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Pretty Little Theories

Cranberry

By Cranberry
in Pretty Little Liars [V]

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mercfan3

mercfan3

I don't think Jenna is bad. Someone has been trying to kill her from the getgo too. I actually think it's possible we could have seen the entire show from Jenna's perspective and it would have looked a lot like the liars. 

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GaT
GaT

My theory is that Aunt Carol used to have a dog named Charles, & that's who is buried in the grave.

dwmckim
dwmckim

Don't forget Maya.

bettername2come
bettername2come

Mona has an identical twin. Her twin tried to kill her, there was quite a struggle, blood was spilled from both parties, Mona killed her evil twin and ran away, deciding to fake her own death. A, for

Crim

Crim

Since the writers most likely no longer keep track of when Jenna was blind and when she wasn't, her being any of the more permanent Team A players pretty much guarantees continuity messes all around. Of course, TPTB might not care anymore.

Black Widow -- Jenna's off-screen mother, because nothing says "bad writing" like introducing the ultimate villian in the last 10 minutes of a mystery.

LOL. That would be an idea. The show could just go for broke and have something like:

 

Black Widow - Jenna's off-screen mother FTW!

Red Coat - Shana (Well, someone must be Not Dead. Would tie in with BW since Shana betrayed Ali to date Jenna.)

Charles - Noel Kahn (Hasn't been on the show in ages, but still a favorite for many. Ironically, it could actually work, because he was tied into several story lines, but we never got a clear idea how he was involved.)

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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

 

Also think that Charles isn't actually responsible for the drowning/scalding baby Ali incident, it was one of the parents. They put Ali in the tub with the water running, got distracted by something and left her too long. Charles walked in and froze up because he was, like, 10, and the parent ended up putting the blame on him rather than take it themselves.

 

I've been wondering something along the same lines...like, perhaps Jason was actually guilty of it, not Charles...? It would be resonate with the whole Courtney/Ali thing, where one was the actual sociopath and got the other committed....

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krimimimi

krimimimi

(edited)

Does it even count as a theory when you don't have any faith in the writers to tie up loose ends or realize a storyline? I swear every stupid finale I sit there trying to come up with ways to take what we've been given and salvage something, and they pretty much screw the pooch every time.

I've got a whole slew of problems with the show at this point, but two instances of Ali claiming something happened to her, that we know/believe happened to other characters really stand out for me. Those are 1) the supposed independent burial alive of two girls on the same evening, and 2) the kidnapping of the Liars/Ali making up the same story beforehand, yet *after* Sara's abduction (supposedly given no knowledge thereof). For mine, if those issues aren't addressed in the finale, the show will be irrevocably damaged in my eyes, and the writers outed as hacks - lazy or stupid, take your pick, because I agree with those of you who are sure open questions won't be addressed later/post-time jump. And the sad thing is, I still think it's possible to address them, but consider it unlikely that they will. (Why, oh why can't I just quit watching?)

Currently we are supposed to believe that Ali and Bethany were 1) both hit on the head by somebody (or somebodies) and were 2) both buried alive 3) by someone other than the individual(s) who struck them.

I'd be fine with them both being struck, if they hadn't both been buried alive, particularly by people other than the strikers. That's asking for me to believe too many coincidences. If the body had been meant to be found, the situation would also be different. But it was too well hidden for the second attack to serve as a stand-in for Ali. I'd even accept that they were both buried alive, if the strikers were the same person (someone who doesn't know how to conk somebody on the head properly/fatally, natch) and that person were the one to bury Bethany (enraged at Ali's rescue, X strikes again and finishes the job by planting her in the ground...), but not if she too was buried by a second person, unrelated to the assault. Once again, a step too far. And that only works if Melissa is the attacker (and buried Bethany), or if she was lying about burying Bethany (either of which she would do why??).

Basically, we know that Bethany was buried alive. We have her body. There was an autopsy. (I reject the idea of a manipulated autopsy report because there is no way the coroner in a small town wouldn't remember a young woman had been buried alive. Or not.) And Melissa admits to having done this, which caused Bethany's death. That admission is a huge deal, so I consider it probable. And admitting that much also makes it's less likely (for me) that Melissa was the one to have struck Bethany. (At the least, she's already confessing to manslaughter. In for a penny...) But here we have Ali saying that that very same thing happened to her. Hmm. And as it stands, we have only the Grunwald's account of pulling Ali from a shallow grave to corroborate any part of Ali's story. It doesn't help that the Grunwald is more than a little loony.

