S01.E14: The Night Lila Died / S01.E15: It's All My Fault

[darkestboy]

That was an interesting finale. I decided to watch them on seperate days but I loved both episodes.

 

Okay, I didn't love the Connor/Oliver storyline, felt a bit cliched but other than that, I do hope thety're still together next season nonetheless.

 

Nate's lawyer is clearly going to be an importan guest star next season. I hope they bag someone from Orange Is The New Black for that role to be honest.

 

Frank being Lila's killer was a satisfying enough twist. Actually felt bad for Lila in the second half of the episode to be honest. Sam was such a prick at the end of it all.

 

Rebecca brought the gang turning on herself as well. If she had just been honest with them from the start, it would've actually saved a lot of time really.

 

Michaela had a brilliant scene with her could've been mother in law. I really liked her in that moment. Laurel being the one to have been keeping her ring was another good twist to be honest.

 

So everyone found out about Asher/Bonnie and Wes's childhood in this as well too.

 

Rebecca's death will be a good driving force for the first half of the next season, 9/10

[Rustybones]

I wonder if the writers even know who will be responsible for killing Rebecca at this point.  They have all summer to work on it.

[LeGrandElephant]

Alcohol is a drug, and if a girl is underage, it's an illegal drug. If she chooses to consume alcohol and someone laces it with a roofie, does that make it her fault? (Spoiler alert: no, that's called victim-blaming). That's a perfectly on point analogy with Rudy knowingly taking one illegal drug that he was told would have a mild and reasonable effect ("help him relax"), and Rebecca purposely and with malicious intent lacing it with another drug that she knew would seriously and permanently harm him. He's only guilty of being too trusting; she's guilty of purposely, maliciously, selfishly harming him and not doing anything to help him after the fact (like telling his grandmother or telling the hospital what he took).

[rudystx01]

"

Who knows what he told Frank, or if Frank was uncharacteristically sloppy. "

 

 

 

 

Frank has been sloppy in the past. Nate caught him planting evidence in a previous episode.

[NewRadical]

Alcohol is a drug, and if a girl is underage, it's an illegal drug. If she chooses to consume alcohol and someone laces it with a roofie, does that make it her fault? (Spoiler alert: no, that's called victim-blaming). That's a perfectly on point analogy with Rudy knowingly taking one illegal drug that he was told would have a mild and reasonable effect ("help him relax"), and Rebecca purposely and with malicious intent lacing it with another drug that she knew would seriously and permanently harm him. He's only guilty of being too trusting; she's guilty of purposely, maliciously, selfishly harming him and not doing anything to help him after the fact (like telling his grandmother or telling the hospital what he took).

This is getting off topic, so this will be my last reply on this matter... the feminist inside me is making me respond.

Comparing an underage girl being roofed to grown ass man taking drugs of his on choice are very very different imo. Rebecca did not force him to take the drugs, nor did she make him smoke an amount so much that it would cause one to overdose. She never said this was a mild drug, she said it would help relax. He also implied that while he had not been high a lot, he had some experience. I would think after his first puff of purple x, he would notice a significant different between that and marijuana.

Again, I am not saying Rebecca is without blame but that if you are an adult and you chose to take drugs, don't ask what kind of drugs or make any further inquires, then proceed to smoke enough that you have a complete mental collapse, you are not blameless. Where as roofing someone is never the victims fault. When someone drinks alcohol there is not a presumption that there is drugs in it, but when you take drugs, random drugs from a drug dealer without inquiring as to what the drugs is or even having an relationship with said dealer, then there is a presumption that, that is dangerous and can result in OD's.

 

[LeGrandElephant]

Minor points to get out of the way: First, "Underage" with respect to alcohol means under 21, and an 18-21 year old is still a "grown ass adult"). Second, There's no indication he knew it was messing with him and kept on smoking. Seems like whatever she gave him originally did the trick.

 

More importantly, if you purposely drug someone by lying to them about what they're taking with the express intent of seriously harming them, you are very very guilty. If you believe a friendly acquaintance that they're giving you a low key drug that will have a relaxant effect and they actually give you something else that harms you, you were naive and overly trusting. How are these things even remotely comparable? 

 

I don't even think "drugging" him is the right word here. The level of harm that was inflicted, ON PURPOSE, is really more like poisoning him. If he accepted a mysterious "herbal tea" from her and it turned out she purposely put hemlock or deadly nightshade in it, would we be blaming him? 

 

This isn't like she sold him some drugs without realizing that they had rat poison in them, or she didn't bother to check if they would interact with his other meds, or anything like that. The situation is that she, completely on purpose and for selfish gain, chose to drug/poison him to a level that would completely destroy his life. And then after she saw the effects firsthand, she continuously chose not to do anything to help him. 

