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S05.E16: First a Verdict, Then a Lawyer


maraleia
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It doesn't take much for Christine to get butt-hurt, does it?  As much as I can't stand Kody, I can only imagine how irritated he gets when she takes something he says and turns it into a massive slight, like the discussion about short vs. long courtships.  Of course, she's the one who takes the smallest criticism of the family and acts like it is the worst thing ever said.  Add to that, her fear of all the people in the "outside world" who are out to get them, and you've got a woman who is in dire need of some kind of therapy.

Unless I'm giving Christine too much credit or misreading it, I suspect Kody inferred he should have had more courtship time as wiggle room to back out. She

picked that up immediately.

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I thought I heard on the early episodes that it was Meri's idea to be polygamous. She was raised in it, seemed to have no objections to it & a strong proponent of it.

She introduced Janelle & Robyn to Kody, not sure about Christine. So it's puzzling to me all Meri's jealousy bouts. Clearly it's one of the missing puzzle pieces TLC

loves to torment viewers with. BTW, isn't booze supposed to be taboo for them, so why Meri's wet bar? To stash tissues for her crying jags, lol.

The wet bar is supposedly for "pastries", etc. hahaha. 

 

I don't think entering polygamy was solely Meri's idea. When she married Kody, they were both in that fundamentalist faith together. I suspect that if Kody decided against plural marriage after the two of them got married, she may not have objected. It was a matter of doing the right thing in her culture for Meri. And with Janelle coming into the picture, I got the sense from their talking heads and the book that it was more Janelle's idea to become part of the family; Meri may have introduced her to Kody, but that was probably unavoidable considering she was already Meri's ex-sister-in-law.  Christine seemed to help balance things out and I can see Meri welcoming that with how much she butted heads with Janelle. 

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I thought I heard on the early episodes that it was Meri's idea to be polygamous. She was raised in it, seemed to have no objections to it & a strong proponent of it.

She introduced Janelle & Robyn to Kody, not sure about Christine. So it's puzzling to me all Meri's jealousy bouts. Clearly it's one of the missing puzzle pieces TLC

loves to torment viewers with. BTW, isn't booze supposed to be taboo for them, so why Meri's wet bar? To stash tissues for her crying jags, lol.

I also think that Meri would have had to introduce Kody and Janelle as Janelle was her sister-in-law.  I'm pretty sure (as stated above) that Janelle did approach Kody about becoming his second wife and that the two of them had a few secret meetings about it before filling Meri in.

 

You know, now that I think about it... If Janelle was "family" to Meri (hahaha, I know), would she have known about Meri's infertility?  Could she have used that as a self-selling point to Kody while she was stabbing Meri in the back?  "You knooooww... I can have many babies... "

 

Idk. Just speculation.

Edited by AndreaF
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" You know, now that I think about it... If Janelle was "family" to Meri (hahaha, I know), would she have known about Meri's infertility?  Could she have used that as a self-selling point to Kody while she was stabbing Meri in the back?  "You knooooww... I can have many babies... "

 

Idk. Just speculation.

OK< that's entirely possible, but how could she know about her own fertility if she never tried to have a child?

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I think Kody knew Janelle anyway, since Janelle was married to Meri's brother at the time he was dating/married Meri.  In fact Janelle was at the wedding, and I think Janelle's mom married Kody's dad before Kody and Janelle got "married".   

 

My personal opinion is that Janelle pursued Kody, and Meri had to acquiesce since she had agreed to take on additional wives as a condition of getting "her man".  She has stated she never had a boyfriend or went on any dates before she met Kody. 

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OK< that's entirely possible, but how could she know about her own fertility if she never tried to have a child?

I don't want to too far afield here but depending on the cause, she could have known. PCOS, for example. I have a relative who has been told since she was a teen that she would have a hard time conceiving, and it's turned out to be true.

However, I note that my theory would have involved medical care for Meri during the lean years, so I concede your point!

