S01.E05: Chapter Five

[Tara Ariano]

Jane moves in with Michael after she gets mad at Xo, but then she reconsiders her hasty actions. Meanwhile, Rogelio grows anxious when Jane plans to meet with him; and Rafael and Petra continue to have marital problems.

[Primetimer]

You, too, can make an entrance like an international superstar: you just need to rent the right equipment.

Read the story

[Dejana]

Another murder at the hotel in a matter of weeks? They are going to have to explain why anyone ever bothers to go and stay there in future episodes. Non-refundable bookings? Maybe that's why the scene is switching to Jane's student teaching next week.

 

I doubt that's the last we've seen of Michael's sleazy brother. I wish it were; he gives me the creeps.

 

Petra and Rafael...she's unbelievably shady, but you have to wonder about the guy who picks her as a wife. I know, he's changed, but how much and for how long? There was a bit of an edge there, in the scenes about him wanting custody of the child.

 

Where is Luisa? Her stepmother/girlfriend didn't seem to be worried about her this week.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Dejana

[Irlandesa]

Petra and Rafael...she's unbelievably shady, but you have to wonder about the guy who picks her as a wife. I know, he's changed, but how much and for how long? There was a bit of an edge there, in the scenes about him wanting custody of the child.

I think we saw a lot of why he chose her as a wife.  He has daddy issues and when his father gave Lochlan the praise and promotion, Rafael set his sights on Lochlan's new fiancee.  They did look happy in the flashbacks but I do wonder how they went from there to where they are now.  Raf clearly has had some up and downs.  He was kind of a sleaze when he first met Petra but then he looked happier with her when she was pregnant...and then, based on Jane's investigation, he must have regressed when he had cancer. 

 

I've loved Petra and all her schemes but I just have to say "hell no!" at falsely accusing her of beating him. 

 

I thought the Jane/Michael fight over the photos was realistic and, as was often repeated tonight, "it's complicated."  I get Jane's position that she thought she knew what kind of couple would raise her baby and Michael had knowledge that directly contradicted it.  And Michael held back that information for selfish reasons.  On the other hand, I don't agree with her when she was very blase about the fact that she wouldn't tell anyone.  Michael is a cop and that information is part of an investigation--it's not the kind of thing he could have or should have shared without agreement from his superiors.  And knowing what she knew about the couple, would she really have been able to go ahead with the adoption?  Would she really have been able to keep that secret from Rafael?  I doubt it. 

[Gin and Tonic]

Would she really have been able to keep that secret from Rafael?  I doubt it.

Agreed.  I know that Michael wasn't really concerned about Jane compromising the investigation, but when she asked "Who was I going to tell?" my eyes could've rolled out of my head.  Clunker line from the writers.

 

I have to say, I'm way more invested in Jane/Michael than any potential Jane/Rafael romance.  I like that he hangs out with her family and respects her boundaries and encourages her to make up with her mom. 

 

Obviously his skeeziness with the Petra stuff is a huge transgression, but I'd rather watch flawed people overcome their issues than Rafael's bad-boy turned perfect-guy.  It's possible that I am simply weak in front of Michael's eyes shining with tears.

 

I'd also like to see how Rafael and Petra's marriage started falling apart.  They clearly loved each other at some point.  How did it turn sour?

[Janet Snakehole]

Not enough narrator this week. But I did love the dad's baby picture.

Edited November 11, 2014 by Janet Snakehole

[La Tortuga]

Maybe this was covered in the bits of the show I missed when my signal was lost, but I don't understand how Rafael has immediately gone from lusting after Jane in his dreams to having a non-verbal but mutually understood rivalry with Michael for her. I get why Michael isn't cool with Rafael being in the picture at all. But why is Rafael suddenly concerned with the idea that he could make Jane happier than Michael could? He's just having sex dreams, not actively wooing her, so why the sudden competition? I guess the question becomes whether he'd still care about Jane's happiness or having a role in her life if she weren't pregnant with his child. I'm not convinced that at this point the answer to that question would be yes.

[Zanne]

On the other hand, I don't agree with her when she was very blase about the fact that she wouldn't tell anyone.

 

 

Especially considering the recent episode all about how she cannot tell a lie, even a lie of omission. Show can't have it both ways!

[La Tortuga]

Agreed.  I know that Michael wasn't really concerned about Jane compromising the investigation, but when she asked "Who was I going to tell?" my eyes could've rolled out of my head.  Clunker line from the writers.

