S03.E10: Forever

[chitowngirl]

Synopsis: Another funeral.
Drops on Hulu June 27, 2024.

Edited June 26 by chitowngirl

[driver18]

I had read a few review headlines that said the season was subpar and came across as muddled and directionless.  I was thinking mid-way through "Napkins," the Tina episode, that it was all very clear to me unless something completely fell apart in the next batch of episodes.

Well, I just finished this last episode, and sure enough, everything made perfect sense and the direction was crystal clear from the first episode to the last. And if you didn't pick up on it, they even banged you over the head with that newspaper clipping and the flashbacks. Evolution, where they started, where they are now, and how they got there.

I loved this season, (OK, fine, "Violet" was a wee weak for me, but everything else was superb). This was easily my favorite of the three. The exploration and growth of these characters as we continue to see them grow and evolve is just beautifully done.

And the double cliffhanger on this one! That mixed review! And Syd's decision! Oy!!! So good. I just truly loved this season. So, so good.

 

[Irlandesa]

My issue with this season showed up in the last little bit where it said "To Be Continued" because that's exactly what it felt like, an incomplete season. 

There were certainly some strong episodes. I liked the premiere, Ice Chips, the finale and Napkins.  And this finale did give us Olivia Colman doing salt bae (what is that for, it just goes right into the cuff!) But everything else built up to mostly incomplete stories.  Is Syd going to leave?  Does Carmy have self-awareness of his patterns (no?) Is Claire supposed to be Carmy's endgame and do I care about her?  Not really.  Can they keep the restaurant going without the uncle paying? 

They didn't even share the name of the baby. 

I didn't hate it as much as others. I don't think I'd say it's a massive step down, as I've seen other fans say.  But it was an incomplete season of a show where part of its strength in past seasons was fully told arcs. 

I think part of my irritation is that they made a big deal that they were going to film Seasons 3 and 4 back-to-back but what is actually happening is the creator is taking his idea for a season of The Bear and stretching it out over 20 episodes instead of the usual 10.  And he didn't even complete the scripts for that, which is why the cast has to go back to finish. 

[driver18]

I guess we'll just have to disagree because it felt like a complete season to me. Last season we were waiting to the  restaurant open and got it. Here we were waiting for the review, and we already knew what it meant. 

If it wasn't a great review, the Bear was done. So, we do have that answer. Now we know next season Jimmy doesn't need to come up with an excuse for pulling out. 

Carmy doesn't have self awareness because the show isn't over.  But he's getting there. He faced his demon head on. 

Last season, Carmy was alone in the freezer while everyone else was together finishing out the night and triumphing. And he was a disaster in that freezer. This time, again, he was alone while the others were having a fun get-together, but he was mellow, chill. (Until he looked at his phone.) That was a change.

This season was all about the growth these characters have made, and the final moments showed Syd and Carmy both having to face a huge hurdle that will effect all the others. All of the growth--and we saw what made them--was to set us up for what is to come for how they handle those hurdles.

As for Claire, it's been about month. I think she's just part of the journey. But like life and this journey they are on... to be continued.

Edited June 28 by driver18

[HollyG]

It was different than the first 2 seasons but I liked it. The way the flashbacks & reflections of the past set to music were cut in with the current story reminded me of a Terrance Mallick film. (Knight of Cups & Tree of Life)

[Mindthinkr]

On 6/27/2024 at 11:01 PM, Irlandesa said:

They didn't even share the name of the baby. 

That annoyed me too. 

[dmc]

Put me down for a person who didn’t feel it was a complete season either. It was filler.  I hate when shows become hits and lose their trajectory. 

[Enigma X]

I liked the season well enough but felt the added humor the Fek (Fak?) brothers provided became cringe and that the over-the-top antics were an answer to those (I am included) saying this show was not a comedy. I liked the brothers way better in the two previous seasons.