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Here's my 2 ¢ about Janelle: she never was the wifey type. She tried it, didn't like it, but kids came along so fast that she was stuck. She seems to be the only

wife who really enjoys working & would go nuts being at home. Plus she's well aware she has no place to go with 6 kids.

    I wish she would get her own show, not even anything to do with plygs but maybe in the tradition of a meaner, bitchier  Delta Burke type, where she plays the straight character (for people who don't get the other meaning of this word, it means the serious one say in a comedy team)...

who is surrounded by various types of weirdos and clowns...oh wait.....lol

Edited by BlackWidow
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I think Kody knew Janelle anyway, since Janelle was married to Meri's brother at the time he was dating/married Meri.  In fact Janelle was at the wedding, and I think Janelle's mom married Kody's dad before Kody and Janelle got "married".   

 

My personal opinion is that Janelle pursued Kody, and Meri had to acquiesce since she had agreed to take on additional wives as a condition of getting "her man".  She has stated she never had a boyfriend or went on any dates before she met Kody. 

Completely concur. In fact, I think Meri approved of Janelle in part because she perceived Janelle as not being much competition to her. She and "Lover" had a lot of adventurous energy and, I'm sure, sexual energy. Janelle was heavier, lower energy, quiet, and (according to Kody) was a rather platonic match. Then came Christine, who was also a big girl--VERY apple-shaped on her wedding day, and probably an easy approval with Meri. But, oh, BUMMER...those big girls started shooting out Kody-babies one after the other, and being able to quit jobs and take off on business trips didn't make up for not having more children.

 

Janelle and Christine were added to the family so quickly, that Meri's infertility would not have had time to be identified in the beginning. Mariah is one of the older set of kids, so I'll bet all of them figured Meri would continue having right along with Janelle and Christine.

Edited by SometimesBites
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OK< that's entirely possible, but how could she know about her own fertility if she never tried to have a child?

Hmm.  I can only guess...  IF she knew about Meri's fertility problems, maybe she presented herself as a back-up womb?  :D

 

To me, it's so weird that Janelle approached Kody (and not Meri) about the marriage, that it seems like there HAS to be a reason she went about it that way. 

 

Some sneaky reason beyond merely wanting the Flamboyant Mr B, and beyond beyond the "ick factor" of being Meri's SIL. 

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Hmm.  I can only guess...  IF she knew about Meri's fertility problems, maybe she presented herself as a back-up womb?  :D

 

To me, it's so weird that Janelle approached Kody (and not Meri) about the marriage, that it seems like there HAS to be a reason she went about it that way. 

 

Some sneaky reason beyond merely wanting the Flamboyant Mr B, and beyond beyond the "ick factor" of being Meri's SIL. 

Sorry but I'm not convinced it was Janelle's idea, but I do think she needed no convincing. On an early episode, Meri said about Kody, " We both knew we'd be polygamous ". And don't forget with her love for Kody & desperate to provide him a baby, her reasons were strong to do so.

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Sorry but I'm not convinced it was Janelle's idea

Oh, that's fine!  lol!  I wasn't really trying to convince anyone about anything; indeed, that's why I love these boards -- one is free to maintain their own beliefs/opinions as they continue on their own (or don't) to research things that interest them!  :)

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Sorry but I'm not convinced it was Janelle's idea, but I do think she needed no convincing. On an early episode, Meri said about Kody, " We both knew we'd be polygamous ". And don't forget with her love for Kody & desperate to provide him a baby, her reasons were strong to do so.

