Star Wars: The Force Awakens (2015)

[MrsR]

Obi Wan won against Annikin because:

 

He was a superior trained/experienced Jedi.

 

He was, as a result, much calmer

 

And most of all, he had been in Annikin's position before (with Darth Maul) and succeeded, so he knew how to counter the move Annikin was about to attempt. Annikin was such a shmuck, he was no where close to being able to beat Obi Wan in a light saber duel. 

 

I think fans really go overboard with the relationship between the Force and the light saber. It's just a freaking cool weapon that the Jedi's chose to use. There's nothing about it that would keep it from being used by some other warrior, (except it's cost maybe). Han uses it as a tool in ESB. A Jedi would be able to pull a blaster or a staff or a lead pipe to them by using the force as well. It's just an expensive intimidating weapon. 

 

And as for Kylo being not a strong enough villian, well Darth was defeated in ANH. And by a scruffy nerf herder at that.

 

 

[Danny Franks]

I think fans really go overboard with the relationship between the Force and the light saber. It's just a freaking cool weapon that the Jedi's chose to use. There's nothing about it that would keep it from being used by some other warrior, (except it's cost maybe). Han uses it as a tool in ESB. A Jedi would be able to pull a blaster or a staff or a lead pipe to them by using the force as well. It's just an expensive intimidating weapon. 

 

Word. It's just a sword made of directed light, not a holy weapon. It bugged me in the prequels when kid Anakin said something about only Jedi using "laser swords". There's no reason for that to be the case, it doesn't take Force sensitivity to use one, it's not encoded to your midichlorians (snerk). All you need is the training to avoid chopping any of your own bits off with it.

 

Of course, it's also been pointed out how impractical a weapon it is for all Jedi to use religiously (if you'll pardon the pun). Yoda needed a special little one, there were Jedi with flailing tentacles and no legs and ridiculously long necks, who would really struggle to coordinate themselves to fight with a lightsaber. Yoda shouldn't ever have needed to use one, because his whole point in Empire was that you don't need to be big or strong or physically capable to wield immense power in the Force. That this tiny, comical looking goblin is the most powerful being in the galaxy, that was the point of him. He was above the physical.

[Ronin Jackson]

Freema Agyeman says she wasn't in TFA: https://twitter.com/FreemaOfficial/status/678498921631584256

 

The camera certainly lingered on the character she is being confused with... when I saw the initial mentions that she has a cameo I remembered the scene and accepted it... but apparently it was just a random extra who happens to have a resemblance.

[absnow54]

According the the Korr Sella Wookieepedia page (wow, these people are prompt) the actress's name is Maisie Richardson-Sellers

[VCRTracking]

Word. It's just a sword made of directed light, not a holy weapon. It bugged me in the prequels when kid Anakin said something about only Jedi using "laser swords". There's no reason for that to be the case, it doesn't take Force sensitivity to use one, it's not encoded to your midichlorians (snerk). All you need is the training to avoid chopping any of your own bits off with it.

 

 

It's why most people IRL don't use metal swords now when they have guns. Not just the fact that they're unwieldy to carry in day to day life but as demonstrated by Indiana Jones a sword is no match for a gun.  The only person who can deflect a laser blast with a lightsaber is a Jedi or other Force-sensitive who uses both agility and precognition.

 

These two articles I think encapsulate the positives and negatives of the movie.

 

Devin Faraci of Birth.Movies.Death. thought is was just "okay". He loved the characters and thought it was fun but hated that it was basically a rehash of A New Hope's plot and called it fanservice.

Will STAR WARS Just Be Fanfic From Now On?

 

This essay from The Mary Sue details the ways The Force Awakens is different in a good way.

 

This Star Wars is Mine

 

I side with the Mary Sue but I agree with Faraci that from now on Star Wars has to move forward instead of copying the past.

Edited December 24, 2015 by VCRTracking

[Kromm]

Watching it again(in a packed theater at 2 in the afternoon full of what seems a lot of non-SW fans who were tearing up after Han's death), I noticed that Kylo pretty much had her on the ropes until he said "I will teach you how to use the Force" and she repeated "The Force?" and she suddenly had that of look of recall and then concentration. 