[dmc]

40 minutes ago, Enigma X said:

I liked the season well enough but felt the added humor the Fek (Fak?) brothers provided became cringe and that the over-the-top antics were an answer to those (I am included) saying this show was not a comedy. I liked the brothers way better in the two previous seasons.

I don’t think it’s a comedy either.  I think it’s a drama with some comedic elements.  And in general, I think this entire season was a clapback to fans which is probably why it’s a mess. They need to stop worrying about the people watching it and just write a good show. 

Edited June 29 by dmc

[possibilities]

I didn't think this season was that different than the others. The show was always about the journey of the characters, how they got to where they are, what their internal struggles are, and how the fate of the restaurant depends on whether they can get their shit together-- and we saw that as much in this season as in the others.

I don't care what the baby's name is. The baby is not even a character. 

I liked this season a lot. I look forward to the next one and wish we didn't have to wait for it, but a lot of shows are like that these days-- short seasons, to be continued, with a long wait between them. 

Edited June 29 by possibilities
typos

[SnapHappy]

Yeah, it actually ended about the way I was expecting, based on the last few episodes. 

Very much a letdown for me, I'll be noping out of any continuation or further seasons. 

At episode 5 of this season, I still had curiosity about who, what and why.  But that's gone now.  This ep was basically a bunch of accomplished real-life chefs with nothing better to do than share a few stories on film.  I've heard plenty on "Top Chef". And Joel McHale grinning like an idiot.  Olivia C. was a bright spark, but her story is done, so there's nobody left who's story I want to hear. 

ETA: Ok, I've had 36 hours to evaluate what we saw, and I think I've made peace with a few of the less enjoyable aspects of the season so far.  I WILL watch when it continues, but I know I'll still be critical going forward.  If Syd doesn't get her shit together I won't hesitate to reinstate my ditching vow.

 

Edited July 1 by SnapHappy

[peeayebee]

I'm not sure if that was a good review or a bad one. We saw flashes of positive words and negative words, so I'm on the fence. 

I was so on edge as Carmy stared at Joel McHale and the followed him to the restroom. At least there wasn't a physical altercation. But I love that Carmy expected closure or satisfaction or something like that, but Joel of course didn't give it to him. I completely believe him that he never thinks about Carmy. He's just taking up space in Carmy's head.

Carmy needs therapy. I don't know if any of the helpful things people said to him actually sunk in. Like Chef Terry saying she was leaving the business so she could meet people and, well, just do other things. And she said she did what she loved WITH PEOPLE SHE ENJOYED, so she's leaving happy. 

Not that Carmy heard it, but Luca and Syd talked about 'repurposing your trauma.' He REALLY needs to do that.

I was wondering about the scene where Keller shows Carmy how to prepare a chicken, esp the part where he shows him how to remove the wishbone. Keller used a knife, comparing the sound and feel to a dental hygienist cleaning your teeth. But when he left, it looked like Carmy just pulled out a wishbone with his hands, no knife. That surprised me, and I'm not sure if I saw that correctly.

I love all the montages of chefs preparing food, esp when we see knife skills.

As for this season, I certainly did not enjoy it as much as S2, but it was still good.

[possibilities]

Joel McHale always plays assholes. 

But Carmy is essentially behaving a lot like the guy he was traumatized by. And he had other role models-- we saw them. We saw at least two other chefs who taught quiietly calmly and respectfully. Even Carmy saw them in his flashbacks. And of course his trauma from McHale's character mimics his childhood, which is really where Carmy's trauma orginates.

 

[peeayebee]

Was Joel McHale the first chef Carmy worked with? The order of his mentors isn't clear to me.

[Domestic Assassin]

I believe Joel McHale was the last chef he worked for before moving back to Chicago.

[Racj82]

I love being with these characters. In this world. In a lot of ways that is just what this show is. Dropping you into the world. We didnt need full episodes from Marcus, Richie and Syd's perspective last season either but they were a window into what makes them tic. Flesh them out. Through the seasons they take time to show how everyone got here.

There is a goal established every season but its always been about the journey.