                  

            Because they all knew each other, Meri saw Janelle's marriage to her brother going down the tubes, and she wasn't getting pregnant and thought, oh, here's someone who Kody won't like better than me, can probably have kids, and I can feel all do-gooder sisteriwives doin it for themselves 'empowerment' *  which will also have the effect of making my brother not seem to be a heel or guilty for it not working out if Janelle gets on board with us-

 

So Meri starts inviting Janelle over to hang out more acting all 'we'll take you under our wing hon'  or somehow orchestrating it that they are around Janelle more, Kody, knowing being part of the deal starts putting the moves on Janelle ..and Janelle's all, wow I'm getting attention - (not like whee I'm valuable breeding material!**)  and you gotta admit, ok she was a little chunky compared to Meri back then who was a stick, but she was cute enough in a kind of nerdy way and Janelle probably was cool to hang out with compared to Queen Meri and the constant 'hmm I don't know, AM I ok with the way you leave dishes overnight? I THINK NOT!' "things have to be perfect or I'm not OK"  something Meri said on the show . If they weren't some kind of Mormon, you could see Kody and Janelle 420ing and watching some silly movie with popcorn and laughing..can't really see that with Meri, who prob acted more like a comforting mommy figure to Kody.

 

Janelle was probably all 'this is way better than with my ex , this guy is giving me attention, and I guess being 4th or 5th- and thought Meri was Ok since all she had with Meri previously was being her sister-in-law and they got on well enough on that level.  Don't tell me you can't see how easily the scenario I just painted could have gone down.

 

I doubt it was so simple as "Oh I fell in love with this person, and then oh, I fell in love with this other person..." *** I call BS on that-I would bet there was way more planning and arrangement with the first three than we are being led to believe. If Janelle or Christine couldn't have had kids, I bet it wouldn't have happened- but in their world, they don't have the societal pressure of having to get 'real-world' married to find out if someone can have kids. Not sure what would have happened to either Chris or Janelle had that been the case. Probably they would have just gone away and we never would have heard of them.

 

 

*plyg manual chapter 1- when roping in a prospective wife, be NICE, but don't let them ever forget you are rescuing them- if single, from a life being alone or way down the plyg totem pole, or if leaving a marriage,  you have saved them from whatever else..the vibe is you like them, you think they are special and magical, but you are doing them a favor and they are soooo  lucky!

 

** plyg manual chapter 2, never  ever make second or 3, 4, etc feel like they are on board for more kids, make sure they feel all special and lay on the celestial 'it was meant to be' 'destiny' 'it's in the stars babe' stuff thickly.

 

*** plyg manual chapter whatever- also see chapt 2, besides the zillions of kids reason, never make them feel like they are on board because of anything practical- their dad holds power in the church, they have a good job, you want all your kids to have that color eyes,  whatever, even if these things are true. Stay with the magical, lovey-dovey stuff. It may not be true, but it makes the chicks happy, and if mama(s) ain't happy, ain't nobody happy...

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In their book, Janelle says that the first time she ever saw Kody, it was like a bolt of lightning (or something similar) and she knew that she was in love with him, even though she was pretty sure that he didn't notice or remember her.  To me, it would seem that the beginning of their "love affair" began strictly with her, as Kody was too wrapped up in Meri, who was his "soul mate" (he uses this term to describe her many times in the book). 

 

Janelle also says that later, after having seen Kody around at various functions (family functions, maybe?), then she and Kody started to become friends and eventually they would begin to have lunch together.  She doesn't brag that Kody started to invite her to lunch, only mentions that they had lunches together -- which, to me, is telling that she probably initiated it. 

 

Somewhere in this time frame (a couple of years after meeting?), Janelle decided to approach Kody's parents about living in a tipi on their property.  I'm a little fuzzy about when this is, but it was "coincidentally" at a time that Meri and Kody were going to visit his parents home.  Janelle lasted less than a week in the tipi (it was winter in Wyoming) and then she went to stay in the house (what a stroke of luck!).  That was when the formal negotiations about her being the 1st mistress started between the 3 of them, but my opinion is that she started planning being with Kody since that first lightning bolt, always being where he was which led to those lunches without Meri, then the tipi incident...  which all might have made Meri suspicious that Janelle was planning this, or that something wasn't right, but Janelle could stick to her story that she and Kody were "just friends".  If Janelle and Meri were such close friends when Janelle was Meri's (and Kody's) sister-in-law, then she surely could have been honest with Meri from the very first feeling of love when she first laid eyes on Kody? 

