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Celebrating 25 Years Of The West Wing

Spoiler Discussion: The apple was poisoned?!

regularlyleaded

By regularlyleaded
in Once Upon A Time

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Shanna Marie

Shanna Marie

It does my heart good to see Emma's normal hair and red leather jacket. Even if it looks like Hook is dead, I'm not going to be too worried because I don't believe for a second they'd kill him for good. I'll wallow in the artificial angst.

 

I'd kind of love it if he's the one who got taken as payment for Robin, but I won't hold my breath because that might mean actually acknowledging that in spite of what she says, everything works out for Regina and sucks for everyone else. Everyone else always ends up suffering for Regina's selfish wishes, but having to actually retrieve Hook from the Underworld because of something Regina did would mean the show actually admitting this.

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Camera One
Camera One

When everyone realized Rumple and Regina weren't coming back, they had a big celebration and put on a cloaking spell so they can never be found or contacted ever again.

Curio
Curio

At least someone is freaking out over Emma's darkness. Keep giving a shit, Hook! You're pretty much the only one who does...

Serena
Serena

HER GRANDMA IS EMMA! Are they being serious with this?

PixiePaws1

PixiePaws1

Woohoo how freaking much have I missed our Emma....and LOOK. ..she's all battle ready in her red jacket to go save her man! ok maybe I am getting carried away. ...but so so happy our golden haired Ems is coming back.

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LizaD

LizaD

Am I missing something? What in that picture=Hook going to underworld? Cause he's not in it? Maybe Colin is the one taking the picture. Belle and Zelena isn't in it either.

I don't think the picture spoiled DS's ending either. We already knew from NYCC that it was ending. And there's only one real possible ending to it.

I'm tired of every finale ending in some separation and the premiere is a saving mission with some amnesia thrown in for good measure.

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Serena

Serena

(edited)

Do we know if the pic is from 511 or 512? Should still be 511, right?

 

I read the crew is in wetsuits - could mean they're filming someone being dragged to the Underworld by boat.

Edited by Serena
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KAOS Agent

KAOS Agent

5.11 is the finale episode. They'll count it as 5.10 though because they want to pretend the spring premiere is the 100th episode. 5.08/5.09 are considered to be 5.08.

 

The remaining 5A episodes are as follows:

5.05 "Dreamcatcher"

5.06 "The Bear and the Bow"

5.07 "Nimue"
5.08 "Birth"
5.09 "The Bear King"
5.10 "Broken Heart"
5.11 "Swan Song"

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RadioGirl27

RadioGirl27

(edited)

Colin was there last night, he just started filming later than the others, but he also finished later than the others. There was one scene without him, I don't think that proves anything.

 

A&E are not the best or brightest writers out there, but I think that even them would see how ending 5A the exact same way they ended 4B, with someone sacrificing his/her life for someone else and the rest of the characters going to save him/her is boring as hell (pun intended) and terribly unimaginative. And the same goes for Hook being the one that does it. He has already given up everything he has, even his life, for Emma. So him doing it again is not creative, original, unexpected or exciting, it's just boring and repetitive, and just another punch in Emma's face. Rumple taking his place? That would be a great twist.

Edited by RadioGirl27
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YaddaYadda

YaddaYadda

I think the whole Hook has sacrificed himself and has been dragged to the underworld is a bit premature. 

 

I'm more curious what happened to the darkness to be honest. Has it been destroyed or is swirling somewhere?

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PixiePaws1

PixiePaws1

I don't think the Darkness can be destroyed because of what it is. my guess is that it could be completely and safely contained (which it seemed to be before FuckwitFire brought it back) , maybe finally contained with no possible way for it to get loose or become a separate sentient entity.

Someone also posited that perhaps it could be dissipated among many. ...meaning it would end up diluted. ..which would seem a strong possibility given it would parallel how Regina & co saved Robin from the Fury

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Hookian

Hookian

the first and last, yeah, but that is definitely her 'oh crap' expression and what I would call 'stoic have to do this' expression in the 2nd and 3rd. ...IMHO. ..:o)

 

Yep and from the looks of that necklace she's very committed to getting Killian back.