This is Lost all over again. A segment of viewers caught up in plot and wanting answers. Another segment that sees the show differently than how its presented. Others who are there for the journey. To be in the world. The latter are the ones who can enjoy these shows the most because the expecations are not there. You are just experiencing the world presented.

[driver18]

Based on what happened this season, which, again, I thought was absolutely beautiful, I think I have an idea of where we're going.

• S1 was meeting these characters.
• S2 was getting to know Carmy and Syd's vision, and the others signing on.
• S3 was showing how they've evolved to get from there to here and how they're equipped to handle that vision.
• S4 is going to be handling that vision when push comes to shove.
• S5 will be the success/finding that balance.

I think.

As for the two cliffhangers, I think they're going to merge actually. We found out that Jimmy doesn't have the money for the restaurant anymore. Shapiro told Syd he has backers with money. Carmy has a restaurant with a crew. So, I think what might happen is that instead of Carmy and Syd partnering up, and Syd partnering with Shapiro, we might just get Carmy, Syd and Shapiro partnering together. Maybe.  I dunno.

It just felt like so many pieces were falling into place in this final episode that had been put together throughout the season. I understand the "incomplete" feeling, but isn't that rather the case for almost every single TV show that isn't at its final episode? You're left wondering what's going to happen next season.

We dealt with the what's what of last season: It was the aftermath of the death of Marcus' mother. We got that.  The aftermath of Claire and what Carmy said. We got that. He's pretty much done with her at this point. Might it change, sure, but for now, we got that answer.  Nat having her baby. She did, sure we didn't get the baby's name, but does that really matter at this point? It was like a day later.

This season's arc was the "funeral" for Ever. We got that. It was seeing the continued growth of our characters, we are seeing that in Carmy, in Richie. It is there. And it was the review, we pretty much got that it was so not very good. So next season we deal with that, and we deal with Carmy & co. finding out that the money from Jimmy is gone. And we deal with Syd's decision re: Shapiro. I already outlined above what I think is gonna happen. Or it could (likely will) be something completely different.

But like this season, the final 'what will happen?' will be dealt with next season. As tv show seasons do be doing.

 

Edited June 30 by driver18

[Jordan61]

5 hours ago, peeayebee said:

Was Joel McHale the first chef Carmy worked with? The order of his mentors isn't clear to me.

I'm wondering that myself, but I THINK the order is: Ever (with Chef Terry)>Noma (in Copenhagen)>wherever it is that he works with Joel McHale. I don't know where the roast chickens guy fits in, though.

[possibilities]

Shapiro is skeptical of Carmy (as demonstrated by his comment to Syd about the dish he liked not seeming like Carmy when they talked in the subway), and I think Carmy isn't ready to be a manager. So maybe Syd and Shapiro take over, Carmy goes to the equivalent of the kind of rehab he sent Richie to in Season 2, and this allows the restaurant to re-brand.

[Irlandesa]

30 minutes ago, Jordan61 said:

I'm wondering that myself, but I THINK the order is: Ever (with Chef Terry)>Noma (in Copenhagen)>wherever it is that he works with Joel McHale. I don't know where the roast chickens guy fits in, though.

I thought he told Terry at one point he did a stage (internship) at The French Laundry--that's Thomas Keller's restaurant*. So I think the timeline for Carmy is culinary school, stage at The French Laundry in CA, (return to Chicago) Chef Terry's restaurant, (to Copenhagen) Noma and NY--although I swear there's another NY stint in there because that's where he was initially headed after Chicago.  They showed him walking into Daniel which is Daniel Bolud's restaurant. 

*McHale said his chef is partially based on Keller but Keller may not be as mean as his character is.

[aghst]

I think it was a positive review.  Or else the restaurant might close and no raison d'être for the show to have more seasons.

But I question that in 2024, a newspaper review would make or break The Bear.  Chicago Tribune subscription has to be way down?  Plus are they struggling to fill the tables?  It's a small place so they can only accommodate so many few diners, because people aren't going to line up and wait outside to be seated.