[NewRadical]

Yeah, I am Canadian. I always think of the drinking age as `18, so sorry for that confusion. Regardless, the average law student is like 25-26 (at least in Canada), which is really old enough to know better..

He took drugs. She said they were drugs. It's not as if she gave him something that she claimed to be not drugs like tea. As a human adult person he should have some knowledge that drugs are dangerous, especially in excess. She knew the drug she gave him could be dangerous if he took too much but there is no indication she forced him to take drugs. He should have asked what she was giving him.

But I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

[Nanrad]

NewRadical, well, drugs is a very broad terms. But, the problem isn't that he took drugs, the problem is that the drug that drove Rudy insane wasn't the one he believed he was smoking. She knew that the drug that she gave him was potentially dangerous and never volunteered that information, which puts most of the blame on her. Because of her intent and their conversation, it's irrelevant if she forced him to since she mislead him about what he was taking. It'd be one thing for him to overdose on the drug he thought he was taking and another to have a laced drug that Rebecca knew could have very dangerous side effects. Him not asking if there was anything else or what the specific drug was doesn't absolve her of blame. 

[JenE4]

I finally watched the episode. I'm surprised that in all 6 pages of comments, not a single person had the same take as I did on Lila's murder. I don't think Frank killed Lila. I think it's still either Rebecca or Sam, but we don't know which. Earlier in the episode, Analiese was giving one of her patented speeches about how the only way you can get through this job as a defense attorney without a guilty conscience is to make up your own version of the truth and keep telling yourself that until you believe it. And at the end of the episode, she was saying the same thing to Wes, you NEED to believe that Rebecca did NOT do it. She was stroking his head and repeating over and over--and having Wes repeat over and over--Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila... So I assumed that that wasn't what actually happened but rather the story that Wes and Analiese convinced themselves to believe. Frank was also very hurt that Laurel thought that he would kill Rebecca. And Frank, in reference to Rebecca being killed, "You think I'm that guy?" implying "You think that I would actually kill someone?!" Analiese said the same thing back to Frank about Rebecca. These two don't keep secrets from each other, so I believe that Analiese knows that Frank has NEVER killed anyone--and never would. However, she also knows that the Scoobies are a little scared of Frank and THEY think he might be capable of it. So, Analiese doesn't want to believe that Sam killed Lila, Wes doesn't want to believe that Rebecca killed Lila, so let's just convince ourselves that our version of the truth to accept this and move on is that it was Frank.

 

But, who killed Rebecca? I think it was Wes. They showed him standing in the basement with the cut duct tape on the floor and an empty chair, which implied that he let Rebecca go. He had also been blaming himself this entire episode and realized he ot ALL of them in this mess over Rebecca. Analiese and I think even other characers questioned Wes, "Are you a man?" and "Be a man!" As if he needed to "man up" and do something about this predicament he got them in. He also was in the throes of a bit of a nervous breakdown crying in Analiese's lap. That looked like someone who just killed his girlfriend to me. However, I will acknowledge that it's almost TOO obvious that all signs point to Wes.

 

Eggs 911. Is EGGS an acronym? I'm at a loss ot what it stands for, though,. I'm just picturing the local supermarket delivery service showing up with a carton, "Does someone have an egg emergency?! That will be $3.50, please." But, I presume "Eggs" will show up in the season premeire looking for Rebecca.

[truthaboutluv]

She was stroking his head and repeating over and over--and having Wes repeat over and over--Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila...

 

 

She was making him repeat that Sam killed Lila, not Frank and this was juxtaposed with the flashback of Frank strangling Lila. I think the point was to show that while Annalise was forcing Wes and maybe even herself to believe it was Sam because they had to, the real evil was still there in the house in the form of Frank.

[JenE4]

She was making him repeat that Sam killed Lila, not Frank and this was juxtaposed with the flashback of Frank strangling Lila. I think the point was to show that while Annalise was forcing Wes and maybe even herself to believe it was Sam because they had to, the real evil was still there in the house in the form of Frank.

Well, that explains why no one else thought that! Lol. I guess my brain couldn't comprehend seeing Frank but hearing Sam.

[Rustybones]

She was making him repeat that Sam killed Lila, not Frank and this was juxtaposed with the flashback of Frank strangling Lila. I think the point was to show that while Annalise was forcing Wes and maybe even herself to believe it was Sam because they had to, the real evil was still there in the house in the form of Frank.

 

I also think Wes killed Rebecca.

 

Annalise can stroke his head and carress Wes all she wants to try to make him believe Frank was the evil one.  She sure as hell can't blame Frank for Sam's murder.

