S02.E14: 6 Months Later

[Liberty]

I just ffwd the on demand version to see the Satan section.  The section was edited so it's tough to know what really happend after Davina exposed that creep Sean calling her Satan, that creep Sean did some mugging for the camera to buy time while he fabricated a response.  Then Kevin asks, and that creep Sean replies that when he revealed his darkest secrets to her, her response created a devil like presence in the marriage he wanted so badly to succeed.

 

While watching this, it was difficult not to be distracted by the style choices the characters made

 

Does the piping on poseur Cilona's jacket light up under black light?

Could poseur Pepper have made better choices in presentation of self?

Poseur Levkoff did not get the flattering camera angles she had received all season long, but how about those shoes!

Lyin' Ryan D and Sean both had on their finest footwear.

Kevin and that creep Sean were the only two who could manage ties, but sport jackets were common.

Davina and Jaclyn looked great, and Jessica was trying to.

 

What am I missing in their style selections?

Edited June 17, 2015 by Liberty

[SneakyCentipede]

Why were the experts all over Davina's ass?!?  How can Davina be to blame, if Sean LITERALLY wasn't there?!?!?

I know! I tweeted Logan asking why she was coming for Davina's neck? " The experiment didn't fail her; she failed the experiment" was my favorite quote. STFU "experts" you were all steaming mad that these people had not agreed to keep up the charade

[algebra]

BTW, how DOES Sean survive the chaotic, frenetic, loud, glaringly-lit, smelly, screaming Hades that is the average City ER? He is such a delicate snowflake; he chose an odd profession for himself.

Think about it: when you live in the city, you hear sirens 24 hours a day, and probably learn to ignore it eventually, because they don't concern you. But when you work in an ER, sirens mean "incoming!" And you get an adrenaline rush and go into action. You don't sleep through it, which means life in the city equates to severe sleep deprivation.

Edited June 17, 2015 by cooksdelight

[SneakyCentipede]

Logan was so unprofessional getting so heated. They failed not the experiment...uh ok

Shoot, I just commented this very quote; sorry! I was so anxious to start talking about those fools that I didn't read the comments first.

[cherry slushie]

Love how they pressured them to keep trying....

They were so desperate to get one successful couple out of this mess, they stopped just short of strapping Jac and Ryan R. to the couch with their eyes forced open (a la Clockwork Orange), looping clips of their good times together over and over until they agreed to give it another shot. I think Ryan R. finally said yes to shut them up, and because he felt guilty after listening to Jaclyn profess her love for him.  He's so not into her romantically.

Edited June 17, 2015 by cherry slushie

[rulesoftravel]

 

I don't buy her restraining order for one second.  I have a friend whose husband's first wife would always file a restraining order on him when he'd come to see the children.  Then when they would move away from her, she'd follow them

You know who does "buy her restraining order?"   Jaclyn and Davina.  They have both been incredibly supportive and they know her.    I think the insider was dead on about 90% of that.   And with what Jaclyn posted about Ryan in SM, it's pretty clear a lot got left in the editing room. 

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[Stinamaia]

agree Ryan is a douche but jessica called him a gambler not a drug addict. Just for ratings alone, if she had said it I would have definitely added that into the show. Personally, she did not come off as abused. When I was younger my parents help a woman who was abused. She avoided windows, wasn't very confident, was jumpy at times, and when she talked about her husband you saw true fear and trepidation. Jessica imho looked like a pissed off woman and rightfully so but not abused. Could he have threatened her? Sure but admitting to smashing his property is more "violent" then we have seen him be to her. saying he was wearing the watch she bought him, then giving him the "ok boo boo I got your number" side hug at the end shows me that she and her lawyer ain't dumb. I don't buy her being afraid. But her giving him the $100 gave me life! Dr. C was right she could have been the bigger person and not be petty but at that point she was just over it and with him cheating on her I don't condone it but don't necessarily blame her.

 

I've worked around abused women and children for 15-20 years.  I've heard a lot of people saying that "x" could not be abused because "x" is not afraid, and "x" seems to like the alleged abuser.  I've also seen women who have been terribly abused become abusive themselves because they are trying to regain some agency, and yes, because they want revenge.  I've seen women instigate.  I've seen others broken down.  The length of time the woman has been abused has something to to with her behavior as well.   Nevertheless, sometimes women appear very strong ( although Jessica does not appear strong to me) yet they have suffered a lot of abuse.   I knew a woman who suffered a great deal of abuse leading up to an incident where her scalp was torn at the hairline and took innumerable stitches to repair.  No one could have told she had been abused had they not seen the long list of criminal charges against her husband who finally received a prison sentence for this last incident even though he had been found guilty of beating her many times before.  