In fact what is the traffic at these high end places?  If a dinner typically costs around $200 per person without wine, sure there could potentially be a lot of people who could afford it but if the reservations are full, maybe people will reserve a couple of weeks in advance.  With a long reservation queue, it still doesn't increase revenues.

In any event, Cicero made that his red line, which is a plot contrivance.

Another contrivance, unless I misunderstand the timeline of the show, is Sydney being in demand by chef Adam, wanting to open his own place after Ever closes.

Sydney has only worked at The Bear.  She doesn't have much of a resume does she?  They may know of her because The Bear has a certain rep or Carmy is known by all these other people in the high-end dining community.

Why would he offer to make her CDC and run his new restaurant, which is probably a high-capital venture.  Why would his investors support  such a hire of a relatively unknown and inexperienced chef who until recently was living with her father?

Yet at the EVER funeral, it's like they've known her for years and have a very familiar relationship with her.  But we saw at the pilot episode that she was just out of culinary school so how many years has it been?  This is the third season so 3-4 years a most?

Is that enough to let Sydney run the kitchen at some new high-end place trying to establish itself?

On paper Syd should jump at the offer.  More money, better benefits, more power.  Also something to put on her CV.  Note that Carmy worked at several restaurants, not just one and he's not that much older than her.

Plus she isn't as valued or Carmy hasn't shown her respect, certainly isn't accepting her input on menu decisions.

That's not even to mention the chaos and her constantly having to talk down Richie vs. Carmy.

There's a reason she hasn't signed that partnership agreement yet.

But what they showed in the finale is all the ties she has to the family.  So she will make an emotional decision and stay.  They could surprise and have her leave and Carmy has to hire someone else while Syd could still be on next season doing her thing at her new restaurant but what would be the point, Carmy having to win her back?

The Fak brothers are going to get Carmy and Claire back together?  Come on ...

[Jordan61]

I just wish someone would ASK Sydney why she's hesitating to sign the partnership, rather than just telling her to sign it. Carmy might not listen, in the state of mind he's in, but Nat or Uncle Jimmy would.

[Phillygurl]

Well I'm here because I am unhappy 😤

I have no problem with character development or even the real life chefs telling their stories nor do I have problem watching an entire episode where Nat is in labor. However, it feels like there was space to move the plot along and they just chose not to for 10 episodes.

Yes plenty of shows end their seasons with cliffhangers but they could have tied up at least one major plot point. Just one. Carmy hasn't even had a conversation with Claire since the freezer. Syd isn't really talking to anyone at all about the offer or how she is feeling. The bear, we haven't even gotten to see much of how their nights are going or what they're serving, etc. No discussion between Carmy and Syd about how he has completely cut her out of decisions regarding the menu. Like really it just feels like a bunch of people living their individual lives, feeling their feelings and refusing to talk about it. 

One thing I felt made this show great were the conversations. They way they would be real with one another even if it resulted in a fight. It felt like that connection was missing. The only 2 great moments with conversation I could think of in the entire season was 1) Tina and Mikey in Napkins 2)Nat and her Mom in Ice Chips.

I guess I just feel let down and I'm not even someone who waited months for this season... I just got into this show last week so I can only imagine how let down people may feel who have been anticipating the show over a long time. 

Ok, rant over. Thanks for reading.

[aghst]

The writers seem to be relying on showing the screaming matches too often.

Yeah the chaos is the signature thing for the show.

But in year 3, they're going to the well a little too much.

Show a new trick, get a new gimmick.

[Hanahope]

7 hours ago, Domestic Assassin said:

I believe Joel McHale was the last chef he worked for before moving back to Chicago.

This would explain why Carmy is almost as toxic as him, rather than being more like the prior chefs he worked under.

[Irlandesa]

14 hours ago, driver18 said:

It just felt like so many pieces were falling into place in this final episode that had been put together throughout the season. I understand the "incomplete" feeling, but isn't that rather the case for almost every single TV show that isn't at its final episode? You're left wondering what's going to happen next season.