 

I thought it was kind of ridiculous for Jane to say that line, not because it's a clunker, but because she is pathologically unable to keep a secret. She blurts things out all the time, whether it's in her best interest or not, sometimes without regard for the best interests of the people she's speaking to. You can't convince me that if she found out her boss's wife was having an affair from Michael, that she wouldn't have blabbed it to Rafael the first time he mentioned Petra in a conversation. I know it, Michael knows it, and Jane would know it too if she wasn't too upset to really think about it.

 

The issue that for some reason no one is giving voice to is that if Michael had told Jane about the affair early on, she might have chosen to terminate the pregnancy. Not that this is a certainty, but it's definitely a factor; after all, the illusion of a good marriage was a factor in her agreeing to carry the baby to term in the first place.

[Irlandesa]

Maybe this was covered in the bits of the show I missed when my signal was lost, but I don't understand how Rafael has immediately gone from lusting after Jane in his dreams to having a non-verbal but mutually understood rivalry with Michael for her. I get why Michael isn't cool with Rafael being in the picture at all. But why is Rafael suddenly concerned with the idea that he could make Jane happier than Michael could? He's just having sex dreams, not actively wooing her, so why the sudden competition? I guess the question becomes whether he'd still care about Jane's happiness or having a role in her life if she weren't pregnant with his child. I'm not convinced that at this point the answer to that question would be yes.

I think the competition stems from a couple of things.  Rafael picked up on the fact that Michael didn't like him because of the pregnancy.   At first he tried to be nice but eventually gave into the fact that Michael didn't like him and a likely result of that was Rafael not liking him very much either.  It actually started there.

 

While he isn't actually pursuing Jane, he is starting to realize he likes her.  Now that he has decided to free himself from his marriage, he realizes he likes a girl who is with a guy who doesn't like him.  So you have that layer added onto the initial dislike.

 

Then there's the kid factor.  At first Rafael thought he'd be able to raise his child with Petra.  But now he may have to share custody with Jane and this dude who has never liked him.  I think he'd be fine sharing custody with Jane but not Michael. 

 

There wasn't anything explicit but the competitive dynamic started a few episodes ago and has just been building.

[HotForBacon]

First time to post on this forum but I love this show.

 

Also, I could listen to the narrator say "Jimmy Smits" over and over. And if you have closed caption on it's "Latin Lover Narrator" LOL

[Kromm]

Not enough narrator this week. 

But with the little we had, we DID get "Jeeeeeemy Smeeeeets" from him.

[Minneapple]

Kind of a more understated episode this week -- well, if you discount the murder of Disgusting Tom.

There is no way on earth Jane would have been able to keep those pictures a secret from Rafael. Heck, she can't keep her own plans to have sex a secret from her grandmother.

Loved the Veronica Mars reference.

Rojelio's baby picture was hilarious.

[gesundheit]

I enjoy Petra as a shallow schemer who also has a good side. I thought this one went too far, and it's such a refreshingly feminist show that going back to the "women will fake domestic abuse" well for a storyline is troublesome. Bummer.

 

Also, wouldn't Petra have some legal rights to the child? The insemination was meant for her. Why does a divorce mean her rights are all out the window?

 

I miss Luisa.

 

I am fully with those of you above who are frustrated by the Michael/Rafael conflict. They're painting Rafael as a little too perfect right now and I'd prefer the show without them asking us to root for Jane and Rafael. I mean of course it's soapy that a baby would be enough reason for two people being super into each other out of nowhere (other than the years-earlier makeout), but it just seems too easily done right now.

 

All that said, I am in love with this show. And Rogelio is the greatest.

[Enginerd]

I thought "Who would I tell?" was funny and not a mistake line because I think that Jane still believes that she can keep a secret, all evidence to the contrary. And who knows, maybe if she and Rafe never crossed paths in a church or near a priest or nun or with a view of anyone's crucifix necklace, she could have kept it a secret from him.

But I'm starting to wonder about Michael's investigative ethics and skills anyway. He just leaves all these files full of sensitive information all over, tossed in the back of his car or stacked on his dresser. He needs to get it together. I did love that he called Jane "Veronica Mars".

I loved Rogelio's Grand Entrance. He's so sweet despite his delusional narcissism. Certainly, going way over the top because he's nervous and he cares is much better than not caring. I wonder if Jane is going to have to deal with a lot of paparazzi since he's a big star and just found out he has a daughter (and greeted her with a very large audience).

I'm not super sad that we won't have to see a lot more of Disgusting Tom. I used to work in a fancy hotel in the summers when I was in school, and it seems like there was ALWAYS a Disgusting Tom or three among the bellhop staff. UGH.