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Curio

Curio

(edited)

I'd kind of love it if [Hook's] the one who got taken as payment for Robin, but I won't hold my breath because that might mean actually acknowledging that in spite of what she says, everything works out for Regina and sucks for everyone else.

 

Yep, I'm still waiting for that Robin payment to come back up again. Despite what the show wants us to believe, that bullshit Guardians of the Galaxy knockoff doesn't count as a payment.

 

Am I the only one a bit disappointed that it seems like Emma isn't the Dark One already? Don't get me wrong, I love Savior Emma as much as the next Emma fan and it's kickass to see her wearing her signature red jacket again, but now I'm nervous this whole Dark Swan arc is going to feel incredibly rushed. I've been really enjoying Jen's performance as the Dark Swan and I was hoping to see it a bit more in 5B. Emma turning dark is one of the biggest obstacles they've given her character in the entire series, and I'd hate to see it wasted on a 10 episode arc when it could have stretched out longer.

 

And I'm not going to comment on any of the possible Hook-being-dragged-to-the-Underworld theories because I actually like those theories, and if this show has shown me anything over the past 5 years, it's if I really want something to happen, it won't happen. So I'll keep quiet and hope for the best.

Edited by Curio
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maryle

maryle

I am in the camp. Not sure yet, about Killian being almost dead.

I understand there evidence for that: the ring, one scene without him, Colin and Jen filmed later alone.

But still too coincidental for my taste too entiery believe it, I admit I do not want to be attach to this big sl for Hook and CS and ending be sad in its not.

If it is really killian who going UW I hop the separation between CS will not last all 5b

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mjgchick

mjgchick

There you go...I can't see it for love or money. ..thank goodness for your sharp eyes!

Just lucky to have 4 eyes instead of 2 busted ones. :)

Emma could still be the Dark One. She probably just doesn't have to act like the Dark One anymore.

The only thing I hate about Hook possibly dead some where is that Emma doesn't seem to get a rest. Haven't she been punished enough show? The only time she wasn't was when she had her memory wiped. lol

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RadioGirl27

RadioGirl27

(edited)

Once again, some fans are making assumptions based on a blurry pic of something that may or may not be one of Hook's rings. Speculations and theories are funny, but they are just that, not truths set in stone, and I think some fans are going to be really disappointed when this half-season ends.

 

Anyway, if they really go there and have a "save Hook" arc in 5B, I would love to see how A&E are going to justify characters like Regina, Robin, Charming or Snow going in this mission, when they have little kids at home. And, really, Emma loves Hook, but the rest of the characters (except maybe Henry) aren't that close to him as to go to hell to save him.

Edited by RadioGirl27
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Mari

Mari

(edited)

Anyway, if they really go there and have a "save Hook" arc in 5B, I would love to see how A&E are going to justify characters like Regina, Robin, Charming or Snow going in this mission, when they have little kids at home. And, really, Emma loves Hook, but the rest of the characters (except maybe Henry) aren't that close to him as to go to hell to save him.

Yes.

 

Plus, as entertaining as I find him, I'm having trouble believing the show would spend 1/2 season focused on Hook, especially when they've previously always focused on Regina in the B section, and they've got the oh-so-delightful Baby Green storyline planned for then, as well.  (Unless my crack wish theory comes true, and Hook is Baby Green, which I admit is a crack theory.)

 

If they do have to spend the 5B season rescuing Hook, we'll probably see less of him than we did with Henry during the Pan arc.

Edited by Mari
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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

(edited)

Rumple warns Emma that she is going to lose the ones she loves the most, just like he did. It looks like Hook is the price Emma paid for giving in to Darkness. (Nevermind the fact that in the same arc, Regina did not have to pay any price for Robin's life.) I too think that it is extremely unoriginal to have Hook sacrifice something or himself for Emma. How many times does that poor guy have to prove himself? 

 

Unless.. the Nevengers do manage to revive Hook from death/near death. This is the Last Straw for Hades. The Storybrooke people have been keeping too many souls from the Underworld (except for Graham and Neal, of course). So, he arrives in Storybrooke to "collect". I would love it if they cast Persephone as well. The King and Queen of the Underworld in Storybrooke might be entertaining. 

 

I've been really enjoying Jen's performance as the Dark Swan and I was hoping to see it a bit more in 5B. 