[jhlipton]

Here's my take on the Rudy situation: 

 

Rebecca came home and saw that Rudy noticed she was wet (because she didn't bother to dry off anywhere on the way home) and rather than either ignore him or say she was at a pool or whatever, she enticed him to smoke some pot to relax). A dumb-ass college male has the hot chick next door notice him for the first time and actually be nice -- he's in her room in a hot flash.  She goes and doses the pot with PCP (which will make him anything but relaxed) and a drug she knows little or nothing about.  She could easily have killed him and did far worse.

 

I fail to see how any of this is Rudy's fault, and how Rebecca (who never showed a bit of remorse for anything she's done) is anything but scum.  

[helenamonster]

I wonder if the writers even know who will be responsible for killing Rebecca at this point.  They have all summer to work on it.

 

They've admitted multiple times to writing by the seat of their pants, so I doubt it.

 

I go back and forth on whether or not I'm down with this method of writing a show. On one hand, yeah, it makes speculation pointless the people writing the episodes have about as much of an idea as to where anything is going while they're writing them as we do when we're watching them. On the other hand, plenty of shows operate by planning out a whole season and still can't deliver that satisfying of a story. Also, I feel like "writing as you go" actually makes it easier to avoid continuity errors. Sometimes, with big master plans, you need to retcon stuff to make your new shiny idea work. With this method, it seems that they frequently go back to episodes to see what things they can expand upon. I don't think there have been any glaring continuity errors as of yet (although anyone who wants to point some out, go right ahead), and most of the twists have been satisfying, at least for me. So for now, I'm reserving judgment. This whole thing might actually work out.

 

I finally watched the episode. I'm surprised that in all 6 pages of comments, not a single person had the same take as I did on Lila's murder. I don't think Frank killed Lila. I think it's still either Rebecca or Sam, but we don't know which. Earlier in the episode, Analiese was giving one of her patented speeches about how the only way you can get through this job as a defense attorney without a guilty conscience is to make up your own version of the truth and keep telling yourself that until you believe it. And at the end of the episode, she was saying the same thing to Wes, you NEED to believe that Rebecca did NOT do it. She was stroking his head and repeating over and over--and having Wes repeat over and over--Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila, Frank killed Lila... So I assumed that that wasn't what actually happened but rather the story that Wes and Analiese convinced themselves to believe. Frank was also very hurt that Laurel thought that he would kill Rebecca. And Frank, in reference to Rebecca being killed, "You think I'm that guy?" implying "You think that I would actually kill someone?!" Analiese said the same thing back to Frank about Rebecca. These two don't keep secrets from each other, so I believe that Analiese knows that Frank has NEVER killed anyone--and never would. However, she also knows that the Scoobies are a little scared of Frank and THEY think he might be capable of it. So, Analiese doesn't want to believe that Sam killed Lila, Wes doesn't want to believe that Rebecca killed Lila, so let's just convince ourselves that our version of the truth to accept this and move on is that it was Frank.

 

But we saw Frank choking Lila until she was dead. This show hasn't shown us anything that hasn't actually happened. Yes, sometimes they'll flash back to a scene and show it from a different perspective or kind of widen the frame of reference, but it's the kind of show where what we see is what happened. Also, Peter Nowalk and Viola have confirmed that Frank killed Lila on Sam's orders, that part of the mystery is solved and done with. Now it's about what Sam had on Frank that persuaded him to do it, and who killed Rebecca.

 

Still wondering what EGGS911 could lead to. The "EGGS" part would have been Rebecca's way of identifying who she was to whoever she was texting, and "911" obviously means an emergency. On another Sopranos-related note, eggs were kind of the unofficial food of death on that show, like oranges in The Godfather (though I think the latter was intentional). Idk if the writers were taking from that as a clue that Rebecca was about to bite it or what, but it's an interesting coincidence.

[secnarf]

Hmm so apparently eggs is slang for heroin (according to a google search?)
We can't really tell how Rebecca died. I think how she died is really important to trying to figure out who killed her. For all we know, she had someone bring heroin to Annalise's house and then purposely OD'd.

[Happytobehere]

Frank has been sloppy in the past. Nate caught him planting evidence in a previous episode.

I have often wondered if that was a mistake or part of a greater plan. I found it interesting that Annalise did not confront Frank about it. Since Nate told her what he knew, the lack of addressing it with Frank always stood out to me.

[ribboninthesky1]

This probably doesn't count as a continuity error so much as "flying by the seat of your pants for a gotcha" writing, but I don't remember Sam and Frank even having a conversation about the weather this season. Yet, in the last 5 minutes of the finale, we find out:

 

1. not only have they talked, not only do they know each other beyond "Annalise's husband" and "Annalise's fixer," they have some kind of relationship where Sam did a huge favor for Frank, and opted to cash in on the IOU,
2. AND they have discussed, at least once if not multiple times, what to do about Lila if things got out of hand.