 

So, Jessica, in my somewhat educated experience, suffered low level abuse of being yelled at and called names.  This is the sort of thing that can escalate into physical abuse.  Fortunately, Ryan wasn't interested in Jessica.   I'm sorry Jessica retained interest in him even though he refused to live with her after the filming.  She still hasn't learned the lesson that even though you can't take someone at his word, you definitely should take him at his actions.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Stinamaia

[algebra]

You know who does "buy her restraining order?" Jaclyn and Davina. They have both been incredibly supportive and they know her. I think the insider was dead on about 90% of that. And with what Jaclyn posted about Ryan in SM, it's pretty clear a lot got left in the editing room.

The thing about the "insider" was when Basement responded and said he didn't know who the insider was but he had a pretty good idea and that was "sad."

That tells me he thought it was one of the women.

The insider also said none of the men were really interested in being married. Got that right!

[rulesoftravel]

 

They were so desperate to get one successful couple out of this mess, they stopped just short of strapping Jac and Ryan R. to the couch with their eyes forced open, looping clips of their good times together over and over until they were brainwashed, a la Clockwork Orange.

And honestly, all Jaclyn and Ryan agreed to was one dinner.   The "expert and the sexpert" acted like they had just agreed to take a blood oath and travel the world together, curing diseases and solving cold cases  It was one dinner and ...Ryan didn't even make that. 

 

 

The thing about the "insider" was when Basement responded and said he didn't know who the insider was but he had a pretty good idea and that was "sad."

I think the "insider" is from production.  And after what Jaclyn posted on fb about Ryan, I believe nothing from his mouth. Good at the talk-bad at the walk.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[SaucyMommy]

I could tell none of the men were sincere. Sean was not tearing up - there were zero tears. No tears. Ryan douche said he was embarrassed by his behavior but this week was acting a fool on IG. Ryan R says all the right things but means none of them

[IndyChick]

 

Jessica was wrong smashing Ryan's watch - BUT, he tries to make it worse by saying it was TWO watches, given to him by his grandparents with great sentimental value.  I highly doubt that.  And, Jessica replaced the watch. 

 

 

Jessica destroyed something that could not be replaced. even if the exact same watch was available - the new watch still would not have belonged to Ryan's grandfather.

[Liberty]

... all Jaclyn and Ryan agreed to was one dinner.   ...

 

Hopefully Jaclyn takes him to an Indian restaurant that has pizza on the menu!

[Stinamaia]

I watched on FYI and didn't see Sean address it. Did I miss it or was it on A&E?

 

You didn't see him address it because he gave one of those droning, bs answers that probably caused your brain to refuse to retain it.  I know he gave an answer, but I could not tell you what he said except that he never really said anything that would explain such a harsh word.

 

They were so desperate to get one successful couple out of this mess, they stopped just short of strapping Jac and Ryan R. to the couch with their eyes forced open, looping clips of their good times together over and over until they agreed to give it another shot. I think Ryan R. finally said yes to shut them up, and because he felt guilty after listening to Jaclyn profess her love for him.  He's so not into her romantically.

 

Jaclyn sat there and told the experts many times that Ryan would not follow through.  She'd been down the road with him many times.  They kept saying bs like marriage is hard.  Sometime you don't like your spouse, etc. etc.   But none of them addressed the FOUR months that Ryan did not talk to her because as he put it, he was concentrating on himself.   Four months without any contact means he's not feeling it.  

 

Also I was disgusted with his "I always want Jacs in my life:   What nonsense! 

[BeatrixK]

Why on earth were Davnia and Sean wearing wedding rings when they first came out to talk with Kevin both separately and together?

 

These rings were left behind in the apt. We all knew they wanted the divorce, so now six months later they are wearing rings?

 

I don't think they had them on at the end when all of  six them were back.

 

I wondered about the wedding rings - and this is just my theory -- but, the show was taped BEFORE the Decision episode...so they couldn't exactly have someone hanging out by the studio, spy someone sans ring, and spoil their ending for them. (Sean V. went into the taping without his wedding ring on:  Does that mean their decision is divorce?')  I noticed that, after they brought the couples back for the group thing, Sean's was NOT on.  So my guess is they just had to wear it to the taping, to help throw off TMZ spies - type folks.

[Stinamaia]

Jessica destroyed something that could not be replaced. even if the exact same watch was available - the new watch still would not have belonged to Ryan's grandfather.

 

But did the old watch belong to Ryan's grandfather?   Jessica says no.   Why is Ryan's word suddenly gospel when he said so many other questionable things starting with how he got a $100 bill from the ATM.   Quite a special ATM indeed.

[rulesoftravel]

Sean dressing as an 8 year old going to his first day of third grade (instead of wearing a jacket like the other guys) really brought home how picked on he was.  He stages everything and plans every word he says.   And the "expert and the sexpert" just lap it up.   

 

 

The reunion was shot after the decision, but the participants are told to wear their rings everywhere until the entire season-including the reunion-is done.      The dramatic leaving of rings behind was staged by the show.  