Well there's also

that missing line of dialogue according to the novelization (the "It's you!" after she calls Luke's lightsaber).  

 Really if you combine that and what you just mentioned, the hint gets much bigger.

[Kromm]

Interestingly enough, Daisy Ridley is not looking for another job at the moment. She will be attending University in England.

I'd say she's got guaranteed work for a few years, except that most folks off the back of a big movie like this--especially a franchise--will try and squeeze in some extra projects to exploit that in the middle bits between shooting the franchise films (Ep 8 is shooting right around now I think though--at least the early stuff, but she'd likely have a window next year after the principle photography has wrapped).  Even the most restrictive contract isn't gonna try and lock an exclusive on a working actor, so if she's not in anything else it's totally by choice.

 

She's a bit old for University unless she's going for an advanced degree though. Interesting. 

 

By the way I LOVE what I just found out about her. Her middle name (one of them at least) is "Jazz".  Daisy Jazz Isobel Ridley.  Fantastic!

Edited December 24, 2015 by Kromm

[nobodyyoucare]

 

Indiana Jones a sword is no match for a gun.

at a distance. Up close the guy with the knife or sword can win over the gun holder before they can pull out their gun and fire. Police and self defense experts constantly make reference to the 21 foot rule. Meaning someone 21 feet or less can move towards you with a knife and kill you in less then three seconds. Within six feet or less you don't have time to react. 

[Kromm]

How is Rey being an innately powerful Jedi any different from 8 year old Anakin? The complaint that she's suddenly super powerful bewilders me because that was the entire point.

Actually since she's a lot older, you could go two ways with this. That being older made her blooming in the Force easier... because you know... it developed in the background.

 

Or the total other way that it makes even LESS sense, if we interpret it as young' uns having more pure ability vs. older people losing a bit of power and gaining control and wisdom. 

 

"Magic" ability in various novels in the fantasy genre go both ways with magic power, and the Force is just magic with another name.

 

I guess my point is that Anakin and her are if not opposites (because she's not exactly old), they're not really the same either. But if we go with the "young are more purely powerful" POV it actually COULD fit into the alternate explanation we might get with her having been trained young and either forgetting or denying it. THEN she'd be like Anakin.

[nobodyyoucare]

 

The only person who can deflect a laser blast with a lightsaber is a Jedi or other Force-sensitive who uses both agility and precognition.

One of the comics that should still be canon since it deals with events leading up to episode 1 and 2 is that Jedi are no match for projectile weapons. When several hundred Jedi went up against a force of Mandalorian warriors after seeing that the Jedis were defectling their blaster fire, the Mandalorians changed to projectiles. While the Jedi won over half of the Jedi were dead. The Jedi outnumbered the Mandarlorians in the battle. Even numbers or half the number of Jedi or less the Mandalorians would have won. 

 

Also you have to remember that a lot of people just considered the Jedi frauds who used some tricks or tech to accomplish their supposed force miracles. Even Jedi were not immune to thinking that someone using a trick were a force user. In one of the comics Count Dooku  questioned if Fett was a force user after Fett caused his weapon to fly to his hand after Dooku took it and moved it across a table. Fett then showed it was a piece of tech he had used to pull off what appeared to be a force miracle. 

Edited December 24, 2015 by nobodyyoucare

[Kromm]

I will say even with all of all the bullshit/poseur stuff we saw from Ren, the one interesting/impressive thing we saw was him being able to stop a laser bolt. That goes a bit of the way along the lines of both challenging the rest of his clownish portrayal, as well as putting a bump into the whole "swords vs. guns" argument.  Assuming other Jedi can do that, and assuming stopping and holding single bolts isn't the beginning and end of it.

[Zuleikha]

The guy was not in control of his emotions, and wasn't in control of the Force.  It was when Rey calmed herself and let the Force in that she stomped Ren.  That's the key being calm and in control, Ren was just a whiny brat who let his emotions control his actions.

