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Spoiler Discussion Thread


Morrigan2575
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1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

"wreaking havoc"?

I don't get that either. I mean if they want a team member like that, they can recruit the Vigilante. He's local, they'd save on gas.

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1 minute ago, Starfish35 said:

"wreaking havoc"?

I'm guessing that's to do with her being a meta, as indicated in that reddit spoiler for 5x09. 

Also, regarding the hating vigilantes: I wonder if that was incorrectly reported or something about her that changed after casting. 

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So happy Felicity's going to be trying to help Diggle. Please let this result in a really nice Felicity/Diggle scene once he's free. 

I guess the fact that she's been "wreaking havoc all over the country" explains why it's so easy for her to just move to Star City. The anti-vigilante detective who's a vigilante. Yeah, if all of that is true, I think she's going to be done being "anti-vigilante" before the end of 5x11. Unless she's anti-non-meta vigilantes? Or anti-every-vigilante-but-me? 

3 minutes ago, bijoux said:

I don't get that either. I mean if they want a team member like that, they can recruit the Vigilante. He's local, they'd save on gas.

But Vigilante isn't female and since Evelyn betrayed them, they need a female vigilante. 

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1 minute ago, bijoux said:

I don't get that either. I mean if they want a team member like that, they can recruit the Vigilante. He's local, they'd save on gas.

But he has the wrong plumbing to be the next Canary! I really hope that after BS's visit, Oliver's like, "Okay, guys, Priority Numero Uno: run a search for any potential female vigilante to fulfill Laurel's arbitrary deathbed directive. Location unimportant--we'll convince her that she'll love Star City!!!"

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3 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

I'm guessing that's to do with her being a meta, as indicated in that reddit spoiler for 5x09. 

Also, regarding the hating vigilantes: I wonder if that was incorrectly reported or something about her that changed after casting. 

Yeah I think you're right.

About hating vigilantes, I'm trying to remember what the source was for that?  

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8 minutes ago, bijoux said:

I mean if they want a team member like that, they can recruit the Vigilante

But they want another BC because Laurel wants one and Vigilante already has his cool persona and this lady doesn't, therefore win-win. Maybe they could also do a casting show:  "Star City's next BC" Pieces of the uniform are handed out every week but you will only be the full BC if you get the jacket.

Edited by Belinea
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3 minutes ago, bijoux said:

It's probably reports of the cry and that reminding them of Laurel. Good enough to invite a stranger to join their club house.

Very likely.  

1 minute ago, Belinea said:

Tina Boland, a detective (formerly of the Central City PD) who is no fan of costumed crimefighters. Described as “brash but tactful, Tina isn’t impressed by anyone, let alone vigilantes like Green Arrow.

http://tvline.com/2016/11/01/arrow-cast-detective-boland-juliana-harkavy/

Thanks!

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I mean, they really are so fortunate that a woman with her own canary cry just happens to appear when they need a new female vigilante. And the internet helps them find her! Wow! 

Haha. 

She probably won't like vigilantes for ten minutes...until Oliver convinces her to move to Star City because she reminds him of Laurel and he needs help keeping her legacy alive. 

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5 minutes ago, Trisha said:

Felicity didn't want to break Diggle out of jail previously but now that he's determined to go through the proper channels to clear his name, she's trying to hack the NSA? What?

I'm okay with this because there is a difference in breaking someone out and hacking for evidence to get him released - which is what I'm assuming this is.

Curious if this unknown adversary becomes a cohort.

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Diggle also would have been a fugitive for the rest of his life.  Destroying evidence would free him.

I don't remember. Did Cooper belong to an organization known as Brother Eye or was he that person? I'm trying to figure out who is tied to Felicity's past a bit. 

Edited by Sunshine
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Also, can someone please do some cursory vetting on this chick before they bring her on? I know after Evelyn that vetting doesn't mean all that much, but please don't be a situation where these morons follow a trail that seems like it's E2 Laurel only to find this Tina person and then decide she's a broken lil thing that needs to be taken under their wing without anything more to it than that. Please show, don't be as dumb as you can be. 

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1 minute ago, apinknightmare said:

Also, can someone please do some cursory vetting on this chick before they bring her on? I know after Evelyn that vetting doesn't mean all that much, but please don't be a situation where these morons follow a trail that seems like it's E2 Laurel only to find this Tina person and then decide she's a broken lil thing that needs to be taken under their wing without anything more to it than that. Please show, don't be as dumb as you can be. 