 

So that's why I think that Janelle is sneaky, and why I think that Meri was so mad at Janelle.  I think that Meri sensed something happening behind her back, that somehow she was being left out of picking their second "wife", and that suddenly Janelle and Kody had this relationship that had somehow evolved. 

 

I'm probably mixing up some of the time info from the book, as I only read bits and pieces of it quite a while ago, so I apologize in advance for any mistakes made, whether regarding time frame, or details.   

Edited by AndreaF
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For someone that knows about these things, is it more typical for current wives to help select new additions? Or for the husband to find them on his own and not say anything until he's seriously courting someone? 

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In their book, Janelle says that the first time she ever saw Kody, it was like a bolt of lightning (or something similar) and she knew that she was in love with him, even though she was pretty sure that he didn't notice or remember her.  To me, it would seem that the beginning of their "love affair" began strictly with her, as Kody was too wrapped up in Meri, who was his "soul mate" (he uses this term to describe her many times in the book). 

 

Janelle also says that later, after having seen Kody around at various functions (family functions, maybe?), then she and Kody started to become friends and eventually they would begin to have lunch together.  She doesn't brag that Kody started to invite her to lunch, only mentions that they had lunches together -- which, to me, is telling that she probably initiated it. 

 

Somewhere in this time frame (a couple of years after meeting?), Janelle decided to approach Kody's parents about living in a tipi on their property.  I'm a little fuzzy about when this is, but it was "coincidentally" at a time that Meri and Kody were going to visit his parents home.  Janelle lasted less than a week in the tipi (it was winter in Wyoming) and then she went to stay in the house (what a stroke of luck!).  That was when the formal negotiations about her being the 1st mistress started between the 3 of them, but my opinion is that she started planning being with Kody since that first lightning bolt, always being where he was which led to those lunches without Meri, then the tipi incident...  which all might have made Meri suspicious that Janelle was planning this, or that something wasn't right, but Janelle could stick to her story that she and Kody were "just friends".  If Janelle and Meri were such close friends when Janelle was Meri's (and Kody's) sister-in-law, then she surely could have been honest with Meri from the very first feeling of love when she first laid eyes on Kody? 

 

So that's why I think that Janelle is sneaky, and why I think that Meri was so mad at Janelle.  I think that Meri sensed something happening behind her back, that somehow she was being left out of picking their second "wife", and that suddenly Janelle and Kody had this relationship that had somehow evolved. 

 

I'm probably mixing up some of the time info from the book, as I only read bits and pieces of it quite a while ago, so I apologize in advance for any mistakes made, whether regarding time frame, or details.   

No need to apologize. This is not the Judgment at Nurenburg, lol.

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I think that's the party line. I don't think Meri was as involved as she would have us believe.

Even though a polyg husband isn't supposed to marry without his current wives permission, I think Janelle & Kody got as close as they could to it as possible being

recognition she had been married to Meri's brother.

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(It's known that TLC generally pays one lump sum per season to the family group)

Thank you, DakotaJustice. It wasn't known to me, lol! To me, that probably explains several things: why the Browns struggled so mightily to buy the Vegas homes & why the wives are still there ( excepting Robyn ). Even Meri remains after the divorce. Whoops...sorry...I had meant Robyn is still

there. She's the exception of possibly not using that reason to stay with him. However, if the show & homes are lost, I'll bet she'll do plenty of

*SMHS*

Edited by youcantbeserious
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No need to apologize. This is not the Judgment at Nurenburg, lol.

Did you mean "Nuremberg"?  I certainly hope that it's not -- I've learned over the years that these blogs/websites should hardly treat their participants like Holocaust war criminals... that would be bad for business! 

