S14.E05: Gunn And Heid

[Misslindsey]

 

Also, about the boys not choosing Ashley and then taking up for her in the lounge: I do not think they were referring to her being chosen last when they were talking about mean girl hijinks. I think they saw and heard what was taking place in the workroom and then saw that shite on the runway. I believe that is what they were reacting to when they were taking up for Ashley. I didn't really think there was any sexism there, NOR do I really think the "girls" chose Ashley last because she's fat. It was all the stuff that happened AFTER that, that was so infuriating.

I concur. I also think that if Ashley somehow ended up on the guys team instead of Merline (or maybe in addition to) she would have brushed off being the last pick  better, because that team was actually talking to each other, not over one another and working together. I think had Merline or maybe even one of the guys ended up  on the other team they would have had the bus come for them as well, because it seemed obvious Candice, Lindsey, Amanda, and Kelly were going to stick together.

[Darling Lily]

I haven't watched the last 3 seasons of PR because I just didn't want to pay the cable bill....I am glad to be watching it again.  That being said, I can't stand that stupid little twit Blake.  He isn't that good, and playing stupid can't be THAT big of a stretch.  He's a little minion.

 

Can't stand looking at Ashley with all the makeup, purple hair, and crazy mashed outfits.  Girl, just because you are BIG doesn't mean you can't look GOOD!  Being a bit older, I cannot understand the wretched hair colour that some women wear these days....the purple is a lot better though than that hideous Bozo red so many black & white women thinks they look good in.  You are only young ONCE!!!  Use your beauty, don't ABUSE it!  

 

Adore Swapnil's everything!!  Edmond a close second.  Marline should go go go.  Can't stand her designs.  Hated the coat she made this time, and everything else she has put her hands on.   

 

Feel so sorry for Tim, he is such a peach, looks like he may have had a run-in with shingles or something similar.  His poor skin!  I still love him!  I could go the rest of my life though, without hearing another word out of HIDE-ee's mouth.  Good grief, she is irritating to me.  

 

Putting Amanda out, don't really get why she was at the bottom on every show.  Other people (hint hint MARLINE) were mush worse.  Watched Amanda recently with her husband on "Flea Market Flip"  she did a much better job on that show.

 

Almost threw up when I saw the results of the women's fabric painting.  What a hot pastel mess.....Tired of these silly challenges, I am with the group that wants the designers back at MOOD picking out what they want to use to design with on the show.

[Shelby]

Y'all keep talking about Ashley's makeup bugging, but Kelly's makeup makes me crazy.  She wears entirely too much, and the colors are not flattering.  I am very curious what she looks like without half the makeup counter on her face.

 

ETA: Designer Kelly, not Osbourne.

 

You're curious to what she looks like without makeup?

 

Half normal, middle-aged man, half Boy George in "Karma Chameleon."

[hks]

Normally I read all the comments first, then comment (TWoP habits), but I wanted to write this immediately: FUCKING THANK GOD FUCKING AMANDA IS GONE. She was the worst person AND worst designer on that team. Long overdue. But THANK GOD.

 

Also Swapnil should have won for that outfit. Edmond's was great, but Swapnil's was gorgeous, clever, and creative.  Just perfect.

[slothgirl]

she showed tremendous restraint when Amanda tried to shame her into letting her use her scissors when she was working with them.  Was Amanda one of those who didn't bring their tools?

Somebody said last episode, and I thought it was Laurie, that her hem was jagged because she'd dropped her scissors so many times. That made me wonder if the scissors she was using and wouldn't give up were actually hers.

 

If it was someone else who said that, then I stand corrected.

Edited September 5, 2015 by slothgirl

[slothgirl]

Add to that their stupidity destroying their fabric before they had the first clue what they were doing. They thought they would just throw every color of paint on a sheet and things would just work out? Really? And it didn't occur to them to keep any of the fabric in reserve. Dumbasses.

Someone on the team mentioned Jackson Pollock as they were indiscriminately heaving paint balls at the white fabric.

 

Whoever that was needs to go back to Art Appreciation class because there was nothing arbitrary and haphazard about Pollock's methods or results.

 

Nothing "Easter Bunny" about his color choices either.

Edited September 5, 2015 by slothgirl

[Muffyn]

Well, they did pronounce his name like Pole-lock (basically turning his name into an ethnic slur) so I sensed they weren't very familiar with him or his work. 

[hks]

Okay I have read through the comments, and I agree with a lot.  Ashley being picked last could have been many things: stupidity or strategy not picking a top competitor; people just wanting to work with friends; or some calculated mean girl shit. Whatever it was, I can understand Ashley being upset, but then I agree, she shouldn't let it keep her down. EXCEPT. She didn't at first.  She kicked ass at paintball, and when the planning started, she tried to assert some strong ideas.  But she was shut down.  And then I think she stopped fighting it.  I also don't think Laurie was being calculated or bitchy by warning her about the upcoming mean girl shit in judging. I think she just wanted things done fairly and was equally disappointed by how badly the team was doing together.

 

And, even though I very strongly expressed my relief and joy for Amanda being ousted, I think this is a better (and less curse-filled) expression of why I felt that way:

 

One more note - I think Amanda not only deserved to get sent home, but deserved to be slapped for her woe-is-me-so-cute bullshit. The woman is severely narcissistic (nothing is ever fair to poor Amanda, it's never her fault, blablabla) with a huge helping of grandiosity thrown in. Or else she's just stuck at age 15 socially and emotionally.  Either way, I was very happy to see her get the high heeled boot.  

[film noire]

When did everyone turn on Ashley? Last week they were fine with her, this week they all hate her.

 

It's because Ashley is suffering from the delusion that she has talent, skill and an equal right to try winning a fashion contest (instead of fading into the background as the Eternally Supportive Fat Friend of the natural winner of any fashion event, The Thin Hip Chick -- a position that cannot be allowed to stand unchallenged.)

 

Ashley also didn't get the memo about dressing her body as a giant apology for even existing;  in shapeless,  dull colored material, meant to hide all those fatal figure flaws that have nearly brought western civilization to its knees since the medieval fitted kirtle took hold. She actually thinks she has the right to dress in a personal style that speaks to her fashion sensibility, as if (hold on, this is shocking) FAT CHICKS HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPORT FASHION.

 

So naturally Candace, being of skinny sound mind and United Nations perspective, decided to uplift Amanda (she being of the Skinny Order of Holy Wenches) and that meant that Ashley, with all her as-if-thin nerve (that nerve likely spurred on by eating Things She Shouldn't -- anything other than celery and an undressed salad) needed to be curtailed and removed, in order to return order to the order of things.  

 

It's not so hard to understand -- it's just like a math problem ( if math were about females in their late twenties acting like twelve year old girls obsessing about everything that doesn't matter -- how many fat girls are needed to beat several entitled Thinsters? Answer: just one.)