We dealt with the what's what of last season: It was the aftermath of the death of Marcus' mother. We got that.  The aftermath of Claire and what Carmy said. We got that.

But all of the things you pointed out had fully told arcs in their seasons and ended with an inflection point or conclusion that set up the next season. None of the stories reached that point this season.  They just stayed treading water or petering out.  Marcus was barely in this season. 

The whole season of Carmy thinking of Claire should have ended in some kind of event with the two of them, whether it's Carmy reaching out, a potential reconciliation, or even Carmy walking away. Instead, we basically ended where we began, which didn't justify the time spent on them.

In the Sydney and Carmy story, their limited screen time refocused on a growing disconnect so it kind of went somewhere but an event to set up the next season would have been one of the following: Sydney confronting Carmy about how he disregards her opinion as a partner, Sydney telling Carmy about her other job offer, or even just showing Sydney making a decision on the job offer.

 

 

Edited July 1 by Irlandesa

[Irlandesa]

3 hours ago, aghst said:

Another contrivance, unless I misunderstand the timeline of the show, is Sydney being in demand by chef Adam, wanting to open his own place after Ever closes.

Sydney has only worked at The Bear.  She doesn't have much of a resume does she?  They may know of her because The Bear has a certain rep or Carmy is known by all these other people in the high-end dining community.

Sydney has a fine dining background which is why she had a tough time being accepted by the rest of the crew in S1.  She has a formal cooking education.  They also focused a lot on her experience owning a catering company which collapsed when she grew too quickly in a way she couldn't support but it led to Carm handing over administrative tasks he didn't want to deal with in Season 1. 

I don't think she has traveled as much as Carm to work at the world's top restaurants but I seem to recall Carmy being impressed with the experience on her resume when he hired her.  I went to The Bear fan wiki to see if there was any more information about her background and take this with a grain of salt (I suspect they got it from her resume), but it has her working at Alinea, Smoke BBQ and Avec.  Alinea is a 3-star Michelin restaurant, while Avec and Smoke BBQ are well-regarded. 

 

Edited June 30 by Irlandesa

[MaryHedwig]

8 hours ago, driver18 said:

Nat having her baby. She did, sure we didn't get the baby's name, but does that really matter at this point? It was like a day later.

I just needed to know that they didn't name the baby Donna.

[possibilities]

I loved the moments between Marcus and Tina, and Marcus and Syd. I think I like the quiet moments. I was really suffering in the beginning (not episode 1, but after that) with the screaming,

I guess I actually don't care at all about the restaurant business, so I enjoy the character episodes, and the quiet moments outside the restaurant.

I'm confused about the review, and also about the uncle's finances. I thought he was saying int he car with Computer that he's broke-- not just that he's tired of losing money on the Bear, but that he really doesn't have it anymore. 

Likewise, the review was confusing. They flashed tidbits too fast for me to read but from what I could glean, it was mixed. If it had been positive, I don't think Carmy would have been upset by it. I did actually feel annoyed that they didn't let us know exactly what the review said. But by his reaction, it had to be somewhat bad.

I was also annoyed by the Carmy-Richie feud. 

I don't know how the show would work with two separate restaurants. Maybe Carmy loses his funding and the deal they make is that Syd is now in charge and Shaprio funds them. But I don't think Shaprio would go for that, and I also don't think Carmy would deal with being demoted. Also, it would go better with Syd in charge, which would totally change the tone.

I don't want Syd to continue with the status quo, though. Even if they have the funding, she can't continue to let Carmy walk all over her. And he has to grow up, anyway. Emulating all his worst role models is just stupid at this point. He's not 3 years old.

I think Syd had Sugar's husband look at her contract (they talked about it during Ice Chips, when she brought the food). I couldn't imagine he'd look at the one Shapiro gave her (he would have to tell Sugar, right?) but then it also seems like he wouldn't be an objective person to look at the partnership agreement from the Bear, either. So that scene was a little confusing to me.