Right? Especially since Evelyn's betrayal just happened. I'd expect them to take a good month or so to watch/vet someone completely before bringing them on. Ask Lyla to run a background check using ARGUS resources. Etc. Not see reports about a vigilante wreaking havoc, forgetting that they've been hunting down a vigilante pretty much doing the same in their own city, and decide, "Yep, she's good for the team! Let's go get her!" 

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4 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

only to find this Tina person and then decide she's a broken lil thing that needs to be taken under their wing without anything more to it than that. Please show, don't be as dumb as you can be. 

Maybe they are in need of a prayer circle or an intervention... Because usually they ignore the details for the sake of epicness...

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Even worse, they've apparently just been betrayed by E2 Laurel so it seems even stupider to trust her now. Don't they know you have to vet people you find out about on the internet?

Cooper belonged to Brother Eye but he's dead, DD killed him.  Is the "unknown adversary" going to be part of Felicity's new darker associates?

Is this the first time the flashbacks have been the lead-off story in the pr write-up?

22 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

Or anti-every-vigilante-but-me?

That would be Chase.

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LOOL so Curtis finds Tina, I never in my wildest dreams predicted that one. And yes Felicity was against Diggle being a fugitive but this time she is helping get his name cleared. I predict at the end of 5x10 they realize that it won't be simple to just have him lawyered but hacking the NSA is the solution.

I am curios as to who the unknown adversary she faces off is.

And does Talia ask Oliver to have sex with her but when he says no she drugs him and rapes him and voila she has a son.."NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA BATMAN!!!"

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11 minutes ago, apinknightmare said:

Also, can someone please do some cursory vetting on this chick before they bring her on? I know after Evelyn that vetting doesn't mean all that much, but please don't be a situation where these morons follow a trail that seems like it's E2 Laurel only to find this Tina person and then decide she's a broken lil thing that needs to be taken under their wing without anything more to it than that. Please show, don't be as dumb as you can be. 

THIS.

Also, if they go find her and basically just ask her to join their team after seeing her use her canary cry and beat up some dudes, they really are as dumb as rocks. 

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This is now the second write up that places Tina dead last as a story point. The Tv Line winter preview put her as a foot note at the end of their summary and now her big introduction episode also places her at the bottom of the totem story pole. I don't know if it means anything but pettily I'm giggling at the fact that she's so far a foot note character in write ups. 

If Felicity is helping Diggle that may very well make her familiar with Chase and could be the seeds of a Felicity/Vigilante team up that's been specced.

Or the "unknown adversary" is some hactivist terrorist Brother eye type group and Felicity gets caught up in their agenda and because of her talent maybe does hack terrorist type things for them because they promise they can help with Prometheus and sort of compromise her self that way.

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21 minutes ago, Angel12d said:

THIS.

Also, if they go find her and basically just ask her to join their team after seeing her use her canary cry and beat up some dudes, they really are as dumb as rocks. 

Don't you know? If someone has the canary cry and is a vigilante, they must be good and trustworthy. It's why Oliver's going to be so eager to find any bit of Laurel in Black Siren. Never mind that Black Siren was going around using the cry probably for years before Laurel had it. And never mind that Laurel took Sara's tech and modified it. I feel like Arrow only remembers Sara was the Canary when it's necessary for the story.

15 minutes ago, ComicFan777 said:

This is the team that put DD's totem back together for no reason...so yes, dumb as rocks.

I will never understand that. Especially since they have a speedster for a friend. I'm pretty sure Barry would have ran around the world putting pieces of the totem in different places if they asked. Even if he was busy, he could have made a few separate trips. 

3 minutes ago, LeighAn said:

This is now the second write up that places Tina dead last as a story point. The Tv Line winter preview put her as a foot note at the end of their summary and now her big introduction episode also places her at the bottom of the totem story pole. I don't know if it means anything but pettily I'm giggling at the fact that she's so far a foot note character in write ups. 

I wonder if they're trying to make it a surprise that Tina becomes the new BC and they think if they don't say much about her or make her the focus, no one will guess. Never mind the fact that it's everywhere online. 

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2 minutes ago, insomniadreams88 said:

I wonder if they're trying to make it a surprise that Tina becomes the new BC and they think if they don't say much about her or make her the focus, no one will guess. Never mind the fact that it's everywhere online. 