That was how I took it. Kylo Ren has no self-discipline and without self-discipline, his raw power is not useful. The time we saw him do his most impressive feat (the laser bolt), he was in a setting of complete control. I also think the theory that Rey was the sole survivor of the massacre of Luke's trainees is likely, in which case Rey would be remembering how to do things she's already trained in.

 

But I wouldn't mind if she's just really, really powerful. Male characters get to be the overpowered chosen one all the time without getting accused of being Gary Stus. 

 

I'm not familiar with the animated series and comic canon. Is it canon that Jedi can mind-wipe memories? My current guess is that Rey is Han/Leia's daughter, but Luke either wiped or altered their memories and Rey's as part of protecting her. It feels too dark to me for the tone of the trilogy to have Han/Leia's only child go so evil, but it doesn't make sense that neither of them would have questioned whether Rey was their believed-to-be-dead daughter if they had intact memories. They wouldn't have buried her body, and both of them know that believed-to-be-dead children aren't always actually dead.

 

I am also speculating that when we find out more about Kylo Ren's back story, we're going to learn that part of what led him to the Dark Side was that he was just average among the trainees at Luke's academy. He came across to me as having deep-seated feelings of inferiority, which is pretty believable characterization for someone who's the son of two legendary heroes and the nephew of one more. 

 

After all the mockery of his lightsaber in the trailer, I thought that lightsaber was exactly the lightsaber Kylo Ren would have. 

[anna0852]

My current guess is that Rey is Han/Leia's daughter, but Luke either wiped or altered their memories and Rey's as part of protecting her. It feels too dark to me for the tone of the trilogy to have Han/Leia's only child go so evil, but it doesn't make sense that neither of them would have questioned whether Rey was their believed-to-be-dead daughter if they had intact memories. They wouldn't have buried her body, and both of them know that believed-to-be-dead children aren't always actually dead.

 

I think someone messed with the memories but it wasn't Luke. Having been hidden and lied to himself, I can't see him doing that. I think there is some other party involved, one we haven't met yet.

 

Unless it was Han and Leia's idea to hide their daughter and have their memories messed with. If they were that desperate to keep her safe and all.

[Ruby25]

 

The voice that stood out for me the most was Alec Guinness saying "Rey", which they apparently pinched from him saying the word "afraid". His voice is so rich, and so synonymous with the idea of the Force, that it evokes a reaction that the others didn't.

This, plus the fact that they obviously specifically wanted Finn to have an American accent even though that actor is British too, but Ridley was allowed to keep her accent, still makes me think there's a chance she's going to turn out to be a Kenobi.

[SNeaker]

Accents in Star Wars has never made any sense. If the Jedi were all taken from their families at a very young age and raised on Coruscant...why do they all have different accents?

 

My guess for Finn is that they wanted at least one American-sounding lead good guy and had to differentiate between him and Rey. Rey's accent is not unlike her alien guardian, no? Though it's funny given the joke that Imperials always have clipped British accents.

[Ruby25]

Yeah, in the old ones all the good guys except Obi-Wan (because he was Alec Guinness) were American, and the Imperial dudes were Brits (because bad guys sound more evil with English accents). In this they cast two Brits for the leads, but only made one of them do an American accent, so I think there was probably a reason for that. And we know that her lineage is going to turn out to mean something, so I'm sticking to my theory that she's from the Kenobi line. And that's why she's even stronger with the Force right away than Luke was.

 

I know that doesn't make much sense for why she'd actually be that much stronger, but it's a very Star Wars fanboy kind of thing to just associate Obi-Wan with being that in sync with the Force, and since there was so much fanfic stuff like that all over this movie, I wouldn't be too surprised if that was their explanation for it.

[Kromm]

I've always tried to figure out if Space British was meant to convey upper classes (because even with Imperials note it was the Officers out of armor that we heard sound British and the Troopers themselves always had their voices too mechanized to tell for sure--so they could have all been "commoners" with Space Yankee accents instead.  But tons of stuff in the prequels, and even Leia in the original movies, messes with that.

Edited December 24, 2015 by Kromm

[MrsR]

 

Space British ™

Hee!

