S02.E14: 6 Months Later

[Stinamaia]

I think academia is snobby in general. I work I. Higher education for an online school and we have an amazing reputation. Not every school is APA accredited and it's not required for a psychologist to become licensed. I have never heard argosy having a bad rep and I know many schools that do. I think too many paint with a broad brush. Many school are elite and only offer their programs to ones that test the best. That's not always an indicator of success in a field.

Being compelled to pay 3.3 million dollars to students means the school engaged in unlawful conduct and unethical behavior.   No one shells out 3.3 million in a settlement without evidence of wrong doing.

 

I'm not part of academia, and although I've spent years and years in the classroom, I've never really enjoyed school.  I enjoy learning and continue learn everyday.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Stinamaia

[MissScarlett]

Dr. Logan to Sean  "you never had any intention of moving out of your comfort zone.  I mean you went back to your apartment every night."

 

Dr. Pepper to Sean:  "HE stopped being emotionally accessible and then HE didn't try anymore". 

 

(I want to keep in mind that Levkoff and Schwartz did call out Sean specifically on his lack of commitment... which surprised me..esp. from Levkoff.  I want to be fair and acknowledge when they pointedly address that issue and not appear biased toward Sean.)

 

But then! ....  Dr. Levkoff: to both:  .10 days out of 42...It strikes me that the work wasn't there for both people and that the experiment didn't fail, they failed the experiment because the time wasn't put in."

 

Now I saw Davina bristle at this..and hell yeah!    WHAT was SHE supposed to do?  Why go back to blaming them BOTH for THEIR lack of work  and THEIR lack of time put in when it was SEAN who wasn't there??  

This is where I get frustrated with the experts. .

 

Seasick, you and I definitely see eye-to-eye on this!  I can't like your post enough!  I thought the comments were made by Dr. Logan to take the heat off of poor weepy Sean.

 

He totally had them fooled.  I think the only person Sean did not fool was Dr. Pepper.  She said nothing to attack Davina but definitely spoke up about how Sean checked out early and never checked back in!

[zxy556575]

I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around.

 

It still comes back to the experts' utter incompetence and professional failings in casting and matching these goons in the first place.

[SaucyMommy]

Being compelled to pay 3.3 million dollars to students means the school engaged in unlawful conduct and unethical behavior. No one shells out 3.3 million in a settlement without evidence of wrong doing.

I'm not part of academia, and although I've spent years and years in the classroom, I've never really enjoyed school. I enjoy learning and continue learn everyday.

I agree however fines happen all the time. Even reputable school break rules. IE Rutgers or North Carolina who got sanctioned for fudging transcripts of players. My SIL works as a finance director at a huge University and the stories I've heard about mis appropriation of finds is astounding. And the fact that schools allow it to happen all the time.

[crazychicken]

I think next season the show should pair up the experts and force them to live with a stranger.      Or maybe "Christian Grey" Sean can be paired with Logan.  

 

The first thing I said to my husband was since they are such experts and believe so highly of their skills they should match for each other eg Logan, Epstein & Pepper can find a match fro Cilona since most of them are married they can do a crossover into the 7 year itch crap that was advertised (seriously you think your marriage is failing so go live & sleep with a new spouse for 2 weeks)

 

I equated the picture falling twice when Sean told his sad little lies with the growing nose of Pinocchio.

I am going to hell I equated it with God is not happy with Sean for his fake rediscovered religious belief due to his traumatic marriage

[SaucyMommy]

He's one example and I don't like him either. I don't think for profit or non profit is an indicator of whether a program graduate can be successful

[rulesoftravel]

 

Maybe there is a lot more than we know about, but Jessica didn't bring up anything last night that justified Ryan being called an abuser, thief and gambler.  I actually think he liked her much more than she liked him evidenced by his efforts & willingness to change.  But, as he realized, she's an actress and played this part to her best advantage, regardless of the damage it caused to him in real life.

I believe that the Show offered Jessica protection after Ryan D threatened her at the Reunion.   I think any damage caused to Ryan's reputation was caused by Ryan.    

 

I also think if he "liked her," she probably would not have spent Valentine's Day alone and have been expected to know what was going on in his life by reading fb pages.  Varying mileages, of course.

[Lady Dee]

Dr. Logan to Sean  "you never had any intention of moving out of your comfort zone.  I mean you went back to your apartment every night."

 

Dr. Pepper to Sean:  "HE stopped being emotionally accessible and then HE didn't try anymore". 