 

The color options for them were horrible. (I say this as I sit here wearing pink pants)

I dunno.... I think they just had no imagination. If you turned everything Easter egg-ish, then go with that.  Cut up the

Easter fabric, turn it into a pattern/textile; Alexander McQueen meets madras. Harsh up all that pastel with bits of

that orange and maybe go Bansky (‘welcome to dismal land’) with little sayings written and hidden, like Easter eggs,

in the pattern. Show some wit. Save the day. Say your ‘girl’ is actually a frickin’ woman – who’d LOVE to vacation at

Balmoral and Bermuda  during Easter break -- but being one of the 99 percent, has to make do with a weekend

hanging out with her nineties posse down the shore – months before the temps break sixty  – whatever:

mix it up,  tell a story, make some clothes and just try. Fucking TRY.

Edited September 5, 2015 by film noire

[Kromm]

I'm really not sure I believe what this show (and Laurie) is selling. These guys have tape on everything. If there was really some anti-Ashley plot why would the show not supply ANY footage? So the total evidence is that later on they picked her as the weakest? Big deal. She'd clearly spent the past few days mainly sulking about being last in that other pick. Which was stupid of them, yes, but hardly seemed like a purposeful plot against her. Candice hardly seems like some mastermind out to get her. I think she honestly picked Amanda for the reason she said (even if Amanda didn't care about that or appreciate it), and the picks after that were indeed less about talent than who they were close to. So they're not close to you Ashley? Grow up. I'm sure you've had a tough time in life and been picked on many times because of your size, but you almost seemed to have made it into a self-fulfilling prophecy here by sulking so much after that being picked last thing--thus truly alienating yourself at that point. 

 

Also there's the fact that Amanda clearly expressed all kinds of bitchiness towards Candice in her talking heads.  One would think if they were such co-conspiring "buddies" that wouldn't have happened.  She certainly didn't seem grateful about being picked first, that's for sure. "Ingrate" is the word that comes to mind.

 

And Laurie, I'm sorry, seems like a shit stirrer. All this stuff about how she "thought it was a bad idea" and how she "felt so bad for Ashley"?  Well we can only take her word for it that she would have picked Ashely sooner. It's easy to claim that after the fact. She also didn't ever ask the others to pipe down and listen to Ashley in the workroom. She simply acted holier than thou about it after the fact, IMO. The fact that Ashley DID get picked as the worst look seemed just as likely to have followed FROM all of this as being inevitable beforehand. Was it driven by bad feelings?  Probably. But when those were established is the question. 

 

And I can't believe Kelly O. followed the usual Heidi formula of gotcha-ing them on something they'd been steered into saying. Not the gang-up on Ashley (which as I said before, even if it WAS a legit gang-up could have been at least somewhat about her sulking for two days). But that Kelly the Contestant DID try to steer away from blaming anyone in her initial answer, got shot down on that and THEN picked Ahsley. Then yes, the others followed her pick like lemmings. But it hardly seemed planned beforehand. They literally were just aping her, because that's what you do--not piss off anyone additional when put in that situation.  Then Kelly O. has the gall to say they should have spread the blame around--what Contestant Kelly HAD tried to do initially by talking about how it had been a team effort and team mistakes.

 

So often you can see this show grab onto something as a storyline and run with it to the hilt. This seems like one of those things. Ashley herself admitted that anyone who got picked last would feel hurt.  And she herself ALSO admitted that people were simply picking roommates. Seems logical, both of those things. Then later, when FORCED by the judges to pick a worst, and having already heard Ashley go on to the judges about how miserable she'd been, essentially ONE contestant, Kelly picked Ashley (and the rest just did the copycat/lemming thing). How this got interpreted as some mean girl plot is totally an exercise in a few contestants (Laurie and later Blake) selling it as that, I think, and the judges and Kelly O. picking up on that and running with it.

 

Candice and her "San Francisco Girl" thing WAS a total transparent crock though. I'm not saying it was good that Laurie (again shit stirring) simply outted her on that for the hell of it, but that said, the story WAS ridiculous, and seeing that they'd literally JUST made it up was doubly so.

 

On the men's side... So Blake can paint flowers?  Big deal. He's still a talent-light (yet mysteriously overpraised) little shit at the core activity this show is testing.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Kromm

[candall]

It's because Ashley is suffering from the delusion that she has talent, skill and an equal right to try winning a fashion contest (instead of fading into the background as the Eternally Supportive Fat Friend of the natural winner of any fashion event, The Thin Hip Chick -- a position that cannot be allowed to stand unchallenged.)

 

Ashley also didn't get the memo about dressing her body as a giant apology for even existing;  in shapeless,  dull colored material, meant to hide all those fatal figure flaws that have nearly brought western civilization to its knees since the medieval fitted kirtle took hold. She actually thinks she has the right to dress in a personal style that speaks to her fashion sensibility, as if (hold on, this is shocking) FAT CHICKS HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPORT FASHION.

 

So naturally Candace, being of skinny sound mind and United Nations perspective, decided to uplift Amanda (she being of the Skinny Order of Holy Wenches) and that meant that Ashley. with all her as-if-thin nerve (that nerve likely spurred on by eating Things She Shouldn't -- anything other than celery and an undressed salad) needed to be curtailed and removed, in order to return order to the order of things.  

 

It's not so hard to understand -- it's just like a math problem ( if math were about females in their late twenties acting like twelve year old girls obsessing about everything that doesn't matter -- how many fat girls are needed to beat several entitled Thinsters? Answer: just one.)

 

I dunno.... I think they just had no imagination. If you turned everything Easter egg-ish, then go with that.  Cut up the

Easter fabric, turn it into a pattern/textile; Alexander McQueen meets madras. Harsh up all that pastel with bits of

that orange and maybe go Bansky (‘welcome to dismal land’) with little sayings written and hidden, like Easter eggs,

in the pattern. Show some wit. Save the day. Say your ‘girl’ is actually a frickin’ woman – who’d LOVE to vacation at

Balmoral and Bermuda  during Easter break -- but being one of the 99 percent, has to make do with a weekend

hanging out with her nineties posse down the shore – five months before the temps break sixty  – whatever:

mix it up,  tell a story, make some clothes and just try. Fucking TRY.

 

If there were a Supplemental Fourth of July Skyrocket option on the upthumb button for this post, I'd click it.

Edited September 5, 2015 by candall

[pasdetrois]

This was one of those episodes where real life fed producer manipulation. There must have been a lot going on off-camera, because I didn't see any mean girl stuff leading up to when the teams were picked. It was suddenly "boom" - no one picked Ashley and we were abruptly immersed in drama. I wonder if the obese outsider/mean girl dynamic began earlier in the hotel rooms. Or, if several of the other women were simply enjoying each other and Ashley projected her fear of rejection onto the situation. I didn't see any overt nastiness, but I did see a bit of clique-y-ness. I do think the following is an apt description of what happened:

 

 

It's so disgusting that Heidi and the producers recognized Ashley's insecurity and exploited it constantly throughout the episode. Chances are it's not the first time she felt left out and they jumped on that as a source of drama.