 

Really it's her accent that's the only thing keeping me from saying she's Han and Leia's daughter. Its so deliberate that she's the only main character other than Imperial pigs, who has a British accent. 

 

But I can see J.J. giving the junk dealer to Simon Pegg,  just to justify the obfuscation.

Edited December 24, 2015 by MrsR

[Kromm]

There's no thematic reason for Rey, the pivot of the new series, to be Kenobi's granddaughter but fans service? But most people that want this forget that she can be Kenobi's grand daughter and still be a Skywalker through one parent. Most of the people that have the Rey Kenobi theory are Reylo shippers who want to change the story to accommodate the ship.

Why is there no reason?  Star Wars--not initially but eventually--became a story about families and legacies. Even if you totally discount the prequels and just go by Empire and Jedi that's true. So why is the suggestion of another legacy thematically off? I'd say it would be dead on.

 

Is it fan service?  Not nearly as much as some stuff we actually saw, like constant cutaways to BB8 doing cute droid stuff, this movie's version of "I am your father" being in a similar setting to the original (with lots of reversals), or early use of Jedi mind tricks. But a Kenobi descendant would directly be a story point, not a flourish like these others.

[SNeaker]

I think one of the producers referred to the fact that the "main" story is the Skywalker story, whereas things like Rogue One and others are standalones in the same universe but in a spinoffy way. Now, there is a current generation Skywalker in Kylo, but if he's the last of his line while Rey is a Kenobi and NOT a Skywalker (though of course she could be both) then we have a problem as far as the Skywalker aspect of the story.

[Kromm]

I think one of the producers referred to the fact that the "main" story is the Skywalker story, whereas things like Rogue One and others are standalones in the same universe but in a spinoffy way. Now, there is a current generation Skywalker in Kylo, but if he's the last of his line while Rey is a Kenobi and NOT a Skywalker (though of course she could be both) then we have a problem as far as the Skywalker aspect of the story.

I was asking why the idea of a Kenobi kid would be off theme. I don't think it would be in the least, but

that said I don't think it's really the way they went. The novelization tosses major hints she's Ren's sister.

[VCRTracking]

I'm glad Rey had a British accent because imagining her with an American accent and it seemed a little too like a movie based on a YA(Young Adult) novel! Not because TFA seemed slight but because there's so many recent movies with a heroine, always American and white(although people still dispute about Katniss being the second part) played by the current hot starlet who's the hero of these big dystopian settings like Hunger Games, Divergent that's supposed to spawn a franchise. Just before the screening I saw yesterday there was a trailer for a new one starring Chloe Grace Moretz where aliens invade the entire planet and her character is the center of the movie.

Edited December 24, 2015 by VCRTracking

[SNeaker]

I was asking why the idea of a Kenobi kid would be off theme.

 

If she's a Kenobi and not a Skywalker then the...I don't know if I can really say protagonist because Anakin wasn't always the protagonist in the prequels, per se, but let's say then that the fulcrum of the new movies would not be a Skywalker. The prequels were about Anakin's fall to the Dark Side. The originals were about his son redeeming him -- not just by "bringing him back" at the end, but redeeming the family by being a hero who stays a hero. Leia, who is brave and good and true, also serves as that redemption. If Ben is the last Skywalker, then that's the end of their story for all time because I don't think he can make it out of these movies alive. So unless he randomly impregnated someone, that switches the focus to a different family legacy.

[Kromm]

If she's a Kenobi and not a Skywalker then the...I don't know if I can really say protagonist because Anakin wasn't always the protagonist in the prequels, per se, but let's say then that the fulcrum of the new movies would not be a Skywalker. The prequels were about Anakin's fall to the Dark Side. The originals were about his son redeeming him -- not just by "bringing him back" at the end, but redeeming the family by being a hero who stays a hero. Leia, who is brave and good and true, also serves as that redemption. If Ben is the last Skywalker, then that's the end of their story for all time because I don't think he can make it out of these movies alive. So unless he randomly impregnated someone, that switches the focus to a different family legacy.

Well there's also an implied repetition of the Vader redemption theme with Ren. Admittedly we have the big failure where he murders his own father, but Vader murdered tons of folks too.

