Unpopular Opinions: "I hate BLTs from Kelly's!"

[LeftPhalange]

Alright everybody, stand back, because I am about to unleash the Unpopular Opinion that will top all other Umpopular Opinions, to wit:

 

If fucking Sonny and fucking Carly are going to be the ones to have baby AJ, I want said baby shot dead in the next (interminable) mob war.  The only reason I was able to put up with Yet.  Another.  Baby. on the canvas was because of the fascinating possibility that Michael having custody of her and never talking to Sonny and/or Carly again would lead to Sonny finally suffering some fucking consequences for his actions for once on this fakakta show.  Now that has been destroyed, I see no reason for little A.J. to stick around.  She can go to Heaven and be the cutest baby angel there.

 

Oh, and the same goes for obnoxious TJ.  If he's going to be just another Sonny ass-kisser, than kill him off.

 

I've wanted Avery dead since the moment Ava found out she was knocked up.

[testardo]

As long as the show is airing, there is hope for improvement IMHO.

How many years has this show aired? I don't see any improvement.

[Harmony233]

How many years has this show aired? I don't see any improvement.

I've given up.I'm tired of hoping for the show to get better when its obvious it never will.

[General Days]

Alright everybody, stand back, because I am about to unleash the Unpopular Opinion that will top all other Unpopular Opinions, to wit:

 

If fucking Sonny and fucking Carly are going to be the ones to have baby AJ, I want said baby shot dead in the next (interminable) mob war.  The only reason I was able to put up with Yet.  Another.  Baby. on the canvas was because of the fascinating possibility that Michael having custody of her and never talking to Sonny and/or Carly again would lead to Sonny finally suffering some fucking consequences for his actions for once on this fakakta show.  Now that has been destroyed, I see no reason for little A.J. to stick around.  She can go to Heaven and be the cutest baby angel there.

 

Oh, and the same goes for obnoxious TJ.  If he's going to be just another Sonny ass-kisser, than kill him off.

 

 

Yes on AJ, no on TJ. Sonny doesn't need any more children

 

I feel you, but mostly I feel against you. That is, yes on killing TJ. No on killing Baby AJ. I want TJ to die and Michael to rescind his goodwill and take back that baby. (He can hang Sonny on a meathook if required, but I'm not committed.)

[Chairperson Meow]

I'm very committed to Sonny being hung on a literal meat hook. Michael, Morgan, Dillion, anyone tall enough to reach. And I really don't care about baby Avery Bavery.

I'm kinda annoyed that I sat through all this shit to get jerked back to The Sonny Show.

It's like when you have a shitty boyfriend and he's all "Ima change", and you're like ehh and he never changes, so you feel so dumb for wasting your time.

GH, you suck and I want my sweater back.

[KerleyQ]

I feel you, but mostly I feel against you. That is, yes on killing TJ. No on killing Baby AJ. I want TJ to die and Michael to rescind his goodwill and take back that baby. (He can hang Sonny on a meathook if required, but I'm not committed.)

 

I'm committed.  Meathook!  Meathook!  Meathook! 

[General Days]

Okay, AJ comes back as a corporeal ghost and hangs Sonny on a meathook, then hands baby AJ to Michael.

Now for an actually possible unpopular opinion...

 

I could not care less about what Liz is doing to Sam. This isn't because I don't like Sam or didn't like Sam/Jason, but because I think Sam is better off with Patrick. He's a brain surgeon. He's not a hit man. Liz and Sam might not think Liz is doing Sam a favor, but she is. I really think Liz and Nik belong together. I was on a break during their sordid affair, and only watched the aftermath online. 

I hate how Liz and Nik have been written over the past year or two. Every time one of them is madly in love with the other, the other wants someone else, then they switch on a dime. It's such a waste of two good actors, who play characters with such a vast and involved history. Maybe once they're actually pariahs, someone will write them a redemptive love story more worthy of Liz/Rebecca and Nik/Tyler.

 

[SlovakPrincess]

I don't really care about Avery. In the insane fan fic that plays in my head, Duke somehow ended up raising the baby and she became Avery Lavery.

And Duke came to his senses about the mob and left it for the baby, all "Anna, we can finally raise a child together! It'll be great! Let's make up!" And she was all "that's completely insane, and it would've been nice if you left the mob for ME, you idiot .. But sure, why not. Right after I go find my other kid."

I mean, if the show refuses to make sense, why can't it do so in a fun, happy way?

[dubbel zout]

I will accept just about any explanation—even no explanation!—if we get sweeping changes.