 

(I want to keep in mind that Levkoff and Schwartz did call out Sean specifically on his lack of commitment... which surprised me..esp. from Levkoff.  I want to be fair and acknowledge when they pointedly address that issue and not appear biased toward Sean.)

 

But then! ....  Dr. Levkoff: to both:  .10 days out of 42...It strikes me that the work wasn't there for both people and that the experiment didn't fail, they failed the experiment because the time wasn't put in."

 

Now I saw Davina bristle at this..and hell yeah!    WHAT was SHE supposed to do?  Why go back to blaming them BOTH for THEIR lack of work  and THEIR lack of time put in when it was SEAN who wasn't there??  

This is where I get frustrated with the experts. .

 

I'm writing this in between doing other things and since I brought up Reply there has been about 55 new posts!!  Wow!   anxious to read them all and apologies if my comments are redundant.   

 

I have SO much more to comment on but I have to do it small doses!   I'd be here all day!  Many of you probably reflect my feelings to a tee anyway.. so I look forward to reading

 

I think she said both didn't put time in because Davina, if she knew he was working weekends, could have spent weekends in New Jersey with Sean. Then Davina could say definitively, I tried but it just didn't work. She made no effort whatsoever. Sean is wrong but so was she. She wasn't willing to sacrifice at all imo.

[Wings]

When I heard the words "Me and Jaclyn.." and "Divorce is not in my vocabulary"  I felt strangely comforted.

 

 

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!  

[crazychicken]

I believe that the Show offered Jessica protection after Ryan D threatened her at the Reunion.   I think any damage caused to Ryan's reputation was caused by Ryan.    

Until that lunkhead went on his social media rampage they were just rumours that were on forums, that a lot of people were taking with a grain of salt. The idiot posted the Protection Order that sent it into mainstream media, it was even news here is Australia.

[rulesoftravel]

 

Then Davina could say definitively, I tried but it just didn't work. She made no effort whatsoever.

Davina did say on SM that she offered to come to Jersey on weekends-and Sean was not interested.   I think I believe Davina. 

 

The segment on Davina was so choppy-much bad editing seemed to be happening.   I was just wondering if Logan, acclaimed sexpert, was trying to vaporize her.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[LK615]

I don't think that's necessarily the case. The right Ryan could have cheated but Jac didn't want to out him about it on the show, esp. because at that point she might have wanted to keep her options open with him. He may have done it because in his mind he was done with her by that point anyway. The experts probably had nothing to do with "forcing" the women to stay in a bad situation. It was probably production, who didn't force them but strongly advised them that it was in their best interests to do so for many non-relationship reasons, like their contract, the money, etc. So I think they might have been strong-armed into it.

Didn't know how to quote. Very good, Snarkle. How about it was part of the reunion, but it was just never aired. Holding on to the last shred of hope that is Jaclyn and Ryan.

Edited June 17, 2015 by cooksdelight

[Snarklepuss]

I didn't sense that Ryan D. is an abuser, but I did get an abuser vibe from Sean, but that's jut me.  I said before that the experts realized Davina had very strange ideals about what a man is supposed to do.  Davina reminds me of someone who's read too many romance novels.

 

I have to put myself in Davina's shoes.  I think she knows when a guy is faking it and what to expect when a guy is sincere about liking her and wanting the relationship to work. I think she kept harping on what a guy would do if he were really interested in her to get her point across that Sean was not showing her that kind of interest, but she didn't express herself so well and instead of making that point she came off as having too high expectations.   It's awfully hard to express and prove your suspicions when the guy is good at convincing the public (and the experts) that he's sincere and goes through just enough motions for them to totally go blind to all the red flags and signs to prove otherwise.

[rulesoftravel]

(There is a post explaining how to quote.)   http://forums.previously.tv/topic/24805-how-to-quote/#entry1018600

 

 

The experts acted like it was a huge failure of the participants and took zero responsibility for their lack of vetting.

 

 

 

 

Holding on to the last shred of hope that is Jaclyn and Ryan.

You should probably let go of that and read the social media page for Jaclyn's fb post.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[Snarklepuss]

I don't think that's necessarily the case. The right Ryan could have cheated but Jac didn't want to out him about it on the show, esp. because at that point she might have wanted to keep her options open with him. He may have done it because in his mind he was done with her by that point anyway. The experts probably had nothing to do with "forcing" the women to stay in a bad situation. It was probably production, who didn't force them but strongly advised them that it was in their best interests to do so for many non-relationship reasons, like their contract, the money, etc. So I think they might have been strong-armed into it.