As to the abductions, we are supposed to believe that Ali made up a story of being kidnapped and held prisoner, but most emphatically not raped (while she was apparently actually just a runaway according to what she tells the girls), precisely what ends up happening to the Liars. And that version works fine for me, because I took their kidnapping as being *caused* by that false report. She goes on very public record claiming to be a kidnapping victim, and A decides to teach her a lesson. (Added bonus: Ali's cries of "wolf" reduce the sympathy the Liars get from the townsfolk post-dollhouse enormously. Pity that was hardly explored.) But then we're supposed to believe that Sara had been kidnapped years prior to Ali ever making that statement. That strikes me as unlikely. Especially as it's at least the second occurrence of this nature (see: burial alive).

So for my money, either Sara wasn't abducted first (and is basically a nefarious faker, and probably in it with Charles or whomever), or Ali had knowledge of it. Both are satisfactory for me. What's not satisfactory is the idea that Ali made up the story that purely coincidentally relates what her brother (or whoever) was already doing to a girl Ali'd never heard of. Or maybe she's psychic, but that would leave me profoundly dissatisfied as well.

Relating that to the first incident, if the explanation lies with Sara faking her imprisonment, it doesn't help explain the live burials. (It basically requires Melissa's involvement there, which is less streamlined.) But if Ali knew that Sara had been taken, then we have another more recent and serious incidence of Ali lying to the Liars (and us), and that would throw some doubt on her version of the events of the night of 1000 yellow tops.

Which would also make her story of running away less probable.

And that increases the likelihood of Ali being in cahoots with "Charles." Or of being in competition with him, for that matter, using the Liars and others as playing pieces in a dangerous and twisted game.

If they're working together, how does that reconcile with the prom Ali-napping? Maybe now he's become so unstable, he's finally breaking for good. Maybe he wants to come clean, or just reunite with Jason. Whatever, there's a rift between them, or he's crumbling, which would explain(ish) the weird interaction at the prom. And here we are, with a mentally disturbed Charles, who only did some of the things we thought, allowing the (nevertheless thoroughly unacceptable) Liar forgiveness scenes (bitch, please). And moving forward, a return to evil Ali. Or they've been competing at malignant live chess. I also like the idea that she's working with NoelKahn, and Charles really died back in the day. And Mrs.D had to die so she wouldn't contradict Ali's versions of that or the burial.

Goodness knows, SP deserves some better material. She always did well with what she had in the past, so I can only assume the blandness of returned Ali is down to what she's asked to play and fuzzy characterization.

All of which also has the advantage of not playing into the crappy patriarchy blah blah victimization scenarios. I'd prefer A to be female. And closer in age to those targeted.

Any of that convince any of you?

That said, if they make Charles be

1) Ezra, I won't care if it makes sense. I'll just be thankful IH was given something to do, and the writers haven't ignored the implications of his watching the girls be stalked without action. Plus it means we don't have three(!) separate parallel instances of people surveilling the girls (NAT/A/Ezra). Yet another improbability that makes me stabby...

2) Wren, I'll be thankful for the return of the pretty. Sometimes that's enough.

3) Wilden, I'll survive. My expectations are low anyway, and Mona didn't make sense looking all dead last fall either.

Edited by krimimimi
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CloudySky

CloudySky

Someone asked Joseph Daugherty about this on Twitter and he admitted that it was a continuity error. He said something like we're not perfect!

LOL! A continuity error is someone holding a cup one second and nothing the next or if we go a little bigger all of the ages of every 20something year old in the series. I can forgive that. But a MAJOR scene like that that was a plot point for half a season in your MYSTERY show...come frickin on. You don't have to be perfect to get that right...