[Oracle42]

Yup. Helena! Reasons! Coma Dream! Mass Hallucination! 

[dubbel zout]

BLT overdose! Staring too long at the sun! Vitamin B6 deficiency!

[Dandesun]

DARK MAGIC!!

[Francie]

From TFGH thread:

 

 

 

But the speech talked about that too, if memory serves.  That we invite these characters into our homes and families week after week and care about what happens to them and how watching is often a tradition passed down.

 

As to that part of the speech, it was fine. Well-written even.  Ron got why people first sat their butt down and watched the show.  But then the speech goes into nothing but tropes and generalities.

 

"Would the hero or heroine find their way back to true love?"

 

"Would the villains get their comeuppance?"

 

"Would families survive their turmoils."

 

It's all so superficial and something that any person could dust off in 20 minutes if they were in a class and assigned the topic:  "Write a final speech by a grand dame of a soap family that explains why soaps are so great."

 

Maybe I'm just being too egotistical.  But that's exactly the kind of assignment we'd get in my college writing class (not about soaps ever, but describing a pinnacle moment; a great game, etc), and about half of the submissions would look like that. Nothing but pablum.  There's no substance to that whatsoever.  It's attributable to any dramatic type of drama and not a serial drama.  Romance is described only as a hero and heroine finding their way to true love? Jesus, that's something a 14-year-old would write in a poem where they rhyme life, strife, wife, and knife.  

 

The romance about soaps is about whether unrequited love will ever be returned?  Will sacrifice be met with reward?  These are pretty superficial too, but I'm not going to take the time to flesh it out here and now. But if you can't capture that gut punch moment where your favorite character sees the person they love with someone else or the high captured when you (finally!) got that pay off moment, don't write that speech.

 

But just like Ron wham, bams, and thank you ma'ams couples into coupledom, I don't think he ever got the concept of crafting and writing a romance. And that toss off line, to me, shows exactly that. I think that's part of my animosity toward it.  You don't see the love for the guts of the genre in that speech. You see a reverence toward how people started watching, but then ... it was generic line after generic line that actually was contrary to the content of much of his writing.

 

 The same, to me, holds true about Tracy's speech when Edward was in the hospital after giving his antidote to Emma. It was such a:

 

We laugh; we cried

We farted; we died

 

kind of speech.  Superficial as McCartney's "Hello, Goodbye lyrics" that he created with a producer's son just rattling off the first word that came to mind (and look, I love Hello, Goodbye as a song, but I won't trumpet those lyrics).  That 14-year-old kid above could have written those "we had good times, we had bad times, and now I rest in the comfort of knowing I'll see my dead wife" lines as well.

 

The speech is fine. It's serviceable. But it's bland. Nothing special.  And something I saw earn about 9 students in advanced creative writing a B+ and a nudge over to communications, public relations, or the business school. And that's my egotistical, condescending, and I'm quite sure unearned, take on it. But it's my take nonetheless.

Edited September 1, 2015 by Francie

[Francie]

DARK MAGIC!!

Synergy with ABC's Once Upon a Time!!

[OnceSane]

Back on topic, please.

[HeatLifer]

I don't know where we stand with this now, but I still cannot stand Sabrina. Why are we only free from her for X time when the actress gets pregnant? It's insanity.

[JaneDigby]

I don't find Sam rootable 98% of the time. I like KeMo. I don't mind Sam, I just don't care about her.

 

The Alexis + Julian Forevah love story is pretty blah for me. It might be that it feels a little, tiny bit like Sonny/Alexis which I hated because it turned Alexis completely into a moron. Alexis needs to tone down the judgement 99% too.

 

I only liked Morgan when Ava was screwing his brains out.

 

I'll accept nearly any excuse to keep Maura West around. Bonus points if Ava gets custody of Avery.

 

I'd like to see Anna and Julian hook up. Just because.

[tvgoddess]

I don't find Sam rootable 98% of the time. I like KeMo. I don't mind Sam, I just don't care about her.

 

The Alexis + Julian Forevah love story is pretty blah for me. It might be that it feels a little, tiny bit like Sonny/Alexis which I hated because it turned Alexis completely into a moron. Alexis needs to tone down the judgement 99% too.

 

I only liked Morgan when Ava was screwing his brains out.

 

I'll accept nearly any excuse to keep Maura West around. Bonus points if Ava gets custody of Avery.

 

I'd like to see Anna and Julian hook up. Just because.

 

Have we met? Will you marry me? 