 

[andidante]

My peeve with this episode (along with everything you guys have said) is the amount of times the chefs said "like" when they were talking at the dinner. LOL

It just grated on my nerves. I know that is how some people speak, but good grief!

[SnapHappy]

19 hours ago, Jordan61 said:

I just wish someone would ASK Sydney why she's hesitating to sign the partnership, rather than just telling her to sign it. Carmy might not listen, in the state of mind he's in, but Nat or Uncle Jimmy would.

Probably because they figure she's a grown-ass woman who doesn't have to be treated like a spoiled, angsty teenager.  Which is EXACTLY how she's acting. 

I think my dislike/disappointment/disgruntlement with Syd for almost all the episodes drives my criticism.  I HATE what they're doing to her character. 

[SnapHappy]

One more thing about Syd, then I'll shut up...  *LOL*

The perfect time for her to TALK to Carmy about the poaching by Adam and the partnership agreement was when he shot down ALL of her menu suggestions.  They were alone, it was quiet, he wasn't being distracted. 

Because that's when a mature and invested Syd would have said something like "I haven't signed the agreement because I feel like you don't want a partner, you just want to hear "Yes Chef" from me.  Shapiro wants me as his CDC, so we need to talk about our partnership NOW or I'll be negotiating with Adam". 

Not harsh, no accusations, just level and factual. He can't expect her to ride his coattails for much longer. 

Edited July 1 by SnapHappy

[chaifan]

I just watched episodes 8, 9 and 10 in a row.  I don't normally do that, limiting my self to 2 max a night when something drops all at once.  And I'd like to say I binged the last 3 because I was so hooked.  But... nope.  I binged the last 3 in hopes that there would be something that would satisfy me in some way.  Sugar's episode was good, but was too separate from everything else I wanted to know about.  Episode 9 got us back to the kitchen, to the season's plot lines, but with very little progression and a lot of confusion (I really didn't understand the flashing review headlines).

And Episode 10.  I guess I'm not the foodie that the writers are writing this for, because I had no idea who any of those people were.  And I really didn't care, either. 

And why isn't Terry partying with her own people?  Why is she hanging out with The Bear's staff instead of her own?  OK, fine, three people from Forks came with her to Syd's.  But where is the rest of her staff?  Why does she feel so much more connected with The Beef/The Bear staff, when we've only seen her have a connection with Carm and Ritchie?

I get what someone said way above, that this season was evolution - where they started, where they are now, etc.  Yeah, I got a lot of that, especially why/how Carm is the way he is.  But I still feel we got nowhere this season.  I feel like the show wanted to make some artsy fartsy season with episodes that may be great from a stand alone standpoint, but barely felt tied together. 

And, OMG, as I'm typing this it hits me... this whole damn season was a tasting menu.  Little bites, some truly stripped down (subtract) to just one element (Tina, Sugar), with a common thread that (supposedly) ties them all together.  The problem is, I've never seen the attraction of a tasting menu.  It doesn't draw me in, and I think the entire premise is rather silly and pretentious. 

 

[Irlandesa]

On 7/1/2024 at 4:44 PM, SnapHappy said:

The perfect time for her to TALK to Carmy about the poaching by Adam and the partnership agreement was when he shot down ALL of her menu suggestions.  They were alone, it was quiet, he wasn't being distracted. 

Because that's when a mature and invested Syd would have said something like "I haven't signed the agreement because I feel like you don't want a partner, you just want to hear "Yes Chef" from me.  Shapiro wants me as his CDC, so we need to talk about our partnership NOW or I'll be negotiating with Adam". 

Unfortunately, they didn't give Sydney much of a POV this season compared to the first two seasons, and we can only speculate what is going on with her. 