 

 

the mature reaction isn't to pout and refuse to participate and sad-sack your way through, as Ashley did.

 

Ashley will have to learn to negotiate the mean-girl world, because she's facing a lifetime of it. I sympathized with her situation deeply, but also was annoyed that she gave in to her emotions completely and wallowed in being the victim. At least she concentrated on putting together a decent product.

 

 

And Laurie's "I'm not a gossipy person" shit-stirring was classic.

On reality shows I always wonder whether someone's behavior was specifically cued by production, or if they try to give production what they think it wants. Laurie, Blake, Edmond and Kelly O. may have been doing this - they saw a storyline developing and jumped on the bandwagon. I can see Edmond defending someone, but not timid precious Blake. And Kelly's involvement made me hoot - she regularly engages in stupid childish social media battles with other women. But it does sound as if Laurie heard very specific conversations, off-camera, that the other women intended to "vote Ashley out." Are we really shocked at this in a competitive reality show?

 

 

Also still can't stand  Jake or Joseph, whose disdain for women is quite stunning.

I noticed this from the first episode. They belong to that class of gay men who loathe women.

 

I'm enjoying Swapnil and Edmond. I prefer watching cheerful, cooperative people. I'm also glad that Merline was able to have a positive experience - she lacks confidence and I want her to have a chance to grow.

 

ETA: Amanda completely gave up in this episode and tried to avoid being aufed by laying on the comedic charm.

Edited September 5, 2015 by pasdetrois

[seasick]

Well, they did pronounce his name like Pole-lock (basically turning his name into an ethnic slur) so I sensed they weren't very familiar with him or his work. 

That was Merline, the one who kept calling muslin "Muslim".    I am part Polish.. I am not aware that the term Polack (i.e."Pole-lock.") is a slur.--I don't THINK it is.   I think it's like saying "Manhattanite or an "Aussie". and Polack instead of "Polander" or "Pol".     

 

Polack may have gotten a bad ring when it was said as "dumb Polack".  I believe this arose out of jealousy because we are so darned good-lookin' !!

[Kore]

It's because Ashley is suffering from the delusion that she has talent, skill and an equal right to try winning a fashion contest (instead of fading into the background as the Eternally Supportive Fat Friend of the natural winner of any fashion event, The Thin Hip Chick -- a position that cannot be allowed to stand unchallenged.)

Ashley also didn't get the memo about dressing her body as a giant apology for even existing; in shapeless, dull colored material, meant to hide all those fatal figure flaws that have nearly brought western civilization to its knees since the medieval fitted kirtle took hold. She actually thinks she has the right to dress in a personal style that speaks to her fashion sensibility, as if (hold on, this is shocking) FAT CHICKS HAVE THE RIGHT TO SPORT FASHION.

So naturally Candace, being of skinny sound mind and United Nations perspective, decided to uplift Amanda (she being of the Skinny Order of Holy Wenches) and that meant that Ashley, with all her as-if-thin nerve (that nerve likely spurred on by eating Things She Shouldn't -- anything other than celery and an undressed salad) needed to be curtailed and removed, in order to return order to the order of things.

It's not so hard to understand -- it's just like a math problem ( if math were about females in their late twenties acting like twelve year old girls obsessing about everything that doesn't matter -- how many fat girls are needed to beat several entitled Thinsters? Answer: just one.)

Btw, speaking as someone who was overweight and now is thin, "Thinsters" aren't some cabal of dark lords secretly collaborating to keep fat women down. There are some serious issues in our culture as a whole regarding female body image, fashion, and media, but casting women with a BMI under 23 ("thin" is a subjective comparative measure, so I picked a random objective form of measurement) as scheming villains constantly subsisting only on raw lettuce and water is just as nonsensical and unproductive as casting all fat women as lazy slobs. Do some people act horribly towards individuals due to their weight? Yes. But assuming that all the women (and apparently the men too, as they didn't select her either) somehow loathe her for a physical quality is beyond reaching. There isn't some grand Anti-Fat conspiracy at work.

[Kromm]

Btw, speaking as someone who was overweight and now is thin, "Thinsters" aren't some cabal of dark lords secretly collaborating to keep fat women down. There are some serious issues in our culture as a whole regarding female body image, fashion, and media, but casting women with a BMI under 23 ("thin" is a subjective comparative measure, so I picked a random objective form of measurement) as scheming villains constantly subsisting only on raw lettuce and water is just as nonsensical and unproductive as casting all fat women as lazy slobs. Do some people act horribly towards individuals due to their weight? Yes. But assuming that all the women (and apparently the men too, as they didn't select her either) somehow loathe her for a physical quality is beyond reaching. There isn't some grand Anti-Fat conspiracy at work.

Well notice how only the women got blamed (even though the men could have just as easily picked her).

[auntlada]

That was Merline, the one who kept calling muslin "Muslim".    I am part Polish.. I am not aware that the term Polack (i.e."Pole-lock.") is a slur.--I don't THINK it is.   I think it's like saying "Manhattanite or an "Aussie". and Polack instead of "Polander" or "Pol".     

 

Polack may have gotten a bad ring when it was said as "dumb Polack".  I believe this arose out of jealousy because we are so darned good-lookin' !!

I thought someone else, maybe Blake, said it first and then Merline said, "You hear that, (someone)? Pole-ock."

[Bebecat]

Jmo, if Ashley is not as "popular" among the other women, it does not have to be due to her weight. Also, not being popular by this bunch of flakes should be viewed as a huge plus, Imo. I am kind of sorry to see her take this so personally, as everyone ended up looking foolish, when she could have come off better by not whining on camera by being chosen last. She knew she had two wins, or a win and share, whatever, that should have been her inspiration. Though personally I am not wild about her work, the judges had rewarded her for it early on, which is all that matters.

Kelly O. Is a pot/kettle, comsidering her twitter fueds with other women over the years, lol. She is extremely immature and downright briainless, Imo.

Mostly, I love Heidi. But wish she had not stirred it up in this episode.

I agree that poor Tim may be battling shingles or something similar. His skin looks painful to me.

[Bella]

Well notice how only the women got blamed (even though the men could have just as easily picked her).

 

Some of us mentioned the men in our comments. I did.

 

There are a number of team selection strategies, but none of the good ones involve picking friends. One strategy is to first pick someone you know that you, personally, can beat. Candace did that, though I do not believe for one single moment that that was her intent. Another strategy is to go for the strongest person left whenever your selection opportunities roll around, figuring that there will be a beatable weak link left at the end. There are strategies around the presence of annoying people, combining styles, contrasting styles, etc. Picking friends is not strategic, however. Nor is going with a single gender. 