Didn't know how to quote. Very good, Snarkle. How about it was part of the reunion, but it was just never aired. Holding on to the last shred of hope that is Jaclyn and Ryan.

 

Thanks, yes that above paragraph was mine.  I agree it could have been addressed at the reunion but left on the cutting room floor.  I think production would have every reason to want to make the men look as good as possible to legitimize having chosen them.

[BexStevia]

Argosy is a joke. At least for mental health related programs.

Are we really defending for-profit schools on here now? They are a cancer on federal education spending. More expensive, more students take loans, more students default, less students finish, less graduates get jobs, the jobs they do get pay less.

Does Dr. C suck because of Argosy? Probably not. But citing his degree from there as any sort of expertise or defense of him at all probably shouldn't be done.

[Stinamaia]

I have to put myself in Davina's shoes.  I think she knows when a guy is faking it and what to expect when a guy is sincere about liking her and wanting the relationship to work. I think she kept harping on what a guy would do if he were really interested in her to get her point across that Sean was not showing her that kind of interest, but she didn't express herself so well and instead of making that point she came off as having too high expectations.   It's awfully hard to express and prove your suspicions when the guy is good at convincing the public (and the experts) that he's sincere and goes through just enough motions for them to totally go blind to all the red flags and signs to prove otherwise.

 

I agree that Davina did not explain herself well.  She said he showed no interest in her, but she needed to follow that up with explicit examples.  There are all those little getting to know you questions that lovers ask.  Silly boring questions. Do you like peas?  What's your favorite color?  Do you like to sightseeing?   blah blah..  They are a little boring unless there is that spark and delight in knowing what your lover enjoys.   After the first couple of days there was almost no touching.  

 

I agree that the location problem was the least of it.  Both of them knew after the "honeymoon" that they weren't going to work out.   From there on out, it was evasion and excused from Sean and increasing exasperation from Davina.

[Neurochick]

I have to put myself in Davina's shoes.  I think she knows when a guy is faking it and what to expect when a guy is sincere about liking her and wanting the relationship to work. I think she kept harping on what a guy would do if he were really interested in her to get her point across that Sean was not showing her that kind of interest, but she didn't express herself so well and instead of making that point she came off as having too high expectations.   It's awfully hard to express and prove your suspicions when the guy is good at convincing the public (and the experts) that he's sincere and goes through just enough motions for them to totally go blind to all the red flags and signs to prove otherwise.

 

Well, I did think Sean was faking it.  I also think Davina expects too much.  That's why I didn't think either one of them was ready for marriage.  She should have said, "the man just wanted to be on TV."

[Wings]

The quality of the colleges these experts attended have has nothing to do with anything.  There are people with prestigious degrees who suck in their careers.  It all comes down to how you apply what you learned in books coupled with integrity.  

 

I would have loved to have seen a close up of the necklaces they all wear.  

[lids]

It still comes back to the experts' utter incompetence and professional failings in casting and matching these goons in the first place.

They need to add in some "filters" for maturity. Obviously two people could be the most compatible couple in the world, but if they're too immature to figure out how to connect, they will never take advantage of the compatibility.

I really wonder how it would have been if Davina and Sean never had the distance issue. Would they have still acted so poorly. I thought it was telling that Sean said he saw Doug's relationship with Jamie and he wanted that. Really? A man would want that?

I love how the host kind of read the immaturity of the cast so quickly. When he asked Ryan why he thought Jessica should have learned about his grandmother's death from a post on Facebook, you could see the wheels of confusion spinning in Ryan's brain. This generation thinks social media substitutes for intimate conversation. They need to teach the next set of participants how to connect.

[athousandclowns]

I am so confused was this program 2 hours? I only saw Jess/Ryan and Jack/Ryan being interviewed. Did my DVR only tape an hour.? Darn I want to see Sean and Davina grilled. My DVR says one hour 9 minutes. DARN

Edited June 17, 2015 by athousandclowns

[MissScarlett]

It still comes back to the experts' utter incompetence and professional failings in casting and matching these goons in the first place.

 

Agreed @lordonia !  They did not set themselves up for success like they did in Season 1

[Stinamaia]

Argosy is a joke. At least for mental health related programs.

