes in to see (hint to writers: check the title of your show if you forget,) but he is also so damn-near perfect that he bores the living crap out of me.

 

3. The villains are awful. Auntie El has potential. Get the writers to stop drooling over James Olsen for ten minutes and they might actually write her some decent scenes. But the other bad guys we've seen were completely and utterly forgettable. And there's no excuse for that. They don't need to be super powerful. They don't need to be brilliant.They just need to be interesting. Throw in some easy comedy-relief gangs, and then later on maybe give us the reveal that they were paid to distract her from a real crime.  Anything's better than Axe That Blows Up Easily Man, or Mopey Nuclear Dude Who Also Has a Flying Suit That Nobody Asks About Because Superman Already Knows. The best way to salvage a flawed superhero show is to have a field day throwing zany well-acted villains at them. 

 

But instead, I think the season's Big Bad is going to an evil shirtless James Olsen clone, who will eventually be stopped by, you guessed it! Superman! With a lot of help, of course from the real James Olsen. Who will then have a very special wedding episode in which he and the entire writing staff get married.

Edited November 14, 2015 by CletusMusashi

[TWP]

All through the episode I kept thinking Kara would break out into song. She really needs to lower her chin when she speaks.

You can take the girl out of Glee, but you can't take the Glee out of the girl.

[Chicago Redshirt]

I have to disagree with the perceived problems CletusMusashi cited.

 

The Superman issue is, if anything, that he and Supergirl had not been talking until this episode. Kal didn't fill Kara in, apparently, that Kryptonite is a thing. There's no indication that Kara has told Kal that her aunt is alive and is threatening to take over the world. These are important things that they should be talking about. 

 

I can understand wanting to be out of Kal's shadow, but these are basic things that relatives and fellow crime fighters should share.

 

I don't think that Jimmy is overly a focus of the show. Nothing he did was all that awesome, other than cover for Kara with Kat a couple times. I don't see him as seeming more awesome than Alex or heck even Winn.

 

In terms of the villains, Astra seems like a decent Big Bad. Vartox (the axe guy) seemed to be a pretty decent threat until his axe got blown up. Reactron managed to fight Superman to a draw multiple times, and posed a real threat to Supergirl here.

[Izeinwinter]

They should have made the time differential in their trips longer. They are not in the man of steel universe? Fine, best way to go about this would have been 

to make their superman literally the 1930's version. Chrash on earth ca 1910, raised by the Kents, legendary hero, whole thing, in his nineties when Kara lands. Heck, could make the trigger for her going public be him finally dropping from old age at 105, having a heart attack while, oh, putting out a fire. 

 

Going with the show as is.. I love the sibling relationship as it has been after the pilot. The pilot was wacky, but, you know, pilots. They have strong chemistry.

 

If they are going to have a love triangle involving Jimmy, Kara and Lucy, for goodness sake, make *Kara* the hinge. She's the main character, and it'd be more interesting. Okay, .... mostly i just want to see Benoist be flirted with by a pretty girl. It should be adorkable. 

Edited November 14, 2015 by Izeinwinter