[HunterHunted]

I'm not cool with Petra faking domestic violence. However despite Petra's shadiness, I like her more than Rafael. From the show's telling, Rafael was a bad boy ho who was arrested constantly, started dating Petra out of petty jealousy, was briefly happy when Petra was pregnant, let Petra nurse him through cancer, and became emotionally distant when he was cancer free. And in an earlier episode, he told Petra that he hadn't asked for a divorce earlier because it felt like Petra really wanted to help him with his cancer. What kind of person implies that they let their spouse care for them as a favor? I know the show wants to build tension in the love triangle, but they really need to remember that Rafael is kind of a jerk.

I'm going to echo every sentiment about Jane being aunt Blabby. She couldn't help but let Michael know that Disgusting Tom was working and Michael never even asked her. Even if Jane hadn't let Rafael know about the affair, she would have told everyone else she works with.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

Also, wouldn't Petra have some legal rights to the child? The insemination was meant for her. Why does a divorce mean her rights are all out the window?

She's not the biological mother of the child, Jane is, so Petra has no rights. Divorce means she won't be gaining any rights via adoption.

[Enginerd]

I would think that Petra could get a financial settlement from a lawsuit against Luisa since she was the one who was supposed to be inseminated. However, since it all went wrong and she is not the mother, I don't think she would have a legitimate claim on the child. However however, since she was going to be inseminated with Rafe's sperm without his explicit consent, maybe she knows she's better off not bringing it up in court.

I don't think Petra wants the baby itself; she mostly saw it as a means of keeping Rafael married to her long enough to collect the $10 million. She did seem happy to be expecting in the flashback. I wonder how exactly it all went downhill for them, aside from losing that baby.

I do enjoy watching Petra. She's interesting. Shady, for sure, but seeing her with her mother, you can also see why she is the way she is.

So the expansion plans for the hotel include a medical spa? This has real possibilities for underhanded medical business. Plastic surgery for criminals on the run? Black market organ harvesting? Who knows?!

[RachelKM]

I thought "Who would I tell?" was funny and not a mistake line because I think that Jane still believes that she can keep a secret, all evidence to the contrary. And who knows, maybe if she and Rafe never crossed paths in a church or near a priest or nun or with a view of anyone's crucifix necklace, she could have kept it a secret from him.

But I'm starting to wonder about Michael's investigative ethics and skills anyway. He just leaves all these files full of sensitive information all over, tossed in the back of his car or stacked on his dresser. He needs to get it together. I did love that he called Jane "Veronica Mars".

 

Agreed on both counts.  I did wonder if Michael could have at least warned her that he had seen something that made him concerned about their relationship.  He didn't have to compromise the actual investigation.  But yeah, Jane would have either blurted it out or done more of her amateur sleuthing crap during which she awkwardly stares at them together too hard trying to discern whether they are really having problems making her look like a lunatic.

 

 

I loved Rogelio's Grand Entrance. He's so sweet despite his delusional narcissism. Certainly, going way over the top because he's nervous and he cares is much better than not caring. I wonder if Jane is going to have to deal with a lot of paparazzi since he's a big star and just found out he has a daughter (and greeted her with a very large audience).

Rogelio was the MVP of this episode for me.  He's so delightfully shallow, clueless and genuinely sweet.  And that picture he gave Jane was fucking aces!

 

 

She's not the biological mother of the child, Jane is, so Petra has no rights. Divorce means she won't be gaining any rights via adoption.

She would also have a problem since she defrosted the sperm without his permission so there was never a joint plan with Rafael about the insemination.   The sample was preserved due to his cancer rather than a mutual fertility/reproductive plan and it was his only sample which she kind of stole. Not the best argument for "was the intended mother."

 

Speaking of Petra/Natalia, how much y'all wanna bet that it will turn out that in her statement to the police about the alleged battery she will  place the time of the incident during the second meeting between Rafe, Michael and his partner making Michael his alibi.  I'm thinking that Michael will see the police report for the alleged battery  and realize the timeline overlap but either not say anything in order to keep Jane away from Rafe or stupidly confront Petra and she'll blackmail him again over the tampering with a crime scene thing... and not say anything keeping Jane away from Rafe.

[gesundheit]

I would think that Petra could get a financial settlement from a lawsuit against Luisa since she was the one who was supposed to be inseminated. However, since it all went wrong and she is not the mother, I don't think she would have a legitimate claim on the child. However however, since she was going to be inseminated with Rafe's sperm without his explicit consent, maybe she knows she's better off not bringing it up in court.