Episode descriptions and winter/season preview summaries I think are like promos where they are controlled by the network not the EPs so it's the Networks take on the episode or how they choose to promote. Therefore your right Tina could very well be more focal in the episode then the write up suggests.

My pettiness comes from the fact that the Network chose not to make her more focal and treat her like a foot note in two write ups now haha. And I don't think it's a 'keep it under wraps' since I think the proposal promo and the black siren promo is evidence enough that while the EPs would like to be secretive and keep things under wraps the Network just wants to show/tell whatever looks the most exciting and gets people to watch. And again total petty me likes that so far Tina isnt exciting numero uno storyline in the episode write ups.

Im sure promo may change however once she appears.

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I wonder what the logic is going to be behind Oliver, Rene and Curtis going on this trip to find Tina. Of course Oliver has to go, Curtis probably because he's tracking her/wants to get out of town because of marital problems/Rene because... why not? History with Tina would make the most sense for Rene to join the trip. 

They're leaving Rory and I guess Thea? to suit up if something happens in Star City while they're gone. And with Prometheus out there... If Prometheus is smart, he'll do something big while Oliver's out of town. 

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They did streamline Tina. Island? Check. Vigilante? Check. All she needs is the name. I will laugh if its literally a two minute conversation.

Tina: "I heard about her. She was a warrior."

Oliver: "Before she died, she made me promise she wouldn't be the last Canary. Will you take the mantle for her?"

Tina: "I'd be honored" 

Oliver: "Here's a jacket."

Tina: "I already feel connected to her."

Oliver......"You and I aren't happening. Ever."

Tina: "Huh?"

I am surprised that Tina is the C plot, but Talia is a big comic figure so I can see them leading with that.

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17 minutes ago, Chaser said:

I am surprised that Tina is the C plot, but Talia is a big comic figure so I can see them leading with that.

I'm not really surprised. I feel like she's going to be a background character for the rest of her run lol

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1 minute ago, wonderwall said:

I'm not really surprised. I feel like she's going to be a background character for the rest of her run lol

Except when her and Felicity hang out, at the loft, where they are roomies.

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Per BFS "Malone's death uncorks what Felicity bottled up (re: Havenrock) and the events of 5.10-5.12 have Felicity re-examing her life, or lack of, as of late"

5.10 Prometheus targets Oliver using BS as a fake LL. Felicity ends up in the crossfire at some point.  

5.11 Felicity ends up in a hack-off similar to the one with Cooper in S4.  Oliver's focus is on honoring his promise to dying Laurel.

5.12 Team goes to Russia. The why is unknown.  In search of Talia makes sense but why take the whole team?  Oliver is the one with connections.  Rescue mission for Susan because of her "investigating" might be a reason to take a bunch of people unfamiliar with the country.  Oliver and Susan reunion which causes Felicity to feel all alone?  Oliver is once again not focused on taking down Prometheus?   

Felicity is going up against another super hacker in 5.11 while trying to help free Diggle.  I guess this addresses Havenrock since she had a hack-off with Cooper trying to stop the launch of the missiles.  MG said they wanted to use new characters which is why neither Donna or Noah were being brought back.  So, is the unknown person on the other end of the computer a random or does Felicity have a unknown half-sibling?  In the comics, Noah Kuttler/Calculator has a daughter, Wendy and a son Marvin White.  Secret sibling that your team mate doesn't know about doesn't really parallel secret child your fiancee doesn't know about, but this show.  If it's a random like Diggle's army guys, the lie being paralleled is probably the lie of omission from 5.04 and the PT break-in.  

Curtis (at least) will know Felicity's secret since he's the main character she's allowed to talk to.  There could be others.  If the lie is simply I'm only working with Team Arrow part-time, Curtis would be the one covering for her.  Oliver's probably unaware because he's operating from the mayor's office more.         

Edited by Sunshine
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18 hours ago, bijoux said:

I don't get that either. I mean if they want a team member like that, they can recruit the Vigilante. He's local, they'd save on gas.

Team Arrow is now on a budget. The Vigilante can't fit into Laurel's old Black Canary suit that's hanging unused in its glass case in the Arrow Bunker.  Tina is not only female but conveniently also has a similar body type to Laurel.

18 hours ago, Starfish35 said:

Yeah I think you're right.

About hating vigilantes, I'm trying to remember what the source was for that?  