 

Seriously, I agree with just about everything on here except I probably think Sam is much more rootable than 2%. She can be a little frustrating at times though.

 

But the rest is straight out of my head.

[dubbel zout]

There are very few rootable characters on the show right now, which is one of the reasons it's doing so poorly, IMO.

Edited September 15, 2015 by dubbel zout

[Oracle42]

I think RC really liked gray characters and those were the ones he was most interested in - it's just that he was terrible at writing them because he doesn't understand / believe that there are lines characters can't cross while remaining viable and rootable

Edited September 15, 2015 by Oracle42

[dubbel zout]

I think viability is the biggest problem with people like Nina and Franco. They've both done such terrible things—and not paid for them—that it's hard to root for them. It is possible to root for good and bad characters. But Ron decides we're going to like a character no matter what. You can't force viewers to like characters just because you want them to. Why is that so hard to understand?

[JaneDigby]

I think viability is the biggest problem with people like Nina and Franco. They've both done such terrible things—and not paid for them—that it's hard to root for them. It is possible to root for good and bad characters. But Ron decides we're going to like a character no matter what. You can't force viewers to like characters just because you want them to. Why is that so hard to understand?

 

Can this go 1000x for Sonny and Jason? Pretty please?

[IWantCandy71]

I do think rootability is important, but I think what's more important than that, is that the characters be interesting. For instance, I don't root for Cesar to win against one of the show's "heroes", but I do like watching him plot and scheme. Anders entertains me.

And I think that's a lot of what's wrong with the show. So many of the people are "beige".  A lot of them are interchangeable-which makes the huge cast even more ridiculous.

 

As for my unpopular opinion, I really detest Kristina Corinthos. And I don't think Lexi is a good actress.

[LeftPhalange]

I do think rootability is important, but I think what's more important than that, is that the characters be interesting. For instance, I don't root for Cesar to win against one of the show's "heroes", but I do like watching him plot and scheme. Anders entertains me.

And I think that's a lot of what's wrong with the show. So many of the people are "beige".  A lot of them are interchangeable-which makes the huge cast even more ridiculous.

 

Yes! My problem with someone like Sonny isn't that he's a mobster, it's that he's boring and predictable. This applies to most of the characters on this show, though. Even the people I like are just...blah. Everything is predictable and when something surprising/*shocking* happens it's usually because it's ridiculous and out of character. 

[dubbel zout]

when something surprising/*shocking* happens it's usually because it's ridiculous and out of character.

 

Which is its own problem. 

[Tiger]

I do think rootability is important, but I think what's more important than that, is that the characters be interesting. For instance, I don't root for Cesar to win against one of the show's "heroes", but I do like watching him plot and scheme. Anders entertains me.

THIS!!! I love me some Cesar Faison, and think Anders Hove is an amazing actor. But at the end of the day/story/whatever, I want Faison to lose and the heroes to win.

I actually thought the Faison/Robin story was excellent up through Dec 2013. But that should have been the end of it. Robert & Anna should have killed Faison for what he did to Robin. And if Robin couldn't be on screen, then she should have been living in Beecher's Corner and see I g her family off-screen, or even heading up some WSB science division and doing the same. Patrick & Robin could have still divorced, and Saint Douchebag could still be alive, but Robin in captivity needed to end when she was finally rescued in Nov/Dec 2013.

[Oracle42]

I want a reset more than I want to see Liz and Nik get their comeuppance.

The show is garbage right now. Most days it's unwatchable and the characters are all Darkest Timeline versions of themselves. Because Nik is the Prince of Douchey Tides but he's not this kind of douche. He definitely would've fucked Hayden while believing she was married and he might even have lied about Jason's identity to keep Jasus and the violence that comes in his wake away from his family but he's not going to have a woman SHOT IN THE HEAD over a bad business deal.

I don't even know what to say about Liz. She's never been this degraded and pathetic and I don't care anymore about seeing her get yelled at because seriously - I saw Lucky read Liz/Nik for filth and it was pretty epic. Somehow I don't see an episode written by Scott Sickles for Jakeson and Sam to do the same thing being worth this interminable story line.

Edited September 19, 2015 by Oracle42

[HeatLifer]

I hate what's being done to Liz because there's no point to it. All so she can look like a crazy person while Patrick/Jason fight over Sam? When will Liz get her own story with her own love interest? Seriously, when was the last time we saw Liz in a loving romantic relationship with no craziness and lies? It's insane to think about.