Ah yes! Okay, I was thinking the first part (she could make a pretty penny, nullifying the need for all of this) but had completely forgotten the second part (she scheduled the insemination surreptitiously).

 

It's odd to me that with that mother, Petra ever would have signed a pre-nup with a multimillionaire that only leaves her with $250K. Not very shrewd!

[La Tortuga]

But I'm starting to wonder about Michael's investigative ethics and skills anyway. He just leaves all these files full of sensitive information all over, tossed in the back of his car or stacked on his dresser. He needs to get it together. I did love that he called Jane "Veronica Mars".

 

 

Michael seems kind of young to be an investigator, so it could be that he's still more accustomed to the way he kept his paperwork when he was still a patrol cop. A patrol car functions as a mobile office, including a work computer in the front and storage in the trunk. Not all officers keep their cars equally and organized, so I can see how Michael would still have the same messy habits.

 

What's really odd to me is that all the paperwork and photos were actually on paper and kept in folders instead of being stored digitally on a password-protected USB drive. Reports and crime scene photos are created digitally because they have to be uploaded to systems that are specific to each agency (or county, as the case may be), so that they can be accessed by superiors and (eventually) by the District Attorney. I've seen cops access crime scene photos from their phones (granted, not major case photos). There wouldn't be a reason to keep a hard copy of a sensitive photo in your personal car/house unless you wanted to show it to someone or were expecting to get locked out of the system. I am chalking this up to the writers thinking that police work hasn't advanced with technology.

[Enginerd]

Lina seemed nice and sensible, so I'm interested to find out WHAT exactly she sees in Michael's sleazebag brother. How old is Michael? If he was legally an adult during the car theft spree that landed Billy in jail, then it can't have been all that long since he was on the wrong side of the law.

I think Rafe and Michael can't stand each other because like recognizes like. They are both dudes with sketchy pasts and questionable character, and both like to think they've evolved and become better, but the dark side is still there and they see that in each other because they are so much the same. Plus, I think Rafe started having feelings for Jane before the sexy dream. He just didn't admit it to himself before. Watching them go at it, Nadine looked like she expected them to whip out a ruler and measure.

[Mickiflips]

 

Where is Luisa?

I know! Two weeks without Luisa is no good. I think it's because Yara Martinez is juggling two shows. This one and Alpha House, so her availability to film varies, obviously. But Luisa is missed when she's not around!

[natyxg]

I liked this episode more than the last two. Those felt too packed, like they were trying too hard. This one was just right.

 

I love Rogelio. I think it's really sweet that he's so interested in Jane, and he's hilarious. I laughed when he wanted to make his grand entrance, but then the stairs were too long and he couldn't help himself, lol. I keep fearing that they will ruin him by giving him some nefarious reason to explain his interest in Jane. I hope that doesn't happen.

 

Petra is growing on me. She's becoming one of the most interesting characters in the show, for me.

[Enginerd]

I thought it was funny when Michael made the comment about putting the baby in the closet since his place doesn't have much space, and then Jane was all "WHAT?!" and he said he was just joking. I personally know at least four sets of parents who have created a compact nursery nook in a closet. In cities with very expensive real estate, it's quite normal!

[Kromm]

I thought it was funny when Michael made the comment about putting the baby in the closet since his place doesn't have much space, and then Jane was all "WHAT?!" and he said he was just joking. I personally know at least four sets of parents who have created a compact nursery nook in a closet. In cities with very expensive real estate, it's quite normal!

Do they take the doors off the closets though?  I'd imagine it would be a pretty good idea, if not strictly a requirement.

[JAYJAY1979]

I'm probably in the minority, but I'm preferring Jane with Michael over Rafe.  I'm dreading that we will be led to the age old story of a bad boy reformed by the love of a pure virgin.  I do hope that the show continues to adapt to the US audience instead of doing a complete remake because the US audience is vastly different.. so far, I think the show is doing that.

 

When watching Petra with her mother Magda, I saw the slap that Magda gave to Petra as both to show Rafe is abusive and also for Petra being so stupid as to sign a pre-nup.  I have to say that Magda hasn't been on much, but she certainly seems evil.. I certainly will be looking at Terri from Three's Company differently the next time I watch that show :)   In the flashbacks, Petra seems warmer and nicer.. and I'm curious to see what caused the two to fall out of love.   My theory is that Rafe soon grew tired of her because he was only interested in her because she was with his rival.  Again.. why should we be rooting for him??

 

Nice to see that the interconnected web of the telenovela continues with the connecting of Jane's best friend to Michael's brother.  I'm wondering if Michael's partner has an unknown connection yet to be explained?