 

 

Ryan D probably won the watch in a poker game.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[SaucyMommy]

But did the old watch belong to Ryan's grandfather? Jessica says no. Why is Ryan's word suddenly gospel when he said so many other questionable things starting with how he got a $100 bill from the ATM. Quite a special ATM indeed.

Exactly! I don't believe it was his grandfathers watch for a second

[Vinyasa]

I wondered about the wedding rings - and this is just my theory -- but, the show was taped BEFORE the Decision episode...so they couldn't exactly have someone hanging out by the studio, spy someone sans ring, and spoil their ending for them.

 

ah, ok. It was taped before the decision show aired, right?

[algebra]

I just ffwd the on demand version to see the Satan section. The section was edited so it's tough to know what really happend after Davina exposed that creep Sean calling her Satan, that creep Sean did some mugging for the camera to buy time while he fabricated a response. Then Kevin asks, and that creep Sean replies that when he revealed his darkest secrets to her, her response created a devil like presence in the marriage he wanted so badly to succeed.

While watching this, it was difficult not to be distracted by the style choices the characters made

Does the piping on poseur Cilona's jacket light up under black light?

Could poseur Pepper have made better choices in presentation of self?

Poseur Levkoff did not get the flattering camera angles she had received all season long, but how about those shoes!

Lyin' Ryan D and Sean both had on their finest footwear.

Kevin and that creep Sean were the only two who could manage ties, but sport jackets were common.

Davina and Jaclyn looked great, and Jessica was trying to.

What am I missing in their style selections?

[Vinyasa]

I wish they had asked all of them

 

- how many nights did you stay in the apts together? Even Davina and Sean said 10 out of 42

 

-where did you decide to live after the six weeks were up? Jessica said Ryan wanted to go separate ways. No need to ask D&S.

[rulesoftravel]

They do footage from the decision show as part of the reunion.   It's taped after.  It was taped in May.   But I believe the participants have to agree to wear the stupid rings in public until the reunion.

 

Facebook had so many posters analyzing every picture posted for hair length and absence or presence of rings.   Sad.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[cherry slushie]

There is a huge difference in talking back to him and purposely being an ass by throwing $100 at him and smashing his watches.  She is not innocent in this.

Yep, Jessica is not so innocent after all.  She knows just what it takes to set off Ryan's hair-trigger temper, and pulled that $100 crap to get him to blow his gasket on live TV.  I'm glad Dr, Pepper (the only legit expert) called her out on it. I think this could be a case of Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned, and she's sporadically pulling his crazy strings like a master puppeteer.  

 

But, the best part was, the minute he had the C-note in his hand, he crumpled it and feigned throwing it to the ground, TWICE, but it never left his hand!  Then he made ripping up motions with his hands, but he never ripped it up!  Then he slyly slipped it into his pocket when he thought the cameras were off of him because the experts were talking.  $100 should net him about 2 grams of coke (I looked it up). ;)

Edited June 17, 2015 by cherry slushie

[Neurochick]

I'm glad I took the insider info with a grain of salt. A number of things didn't align. They said the wrong Ryan cheated and that the experts forced the women to say yes. I'm sorry but if someone is forcing me to stay in a bad situation I wouldn't be giving them a big hug like jessica and jac did with the experts.

As far as the experts are concerned we have got to stop acting like they lived this experience with the participants as it was happening. They matched the people and then the people had to do the work. Even the participants acknowledged that. These were not their personal therapists providing them services. Golly, calm down. They aren't quacks because the people are getting divorced. They made arrangements based on info the participants gave them and assessments. Honestly, if we could do better and handle the stress of that then they wouldn't have a show and we wouldn't be watching it and talking about. Plus, they are are personally invested. In any matchmaking situation the matchmaker usually is.

I agree Ryan is a douche but jessica called him a gambler not a drug addict. Just for ratings alone, if she had said it I would have definitely added that into the show. Personally, she did not come off as abused. When I was younger my parents help a woman who was abused. She avoided windows, wasn't very confident, was jumpy at times, and when she talked about her husband you saw true fear and trepidation. Jessica imho looked like a pissed off woman and rightfully so but not abused. Could he have threatened her? Sure but admitting to smashing his property is more "violent" then we have seen him be to her. saying he was wearing the watch she bought him, then giving him the "ok boo boo I got your number" side hug at the end shows me that she and her lawyer ain't dumb. I don't buy her being afraid. But her giving him the $100 gave me life! Dr. C was right she could have been the bigger person and not be petty but at that point she was just over it and with him cheating on her I don't condone it but don't necessarily blame her.

Davina deserved to get asked what her part was to play in the ending of her relationship. I was just as frustrated with her as Dr. Logan. There is no growth in you as a person, imho, if you cannot see and take responsibility for your actions in the demise of something. To me that is disingenuous. She was no angel and if she had owned up to that like everyone else did she would have come off better. Being rightfully pissed doesn't make you immune from correction.