 

Also, let the record reflect that I was making a general apology to any posters who might know more details than I did, or who don't necessarily know the details but like to nitpick points, or whomever.  lol!  :)

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I'm not sure they get paid only once a season, but they do likely only get one check when they do get paid.  I think it's normal to be paid as the episodes air.  

Hmm...now that is interesting ( to me, anyway ). If they do indeed get one check, I wonder if they divvy it up to separate family accounts according to need or it stays in one family account? They can do an episode on that alone, with each wife pleading her case, lol.

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The Gosselins, Duggars, and I believe also the Browns set up a corporation to receive the funding.  I think that gives the head of the family more control of negotiating and dividing the pool.

It helps with taxes, too. Let's say Family X has a reality show, which earn $100 for the family for the whole season. If Family x sets up a parent company/LLC whatever, then TLC pays the LLC $100. Then the LLC can say the family members are its employees, and pay the 5 family members $1 each. This gives the parent company $95 profit for the season, and puts the family members in a much lower tax bracket. In normal LLCs, it also protects the personal belongings, homes, etc., in case for some reason they're sued, because all liability is absorbed by the parent company. It would be interesting to learn if the homes are in the names of the bankrupt individuals or the Brown LLC.

 

When Jon & Kate + 8 was on, the 'light bulb' moment for me that signaled they were going to split, was when it was made public that they had put the new house (where Kate and the Kids live now) and a lot of the income into a trust for the kids, instead of in Jon and/or Kate's names. I suspect Kate had the sense to protect the home for the kids (knowing she'd live there, too) instead of having to sell it, be taxed to death and of course split things with Jon. 

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Did you mean "Nuremberg"?  I certainly hope that it's not -- I've learned over the years that these blogs/websites should hardly treat their participants like Holocaust war criminals... that would be bad for business! 

 

Also, let the record reflect that I was making a general apology to any posters who might know more details than I did, or who don't necessarily know the details but like to nitpick points, or whomever.  lol!  :)

I think you're taking things a bit too seriously. I never objected or analyzed the occasional profanity on here.

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I wonder if this divorce business is to either...

1) take advantage of financial aide for both Meri and Mariah and tax breaks -- I am sure Kody is paying himself the most from the show. B/c Meri is married to him and Mariah is legally his child, they have to shell out serious $$ for her (and Meri) to go to school. OR

2) Meri divorcing him is really her decision. She is testing the waters, seeing how she likes being disconnected from him legally and financially (sort of...).

She probably sees herself and her only child better off financially without him and if it makes it easier for her to disconnect and jump ship, why not?

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Meri is taking a whopping one class per semester.  This can't realistically have anything to do with financial aid for her.

I think she only said she wanted to go to college so she could get out of Sister Wife's Closet and show Robyn that she (Meri) still had some autonomy.

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I think you're taking things a bit too seriously.

You know, I can definitely see how you might be right about this!  :)

 

Meri is taking a whopping one class per semester.  This can't realistically have anything to do with financial aid for her.

I agree, and don't believe that we'll ever know the truth unless someone finally decides to do a REAL tell-all (book or interview) either for the cash or for revenge or whatever.  I don't discount the idea that even a real tell-all will have lies scattered all over it because as a group they've hardly proven themselves trustworthy, but there is always a chance that the truth will win the day... 

 

Of course, if that person waits until the Browns are completely out of the public eye and mind then no one will care, so they'd better hurry up! 

 

ETA: Unless one of the children do a tell-all... I think that most of them would be trustworthy. 

Edited by AndreaF
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She probably sees herself and her only child better off financially without him and if it makes it easier for her to disconnect and jump ship, why not?

Yes, but did you see the look on Meri's face in the clip showing her telling Kody & Robyn she filed for divorce? Meri had her uncomfortable " I'm lying " face on.

She DID file but the rest probably wasn't true about them not knowing or even HER idea.