 

Finally, I loved Rogerlio trying to impress his daughter.. and then later lamenting to Xio about his failure to connect.  I hope Xio gets her happy ending as well :)  I do agree with a previous poster that seeing Xio and Jane together reminds me of the Gilmore Girls except that grandma lives with them :)

 

Can't wait for chapter 6!

[Enginerd]

 

Do they take the doors off the closets though?  I'd imagine it would be a pretty good idea, if not strictly a requirement.

Either take the doors off, or just leave the door open if it's a swing door. They definitely don't just close the baby up in the closet. Usually it's a regular (non-walk-in) closet with the slider doors, and they take those off and slide in a crib with storage bins below and a shelf above. No space for a changing table, so they use a changing mat on the floor. Et voila, a nursery. Another friend used a walk-in closet, which was a little bigger. She leaves the door open, but the door is all louvers so she doesn't worry about the baby not having enough air if the door gets closed. A baby doesn't really need a lot of space or stuff.

[LoneHaranguer]

 

However however, since she was going to be inseminated with Rafe's sperm without his explicit consent, maybe she knows she's better off not bringing it up in court.

Besides that, the chances of it working were low anyway (enough so that the doc didn't worry about inseminating the wrong woman), so the court is not going to give much weight to any claim by Petra of losing out.

[blugirlami21]

A lot of Rafe hate here.  I actually like him a lot, I think he obviously has daddy issues and he acted out in his past but I don't think that makes him a bad person.  I also don't like Petra as much as others seem to.  Zas?  Explicitly stated that she only stuck with Rafe throughout the cancer to better her chances at getting that money.  Same thing with the insemination that didn't happen.  I have no doubt that she only married Rafe for his money.  She probably had to sign a pre-nup because Rafael's father wanted to protect their assets.  I do think that the fake domestic disturbance plot is beneath her. 

 

I think what I like most about this show is that no one is a completely good or bad person. 

 

Was I the only one disturbed by Michael's story about his brother?  Michael stole a car, Michael's brother got caught and took the rap and Michael never spoke to him again afterwards?  His brother seems to be a pain in the side right now but I would be too if I took the blame for something my brother did and then he treated me like a leper afterwards.

 

Jane kind of bothered me in this episode.  I felt that she was too quick to make judgements about a situation with both her mother and father.  I understand how upsetting it was to find out that Michael knew about the affair but I really don't think it's enough to break them up for good.  Maybe Jane, Michael, and Rafe could be the ultimate nuclear family and all live together once the baby is born.  I think that would be hilarious.

[Enginerd]

I like Rafael. Partly for shallow reasons, but I also think he's interesting. He has a lot of baggage which I'm sure we'll see him slowly unpacking throughout the series. Mom unknown, Dad a jerk, series of trophy wife stepmothers who didn't care about him or his sister (until Rose), gold-digger cheating wife, cancer, infertility, struggle to prove himself professionally, alcoholic sister who seems to be the only one he's at all close to, etc. Plus, I find him entertaining, especially when he has awkward conversations with Jane or zings Petra when she thinks her seductions are working.

I thought Michael and Billy were stealing cars together, so Billy was indeed guilty of the charge, but Michael was too and wasn't punished. I didn't get the impression they never spoke afterward, just never spoke of that little deal and that Michael started trying to avoid him after he got out of jail and went back to that life rather than turning things around like Michael had done. Of course, Michael should know that it's easier to take a turn for the better when you aren't in prison, but he doesn't seem all that philosophical or introspective in general.

[ElleBee]

I understand how upsetting it was to find out that Michael knew about the affair but I really don't think it's enough to break them up for good.  

 

I have a feeling that she may have been subconsciously picking a fight because she's still conflicted about her underlying feelings for Rafael. Once Michael said he was okay with her keeping the baby, she had to find a new reason/excuse why she and Michael might not be right for each other. (Not to say that she wasn't right to feel hurt but, as you said, it didn't seem like enough to break up an otherwise (supposedly) strong relationship.)

[natyxg]

I understand how upsetting it was to find out that Michael knew about the affair but I really don't think it's enough to break them up for good.

 

Jane has always been pretty "perfect" and in my experience people like that tend to be very judgemental because they haven't been in the position of the screw up. I imagine at some point she will screw up majorly and will become more understanding of other people's mistakes. Ot at least that's what I keep expecting as I'm watching this 23 year old not even being able to lie to her grandmother about having sex. At some point she has to fall from the pedestal.