TVLine paraphrased some of what was originally reported in Variety. Here's the original source quote...

http://variety.com/2016/tv/news/juliana-harkavy-arrow-cast-walking-dead-1201906144/

Quote

Harkavy will have a recurring role as Tina Boland, a detective formerly of Central City. Boland is brash yet tactful, tough, speaks her mind, and is not the easiest person to impress. She also has a problem with vigilantes like Green Arrow (Stephen Amell) and his new team of recruits: Wild Dog (Rick Gonzalez), Artemis (Madison McLaughlin), Curtis Holt (Echo Kellum), and Ragman (Joe Dinicol). Harkavy’s character will join in the back half of the season.

Edited by tv echo
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Maybe she's like Chase and it's not vigilantes she has a problem with but incompetent ones.  The new recruits certainly fall into that category.

I wonder if the whole team goes to Russia because they're following a Prometheus clue.  I can understand taking Rene and Rory, and Tina since she's the new BC but why take Felicity and Curtis?  Why take six people, seven if Diggle's going, and leave Star City undefended?

I'm wondering if Felicity is really going up against another hacker .  The write-up says

Quote

Felicity (Emily Bett Rickards) attempts to hack the NSA to help free Diggle (David Ramsey) but when her online efforts are flagged, she faces off against an unknown adversary.

It does sound like the "unknown adversary" is another hacker like her battles with Cooper and Brie in s3 and Noah and Cooper in s4 but it's also possible that it's someone who goes after her because the system noticed she was in.

Someone mentioned (elsewhere) that much of the time in the comics Green Arrow and Black Canary were independent contractors.  It occurred to me that if the writers follow that route, BC v3 could work.  I've been assuming that Tina will be a permanent part of Team Arrow once she's been brought in but they could make the character recurring as Sara was when she was still in the LoA.  The Black Canary could be trained and join the Team, and then later in the season or at the end of the season decide that she's going to go back to Hub City and clean things up there.

Having her recurring would in fact make the Black Canary a more powerful character because she wouldn't be subservient to Green Arrow on his team as Laurel was, and avoid the Arrow/Canary vs the rest of the team that was there when Sara joined fulltime in s2.

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SO the person that flags her hacking isn't an actual villain but an adversary for Felicity at this point in time. I wonder if it will turn out to be someone from the comics, imagine it being Oracle. We know she exists in this universe so why not, right.

Also if Felicity is getting flagged then it means that she is being somewhat reckless and that her head isn't in the game or that it is someone really familiar with her work. Either way it sets up an interesting show down. Maybe her finding this person is what kicks off her taking down Prometheus in morally questionable ways. 

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6 minutes ago, Sunshine said:

I thought Arrow couldn't use Oracle? 

They couldn't use the name. I doubt they can use the actual character but DC isnt doing anything with her now that TT isnt happening at the moment. But I am ok with MG not getting his hands on her.

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23 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Maybe she's like Chase and it's not vigilantes she has a problem with but incompetent ones.  The new recruits certainly fall into that category.

I wonder if the whole team goes to Russia because they're following a Prometheus clue.  I can understand taking Rene and Rory, and Tina since she's the new BC but why take Felicity and Curtis?  Why take six people, seven if Diggle's going, and leave Star City undefended?

I'm wondering if Felicity is really going up against another hacker .  The write-up says

It does sound like the "unknown adversary" is another hacker like her battles with Cooper and Brie in s3 and Noah and Cooper in s4 but it's also possible that it's someone who goes after her because the system noticed she was in.

Someone mentioned (elsewhere) that much of the time in the comics Green Arrow and Black Canary were independent contractors.  It occurred to me that if the writers follow that route, BC v3 could work.  I've been assuming that Tina will be a permanent part of Team Arrow once she's been brought in but they could make the character recurring as Sara was when she was still in the LoA.  The Black Canary could be trained and join the Team, and then later in the season or at the end of the season decide that she's going to go back to Hub City and clean things up there.

Having her recurring would in fact make the Black Canary a more powerful character because she wouldn't be subservient to Green Arrow on his team as Laurel was, and avoid the Arrow/Canary vs the rest of the team that was there when Sara joined fulltime in s2.

I'm probably most curious about 5x12 in terms of upcoming episodes. It is a big group to take to Russia. Going with what DR said about there being more OTA later, I'm hoping OTA carry the A-Plot with everyone else as back up. Regarding Reporter: I'm thinking when they go to Russia, Oliver finds out about a Reporter connecting people about Mayor Queen.