 

All I can say is this story puts a ton of pressure on Snoke's eventual reveal, and I'm already skeptical. One of my biggest negatives was how hokey Snoke seemed.

[Ruby25]

I think switching to another family legacy wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. There are other people besides Skywalkers in this galaxy. Plus, I think making it so that she's actually not what everyone assumes she is would be a nice twist.

[SNeaker]

I think switching to another family legacy wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. There are other people besides Skywalkers in this galaxy. Plus, I think making it so that she's actually not what everyone assumes she is would be a nice twist.

 

That's fine. It's a legit position to take. I just meant to explain why her being a Kenobi (or a random) without also being a Skywalker would require a switch.

 

I don't personally want that switch, not so much because I care specifically about Skywalkers, but because I don't want that to be where their story ends. It's too sad. It's also less compelling for me if Rey is not part of the family because her needing to stop Kylo Ren would have less resonance, and she certainly wouldn't be interested in redeeming him. But I freely admit that's an emotional response.

[Ruby25]

Well, I dont know- I think it would still have some thematic resonance to see a Kenobi having to take down a Skywalker and maybe do it right this time (tying into how Obi-Wan was unable to stop Anakin).

[Ruby25]

I have no interest in seeing her get together with Kylo Ren- I genuinely think it would just be a better twist if she's NOT a Skywalker herself too.

[jennifer6973]

That's why they're making movies called Star Wars 'stories' like Rogue One and the Han back story movies. They're deliberately distinguishing these movies from the Star Wars 'episodes' which everyone from JJ to Kathleen to George have pointed out are Keeping Up With the Skywalkers.

 

 

 

I'd rather keep up with the Skywalkers then the Kardashians, just saying.

[Kromm]

Every plot point about this movie was a repeat of the OT. I don't think repetition is what they're worried about.

I wasn't saying that at all. I wasn't calling out the repetition for criticism, I was pointing out that we have a situation where they might be repeating and people weren't considering it (because it was in part a reversal). Someone pointed out that Rey should be a Skywalker because if she wasn't then Ren was the end of the Skywalker legacy--a kick in the shin of it because it would invalidate Luke and his redemption of Vader. I was pointing out that while this movie suggests Ren is beyond help--you know with the murdering of his own Daddy and such--that people weren't really thinking about the horrible things Vader must have done in his day. Ergo, even Ren isn't unredeemable according to Star Wars lore. The sticking point would be if it has to be a member of his own family to bring him back or not. I don't think it HAS to (although

based on the novelization I suspect the Star Wars writing crew likely does and it's what we will get

)

[Kromm]

And like I said, most of the reasons wanting her to be Kenobi are just trying to justify a creepy ship - the possible incest in Reylo is the least horrifying thing about it - so I'm side eyeing that theory a lot.

That is a totally unfair thing to say. It generalizes every possible reaction across the Internet based on you perhaps observing a few people and concluding it's the only possible reason.

 

I personally would have liked it if she was a Kenobi but I don't think anyone in these films needs to get with Ren. He's errr... icky. If they intend to redeem him the problem I'm having is even though I think that's likely where they're going, I don't think we got the emotional weight of him being worth saving. I don't even GET the shippers, because why would you WANT to ship such a clear hero (Rey) with an icky guy (even if his last name is Solo?)  If Ren is redeemed it has to be another way than some dumb "through the love of a good woman" bullshit. And Rey Kenobi if that's really her name (doubtful, since

I read that "Rey" isn't even probably her real first name

) wouldn't need to be a prop just to accomplish that.  Talk about an anti-feminist message if they DID do that kind of shit! Probably not on Kathleen Kennedy's watch though. 

[johntfs]

After all the mockery of his lightsaber in the trailer, I thought that lightsaber was exactly the lightsaber Kylo Ren would have. 

 

 

I liked Ren's lightsaber.  After the somewhat ridiculous designs from the prequel movies (you have a two-bladed saber, well mine has eight blades), Ren's improvement to his saber is simple and practical.  He puts a crossguard on it keep people from beating him by sliding their blade down his and maiming his hand.