I don't like Sean so anything he said was blah to me but everyone is allowed to change their mind. He thought he could handle moving and then he realized he couldn't. That doesn't make him a liar just that he didn't know that about himself until he was put in this situation. However, I do think that if Davina had been the girl for him he would have made the sacrifice.

Love Jac. Dated a dude like Ryan R. He's the type that talks our of both sides of his mouth. She doesn't need that.

 

I totally agree with this post.  I'll sit at the minority table with you too.  I didn't sense that Ryan D. is an abuser, but I did get an abuser vibe from Sean, but that's jut me.  I said before that the experts realized Davina had very strange ideals about what a man is supposed to do.  Davina reminds me of someone who's read too many romance novels.

 

To me Jessica came off as someone who was pissed off that Ryan might have cheated on her.  She would have stayed with him, anger issues and all, but when she saw that Valentine's Day card, she got pissed.  Ryan though had no clue as to how to be a husband, as Kevin pointed out.  

 

I really don't know what's true and what's untrue about the rumors, but one thing I do sense, most of them had no business on the show because they're not grown up enough to get married.

[Stinamaia]

Jessica is angry and emotional.  She is rather immature as well.  

 

I thought he slipped the bill into his pocket, but thought I might have seen it wrong because he made a motion afterward that he had thrown it down.  First I noticed him looking like he was going to pocket it, and then like he was going to throw it down, and then again looking like he was taking it, and then throwing it down. I didn't see Jessica pick up anything at the end.  Editing monkeys?    I'll have to rewind.

[phdme]

I don't know if I'm happy or not that I found this forum.  It's kept me entertained and fueled my crazy need for MAFS info.  But this gal has got to let it go!  I have spent far too much time thinking about this crazy show.  Dang.  :) 

 

The first thing I feel compelled to say is that the experts aren't chumps or idiots.  Even Dr. Cilona has a Ph.D. from an APA accredited school.  That's no easy task, even if it's Argosy.  The college I teach at doesn't have American Psychological Association accredidation and boy-howdy do we wish we did.  Schwartz is a Yale alum and Levkoff is an NYU alum.  Epstein is a Chaplain at Harvard, so he's doing perfectly fine as well.  I admit that as a Ph.D., I got a little wonky with the criticism of the experts, but last night you could see it on their faces, how disappointed and frustrated they were.  It became perfectly apparent that they were trying to still teach the participants how to be in any relationship, not just this one.  I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around. 

 

Oh to the dear Davina and Sean....  Davina, from the honeymoon, showed a bizarre need to have Sean intuit her thoughts and desires.  The infamous crying moment had him trying to make her laugh, I'm sure because he was uncomfortable with his new 'wife' crying for the first time.  As a nervous Nellie, he was trying to break the ice and it didn't work.  She was mad that he didn't guess what she was feeling or thinking. Could he have simply asked, "What's wrong?"  Sure.  He didn't.  And the reality is that she never offered to explain the tears herself.  I think Levkoff was on point to ask her about her own willingness to accept accountabillity.  I don't remember Davina really saying what she could've done better.  I'm all for being a strong woman, but sometimes it's not about being strong, it's about being obstinate.

 

And Ryan and Jess-- goodness gracious.  It really doesn't matter what kind of dress Jess was wearing, she desperately needs to mature.  Yes, does Ryan have some significant confidence/arrogance issues to work out?  Yes.  But her smashing of the watch and $100 dollar bill was just so petty.  Even as the experts were trying to teach how to behave, she retorted like a teenager, that she was pissed off.  Oil and water, those two.  Bless them both and let them find peace somewhere, anywhere.

 

Jac and Ry and Kev and Lo and Pep.  Dear Jaclyn, you feisty gal, you.  It's totally okay to use someone's full name.  I promise.  What a shocker this one was.  From all the preview footage, I would've never guessed the warmth that was still there between them.  They were the emblematic couple for the entire season-- folks who have all the potential in the world, sometimes just let the relationship they're in slip through the cracks.  They don't follow through and make the committment.  When I think about the first season, two of those couples were willing to do everything in their power to make it work.  It was exhausting to see them work so hard, but that exhaustion paid off.  Even the immature Cortney (I'm remember the death glare she gave Jason when he called her out on wanting to make memories), stuck it out and continually gave herself over to the 'experiment.'  Doug and Jamie had the ludicrous cigarette fiasco, but it never devolved into the $100 bill fiasco.  Oy vey.  These couples!  The experts can only do what they can do.  What was in the participants minds vs. their hearts was very, very different.  Bless the beasts and the children.  ...And me, because I'll be tuning in for season three.

[Stinamaia]

I totally agree with this post.  I'll sit at the minority table with you too.  I didn't sense that Ryan D. is an abuser, but I did get an abuser vibe from Sean, but that's jut me.  I said before that the experts realized Davina had very strange ideals about what a man is supposed to do.  Davina reminds me of someone who's read too many romance novels.