 

What? Why not just make Sam the direct murderer, and be done with it?  To me, the point of using "in media res" as a narrative device is that, when past and present come together, everything that the audience has seen beforehand, from scene 1, should make sense, even if it was a detail we missed earlier.   And as others have mentioned, Frank was shown being demonstrably sloppy when Nate saw him planting/removing evidence (don't remember which).  Yet this dude slipped onto the popular roof of a busy sorority house without being seen 5 minutes after Sam's call, murdered a girl, had plenty of time to drag the dead body up the ladder into the water tank, didn't notice the dropped phone when he came back down the ladder (because hitmen can't be bothered to ensure no evidence is left behind?), and left undetected.         

 

And given all we know about Sam's involvement the night of the murder, I don't remember Sam being questioned by the police.  It would be one thing if Sam and Lila's final moments were off in a secluded area, but how would Sam have managed to sneak by everyone when he went to see Lila?  Yet Rebecca, in the dark outside the house, is remembered by some boy who wasn't even paying much attention? 

 

There are some other things during the season that felt off to me as well, but the above immediately stuck out to me in this episode.   

Edited March 3, 2015 by ribboninthesky1

[truthaboutluv]

And given all we know about Sam's involvement the night of the murder, I don't remember Sam being questioned by the police.

 

 

The understanding was that no one knew Sam was the guy Lila was sleeping with so the police would have no reason to question him. He was one of her professors but let's face it, she probably had multiple professors. Rebecca who hung out with Lila didn't know Sam was the guy she was sleeping with until she saw the wallpaper at their house. She knew Lila was seeing an older married professor but she never told Rebecca his name.

 

As for Rebecca, I don't think she was arrested just on the baskeball player's eyewitness account because according to Wes, in the statement the guy actually ID'ed someone else because it was so dark he didn't really get a close look at Rebecca. My guess is, what got Rebecca initially arrested is that others at the frat house probably knew about her and Griffin hooking up and heard Lila catching them and the fight they had which was all the same night Lila died. So theoretically they were last people to see Lila alive and she was angry at them. That's why they were both arrested for Lila's murder.

[ribboninthesky1]

The understanding was that no one knew Sam was the guy Lila was sleeping with so the police would have no reason to question him. He was one of her professors but let's face it, she probably had multiple professors. Rebecca who hung out with Lila didn't know Sam was the guy she was sleeping with until she saw the wallpaper at their house. She knew Lila was seeing an older married professor but she never told Rebecca his name.

 

I remember that part.  My point is that Sam was at the house, for however long, that night as well. I brought Rebecca up not because I believe that was what got her arrested, but as a reminder that the cops questioned people who had little or nothing to do with anything beyond being at the house around the time of the murder.  So no one saw Sam and recognized him? As a professor on the campus? No one at all? Because there is little reason for a middle-aged professor to be in or around a sorority house at 1:30 am.   

[truthaboutluv]

Yeah well that's one of the contrivances most pointed out - that both Sam and Frank ended up on that roof that night and no one saw them is ridiculous.

[kikaha]

Sam had Frank do his dirty work because Frank IS a hitman.  (Among other things.)  Sam was just a psychology professor (who preys on impressionable female students). 

 

The circumstances of Lila's death were absurd, of course.  The fact that they killed her up there, that same night Sam visited her, in a public place (the roof of her home), that was crawling with people and activity, strains all logic.  For that matter, Sam trying to kill Rebecca, when he was severely injured and surrounded by enemies, was absurd.  So were many cases of the week. 

 

But I still enjoyed the twists and turns, and am pretty eager to see what comes up next season. 

[PrincessTT]

This probably doesn't count as a continuity error so much as "flying by the seat of your pants for a gotcha" writing, but I don't remember Sam and Frank even having a conversation about the weather this season. Yet, in the last 5 minutes of the finale, we find out:

 

1. not only have they talked, not only do they know each other beyond "Annalise's husband" and "Annalise's fixer," they have some kind of relationship where Sam did a huge favor for Frank, and opted to cash in on the IOU,
2. AND they have discussed, at least once if not multiple times, what to do about Lila if things got out of hand.

 

This was sort of addressed in the interview with Peter Nowalk that someone linked to earlier. 

 

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/02/26/how-get-away-murder-boss-killer-finale-and-whats-next

[WalrusGirl]

Hmm so apparently eggs is slang for heroin (according to a google search?)

We can't really tell how Rebecca died. I think how she died is really important to trying to figure out who killed her. For all we know, she had someone bring heroin to Annalise's house and then purposely OD'd.