Edited December 25, 2015 by johntfs

[SNeaker]

 

Someone pointed out that Rey should be a Skywalker because if she wasn't then Ren was the end of the Skywalker legacy--a kick in the shin of it because it would invalidate Luke and his redemption of Vader. I was pointing out that while this movie suggests Ren is beyond help--you know with the murdering of his own Daddy and such--that people weren't really thinking about the horrible things Vader must have done in his day. Ergo, even Ren isn't unredeemable according to Star Wars lore.

 

For me it's not about whether Ren himself could be redeemed the way Vader was. Maybe he will be. But Vader had to die, and I think, so does Ren. Either way. Unless they somehow go back and say that this whole time he was really completely brainwashed and forced into turning dark by Snoke, Ben can't come back and live a nice life and get married and have kids. That just ain't happening. Which means that whether he is redeemed or not, he's the last Skywalker. I don't consider the redemption of the Skywalker legacy to be Vader's moment of being brought back to the light. Not after all of the terrible things he did. The redemption is through the children who avoid the mistakes of the father and usher in a better future for themselves and for the galaxy with their contributions towards peace and freedom.

Edited December 25, 2015 by SNeaker

[Ruby25]

I'm not a fan of twists simply for the sake of being twists. There's too much of that happening these days. That is about the only merit in Rey suddenly becoming a Kenobi and pretty much character assassinating Obi-Wan posthumously. If there is such a kick back against her being a Skywalker - another thing that makes little sense considering that these as Star Wars movies after all and the family dynamics are the basis of them - then she might as well just be random Jedi. 

How would his character be assassinated?

[Morrigan2575]

I wasn't saying that at all. I wasn't calling out the repetition for criticism, I was pointing out that we have a situation where they might be repeating and people weren't considering it (because it was in part a reversal). Someone pointed out that Rey should be a Skywalker because if she wasn't then Ren was the end of the Skywalker legacy--a kick in the shin of it because it would invalidate Luke and his redemption of Vader. I was pointing out that while this movie suggests Ren is beyond help--you know with the murdering of his own Daddy and such--that people weren't really thinking about the horrible things Vader must have done in his day. Ergo, even Ren isn't unredeemable according to Star Wars lore. The sticking point would be if it has to be a member of his own family to bring him back or not. I don't think it HAS to (although

based on the novelization I suspect the Star Wars writing crew likely does and it's what we will get

)

Unredeemable to the story/characters and Unredeemable in the eyes of the fans are two very different things. It may be hypocritical but I probably would have been OK with a Kylo Redemption IF he hadn't killed Han. I could forgive killing/torturing nameless red shirts (even if it's morally reprehensible) but killing a character in loved...I don't think I'll be happy with Kylo getting redeemed.

Of course that's today, tomorrow I might want Kylo redeemed for Leia's sake.

[calliope1975]

I suspect Kylo will get a Vader redemption, in that 10 minutes before he dies, he does something helpful and voila! Redeemed. I don't see how he could ever realistically come back after killing Han Freakin' Solo. I do hope Leia gets to bitchslap her son a few times before he dies, though.

[JessePinkman]

I honestly think Kylo is going to get a full on redemption that doesn't include death. I don't know how the fans will feel about that but I just have this feeling that his story does not end with him dying.

 

If anyone cares, here are some impressions from an 8 year old (the series target audience, right George?):

 

Saw it again today with my niece, surprisingly she knew about Luke and Darth Vader without me telling her (the strength of cultural osmosis). She enjoyed it but she became very restless during the Rebellion/First Order battles, she turned to me and said "This is an action movie.", which is not exactly her thing.

 

BUT every funny bit hit it out of the park, the first part of the movie was dragging for her however she absolutely lit up when Rey started chasing Finn down, in fact she loved everything with Rey/Finn/BB-8 (so did I! I could watch an entire movie of just them). She recognized Han when he showed up and said about Chewie "That is one smart gorilla." She didn't like Han getting killed, said it was too violent.