 

I don't know why Ashley was picked last. I don't know the men's reasoning and I don't know the women's reasoning. I do know that once they were in the workroom, I saw that the other women were ignoring her contributions. Being ignored hurts.

 

But did Ashley openly state that they were talking over her because of her weight? Or did she just state that she felt hurt and ignored? I remember it as being the latter, but I could be wrong. If she did connect it to her weight, it could circle back to previous experiences of being treated badly due to her weight. That seems logical, but it could be wrong, too. 

 

What I saw when I watched the episode was four catty women who excluded a talented teammate from the discussion and hurt her feelings. The four catty women played that situation a whole lot worse than the talented teammate did, IMO. 

[jrlr]

Putting Amanda out, don't really get why she was at the bottom on every show.  Other people (hint hint MARLINE) were mush worse.  Watched Amanda recently with her husband on "Flea Market Flip"  she did a much better job on that show.

OMG, that no-talent little bitch is a reality-show whore?  Makes PERFECT sense: entitled 20-something who thinks she is so fucking adorable, smart and talented that she doesn't have to do anything in life other than push her face into a camera to be a "star"!!!!  Well I have yet to see (and won't because, thank god, she's off the show) any signs of talent, brains, or adorability in that walking example of contemporary narcissism.  Good job, Mom and Dad, raising a daughter who would probably not be able to hold a job at Starbucks because of her attitude.  I'd love to see Amanda tossed out into the REAL world and see how she fares.  And IMO, Lindsey isn't very far behind Amanda in the "Mommy and daddy told me that everyone's farts smell bad except mine, which smell like heather and sound like bells"  attitude.  

 

Glad we have Edmond and Swapnil in the competition because they are the only adults (with the possible exception of Laurie) in this bunch of whining (Amanda), posing (Lindsey), crying (Ashley), cliched (Blake) BORING bunch.  I'd been getting to like Candace, but she has now sunk to the bottom of the list for me.  Lindsey and Kelly proved they have no spines.  Joseph - or is it Jake? - is a pain in the ass.  Heidi needs to get over the glittery mini-dress love-fest - sorry, Heidi, no matter how gorgeous your legs are, you're too old for that crap.  Tim seems depressed (I would be too if I'd sunk to the Mary Kay and Sally Beauty new show low). Glad Merline is back on her meds, she is kind of an interesting designer and she seems sweet.  

 

Why the hell do I keep watching this show?  Oh yeah, it's better than politics.

[Kromm]

Some of us mentioned the men in our comments. I did.

I was referring to on the show specifically--not saying that nobody was mentioning them HERE. Tim, Heidi, Nina, and of course Ashely herself... none of them mentioned the men, and in fact Blake's little rant equally applied to them, and yet he still was portrayed as some voice of reason (instead of the whiny little hypocrite he is) for saying it.  If that echoes something you said on a previous page, I apologize for not addressing that, but it wasn't an attempt to slight you, I promise. I was specifically responding to Kore mentioning the men in a more oblique fashion (who simply pointed out that the men also hadn't picked her--which I then intended to support/add to with that observation that not only hadn't they picked her, but they didn't get the blame for it from the people on the show who so easily blamed the women).

Edited September 5, 2015 by Kromm

[PepperMonkey]

Okay, now I am just loving the term Thinsters. Where do I get my jacket? And to bring it back to the discussion at hand, I, and many others, said going all the way back to page 2 of posts, that we didn't think Ashley's size figured in to anything that happened.

 

I still think they disrespected her for whatever reason, but I don't think it's because "she's fat, so she must not know anything." Because I DO think they shut her out a bit and did not show her any respect as a human (of whatever size) at all.

 

I just want her to rise above all the childishness and compete to the best of her ability, and they can all go to hell.

[Bella]

I was referring to on the show specifically--not saying that nobody was mentioning them HERE. Tim, Heidi, Nina, none of them mentioned the men, and in fact Blake's little rant equally applied to them, and yet he still was portrayed as some voice of reason (instead of the whiny little hypocrite he is) for saying it.  If that echoes something you said on a previous page, I apologize for not addressing that, but it wasn't an attempt to slight you, I promise. I was specifically responding to Kore mentioning the men in a more oblique fashion (who simply pointed out that the men also hadn't picked her--which I supported by adding that despite doing that they didn't get any blame ON THE SHOW for it).

 

Okay, I get your point. But didn't Heidi call them all out for not choosing Ashley? That's what I remember. I don't recall that she directed her statement about the selection process to the women's team alone. 

[Kromm]

Okay, I get your point. But didn't Heidi call them all out for not choosing Ashley? That's what I remember. I don't recall that she directed her statement about the selection process to the women's team alone. 

I suppose it started out that way, but the pile on that happened later was consistently directed towards the women. Blake's criticisms were about the women. Ashley herself only reserved her hurt feelings and her attitude/sulking for the women. The judging portion (vs. the schoolyard pick) had it rehashed so that it was all about the women (which did spin into them again supposedly ganging up on her, but I think we all realize that the judges cornered contestant Kelly and pushed her into picking a name--and the others just copied her). So yeah, maybe the men were included for the first 5 seconds it was ever discussed, but not for long.

 

it certainly didn't help that we had another contestant on the women's team stirring the pot by referring to statements we magically didn't get to see tape of (a bit unbelievably when it supposedly happened right there in the other room and they're always recording), but even before that happened, the spin was already that Ashley was pissed off at the other women specifically.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Kromm

[slothgirl]

There are a number of team selection strategies, but none of the good ones involve picking friends. Nor is going with a single gender. 

 

I don't know why Ashley was picked last. I don't know the men's reasoning and I don't know the women's reasoning. I do know that once they were in the workroom, I saw that the other women were ignoring her contributions. Being ignored hurts.

 

What I saw when I watched the episode was four catty women who excluded a talented teammate from the discussion and hurt her feelings. The four catty women played that situation a whole lot worse than the talented teammate did, IMO. 

 

The only pick that made much sense to me was Blake picking Swapnil. Every pick after that left me scratching my head.

 

Why was Edmond the last guy picked? Why didn't the other guys want him? I found it interesting that they showed the clip of Hanmiao and Edmond in the previouslies. She was trying to gesture and Edmond was doing his "Talk!Talk!Talk!Talk! You're doing this (gestures) with your arms, but you need to talk. Please talk. Why don't you talk? Talk!" thing while basically not stopping talking himself and she says "Shut up!". (I always saw that incident differently than most posters) I remember that everyone was sad to see their little Happy Nut go, and I wonder if there's something about Edmond we haven't seen yet that makes the others not want to work with him. Foolish if so, because he played an obviously major part in catapulting them to the top. Maybe they were afraid he would be too Alpha-male?