 

To me Jessica came off as someone who was pissed off that Ryan might have cheated on her.  She would have stayed with him, anger issues and all, but when she saw that Valentine's Day card, she got pissed.  Ryan though had no clue as to how to be a husband, as Kevin pointed out.  

 

I really don't know what's true and what's untrue about the rumors, but one thing I do sense, most of them had no business on the show because they're not grown up enough to get married.

I don't think you can tell who is an abuser by looking at them.  You have to see what they do.   I have no idea if RyanD is an abuser, but I do know he uses abusive language and anger to control a situation because I saw it.  This is the behavior that can lead to physical abuse because it is so closely tied to anger and self justification.   What I saw of Sean is that he uses talking at length to control a situation.  Both are controllers.  

[rulesoftravel]

 

I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around.

I totally agree with myself that the experts failed everyone.   Rush job-bad results.  Unprofessional.

 

 

 

 

Davina, from the honeymoon, showed a bizarre need to have Sean intuit her thoughts and desires.  The infamous crying moment had him trying to make her laugh, I'm sure because he was uncomfortable with his new 'wife' crying for the first time

Davina has said this was taken out of context and that the show edited out the multiple times she had comforted a crying Sean.    What we see is not the whole story.  For some reason, Davina is the Show's villain, even though many co-workers of Sean have agreed he's a liar.   OTOH, Davina's friends and people who know her seem to think she got a raw deal.    

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[cardigirl]

The first thing I feel compelled to say is that the experts aren't chumps or idiots.  Even Dr. Cilona has a Ph.D. from an APA accredited school.  That's no easy task, even if it's Argosy.  The college I teach at doesn't have American Psychological Association accredidation and boy-howdy do we wish we did.  Schwartz is a Yale alum and Levkoff is an NYU alum.  Epstein is a Chaplain at Harvard, so he's doing perfectly fine as well.  I admit that as a Ph.D., I got a little wonky with the criticism of the experts, but last night you could see it on their faces, how disappointed and frustrated they were.  It became perfectly apparent that they were trying to still teach the participants how to be in any relationship, not just this one.  I totally agree with Levkoff that the participants failed the experiment, not the other way around.

 

Quoted because I TOTALLY agree with this AND because you said "boy-howdy"  which I love.  

[GeorgiaRai]

I ended the season liking only Jaclyn, Davina & RyanD.  I had liked Jessica until recently, but unless a LOT more comes out and is substantiated by some kind of evidence or proof, my opinion of her is about as low as it can go.  She was the first one I followed on FB and Twitter, and the first one I've un-followed.  What a depressing show.

 

That being said, between PTV posters calling him Ryan Douche and FB posters calling him Ryan Sushi, he will, in my mind, forever be "Ryan Doucshi". 

[Neurochick]

I don't think you can tell who is an abuser by looking at them.  You have to see what they do.   I have no idea if RyanD is an abuser, but I do know he uses abusive language and anger to control a situation because I saw it.  This is the behavior that can lead to physical abuse because it is so closely tied to anger and self justification.   What I saw of Sean is that he uses talking at length to control a situation.  Both are controllers.  

 

See, I don't get the abusive language issue.  I don't think that being angry and yelling equals abuse.  I mean I've been yelled at many times, I've had people say they were going to kick my ass and beat the shit out of me.  I know that words can turn into actions but they don't always do.  

 

What I also think is abusive is when you have a different opinion and get attacked for it.  Maybe I shouldn't post here anymore.

[Stinamaia]

Looking up Argosy's accreditation and found this:  http://www.apa.org/monitor/2014/02/argosy.aspx

 

Argosy to pay $3.3 million for misleading psychology students

See, I don't get the abusive language issue.  I don't think that being angry and yelling equals abuse.  I mean I've been yelled at many times, I've had people say they were going to kick my ass and beat the shit out of me.  I know that words can turn into actions but they don't always do.  

 

What I also think is abusive is when you have a different opinion and get attacked for it.  Maybe I shouldn't post here anymore.

I did not think I was attacking you, but rather expressing a different opinion.

I'm also confused why you think being attacked for having a different opinion is abuse, but that yelling and threats of bodily harm are not abusive.  

I agree that yelling and anger and threats do not necessarily turn into physical abuse.  

[MissScarlett]

 Dr. Logan looked like she was on the verge of crying during every segment, except when Davina was by herself being interviewed.  Then, she just looked plain pissed.  I was expecting laser beams to come shooting out of her eyes.  Dr. Pepper looked very sad and heavy hearted throughout.

 

Sean & Davina:  I'm not surprised that Sean turned on the waterworks.  He came out shoulders hunched, head down and respectfully waved at the "experts".  I felt it was just an act.  I love Davina!  I know that she's not very popular but ... I find her to be brutally honest and someone who tells it like it is.  This woman knows who she is and does not apologize for it.  I respect that.