Are we really defending for-profit schools on here now? They are a cancer on federal education spending. More expensive, more students take loans, more students default, less students finish, less graduates get jobs, the jobs they do get pay less.

Does Dr. C suck because of Argosy? Probably not. But citing his degree from there as any sort of expertise or defense of him at all probably shouldn't be done.

Apparently, some are doing so.   You bring up good points, but my main difficulty is that the mental health and social worker careers are becoming more and more inundated by graduates from these schools, and I question their training and abilities. I know for a fact that there are people who merely want that piece of paper to get more money/advancement at work rather than education.   I think these schools are devaluing higher education.  However, one of the reasons they are doing so is because other schools are becoming disastrously expensive and state and federal governments are not investing in education.  

[rulesoftravel]

 

I agree that Davina did not explain herself well.  She said he showed no interest in her, but she needed to follow that up with explicit examples.  There are all those little getting to know you questions that lovers ask.  Silly boring questions. Do you like peas?  What's your favorite color?  Do you like to sightseeing?   blah blah..  They are a little boring unless there is that spark and delight in knowing what your lover enjoys.   After the first couple of days there was almost no touching.

Or maybe that was all edited out so that Sean can be the saint and Davina, Satan.

[Lady Dee]

Thanks, yes that above paragraph was mine.  I agree it could have been addressed at the reunion but left on the cutting room floor.  I think production would have every reason to want to make the men look as good as possible to legitimize having chosen them.

 

That might be true but I for one couldn't hug it out with some one if they had cheated on me the way they hugged it out when he first came in. No ma'am.

[BexStevia]

The quality of the colleges matters if you are using their degrees as part of your justification for calling them "experts"

Notice Dr. C's bio makes no mention of where he got his doctorates. Then look at Dr Pepper's bio.

Just saying.

[LK615]

Thanks, yes that above paragraph was mine. I agree it could have been addressed at the reunion but left on the cutting room floor. I think production would have every reason to want to make the men look as good as possible to legitimize having chosen them.

It 100% was - insider info :). While it didn't happen during the actual 6 week filming, it did occur as soon as the 6 weeks were over. He flat out told Jaclyn he did - not with his ex but with two other women. Of course production didn't air it because they couldn't have two cheaters on the show!

[MissScarlett]

Well, I did think Sean was faking it.  I also think Davina expects too much.  That's why I didn't think either one of them was ready for marriage.  She should have said, "the man just wanted to be on TV."

 

I think Davina expected what she was sold, which is that all of these psychological tests, instruments, etc. would help find her "perfect" match.  She went into her wedding day with the expectation that he would be the perfect person for her.  

 

Their wedding day WAS perfect by all standards.  They had crazy chemistry at first.  So, she went to sleep on the night of her wedding with a smile on her face thinking that her knight in shining armor had finally arrived.  Then came the BOOM and she realized that he wasn't fully invested in this.

 

I agree that she had high expectations and wasn't able to successfully adjust those expectations once the problems started.  BUT ... for her to even have a chance to adjust those expectations means that Sean would have had to be "present" in their relationship.  He was not.  Her protective mode kicked on and she sort of held herself above it all.

 

Now, her friends did say that she had trouble moving past the second date... so I think it's definitely fair to say that she has unreasonably high expectations.

Edited June 17, 2015 by MissScarlett

[okerry]

Also - at one point the "experts" mentioned that 7,000 people applied for this season!  And these 3 boys are the best you could get?

Apparently 6,999 of the applicants were women. The one man was the S&M dude we saw in the LoserCam spot, and I guess even these "experts" didn't want to deal with that. So they went out and recruited a slimeball, a mama's boy, and a male who may or may not be straight and is probably bi. And that's what we saw.

[Kiss my mutt]

I really thought Davina handled herself well up against the experts. They were getting all riled up and emotional and she just stated her opinion and stayed calm while not letting their accusations to unchallenged.

[okerry]

Also, ITA with whoever said upthread that Sean lost all interest in Davina when he realized - almost certainly on the first night - that she was actually serious about this and thought it was a real marriage. He thought it was just a chance to be on TV and get some free sex for a few weeks, and thought she'd look at it the same way.

 

And I still think the awkward moves he put on her once the door closed to the honeymoon suite ended any chance of her even trying.

 

I tend to think he's bisexual, not just gay. That kinda explains his oddball behaviour and stories like the pregnant hookup, which nobody is denying AFAIK.

[Canada]

I have one word for these episodes. this season, and these 'experts' - FAIL.