But she might have come to the conclusion that she needs to reach a decision on the offer without talking to Carm.  She has fought the battles to have her input taken into account only for Carmy to regress this season into wanting to control everything. She probably thinks, and I believe, he could convince her to stay and sign the partnership agreement.  The thing he hasn't proven is whether or not he's ready to consistently accept her input as a partner. 

So while there is a part of me that wishes she'd communicate what's going on, I also understand why she doesn't. He's treating her like an employee and it's not smart, as an employee, to talk about leaving to your boss until you're ready to do it. I just think narratively, it's silly to keep the whole story in limbo until next season.

[FnkyChkn34]

I have a question, especially to those who think that they know what the review says.  

What does it really, truly say?  And, follow-up, how do you know that?

I was pausing the show and trying to read as many as I could.  I thought that they were all possible reviews, basically in Carmy's head.  As far as I could tell, they all had different bylines.  I don't think any could be *the* review that they were all waiting for to determine their fate.  I'm also not sure what Carmy's messages from Computer at the end mean either, because he'd probably be calling if it was both good or bad news.  Plus if Unc is actually broke, Computer could be calling for unrelated reasons.

Just wondering what I missed...  

[Jordan61]

On 6/30/2024 at 2:45 PM, Hanahope said:

This would explain why Carmy is almost as toxic as him, rather than being more like the prior chefs he worked under.

I'm currently rewatching, and I know a lot of people blame Chef David for how Carmy is acting, but it seems like it's been there all along. When he was working at Ever, he was snapping at Luca to go faster. That's when Chef Terry noticed and said, "chefs, quiet!" And he worked at Ever way before he worked with Chef David.

[MaryHedwig]

On 7/3/2024 at 6:52 AM, FnkyChkn34 said:

Just wondering what I missed...  

You missed Season 4. No, seriously, I think you explained well the ambiguity, and frustration, we are all feeling right now.  Remember the days when were didn't know if Snape was good or bad? I think we are there again. (By the way, by the tie the next Harry Potter book came out, I really didn't care.)

[maddie965]

I was ready to defend this season to death, even after seeing all the bad reviews out there (hope Carmy did not see them!). But the last episode broke me. It's bad enough that the first half of the episode plays like a documentary with chefs talking about their lives (not interested, sorry), but then they have to go and NOT SOLVE ANYTHING.

I mean, I don't need plots, I love the poetic reflexive episodes, I adored Napkins and Ice Chips, I worship the actors, the dialogue, the characters, the flashbacks, everything. But give me some resolution!

Things hanging in the air:
- Carmy and Claire;
- Carmy and Syd;
- Carmy and Ritchie;
- Review (really, they couldn't show the f* review?)
- Restaurant closing for lack of money.

I feel like we were promised a whole season, but they gave us half. Even two more episodes might solve it. The way it is, The Bear is still miles above most of the shows out there, but was unable to give us a full, satisfying meal this time around.

[Haleth]

Syd needs to run.  Run, Syd, run!  Even if the new job doesn't pan out, if the new restaurant fails she has now seen what a toxic environment The Bear person Carmy is.  Chef Terry brought out the best in her staff.  Even Richie was a different person in that environment after only immersing himself for 5 days.  Sure, when the restaurant first opened it was probably chaotic with a lot of mistakes happening there too, but the calmness and orderliness and respect that Syd witnessed will not happen under high strung Carmy.  

On 6/30/2024 at 3:41 PM, aghst said:

But I question that in 2024, a newspaper review would make or break The Bear.

Yeah, I would think word of mouth > a newspaper review.  In any case I'm not worried about a bad review.  It would make sense that it's a mixed review, with more good than bad*, Carmy fixates on all the bad stuff but it isn't damaging to the restaurant.

*The bad stuff probably includes all the shouting and f bombs being thrown around in the kitchen, overheard by patrons.

[SnapHappy]

On 7/3/2024 at 8:52 AM, FnkyChkn34 said:

What does it really, truly say?  And, follow-up, how do you know that?