 

How could she take accountability when Sean was barely around?  His absence served to piss her off even more.  When he was around, it seems he only wanted to open up about his issues.  Something was always wrong with that guy.  Sure, she could have looked outside herself and been more attune to his needs but he would have needed to be "present" for that and he was not.  Davina is not a chaser.

 

Everything was about Sean in the same way that everything was about Davina.  Neither person budged.  Each person wanted the other to "take care" of them.  I will say this... when Davina said "I will be here for you but I need you to be here with me"... I believed her 100%.  If Sean would have tried more, toughed it out, and truly courted her, I believe the loving / soft hearted / caretaking Davina would have come out and been the person to nurture him.

 

The "experts" failed Davina and I don't blame her one iota for being pissed and a little petty.  I think Sean was there simply to get his feet wet in reality television land.

 

RyanD & Jessica:  Ryan is like a petulant child.  He apologized but I don't think it was sincere.  He just wanted to wash his hands of the whole thing. I don't know that I believe he is a wife beater, but I definitely think he is someone who is very emotionally abusive and runs his mouth without considering the other person's feelings.  He seems hot tempered and impulsive.  His friends are thugs and he seems very thuggish himself.  Not a good guy.

 

On the other hand, I thought it was in poor taste when Jess tried the $100 burn.  It was awkward at best.  Also, she broke a watch that his grandfather gave him.  Obviously she chose to be reactive instead of proactive but I can't say that I blame her?  Ryan put her through a lot.  She agreed to stay married and then the bastard said he needed his space and that they should return to separate apartments.

 

I think the "death threats" trumps anything Jessica may have done.  Ryan is very obviously a bad guy.  Still, I don't think either can claim innocence in this marriage.

 

RyanR & Jaclyn:  America's favorite couple?  Uhm okay?  Personally, I am glad that they are through and I hope that Jaclyn DID NOT give him the time of day after the reunion.  Despite not being attracted to him initially, she really threw herself into the experiment and into the marriage while Ryan remained very selfish and guarded.  He wasn't ready for marriage.  He probably went into this to up his real estate game.  Jaclyn deserves better and I hope she gets it!  She is a class act all the way and Ryan fucked up royally.  I didn't see a man sitting on that couch, I saw a momma's boy.  I am relieved that these two are over.  Whoever marries Jaclyn for real, will be a very lucky guy.

 

In fact, all of the "men" this season were really boys.  None of them were men.

 

Drawing a comparison to last season -- now those guys were men.  Doug was so patient with Jamie.  When she opened up to him, he was right there with her 100%.  She said some terrible things about him and he stood by her, falling in love with her.  Jason gave his all to Courtney and to the experiment despite his mom having terminal cancer.  I believe Courtney was the rock that helped him get through when his mom died.

[rulesoftravel]

 

 

Looking up Argosy's accreditation and found this:  http://www.apa.org/monitor/2014/02/argosy.aspx

Argosy to pay $3.3 million for misleading psychology students

So, it's not  quite an APA accredited psychology program.    Why does this not surprise me? 

 

 

 

Standing by my feeling that Ryan won the watch.  And as Jessica said, he was lying about wearing the new watch she gave him to replace it.   I saw him move his hands down so no one could see the watch.  Who lies about wearing a watch?   

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[GeorgiaRai]

See, I don't get the abusive language issue.  I don't think that being angry and yelling equals abuse.  I mean I've been yelled at many times, I've had people say they were going to kick my ass and beat the shit out of me.  I know that words can turn into actions but they don't always do.  

 

Yes. So much yes!!  The only thing we know for sure Ryan has done is raise his voice during an argument, from across the room.  And several times we've seen him end a bad situation by leaving the room rather than perpetuate - much less escalate - the argument.  Yelling during a two-person argument does not equate to verbal abuse, IMO, and quiet words can be just as hurtful as loud ones.

 

Maybe there is a lot more than we know about, but Jessica didn't bring up anything last night that justified Ryan being called an abuser, thief and gambler.  I actually think he liked her much more than she liked him evidenced by his efforts & willingness to change.  But, as he realized, she's an actress and played this part to her best advantage, regardless of the damage it caused to him in real life. 

 

Edited June 18, 2015 by GeorgiaRai

[Lady Dee]

I watched on FYI and didn't see Sean address it. Did I miss it or was it on A&E?

 

I watched on A&E so not sure about FYI.

[cooksdelight]

Ryan talking about his dead grandmother and the watches reminded me of all the Chopped contestants who trot out the dead grandmother/father/mother/pony stories to garner sympathy.

[Lady Dee]

So, it's not an APA accredited school.    Why does this not surprise me? 

 

 

 

Standing by my feeling that Ryan won the watch.  And as Jessica said, he was lying about wearing the new watch she gave him to replace it.   I saw him move his hands down so no one could see the watch.  Who lies about wearing a watch?   

 

Not all schools have APA accreditation and its not required as long as the school as a whole is accredited by the governing body in which it is located.