 

And I just have to say that the way one of the experts (blonde one, Logan?) was sitting was so rude!  Legs akimbo, in the space of the expert on either side of her.  No class.  And why was she wearing a muumuu?  She was just horrific.

[okerry]

It became perfectly apparent that they were trying to still teach the participants how to be in any relationship, not just this one.  I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around.

 

Yebbut - weren't these experts aware that the men were recruited and none of them really wanted to be married? That one little fact cut the whole experiment off at the knees and invalidated the whole thing.

 

When a man doesn't really want to be married, there's nothing anyone can do or say to change his mind - certainly not for long.

 

Crikey, I'm a college dropout and I know that!

[Vinyasa]

I think production would have every reason to want to make the men look as good as possible to legitimize having chosen them.

 

Of course, they tried to put lipstick on pigs!

[rulesoftravel]

 

That might be true but I for one couldn't hug it out with some one if they had cheated on me the way they hugged it out when he first came in. No ma'am.

I thought Ryan D's and Jessica's hug was pretty lukewarm.   Ryan R and Jaclyn-hell, Jaclyn just likes hugging.   She even hugged the experts-I would have had a hard time doing that.     I watched how far Jaclyn was sitting away from Ryan, when they used to be joined at the hip.  In fact, when Ryan slid his arm around the back of the loveseat, Jaclyn moved further away and he dropped his arm.    No one looked really thrilled to be with their "spouses" anymore.  Varying mileages, of course.

[Snarklepuss]

The first thing I feel compelled to say is that the experts aren't chumps or idiots.  Even Dr. Cilona has a Ph.D. from an APA accredited school.  That's no easy task, even if it's Argosy.  The college I teach at doesn't have American Psychological Association accredidation and boy-howdy do we wish we did.  Schwartz is a Yale alum and Levkoff is an NYU alum.  Epstein is a Chaplain at Harvard, so he's doing perfectly fine as well.  I admit that as a Ph.D., I got a little wonky with the criticism of the experts, but last night you could see it on their faces, how disappointed and frustrated they were.  It became perfectly apparent that they were trying to still teach the participants how to be in any relationship, not just this one.  I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around. 

 

Speaking as someone who has an MS in Counseling Psych. from Fordham University (and graduated with a 4.0 GPA no less) I can attest to the fact that smart people go into psychology for different reasons, not all of them are equally as valid, IMHO.  I don't think it matters whether Cilona and Levkoff went to a diploma mill or Harvard, I still question their professionalism by putting their own egos and reputations before the participants' by criticizing them and essentially sloughing off all responsibility for their bad matches by claiming that the participants hold full responsibility for failing at the experiment.  Where is their accountability?  All I see is defensiveness, argumentiveness (with fans and the participants) and nothing resembling the kind of impartiality and self awareness one would expect from people with their degrees and supposed list of accomplishments.  What they are asking of the participants is not what they ask of themselves.   This is not professional behavior, IMHO.  I have to tell you, I have known a lot of people like them in the field and hate to say that there are many quacks and people of questionable mental health and character who go into it for their own egos and self aggrandizement.  And a lot of them are smart, went to Ivy league schools and have a list of credits a mile long on their resumes.  

 

And BTW, you will notice that I did not include Dr. Pepper in that paragraph.  She has shown the qualities of a true professional.  She did not put the responsibility on the participants alone.  She did not get involved in heated mud slinging with fans and participants online.  She shed tears and apologized to Jessica for her role in choosing Ryan D.  Neither of the other two offered any apologies or took any responsibility.  You can teach psychology, but unfortunately you can't teach character.  Maybe that's why they were sucked into a questionable project that degenerated into reality show trash in the first place - Because they don't have the character to know better and/or to care.  I don't include Dr. Pepper in that because she is old school and I can imagine that she was an idealist about this process and may not have realized the reality show pitfalls that she might be getting into until it was too late.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Snarklepuss

[Bella]

Quick note to keep things rolling smoothly:

1. Be respectful of differing opinions or your posts will be deleted. Not hidden, deleted.

2. Reread 1.

3. The Social Media thread has a ton of background material that answers a lot of questions. There's nothing left to spoil, so it's safe for the spoiler averse.

4. Reread 1.

Thanks!

[JellyFishQueen]

Did anyone else thought it was odd Ryan D snapping at the girls saying he was just as tight with the boys? It felt like an odd thing to be argumentative about...