Interesting re EGGS, but for what it's worth, that really didn't look like a heroin OD. Plus, one would think that if she had someone sneak in, she'd have them release her then flee, not hang around and get high while pondering what to do next. I think the text is how someone will first notice she's missing.

(I guess Asher will notice, but he could be put off with "she's cray cray after all, she and Wes broke up and she split" - everyone but Annalise, Frank, and whoever actually killed her (if not Frank) will even think they're telling the truth, albeit a sanitized, kidnapping-free truth.)

[discoprincess]

Frank has been sloppy in the past. Nate caught him planting evidence in a previous episode.

 

Did Frank wear gloves while strangling Lila? I don't remember. 

Yeah well that's one of the contrivances most pointed out - that both Sam and Frank ended up on that roof that night and no one saw them is ridiculous.

Frank is known for sleeping with students - well, at least law students. Maybe he has been known to dip into the dating pool of undergraduate students as well. (Yeah, it may be a stretch, but that may explain why, if Frank was spotted at the sorority house, his presence wasn't deemed to be out of the ordinary.) 

 

ETA: I noticed that even though they spoke of a "Spruce Road", there was a glimpse of a street sign that said "Spruce Street" (the name of an actual street in Philly).

Edited March 3, 2015 by discoprincess

[St. Claire]

Did Frank wear gloves while strangling Lila? I don't remember.

 

He did. the reveal started with the gloved hands strangling her, then panned up to his face.

[helenamonster]

Did Frank wear gloves while strangling Lila? I don't remember. 

Frank is known for sleeping with students - well, at least law students. Maybe he has been known to dip into the dating pool of undergraduate students as well. (Yeah, it may be a stretch, but that may explain why, if Frank was spotted at the sorority house, his presence wasn't deemed to be out of the ordinary.) 

 

ETA: I noticed that even though they spoke of a "Spruce Road", there was a glimpse of a street sign that said "Spruce Street" (the name of an actual street in Philly).

 

Yep, Frank was wearing gloves.

 

You know, I just realized that both Frank and Sam had/have a history of sleeping with students. Maybe that's how they bonded.

 

And yes, Philadelphia is, I think, all "Streets," no "Roads." And many of them are named after trees, per the original plan of William Penn, who wanted numbered streets traversing north and south and tree-named streets traversing east to west. Besides Spruce, there's also Vine, Cherry, Chestnut, Walnut, Locust, Pine...Race Street used to be Sassafras Street, Arch Street used to be Mulberry Street, and South Street used to be Cedar Street. The show didn't really do too much research on the city. I remember from one of the earlier episodes that someone noticed a Wawa in the background. Wawa is a popular chain of convenience stores in that area, but there was a sign on the building that advertised selling liquor, indicating that they just took a California convenience store and put a Wawa sign on it. In Pennsylvania, liquor can only be sold in state stores.

 

It's too bad they don't shoot more of the show on-location in Philly, though I can understand that it's easier to just work in Los Angeles. However, Philly is a super-fascinating city with some really wonderful architecture and history. I didn't appreciate how cool it was until I left. I do like that they superimposed the skyline so that it looks like it can be seen from the roof of the sorority house. It's not the most famous or impressive skyline (I don't think they were even allowed to have one until the '80s; originally, I believe it was illegal to build any structure taller than William Penn's hat on top of city hall), but it makes me a little homesick any time they show it.

[kikaha]

What damaging or incriminating information can the new prosecutor get from Asher?  One risky area is his relationship with Bonnie.  While I think Bonnie is completely devoted to Annalise, she could unintentionally let something slip.  If Asher actively works with the prosecutor, he could even try to mine her for info.   

 

I also wonder about the time frame when season two starts.  Will another school year have started?  If so, will new students make up the Keating 5?  If not, it would look even more suspicious to the prosecutor.  If so, then without the constant work and contact with each other, this year's Keating 5 could easily fracture. 

[rubyred]

What damaging or incriminating information can the new prosecutor get from Asher?  

Good question. I think all he can contribute is that he saw Connor's car at Annalise's the night he went there to confront Michaela about stealing the trophy. He thought they were there but he never saw anyone so that's not proof just conjecture,; and he later saw their (alibi) bonfire pics, which would seem to confirm their own recountings of the night. After that he was distracted by Bonnie's booty call. Just not sure what thread that prosecutor can pull that will unravel the alibis of the Keating 4.

[nara]

What damaging or incriminating information can the new prosecutor get from Asher?  One risky area is his relationship with Bonnie.  While I think Bonnie is completely devoted to Annalise, she could unintentionally let something slip.  If Asher actively works with the prosecutor, he could even try to mine her for info.   

As someone mentioned above, Asher is clearly different from the others in that he isn't scared to death of something, so Prosecutor is separating him from the herd.  Or, as the son of someone important, he might be considered to have "the most to lose" and therefore the most amenable to working with the prosecutor for a deal. 