[Oracle42]

With Ewen - before RC turned him into an evuuuuul goat herder so he could fling Liz at Jason again

[HeatLifer]

Oh, of course! That's exactly what I'm talking about. I get that it's a soap. But characters still get to have LOVE. And, Liz, for some reason, is treated like this punching bag who can never get it right, or screws it up, or falls for a psycho. It's happened enough. She (and her fans) deserves to get a normal story at this point.

[WendyCR72]

The only trouble with Liz in a romance is, the hacks have written her as "the grass is always greener chick" for so long that, aside from those that already like Liz, I'm not sure viewers would invest in it since Liz always seems to be looking to upgrade every time she already has a guy.

[Chairperson Meow]

I don't believe that Jason is all that in the sack, as a hired killer, as a son, as a friend, as a love interest, as a robot, a sweater model, a person, a brother, or a surrogate father/uncl. I don't buy that he's better than Lucky (who is a pretty stand up guy with a messed up dad and great mom), AJ (alcoholic who tried to recover), or hell even Ric mostly (minus that Magda stuff and um the Sonny crap and stuff) or Nik (banged a ghost, stole a company). I can't believe a pretty, smart woman is risking everything for some thug who doesn't want her. It's so stupid. Liz can do better than the parade of losers she's been given. Just because she has kids doesn't mean some nice, non criminal wouldn't date her.

[HeatLifer]

The only trouble with Liz in a romance is, the hacks have written her as "the grass is always greener chick" for so long that, aside from those that already like Liz, I'm not sure viewers would invest in it since Liz always seems to be looking to upgrade every time she already has a guy.

They can easily change that. Patrick has had two marriage proposals inside Robin's home in the span of 2 years and he's seen as perfectly normal.

[WendyCR72]

They can easily change that. Patrick has had two marriage proposals inside Robin's home in the span of 2 years and he's seen as perfectly normal.

 

Of course, but within that (fucked up and dumbass) concept, at least Patrick keeps his focus on the female du jour. Well, since Looney Lisa. But Liz has never seemed content in a good decade. She had a guy that loved her - Lucky - but wasn't satisfied and shit on him.

 

So I think a lot more rehab needs to go into Liz than even Patrick, if the perception of Liz is to change.

[HeatLifer]

Of course, but within that (fucked up and dumbass) concept, at least Patrick keeps his focus on the female du jour. Well, since Looney Lisa. But Liz has never seemed content in a good decade. She had a guy that loved her - Lucky - but wasn't satisfied and shit on him.

So I think a lot more rehab needs to go into Liz than even Patrick, if the perception of Liz is to change.

Eh. Lucky went cray for a few years there.

[Chairperson Meow]

Eh. Lucky went cray for a few years there.

But.....

His job was never to kill people. Also, Lucky wouldn't have bought any of that bs about Robin "going to Paris". Lucky would've rescued Robin, stared at pills, cried, had sex with Sam, saved some kids, saved Jason, found AJ, told Sonny he sucks, then high fived Dante with time to give Det Tree a swirly.

[HeatLifer]

But.....

His job was never to kill people. Also, Lucky wouldn't have bought any of that bs about Robin "going to Paris". Lucky would've rescued Robin, stared at pills, cried, had sex with Sam, saved some kids, saved Jason, found AJ, told Sonny he sucks, then high fived Dante with time to give Det Tree a swirly.

Haha. True. Lucky was not a hitman. But he still had a part in the destruction of his relationship with Liz. Obvs Liz finally crapped on them with the Nik affair.

[Tiger]

But.....

His job was never to kill people.

'Nuff said!

[Chairperson Meow]

Lucky also respected his mom.

[Ambrosefolly]

But.....

His job was never to kill people. 

I believe the only reason they turned Lucky into a drug addict and then a cheater was to make Jason look better in comparison. It had nothing to do with taking Lucky's character to an interesting place, if it did his family wouldn't have been so dismissive of him. They acted like Lucky had been a druggie for years when it actually hadn't been for that long. Even with all that, he was still the better choice because his job wasn't to kill people on the orders of a vindictive asshat. Oh, and he (at least eventually) didn't go around defending his drug uses and cheating on his wife as an alternative lifestyle choice. 

[dubbel zout]

Liz's relationships haven't been a writing priority since she and Lucky permanently split. She hasn't been a main player in her own stories for a long time, and she still isn't. 

[Ambrosefolly]

Liz's relationships haven't been a writing priority since she and Lucky permanently split. She hasn't been a main player in her own stories for a long time, and she still isn't. 

It has never been a priority.