[SaucyMommy]

I agree that character cannot be bought. I found Logan's behavior atrocious. She blamed the people for their lousy matchmaking. If you like the person, you put in effort. These were mismatched couples that should not have been put together. I think it's difficult to say why Davina was as cold as she was, but Imo I do think she is acting this way because she got played. Sean says all the right things - and has fooled many - but he doesn't fool me.

[seasick]

Ryan R's behavior is Very Strange.  Here is what I THINK  the real story is:.

 

Some woman has his balls on a string.  Not a serious ex,, but one that had been toying with him for awhile.  It seemed to be going nowhere but he couldn't get her off his mind.  

 

Recruited or not he came into the experiment carrying a torch.  but..thinking   "Time to move forward and get this woman off my mind'.   It's not going anywhere'"  ... finally wanting to accept she's just not that into him.

 

Then.a few weeks into the experiment....Ringy-Dingy!!!  . She got word and called him up.  (these types can't bear to see a man move on. even if they're not that into him)    She schmoozed and gave him just enough to think it could be on again big time,  and that her former ambivalence was just a big misunderstanding.  He jumped.

 

Can't sleep w Jac anymore,  can't call her in Key West,  After the show he can't have any contact or Lady Love will get mad. Even took her off as facebook friends.

 

Now before you say anything,  I agree it does not line up with him saying he wanted to stay married.  But then again.. why did he??  He never saw her again or contacted her again after that.  There is nothing preventing him from staying closer as friends if he is still free and single.    But he wants no part of it, despite the fact that he does like Jac.  It's too strange and suspicious for it to be just him not really wanting to be married.  

 

  And as soon as the coast is clear and his relationship with Jac is damaged beyond all hope Lady Love will dump and move on.

 

This is not something Ryan could ever talk about openly.  I think he's a pretty okay guy overall but this situation is too embarrassing to admit to.   

[Vinyasa]

10 out of 42 days in the apt for Davina and Sean.

 

I didn't watch Season 1, but did they live together?

[Wings]

The quality of the colleges matters if you are using their degrees as part of your justification for calling them "experts"

Notice Dr. C's bio makes no mention of where he got his doctorates. Then look at Dr Pepper's bio.

Just saying.

 

 

You can get a BS or BA in psychology and do this job well.  Dr C's doctorate is useless if he cannot do what he was trained to do in his undergraduate degree.  His doctorate means nothing. That man is a con artist.  

[GeorgiaRai]

I believe that the Show offered Jessica protection after Ryan D threatened her at the Reunion.   I think any damage caused to Ryan's reputation was caused by Ryan.    

 

I also think if he "liked her," she probably would not have spent Valentine's Day alone and have been expected to know what was going on in his life by reading fb pages.  Varying mileages, of course.

 

Absolutely varying mileage!  If I felt Jess was sincere and if I believed the (to date, unsubstantiated) rumors about Ryan, I'm sure I'd agree with you and side with public opinion. 

 

The way I see it, he wasn't given the opportunity to explain about Valentine's Day, even though it was clear he had something to say.  He wasn't asked to give his explanation of didn't live together after Decision Day. He's been accused of lying about the watches.  He's been accused of cheating (based on a mailed card, so far as we know) & doing drugs (based on a fake Instagram account).   It's just all way too much innuendo & accusation, and not enough substance, IMO, unless one chooses to take Jessica's word without question.  I simply don't.

And I'm not afraid to be proven wrong and will happily eat crow when/if anything concrete comes out. :)

[lids]

Yebbut - weren't these experts aware that the men were recruited and none of them really wanted to be married? That one little fact cut the whole experiment off at the knees and invalidated the whole thing.

That's not really fact though. That's from a no-name person who made statements on a message board.

[Lady Dee]

Ryan R's behavior is Very Strange.  Here is what I THINK  the real story is:.

 

Some woman has his balls on a string.  Not a serious ex,, but one that had been toying with him for awhile.  It seemed to be going nowhere but he couldn't get her off his mind.  

 

Recruited or not he came into the experiment carrying a torch.  but..thinking   "Time to move forward and get this woman off my mind'.   It's not going anywhere'"  ... finally wanting to accept she's just not that into him.

 

Then.a few weeks into the experiment....Ringy-Dingy!!!  . She got word and called him up.  (these types can't bear to see a man move on. even if they're not that into him)    She schmoozed and gave him just enough to think it could be on again big time,  and that her former ambivalence was just a big misunderstanding.  He jumped.