 

And she was predicting things throughout the movie that I didn't see the first time I watched it, like when Kylo Ren was trying to get the lightsaber out of the snow she knew that Rey would get it instead. She also told me, without prompting, that Rey is definitely Luke's daughter. And she said the next movie is gonna be all about Luke Skywalker. That's my girl.

[Jediknight]

The only thing is that the Dark Side feeds off being an emotional wreck. So the fact that he wasn't calm or in control should have given him an additional edge in the fight.

The Sith feed off of anger, but they're calm and in control of their emotions.  Look at Empire, Darth was calm and in control when he stomped Luke.  He fed off of his emotions, but his emotions didn't control him, he controlled them.  In Return, The Emperor was irate, but he was in control of his anger and he was calm.  Kylo wasn't controlling his emotions, they were controlling him, so he wasn't feeding off of them.  He had no control over anything.

[VCRTracking]

And I actually think Rey was beginning to begin to be seduced by the Dark Side. Her anger and hate as much as the Force was powering her. She was going to kill Ren and only the planet breaking apart saved him. Here's where both being the grandchildren of Vader really would be great because Ren being Leia's son was being pulled "by the light" which he saw as weakness but Rey being Luke's daughter is more prone to fall to the dark.

 

I think switching to another family legacy wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. There are other people besides Skywalkers in this galaxy. Plus, I think making it so that she's actually not what everyone assumes she is would be a nice twist.

 

I just think it's hilarious in a great way that all the turmoil is centered on one family, as many on Twitter have noted! This is an example:

 

Jeremy McGovern ‏@JeremyMcGovern Dec 23

So I just saw #StarWarsTheForceAwakens, I feel like that entire galaxy's problems would be solved if they just got rid of that one family.

 

Edited December 25, 2015 by VCRTracking

[Phebemarie]

I have a potential redemption arc that could redeem Kylo some of his bad-guyness.  What if Ben is the person who dropped Rey on the isolated planet?  Here's the potential plot:  As a teenager at Luke's academy, Ben had visions of a massacre and took Rey away for her own safety.  On Jakku, he mind-wiped her after promising someone would be back to save her when the evil was eradicated.  Meanwhile Snoke, somehow a friend of the Solo/Skywalker family, followed the fleeing youngsters, grabbed Kylo, and brought him around to the dark side leaving Rey to wait on Jakku forever.  

[TVSpectator]

I have a potential redemption arc that could redeem Kylo some of his bad-guyness.  What if Ben is the person who dropped Rey on the isolated planet?  Here's the potential plot:  As a teenager at Luke's academy, Ben had visions of a massacre and took Rey away for her own safety.  On Jakku, he mind-wiped her after promising someone would be back to save her when the evil was eradicated.  Meanwhile Snoke, somehow a friend of the Solo/Skywalker family, followed the fleeing youngsters, grabbed Kylo, and brought him around to the dark side leaving Rey to wait on Jakku forever.  

 

Did you mean  Ben/Kylo and not Ben/Obi-Wan?

[Phebemarie]

Too many Bens!  Yes, I meant Kylo/Ben.  The time-line wouldn't work with Obi-wan.

[TVSpectator]

Too many Bens!  Yes, I meant Kylo/Ben.  The time-line wouldn't work with Obi-wan.

 

Yeah, I know the feeling. Too many Bens indeed!

[Raja]

"We're just going to patrol over... there."

 

It reminded me of the Sheriff in Silverado who's jurisdiction ended right here today.

[Izeinwinter]

Snoke's projection is so bloody over the top that I think there is a fairly good chance that it's a smokescreen, but I'm having trouble thinking of any existing characters who would be leading from a false identity like that. But it would be a hilarious reveal if we finally met Snoke and it's Natalie Dormer. "No, I am your mother". >,)

 

I love Rey very, very much. Astounding performance, lovable as all hell character. If she's a Luke expy, she's Luke 2.0 - New and Improved. 

 

RE: The entire heredity discussion: Don't discount the possibility that force sensitivity is hereditary and the old republic was quite deliberately trying to eradicate it. The dark side of the force twists people into super powered mustache twirling villains of a regular basis. The Jedi order might have done a lot of good, but it also regularily had people go insane from using the force and embark on rampages. It would make perfect sense if the senate was quietly trying to make it all just stop being a problem. No force users, less wars started for the Evuls. 