 

Asher can talk about what he saw when he arrived at the house the night Sam was killed.  He might remember more details when questioned.  Also, he can attest to the fact that the trophy that was stolen from him was intact and is now broken, which could lead to the weapon that killed Sam.  I do like the idea of Asher having a bigger role.  I'm hoping that he doesn't get corrupted, but I wouldn't put money on it.

[Chicago Redshirt]

Asher could attest to the following:

-On the last date anyone saw Sam alive, he had the trophy stolen from him. He went to Anna's house at X p.m. He saw Connor's car in the driveway of the house. He was convinced that several of his fellow clerks were there. Eventually he left. 

-On the last date that Sam was seen alive, there was a bonfire that the school was holding. He wanted to go with the rest of the clerks, but they all said they didn't want to. Then they apparently went anyway.

-Somehow the trophy got back to Anna's house

-His fellow clerks have been behaving strangely since the last date Sam was seen: seemingly very nervous, and specifically excluding him from discussions.

-Anna has been acting unlike he knew her in the wake of the discovery of Sam's death, including completely being unavailable to handle a trial.

 

None of those pieces on their own are very incriminating, but they could give Prosecutor places to look and threads to pull on. 

 

Prosecutor's questions might also turn a light on in Asher's head and get him to ask questions of AK, Bonnie, Frank and the Murder 4 that they don't want to answer.

 

Finally, if Prosecutor can manipulate him into keeping a spying eye on the rest of the crew, that's going to be trouble.

[kikaha]

Another question: does anyone know how much time is supposed to have passed during the first season?  A full school year?

[Chicago Redshirt]

I don't think it's a full school year. It seems more like a semester and a half. In other words, the time frame within the series seems to roughly have corresponded to the real world time-frame of starting in September and finishing up around now.

 

I don't know if I can point to any objective evidence within the series to confirm that the finale was supposed to be taking place in February/March, though.

Edited March 4, 2015 by Chicago Redshirt

[Chicago Redshirt]

I finally watched the episode. I'm surprised that in all 6 pages of comments, not a single person had the same take as I did on Lila's murder. I don't think Frank killed Lila. I think it's still either Rebecca or Sam, but we don't know which. 

 

We were shown Frank strangling Lila and dumping her body in the water tank. I don't think there's any getting around the idea that Frank was the one who actually carried out the killing of Lila. 

 

We also were shown that Rebecca discovered Lila's body in the water tank and was horrified.

 

Finally, we were shown that Sam called someone and basically called for that person to do what they had discussed because the person owed him. 

 

Unless the show is playing games with us big-time, it seems clear: Sam called Frank to have Lila killed, citing an unspecified debt of Frank's to Sam. Frank then carried out the killing. Rebecca soon made the unfortunate discovery of Lila's body and made a series of unfortunate decisions after that which had the effect of making her seem guilty of the murder and that had her turn a law student into a basket case (the latter not being such a hard task, I suppose).

[wanderingstar]

Prosecutor's questions might also turn a light on in Asher's head and get him to ask questions of AK, Bonnie, Frank and the Murder 4 that they don't want to answer.

Finally, if Prosecutor can manipulate him into keeping a spying eye on the rest of the crew, that's going to be trouble.

 

I've been thinking since the prosecutor showed up to Asher's door that some combination of the above would happen. Either Asher becomes suspicious of the K4 on his own and starts investigating, or the prosecutor sends him into action as a spy. They can't go another whole season with Asher completely out of the loop. The dilemma for Asher once he learns the truth about Sam's death will be whether to notify the authorities (thereby implicating Bonnie) or join the rest of them in their omerta.

Edited March 4, 2015 by Gillian Rosh

[helenamonster]

Noooo, I don't want Asher to become a rat. Bad things happen to rats on television, and I don't want his body to be the next one found under Annalise's basement stairs.

[tennisgurl]

I don`t think he would be a rat intentionally. I could see him accidentally implicating the murder 4 though...

 

I would really like to see what would happen if a prosecutor tried to get him to flip on the others. 

[Fredward]

There is NO WAY, in my mind at least, that Puppy could kill Rebecca. He is not that far gone yet. If it HAS to be one of the Keating 5 my money is also on Laurel. Or Frank for that matter, he clearly has no trouble lying with a straight face. OR. Possibly. The person she texted for help. Though I'm not sure what motive there would be.

[discoprincess]

There is NO WAY, in my mind at least, that Puppy could kill Rebecca. He is not that far gone yet. If it HAS to be one of the Keating 5 my money is also on Laurel. Or Frank for that matter, he clearly has no trouble lying with a straight face. OR. Possibly. The person she texted for help. Though I'm not sure what motive there would be.