 

I too am enjoying it a lot. But better a short arc than drag it too long and have Dark Emma do really unsavory things. I do feel for JMo in a way. This is the first time she got to play a proper variation of her character, unlike most of the others. It's like Josh Jackson in Fringe. Fringe spoiler:

He was the only character with no Alternate Universe/Timeline counterpart.

 

Edited by Rumsy4
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YaddaYadda

YaddaYadda

Yep, I'm still waiting for that Robin payment to come back up again. Despite what the show wants us to believe, that bullshit Guardians of the Galaxy knockoff doesn't count as a payment.

 

No, it doesn't as payment. And Snow hasn't paid the price for casting the curse either. The difference between Regina casting it and Snow casting it, is that Henry Sr is dead, dead, dead, while David isn't.

 

Snow and Regina haven't paid for their actions. And I'm talking about a specific action here, not the whole but Snow paid because she lost 28 years of her daughter's life or whatever...the bottom line is - David still alive. Robin - Still alive.

 

For me, if they're doing the Underworld, then this is their opportunity to explore the ridiculousness that is the price of magic. 

 

As far as Hook goes, what I find really interesting which no one has brought up is that Gold is there on the scene with everyone, and Emma in particular. Has he gone back to being the Dark One (I doubt it)? And if he's not some terrible villain, then why was he and Hook sword fighting on the JR? 

 

If Gold isn't the villain, then Hook is, because they are foil for each other.

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Tiger

Tiger

5.11 is the finale episode. They'll count it as 5.10 though because they want to pretend the spring premiere is the 100th episode. 5.08/5.09 are considered to be 5.08.

 

The remaining 5A episodes are as follows:

5.05 "Dreamcatcher"

5.06 "The Bear and the Bow"

5.07 "Nimue"

5.08 "Birth"

5.09 "The Bear King"

5.10 "Broken Heart"

5.11 "Swan Song"

Has ABC announced air-dates?

Because apparently the order for Blood & Oil has been cut and it may be pulled from the schedule after tomorrow, if it even airs tomorrow.

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snarkastic

snarkastic

To throw an alternative, Hook or whoever could be going willingly to the Underworld to get some item or info that can only be obtained there. Or help out with a problem in the Underworld caused by getting rid of the darkness.

And I just want to say, we figured out Emma had no memories in season 3 because she was wearing plaid pants. I say jump to whatever conclusions, there's a good chance you ARE right.

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Serena

Serena

(edited)

Once again, some fans are making assumptions based on a blurry pic of something that may or may not be one of Hook's rings. Speculations and theories are funny, but they are just that, not truths set in stone, and I think some fans are going to be really disappointed when this half-season ends.

Yeah, the "ring" is too blurry to tell. How do we know it's not one of her usual necklaces? Didn't she have a circle one?

 

Anyway, if they really go there and have a "save Hook" arc in 5B, I would love to see how A&E are going to justify characters like Regina, Robin, Charming or Snow going in this mission, when they have little kids at home. And, really, Emma loves Hook, but the rest of the characters (except maybe Henry) aren't that close to him as to go to hell to save him.

Eh, why do these people need to do everything together? Emma would go, obviously, because she loves Hook. Someone else (maybe either Snow or Charming, with the other one staying with Baby DoOver) would go to provide support. Regina would stay because Henry can't be without BOTH his mothers. Robin would stay because Zelena is in SB and he needs to be there for the birth. If they really wanted to shake things up, Rumple and Belle could go with Emma.

They can have two storylines (like the current Camelot six weeks/Storybrooke DS thing) where we follow both the Hook rescue mission and whatever is happening at home.

Edited by Serena
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sharky

sharky

Blood and Oil hasn't been pulled from air, their episode order has just been reduced to 10.

 

I wonder if Emma isn't dark anymore because Hook did indeed find a way to get rid of the darkness and it somehow involves depositing it back where it belongs: in Hell. It would give him time to say goodbye and give Emma his ring/necklace, it would explain Colin and JMo filming together alone and also the cast without Colin. And if he does do this for Emma, it would explain the Nevengers trying to get him back. For David and Snow, it's rescuing the man who saved their daughter, for Henry it's his mom, etc.