Edited December 25, 2015 by Izeinwinter

[Skyline]

Finn/Poe has really taken off. It's the most popular ship.

www.usatoday.com/story/life/entertainthis/2015/12/24/star-wars-the-force-awakens-bromance/77894794/

[VCRTracking]

It's more that most fangirls tends to ship characters with ones of the same gender rather than the official hetero pairing especially when they have an extremely close friendship like Charles and Erik in the X-Men or Steve and Bucky in Captain America. They could even be related like the brothers on Supernatural and they'd still be shipped together! Rey never even meets Poe onscreen and Poe telling Finn he looks good in his jacket really sealed the deal. And as for Rey and Kylo Ren, the forbidden possibility of incest and his being evil but vulnerable just makes it even bigger selling point for some fans(Hermione and Draco Malfoy).

 

Maz Kanata From Star Wars: The Force Awakens Was Based On J.J. Abrams' High school Teacher

Edited December 26, 2015 by VCRTracking

[Ronin Jackson]

I would think even a hint of incest potential would sink any Rey-Kylo "ships" but that wouldn't be the only thing about modern fan culture I don't get. I'm probably not familiar with some of the stranger ones (Hermione-Draco is news to me) but Rey-Kylo has got to be one of the more nonsensical ones out there. Of all the potential "ships" that were hinted at in the actual film, the only one that would have legs is Finn-Rey, but I suspect the mildly flirty banter and chemistry (the hand holding during the escape, Finn asking about a boyfriend... that's all I can recall from one viewing) mimicked Luke and Leia in Episode IV more than anything else (though we can probably rule out FInn and Rey being siblings).

[VCRTracking]

There are jokes online about "We Need To Talk About Kylo" a reference to We Need To Talk About Kevin, the movie with Tilda Swinton as the mother of a disturbed teenager played by Ezra Miller who goes on a rampage at school. Entertainment Weekly made it the headline of their article about Han's death scene:

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/12/21/jj-abrams-kylo-ren-shocking-act-star-wars-force-awakens

Edited December 26, 2015 by VCRTracking

[Danny Franks]

The parallels with modern day shooters is unnervingly spot on.

 

It's a perfect comparison, and it highlights one of the reasons I liked this movie so much. It felt authentic to the original Star Wars ethos, but it has a modern sensibility when it comes to the characters. Rey, Finn and Kylo Ren all felt more up-to-date and emotionally complex than the characters of A New Hope, and definitely more than the characters of the prequels.

 

Kylo Ren really is the angry, disaffected, emotionally unstable youth, who dreams of being important. He's living his twisted fantasy with the New Order, just like school shooters do when they snap and go on a rampage. He's just being told by his compatriots that it's the right thing for him to be doing, which makes it even worse.

 

And this is why I think there is no redemption for him. I think Abrams and (yes, gasp when you say it) Disney are looking at a more adult take on the villainy of the franchise. Abrams said in an interview that Kylo Ren killing Han was supposed to show that there was no good left in him, and it worked like a charm for me. The fact that people are still pulling for him to be redeemed just seems to say more about certain sections of a fandom needing to woobify 'dreamy' bad guys (Spike, Loki, Sylar etc) that it being a realistic possibility. And I very much doubt the prospect of Rey and Kylo Ren being siblings would put all of those people off the 'ship.

 

Sure, you can say, 'but Anakin killed all those kids and got redeemed at the end', but it's not the same. That story was told back to front, and we saw Anakin's redemption before we even saw his original fall to evil. And his fall even had arguably noble goals, because he thought he would be saving Padme (that fact that the story was executed in such amateurish fashion makes it difficult to remember the details, I find). This time we, as well as Rey and Finn, saw Kylo Ren murder his father coldly, deliberately and in a moment where his father was showing total vulnerability. And as far as we know, he did it for no other reason than he wants to be the coolest kid in the First Order club. He ain't getting a let off for that.