 

Did we see any evidence of the girls being catty? Maybe we have different definitions of catty. We didn't even see the conversations Laurie was reporting about how they were going to all name Ashley as the one to go. Assuming that did take place, that isn't catty unless they were trash talking her personally rather than evaluating her as either a teammate, designer, or threat as a competitor. Strategizing isn't catty. Gossip and trash talking about someone on a personal level is what I would think of as "catty". We don't even know if they were specifically plotting to all name her, or if they were discussing while she was in another room, that she hadn't contributed much.

 

We actually have NO direct knowledge of what they said or the context of the conversation or if it was planned for while she was out of the room, or spontaneous, or whispered and spread person to person deliberately.

 

Personally, I thought it was foolish of Laurie to go out of her way to diss her team to the judges. I'm also surprised the judges didn't call her out for tattling now instead of working with the team to solve the problems as she saw them. I'm not saying she DIDN"T try... I'm saying that the judges usually come down pretty hard on anyone who separates themselves from their team with a "The team was all this, but not ME! I'M the exception to this travesty!" attitude. I don't know any bosses in the real world who want to hear that either. There may be a short term benefit based on the specific situation, but there's almost always a long term negative ramification because the boss will always see you as "Not a team player" going forward, and possibly even "Not trustworthy".

 

Also, IMO, I'm not all that impressed with Ashley's work so far, so I'm not on the "excluded a talented teammate" train. I thought her look this week was fug. That collar made me shudder.

 

The women were all talking over each other and not listening to one another. I didn't see that Ashley was specifically ignored. As another poster upthread suggested, I saw someone who would have preferred a more structured discussion (like the M&M team was having) being thrown together with a bunch on extrovert chatty "free-association" types. It was a bad mix, but they all pretty much ignored what the others were saying.

 

But since they were all just continuing to talk, it's easy to watch and think Ashley was being singled out for exclusion because she stopped talking when no one was listening instead of behaving the way they were. (And I can't fault her at all for that... as I said upthread, that team would have driven me nuts!)

Edited September 5, 2015 by slothgirl

[Kromm]

Personally, I thought it was foolish of Laurie to go out of her way to diss her team to the judges. I'm also surprised the judges didn't call her out for tattling now instead of working with the team to solve the problems as she saw them. I'm not saying she DIDN"T try... I'm saying that the judges usually come down pretty hard on anyone who separates themselves from their team with a "The team was all this, but not ME! I'M the exception to this travesty!" attitude. I don't know any bosses in the real world who want to hear that either. There may be a short term benefit based on the specific situation, but a long term negative ramification.

The judges didn't call her out for it because it suited them to know what she told them, so they could lob hardballs at the rest of the team.  They only go for that "why doesn't the rest of the team like you" bit when it serves them.  In this case, Laurie acted like she was the hero and sole voice of reason. Which she COULD have been, but in addition to there being no tape of the supposed discussion, there's also none of Laurie actually trying to SOLVE the problem she claimed she saw. 

 

As for the final pick of Ashley by three of them (and perhaps four if Candice hadn't been interrupted), again I don't see how that possibly could have been planned. While on some previous seasons they've had team challenges where they ask that "who should go" question, I don't think they've done it so consistently the team would suspect it. And Kelly DID clearly try to answer another way first.  Even if the show (and Kelly O.) wanted to ignore that. 

[Bella]

I suppose it started out that way, but the pile on that happened later was consistently directed towards the women. Blake's criticisms were about the women. Ashley herself only reserved her hurt feelings and her attitude/sulking for the women. The judging portion (vs. the schoolyard pick) had it rehashed so that it was all about the women (which did spin into them again supposedly ganging up on her, but I think we all realize that the judges cornered contestant Kelly and pushed her into picking a name--and the others just copied her). So yeah, maybe the men were included for the first 5 seconds it was ever discussed, but not for long.

 

I don't blame Ashley for being a bit hurt over being picked last. And that was on both the men and women. But what I think keeps being forgotten or left out is that she pulled it together and was a team player when it came to the paintball game. She stood there and fired away like a champ. It was later, when the other women talked over her, that she realized that she was on the outside despite sucking it up and doing her best. So then because she's a human being, and a young one at that, with the usual assortment of human flaws that make me question the sanity of anyone who goes on reality TV, she kept bringing up the "I was picked last" notion - possibly due to producer prompts - rather than the "I was damned good in the paintball game, I've won two challenges, and they still didn't listen to a single thing I said" line that an older, more self-assured person might say.

 

Anyway, reality TV editing thrives on exaggeration and misdirection. I'm still sympathetic to Ashley and I'm still glad that Amanda is gone. I still think Laurie did the right thing by warning Ashley about a possibly unrecorded conversation among the others that may have taken place when they knew the camera and sound people weren't around (ladies room, anyone?). I still don't like Candace. I still think that Blake is a narcissistic little twerp who indicated a bit of heart at the very end of the episode. I still love Swapnil's eyes, contacts or not, and I still love Edmond's design aesthetic. I still think two of the guys are so forgettable that I don't even try to assign them names because I know I'll get it wrong. And I'm prepared for any of this to change in the coming weeks.

[Freckledbruh]

I also mentioned the men on here and Heidi definitely mentioned the men in her initial statement. I think people are conflating the team picks and how Ashley was treated AFTER the teams were picked. IMO, they all discriminated against her in the team pick because of weight because they assumed she would suck at paintball and running due to her size. Once they all got back to the workroom, I think the mean girls decided that either of the minority team members (Ashley or Laura) were getting the shaft and picked Ashley because, yet again, they assumed that her being overweight meant she would be the weaker of the two.

I can't stand this "where's the empirical evidence?" bull. That is the same page out of the racist handbook to deny racism. Few people straight up tell you that their actions are the result of prejudice.

[gingerormaryann]

The Mean Girls already identified their agenda a few weeks back when Lindsay was teamed with Jake and we had innumerable TLs from Candice, Amanda and Kelly about how Jake wasn't doing anything, Lindsay was being stifled, she was doing all the work, etc., the exact same things we heard during this challenge.   

 

If Laurie is a shit stirrer, GOOD!  There was plenty of shit to be stirred and it turned out she was exactly right about what she warned Ashley about.  The best part of the conversation when they were waiting for their critique was when Candice came up with that ridiculous SF story and when she said what they're going to say up there, Laurie shot back "tell the truth." 

 

Overall, people should be saddened that this team personified every negative feeling that people have about women in groups:  They're catty, non-communicative, clique-ish, hold grudges and are unproductive.  You can argue that the workroom scenes were manipulated by the producers but what can't be disputed is that their end product (both sets) displayed the worst characteristics possible.  And as Heidi aptly stated, so did their behavior on the runway.