[nilyank]

 

 

Liz's relationships haven't been a writing priority since she and Lucky permanently split. She hasn't been a main player in her own stories for a long time, and she still isn't.

 

It has never been a priority.

 

Even her rape story was about Lucky and his parents and the original rape storyline.

[Chairperson Meow]

I believe the only reason they turned Lucky into a drug addict and then a cheater was to make Jason look better in comparison. It had nothing to do with taking Lucky's character to an interesting place, if it did his family wouldn't have been so dismissive of him. They acted like Lucky had been a druggie for years when it actually hadn't been for that long. Even with all that, he was still the better choice because his job wasn't to kill people on the orders of a vindictive asshat. Oh, and he (at least eventually) didn't go around defending his drug uses and cheating on his wife as an alternative lifestyle choice.

Lucky and AJ get addicted to drugs and alcohol. They realize that this is no way to be a functional adult, especially if one wants to say, run a corporation or be a cop or parent a kid. So, they go and seek treatment. Continuously. Not when it's convenient like some characters. It's in their DNA, their fabric, but they try. They fucking try. And Show mocks them for it. Over and over again. Sonny "loves" his kids, sister wives, and hangers on.... yet he can't remember to care for himself. But he's the strong Teflon Don. Nina (let's forget about the repetitive bs MSt does for a min) gets attacked by her mom, cheated on and abandoned by her husband, also replaced.... yet she will always be That Crazy Lady in The Coma. But we've seen her check herself into Shadybrook to calm herself, go to her brother for help, etc. She hasn't picked up a gun. Yet, characters like Jason and Sonny are these fucking paragons of virtue who can't think straight or keep their tempers in check. They're allegedly "better " than every character and damn every character who disagrees because you get guilted or killed or driven away.

[OnceSane]

Topic, y'all.

[Chairperson Meow]

UO:

I actually like MSt when she doesn't always repeat stuff. If I pretend Roger Howarth isn't Franco, serial killer, then the whole thing works and I like it. I especially liked MSt and MW's confrontation scenes. It's kinda nice seeing MSt play a character that isn't the Red Menace. But I miss McBain, so I'm very unpopular with my opinions.

[IWantCandy71]

THIS!!! I love me some Cesar Faison, and think Anders Hove is an amazing actor. But at the end of the day/story/whatever, I want Faison to lose and the heroes to win.

I actually thought the Faison/Robin story was excellent up through Dec 2013. But that should have been the end of it. Robert & Anna should have killed Faison for what he did to Robin. And if Robin couldn't be on screen, then she should have been living in Beecher's Corner and see I g her family off-screen, or even heading up some WSB science division and doing the same. Patrick & Robin could have still divorced, and Saint Douchebag could still be alive, but Robin in captivity needed to end when she was finally rescued in Nov/Dec 2013.

 

Well, I was just using Cesar as an example of a character we might enjoy watching, but don't root for. I agree, though. As much as I enjoy him, he's past due for some justice.

[kristabell]

Yes! My problem with someone like Sonny isn't that he's a mobster, it's that he's boring and predictable. This applies to most of the characters on this show, though. Even the people I like are just...blah. Everything is predictable and when something surprising/*shocking* happens it's usually because it's ridiculous and out of character. 

I have always loved Faison too, but the thing is you can't have him on all the time. What soap writers don't seem to understand is that uber-villains cannot be a permanent part of the canvas. Back in the day, when Faison really worked as a character imo, he came on for a few months, messed with everyone, was awesome, and then left. And then the interesting part was watching the characters on canvas deal with the fallout.

Which brings us to the problem with Sonny. He can't be a super-bad mobster or whatever he's supposed to be AND be a "normal" character on canvas. That's the same problem with Nina and Franco. And it's something a lot of soap writers, but especially RC, don't seem to understand. I don't want to watch a character rape someone, then have them put into a couple as a normal romantic lead (hi, Ron). It doesn't work. It makes sure the bad guys never really pay, it's painfully obvious that Sonny will never lose (so everyone can see the ending of every story a mile away), and it makes characters ridiculous. You can't have "super bad" also be the romantic lead. Real bad guys only work if they are allowed to be real bad guys. That doesn't mean they can't be grey, or even somewhat rootable; but what they can't be is a "normal" character on canvas.

[Oracle42]

The problem with that is that RC probably grew up watching Luke and Todd become enormously popular characters.

[Ambrosefolly]

The problem with that is that RC probably grew up watching Luke and Todd become enormously popular characters.

I will reply in the GH News thread.