 

As for the TVLine blind item, I'm going to agree that it sounds like Castle. It's a show with a co-lead, they're breaking the season in half this year, and they've been building an arc with one of the main characters that would make a death or fake death totally make sense story-wise.

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YaddaYadda

YaddaYadda

Has ABC announced air-dates?

Because apparently the order for Blood & Oil has been cut and it may be pulled from the schedule after tomorrow, if it even airs tomorrow.

 

This is as far as I can tell

 

5x05 (Dreamcatcher) - Oct 24

5x06 (Bear & Bow) - Nov 1

5x07 (Nimue) - Nov 8

5x08 (Birth) - Nov 15 ------ This episode is supposed to be 2 hours long *I think*

5x09 (Bear King) - Nov 29

5x10 (Broken Heart) + 5x11 (Swan Song) - Dec 6th

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KingOfHearts

KingOfHearts

(edited)

Lana is wearing her Evil Queen dress from the scene when she first met Hook. So there will be Regina\Hook flashback.

It goes like this:

*hat portal swirling*

Regina: "Oh wait!"

*hat stops*

Hook: "Bloody hell..."

Regina: "Let me go get a potion in case the enchantment doesn't work! Be back in a moment!"

Edited by KingOfHearts
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kili

kili

For David and Snow, it's rescuing the man who saved their daughter, for Henry it's his mom, etc.

David just killed Hook in the AU for protecting Emma and Henry and he can't even bother to invite him to sit with them at Grannies. Henry would be all for saving Hook (he'll save just about anybody), but  David and Snow would probably not notice Hook was even missing.

 

Unless Colin needs some time off to film something else, I just don't see them building the 5B arc around him if he's the one that saves the day in 5A. Although he is a popular character, he is not one of the main characters and at this point, I'd just settle for him not carrying the Idiot Ball in 5A. His name on the sword looks promising tied with Eddie and Adam consistently saying he doesn't get tempted to the dark side by Emma. So, he might get a role in de-darking Emma.

 

Now, Regina being dragged to the Underworld makes some sense. They've already foreshadowed her going there in "The Price" and she could have some stuff to do in the Underworld. She could run into lots of characters we know and love/hate because she's interacted with dead characters we know. Who is Hook going to interact with? Sure, he knows a lot of dead people, but we only know Neal, Pan, Liam and Milah (and the former two are terribly minor characters).  So, unless they retcon Hook into everybody's story (which ruins his backstory) what does he do with his 5 minutes of the episode (unless he is off filming something else somewhere so he isn't seen at all)?

 

We've already shown that the show will go to the ends of the earth to make Regina happy and she is linked to almost everybody. She is a main character and has been kind of side-lined so far this season.  I think the Zelena-baby-drama has not been well received, so they needed something new for her to do. Being rescued and fending off all those evil former victims of her would definitely keep her on screen next half-season.

 

Rumple is the other main character that could go to Hell, but I suspect that he's already been in peril this half-season, so I don't think it is him. 

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Mari

Mari

(edited)

^^^Yup.  That's pretty much how I see it, too.

 

 

Blood and Oil hasn't been pulled from air, their episode order has just been reduced to 10.

 

As for the TVLine blind item, I'm going to agree that it sounds like Castle. It's a show with a co-lead, they're breaking the season in half this year, and they've been building an arc with one of the main characters that would make a death or fake death totally make sense story-wise.

Blood and Oil is bad enough that during an episode, one of the ND senators live tweeted things the show got wrong about North Dakota.  

 

As for the blind item--I scrolled down the article, and read the comments.  They were pretty sure it was Castle.   Not that they can't be wrong, but apparently Castle's been . . . polarizing this season.  (Wouldn't know.   Not a Castle watcher.)

 

Not that one of our characters won't "die" during the midseason finale break, but I don't think that particular article is us.

Edited by Mari
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Hookian

Hookian

(edited)

 

If they do have to spend the 5B season rescuing Hook, we'll probably see less of him than we did with Henry during the Pan arc.

Why would you think that especially since they're going to the Underworld? I see Hook getting tons of screentime he's not just gonna be sleeping. I suspect he's wandering around the Underworld trying to find a way out and I think he reunites with his father in the closing moments of the finale. Makes so much sense especially when we know his father is introduced in the mid-season finale and is probably immortal but that's just a guess.