[Muffyn]

That was Merline, the one who kept calling muslin "Muslim".    I am part Polish.. I am not aware that the term Polack (i.e."Pole-lock.") is a slur.--I don't THINK it is.   I think it's like saying "Manhattanite or an "Aussie". and Polack instead of "Polander" or "Pol".     

 

Polack may have gotten a bad ring when it was said as "dumb Polack".  I believe this arose out of jealousy because we are so darned good-lookin' !!

I should have suspected Merline or as someone later suggested a Merline/Blake combo.  It's not the worst word ever but it's rarely used in a complementary fashion.  I see it as one of those words we use among our own but give the side eye to others that use it.  YMMV.

 

The women made a huge number of missteps....it seemed as if, when given two choices, they made the worst decision.  Why didn't it dawn on any of them to hold back some of the white material instead of making a monstrous mess of all of it?  It is so odd to me that the men had the lighter touch using the materials while the women's outfits looked as if they had only clubs to sew with.  Candice's notion of the "girl" coming from San Francisco was ridiculous and too clearly pasted on at the end rather than being a theme from the beginning.  Now maybe her plan always was to get rid of Ashley, who has shown design skills, but instead she lost one of the weaker designers and one of her minions.  I am a bit annoyed because I liked Candice up until now but she was a let down. And, no, I'm not going to take some prissy "I don't work in color" as an excuse.  The world is full of color, and not everyone wanders around in black all the time.

 

This is one of the best descriptions I've seen of the all women team in action - when given two choices, pick the worst.  They shot themselves in the foot so many times it's amazing they could still walk.  

 

I live in San Francisco.  When Candace first said their girl was going to SF and later was from SF I laughed.  We are not a pastels city.  In fact, I've had clients from other areas of the country mention how much black I wear.  If someone did an all black collection and said SF fashion was their inspiration, I might believe.  The purple puke collection - no.  

I don't know why Ashley was picked last. I don't know the men's reasoning and I don't know the women's reasoning. I do know that once they were in the workroom, I saw that the other women were ignoring her contributions. Being ignored hurts.

 

But did Ashley openly state that they were talking over her because of her weight? Or did she just state that she felt hurt and ignored? I remember it as being the latter, but I could be wrong. If she did connect it to her weight, it could circle back to previous experiences of being treated badly due to her weight. That seems logical, but it could be wrong, too. 

 

What I saw when I watched the episode was four catty women who excluded a talented teammate from the discussion and hurt her feelings. The four catty women played that situation a whole lot worse than the talented teammate did, IMO. 

I agree.  Ashley did not attribute this to her weight.  People on this board have brought that up as a reason for both teams to skip her because of the paint ball connection.  No one knew she would be a deadly assassin in the world of paint ball.  If I ever play, I want her on my team.  

 

I have already laid out what I saw as the reason for the order of selection.  It was interesting that two people who have won challenges were left to near the end - Edmond and Ashley.  This selection process rolled out strangely.  

 

I suppose it started out that way, but the pile on that happened later was consistently directed towards the women. Blake's criticisms were about the women. Ashley herself only reserved her hurt feelings and her attitude/sulking for the women. The judging portion (vs. the schoolyard pick) had it rehashed so that it was all about the women (which did spin into them again supposedly ganging up on her, but I think we all realize that the judges cornered contestant Kelly and pushed her into picking a name--and the others just copied her). So yeah, maybe the men were included for the first 5 seconds it was ever discussed, but not for long.

 

it certainly didn't help that we had another contestant on the women's team stirring the pot by referring to statements we magically didn't get to see tape of (a bit unbelievably when it supposedly happened right there in the other room and they're always recording), but even before that happened, the spin was already that Ashley was pissed off at the other women specifically.

The later comments were aimed at the women because they were directed to the way she was being treated during the challenge.  So this went beyond the selection process.  Ashley did kick ass at paint ball.  She did try to participate in the discussions and became frustrated when it became clear her team would not focus on the important items to allow them to move forward.  I work in project management.  I've seen teams that are that dysfunctional.  A good leader would identify the key items to be decided then focus the team discussions to garner solutions.  Candace was treated as the ersatz leader.  She chose not to take the reins.  

 

Laurie didn't say that she heard them specifically say they were going after Ashley.  She said it was a sense she had from some comments she heard.  If there had been a group discussion it probably would have been shown.  In the way she stated this, it seemed more like she had heard snippets of different conversations from which her sense was the team would cal out Ashley if they in the bottom.  Even this clueless crew had to have some idea that they could be in the bottom.  I can believe that they started thinking about who they would torpedo if asked.  

[dgpolo]

 

As for the final pick of Ashley by three of them (and perhaps four if Candice hadn't been interrupted), again I don't see how that possibly could have been planned. While on some previous seasons they've had team challenges where they ask that "who should go" question, I don't think they've done it so consistently the team would suspect it. And Kelly DID clearly try to answer another way first.  Even if the show (and Kelly O.) wanted to ignore that.

I think the picking of Ashley as the one to go was definitely planned, I don't think Laurie made it up, I think she was reporting something she had heard, and the 'who should go' (or stay) question HAS been used so consistently that I knew it would be asked here (and was disappointed when the flip of who should win wasn't asked of the guys and Merline).

The way that Nina practically exploded from her chair when they kept saying Ashley was the worst, when it was obvious she was NOT makes Kelly O's interruption make more sense, after they basically told the team they had to pick someone, the fact that they picked ASHLEY made them say something because they knew Ashley was not the worst and so the women were picking that look for some other reason, and what other reason is there except we don't like Ashley so we are picking her regardless of the worth of her work.

[Bella]

I think the picking of Ashley as the one to go was definitely planned, I don't think Laurie made it up, I think she was reporting something she had heard, and the 'who should go' (or stay) question HAS been used so consistently that I knew it would be asked here (and was disappointed when the flip of who should win wasn't asked of the guys and Merline).

The way that Nina practically exploded from her chair when they kept saying Ashley was the worst, when it was obvious she was NOT makes Kelly O's interruption make more sense, after they basically told the team they had to pick someone, the fact that they picked ASHLEY made them say something because they knew Ashley was not the worst and so the women were picking that look for some other reason, and what other reason is there except we don't like Ashley so we are picking her regardless of the worth of her work.

 

This is exactly the way I see it. Thank you.

[sinkwriter]

 

As for the final pick of Ashley by three of them (and perhaps four if Candice hadn't been interrupted), again I don't see how that possibly could have been planned.

 

I don't know... it felt very staged to me. I mean, Amanda especially seemed like a terrible actress. "I'm so sorry, but...Ashley." Lindsey's response as well felt rehearsed, like she was pretending to consider the question and then chose the pre-planned Ashley as well. 