[ZaldamoWilder]

Even when it was happening, I was so sure that Ryan R. was only caving into pressure by the experts to give it another chance with Jaclyn.  I doubt he has any intentions of doing that.  That poor girl is handling it very well.  I don't think I would have handled it as well as she did.  I think Jac is a class act and Ryan R. is a real jerk.  It was pearls before swine.  Jaclyn isn't too much for him, he's not enough for a real woman, IMHO.

 

After the episode where she jumps on his back, I expressed nearly the exact same sentiment.  Actually I think the words I used were, there's no such thing as too much woman, there's only the punkasses who aren't equipped to handle em.  Which was followed by an advocates for introverts discussion.   I stand by that he might be an introvert, but that wasn't his problem in this relationship.  Here, mainly he's a punkass.

 

 

Also - at one point the "experts" mentioned that 7,000 people applied for this season!  And these 3 boys are the best you could get?

 

Lol. It sounds like a lot.  Now subtract the applicants that weren't in the NYC tristate area, subtract those who lied about their ages, subtract everybody who didn't know the difference between single and never having been married.  Of this group, delete the applicants who off the top will not compromise, of the remaining, subtract those who will not translate to television and/or do not meet the physical standards for this to even be feasible.   And yeah, you've got like 80 people to choose from.   Match.com works on this same model btw, lol!

 

As a rule, I try to recognize the possibility of different interpretations of a person's actions, in order to preserve my faith in humanity in,the midst of depravity and squalor. So, here's what: Maybe Sean entered this show on a fraudulent foundation. His motives were underhanded and selfish. Okay. But maybe once he recognized that Davina was sincere and not a fellow poseur, his dormant decency gene came through. Maybe he said I cant sleep with this chick! Shes buying into this farce! Yeah Im a prick, but even I have my limits. I'll look like a weak ass, but I'll know the truth.

 

I don't have anything to add to this, I just thought it was a yummy sentence and I wanna save it for posterity.

 

Reflecting a little more on the Reunion...

Davina continues to get criticized (across the net) for the failure between her and Sean. Her "inability to compromise" on their living situation seems a huge problem for so many viewers. I blame Cilona for that particular, unfair backlash.

From the beginning, Davina's dealbreaker was clear. She would not leave Manhattan. Yet, after Sean agreed to relocate, then reneged, Cilona decided to berate Davina. Well she never specified it had to be the Upper East Side, Cilona griped after the fact. Why not the Upper West Side? Sean could have handled the NY/NJ commute from the UWS!

And Cilona was all over social media with that kind of shaming of Davina. Unfair and unjust. Because the commute was the least of Sean's problems with Davina.

Did the experts hear Jaclyn tonight? She said she was willing to do ANY compromise for Ryan. Half a week in NJ, half a week on LI. Alternating weeks or alternating weekends. But Ryan wasnt interested. He's not in love with Jaclyn, nor sexually compatible.

That has to be hurtful to Jaclyn, but she knows it's better to know the truth now, rather than later.

Unlike Sean who continues the charade that the commute and energy and noise of the city are what killed the romance and desire. Oh, yeah, and Davina's inability to be his "caretaker"? Tonight he said, "...and I'll never forget it, when she said to me, 'I am not going to be your caretaker.'" He was shocked by her callousness. Shocked. Is that what he really wanted from a wife?

I say, good for Davina, good for knowing what she wants and what she doesnt want. And, good for Davina standing up for herself in the face of the ugly onslaught of accusations by Levkoff and Cilona.

BTW, how DOES Sean survive the chaotic, frenetic, loud, glaringly-lit, smelly, screaming Hades that is the average City ER? He is such a delicate snowflake; he chose an odd profession for himself.

 

In my limited experience, what I've been shocked and amazed to find out is that most men (the ones I've met) want this.  Stated or not.  It is the impetus for verbal bullshit like:  you don't cook (like my mommy did/does for me); you don't clean (the way my mommy did/does for me).  People who are perfectly capable, self sufficient human beings in all other respects actually maintain this as a standard by which to judge the *wifeability* of single women.  I don't just mean mamas boys nor am I referring exclusively to my own experience.  They don't just want partners, they want to be nurtured.  I'm just gone leave that right there.

 

I know ya'll really mean this in an analytical, accountability way but I feel like I need to say this because it's really start to work my nerves: words/phrases like what Jessica did to "trigger" or "instigate" Ryan subconsciously (or maybe not) place the blame for his temper on her shoulders.  They're shitty to each other, I can acknowledge that, but the language around what a woman does to "bring him to that place"  please, no.

[rulesoftravel]

I think next season the show should pair up the experts and force them to live with a stranger.      Or maybe "Christian Grey" Sean can be paired with Logan.  

[suzeecat]

Jessica destroyed something that could not be replaced. even if the exact same watch was available - the new watch still would not have belonged to Ryan's grandfather.