I think Tina is going to be the I-only-work-with-the-chip-on-my-shoulder type of vigilante. I really like the idea of Tina staying recurring and just popping randomly. It's what I wanted for Sara.

Good point about "Unknown adversary". Could be a hacker, could be the FBI.

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That's two episodes in a row - 511 and 512 - they're leaving the city with almost no one to defend it. Seriously, Prometheus, make a move then. Make Oliver wonder if leaving the city was a bad idea and maybe he could have stopped whatever happens. (Wasn't there a BTS photo of a memorial or something from 513? Maybe something does happen in Star City while everyone is gone in 512.)

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14 minutes ago, Chaser said:

Good point about "Unknown adversary". Could be a hacker, could be the FBI.

How does going up against the NSA, the FBI, Argus or whomever help propel Felicity to a dark place? If she's being reckless and getting caught shouldn't she be thinking maybe I need to get out as opposed to using morally grey areas to target Prometheus? If it's a "good guy" isn't the option work for us or go to jail? Do not pass go.  Do not collect $200. (Monopoly reference).  There isn't really a choice to contemplate.  Prometheus might very well have contacted Brother Eye ("bit tied to her past" and a future she's contemplating) figuring they would try and get Diggle free by unlawful means so someone's on the lookout for her.  It's also why I suggested the unknown adversary might actually be a sibling she's unaware of.  Noah Kuttler has a son as well as a daughter in the comics.   

Not saying it couldn't be a "good guy".  I'm just trying to understand.     

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1 hour ago, insomniadreams88 said:

That's two episodes in a row - 511 and 512 - they're leaving the city with almost no one to defend it. Seriously, Prometheus, make a move then. Make Oliver wonder if leaving the city was a bad idea and maybe he could have stopped whatever happens. (Wasn't there a BTS photo of a memorial or something from 513? Maybe something does happen in Star City while everyone is gone in 512.)

In 5.11 we have Rory & Thea in town.  In 5.12 it looks like Rene and Thea.  Rick is in none of the BTS Russian pics but is in a suit and tie with Paul Blackthorne.  5.13 is titled "Spectre of the Gun" and mayor's office is shot up.  If it's Bratva or Vigilante collateral damage, I'm guessing it's to trigger Rene's  flashbacks to the loved ones he lost (girlfriend and baby) .  He's referenced an ex and a child on screen.  In the comics Wild Dog's girlfriend was shot and died while they were on a date.  I guess it could be Bratva collateral damage brought on by 5.12.  

Edited by Sunshine
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Everyone but Rene is going to Russia?  Poor Quentin.

The idea that Felicity's adversary might be a half-sibling or other relative that Prometheus found is interesting.  But I don't think they're going to do it because they seem to be writing away from her family this season.  (Fear of the Felicity & Friends tagline?)

I'm hoping though that it's not another hacking battle because that's all they seem to be able to write for Felicity. I'm hoping it's something longer term and more devious.

Edited by statsgirl
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35 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

Everyone but Rene is going to Russia?  Poor Quentin.

I'm hoping though that it's not another hacking battle because that's all they seem to be able to write for Felicity. I'm hoping it's something longer term and more devious.

Unless Rick just wasn't around for the BTS photo and mannequin challenge.  Now that I think about it the BTS w/Rick & Paul might be 5.13.  It was a 100th episode Instagram thing by Echo.  SA said at a HVFF Atl something about the 2 sharing scenes and they were around 5.12 then.  I might be mixing up things.

I hope for more than a hacking battle too but I think that's what 5.11 is.  5.10-5.12 sounds like setup per BFS.

46 minutes ago, Proteus said:

I don't think Rene is in the comics. The show made him up and gave him the Wild Dog identity that is in the comics.

Yeah. I googled Wild Dog and noticed the name was different but the girlfriend getting shot while on a date with him was the backstory.

Edited by Sunshine
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3 hours ago, tv echo said:

 

So I guess JH is in 515 also..

 

For some reason I have the feeling she will be in every episode until the end of the season.

Also she will be the new BC by 5x23, I actually have no doubt about that.

Edited by Belinea
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What if they're going to Russia to help prove Digg is innocent. That's a valid reason, in my opinion, for the team to go....

They might have traced the missing nukes there (or Anatoli has tipped them off).

That would work for me.

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