 

I've not seen every season of PR, but of the seasons I've seen, I don't recall ever seeing an entire group of people all pick the same person to go home during a team challenge. Usually there's a mix of two (or sometimes even three) targets, because each person has a different competitor whose work they don't particularly like. For all of them to choose Ashley felt planned to me. Especially because -- for me, anyway -- looking at Ashley's outfit, I didn't see "worst" written all over it. At least (whether one likes the style personally or not) it had a lot of detail work in that pleated collar. For me, the taste level of Kelly's was far worse. I mean it was a tube bra with a weird sort-of vest over it. Baffling and ugly.

Edited September 5, 2015 by sinkwriter

[RedheadZombie]

At this point, I love Edmond.   I thought he was hilarious during the paint ball fight.  He was good natured about the whole thing, and managed to praise Ashley's paint ball abilities without mentioning her size.  He laughed it off as she was going at him hard, and he continued to do so in his talking heads.  He also encouraged her to speak her mind when she was upset. 

 

The only thing more amusing than Candice choosing Amanda to "uplift her", was Candice's TH where she smirks and says, "I think she's [Amanda] going to be the comeback kid".  No way did Candice choose Amanda first in a diabolically clever plan to make her the fall guy if they should lose.  After all, she described Amanda as knowing "color and print".  She also stated she "loves Kelly's work".  Not only does she relish her clique, it also blinds her to their faults.

[DrivingSideways]

\This episode felt more like Survivor than any other episode I've seen... the four white chicks formed an alliance.  I guess there's nothing wrong with that, but it wasn't fair to Ashley and Laurie.  Ashley thought Candace would choose her, and Candace chose her friend.  Maybe she thought one of the next ones would choose Ashley.  I'm glad they were called on their pile-on, and I hope that the remaining girls make it up to Ashley in the next episode.  Kelly is right though... it's a cut throat industry, so don't let them see you cry, Ashley.  There may have been an element of it that was sizest or racial, but I'm not going to paint four girls who were probably just immature with those labels.

 

I wish Swapnil would pop out those contacts.  It makes it incredibly hard to take him seriously.  I just think Michael Jackson Thriller video when I see him.

[film noire]

Btw, speaking as someone who was overweight and now is thin, "Thinsters" aren't some cabal of dark lords secretly collaborating to keep fat women down. There are some serious issues in our culture as a whole regarding female body image, fashion, and media, but casting women with a BMI under 23 ("thin" is a subjective comparative measure, so I picked a random objective form of measurement) as scheming villains constantly subsisting only on raw lettuce and water is just as nonsensical and unproductive as casting all fat women as lazy slobs. Do some people act horribly towards individuals due to their weight? Yes. But assuming that all the women (and apparently the men too, as they didn't select her either) somehow loathe her for a physical quality is beyond reaching. There isn't some grand Anti-Fat conspiracy at work.

 

I've been on both sides of the scale as well -- and yeah, there actually is a society-wide, fat-shaming "conspiracy" which I think these women bought into. Add into that the contempt the fashion world feels for women of size (how many times has a designer in seasons past bemoaned getting a client with a body outside the model spectrum?) and it becomes very hard to presume purity on the part of these women. And then -- after othering the fuck out of Ashley,  they moved on to the woman of color who dared to open her mouth and suggest they tell the truth on the runway -- all purely random, I'm sure:)

 

And the reason the women & their picks are being examined more deeply than that of the men is because  the first woman to pick *won a challenge* working with Ashley --  not picking her was a very clear statement that the picks were based on something that had nothing to do with talent, or likelihood of success, but something else. And this wasn't a challenge situation in which having the most successful designer would work against you (as in a team of two only, or the most successful  also having immunity, leaving you alone to be sent home if your team failed). This was a team challenge in which Ashley -- as one of the two MVP of the season so far -- would only bring you closer to victory, and nobody going home.

 

Instead, Candace picked the person who had been the *biggest failure* all season, in order to "uplift" one woman (uh hunh) and then leading the rest right into the toilet. Even if only motivated by the purest of intentions -- completely untouched by the fat-hating fashion culture Candace lives and breathes in -- that was a stupid, idiotic move. The Fathead vs. The Fat* Girl;  I'll pick Ashley first, every time.

 

(* i use "fat" instead of "overweight" out of respect for fat feminists trying to reclaim the word as a descriptor, not a moral failing requiring prettier words. )

Edited September 5, 2015 by film noire

[Muffyn]

It was also telling that the bottom three standing on the stage at the end did not include Ashley.  Candace was there for her bunched up mess of a dress.  Amanda showed her tent of many colors.  And Kelly showed a chest binder (I won't call it a bandage top because it was so ill fitting it did nothing but flatten the models breasts, a poorly designed harness and a fugly, super high-waisted mermaid skirt. 

 

The work that Laurie, Ashley and Lindsey did was not good.  At best they achieved boring.  However, they were well above the three bottom looks.  

[Kromm]

they all discriminated against her in the team pick because of weight because they assumed she would suck at paintball and running due to her size. 

They didn't even know paintball was the challenge when teams were picked.  It hadn't been mentioned yet.

[Freckledbruh]

They didn't even know paintball was the challenge when teams were picked.  It hadn't been mentioned yet.

I know the designers aren't very bright but I don't think they are completely stupid. Heidi and Tim were carrying paintball guns and dressed in coveralls. I mean duh!

[Kromm]

I have already laid out what I saw as the reason for the order of selection.  It was interesting that two people who have won challenges were left to near the end - Edmond and Ashley.  This selection process rolled out strangely.  

Actually this suggests it was a deliberate plan, sure. But by BOTH the men and the women in cooperation.  Pretty much everyone except those two, and perhaps a few others picked near the end.

 

Not that they knew a schoolyard pick was coming. That's the problem with all of these theories.  

I know the designers aren't very bright but I don't think they are completely stupid. Heidi and Tim were carrying paintball guns and dressed in coveralls. I mean duh!

Fair point, but I'd sooner believe they simply saw her as a threat than that they thought about a possible challenge (and decided it merely by eye contact right then and there).

[RedheadZombie]

Normally I read all the comments first, then comment (TWoP habits), but I wanted to write this immediately: FUCKING THANK GOD FUCKING AMANDA IS GONE. She was the worst person AND worst designer on that team. Long overdue. But THANK GOD.

 

Also Swapnil should have won for that outfit. Edmond's was great, but Swapnil's was gorgeous, clever, and creative.  Just perfect.

 

Ah, the 15/15 rule.  Fond memories of reading fifteen pages or fifteen days (whichever is greater) before posting.

[sinkwriter]

 

I know the designers aren't very bright but I don't think they are completely stupid. Heidi and Tim were carrying paintball guns and dressed in coveralls.

 

When Tim pointed out that Blake hadn't been hit at all... I loved his "oh snap!" comment, but I would have laughed my head off if he had turned around and shot Blake with his paintball gun, just once. To let him know you have to play, you have to participate, you don't get to skip out.