Well, Rebecca was a drug dealer. If the authorities were to discover that Rebecca was murdered, Annalise can claim Rebecca's murder was drug related as a classic misdirect.

 

The show didn't really do too much research on the city. I remember from one of the earlier episodes that someone noticed a Wawa in the background. Wawa is a popular chain of convenience stores in that area, but there was a sign on the building that advertised selling liquor, indicating that they just took a California convenience store and put a Wawa sign on it. In Pennsylvania, liquor can only be sold in state stores.

It's too bad they don't shoot more of the show on-location in Philly, though I can understand that it's easier to just work in Los Angeles. However, Philly is a super-fascinating city with some really wonderful architecture and history. I didn't appreciate how cool it was until I left. I do like that they superimposed the skyline so that it looks like it can be seen from the roof of the sorority house. It's not the most famous or impressive skyline (I don't think they were even allowed to have one until the '80s; originally, I believe it was illegal to build any structure taller than William Penn's hat on top of city hall), but it makes me a little homesick any time they show it.

 

Yes, Pennsylvania has its Wine and Spirit Shoppes.

 

Liberty Place was the first structure to be taller than the William Penn statue on top of City Hall. I think the Comcast skyscraper is now the tallest building in Philly. As long as Middleton is not in Center City (I doubt it is), the skyline should be visible from the rooftops of various buildings on campus.

Edited March 4, 2015 by discoprincess

[discoprincess]

The show didn't really do too much research on the city. I remember from one of the earlier episodes that someone noticed a Wawa in the background. Wawa is a popular chain of convenience stores in that area, but there was a sign on the building that advertised selling liquor, indicating that they just took a California convenience store and put a Wawa sign on it. In Pennsylvania, liquor can only be sold in state stores.

 

It's too bad they don't shoot more of the show on-location in Philly, though I can understand that it's easier to just work in Los Angeles. However, Philly is a super-fascinating city with some really wonderful architecture and history. I didn't appreciate how cool it was until I left. I do like that they superimposed the skyline so that it looks like it can be seen from the roof of the sorority house. It's not the most famous or impressive skyline (I don't think they were even allowed to have one until the '80s; originally, I believe it was illegal to build any structure taller than William Penn's hat on top of city hall), but it makes me a little homesick any time they show it.

Yes, Pennsylvania has its Wine and Spirit Shoppes.

 

Liberty Place was the first structure to be taller than the William Penn statue on top of City Hall. I think the Comcast skyscraper is now the tallest building in Philly. As long as Middleton is not in Center City (I doubt it is), the skyline should be visible from the rooftops of various buildings on campus. 

[Chicago Redshirt]

I don`t think he would be a rat intentionally. I could see him accidentally implicating the murder 4 though...

 

I would really like to see what would happen if a prosecutor tried to get him to flip on the others. 

He ratted in a sense his own father, albeit with a guarantee that nothing bad happen to him. 

 

I can't see him having any problem ratting out the M4, with the possible exception of Connor since he thinks of them as bros.

 

There is NO WAY, in my mind at least, that Puppy could kill Rebecca. He is not that far gone yet. If it HAS to be one of the Keating 5 my money is also on Laurel. Or Frank for that matter, he clearly has no trouble lying with a straight face. OR. Possibly. The person she texted for help. Though I'm not sure what motive there would be.

I think the show has given enough evidence that "Puppy" is not a very good nickname for Wes. After all, Wes smacked a guy upside the head and killed him. He orchestrated a coverup, messy though it was. Besides Laurel, Wes has been able to hold things together the best.

 

And fueled by Rebecca not being who he idealized her as, as well as the threat she posed all of them, I could see Wes going to talk to Rebecca, getting some of her sass, and Wes just snapping.

[LeGrandElephant]

Rebecca told Wes about the terrible thing she did to Rudy, and Wes saw the effects for himself. I could see him using that to convince himself that it wasn't all that immoral to kill Rebecca. 

[Fredward]

I think the show has given enough evidence that "Puppy" is not a very good nickname for Wes. After all, Wes smacked a guy upside the head and killed him. He orchestrated a coverup, messy though it was. Besides Laurel, Wes has been able to hold things together the best.

 

And fueled by Rebecca not being who he idealized her as, as well as the threat she posed all of them, I could see Wes going to talk to Rebecca, getting some of her sass, and Wes just snapping.

 

Wes really didn't handle the Sam thing very well at all. If 'Caela and Connor fell apart on the outside and Laurel was just a ripple in an otherwise freakishly smooth pond Wes was the iceberg that exploded, but only the part that was under water. He only capsized later. Maybe not the smoothest metaphor. He almost immediatly starts questioning Rebecca and sort of almost subconsciously checks the water for whether what he did was 'right.' And I think that's the only reason he held it together as long as he did, the immediacy of the predicament and the very obvious way someone close to him was in danger was what allowed him to smash Sam's skull and the fact that he thought it was the morally 'correct' thing to do for both Rebecca AND Lila is what kept him together for as long as it did.