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lorikauai

lorikauai

I have always wondered if Ali's recount of the burying alive incident is really her changing herself from perpetrator to victim. She did write the letter encouraging Bethany to see her that night. Maybe she hit Bethany and Mrs D witnessed it? So she and Mrs D took the body to the hole and started to bury it with Mrs D saying, "What have you done?" Perhaps Ali ran off and Mrs D tried to catch her and in the meantime Melissa stumbled across the body in the hole and finished burying it thinking Spencer had killed Ali. We still have the problem of Mrs Grunwald pulling Ali out of the grave but it's less far-fetched that Ali paid Grunwald to tell the girls that story than Grunwald had a psychic vision and happened to make it to Rosewood in time to pull Ali from the grave before she suffocated. 

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krimimimi

krimimimi

(edited)

I have always wondered if Ali's recount of the burying alive incident is really her changing herself from perpetrator to victim. She did write the letter encouraging Bethany to see her that night. Maybe she hit Bethany and Mrs D witnessed it? So she and Mrs D took the body to the hole and started to bury it with Mrs D saying, "What have you done?" Perhaps Ali ran off and Mrs D tried to catch her and in the meantime Melissa stumbled across the body in the hole and finished burying it thinking Spencer had killed Ali. We still have the problem of Mrs Grunwald pulling Ali out of the grave but it's less far-fetched that Ali paid Grunwald to tell the girls that story than Grunwald had a psychic vision and happened to make it to Rosewood in time to pull Ali from the grave before she suffocated.

That works perfectly for me, because it reduces it to one girl buried alive. And Evil!Ali makes so many of the story inconsistencies go away. Plus her overturned conviction increases the likelihood that she wouldn't be prosecuted (for anything) again in the near future. (Her conviction was always the glitch in my Charles&Ali tag team theory, and made me think they were battling it out instead, or there was another antagonist, but we've already had Mona and are seriously gilding the lily as is. If she's super evil, though, and responsible for Bethany's murder, then suddenly it becomes a gambit instead. I like that. :-))

As to the Grunwald, who knows, maybe she rescued Bethany's ghost? I've certainly had problems keeping the long haired blondes straight, so maybe she couldn't tell the difference either. (That ghost bit makes more sense if you watched Ravenswood.)

Edited by krimimimi
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cuddlingcrowley

cuddlingcrowley

(edited)

 

Has it ever been established what they were even doing on the ground? As it turns out, he wasn't choking her and they weren't having an intercourse (because apparently Alison is a virgin... minus Wilden, maybe), so all those noises came from... intense kissing???

 

 

I'm thinking while Ian and Alison apparently never had "intercourse", it's likely they did everything but considering that video and the fact they got a room together at Hilton Head and were set to film whatever they intended to do there, if I recal correctly.

 

I took the interview stuff to the spoiler thread! My bad!

Edited by cuddlingcrowley
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Cranberry

Cranberry

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I hope that none of the girls are pregnant/have a child after the time jump. I've got nothing against people having kids, but unless they're actually the focus of a show, babies tend to bring a show (especially an action-y show) down. I'm thinking about shows like Homeland and Revenge where the babies couldn't be worked into the storyline so were shuffled offscreen with a caretaker/relative most of the time.

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Giuliano Lanzilli

Giuliano Lanzilli

(edited)

I'm thinking while Ian and Alison apparently never had "intercourse", it's likely they did everything but considering that video and the fact they got a room together at Hilton Head and were set to film whatever they intended to do there, if I recal correctly.

 

I took the interview stuff to the spoiler thread! My bad!

 

I'm more confused than ever! By "they did everything" do you by any chance mean "all of the other sexual practices BUT penetration"? I'm no legal expert but, if that were the case, could Ian really afford to think he was off the hook and there was no way Alison could've made him suffer any legal consequences for engaging in said practices with her? Besides, why would you meet up IN THE WOODS, AT NIGHT, where IT'S JUST THE TWO OF US and do everything BUT stopping at full-on sex??? It doesn't make any sense... It was OBVIOUSLY the showrunners rewriting history for the umpteenth time .-.

Edited by Giuliano Lanzilli
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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

Is anyone else as anxious/excited/overly invested as I am about tonight? I spent most of last night watching old episodes and working on theories and ended up legitimiately kept tossing and turning all night with visions of Red Coats dancing in my head.