[Irlandesa]

 From the show's telling, Rafael was a bad boy ho who was arrested constantly, started dating Petra out of petty jealousy, was briefly happy when Petra was pregnant, let Petra nurse him through cancer, and became emotionally distant when he was cancer free. And in an earlier episode, he told Petra that he hadn't asked for a divorce earlier because it felt like Petra really wanted to help him with his cancer. What kind of person implies that they let their spouse care for them as a favor? I know the show wants to build tension in the love triangle, but they really need to remember that Rafael is kind of a jerk.

 

In regards to Petra and Rafael, there's still a lot to unpack about their demise but they did hint at a few things in the conversation where she asked to give them another chance.  She tells him that she is sorry she did a bad thing. I don't know what she was referring to here.  Maybe it was about trying to get pregnant or maybe it was something else in their past.  But the more interesting thing she said is that she remembers exactly the day when she realized he had stopped loving her.  She said it was half way through his chemo. He had a visit from his sister that seemed to go well and after she left, he looked at Petra as if everything had changed.

 

IMO, that's a bit too ridiculously specific to refer to something as vague as fading love.  I think Luisa told him something about Petra that changed his view on her/their marriage. 

 

I like Raf but I do think he's not as developed as some of the other characters.  I think a lot of that has to do with the fact that we've discovered who people are through their established relationships and actions. Other than ask for a divorce, he hasn't really taken many significant actions.  And ever since Zas died, he doesn't have a sounding board.  We haven't seen very much of his father or their relationship.  And based on things some of the characters have said, I think Rafael's relationship with his sister is an important one--one that they can't explore without Luisa on the show.

It's odd to me that with that mother, Petra ever would have signed a pre-nup with a multimillionaire that only leaves her with $250K. Not very shrewd!

 

It's shrewd if that's what was being offered at the time and she needed to prove she wasn't a gold digger.  Five years isn't a long time and the payout increases significantly at that time.  I also wonder how much Raf is actually worth or if the larger payout is somehow related to his father.  I'd also imagine that having a kid might change the terms of the prenup which is why we saw her pregnant so soon after they got married.  The cancer then delayed any more babymaking attempts.

[Unclejosh]

Starting to dislike Jane a little and I hope her bratty, self entitled, and judgmental behavior gets under control soon.

[JellyFishQueen]

Does anyone else expect to hear Ron Howard during the narration or is it just me?

Starting to dislike Jane a little and I hope her bratty, self entitled, and judgmental behavior gets under control soon.

I agree, I mean it is police investigation...

[Jellybeans]

I love this show, the characters but Jane annoyed me greatly in this episode. I hope that's part of her character development.

[turnitwayup]

 

Loved the Veronica Mars reference.

 

Me too. It's even more funnier since the guy that plays Michael's brother was on Veronica Mars.

[aradia22]

I'm in a weird place with this show. It's very watchable but I'm not sure I enjoy it that much. This is the third telenovela style American remake I've watched after Ugly Betty and Devious Maids and I can't help comparing it and finding it lacking. The actors aren't terrible. They're fine. And the writing isn't awful. It's full of twists and turns and some nice little jokes here and there. But... I guess it's missing a sense of joy. Also, I knew from episode 1 that they were determined to push Rafael and Jane and I just don't like the actor and I think she has a much better relationship with Michael. It seems like they're throwing a ton of relationship drama in their way to clear the path for Jane and Rafael. My problem with that is that to do so they're writing a character that contradicts the one they established.

 

My suspicion is that Petra's mother is the big bad wolf. I don't know how it makes any sense but I'm suspicious whenever there are no identifying features like a "the man without a face" character. I've watched enough soaps to know it doesn't have to be a man. She seems cold and calculating enough to be a crime boss.

 

 

Petra and Rafael...she's unbelievably shady, but you have to wonder about the guy who picks her as a wife. I know, he's changed, but how much and for how long? There was a bit of an edge there, in the scenes about him wanting custody of the child.

I'm confused about the timeline. He kissed Jane five years ago. A year ago he was diagnosed with cancer. Somewhere in that window of time he married Petra. But he still has a reputation as a delinquent playboy. Was he cheating on Petra? Even though they were apparently blissfully in love? Confused.