I was pausing the show and trying to read as many as I could.  I thought that they were all possible reviews, basically in Carmy's head.  As far as I could tell, they all had different bylines.  I don't think any could be *the* review that they were all waiting for to determine their fate.  I'm also not sure what Carmy's messages from Computer at the end mean either, because he'd probably be calling if it was both good or bad news.  Plus if Unc is actually broke, Computer could be calling for unrelated reasons.

Just wondering what I missed...  

I also think it was a mental mish-mash of all the possible reviews that The Bear could have gotten, and Carmy is "seeing" them scroll through his mind in print form. 

[peeayebee]

Here's an interesting view on what the review could possibly be. The writer admits she could be way off, but it's certainly possible. I esp like her take on why Carmy says, "Mother******r!" at the end.

[maddie965]

Very interesting, and probably true. Thank you!

[aghst]

There is speculation that Storer was going to finish the show in 3 seasons but Hulu and FX asked them to stretch it out to 4 seasons and this is why season 3 is as it is.

They added episodes like Ice Chips, which is really peripheral to the story of the restaurant but gives them a chance to have JLC on again and for them to have a standalone episode.

[peeayebee]

If that's true, it sucks to force a creator to change the course of their vision.

[Irlandesa]

2 hours ago, aghst said:

There is speculation that Storer was going to finish the show in 3 seasons but Hulu and FX asked them to stretch it out to 4 seasons and this is why season 3 is as it is.

They added episodes like Ice Chips, which is really peripheral to the story of the restaurant but gives them a chance to have JLC on again and for them to have a standalone episode.

 

Ice Chips isn't that much different from Season 2's Forks (Richie's journey of self-discovery), Honeydew (Marcus in Copenhagen) or even Fishes (which was mostly about family dysfunction than anything related to the restaurant.) Even though some took place in restaurants, they were all side-stories away from The Bear.

So even if the spec is correct that he was given more episodes than he originally thought he'd get, I don't think it's the reason we got more stand-alone type episodes.

 

1 hour ago, peeayebee said:

If that's true, it sucks to force a creator to change the course of their vision.

I doubt he was forced to do it.

Edited July 5 by Irlandesa

[txhorns79]

The one thing I really got from the episode is that Chef Terry would make for an excellent party guest, and I would love to be her friend.  I'd also love a show that follows her story. 

[possibilities]

14 hours ago, peeayebee said:

Here's an interesting view on what the review could possibly be. The writer admits she could be way off, but it's certainly possible. I esp like her take on why Carmy says, "Mother******r!" at the end.

Responding to the review, I feel like Carmy was the source of the problems, he was a terrible manager, undermined Syd who is a decent manager, and didn't properly train or support the staff or foster an environment where anyone could function.

So even if he has a vision, it's his fault that the restaurant didn't succeed more in executing it. If the review praises him at the expense of the other players, it will only make him more of an abusive ego maniac, which will only make the situation worse and not at all support fostering an environment for success. 

 

[peeayebee]

7 hours ago, possibilities said:

So even if he has a vision, it's his fault that the restaurant didn't succeed more in executing it. If the review praises him at the expense of the other players, it will only make him more of an abusive ego maniac, which will only make the situation worse and not at all support fostering an environment for success. 

I wonder. The other way it could go is that he sees he has been so focused on creating the dishes and being a dictator that he has ignored the rest of the restaurant, to everyone's detriment, including The Bear.

[possibilities]

3 hours ago, peeayebee said:

I wonder. The other way it could go is that he sees he has been so focused on ceating the dishes and being a dictator that he has ignored the rest of the restaurant, to everyone's detriment, including The Bear.

That would be better.

[txhorns79]

13 hours ago, possibilities said:

Responding to the review, I feel like Carmy was the source of the problems, he was a terrible manager, undermined Syd who is a decent manager, and didn't properly train or support the staff or foster an environment where anyone could function.

Yes, I don't know how the kitchen staff, who are mostly relatively inexperienced with this level of haute cuisine, can possibly function properly with an ever changing menu and no real chance to catch up.