This show brings me so much joy, as improbable and perhaps insane as that sounds. Whatever the PLL equivalent of a Trekkie is, I am at that level. So to know that we will (maybe/probably) solve much of the mystery tonight is giving me a weird mix of thrill and dread that I honestly feel a little sick! I've been dyyiiiiing to know things that now I'm not so sure I wanna know, because then it's overrrrr. No doubt there will be some mysteries that carry over and hopefully new mysteries to come after the jump, but I'm having a weird "end of an era" panic.

 

Whatever happens, we'll always have Rosewood.

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cuddlingcrowley

cuddlingcrowley

(edited)
I'm more confused than ever! By "they did everything" do you by any chance mean "all of the other sexual practices BUT penetration"?

 

 

Yes.

 

I'm no legal expert but, if that were the case, could Ian really afford to think he was off the hook and there was no way Alison could've made him suffer any legal consequences for engaging in said practices with her? Besides, why would you meet up IN THE WOODS, AT NIGHT, where IT'S JUST THE TWO OF US and do everything BUT stopping at full-on sex??? It doesn't make any sense...

 

 

You'd be surprised how common is it to think sex only counts if it involves vaginal intercourse, so I can believe quite easily that Ian not having intercourse with the 15 year old girl made him feel he wasn't doing anything wrong. Besides, that way it's a lot more harder to prove he was doing anything at all.

 

 

It was OBVIOUSLY the showrunners rewriting history for the umpteenth time .-.

 

 

Of course it was. But this show has a long history of asking me to suspent my disbilief as far as all the girls are concerned. Maybe because I'm in the same agegroup as the actresses are in real life and they all look their age to me. And the characters often act that age as well, especially in season 1. I'm sure if they had played these characters back when they were their age it would have been a lot easier to buy certain character choices.

Edited by cuddlingcrowley
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cuddlingcrowley

cuddlingcrowley

(edited)
Is anyone else as anxious/

 

 

Check!

 

excited/

 

 

Check!

 

overly invested as I am about tonight?

 

 

CHECK!

 

I blame the cast entirely for it because of the recent interviews! I'm in a state and so damn glad this show airs on Tuesdays because I don't think i'd survive waiting another day!

 

This is it. There's no more: they'll make it work some other time. Either they tie (almost) everything together in a way that makes sense today or they never will and it will most likely ruin the show forever, retroactively. I've decided not to watch the episodes Marlene told us to because I'm really excited to do a full series rewatch so I'm praying they don't ruin everything.

Edited by cuddlingcrowley
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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

 

I've decided not to watch the episode Marlene told us to because I'm really excited to do a full series rewatch so I'm praying they don't ruin everything.

 

Do you mean the list of 5 eps? If so, those are the ones I watched last night and I remain just as up in the air. I thought I had a theory NAILED and then this last season kinda mucked it all up, so I really have NO idea what tonight will bring!

 

After every season, pretty much, I do a whole or at least a half series re-watch, but I'm ESPECIALLY excited to do so now. You know, provided everything lines up. I just re-watched the pilot where you can see Mona texting as A under desk if you look carefully, and I PRAY they've put in these kinds of easter eggs throughout for the big(ger) A reveal tonight! So good.

P.S. I'm sure y'all all know, but ABC Fam is airing some of the greatest hits from noon onward. I'm watching in the background as I "work," aka pretend to have anything on the brain but A theories.

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cuddlingcrowley

cuddlingcrowley

(edited)

Do you mean the list of 5 eps?

 

 

 

Yep. The only seasons I ever rewatched were season 1 and 2 because there used to be a chanel in my country that aired them repeatedly. I've probably rewatched the pilot 30 times (what a great pilot  *_*).

 

I'm not from the US so I don't get ABC family, otherwise I'd be watching the episodes that are being aired today as well. But as it is, I have way too much stuff to do to actually dig up the episodes.

 

I have a good feeling the answers themselves will make sense. Marlene said over and over again she's not worried about shocking people and I don't care to be shocked. My main concern is Charle's sob story. Now, that I'm terrified of. But full disclaimer: if Charles in indeed Wilden, then y'all gonna think of me as weak tomorrow. Because I love the guy!

Edited by cuddlingcrowley
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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

 

My main concern is Charle's sob story. Now, that I'm terrified of.

 

Word. Short of some kinda Strangers on the Train switcheroo, where Charles isn't actually the one who's been torturing them, there's nothing that's actually gonna work for me. And I'm still SUPER worried they're going to do a Charles as transgender storyline, which will just be such an offensive disaster it might ruin everything for me. But I'm slighty less worried about that than I was at the begnning of the season....