 

Can't sleep w Jac anymore,  can't call her in Key West,  After the show he can't have any contact or Lady Love will get mad. Even took her off as facebook friends.

 

Now before you say anything,  I agree it does not line up with him saying he wanted to stay married.  But then again.. why did he??  He never saw her again or contacted her again after that.  There is nothing preventing him from staying closer as friends if he is still free and single.    But he wants no part of it, despite the fact that he does like Jac.  It's too strange and suspicious for it to be just him not really wanting to be married.  

 

  And as soon as the coast is clear and his relationship with Jac is damaged beyond all hope Lady Love will dump and move on.

 

This is not something Ryan could ever talk about openly.  I think he's a pretty okay guy overall but this situation is too embarrassing to admit to.   

 

He seems like the type of person who knows they have a good thing but can't commit but also don't want to let it go because they know they will regret it later down the line.

[Wings]

Seasick, this could very well be.  There is something more and I believe the insider info on most things, maybe all.  They mentioned a ex in Ryan's picture. 

 

I hope to see more come to light as time goes forward.  The women are the ones likely to confirm some of the spoiler material. 

[ralph]

You could see how pissed the experts where at the couples given their reputations are on the line for NONE of them working out, which is why they all scrambled to get Ryan R and Jaclyn to go out for dinner. I like the show and I think it's a great idea, I believe the experts credentials and all the work they put into matching people, I hope the show isn't cancelled and they have a 3rd to at least redeem themselves. There is really no reason Jaclyn and Ryan R didn't work out, but Davina and Sean spent 10 or 12 of their 42 days together and Ryan....and well, we all know what went down with Ryan D and Jessica. BTW, Did you see Levkoff's face when Jessica said he cheated. I think she was angrier than Jessica.

Edited June 17, 2015 by ralph

[GeorgiaRai]

That's not really fact though. That's from a no-name person who made statements on a message board.

 

Thanks for bringing that point up again.  Some rumors have been repeated so many times and in so many places, they're being accepted as proven fact.  Like so  many other things, there may turn out to be some facts to substantiate this claim, but ... none so far, that I've seen or heard.

[rulesoftravel]

 

Absolutely varying mileage!  If I felt Jess was sincere and if I believed the (to date, unsubstantiated) rumors about Ryan, I'm sure I'd agree with you and side with public opinion.

The one thing we do know and that the Show has admitted is that they provided protection for Jessica after the Reunion.   I also think the fact her law firm referred her to another attorney for the protection order was to avoid any suggestion that she was faking this for attention.  I look forward to the court date-that could answer a lot of questions.

 

 

But then, I think the Show is a mess and that the expert advice is laughable.   In Ryan D's words...read a book;same level of advice.  JMO.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[Wings]

Ryan R's behavior is Very Strange.  Here is what I THINK  the real story is:.

 

Some woman has his balls on a string.  Not a serious ex,, but one that had been toying with him for awhile.  It seemed to be going nowhere but he couldn't get her off his mind.  

 

Recruited or not he came into the experiment carrying a torch.  but..thinking   "Time to move forward and get this woman off my mind'.   It's not going anywhere'"  ... finally wanting to accept she's just not that into him.

 

Then.a few weeks into the experiment....Ringy-Dingy!!!  . She got word and called him up.  (these types can't bear to see a man move on. even if they're not that into him)    She schmoozed and gave him just enough to think it could be on again big time,  and that her former ambivalence was just a big misunderstanding.  He jumped.

 

Can't sleep w Jac anymore,  can't call her in Key West,  After the show he can't have any contact or Lady Love will get mad. Even took her off as facebook friends.

 

Now before you say anything,  I agree it does not line up with him saying he wanted to stay married.  But then again.. why did he??  He never saw her again or contacted her again after that.  There is nothing preventing him from staying closer as friends if he is still free and single.    But he wants no part of it, despite the fact that he does like Jac.  It's too strange and suspicious for it to be just him not really wanting to be married.  

 

  And as soon as the coast is clear and his relationship with Jac is damaged beyond all hope Lady Love will dump and move on.

 

This is not something Ryan could ever talk about openly.  I think he's a pretty okay guy overall but this situation is too embarrassing to admit to.   

 

 

This would explain Ryan's abrupt withdrawing from Jaclyn shortly after they consummated their relationship.  He was into her in the beginning and was eager for sex.