 

I thought the Jane/Michael fight over the photos was realistic and, as was often repeated tonight, "it's complicated."  I get Jane's position that she thought she knew what kind of couple would raise her baby and Michael had knowledge that directly contradicted it.  And Michael held back that information for selfish reasons.  On the other hand, I don't agree with her when she was very blase about the fact that she wouldn't tell anyone.  Michael is a cop and that information is part of an investigation--it's not the kind of thing he could have or should have shared without agreement from his superiors.  And knowing what she knew about the couple, would she really have been able to go ahead with the adoption?  Would she really have been able to keep that secret from Rafael?  I doubt it

 

Agreed.  I know that Michael wasn't really concerned about Jane compromising the investigation, but when she asked "Who was I going to tell?" my eyes could've rolled out of my head.  Clunker line from the writers.

 

Thank you! I thought I was going to be the only one thinking this. Everyone on this show is connected. There are so many people she could have told to possibly compromise the investigation (not that that was Michael's primary concern). Even telling her best friend when they work at the hotel could have had consequences. She's one of a long list of fairly self-righteous female characters and one thing I can say for the show is that the way they've written Jane, she gets a long of room to act that way because of her upright behavior and the details of her backstory. It's still a little annoying though.

[aradia22]

 

I enjoy Petra as a shallow schemer who also has a good side. I thought this one went too far, and it's such a refreshingly feminist show that going back to the "women will fake domestic abuse" well for a storyline is troublesome. Bummer.

I think they're doing some interesting things with religion and the pregnancy storyline in general but let's not get ahead of ourselves. I understand why with her background, Jane would be particularly focused on creating a good environment for the baby but she does tend to prioritize its needs over anything else. While the show does have a more nuanced, realistic perspective of life (particularly concerning Xiomara) I'm not convinced they don't still have ideas about "bad" and "good" women. Also, let's not forget our three lesbian characters. One (Luisa's wife) is an adulteress. The other (Rose, I think, Luisa's ex-love/stepmother) is also an adulteress and a lawyer who gave up her job to become a trophy wife and someone who gave Luisa the legal advice of ignoring her mistake and hoping it would go away. Also, they haven't cleared up if she's pretending to no longer be a lesbian or if she's bisexual or what. It seems weird that Luisa's father would knowingly take up with his daughter's ex-lover. And lastly there's Luisa. Our one female professional who got too "emotional" to do her job properly. Who avoids taking responsibility for her actions. Who never once thought about how her actions might effect Jane in the scene where she told Rose about the mix up. What if Jane didn't find out about her pregnancy until much later? She was effectively taking away Jane's choice to terminate an early pregnancy. Who thinks she should still be allowed to practice medicine after massively screwing up (maybe more than once given her history of addiction). Who has never really made a heartfelt apology to Jane. Great feminism, show.

[Irlandesa]

This is the third telenovela style American remake I've watched after Ugly Betty and Devious Maids and I can't help comparing it and finding it lacking.

I don't think it's as good as Ugly Betty was in its first thirteen episodes, we'll see if it handles the transition from the first 13 into full season/series better than that show did.  I do think it's better than Devious Maids at this point.

 

It seems like they're throwing a ton of relationship drama in their way to clear the path for Jane and Rafael. My problem with that is that to do so they're writing a character that contradicts the one they established.

How are they doing that?  Only seven episodes have aired so far.  IMO, we're still in the "establishing who these characters" are phase and haven't gotten to the "out-of-character-under-the-bus-throwing" actions point. 

 

They've hinted at Michael's ruthlessness from the beginning.  His brother showed up hinting at the backstor we got.  He allowed Jane to think Rafael and Petra were a happy couple even though he knew they weren't.  He didn't have to tell her how he knew but he kept mum on that because it suited his needs.  He obstructed justice to protect Petra.  He also told Jane she was hormonal when she suspected something weird was going on.

 

But overall, while I do think Rafael and Jane are meant to be end game if this follows the tenets of a traditional telenovela, the show hasn't abandoned trying to sell Michael & Jane to the audience...i.e. the flashbacks in the same episode that Jane and Raf were kicked up a notch.

 

But he still has a reputation as a delinquent playboy. Was he cheating on Petra? Even though they were apparently blissfully in love? Confused.

 

Reputations, once established, are hard to shake, especially if a person is only known by an individual by their reputation.

 

 Also, they haven't cleared up if she's pretending to no longer be a lesbian or if she's bisexual or what. It seems weird that Luisa's father would knowingly take up with his daughter's ex-lover...Great feminism, show.

Do they need to establish how Rose defines herself?  She's in love with Luisa.  She has married Luisa's father for money.  I don't get the impression that she has shared her previous relationship with Luisa with her husband.

 

Yes, the lesbians are a mess but pretty much everyone on this show is a mess.  But this show does have strong female characters with strong female POV and strong female-to-female relationships.  I actually think it does quite well on the 'feminism' front.