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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

(edited)

When Aria look up in class and sees Ezra is her teacher, she gets the first A text. In the right corner, in a couple quick cuts, you can see that everyone is looking at Aria (bc her phone just rang/she yelps at seeing Ezra), but Mona is looking down and has her hands under the desk. (As a professor, I've seen so many surreptitious texting attempts like this, I laughed aloud.)

 

It's a blink an you'll miss it little moment.

 

[Edited to add: Dang it, I'm so sorry @Cranberry, I'm pretty sure I just devolved into Wrong Thread talk here! I don't know how to move things from thread to thread (can you delete your own posts?), or I'd do the dirty work myself. Apologies for being a threadjacker RIGHT after you warned us otherwise!]

Edited by itainttippithebird
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raytch

raytch

Check!

Check!

CHECK!

I blame the cast entirely for it because of the recent interviews! I'm in a state and so damn glad this show airs on Tuesdays because I don't think i'd survive waiting another day!

This is it. There's no more: they'll make it work some other time. Either they tie (almost) everything together in a way that makes sense today or they never will and it will most likely ruin the show forever, retroactively. I've decided not to watch the episodes Marlene told us to because I'm really excited to do a full series rewatch so I'm praying they don't ruin everything.

Hell yeah I'm excited! And it's all thanks to the interviews with the cast!

After the last few episodes my expectations have hit rock bottom and I thought I didn't care anymore and I just wanted it to be over but who the heck am I kidding? I have been in this show since day one and no matter what happens tonight I'm thrilled that we'll finally get some legit answers. Are we getting a full break down of all our 18384949 questions that have been piling up for 5 years now? of course not! But we're getting something and I've made my peace with that.

My only problem is the A sob story, but who knows? And honestly at this point... WHO CARES. We're gonna see A. That psycho son of a mother is gonna take off his mask and the world will come crashing down.

Also, whoever it is we'll know for sure and I can finally think about other things in the shower or while eating or whenever I'm not talking to people or working.

I'm sitting at home wondering if I should go out and get drunk and sleep like a baby and just catch the episode tomorrow like a sane person would do, or if I should drink a whole pitcher of coffee and wait until 4 am and watch live with you guys!

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Giuliano Lanzilli

Giuliano Lanzilli

Hell yeah I'm excited! And it's all thanks to the interviews with the cast!

After the last few episodes my expectations have hit rock bottom and I thought I didn't care anymore and I just wanted it to be over but who the heck am I kidding? I have been in this show since day one and no matter what happens tonight I'm thrilled that we'll finally get some legit answers. Are we getting a full break down of all our 18384949 questions that have been piling up for 5 years now? of course not! But we're getting something and I've made my peace with that.

My only problem is the A sob story, but who knows? And honestly at this point... WHO CARES. We're gonna see A. That psycho son of a mother is gonna take off his mask and the world will come crashing down.

Also, whoever it is we'll know for sure and I can finally think about other things in the shower or while eating or whenever I'm not talking to people or working.

I'm sitting at home wondering if I should go out and get drunk and sleep like a baby and just catch the episode tomorrow like a sane person would do, or if I should drink a whole pitcher of coffee and wait until 4 am and watch live with you guys!

 

LOL!

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Giuliano Lanzilli

Giuliano Lanzilli

(edited)

Guess which one I ended up doing Giuliano!

 

Unfortunately I think I'm gonna choose the same option (but just this one time, because I'm considering dropping the show for good after tonight's episode since I feel like its very purpose would be lost without the dragged-on-for-centuries A storyline and I just LOATHE time jumps). Mostly I just don't wanna have to keep dodging the revelation spoiled all over the web for the whole day of tomorrow, so I figured I'll just get it out of my system ASAP! XD

Edited by Giuliano Lanzilli
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raytch

raytch

(edited)

Unfortunately I think I'm gonna choose the same option (but just this one time, because I'm considering dropping the show for good after tonight's episode since I feel like its very purpose would be lost without the dragged-on-for-centuries A storyline and I just LOATHE time jumps). Mostly I just don't wanna have to keep dodging the revelation spoiled all over the web for the whole day of tomorrow, so I figured I'll just get it out of my system ASAP! XD

Haha Amen!