I don't believe the watch she smashed was from his grandparents.  I think Ryan just said it was from his grandparents to make it look even worse.

[Stinamaia]

So, it's not an APA accredited school.    Why does this not surprise me? 

 

 

 

Standing by my feeling that Ryan won the watch.  And as Jessica said, he was lying about wearing the new watch she gave him to replace it.   I saw him move his hands down so no one could see the watch.  Who lies about wearing a watch?   

Argosy has around 19 locations around the country.   Is it possible that some are accredited and some are not?  

 

I'm very cynical about these pay for play schools.  (probably I'm as snobbish as Davina!)  My experience is with grads from others similar schools though and not Argosy.  One man who got a masters quite literally could not read without moving his lips.  I mean really.  He moved his lips when he read. He told me his wife had done all his course work for him.  But that said, I've known graduates from Harvard Law School who made me roll my eyes.  I've also known some brilliant Harvard Law School grads.    More brilliant ones, fortunately.  :)

[Liberty]

When I heard the words "Me and Jaclyn.." and "Divorce is not in my vocabulary"  I felt strangely comforted.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Liberty

[Stinamaia]

Not all schools have APA accreditation and its not required as long as the school as a whole is accredited by the governing body in which it is located.

But wouldn't you agree that it is unethical to mislead students about accreditation when there is none?

[SaucyMommy]

Argosy has around 19 locations around the country. Is it possible that some are accredited and some are not?

I'm very cynical about these pay for play schools. (probably I'm as snobbish as Davina!) My experience is with grads from others similar schools though and not Argosy. One man who got a masters quite literally could not read without moving his lips. I mean really. He moved his lips when he read. He told me his wife had done all his course work for him. But that said, I've known graduates from Harvard Law School who made me roll my eyes. I've also known some brilliant Harvard Law School grads. More brilliant ones, fortunately. :)

I think academia is snobby in general. I work I. Higher education for an online school and we have an amazing reputation. Not every school is APA accredited and it's not required for a psychologist to become licensed. I have never heard argosy having a bad rep and I know many schools that do. I think too many paint with a broad brush. Many school are elite and only offer their programs to ones that test the best. That's not always an indicator of success in a field.

[MsPH]

I totally agree with myself that the experts failed everyone.   Rush job-bad results.  Unprofessional.

 

 

ITA. When at least two of the men have serious issues they were well aware of BEFORE marrying them off to a stranger, then there is absolutely no excuse for doing it. Two couples also had a major location issue that the experts totally brushed off and basically blamed the couples themselves for. It's no wonder Sean and Davina barely spent time together! They should've known they were setting them up for failure, but they were way too blinded by their power. They thought they were playing God by finding these people's soulmates, so any practicalities be damned. That's not how it works. You may be a good fit and never find that out because you're too busy worrying about all the practical stuff. You need to be in love first to overcome obstacles, not try to fall in love while overcoming them.

[seasick]

Dr. Logan to Sean  "you never had any intention of moving out of your comfort zone.  I mean you went back to your apartment every night."

 

Dr. Pepper to Sean:  "HE stopped being emotionally accessible and then HE didn't try anymore". 

 

(I want to keep in mind that Levkoff and Schwartz did call out Sean specifically on his lack of commitment... which surprised me..esp. from Levkoff.  I want to be fair and acknowledge when they pointedly address that issue and not appear biased toward Sean.)

 

But then! ....  Dr. Levkoff: to both:  .10 days out of 42...It strikes me that the work wasn't there for both people and that the experiment didn't fail, they failed the experiment because the time wasn't put in."

 

Now I saw Davina bristle at this..and hell yeah!    WHAT was SHE supposed to do?  Why go back to blaming them BOTH for THEIR lack of work  and THEIR lack of time put in when it was SEAN who wasn't there??  

This is where I get frustrated with the experts. .

 

I'm writing this in between doing other things and since I brought up Reply there has been about 55 new posts!!  Wow!   anxious to read them all and apologies if my comments are redundant.   

 

I have SO much more to comment on but I have to do it small doses!   I'd be here all day!  Many of you probably reflect my feelings to a tee anyway.. so I look forward to reading

[rulesoftravel]

"Me and Jaclyn...are not together."    Oh Ryan.    Seriously. 

 

I'm still in awe over how Poor Anxious Sean made all the experts who were so upset with him for not staying in the apt with Davina still find a way to blame Davina.    I equated the picture falling twice when Sean told his sad little lies with the growing nose of Pinocchio.

Edited June 17, 2015 by rulesoftravel

[zxy556575]

It seems to me that the location decision for Sean/Davina was a straw man argument. They both knew when they got back from the honeymoon that their match was a horrible mistake and neither was then willing to put themselves out to compromise in any way for someone they basically didn't even like.

[Primetimer]

Married At First Sight: Six Months Later reunites the world's three most poorly matched couples for some good old-fashioned bickering! Should you bother watching?

Read the story

[Liberty]

Wonderfully well written.