Anyway, if they really go there and have a "save Hook" arc in 5B, I would love to see how A&E are going to justify characters like Regina, Robin, Charming or Snow going in this mission, when they have little kids at home. And, really, Emma loves Hook, but the rest of the characters (except maybe Henry) aren't that close to him as to go to hell to save him.

 

 

Well Regina is going no brainer. I think she'll make the same promise Emma made to her in 4x11 where she told him she will help her get her happy ending.

Gold is also a no brainer, I suspect Belle is going to want him to help them save Killian

Robin will follow Regina, and one of the Charming's will go. I suspect it will be Charming going.

 

Those are the 5 I think will go and for Regina and Rumple a hell of a test for them to see all the people they've killed.

Edited by Hookian
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maryle

maryle

well, the last bts of Colin and Jen ( as DS) did it for me I now believe Hook sacrafice himself and that it is the price for getting off the Darkness. Now redeeming a character by a big sacrafice is redundant but it is how the show roll.

And if Hook is not as major character as Regina or even Rumple at some point Hook must make something big for the love story of Emma Swan to be truly epic. So, why not now?

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RadioGirl27

RadioGirl27

(edited)

I think those new pics are not from yesterday but from the day before, when Jen was still wearing her DS outfit.
 

Gold is also a no brainer, I suspect Belle is going to want him to help them save Killian

Gold would never, ever, go in a "Save Hook" mission, not even if Belle asks him. Hell, Neal can came back from the dead to ask him and he would still refuse.
 

at some point Hook must make something big for the love story of Emma Swan to be truly epic. So, why not now?

Yeah, because he has never done anything big for Emma. He has never jumped through a portal for her, he has never given up his home for her, he has never died for her. No, nothing big.

Edited by RadioGirl27
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Hookian

Hookian

(edited)
Gold would never, ever, go in a "Save Hook" mission, not even if Belle asks him. Hell, Neal can came back from the dead to ask him and he would still refuse.

 

 

Well they're gonna find a way for him to go because he and Regina coming face to face with all their victims is gold. Especially now that he's a changed man. Robert would act the hell out of it.

 

FYI Captain Swan is basically paralleled to Hercules/Megara but a gender role reversal. Hook/Meg save Emma/Hercules life and the other journeys to the Underworld to save them.

Edited by Hookian
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HoodlumSheep

HoodlumSheep

(edited)

Of course, the day our internet decides to malfunction is the day where we're pelted with spoilers. I feel like I've missed a bunch of stuff.

I'm disappointed that it looks like Hook and Regina will be sharing a flashback based on what she's wearing. Bleh. I just don't like it. Why have these particular memories never been brought up before? why have they always acted like her sending him to go kill Cora has been their only previous interaction? I guess I can still hold out hope she doesn't share a scene with Papa Hook. Or maybe the tv gods will grant me my wish and they're just recycling some of the Evil Queen's outfits now, and that Hook and Regina don't interact in flashbacks.

Anyways, I jumped off of tumblr because the spoilers tag is 90% "Killy's going to die!" stuff. I just don't understand all the fretting. If he dies, he'll be back.

Edited by HoodlumSheep
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Rumsy4

Rumsy4

I'm disappointed that it looks like Hook and Regina will be sharing a flashback based on what she's wearing. Bleh. I just don't like it. Why have these particular memories never been brought up before? why have they always acted like her sending him to go kill Cora has been their only previous interaction?

 

Maybe it happens after Hook brought Cora's "body" to Regina. I rewatched the scene in "The Queen of Hearts", there might be some wiggle room for that. Or just before Regina sends Hook to Wonderland to kill her mother. As to why these particular memories have never been brought up before--simple. The writers just thought of it! Just like the million other plot points they have shoved into flashbacks. :-p

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maryle

maryle

You are right the bts pic are not from yesterday, I am back at the fence for the Killian sacrifice thing.

<<He has never jumped through a portal for her, he has never given up his home for her, he has never died for her. No, nothing big.>>

It is not about what if I aready saw Killian worthy of Emma (I do ) but there still so much people in the fandom still only seing the pirate that it will help if they see a big hero act from him on sreen. They will not have the possibility to minimalyze it.

Or maybe I just I want to see him be the hero for once!

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