[aradia22]

 

How are they doing that?  Only seven episodes have aired so far.  IMO, we're still in the "establishing who these characters" are phase and haven't gotten to the "out-of-character-under-the-bus-throwing" actions point.

Perhaps I should say that it seems like they're trying to write two different characters simultaneously. 

 

Do they need to establish how Rose defines herself?  She's in love with Luisa.  She has married Luisa's father for money.  I don't get the impression that she has shared her previous relationship with Luisa with her husband.

Mmm, I think it's important. I'm not totally sold on her actually being in love with Luisa vs. enjoying their physical relationship and caring about her knowing about her alcoholism. Regardless, it's one thing to marry someone you don't love. There's a gulf between mercenary and denying your sexuality for a marriage of convenience. 

 

Yes, the lesbians are a mess but pretty much everyone on this show is a mess.  But this show does have strong female characters with strong female POV and strong female-to-female relationships.  I actually think it does quite well on the 'feminism' front.

Agree to disagree. And I forgot to bring up Petra and her mom. I've gotten to the point where I expect more from shows now. 

[Irlandesa]

Mmm, I think it's important. I'm not totally sold on her actually being in love with Luisa vs. enjoying their physical relationship and caring about her knowing about her alcoholism. Regardless, it's one thing to marry someone you don't love. There's a gulf between mercenary and denying your sexuality for a marriage of convenience.

You're right, "love" might be quite a stretch, although given how dangerous an affair with her daughter-in-law would be to her comfortable lifestyle, I think there must be quite a strong connection.  I do think exploring Rosa's motives more could be interesting.  I just hope we get that chance but both of the actresses who play Luisa and Rose have other show commitments. 

 

Agree to disagree. And I forgot to bring up Petra and her mom. I've gotten to the point where I expect more from shows now.

We can agree to disagree but I object to the implication that "wanting more" is wanting the kind of female character you want.  I have pretty high standards for female characters in that I want them to have the same opportunities male characters have had to be messy while driving story. 

[aradia22]

 

We can agree to disagree but I object to the implication that "wanting more" is wanting the kind of female character you want.  I have pretty high standards for female characters in that I want them to have the same opportunities male characters have had to be messy while driving story.

That's on me, not any implication about anyone else's lack of standards. I don't need all characters to be a certain way. That's boring and hampers storytelling and it doesn't reflect real life. My personal issue is that I tend to primarily watch shows with female protagonists and possibly feminist overtones but I find that even in that space, there are sometimes lines drawn between the good and bad female characters. By that, I don't mean that female characters can't make mistakes or be emotional or struggle with serious problems like drug addiction or anything like that. What I'm talking about is a less dramatic version of the Madonna/whore dichotomy. When a show doesn't concern itself with developing all the characters or wants to create villains, I think it's easy to slip back into stereotypes and archetypes and oftentimes that results in trading upon negative stereotypes about women as shorthand for establishing a character. You could make this argument about almost any show but I think some are worse offenders than others. Again, this is on me, and I think I'm super susceptible to internalizing a lot of negative messages and overt/covert misogyny so now if I feel like a show is getting to that place, in spite of its good elements I try and cut ties. 

[PiggyRod]

Had to rent this episode on Amazon as it was not available for free anywhere else. Completely worth it, The Latin Lover Narrator and Rogelio are the best part of every single episode, they are so funny!  But Gina is such a great actress, I am captivated every time she is on my screen.

 

So disgusting Tom is dead and Petra is now accusing Rafael of domestic violence, the plot thickens!

[Lady Calypso]

Rogelio is hilarious, and continues to be one of my favourites. I love how endearing he is toward Jane and how much he wants to be part of her life. I loved his Grand Entrance and how he has to be drinking wine when he's nervous. 

 

I really like Michael still. I guess I like that he is flawed, but he also cares about Jane a lot. I love that he encouraged her to speak to her mother several times throughout the episode, but he was also there for her while she figured it out. Maybe they won't end up together; maybe they aren't meant for each other. But gosh darn it if I don't want Michael to just disappear from her life. Also, a really small thing, but how he held open her car door for her after Jane met with her father? Super adorable. I like how Michael and Rafael both have their significant flaws, but they're also genuinely good guys. They may be rough around the edges, but they mean well. 

 

I love the 'unspoken text' between Rafael and Michael. Michael's brother is so sleazy and I do not like him. I also really like Petra. I also laughed at Disgusting Tom pointing the finger at "The Man With No Face" and then the camera cut to...Petra's mother. A possible sign?