 

Killing Rebecca though? There's no other person that needs to be avenged, no injustice that should be righted. He has nowhere to displace or alleviate guilt/responsibility. Can't totally discount the snapping thing though. If he did kill her, which I honestly doubt, then it would be via snapping and not pre-meditated murder. Or otherwise, much like Jon Snow, I know nothing.

Edited March 5, 2015 by Fredward

[mikem]

I don't know if this has been brought up before, but has the show ever explained why a sorority house in the middle of Philadelphia would have a functioning water tank on the roof (that is, one that actually has water in it)?  I know the show is not big on realism, but it strikes me as an odd choice of a place to find the body.

[LeGrandElephant]

I'm also curious whether the water started tasting bad ... I mean how gross is that? They had a decomposing body floating in their water supply for how long? Weeks, months? I'm surprised they didn't all get sick from drinking that water. 

[cooksdelight]

If the sorority house is old, it might very well have a water tower. But yeah.....the water would be downright gnarly by the second or third day. I remember seeing Lila's body during the autopsy process and she looked worse than anything I've seen on The Walking Dead.

[ribboninthesky1]

If I recall correctly, Lila had been missing a few days to a week, and her body was found because the sorority house called a plumber due to the water.  So I imagine it was unpleasant, to say the least. 

[helenamonster]

Actually, what's weird--if I'm remembering correctly--is that none of the girls seemed to notice. For some reason, the scene from the pilot where the maintenance guy came to the sorority house has always stuck out to me. He knocked, said someone had called to report a problem with the water. The girl who answered the door asked if anyone had called maintenance, and no one responded (though there was music playing and all the other girls seemed distracted). Then she just gave him a careless "the water tank's on the roof" and that's when he went up and found Lila. I suspected then that none of the girls had been the one to call, and that it was actually Rebecca who had done so. Seeing as how Rebecca was the first one to find her, I think that could be entirely possible still. Though I'm not sure if it matters at this point.

[Ravenya003]

I'm extremely late to the party, but I've just finished marathoning the final handful of episodes and:

 

FRANK! You know I was totally surprised, and then almost instantly was NOT surprised. Of COURSE it was Frank. He's been right in our faces, all season long, doing questionable, shady shit. ALL season. He wasn't even hiding. The show didn't even try to pretend he wasn't compromised.

I didn't see that coming and as I look back at it now I have no idea why I didn't.

 

 

My reaction exactly. Why did I just assume he was a lawyer? He never did ANY lawyer-related stuff. We never saw him in the courtroom, or even doing bookwork! How did I not see that?! He just did all the shady stuff without question. 

 

These are the best kinds of twists: the ones that you never saw coming but which make perfect sense in hindsight. 

 

Tbh, this is one of those case's where I didn't care about the character until she was dead. Is there a name for that trope?

 

 

There is, actually! It's called Alas Poor Scrappy.

[helenamonster]

I'm extremely late to the party, but I've just finished marathoning the final handful of episodes and:

 

 

My reaction exactly. Why did I just assume he was a lawyer? He never did ANY lawyer-related stuff. We never saw him in the courtroom, or even doing bookwork! How did I not see that?! He just did all the shady stuff without question. 

 

These are the best kinds of twists: the ones that you never saw coming but which make perfect sense in hindsight. 

 

 

There is, actually! It's called Alas Poor Scrappy.

 

Actually, they mentioned pretty early on that Frank was definitely not a lawyer, though they weren't quite what exact purpose he served. The back half of the season really kind of confirmed that he's Annalise's (and Sam's, apparently) fixer.

 

And thank you for that! Yeah, I was mulling around on tvtropes recently for a paper I was writing and got distracted trying to find something that fit with how I feel about the Rebecca thing, and that is it perfectly! Although I wasn't necessarily upset about her death, it was just imagining the way it happened made my skin crawl). I'm just more interested in her as a character now that she's no longer among the living.

[wanderingstar]

I'm just more interested in her as a character now that she's no longer among the living.

 

I felt the same way about Rebecca when I re-watched the finale. I actually found it kind of ballsy that she tracked down that campus cop as a little insurance policy. And I get her mindset: she was used to fending for herself; she never really trusted any of the K4, except Wes - and even him she didn't trust enough to tell the whole truth of what happened with her the night Lila was murdered. 

 

I'll be curious to see how the Who Killed Rebecca story plays out in season 2. I'm guessing Katie Findlay will be back for flashbacks and such.