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The only real world (as opposed to purely emotional) justification I can see for the wife switch is not insurance, but a custody defense.  I suppose Robyn's kids' father COULD say she's shacking up with some guy she's not married to and having children with him.  I don't think that necessarily is as big a deal in 2015 Las Vegas as it would have been in 1965 Utah, but it makes more sense than insurance since if Kody bought it, he could cover his children no matter who they were by.

 

The other is just some bankruptcy fine print issue they're onto that we haven't identified yet.  He and Meri already declared at least once... maybe you only get one with a spouse, but a new spouse re-sets the clock?  

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The only real world (as opposed to purely emotional) justification I can see for the wife switch is not insurance, but a custody defense.  I suppose Robyn's kids' father COULD say she's shacking up with some guy she's not married to and having children with him.  I don't think that necessarily is as big a deal in 2015 Las Vegas as it would have been in 1965 Utah, but it makes more sense than insurance since if Kody bought it, he could cover his children no matter who they were by.

 

The other is just some bankruptcy fine print issue they're onto that we haven't identified yet.  He and Meri already declared at least once... maybe you only get one with a spouse, but a new spouse re-sets the clock?  

Now this is the most plausible reason I've heard so far.

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The thing that puts a wrench is a lot of these ideas is that Meri said she had been thinking about it 5 years ago, about the time Robin was in the picture. WHY?? WHY FIVE years ago???

 

If that's true then it's not about insurance or about custody.  But then again it may not be a true statement.

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If that's true then it's not about insurance or about custody.  But then again it may not be a true statement.

 

You hit the nail on head with both statements.  Everything coming out of her mouth (and the rest of the nimrods) is scripted and designed to keep the shipwreck afloat for another season.

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The thing that puts a wrench is a lot of these ideas is that Meri said she had been thinking about it 5 years ago, about the time Robin was in the picture. WHY?? WHY FIVE years ago???

 

If that's true then it's not about insurance or about custody.  But then again it may not be a true statement.

 

It could still be true if they discussed this possibility at the time Robyn came into the picture, but put it off for some reason, like the father was not amenable to it for a long time.  I figure there may be some legal advantage to being married to the person whose children you want to gain custody of.   I'll have to ask a lawyer.

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Can you imagine what would be possible if they spent as much time actually working and making adult choices as they did coming up with all the schemes that have kept them afloat all these years - including whatever is afoot here?

 

I've had this same thought almost every time I've watched Judge Judy.

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The only thing Richard knew about plural marriage before the Browns was what he's seen on the 7'oclock news. But now his whole perception has changed. Yeah, that's like saying every pig stye I've ever walked through reeked, but today I walked through a clean stye...so pig styes are much nicer than I thought.

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If Kody adopted those kids, and say stayed legally with Meri, then Robyn could go after Meri's income as well as far as child support, oreven just for this most recent kid. Not sure how that plays out in plyg circles but in mono circles I have heard this happens, but usually it is the new spouse whose wages get attached as part of total household income. That said, if Robyn left, and Kody and Meri stayed married, I wonder if she could have attached Meri's TLC gravy. I'm not sure about the ages of the other kids but if Kody was on the hook for child support,  it would sure put a dent in Meri's share if their income were to be considered what they call 'co-mingled' - In that scenario, you can't blame Meri for bailing. Now none of the other moms can go after her share. No matter what you think about the size of her house, the wet bar, all that stuff, you gotta admit, that would suck mighty and strongly lol.

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In my state, only the legal parent's income is factored into these scenarios. The parent's subsequent spouse's income is not up for grabs, even if the couple shares joint bank accounts. In fact, some low life folks attempt to use this very much to their advantage: if the spouse has a significant income, the deadbeat parent can try to slither out from under his/her obligations by claiming to be out of work or disabled somehow, all the while living quite well on the income of the current spouse--whose income can't be touched.

 

NOTHING the Browns do to manipulate the system would surprise me...

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