[Honey]

Jmo, if Ashley is not as "popular" among the other women, it does not have to be due to her weight. Also, not being popular by this bunch of flakes should be viewed as a huge plus, Imo. I am kind of sorry to see her take this so personally, as everyone ended up looking foolish, when she could have come off better by not whining on camera by being chosen last. She knew she had two wins, or a win and share, whatever, that should have been her inspiration. Though personally I am not wild about her work, the judges had rewarded her for it early on, which is all that matters.

Kelly O. Is a pot/kettle, comsidering her twitter fueds with other women over the years, lol. She is extremely immature and downright briainless, Imo.

Mostly, I love Heidi. But wish she had not stirred it up in this episode.

I agree that poor Tim may be battling shingles or something similar. His skin looks painful to me.

Tim has psoriasis.

[Muffyn]

Actually this suggests it was a deliberate plan, sure. But by BOTH the men and the women in cooperation.  Pretty much everyone except those two, and perhaps a few others picked near the end.

 

Not that they knew a schoolyard pick was coming. That's the problem with all of these theories.  

 I have not said it was a deliberate plan for either team.  They did not know they would be selecting teams on this day until they were told it was a team challenge.  They also didn't know that each person selected would select the next member.  And they certainly couldn't have guessed the button bag pull for Candace.  I am not saying there was a conspiracy afoot in the selection process.  I don't think anyone has.  There were just some very odd individual decisions made if looking at this from the perspective that people are trying to win a reality competition.  

[RedheadZombie]

I thought someone else, maybe Blake, said it first and then Merline said, "You hear that, (someone)? Pole-ock."

 

Swapnil mentioned Pollock first, and with his accent it sounded like Pole-ock.  Merline repeated what he said, "Oh, Jackson Pollock.  Can we do Jackson Pollock?"  Neither realized they had mispronounced it, and neither meant it as a slur, IMO. 

 

I rewatched the episode and upon reflection, I have altered my opinion of Ashley, but only slightly. I DO think she has a complex due to her weight and I'm sure she was always picked last for everything, but she victimized herself in the beginning when she was incredulous that she was picked last. I think her feelings were MORE hurt, though, by them marginalizing her when she tried to help steer the team, and then even MORE when she *felt* ostracized by the gang which culminated in her finding out from Laurie that she had overheard them planning to steamroller her on the runway, if they lost. I wish she wouldn't cry because it harkens back to that victim thing again and I hate to see someone make themselves the victim, like Amanda did every single week since she started on the show. 

 

Ashley is only twenty-four.  I think she may have been hit with the realization many of us experience as adults:  High school mentality doesn't end when you graduate.  It can be devastating to those who were miserable during their teens.

[akr]

I don't think they consciously disregarded Ashley because of her weight - prejudice isn't usually that bald. It's just, they picked who they felt most comfortable with, who just happened to be the other young, hip (in their minds) skinny white girls. Candace had the hubris to think she could be "nice" and mentor Amanda, who she perceived as struggling, and for whatever reason it just devolved to selecting the little clique that they'd probably already settled into. They "got along" with everybody, and maybe even liked and respected Ashley and/or Laurie and Merline as much or even more than each other, but they nonetheless just didn't automatically feel like part of their little club. Not of course because they were overweight or minorities, but just because. This is how it works, subjectively - and objectively, it doesn't make a difference to the person who is perpetually left out because of it.  

 

As someone who is no longer young, hip or svelte, (actually I was more athletic than svelte at my best), I would nonetheless like to know where I can get Lindsey's earrings. Maybe that will make her feel less cool for having chosen them. 

[film noire]

Ashley is only twenty-four.  I think she may have been hit with the realization many of us experience as adults:  High school mentality doesn't end when you graduate.  It can be devastating to those who were miserable during their teens.

 

Yes -- here she is on PR, likely thinking  "My talent is my calling card now & I've done really well so far -- I won't be rejected for my size here" only to find out her wins and talent meant fuck all (for whatever reason) in the pick process.

 

As someone who is no longer young, hip or svelte, (actually I was more athletic than svelte at my best), I would nonetheless like to know where I can get Lindsey's earrings. Maybe that will make her feel less cool for having chosen them. 

 

LOL

[aradia22]

 

Very depressing that they reinforced the negative perceptions the media portrays women (or in this case, "girls") in groups as.

I'm still not seeing it. Maybe it's because this is exactly the kind of garbage Lifetime likes to push while purporting to be female-friendly programming. The evidence is thin. Laurie hearing "something" that was conveniently not filmed. Blake calling them mean girls. Ashley crying. Three people choosing her admittedly terrible pleated thing as the worst outfit. Talking heads that were probably filmed after all of this had gone down.

[slothgirl]

People on this board have brought that up as a reason for both teams to skip her because of the paint ball connection.  No one knew she would be a deadly assassin in the world of paint ball.  If I ever play, I want her on my team.  

 

I have already laid out what I saw as the reason for the order of selection.  It was interesting that two people who have won challenges were left to near the end - Edmond and Ashley.  This selection process rolled out strangely.  

 

If they didn't pick her because they thought her size might be a disadvantage in a physical challenge, then why oh why would the guys have picked Jake and bloody JOSEPH before picking Edmond, who is both more athletic and more talented than either of those guys?

 

To me the non-selection of Edmond was a bigger head-scratcher than the non-selection of Ashley. MOST of the contestants probably don't particularly care for Ashley's overall aesthetic. (and neither do I). I can't believe that none of them like Edmond's. I agree, the whole thing was strange.

 

The problem with early team challenges is that the contestants all know so much more about each other than we do at this point. It's impossible to say what might lead them to make various decisions about the other contestants, because we have such a limited reference point for each's experience of the others.

 

Someone upthread mentioned that the contestants are chattering on twitter about all this. Does anyone have a link?

 

When Tim pointed out that Blake hadn't been hit at all... I loved his "oh snap!" comment, but I would have laughed my head off if he had turned around and shot Blake with his paintball gun, just once.

That would have almost made the entire episode worth it!

Edited September 5, 2015 by slothgirl

[Honey]

I wish Swapnil would pop out those contacts.  It makes it incredibly hard to take him seriously.  I just think Michael Jackson Thriller video when I see him.

Ugh, I agree.  He's just so odd looking.

[aradia22]

 

Wasn't Ashley initially making pants to go with the top that she made? I thought she mentioned that she did not like the fit or something and that is why she scrapped them in favor of the skirt.

Yes. I'm going to have to pay more attention to her construction skills. I thought she did a very nice job with the gray dress. But her first winning look was pretty basic. It was a good design but wasn't particularly difficult to make. Then she made that weird house coat with the diamonds. She needed Candice's help with the giant hideous red pants. And this week she used the pants from the jumpsuit but they somehow ended up being too tight? I'd forgotten about that until I read this.