Now the trick is to stay awake long enough. I'm trying to kill time. So far I've cooked 3 meals, cleaned the fridge and watered every plant I have.

Next up is laundry which should take a couple of hours.

I'm so regretting this tomorrow.

Ok I just need to say this one more time because it's never going to happen.

PLEASE LET IT BE EZRA LORD, PLEASE LET IT BE EZRA.

Edited by raytch
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cuddlingcrowley

cuddlingcrowley

Now the trick is to stay awake long enough. I'm trying to kill time. So far I've cooked 3 meals, cleaned the fridge and watered every plant I have.

 

 

Ha! i'd never manage to stay awake till 4 am, good luck! 

Ok I just need to say this one more time because it's never going to happen.

PLEASE LET IT BE EZRA LORD, PLEASE LET IT BE EZRA.

 

Psss, we're all thinking it. I'll take Toby too!!!!

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WhosThatGirl

WhosThatGirl

(edited)

Ugh. All of these clues annoy the hell out of me. How is Clue 10 possible? Also Clue 9 is confusing too. I'm trying to think of how clue 9 is possible.  it does kick Wren out. Unless they make something up, which.. they could. It's this show. I should have stacked up on the vodka tonight ;)

Edited by WhosThatGirl
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itainttippithebird

itainttippithebird

 

"Let Go and Let VanderJesus".

 

Huh???

 

Oh, just a silly play on the phrase "let go and let God" subbing in a common nickname for Mona in the fandom - VanderJesus.  People called her this for her omniscent awesomeness long before her death and resurrection, but that made her nickname all the more awesome.

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WhosThatGirl

WhosThatGirl

(edited)

Don't forget Pepe the dog! Clue 13 made me laugh out loud. So A really does have an abusive relationship with the girls. I think the clues are just trolling us. I expect the next clue to be "A wears a black hoodie" or something. 

Edited by WhosThatGirl
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allonsyalice

allonsyalice

It's all the obvious things "A is under the age of 50." "A is not a parent." could you imagine if a parent was doing all of this. I'm off thinking it's Wren, though, because I'm not sure Wren knows Ali exists. I wish it could be Aria, but maybe Melissa?  

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allonsyalice

allonsyalice

(edited)

Same, but I'm thinking that Uber A and Black hoodie are in cahoots, which leaves Black Veil doing their own Black Veil thing. 

 

edit, sorry, A IS TALLER THAN ARIA? WHO ISNT???

Edited by allonsyalice
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marina707

marina707

I'm not sure about Charles' identity (I'm sort of thinking Wilden at this point, maybe) but given all the stuff in the media about his tragic backstory and the articles/interviews that imply they're going to try to redeem him, I don't think he's A. And one of the moms (Pam, I think?) saying something last episode about how maybe it's not him that's responsible for the A stuff makes me think it even more.

 

For A, I'm actually leaning towards an Ali twin. I think it would be the most "shocking", and there have been so many hints over the years that would fit. Of course, some of them were vague enough that they could refer to Charles, but not all of them. And if she was around and pretending to be Ali before her "death", some of the liars' friendship would actually be with the twin instead, and would fit the "betrayal" scenario everyone keeps talking about. Some of the clues might not fit exactly, but if we thought she was Ali at the time, I think they could.

 

Of course, I may be (and probably am) way off base, but I guess we'll see soon enough!

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raytch

raytch

Man those clues are priceless!

Literally there is no one on the show older than 50 except for Dr. Palmer and Grandma Marin. Maybe Ezra's mom too.

And everyone is taller than Aria. Even Mona!


I get it's ABCF's strategy fo trending the hashtag but seriously... try a little harder.

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methodwriter85

methodwriter85

Word. Short of some kinda Strangers on the Train switcheroo, where Charles isn't actually the one who's been torturing them, there's nothing that's actually gonna work for me. And I'm still SUPER worried they're going to do a Charles as transgender storyline, which will just be such an offensive disaster it might ruin everything for me. But I'm slighty less worried about that than I was at the begnning of the season....

 

Well, your worries were well-founded, and man, how about the progress of having yet another villainous transgender character?

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